Cook: Turnovers, and lack thereof, the real issue

[B]Cook: Turnovers, and lack thereof, the real issue[/B]

December 17, 2012
By Ron Cook / Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

ARLINGTON, Texas -- Linebacker Lawrence Timmons had the Steelers' only sack Sunday, throwing Dallas Cowboys quarterback Tony Romo for a 13-yard loss in the third quarter. Linebacker James Harrison forced the Cowboys' only turnover, stripping the ball from running back DeMarco Murray late in the first quarter deep in Steelers territory to set up a fumble recovery by defensive end Brett Keisel. The defense didn't have an interception for the seventh time in 14 games and has just seven for the season.

"That's not going to win ballgames," Steelers safety Troy Polamalu said.

It didn't Sunday, that's for sure.

Not when the Cowboys defense had four sacks, recovered a fumble and had an overtime interception that won the game, 27-24.

The Steelers started the day with a turnover ratio of minus-13, which ranked 29th in the 32-team NFL. That it is now minus-14 is a pretty good reason the Steelers have lost four of five games, are a decidedly mediocre 7-7 and need to win their final two games at home against the Cincinnati Bengals and Cleveland Browns to make the playoffs.

"Their defense outplayed our defense today," Polamalu said. "We weren't able to get field position with pressure the way their defense did. We couldn't stop the run in cover-2. We missed tackles and had to put eight men in the box. That put the corners on an island ...

"Everything worked together."

Or, more correctly, didn't work together.


It's not as if the Steelers offense bailed the team out. The guys who are supposed to be stars came up small at the worst times. Quarterback Ben Roethlisberger threw a horrible interception to cornerback Brandon Carr on the second play of overtime. His pass was well behind wide receiver Mike Wallace, who made things worse by turning into a spectator and allowing Carr to get up and return the interception 36 yards to the Steelers 1. Wide receiver Antonio Brown -- the team's Most Valuable Player last season -- lost a fumble at the end of a 22-yard punt return in the fourth quarter, let another punt roll to cost the Steelers valuable field position and failed to stay inbounds to stop the clock when the Steelers were going to have to punt late in regulation. The rebuilt offensive line -- rookie David DeCastro made his first NFL start at right guard, bumping Ramon Foster to left guard -- couldn't get the running game going and allowed Roethlisberger to be sacked four times in the second half.

"100 percent ... This is on me," Roethlisberger said. "I let the team, the fans, everybody down."

It's also easy to blame the Steelers' patched-up secondary for the loss. Starter Ike Taylor (ankle) missed his second consecutive game, not coincidentally a second loss.

His backup, Cortez Allen (hip) also sat out, forcing Josh Victorian to start at cornerback and Robert Golden to play nickel back. It didn't help that starting cornerback Keenan Lewis left midway through the fourth quarter after making a spectacular play to break up a pass for wide receiver Dez Bryant in the end zone. That forced cornerback Curtis Brown into action, a move the coaches clearly didn't want to make after Brown played lousy a week earlier in the loss to the San Diego Chargers.

Romo threw for 341 yards and two touchdowns and had a passer rating of 111.3. He regularly picked on Victorian, who admitted he was a "little shaky" in the first half but thought he played better in the second half. Steelers linebacker Larry Foote and safety Ryan Clark thought all of the young guys played better as the game went on.

"We played our same defense," Foote said. "We probably even went a little more zero coverage than usual. We left those guys on an island the whole game and they held up."

"That isn't why we lost," Clark said of the young secondary. "They were throwing a lot of hitches and outs. It's not like they were beating us with deep routes."

The old guys are right.

It took Brown's fumble at the Steelers 44 for the Cowboys to get the tying touchdown after the Steelers had gone ahead, 24-17, and Roethlisberger's interception for the Cowboys to get the winning field goal.

It's simple, isn't it?

The Cowboys won because they forced more turnovers.

[B]You want to know the biggest reason the Steelers have lost four of five games?Their opponents forced 18 turnovers in those five games, they forced four.[/B]

It really is simple.

[URL]http://www.post-gazette.com/stories/sports/ron-cook/cook-turnovers-and-lack-thereof-the-real-issue-666691/#ixzz2FHavsKm3[/URL]

Opponents "forced" 18 turnovers?

About 1/4 of those were actually "forced"...the rest were just crappy, bonehead plays....

Turnovers come when the Qb is under duress especially Romo, yet the a Steelers refuse to bring the house on this guy and sit back and bring a 4 man rush all game. That's why the team haven't forced any.

We are turnover challenged.

[QUOTE=Jooser;538382]We are turnover challenged.[/QUOTE]

it's been that way for a few years now.

Two weeks in a row against one of the worst OLs in the NFL and we can't touch the QB. Our pass rush makes them look like the Redskins' "Hogs" of the 80s. The inability to get real pressure on the QB renders this defense mediocre at best.

[QUOTE=Oviedo;538393]Two weeks in a row against one of the worst OLs in the NFL and we can't touch the QB. Our pass rush makes them look like the Redskins' "Hogs" of the 80s. The inability to get real pressure on the QB renders this defense mediocre at best.[/QUOTE]

Yes, and the inability for the OL to create a push for the running game, RB's fumbling, WR's dropping passes, and Ben throwing INTs renders this offense LESS than mediocre. The whole team is sick, starting with the coaching staff down.

We need to draft some potential play makers on defense...........

[QUOTE=pfelix73;538419]We need to draft some potential play makers on defense...........[/QUOTE]

Absolutely. Our defenses inability to sack the QB and get turnovers means we have zero margin for error. That is why when we make a mistake it usually costs us the game. This is the biggest difference in our defense the last two years. We can't buy a sack or turnover. Players or scheme, but something needs to change or we need to get use to being a 9-7 team.

We need a dominant NT.

And too his credit, James Harrison tries to get the ball every chance he gets. He even fights guys after he tackles them. I get a feeling he's ready to explode. If we could just get Troy and Ben to up their games, we might be ok.

[QUOTE=flippy;538424]We need a dominant NT.

And too his credit, James Harrison tries to get the ball every chance he gets. He even fights guys after he tackles them. I get a feeling he's ready to explode. If we could just get Troy and Ben to up their games, we might be ok.[/QUOTE]

I'll sing the old song "We need the 4-3!"

We don't have the players to successfully do the 3-4. You need dominant OLBs and we don't have them. Harrison tries hard but doesn't get to the QB anymore. Woodley has gotten fat and happy on his big contract and is a non-factor. Our pass rush is pathetic and on track for one of the worst sack totals in two decades. Same with Interceptions. This is a two to three year trend and it is time to wake up a recognize we need a major change not a cosmetic one or waiting two to three more years to get the players to "maybe" turn it around.

[QUOTE=Oviedo;538427]I'll sing the old song "We need the 4-3!"

We don't have the players to successfully do the 3-4. You need dominant OLBs and we don't have them. Harrison tries hard but doesn't get to the QB anymore. Woodley has gotten fat and happy on his big contract and is a non-factor. Our pass rush is pathetic and on track for one of the worst sack totals in two decades. Same with Interceptions. This is a two to three year trend and it is time to wake up a recognize we need a major change not a cosmetic one or waiting two to three more years to get the players to "maybe" turn it around.[/QUOTE]

I fail to see how putting Woodley, Hood, Heyward and the rest in a 4-3 will make them anymore effective. The problem is not the scheme - it is the players.

[QUOTE=Slapstick;538380]Opponents "forced" 18 turnovers?

About 1/4 of those were actually "forced"...the rest were just crappy, bonehead plays....[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Steelhere10;538381]Turnovers come when the Qb is under duress especially Romo, yet the a Steelers refuse to bring the house on this guy and sit back and bring a 4 man rush all game. That's why the team haven't forced any.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="Oviedo"]Two weeks in a row against one of the worst OLs in the NFL and we can't touch the QB. Our pass rush makes them look like the Redskins' "Hogs" of the 80s. The inability to get real pressure on the QB renders this defense mediocre at best. [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="Jooser"]Yes, and the inability for the OL to create a push for the running game, RB's fumbling, WR's dropping passes, and Ben throwing INTs renders this offense LESS than mediocre. The whole team is sick, starting with the coaching staff down. [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="pfelix73"]We need to draft some potential play makers on defense........... [/QUOTE]

Any one of these statements has a whole lot more truth than Cook's article.

I think we also see how meaningless some statistics are. The Steelers (at least going into this last weekend) had the #1 defense in the NFL when going by yards allowed per game.
But in today's NFL, unless you get some turnovers, you're really not the #1 defense. In fact, you might be mediocre. In today's NFL, with the rules favoring the offense, you can't count on stopping the opponent, so you'd better, at times, get the ball away from them (you need pressure and playmakers on D), and you'd better have an offense that can score some points when you get the ball. We don't, and that's why we're sitting at 7-7, on the outside looking in.

[QUOTE=Steelhere10;538381]Turnovers come when the Qb is under duress especially Romo, yet the a Steelers refuse to bring the house on this guy and sit back and bring a 4 man rush all game. That's why the team haven't forced any.[/QUOTE]

I have to disagree a bit on that one. There were multiple times in the second half Romo was under immediate pressure due to a blitz, but had complete confidence to simply throw the ball (almost without looking) out to Bryant regardless of coverage, because he knew his guy could beat Lewis or Victorian (mostly Victorian). At one point on a 3rd and 4 Victorian was giving the WR on his side of the field a 12 yard cushion and Lewis was in press coverage.

Of all the injuries (excluding Ben) Ike Taylor going down hurt the most. Our pass defense went from really good to really bad in the past 3 weeks. Hopefully, Lewis will be able to go this weekend; if he isn't, AJ Green might be able to get into the HOF after one game playing against Victorian.

Romo was playing against practice squad corners yesterday. There were more than the one time described above where he clearly just threw it without looking knowing his guy was way better than any corner the Steelers had on the field.

Pappy

[QUOTE=phillyesq;538443]I fail to see how putting Woodley, Hood, Heyward and the rest in a 4-3 will make them anymore effective. The problem is not the scheme - it is the players.[/QUOTE]

Because you change the responsibilities for some players in a 4-3...you could just as easily make changes to the current 3-4, but not in the middle of the season....

[QUOTE=Slapstick;538453]Because you change the responsibilities for some players in a 4-3...you could just as easily make changes to the current 3-4, but not in the middle of the season....[/QUOTE]

On third and long, regardless of base scheme, the responsibility is generally to pressure the QB. There are some exceptions -- with some QBs, you want to keep them in the pocket or whatever - but essentially, you want some pressure.

The players are the problem with the pass rush more than the scheme.

[QUOTE=Slapstick;538453]Because you change the responsibilities for some players in a 4-3...you could just as easily make changes to the current 3-4, but not in the middle of the season....[/QUOTE]

Exactly. You put Woodley at DE and let him just go after the QB versus chasing receivers and constantly pulling his hamstring. Hodd goes after the QB versus "occupying" offensive linemen. All your DL would get more one on one match ups versus getting double teamed.

Plenty of great suggestions in here, and most lead toward the same theme- we need more plays on the Defense.

It could be that Warren Sapp was on to something. Our 'big plays' guys of the last 5 years are no longer making regular big plays- Harrison used to dominate 'games', now he can dominate the occasional play, but nowhere near the level of disruption he used to cause. Polamalu is probably not diminishing as much as some think he is, but you have to be concerned that he seems dinged up so often. Also, strangely, the defense actually looked 'better' this season without Troy. Keisel no longer appears in the backfield as much as he used to. Hampton no longer commands the same level of blocking as he used to. Even Ike has been more prone to 'grabbing on' to WR's this year in order to not lose his coverage.

These guys are getting old. They are losing a step, or two. And they can't be relied upon to dominate like they used to.

There are a couple of promising players on the roster- Keenan Lewis, obviously, Cortez Allen, Cameron Heyward, Jason Worilds... they all look like they can contribute. Dominate? Maybe, maybe not. The 2 CB's look like good guys- solid, strong- might not be Darrell Revis, but they'll be starting quality. Heyward is physically right. It's way too early to write him off- he needs gametime. Worilds looks good in patches.

If you were to ask Chadman how he'd go about revamping the Defense (excluding the shift to 4-3), it'd be as follows:

1. NT. Hampton is slowing down (or stopped), McClendon has not surpassed him to any level worthy of considering 'dominant'. Ta'amu needs to 'superman' himself after his brain-explosion. There is no 'genuine' progression plan in place at NT, and this is the position that needs to soak up blockers to make the OLB's & DE's & ILB's most effective. While stats won't ever back up the importance of this position- we need a new Hampton here, fast. No surprise the lack of genuine pressure on the QB has gone hand-in-hand with Hampton's regression.

2. Pass rushing OLB- while Chadman likes Worilds, unless he does something that makes us all think 'whoa', you can't just 'hope' he'll be a replacement for Harrison. While it's a real need, it could be that there is time to 'develop' one here so long as Worilds can step in as a starter for the short term.

3. Safeties- we need them. When Mundy & Allen are the back-ups to the aging starters, you need an upgrade. Not only that- we need playmakers that can cover & take the ball away. While Clark has been great, he's older than Troy. And Troy can't take the beating he gets every year without it catching up. These 2 are above the line, now, but it wouldn't take much for both of them to decline, and rapidly, at about the same time.

4. ILB- Foote isn't a long term answer & Sylvester hasn't come along like hoped. Spence, however, has 'playmaker' written all over him- so long as he comes back from his injury.

There are some problems with this team, going forward. But there are pieces in place- Timmons, Woodley, Hood (even though he's hated here), Lewis, Allen.... that's a nucleus right there. And looking at that group- there are playmakers there.

Get a few positions sorted, and this defense goes from 'good' to 'dominant'.

[QUOTE=Chadman;538567]Plenty of great suggestions in here, and most lead toward the same theme- we need more plays on the Defense.
[/QUOTE]

this begs a much more important question:

when is Schiavone going to race again? :cool:

[QUOTE=papillon;538451]I have to disagree a bit on that one. There were multiple times in the second half Romo was under immediate pressure due to a blitz, but had complete confidence to simply throw the ball (almost without looking) out to Bryant regardless of coverage, because he knew his guy could beat Lewis or Victorian (mostly Victorian). At one point on a 3rd and 4 Victorian was giving the WR on his side of the field a 12 yard cushion and Lewis was in press coverage.

Of all the injuries (excluding Ben) Ike Taylor going down hurt the most. Our pass defense went from really good to really bad in the past 3 weeks. Hopefully, Lewis will be able to go this weekend; if he isn't, AJ Green might be able to get into the HOF after one game playing against Victorian.

Romo was playing against practice squad corners yesterday. There were more than the one time described above where he clearly just threw it without looking knowing his guy was way better than any corner the Steelers had on the field.

Pappy[/QUOTE]OK let me ask you this, do you consider a 4 man rush a blitz in a 3-4 defense, I guess you can say that but really 4 rushers against 5 OL is not a blitz to me. I saw plenty of times Romo just sit in the pocket with no pressure at all and pick the D apart. I know it's hard to do when you have backup cb playing but even when we had healthy cb it has been a theme for this defense the last couple of years and if you want coincidence as to why there have been less TO for the defense I think that would be why, If you hurry the QB mainly ones who don't like pressure including Romo I think the TO will come. Phill Simms brought up a good point when he said there are three things that DL wants and two was don't get beat deep and tackle. Well you will be high in the rankings if you don't get beat deap, but guess what you want have many To's.

[QUOTE=hawaiiansteel;538618]this begs a much more important question:

when is Schiavone going to race again? :cool:[/QUOTE]

January 2 is what we are aiming for- 1100m 3 year old filly/mare race at "Royal" Doomben.... fingers crossed. ;) Track work has been, quote from the trainer, 'sensational'.

[QUOTE=Steelhere10;538636]OK let me ask you this, do you consider a 4 man rush a blitz in a 3-4 defense, I guess you can say that but really 4 rushers against 5 OL is not a blitz to me. I saw plenty of times Romo just sit in the pocket with no pressure at all and pick the D apart. I know it's hard to do when you have backup cb playing but even when we had healthy cb it has been a theme for this defense the last couple of years and if you want coincidence as to why there have been less TO for the defense I think that would be why, If you hurry the QB mainly ones who don't like pressure including Romo I think the TO will come. Phill Simms brought up a good point when he said there are three things that DL wants and two was don't get beat deep and tackle. Well you will be high in the rankings if you don't get beat deap, but guess what you want have many To's.[/QUOTE]

By definition a blitz is rushing more players than the offense has linemen to block them. Of course, I doubt that is the definition that anyone uses, because it wouldn't be a blitz then until you are rushing 6 defensive players. Lets say that Hood, Kiesel and Heyward are the linemen, that's three, then Harrison or Woodley makes the 4th, it's still not a blitz, but if Timmons, Foote or Polamalu come then in my mind you have a blitz. And, each of those three guys rushed the passer at different times yesterday. Timmons had his sack on what I believe was a "blitz", Foote made a play in the backfield or hurried Romo (I can't remember which exactly) and Polamalu was dancing with an offensive tackle a couple of times. The Steelers "blitzed" and Romo wasn't even worried about where he was going with the ball, he just threw it and it ended up a completion because of bad coverage.

It's why many sacks are a combination of coverage and pass rushing. If Ike's in the game yesterday, he may have had a pick or Lewis may have had a pick, because a couple of Romo's throws were made without setting his feet and without looking during what I would call a "blitz". I wish I had the video of the game to embed. I can remember thinking when I saw Romo just turn and heave it that there was no way the pass was getting to the intended receiver and then lo and behold Bryant shows up with a Steeler CB yards behind him. I was stunned that the pass could be completed.

Pappy

I'm going to rewatch the game maybe tonight or tomorrow and try and see but from game play memory I think I saw two occasions where the Steelers sent 5 and they both were in the same drive one was a completion to Autston on a out route. But when DL send a Timmons, Foote etc you will see one or both Olb drop into coverage thus still making it a4 man rush. I think also after the Brown fumble they sent allout blitz on the goal line twice. And from memory no completion for Romo.

Four men a blitz does not make. That has been the problem for two years now. Too predictable.

[QUOTE=Oviedo;538664]Four men a blitz does not make. That has been the problem for two years now. Too predictable.[/QUOTE]

And exactly how is your beloved 4-3 defense less predictable? Everyone know which 4 guys are rushing in a 4-3. Not so much with a 3-4 zone blitz scheme.

[QUOTE=RuthlessBurgher;538698]And exactly how is your beloved 4-3 defense less predictable? Everyone know which 4 guys are rushing in a 4-3. Not so much with a 3-4 zone blitz scheme.[/QUOTE]

Because the 4-3 is the base defense with a minimum of 4, not 3, rushing on every play. It isn't a blitz until you send one or two additional. Because you play the 4-3 doesn't mean you stop blitzing but you do generate more of a pass rush and pressure each and every play with 4 versus 3. In addition, those 4 DL aren't instructed to "occupy blockers" so the LBs can make a play. They are expected to make plays.

The "blitz" term is pretty much predicated on a 4-3 base...in the 4-3 base, you have 4 guys rushing the passer and 7 dropping into coverage...

So, a "blitz" would be when a 5th pass rusher goes after the QB...

Our "zone blitz" usually isn't an actual blitz in most cases...in the 3-4, any one of the LBs could be a pass rusher...with the zone blitz, a player that normally drops into coverage rushes the passer while another player drops into coverage...they may not send 5 rushers at all, but one of the four that they do send is someone who the QB is not supposed to expect...

QB pressure and TOs are related and I agree we are struggling in both categories this year...but the season would look a lot different if the offense and special teams could hold onto the ball...

[B]STAT THAT STICKS[/B]: 18 -- Turnovers by the Steelers over the past five weeks, the most in the NFL. Pittsburgh committed two critical ones Sunday: [URL="http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/_/id/13934/antonio-brown"]Antonio Brown[/URL]'s fumble in the fourth quarter and [URL="http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/_/id/5536/ben-roethlisberger"]Ben Roethlisberger[/URL]'s interception in overtime.


While I can't argue that the defense needs to generate more TOs, the opposite holds true for the other side of the ball. A quite frankly, the defense is playing well enough to win many of the games we lost...if only we didnt turn the ball over....

[B]Steelers’ D Getting a Pass Again?[/B]

Dec 18

I was once told by a fairly ‘respected’ Pittsburgh Steelers’ writer that statistics don’t mean anything when talking football. Stats, he said, “were for Skip Bayless.” While I don’t necessarily disagree with that sentiment, there are however some numbers you just can’t avoid discussing and that number continues to center around ‘one.’

The Steelers’ defense was ranked number one in the league entering last week’s game in Dallas and also rated number one against the pass. Has the defense played well this year? Considering the problems on offense in recent weeks I’d say yes, but then there is Denver and Oakland and Tennessee and then Sunday in Dallas.

Fans can complain and make points about the injuries on Sunday and while those may not be completely thrown out, they cannot be an excuse. Every team deals with injuries. It’s the nature of the beast and you need to accept it.

Tony Romo completed 30 of 42 passes for 341 yards and two touchdowns. He did not turn the ball over either which is something he typically does once or twice per week. When you have young guys in the secondary you have to find ways to help them and that falls on the guys along the front seven. Unfortunately, the pressure applied by these guys was minimal and far too infrequent. Had ‘Jerry World’ had a grass field, Romo still would have had a clean jersey at the end of the day.

James Harrison rarely got pressure and LaMarr Woodley was as absent as a Super Bowl Trophy in Cleveland. Yes, Harrison still made plays and that can’t go unmentioned, but both men are paid extremely well to get to the other team’s quarterback and Woodley especially is falling woefully short.

The front three, which we know are not necessarily responsible for getting pressure have done little of that anyway. Brett Keisel and Ziggy Hood have had their moments but have been far too inconsistent. Cam Heyward is starting to become a disappointment in my mind. Two years in now and I have yet to see significant plays from him.

I’m still waiting for an explanation as to where Steve McLendon is? The guy who impressed last season and during the preseason continues to see far too few snaps in my opinion. That isn’t a knock on Casey Hampton, but McLendon needs more time on defense especially in passing situations.

What we have to realize is this defense is no longer ‘BlitzBurgh’ and anyone thinking it is has not watched this team this year or last for that matter. The speed on the edges is gone. Harrison and Woodley have never really been speed rushers anyway the way a Jason Gildon once was. Teams no longer worry about having to get rid of the ball quickly and they have chip-blocked less and less through the season.

So how does this defense have such a strong ranking then right? This is not as difficult to explain as you might think. First of all, the Steelers might be first in total defense but they are eighth in points allowed at 20.8 points given up per game. You know how the defense has been on the field a lot the last two weeks? Believe it or not, they are second in the league in terms of how much time they are on the field. That makes the 20 points given up per game even more glaring.

Perhaps the most disturbing stat for this defense is that they rank 28th in the league in takeaways. After last year’s dead-last rating, many of us thought that was just a hiccup but it is becoming a trend. In three of the last five seasons, the Pittsburgh defense has rated 23rd or below in takeaways. In the two years they were better, they were in the top 10.

Compare the Steelers’ defense to the top 10 in takeaways in 2012 and you’ll notice only two teams in that group that aren’t in the playoff hunt. There’s a correlation there and it can’t be denied. Teams that limit scoring and create turnovers are just as good as teams that have number one rankings.

Yes, health is always an issue as it is for every team, but this team relies far too much on letting other teams make mistakes rather than forcing them. The ‘bend-don’t-break’ mentality of Dick LeBeau is out of touch and no longer applicable with today’s game and especially with this team’s talent or lack thereof. The defense has to get younger and more importantly faster on the edges. If that means putting Woodley back to his down position at end that he played in college then so be it.

As troubled as this offense is, the defense isn’t exactly a model of perfection despite their ranking either. There is only one ‘number one’ we should be concerned with at the end of the season and that’s the number one team in the league, not defense. After all, where did the number one defensive ranking get us last year?

[URL]http://network.yardbarker.com/nfl/article_external/steelers_d_getting_a_pass_again/12463375[/URL]

Great article Hawaiian. That's what I was sayin earlier, playing not to get beat deep and somewhat passive will keep the rankings high but the TO low.

[QUOTE=Oviedo;538701]Because the 4-3 is the base defense with a minimum of 4, not 3, rushing on every play. It isn't a blitz until you send one or two additional. Because you play the 4-3 doesn't mean you stop blitzing but you do generate more of a pass rush and pressure each and every play with 4 versus 3. In addition, those 4 DL aren't instructed to "occupy blockers" so the LBs can make a play. They are expected to make plays.[/QUOTE]

Again, on third and long, don't the players in the nickel have the same responsibility? Isn't Ziggy supposed to be getting after the QB?

I agree.. Why in the hell do we allow catches and then focus on tackle... why are we not going after the ball when opponent throws the ball!!!

[QUOTE=Steelhere10;538929]Great article Hawaiian. That's what I was sayin earlier, playing not to get beat deep and somewhat passive will keep the rankings high but the TO low.[/QUOTE]

It's also a winning strategy, provided that the offense doesn't turn the ball over 18 times in three games...

[QUOTE=phillyesq;538934]Again, on third and long, don't the players in the nickel have the same responsibility? Isn't Ziggy supposed to be getting after the QB?[/QUOTE]

It depends. Is Ziggy still responsible for two gaps in the nickel? If so, then he's not getting after the QB...

[QUOTE=hawaiiansteel;538925][B]Steelers’ D Getting a Pass Again?[/B]

Dec 18

I was once told by a fairly ‘respected’ Pittsburgh Steelers’ writer that statistics don’t mean anything when talking football. Stats, he said, “were for Skip Bayless.” While I don’t necessarily disagree with that sentiment, there are however some numbers you just can’t avoid discussing and that number continues to center around ‘one.’

The Steelers’ defense was ranked number one in the league entering last week’s game in Dallas and also rated number one against the pass. Has the defense played well this year? Considering the problems on offense in recent weeks I’d say yes, but then there is Denver and Oakland and Tennessee and then Sunday in Dallas.

Fans can complain and make points about the injuries on Sunday and while those may not be completely thrown out, they cannot be an excuse. Every team deals with injuries. It’s the nature of the beast and you need to accept it.

Tony Romo completed 30 of 42 passes for 341 yards and two touchdowns. He did not turn the ball over either which is something he typically does once or twice per week. When you have young guys in the secondary you have to find ways to help them and that falls on the guys along the front seven. Unfortunately, the pressure applied by these guys was minimal and far too infrequent. Had ‘Jerry World’ had a grass field, Romo still would have had a clean jersey at the end of the day.

James Harrison rarely got pressure and LaMarr Woodley was as absent as a Super Bowl Trophy in Cleveland. Yes, Harrison still made plays and that can’t go unmentioned, but both men are paid extremely well to get to the other team’s quarterback and Woodley especially is falling woefully short.

The front three, which we know are not necessarily responsible for getting pressure have done little of that anyway. Brett Keisel and Ziggy Hood have had their moments but have been far too inconsistent. Cam Heyward is starting to become a disappointment in my mind. Two years in now and I have yet to see significant plays from him.

I’m still waiting for an explanation as to where Steve McLendon is? The guy who impressed last season and during the preseason continues to see far too few snaps in my opinion. That isn’t a knock on Casey Hampton, but McLendon needs more time on defense especially in passing situations.

What we have to realize is this defense is no longer ‘BlitzBurgh’ and anyone thinking it is has not watched this team this year or last for that matter. The speed on the edges is gone. Harrison and Woodley have never really been speed rushers anyway the way a Jason Gildon once was. Teams no longer worry about having to get rid of the ball quickly and they have chip-blocked less and less through the season.

So how does this defense have such a strong ranking then right? This is not as difficult to explain as you might think. First of all, the Steelers might be first in total defense but they are eighth in points allowed at 20.8 points given up per game. You know how the defense has been on the field a lot the last two weeks? Believe it or not, they are second in the league in terms of how much time they are on the field. That makes the 20 points given up per game even more glaring.

Perhaps the most disturbing stat for this defense is that they rank 28th in the league in takeaways. After last year’s dead-last rating, many of us thought that was just a hiccup but it is becoming a trend. In three of the last five seasons, the Pittsburgh defense has rated 23rd or below in takeaways. In the two years they were better, they were in the top 10.

Compare the Steelers’ defense to the top 10 in takeaways in 2012 and you’ll notice only two teams in that group that aren’t in the playoff hunt. There’s a correlation there and it can’t be denied. Teams that limit scoring and create turnovers are just as good as teams that have number one rankings.

Yes, health is always an issue as it is for every team, but this team relies far too much on letting other teams make mistakes rather than forcing them. The ‘bend-don’t-break’ mentality of Dick LeBeau is out of touch and no longer applicable with today’s game and especially with this team’s talent or lack thereof. The defense has to get younger and more importantly faster on the edges. If that means putting Woodley back to his down position at end that he played in college then so be it.

As troubled as this offense is, the defense isn’t exactly a model of perfection despite their ranking either. There is only one ‘number one’ we should be concerned with at the end of the season and that’s the number one team in the league, not defense. After all, where did the number one defensive ranking get us last year?

[URL]http://network.yardbarker.com/nfl/article_external/steelers_d_getting_a_pass_again/12463375[/URL][/QUOTE]

Excellent article. Hits the nail on the head and accurately describes the issues that are on this defense that many don't want to see because they are too busy making excuses. However this is not a one season phenomenom. The trend has been there for the past few season if anyone wanted to see it.

The defense doesn't work anymore because it is too reliant of experienced veterans always being there and always being 100%. It does not allow a margin of error due to the excessive complexity and time it takes to be considered qualified to actually play. It's like an engine that has to be perfectly tuned all the time or it doesn't run.

Who have you heard arguing these points the last three seasons?

[QUOTE]The ‘bend-don’t-break’ mentality of Dick LeBeau is out of touch and no longer applicable with today’s game and especially with this team’s talent or lack thereof.[/QUOTE]

Putting out the template!

[QUOTE] If that means putting Woodley back to his down position at end that he played in college then so be it.[/QUOTE]

Needs to play DE!

[QUOTE]What we have to realize is this defense is no longer ‘BlitzBurgh’ and anyone thinking it is has not watched this team this year or last for that matter. The speed on the edges is gone. Harrison and Woodley have never really been speed rushers anyway the way a Jason Gildon once was. Teams no longer worry about having to get rid of the ball quickly and they have chip-blocked less and less through the season.[/QUOTE]

We don't really blitz because our OLBs are bullrushers and always have been.

Bottomline: Time to wake up and quit living in the past and change this defense!

[QUOTE=Oviedo;538946]Excellent article. Hits the nail on the head and accurately describes the issues that are on this defense that many don't want to see because they are too busy making excuses. However this is not a one season phenomenom. The trend has been there for the past few season if anyone wanted to see it.

The defense doesn't work anymore because it is too reliant of experienced veterans always being there and always being 100%. It does not allow a margin of error due to the excessive complexity and time it takes to be considered qualified to actually play. It's like an engine that has to be perfectly tuned all the time or it doesn't run.

Who have you heard arguing these points the last three seasons?



Putting out the template!



Needs to play DE!



We don't really blitz because our OLBs are bullrushers and always have been.

Bottomline: Time to wake up and quit living in the past and change this defense![/QUOTE]

The facts show that the defense still works.

[QUOTE=BURGH86STEEL;538956]The facts show that the defense still works.[/QUOTE]

No, the meaningless rankings based on yardage provide an illusion it works. The inability to make game changing plays, intercept the ball and sack the QB shows it doesn't work like it use to.

[QUOTE=Oviedo;538993]No, the meaningless rankings based on yardage provide an illusion it works. The inability to make game changing plays, intercept the ball and sack the QB shows it doesn't work like it use to.[/QUOTE]

Not really. The defense made some game changing plays vs the Cowboys. The defense made several stops vs the Cowboys. Stopping the opposition can be considered game changing moments. The special teams and offense killed the defenses moments in crunch time by giving the ball away.

Turnovers are nice but can't be counted on to win games every week. Creating turnovers isn't as important as giving the ball away. Take care of the football and you give your team a chance to win.

[B]Top-ranked Steelers defense lacking in big plays[/B]

By WILL GRAVES (AP Sports Writer) | The Associated Press
Thu, Dec 20, 2012

PITTSBURGH (AP) -- Every time a pass comes his way, Pittsburgh Steelers cornerback Keenan Lewis is faced with a choice: the ball or the man?

If Lewis chooses the ball, he knows he better be sure he can get a hand on it. If he chooses the man, Lewis knows he better bring the guy down, or else.

''You don't make that tackle, they score a touchdown on you and you might be coming out,'' Lewis said.

Lewis has proven to be a pretty shrewd decision-maker. His 21 pass breakups lead the NFL and he's rarely been beaten deep while serving as the backbone of a secondary that leads the NFL in fewest yards passing allowed.

The one thing Lewis hasn't done, is actually catch the ball. Then again, neither have the rest of his teammates on the league's top-ranked defense.

For all their responsible tackling, the Steelers (7-7) have lacked a certain menace this season, and it could cost them a playoff spot.

Heading into Sunday's game against Cincinnati (8-6), Pittsburgh ranks 27th in turnovers forced (13) and is tied for 23rd in sacks (27). Not exactly the formula that led the Steelers to three Super Bowl appearances - and two wins - in a six-season span from 2005 to 2010.

While the lengthy absences of safety Troy Polamalu, linebackers James Harrison and LaMarr Woodley and cornerback Ike Taylor have played a role in the drop, the Steelers insist there are plays to be made, they're just not making them.

''I've dropped a ball that hit me in my face against Kansas City,'' said safety Ryan Clark, who has three of Pittsburgh's seven interceptions. ''Keenan dropped one against Tennessee. (Larry) Foote's dropped balls. We've had opportunities and that's on us.''

Hall-of-Fame defensive coordinator Dick LeBeau isn't complaining. His job is to design schemes that slow opponents down. Getting the ball is a bonus.

''You can talk about a lot of statistics, but leading the league in yardage yielded is an important one,'' LeBeau said. ''Do we need more interceptions? Sure. We need more turnovers ... but every week we're trying to keep our football team in the game, keep the score in a manageable position.''

Something the Steelers have done as well as anyone in the league. The game-turning plays, however, have been sporadic. Pittsburgh is on pace for its fewest turnovers and sacks since LeBeau returned for a second stint as defensive coordinator in 2004.

Some of it is the byproduct of a defense in transition.

A unit that began the season with seven starters in their 30s now features a secondary with four cornerbacks - Lewis, Cortez Allen, Curtis Brown and Josh Victorian - 26 or younger. It's the same along the defensive line, where 26-year-old nose tackle Steve McLendon is now basically a co-starter with 35-year-old Casey Hampton. Ditto the linebackers, where 24-year-old Jason Worilds leads the team with five sacks.

The youth movement has forced LeBeau to tinker a bit with his game plan. The Steelers spend the early portion of the game letting the youngsters get their feet set before unleashing the complex blitzes that are LeBeau's trademarks.

''With the younger guys back there we hold off a little bit and kind of simplify and so guys can play a little bit faster and they kind of know what they're doing,'' Hampton said. ''At the same time when it's simple there really shouldn't be no big plays or anything like that.''

Big plays haven't killed the Steelers this season, but little ones. The proliferation of short passing attacks give the front seven less time to get to the quarterback and shorter routes mean fewer opportunities for defensive backs to get in front of the ball.

''You look at it we've probably been one of the best teams in the NFL this year taking away the deep ball,'' Lewis said. ''Teams ain't really trying to throw deep like that no more. When you don't have those plays, those short plays is (less) of a risk to make a mistake.''

The Steelers have allowed just 18 passes over 25 yards this season and opponents are averaging just 5.9 yards per pass attempt, the lowest in the league. Yet their inability to create turnovers has forced the offense to deal with long fields almost every time it gets the ball.

Clark pointed to a 34-24 loss to San Diego two weeks ago as proof that the defense needs to be more opportunistic. The Steelers held San Diego to three straight three-and-outs with the ball near midfield in the first half. Each time the Chargers pinned the Pittsburgh offense deep in its own end. Each time the Steelers ended up punting and the Chargers finally capitalized on the great field position.

''We weren't flipping the field because we didn't make a play, special teams didn't make play and the offense didn't make a play,'' Clark said. ''Flipping the field is a huge part of the play ... if you look at the games we lost, that's why we lost.''

Not exactly. The Steelers have committed 27 turnovers this season, seventh-most in the league. Those miscues have often put the defense in difficult situations, even if Clark and company refuse to use it as an excuse.

If Pittsburgh was coasting into the playoffs - as it did last year when it created just 17 turnovers - the lack of takeaways wouldn't be an issue. But the Steelers have dropped four of five and need to win out to play past Dec. 30. The season could come down to one or two tipped passes that turn into interceptions or one fumble that ends up with a guy in a black helmet on top of it.

''We definitely need to get more turnovers and sacks and things like that if we want to be successful,'' Hampton said.

[B]NOTES:[/B] Lewis missed practice on Thursday with a hip flexor and is questionable ... Polamalu sat out practice for the second straight day but it was not injury related.

[URL]http://sports.yahoo.com/news/top-ranked-steelers-defense-lacking-190806894--nfl.html;_ylt=A2KJ3Cau0NNQaEcAa.XwFAx[/URL].

I guess this games blows that theory....

While I agree that getting turn-overs and limiting them on offense is typically a recipe for success, the Steeler offense is so pathetic that it doesn't make a difference....

I don't know the numbers but I can assure you that we did not capitalize on many (if any) turn overs or special teams returns...

But you all can keep harping on the defense, how bad DL sucks, no sacks, no turn overs....blah, blah, blah....

The season was a failure because of the OFFENSE....PERIOD!!!!