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Nix is growing on me
Originally, I was annoyed at the prospect of taking Nix in the first; I felt like we already have too many high picks invested in our 3-4 DL, which had been able to function well on mid-round picks, other than Hampton, and then Hood and Heyward, where Hood was basically a bad 1st round pick.
With all our holes, it seemed having to go with another first rounder on a unit that really doesn't feature any play makers to begin with. Plus, Nix was hurt last year.
But, if the 3-4 really needs an immovable object at NT, I guess we got to do what we got to do if we are staying in the LeBoo system. Nix is a fit. He is a beast. He is a young Casey. And he seems like a good guy - no thug problems or worries there.
After watching interviews and his play on tape, I would be fine with them taking him in the first. That's not to say I wouldn't like other picks as well, like Dennard or Evans, but if they take Nix I won't run into traffic.
[video=youtube;IcJiW47eHrk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcJiW47eHrk[/video]
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I believe he has the potential to be better than Casey Hampton. Think Vince Wilfork in his prime. And if you add him next to Cam Heyward, you will see Heyward become one of the leagues best playmakers in the league.
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[QUOTE=Dee Dub;595899]I believe he has the potential to be better than Casey Hampton. Think Vince Wilfork in his prime. And if you add him next to Cam Heyward, you will see Heyward become one of the leagues best playmakers in the league.[/QUOTE]
Even his listed "cons" are not really legit. "He might get tired towards of end of game." Gee whiz, what 350 lb man won't. That is why Casey - and Nix more than likely - know when to pick and choose their spots to go all out. Big guys all have to know this. No giant guy can pour out full effort every play; it's not possible or they will be whipped, and, as they say, exhaustion makes cowards out of us all. One other knock was he can't keep up with running backs to tackle them if they go outside. Well, what 350 lb monster can? No one. He's not built to do that job. How is that a con? I bet he also can't cover a wide receiver in the open field either. Is that a con too? I am warming up to this pick if they go there. I also love that he has already grown up, and went through the state of being depressed because he was too out of shape at NDU. He hated it. And hopefully he won't go back to that phase. Listening to him, he seems fairly bright and a quality person. No chance of an Albert Haynesworth situation.
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Welcome to the dark side, guys!
FWIW, I heard he has a crazy sense of humor with the media... Could be entertaining, too!
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No thanks. He has already missed a significant part of a season with a balky knee. Carrying 350lbs isn't going to make that knee better and will continue to be an issue. The bottom line is that he isn't worth the #15 pick. He is a top 40 player in this draft not a top 15.
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[QUOTE=SteelerOfDeVille;595903]Welcome to the dark side, guys!....[/QUOTE]
I think what you meant to say was, "Welcome to the late freight DeVille!!"
I've been on Nix for a long time.
[URL]http://www.planetsteelers.com/forums/showthread.php/42202-Louis-Nix-III[/URL]
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[QUOTE=Oviedo;595906]No thanks. He has already missed a significant part of a season with a balky knee. Carrying 350lbs isn't going to make that knee better and will continue to be an issue. The bottom line is that he isn't worth the #15 pick. He is a top 40 player in this draft not a top 15.[/QUOTE]
There is nothing wrong with his knee. Nothing that has anyone concerned of lingering affects down the line. And you should have stopped there. The rest is embarrassing. Top 40 pick says you know very little about him.
What he would do for Cameron Heyward would be significant. As of right now, Heyward will draw the double team or chip. But have Nix next him and there is no way you can ever do that to Heyward. And incase you missed it, Heyward is a freight train about to take off.
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[QUOTE=Dee Dub;595908]I think what you meant to say was, "Welcome to the late freight DeVille!!"
I've been on Nix for a long time.
[URL]http://www.planetsteelers.com/forums/showthread.php/42202-Louis-Nix-III[/URL][/QUOTE]
nice. I'm not gonna search, but, he (and Mosley) have been my 2 choices from the jump. Improving the run d would help improve the overall d--even the pass d (by virtue of being in more 3rd and longs). A lot of guys are missing the boat here.
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I've cooled on Nix, though if we got him, I'd be... satisfied. I think he has low bust potential.
If he is Wilfork/Hampton ilk, I'm all-in. But I think about the Packer defense, with BJ Raji, as a warning sign. Raji looked every bit the monster that Nix could be, but in the end, he was so soft that they had to play him on the End (rather than at NT, where they drafted him to play). And as an effect, their D doesn't make opposing offenses one-dimensional.
For us to take Nix, I would have to be convinced that he is Vince Wilfork-level fatness. Not just any other big, fatman status. (After all, there are big fat guys coming down the pike all the time. e.g. Ta'amu)
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Our run D was atrocious last year. I never could have imagined it. We need the man at the bottom of the pyramid who unselfishly supports it all.
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I think we should trade out of the 15th spot and grab him around 20th-25th if we want to go that way, thats if anyone is willing to trade down. Grab an extra 3rd or whatever it would be. The only thing that would stop me would be if someone like Justin Gilbert is still on the board.
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I will take it one step farther. Not only would he help Heyward's game, but Vince Willliams as well.... I'd consider him at #15 if both of those CB's are already gone. Really think our pick is a CB though. Probably Dennard at this point as the other will be gone....
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[QUOTE]Originally, I was annoyed at the prospect of taking Nix in the first; I felt like we already have too many high picks invested in our 3-4 DL, which had been able to function well on mid-round picks, other than Hampton, and then Hood and Heyward, where Hood was basically a bad 1st round pick.
With all our holes, it seemed having to go with another first rounder on a unit that really doesn't feature any play makers to begin with. Plus, Nix was hurt last year. [/QUOTE]
Correct......up until this point
[QUOTE]But, if the 3-4 really needs an immovable object at NT, I guess we got to do what we got to do if we are staying in the LeBoo system. Nix is a fit. He is a beast. He is a young Casey. And he seems like a good guy - no thug problems or worries there. [/QUOTE]
Our defense was FINE without Hampton in the lineup when we had Farrior (a PROLIFIC tackler even as a Jet) and Deebo (BY FAR the best run stopping 3/4 OLBer of this era) or even Porter before him. 17-1 over about an eight or nine year stretch when Hampton was injured. He missed over half of one season and we still had the number one defense.
The problem this year aint just about NT. PEOPLE WE HAD A SIXTH ROUND NONAME Vince Williams at inside LB. Jarvis was a first rounder but EVEN IN COLLEGE he was no run stuffing beast anywhere NEAR Harrison. We have all of ONE good run stuffer at LB in Timmons (Worilds came on late in the season, and our run defense was much improved when he started coming on).
I would go MLB before NT.
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[QUOTE=Captain Lemming;595936]
The problem this year aint just about NT. PEOPLE WE HAD A SIXTH ROUND NONAME Vince Williams at inside LB. Jarvis was a first rounder but EVEN IN COLLEGE he was no run stuffing beast anywhere NEAR Harrison. We have all of ONE good run stuffer at LB in Timmons (Worilds came on late in the season, and our run defense was much improved when he started coming on).
[/QUOTE]
Glad someone else gets it. It's not fair to put all the blame on McLendon for our slide in run D.
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lol... our run defense was all VW and JJ's fault. hahahaha
I'd believe that if I wasn't watching our DL (especially our NT) get completely pushed off the ball.
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[QUOTE=BradshawsHairdresser;595941]Glad someone else gets it. It's not fair to put all the blame on McLendon for our slide in run D.[/QUOTE]
this issue can also be referred to as the Loss of Foote. However, at least we have able bodies to man that post. Nobody on the team is truly built to handle the 3-4 NT position.
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[QUOTE=Discipline of Steel;595944]this issue can also be referred to as the Loss of Foote. However, at least we have able bodies to man that post. Nobody on the team is truly built to handle the 3-4 NT position.[/QUOTE]
Yea... we really missed a guy that gets trucked by RBs after 3-4 yard gains. But his "tackle" stats look good.
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[QUOTE=steelz09;595947]Yea... we really missed a guy that gets trucked by RBs after 3-4 yard gains. But his "tackle" stats look good.[/QUOTE]
Well, at least he was in the right place and made tackles.
[QUOTE="Discipline of Steel"]Nobody on the team is truly built to handle the 3-4 NT position. [/QUOTE]
I think McLendon might be moved to DE, if the Steelers, as I expect they will, draft a NT. I hope they don't spend a first-rounder on Nix. IMO, they can get better value by waiting in the draft. I'd like to see them spend their first-round pick on a playmaker.
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[QUOTE=sick beats;595898]if they take Nix I won't run into traffic.[/QUOTE]
Now that deserves to go in the underhanded compliment Hall of Fame.
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[QUOTE=steelz09;595947]Yea... we really missed a guy that gets trucked by RBs after 3-4 yard gains. But his "tackle" stats look good.[/QUOTE]
Tackle "stats" mean he made the tackle.
Foote is no Farrior, true.
But I will take getting trucked and allowing 4 yards over a 6 round rookie "replacement" does not make the tackle at all so that William Gay can make the play after twenty yards.
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[QUOTE=BradshawsHairdresser;595950]Well, at least he was in the right place and made tackles.
I think McLendon might be moved to DE, if the Steelers, as I expect they will, draft a NT. I hope they don't spend a first-rounder on Nix. IMO, they can get better value by waiting in the draft. I'd like to see them spend their first-round pick on a playmaker.[/QUOTE]
Money post.
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Nix is not worthy of Top-15 pick.
Steelers run defense did not have issues when Steve mcClendon was in the game. I prefer WR/CB/TE in Rd 1.
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I don't know how good Nix will be as an NFL player, but I do know this...
Even in today's "pass happy" NFL, if the career of Casey Hampton was available at 15 I would grab him. NT is not only a run stuffing position. Even in pass D, a Casey Hampton does not get onto the QB for the sack, but he frees up others, he eliminates passing lanes and options, he forces protection. Reading stats tells me that a NT like Hampton is not important, but my eyes tell me different.
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[QUOTE=steeler_fan_in_t.o.;595990]I don't know how good Nix will be as an NFL player, but I do know this...
Even in today's "pass happy" NFL, if the career of Casey Hampton was available at 15 I would grab him. NT is not only a run stuffing position. Even in pass D, a Casey Hampton does not get onto the QB for the sack, but he frees up others, he eliminates passing lanes and options, he forces protection. Reading stats tells me that a NT like Hampton is not important, but my eyes tell me different.[/QUOTE]
No one is denying importance of a NT but Steelers already have 3 NT on roster. Steve, Cam and Fangupo. Steelers fan are saying move mcClendon to DE but we don't know if Steelers coaches think that way.
Also can Nix fix Steelers Defense by playing as a rookie?? Normal curve for a Steelers DL to start is 3 years. Its better to draft a NT in mid-round and develop him to take starter role in 3 years rather than picking a player at 15 and make him ride the pine for 3 yrs.
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[QUOTE=grotonsteel;595992]No one is denying importance of a NT but Steelers already have 3 NT on roster. Steve, Cam and Fangupo. Steelers fan are saying move mcClendon to DE but we don't know if Steelers coaches think that way.
Also can Nix fix Steelers Defense by playing as a rookie?? Normal curve for a Steelers DL to start is 3 years. Its better to draft a NT in mid-round and develop him to take starter role in 3 years rather than picking a player at 15 and make him ride the pine for 3 yrs.[/QUOTE]
The NT and the DEs have different responsibilities...IIRC, a 0 tech NT can learn their responsibilities much more easily than a 5 tech DE...
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[QUOTE=Slapstick;595994]The NT and the DEs have different responsibilities...IIRC, a 0 tech NT can learn their responsibilities much more easily than a 5 tech DE...[/QUOTE]
Kimo V started as a NT made the switch and was better as an end.
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[QUOTE=steeler_fan_in_t.o.;595990]I don't know how good Nix will be as an NFL player, but I do know this...
Even in today's "pass happy" NFL, if the career of Casey Hampton was available at 15 I would grab him. NT is not only a run stuffing position. Even in pass D, a Casey Hampton does not get onto the QB for the sack, but he frees up others, he eliminates passing lanes and options, he forces protection. Reading stats tells me that a NT like Hampton is not important, but my eyes tell me different.[/QUOTE]
Number one defense, most Steeler wins EVER at 15-1, beat BOTH SB teams, during the only season in Hamptons career that he missed 10 games.
The one loss was one of the few games he played in.
Is Hoke as good as Casey? Of course not.
The point is that we NEVER EVER missed him all that much when he was out and our linebackers were solid.
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The only way I take Nix is if he is our last resort at #15. That would mean...Dennard, Gilbert, Mosley and even Lee have to be gone before I would take Nix.
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[QUOTE=Captain Lemming;596035]Number one defense, most Steeler wins EVER at 15-1, beat BOTH SB teams, during the only season in Hamptons career that he missed 10 games.
The one loss was one of the few games he played in.
Is Hoke as good as Casey? Of course not.
The point is that we NEVER EVER missed him all that much when he was out and our linebackers were solid.[/QUOTE]
Hoke was no Casey, but he was good. Hoke would be a much better option than any potential NT we currently have.
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[QUOTE=grotonsteel;595992]No one is denying importance of a NT but Steelers already have 3 NT on roster. Steve, Cam and Fangupo. Steelers fan are saying move mcClendon to DE but we don't know if Steelers coaches think that way.
Also can Nix fix Steelers Defense by playing as a rookie?? Normal curve for a Steelers DL to start is 3 years. [B]Its better to draft a NT in mid-round and develop him to take starter role in 3 years rather than picking a player at 15 and make him ride the pine for 3 yrs[/B].[/QUOTE]
Exactly, couldn't have said it better myself.
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[QUOTE=Captain Lemming;596035]Number one defense, most Steeler wins EVER at 15-1, beat BOTH SB teams, during the only season in Hamptons career that he missed 10 games.
The one loss was one of the few games he played in.
Is Hoke as good as Casey? Of course not.
The point is that we NEVER EVER missed him all that much when he was out and our linebackers were solid.[/QUOTE]
NT isn't important... just ask future HOFer Ray Lewis whom practically begged the Ravens FO to draft Ngata. I don't understand why he would need a NT.... Being such a great ILB, why would he need or want a great NT? Seems bizarre, I know.
Clearly, SF just doesn't get it. They are absolutely stacked at LB and they signed Glenn Dorsey last year to a 2 year / 7 mil contract. Now, why would SF even worry about the NT position when they have the best LBs in the league???? Hmmm... bizarre.
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[QUOTE=grotonsteel;595992]No one is denying importance of a NT but Steelers already have 3 NT on roster. Steve, Cam and Fangupo. Steelers fan are saying move mcClendon to DE but we don't know if Steelers coaches think that way.
Also can Nix fix Steelers Defense by playing as a rookie?? Normal curve for a Steelers DL to start is 3 years. Its better to draft a NT in mid-round and develop him to take starter role in 3 years rather than picking a player at 15 and make him ride the pine for 3 yrs.[/QUOTE]
most self-contradictory post of the day. "Not denying importance, but, we got 3 bodies there"...
If we're thinking he's Casey all over again, didn't Casey start as a rook?
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Nix is a top 40 player, taking him at 15 is silly.
Cam Thomas is not the best player out there but I think signing him closes the door on reaching for Nix at 15, Nix is still very much in play in the second round
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[QUOTE=K Train;596062]Nix is a top 40 player, taking him at 15 is silly.
Cam Thomas is not the best player out there but I think signing him closes the door on reaching for Nix at 15, Nix is still very much in play in the second round[/QUOTE]
I agree with this. If we were talking about drafting 25-30 Nix would be in play but #15 is just too high especially when it means you could be possibly passing on guys like Gilbert, Dennard, Evans, Marquise Lee, Ebron, Hageman, etc.
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[QUOTE=Oviedo;596063]I agree with this. If we were talking about drafting 25-30 Nix would be in play but #15 is just too high especially when it means you could be possibly passing on guys like Gilbert, Dennard, Evans, Marquise Lee, Ebron, Hageman, etc.[/QUOTE]
I agree. Nix would be fine late in the first or if he fell to the second, but I don't like him at 15. I think it is very important to have a good NT, but I'm not convinced that Nix is that guy.
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[QUOTE=Oviedo;596063]I agree with this. If we were talking about drafting 25-30 Nix would be in play but #15 is just too high especially when it means you could be possibly passing on guys like Gilbert, Dennard, Evans, Marquise Lee, Ebron, Hageman, etc.[/QUOTE]
I entirely agree with that list too
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[FONT=Comic Sans MS][FONT=Comic Sans MS][B]A Smith & Von Oelhoffen were the DEs Hamptons rookie year ('01) . Von Oelhoffen played inside & outside his first year here which was also Kevin Henry's last year ('00). A Smith & Henry were the DE's with Von Oelhoffen in the middle. Von Oelhoffen would slide outside in rotation for Clancy to come in at NT. They liked Von Oelhoffen better at DE so the slid him outside when they allowed Henry to sign with the Bengals. They drafted Hampton that same year. [/B][FONT=Comic Sans MS][B]Hampton started as a rookie in week 7 replacing a struggling Kendrick Clancy at NT. [/B][B]Von Oelhoffen went back inside in '04 when Hampton was lost for the year.[/B][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]
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[QUOTE=grotonsteel;595992]No one is denying importance of a NT but Steelers already have 3 NT on roster. Steve, Cam and Fangupo. [/QUOTE]
Steve was benched last year.
Cam was benched in San Diego last year.
Fangupo could not get on the field last year.
Going to camp with those three does not indicate that the team places much importance on the position.
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[QUOTE=SteelerOfDeVille;596049]most self-contradictory post of the day. "Not denying importance, but, we got 3 bodies there"...
If we're thinking he's Casey all over again, didn't Casey start as a rook?[/QUOTE]
If a 1st rounder NT can't start as a rookie, then let's just quit. What on earth doesn't a rookie NT know to prevent him from playing? Will he be dropping into coverage much? How many reads does he need? It is not just his job to basically clog up the middle and just push up inside the pocket? What is there to learn? Line up over center and push guys around as much as possible, not allowing the OC or OG to make contact on the LBs. What, do they need to also engineer a rocket to Mars in the meantime?
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[QUOTE=phillyesq;596066]I think it is very important to have a good NT, but I'm not convinced that Nix is that guy.[/QUOTE]
Ask Manti T'eo if he helped...