Optimistic OL take

[whisper]

https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2022/4/18/23025298/state-of-the-pittsburgh-pittsburgh-steelers-offensive-line-pre-2022-nfl-draft-edition-news-update

Reading that, we don't even need to draft for the OL; that would be tragic if the team felt like this take. Both OTs are well below average, both. C is below avg., regardless of who they have in there. OGs may attain avg. status if they are lucky. And for that, everything is so solid we don't even need to draft any OLmen? Maybe one for depth?

Benedict must be looking for some Rooney perks with this piece.

[Buzz]

The addition of Daniels was very helpful, but this is still a sub-par OL

I'd love to see us add a talented player or two to the mix, whether through the draft or FA

[SteelerOfDeVille]

https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2022/4/18/23025298/state-of-the-pittsburgh-pittsburgh-steelers-offensive-line-pre-2022-nfl-draft-edition-news-update

Reading that, we don't even need to draft for the OL; that would be tragic if the team felt like this take. Both OTs are well below average, both. C is below avg., regardless of who they have in there. OGs may attain avg. status if they are lucky. And for that, everything is so solid we don't even need to draft any OLmen? Maybe one for depth?

Benedict must be looking for some Rooney perks with this piece.
dude, a little earlier today (another thread) i was saying that it's possible that the team doesn't see O-Line as a need...

As i really looked at the offseason moves, I believe that THEY believe they've done enough... they think they fixed the interior, Moore Jr did decent for a rook and should improve. And Chuks was signed to start at RT. Anything they do is for depth, but mostly because they have bigger needs.

[Northern_Blitz]

Me: Sees thread title.
Still me: Sees author of thread.

<curiously clicks>

Me again: Realizes that title has nothing to do with the author's post...as expected.

[Northern_Blitz]

dude, a little earlier today (another thread) i was saying that it's possible that the team doesn't see O-Line as a need...

As i really looked at the offseason moves, I believe that THEY believe they've done enough... they think they fixed the interior, Moore Jr did decent for a rook and should improve. And Chuks was signed to start at RT. Anything they do is for depth, but mostly because they have bigger needs.

Sounds like the structure of Chuck's contract makes it so that he gets paid like a starter, but there's little dead money if he gets cut.

I think this is a smart move.

If a guy we think can start this year or next year falls to us, we can draft him.

If not and Chucks struggles, we can cut him and address the position in UFA or in the draft next season.

I don't think we'll draft an interior OL...although I liked what I read about Zion and wanted him to be the pick before we made the OL moves we did in the summer. Maybe we still make a pick like that if he falls? Maybe that's the benefit of having many of our iOL guys being able to play multiple positions?

[SidSmythe]

As much as I love "Skill" Positions and I go over the Current Roster - the Elephant in the Room is still the OL.
Daniels is a good addition but lets not forget the Steelers are still waiting to see if MOORE & CHUKS live up to their potential.
Having said that . . . good chance one doesn't and lets not forget injuries.

If there's an OL on the Board that is versatile enough to play OG and OT or OG and C - you gotta take them.

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

As i really looked at the offseason moves, I believe that THEY believe they've done enough... they think they fixed the interior, Moore Jr did decent for a rook and should improve. And Chuks was signed to start at RT. Anything they do is for depth, but mostly because they have bigger needs.

What they have at tackle is a situation where if they draft a tackle he will not be forced into the day one starting lineup as Green and Moore were last year. I can't believe that anyone in the FO believes that the position is settled.

[Oviedo]

I think we need an OT for sure by Round 4 and probably an IOL late.

[Joel Buchsbaum]

I think we need an OT for sure by Round 4 and probably an IOL late.

Agree but i don''t want to spemd a pick on a " bench " player in rounds 1-4 as we have two long term contracts at tackle. Personally I would have low ballled Chucks. He's not very good. Who else tried to sigh him?

[Buzz]

Agree but i don''t want to spemd a pick on a " bench " player in rounds 1-4 as we have two long term contracts at tackle. Personally I would have low ballled Chucks. He's not very good. Who else tried to sigh him?

I think we were bidding against ourselves?

[Ernie]

I'm fine with a stud OT in round 1. I'm honestly hoping for DT, OT, or S in that particular order.

[NorthCoast]

I'm fine with a stud OT in round 1. I'm honestly hoping for DT, OT, or S in that particular order.Only Penning might drop to 1.20 on Day 1 and I wouldn't take him at that point. OL is the easiest position to project success in the NFL. I wouldn't look at OL until at least Day 2 or maybe Day 3.

[SteelerOfDeVille]

3) Nicholas Petit-Frere, OT, Ohio State

This is the type of pick I'd like to see at OT... Someone capable of giving them competition, but not a 1st or 2nd rounder

[Ernie]

This is the type of pick I'd like to see at OT... Someone capable of giving them competition, but not a 1st or 2nd rounder

A Dan Moore/Chuks Okafor mid round type of pick?

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

Usually when I look at football scenarios like this one I try to evaluate using three metrics: hope (ceiling), expectation, and floor. I'd say that the good news going into this season is that right now the OL is higher than the performance we saw last year. The bad news is that there is still a long way to go.

[SteelerOfDeVille]

A Dan Moore/Chuks Okafor mid round type of pick?
Would I like to have a 1st round OT? Sure? But not more than I'd like to have a 1st round DT/DE/CB/SS/WR. It's simply a matter of priority.

[flippy]

https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2022/4/18/23025298/state-of-the-pittsburgh-pittsburgh-steelers-offensive-line-pre-2022-nfl-draft-edition-news-update

Reading that, we don't even need to draft for the OL; that would be tragic if the team felt like this take. Both OTs are well below average, both. C is below avg., regardless of who they have in there. OGs may attain avg. status if they are lucky. And for that, everything is so solid we don't even need to draft any OLmen? Maybe one for depth?

Benedict must be looking for some Rooney perks with this piece.

The QB and the play calling dictated the OLine performance last year.

Everyone gets a mulligan.

We could have had 5 pro bowlers up front and they would have struggled given their QB couldn’t move and this could barely hold the ball past 2 seconds.

D’s had 5 yards to defend. They could put 11 in the box without any fear of getting beat. How do 5 guys block 11?

There was really almost nothing the linemen could do.

[Captain Lemming]

Me: Sees thread title.
Still me: Sees author of thread.

<curiously clicks>

Me again: Realizes that title has nothing to do with the author's post...as expected.

That is EXACTLY what happened to me.

What? whisper started a positive thread... no way...

No way was right.

[whisper]

dude, a little earlier today (another thread) i was saying that it's possible that the team doesn't see O-Line as a need...

As i really looked at the offseason moves, I believe that THEY believe they've done enough... they think they fixed the interior, Moore Jr did decent for a rook and should improve. And Chuks was signed to start at RT. Anything they do is for depth, but mostly because they have bigger needs.

If you're right, it's a crying shame, but totally possible and plausible. Green was trash at C last year, but a rookie and mostly playing a new position (something this team seems to live for). The two new OGs, plus hopefully Dotson may mean we are "OK" at OG. But the OTs are clearly below average. Add it all up, and it's still one of the weakest OLs in the NFL.

[whisper]

Me: Sees thread title.
Still me: Sees author of thread.

<curiously clicks>

Me again: Realizes that title has nothing to do with the author's post...as expected.

Me: baffled how one could conclude the above. It was clearly a pie-in-the-sky take on the state of the OL. One of the very worst OLs in the NFL adds two very average OGs and we are supposed to think it's all good.

[Ernie]

Would I like to have a 1st round OT? Sure? But not more than I'd like to have a 1st round DT/DE/CB/SS/WR. It's simply a matter of priority.

That's debatable.. depending on if Tuitt comes back.. and we resign Edmunds... I also think our CB quality/depth is better than OL.
I'd be fine with a stud WR in round 1..

[SteelerOfDeVille]

That's debatable.. depending on if Tuitt comes back.. and we resign Edmunds... I also think our CB quality/depth is better than OL.
I'd be fine with a stud WR in round 1..
Fair, but ranking the needs is a whole other discussion.

The general point was that with your 1st round pick, you hit your weakest link if the player fits, then go BPA if you're solid all around (which this team is not).

Unless Cross falls, there isn't a OT that fits their M.O. (Penning and Raimann aren't Power-5 players and are VERY unlikely for this team in the 1st).

That leaves other needs, or BPA

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

Fair, but ranking the needs is a whole other discussion.

The general point was that with your 1st round pick, you hit your weakest link if the player fits, then go BPA if you're solid all around (which this team is not).

Unless Cross falls, there isn't a OT that fits their M.O. (Penning and Raimann aren't Power-5 players and are VERY unlikely for this team in the 1st).

That leaves other needs, or BPA

Funny, just saw a mock on NFL.com where Cross fell and the Steelers nabbed him. He fell because there was a huge rush on QBs. That is my hope, that a couple of QBs go early and the floodgates open (I think that was Carolina, Atlanta, Seattle, then New Orleans trading up). With 4 QBs moving up, someone we covet has to drop.

[Steel Maniac]

I think that if they think we are fine on the O-line right now, then Colbert is still in the bottom basement shopping mentality regarding building the O-line. Not only do you not know if these guys are going to pan out but we are also still thin in depth. We need to take a tackle in the first 3 rounds. A guy who can come in and play ( if need be).

Look at our recent years of injuries on the O-line. And some say we don’t need to take one or two this draft??

[hawaiiansteel]

I think that if they think we are fine on the O-line right now, then Colbert is still in the bottom basement shopping mentality regarding building the O-line. Not only do you not know if these guys are going to pan out but we are also still thin in depth. We need to take a tackle in the first 3 rounds. A guy who can come in and play ( if need be).

Look at our recent years of injuries on the O-line. And some say we don’t need to take one or two this draft??

if only we had drafted Adrian Ealy like you wanted all of our problems at OT would be solved. :roll:

[steeler_george]

The QB and the play calling dictated the OLine performance last year.

Everyone gets a mulligan.

We could have had 5 pro bowlers up front and they would have struggled given their QB couldn’t move and this could barely hold the ball past 2 seconds.

D’s had 5 yards to defend. They could put 11 in the box without any fear of getting beat. How do 5 guys block 11?

There was really almost nothing the linemen could do.

Add in we we were suckered punched in the face with Decastro out, Dotson not up to par, and Finney, Haus all injuried in mini camp.
Then the seson started, and the injury bug killed us at the Guard position.
There was no continuity...
No way to evaluate talent.

Hopefully we will at least have that ( continuity) which sometimes adds levels to the talent.

[steeler_george]

But if do build the OL, it always starts inside to outside.

Adding Zion would be a great way to start.
He can compete at Guard and Center

Zion-Cole/Green-Daniels
Dotson-Zion/Cole/Greem-Daniels

I might even trade Green for a 5th.

There is some good talent also in the 3rd 4th. ( Strang, Goed)

[NorthCoast]

I think that if they think we are fine on the O-line right now, then Colbert is still in the bottom basement shopping mentality regarding building the O-line. Not only do you not know if these guys are going to pan out but we are also still thin in depth. We need to take a tackle in the first 3 rounds. A guy who can come in and play ( if need be).

Look at our recent years of injuries on the O-line. And some say we don’t need to take one or two this draft??In the Colbert era, they've drafted 14 OTs, none in the 1st rd. I don't expect that to change this year. They've also picked DT 14 times since Colbert started. Twice in the first round; Hampton and Hood. Their hit rate on both positions has been less than 50%.

TBH, the 'safe pick' might be LB or WR since their hit rates seem to be better.

[Northern_Blitz]

if only we had drafted Adrian Ealy like you wanted all of our problems at OT would be solved. :roll:

https://wompampsupport.azureedge.net/fetchimage?siteId=7575&v=2&jpgQuality=100&width=700&url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.kym-cdn.com%2Fphotos%2Fimages%2Fnewsfeed%2F000%2F954%2 F323%2F394.jpg

:rolleyes:

[Ernie]

In the Colbert era, they've drafted 14 OTs, none in the 1st rd. I don't expect that to change this year. They've also picked DT 14 times since Colbert started. Twice in the first round; Hampton and Hood. Their hit rate on both positions has been less than 50%.

TBH, the 'safe pick' might be LB or WR since their hit rates seem to be better.

Not sure Hood was a miss. He hung around the league several years after leaving Pitt.
And I'm honestly not sure our "Hit rate" at WR is higher than 50%..
We have a reputation for finding gems in the draft.. but if we go back a few years... Wheaton, Coates. Martavious Bryant, and more recently... Juju, James Washington... and the jury is still out on Claypool... I'm not sure we are much more the average in that regard..
I think finding AB in the 6th has given us the above mentioned reputation and I'm not sure it is well earned at this point (recent years).

[Northern_Blitz]

Not sure Hood was a miss. He hung around the league several years after leaving Pitt.
And I'm honestly not sure our "Hit rate" at WR is higher than 50%..
We have a reputation for finding gems in the draft.. but if we go back a few years... Wheaton, Coates. Martavious Bryant, and more recently... Juju, James Washington... and the jury is still out on Claypool... I'm not sure we are much more the average in that regard..
I think finding AB in the 6th has given us the above mentioned reputation and I'm not sure it is well earned at this point (recent years).

Good point on the WRs.

I think we draft lots of WRs, so it's easier to remember the hits.

I also think it's easier to hit on WRs when you have a HoF QB. And we were fortunate to have that for a long period of time.

[Steel Maniac]

In the Colbert era, they've drafted 14 OTs, none in the 1st rd. I don't expect that to change this year. They've also picked DT 14 times since Colbert started. Twice in the first round; Hampton and Hood. Their hit rate on both positions has been less than 50%.

TBH, the 'safe pick' might be LB or WR since their hit rates seem to be better.

Your right about “ the safe picks” and I see where your going as far as how Colbert has drafted in the past. I guess we first have to see who falls to us; hoping at least 3 Qb’s go before our pick would truly help us.

With that said, we we could / should go DT in the first round. But Loyd is so tempting thou….

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

Not sure Hood was a miss. He hung around the league several years after leaving Pitt.
And I'm honestly not sure our "Hit rate" at WR is higher than 50%..
We have a reputation for finding gems in the draft.. but if we go back a few years... Wheaton, Coates. Martavious Bryant, and more recently... Juju, James Washington... and the jury is still out on Claypool... I'm not sure we are much more the average in that regard..
I think finding AB in the 6th has given us the above mentioned reputation and I'm not sure it is well earned at this point (recent years).

you missed good 'ol Limas Sweed for the top of that list.

[Northern_Blitz]

you missed good 'ol Limas Sweed for the top of that list.

It's too bad because he seemed to be really good at getting open.

[SteelerOfDeVille]

I think that if they think we are fine on the O-line right now, then Colbert is still in the bottom basement shopping mentality regarding building the O-line. Not only do you not know if these guys are going to pan out but we are also still thin in depth. We need to take a tackle in the first 3 rounds. A guy who can come in and play ( if need be).

Look at our recent years of injuries on the O-line. And some say we don’t need to take one or two this draft??
I don't think anyone is saying "don't need"... it's more of an expectation.

My gut says that the *FO thinks* they've covered it sufficiently, unless the right guy falls.

[SteelerOfDeVille]

Not sure Hood was a miss. He hung around the league several years after leaving Pitt.
And I'm honestly not sure our "Hit rate" at WR is higher than 50%..
We have a reputation for finding gems in the draft.. but if we go back a few years... Wheaton, Coates. Martavious Bryant, and more recently... Juju, James Washington... and the jury is still out on Claypool... I'm not sure we are much more the average in that regard..
I think finding AB in the 6th has given us the above mentioned reputation and I'm not sure it is well earned at this point (recent years).
I think that reputation is more about hitting BIG on those mid-to-late rounders.

At one point, you had Wallace beside Ward with AB and Sanders as backups on one roster.
As you lost Sanders and Wallace, you had AB, Martavis, Coates and Wheaton all on the same team.
You lose those guys (including AB) and go get DJ to compliment Claypool and JuJu.

You'd be hard pressed to find a team throughout the league that has found that kind of talent at any single position during the last 12 years, never-mind the fact that about half of them were rounds 4-6. It's not that there aren't misses, but the hits are HUGE hits and the reputation was deserved.

Having said all that, sometimes that's also impacted by a QB having a preference - look at Cooper Kupp's 1-year turn around with a new QB.

[Ernie]

I think that reputation is more about hitting BIG on those mid-to-late rounders.

At one point, you had Wallace beside Ward with AB and Sanders as backups on one roster.
As you lost Sanders and Wallace, you had AB, Martavis, Coates and Wheaton all on the same team.
You lose those guys (including AB) and go get DJ to compliment Claypool and JuJu.

You'd be hard pressed to find a team throughout the league that has found that kind of talent at any single position during the last 12 years, never-mind the fact that about half of them were rounds 4-6. It's not that there aren't misses, but the hits are HUGE hits and the reputation was deserved.

Having said all that, sometimes that's also impacted by a QB having a preference - look at Cooper Kupp's 1-year turn around with a new QB.

We had a great run on WRs with Wallace and AB. Sanders never really hit his stride until he went to Denver. Had he stayed.. I have little doubt he would have been productive (to a lesser degree)

[SteelerOfDeVille]

We had a great run on WRs with Wallace and AB. Sanders never really hit his stride until he went to Denver. Had he stayed.. I have little doubt he would have been productive (to a lesser degree)
Sander's problem was he was borderline pro bowl talent, but 4th best on the team (behind Hines, Wallace and AB)... heckuva stable right there

[Ernie]

Sander's problem was he was borderline pro bowl talent, but 4th best on the team (behind Hines, Wallace and AB)... heckuva stable right there

If I remember correctly.. he actually came out of the gate a little faster than AB.. but an injury sent him down the depth chart... and the rest was history.

[Captain Lemming]

Sander's problem was he was borderline pro bowl talent, but 4th best on the team (behind Hines, Wallace and AB)... heckuva stable right there

Yet he has a ring unlike Brown and Wallace.

Again to my point about the folly of paying big bucks for the position.

[Captain Lemming]

If I remember correctly.. he actually came out of the gate a little faster than AB.. but an injury sent him down the depth chart... and the rest was history.

Sanders was given opportunity first as a premium pick. I said on this forum Brown looked better as soon as he had a chance to perform while listed behind Sanders.

[whisper]

I don't think anyone is saying "don't need"... it's more of an expectation.

My gut says that the *FO thinks* they've covered it sufficiently, unless the right guy falls.

The FO probably agrees with this article, which is crap on a cracker. Their moves were hardly enough to build a solid OL, not even close.

[Ernie]

Yet he has a ring unlike Brown and Wallace.

Again to my point about the folly of paying big bucks for the position.

Thinkin AB picked up a ring with TB last year..
But I agree wholeheartedly about your point related to paying big money for WRs.

[SteelerMaine83]

I think the point is that the team thinks it has starter capable players at all positions at this point. That doesn't mean they won't look to upgrade on make "future" picks at OL or anywhere else.

However, I do believe they improved their OL a good bit this off-season. Daniels is an above average OG who's young and best years are still ahead. Cole, who is much maligned here, grades as a slightly below average OG but an above average C. Both PFF and the articles written on him when he took over at C were very complementary. Could be a young player that finally found his spot/groove and is ascending. Dotson should be back and healthy--despite being a doghouse player on the team (for some reason), we were much better when he was playing. We should reasonably expect improvement from Moore in his second year. Chuks, well....

We've also then got better interior depth than we had, but we probably really could use another OT with future starter potential.

So, anyway you slice it, our OL has likely improved, even though the bar was set pretty low.

My draft crush OL? Penning and Zuon Johnson.

[Joel Buchsbaum]

https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2022/4/18/23025298/state-of-the-pittsburgh-pittsburgh-steelers-offensive-line-pre-2022-nfl-draft-edition-news-update

Reading that, we don't even need to draft for the OL; that would be tragic if the team felt like this take. Both OTs are well below average, both. C is below avg., regardless of who they have in there. OGs may attain avg. status if they are lucky. And for that, everything is so solid we don't even need to draft any OLmen? Maybe one for depth?

Benedict must be looking for some Rooney perks with this piece.

Agree. The only player we have above average is one guard and he not special. Mabye the left tackle who was a rookie last year will be better, that's reasonable. Tackle could be the pick tonight, which well maybe me pissed as we could have had a 4th round compenstory pick for losing Chucks or at least save a lot of money by low balling him.

[feltdizz]

Yet he has a ring unlike Brown and Wallace.

Again to my point about the folly of paying big bucks for the position.

AB caught a TD pass in the SB win over KC.

[whisper]

Agree. The only player we have above average is one guard and he not special. Mabye the left tackle who was a rookie last year will be better, that's reasonable. Tackle could be the pick tonight, which well maybe me pissed as we could have had a 4th round compenstory pick for losing Chucks or at least save a lot of money by low balling him.

It's not like we haven't already seen this movie before with Cool Shades/Colbert: How many years did they waste with not addressing a poor OL? Who ca forget Cool Shades arrogantly state there "were other ways to help Ben" than drafting OL help in 2008? In that draft they went:

1. Slip-and-Fall
2. Sweed (FAIL WR)
3. Bruce Davis (FAILED LB)
4. Tony Hills (FAIL OT)
5. Dennis Dixon (FAIL QB)
6. Humpal - fail
7. Mundy -fail

Take a look at all the quality OLmen they left to draft the above bums.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2008/draft.htm

They let Ben get abused for years before they finally began drafting some OLmen.
It looks like they are back on that trail once again.

[feltdizz]

It's not like we haven't already seen this movie before with Cool Shades/Colbert: How many years did they waste with not addressing a poor OL? Who ca forget Cool Shades arrogantly state there "were other ways to help Ben" than drafting OL help in 2008? In that draft they went:

1. Slip-and-Fall
2. Sweed (FAIL WR)
3. Bruce Davis (FAILED LB)
4. Tony Hills (FAIL OT)
5. Dennis Dixon (FAIL QB)
6. Humpal - fail
7. Mundy -fail

Take a look at all the quality OLmen they left to draft the above bums.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2008/draft.htm

They let Ben get abused for years before they finally began drafting some OLmen.
It looks like they are back on that trail once again.

We won the SB that same year.. lmao.

[whisper]

The FO probably agrees with this article, which is crap on a cracker. Their moves were hardly enough to build a solid OL, not even close.

I rest my case: NO OLmen drafted after 4 rounds; I guess the OL is so f---g solid there are no worries there. Yea, f----g right, there isn't. We are in for a big surprise come regular season play and an OL with such crap OTs.