[QUOTE=Captain Lemming;549999]NOT EVEN CLOSE.
All you see are sacks dude.
Greene was a ONE TRICK PONY. Great at it but sacks but nothing else. He is closer to Gildon than anyone discussed here.
You are right he was consistent for a long period with gaudy career sack numbers.
Greene was not the best LBer ON HIS Steeler TEAM much less of all time. GLloyd by a long shot. DL said it in his interview and he know better than you or I.
Harrison COMBINED Greenes sack ability with Lloyds run game dominance.
Double digit sacks and triple digit tackles routinely.
Look it up OV, NOBODY does that period- league-wide.
Pass rush like Greene, run D like Glloyd or Ham. Makes the biggest defensive play in team SB history IN COVERAGE. Harrison can dominate a game in all phases, all over the place. Kevin Greene could never do that.
I'll give Greene props on longevity, Harrison started late and is breaking down.
But at their peak?
[SIZE=3]Harrison was the best defender in THIS LEAGUE.
As a Steeler, Greene was never the best defender on his team.[/SIZE][/QUOTE]
WORD BOOTY. Fo WHEEL
[QUOTE=Oviedo;549941]Kevin Greene = 160 sacks in 228 games
James Harrison = 64 sacks in 95 games
Harrsion had two great years but Greene did just as much longer and more consistently. I think everyone forgets how dominant Greene was. Ten seasons of double digit sacks with two consecutive seasons of 16.5. Sorry but I'll take him over Harrison all the time.[/QUOTE]
Now I suspect you're just trying to stir the pot here. James has nearly the same number of career tackles in half the games.
Kevin Greene is the Mike Wallace of LBs. He was the original 1 trick pony :)
I'm not sure any LB has ever been as dominant as Harrison was in 2008. 16 sacks, 7 FFs, 100+ tackles. On top of it he played ST. What other DMVP do you ever remember being a regular contributer on ST. And he probably deserved the SuperBowl MVP that year for the greatest play in Steelers' history. Sure Ben/Santonio pulled out the game in the end. But James play was the bigger play. It was a 14 point swing. And I give the whole darn D credit for that play. I've never seen hustle and blocking like that ever. All 11 guys made an impact.
And then you have to consider overall impact on the game. Greene was just a pass rusher. James was the most dominant player on the greatest D of all time.
And there's never been another LB that pursues ball carriers from behind like James.
Plus James and Greene played different positions. And James often has to take on the best lineman on the other side of the field. Something Greene never had to do.
To back up my original point, during Greenes BEST season as a Steeler, Lloyd was team MVP. As I said Greene was the second best linebacker [SIZE=3]on his team[/SIZE]. Throw in Woodson in addition to Lloyd (both were team MVPs when Greene was a Steeler) and [SIZE=3]Green was the third best defensive player on that team nevermind the league as whole.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Harrison in his prime had no peer in the NFL period. Nobody can do what James can when he is on.[/SIZE] On any given week Harrison can lead his team in tackles or sacks or both as an aging Harrison did to end the season (11 tackles 1 sack).
Do you remember JH and his 9 tackle, 3.5 sack 4 forced fumble 1 recovery 1 int domination of rival Baltimore in 2007? 6 hurries too. Can you recall EVER seeing ANYBODY EVER have such a dominating performance on defense?
Here for a reminder:
No fluke in 2008 against Baltimore he dominated again 10 tackles 2 sacks, 1 ff. Just destroying people, the strip fumble on one of his sacks returned for a TD was the margin of victory.
Greene was literally incapable of that kind of total game domination that JH is capable of.
Harrison has single games with multiple sacks and double digit tackles. Most OLBers will never do that in their career even once.
Our OLbers today would not be linebackers on the 70s team. They would be on the dline and would make LC look like a twig. Jack Ham would make a fine safety today.
How can you compare these units? With both Joe Greene and LC in front of him Ham was as likely to take on a tackle to make a play as Troy is today. Woodley and Harrison have to do it all the time.
How can anyone compare Kevin Greene and Jack Ham? Again, LC was far closer to K Greene as a player than Ham.
I guess you can compare inside guys. 70s with Lambert easy.
But units? How do you do it?
I can say this, Harrison can play either the line or Lber in the 70s and would be a freak of nature back then. Ham literally cannot play olber on todays Steeler team. Middle perhaps if the line can free him up, but strong safety matches his skill set today on a 3/4 team.
[SIZE=3]Hows this, imagine Troy P as a linebacker opposite Ham with Lambert between them in the 70s. THAT would be awesome.[/SIZE]
[QUOTE=Shoe;549858]Oh, give that a rest! NO ONE makes Harrison (I'm talking about his play on the field) "look like a pussycat". Take off the rose-colored glasses, and come back to reality. The greatest MLB I ever saw (I never really watched Lambert) was Ray Lewis. And even a prime Ray Lewis... Harrison (at his peak) had a comparable impact vs.
GTFOOH with that noise.[/QUOTE]
Ham was an outside linebacker. Not sure if you're aware of that or not. I even said best OLB ever. And yea Harrison is mean, but tell me when he comes out and jacks up a special teams guy from the other team because he pats our kicker on the head.
[QUOTE=Captain Lemming;550052]To back up my original point, during Greenes BEST season as a Steeler, Lloyd was team MVP. As I said Greene was the second best linebacker [SIZE=3]on his team[/SIZE]. Throw in Woodson in addition to Lloyd (both were team MVPs when Greene was a Steeler) and [SIZE=3]Green was the third best defensive player on that team nevermind the league as whole.[/SIZE][/QUOTE]
Hellz to the nozzzzzz. I would put Lake in front of Greene for a better total player. Lake was amazing. All KG did was chase the QB, albeit, did it well. Lake could cover, tackle, sack, play S, CB, whatever was needed. He was right up there with Woodson for overall insane physical skill, along with tremendous drive and instincts. Back in those years, when a play needed made for a win in the balance, it was always Lloyd, Woodson or Lake who would make the play.
[SIZE=3]Hows this, imagine Troy P as a linebacker opposite Ham with Lambert between them in the 70s. THAT would be awesome.[/SIZE][/QUOTE]
That's pretty close to my dream team of LBs in Ham, Timmons, and Troy. Could you imagine Troy getting to stay clean behind Mean Joe and Holmes? He'd leap the line to sack the QB every single play. And I'm dead serious.
Here's another thought for the 70s - Ham, Lake, and Troy. Could you imagine that range? Troy and Lake are roughly the same size as the 70s LBs. And I think Lake would be the best LB ever if given that shot because he showed he can play as good as any CB. So he'd put Ham's coverage skills to shame. Troy would put both of their range to shame.
We're on the exact same wavelength on this thread. Ham was the Troy P of the 70 Steelers. He could cover a WR 20-30 yards down field with ease. He had range unlike any LB we've ever seen.
Although my real dream scenario would be to have Harrison and Lloyd on the same team rotating to keep each other fresh. Both pushing each other to be meaner. And of course I'd put both of these guys into the 70s era so they'd be free to play as violently as they wanted.
I'm sorry but James Harrison was the most COMPLETE OLB the Steelers EVER had.
How many times did we see Harrison GROPED by Left Tackles?? His stats don't reflect his overall domination.
HARRISON could actually beat a blocker w/out getting a step on him. Most defenders are DONE once they are engaged by an O-Lineman. Harrison was special.