Hint to R Fichtner

[NorthCoast]

Since it's a short week before the game here's a hint to Fichtner for gameplanning against BAL. When NE played against them they primarily used Harris at RB in 21 personnel on 70% of offensive plays. He had 22 carries on the day for 121 yds. But here is the key; on every single one of his rushes they used a FB to block. The genius part of this was that it kept BAL in their base defense for the most part. This helped both running and passing. This is not something BAL likes to use a lot of and Newton was generally successful in passing on a lousy day, completing 13 of 17 attempts.

....you can thank me later RF... cheers!

[Oviedo]

Maybe a coming out party for Derek Watt.

It would really help to have McDonald back but not sure that is likely. Will probably have to promote Rader from the PS

[feltdizz]

Maybe a coming out party for Derek Watt.

It would really help to have McDonald back but not sure that is likely. Will probably have to promote Rader from the PS

I was never a big Vance fan due to his injuries. He always seems to be dinged up.

We aren’t going to run with a FB all game. It’s not what we do. We will continue to do what we do until they stop it.

[Djfan]

We aren’t going to run with a FB all game. It’s not what we do. We will continue to do what we do until they stop it.

Haven't they stopped it? Looks like they have.

I also noticed that the FB was in the game at the end, We ran pretty well then, too.

[feltdizz]

Haven't they stopped it? Looks like they have.

I also noticed that the FB was in the game at the end, We ran pretty well then, too.

stopped what? I’m talking about our pass first, pass often offense. IMO it feels like we run just enough to keep the D honest but it’s primarily on Ben’s arm.

I turned to the Tenn game at the end. We were up so far I wanted to see the Ravens lose and Tenn delivered.

[flippy]

The problem with the running game is James Conner's mullet. He grew it in 2018 and had a pro bowl year. Bring back the mullet.

[Eich]

stopped what? I’m talking about our pass first, pass often offense. IMO it feels like we run just enough to keep the D honest but it’s primarily on Ben’s arm.

And a lot of our "run game" has become short passes.

I'll admit it concerns me. It's amazing that we're 10-0 with almost no threat of a traditional run game. Our line seems to be doing a decent job protecting Ben. But it's just a hot mess with a traditional run game. Hopefully they'll manage some kind of improvement as the season goes on.

[NorthCoast]

I was never a big Vance fan due to his injuries. He always seems to be dinged up.

We aren’t going to run with a FB all game. It’s not what we do. We will continue to do what we do until they stop it.And that's the point dizz. You take away what an opponent likes to do. This works for the defense. Why not do it on offense and force them into formations they don't want to use? The days of 'we do what we do' are over. Gotta get smarter on game plans since the back end of the schedule gets pretty tough.

[Buzz]

And that's the point dizz. You take away what an opponent likes to do. This works for the defense. Why not do it on offense and force them into formations they don't want to use? The days of 'we do what we do' are over. Gotta get smarter on game plans since the back end of the schedule gets pretty tough.

I like it. Borrow a little from Hoodie's philosophy. Now if only Fichtner could get this message.

[Ernie]

We are averaging 100 yards per game on the ground (team rushing). Conner is averaging 4.4 per rush. I'm not sure the issue is a lack of production.. but more a reflection of the overall game plan. I agree that the short passing game has replaced touches in the run game.

[Oviedo]

We are averaging 100 yards per game on the ground (team rushing). Conner is averaging 4.4 per rush. I'm not sure the issue is a lack of production.. but more a reflection of the overall game plan. I agree that the short passing game has replaced touches in the run game.

I think it is a result of us having an insane amount of talent in our pass catchers. Ebron is coming on. Johnson is an insane talent who could be close to AB at his best in time. Claypool is a beast. If he doesn't catch a pass there is a high probability he get the PI call. IMO Washington is the sleeping giant. He could be a huge factor down the stretch as they try to take away other receivers.

[Chucktownsteeler]

We need a solid balanced attack and get the lead early. It's nice to have the DL healthy again.

[Ernie]

I think it is a result of us having an insane amount of talent in our pass catchers. Ebron is coming on. Johnson is an insane talent who could be close to AB at his best in time. Claypool is a beast. If he doesn't catch a pass there is a high probability he get the PI call. IMO Washington is the sleeping giant. He could be a huge factor down the stretch as they try to take away other receivers.

I agree with that 100%.. and was thinking along those lines when I made that post... so much talent...and only 1 football to go around.. even a guy like Vance M is a playmaker.. but sort of gets lost in the shuffle so to speak. Definitely as talented of a group as weve seen in many, many years...
And to think some folks were worried about life after AB... thankfully, "Cooler heads didnt prevail"

[Steel Maniac]

And that's the point dizz. You take away what an opponent likes to do. This works for the defense. Why not do it on offense and force them into formations they don't want to use? The days of 'we do what we do' are over. Gotta get smarter on game plans since the back end of the schedule gets pretty tough.

I kinda agree with this:

We are going to need a plan/ option b & c down the line on offense. We have to be able to move the ball successfully down the field by running if need be and be comfortable doing it.

[Steel Maniac]

I agree with that 100%.. and was thinking along those lines when I made that post... so much talent...and only 1 football to go around.. even a guy like Vance M is a playmaker.. but sort of gets lost in the shuffle so to speak. Definitely as talented of a group as weve seen in many, many years...
And to think some folks were worried about life after AB... thankfully, "Cooler heads didnt prevail"

We do have a ton of pass catching option ; and I get the idea of playing to you strengths. But I also know flexibility is important especially if Ben is off on a certain day and we need to run to win.

[feltdizz]

And that's the point dizz. You take away what an opponent likes to do. This works for the defense. Why not do it on offense and force them into formations they don't want to use? The days of 'we do what we do' are over. Gotta get smarter on game plans since the back end of the schedule gets pretty tough.

Personally I wouldn’t come out doing it because it takes the ball out of our best players hands on offense.

No offense to Conner but I just don’t think our offense needs to run thru him this year. Like others have said. Our short passing game is our run game this year. I would rather see Ben throwing underneath to JuJu and Johnson and Ebron than trying to run between the tackles with Conner and Watt.

Tennessee and the Pats weren’t running the ball just because they Baltimore has injuries up front. They ran the ball a ton because they don’t have a bunch of weapons at WR.

Plus I don’t want a low scoring ground and pound game.

[feltdizz]

I agree with that 100%.. and was thinking along those lines when I made that post... so much talent...and only 1 football to go around.. even a guy like Vance M is a playmaker.. but sort of gets lost in the shuffle so to speak. Definitely as talented of a group as weve seen in many, many years...
And to think some folks were worried about life after AB... thankfully, "Cooler heads didnt prevail"

I don’t think Vance has been a weapon at all this year. Ebron is taking his targets and rightfully so. Dude is just built for the passing game and Vance looks so slow in comparison.

Claypool just changed our hole offense. Amazed he lasted until the second. Dude is a freak.

[Oviedo]

I don’t think Vance has been a weapon at all this year. Ebron is taking his targets and rightfully so. Dude is just built for the passing game and Vance looks so slow in comparison.

Claypool just changed our hole offense. Amazed he lasted until the second. Dude is a freak.

But it is fun waiting for the next time Vance stiff arms a guys into the lower seats. One of my favorite plays in my NFL viewing life. That and Bettis trucking Brian Urlacher

[Ernie]

I don’t think Vance has been a weapon at all this year. Ebron is taking his targets and rightfully so. Dude is just built for the passing game and Vance looks so slow in comparison.

Claypool just changed our hole offense. Amazed he lasted until the second. Dude is a freak.

I didnt say Vance has been a weapon this year. Hes a proven weapon though. My point still stands.. thanks for helping me make it

[NorthCoast]

Personally I wouldn’t come out doing it because it takes the ball out of our best players hands on offense.

No offense to Conner but I just don’t think our offense needs to run thru him this year. Like others have said. Our short passing game is our run game this year. I would rather see Ben throwing underneath to JuJu and Johnson and Ebron than trying to run between the tackles with Conner and Watt.

Tennessee and the Pats weren’t running the ball just because they Baltimore has injuries up front. They ran the ball a ton because they don’t have a bunch of weapons at WR.

Plus I don’t want a low scoring ground and pound game.Wouldn't it have been nice if, when the Steelers were up 20-3, they could just hand the ball off, run clock, and get out of the game sooner? I think so. I get the obsession with passing using a HOF QB but every incompletion stops clock. It was a blessing the Jags were so pathetic on defense. The Steelers had 2 three and outs, and 1 four and out in the second half. That spells trouble against a better opponent.

[The Man of Steel]

I’d like to see Connor bulk back up to 250lbs which was his playing weight at Pitt during that season when he ran for 1,800 yards. Seems like he hasn’t been a punishing runner ever since he slimmed down.

[Steel Maniac]

Wouldn't it have been nice if, when the Steelers were up 20-3, they could just hand the ball off, run clock, and get out of the game sooner? I think so. I get the obsession with passing using a HOF QB but every incompletion stops clock. It was a blessing the Jags were so pathetic on defense. The Steelers had 2 three and outs, and 1 four and out in the second half. That spells trouble against a better opponent.

I know going forward, we've talked about improving the O-line. But if the right runningback were there in the second round of the draft next year, would you take a runningback?

[feltdizz]

I’d like to see Connor bulk back up to 250lbs which was his playing weight at Pitt during that season when he ran for 1,800 yards. Seems like he hasn’t been a punishing runner ever since he slimmed down.

he was a freaking beast at PITT but that stiff arm is gone. Not sure if the fumbles caused him to change his running style but it’s not the same guy we drafted out of PITT.

I still think Snell should get more
touches and Conner should be our 1B.

[feltdizz]

But it is fun waiting for the next time Vance stiff arms a guys into the lower seats. One of my favorite plays in my NFL viewing life. That and Bettis trucking Brian Urlacher

that play was awesome but I think part of the problem is waiting on something that may never happen again. I just want dude to make a few catches downfield for first downs.

[feltdizz]

Wouldn't it have been nice if, when the Steelers were up 20-3, they could just hand the ball off, run clock, and get out of the game sooner? I think so. I get the obsession with passing using a HOF QB but every incompletion stops clock. It was a blessing the Jags were so pathetic on defense. The Steelers had 2 three and outs, and 1 four and out in the second half. That spells trouble against a better opponent.

yeah, that’s a legit criticism and part of the reason a few games have been closer than they should’ve been this year.

[Ernie]

I know going forward, we've talked about improving the O-line. But if the right runningback were there in the second round of the draft next year, would you take a runningback?

Depends on a number of things.. with the main question being.. is Conner signed to another contract? And how many of our other key pieces still with the team? If we win the SB.. I have a feeling there will be a lot of "Re-tooling" going on.. including the QB position

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

Wouldn't it have been nice if, when the Steelers were up 20-3, they could just hand the ball off, run clock, and get out of the game sooner? I think so. I get the obsession with passing using a HOF QB but every incompletion stops clock. It was a blessing the Jags were so pathetic on defense. The Steelers had 2 three and outs, and 1 four and out in the second half. That spells trouble against a better opponent.

Unfortunately, the Steelers have not been able to consistently run the ball at points where everybody knew they were going to. The end result is typically 2 minutes come off the clock and the Steelers give it back after a 3 and out.

[Ernie]

Unfortunately, the Steelers have not been able to consistently run the ball at points where everybody knew they were going to. The end result is typically 2 minutes come off the clock and the Steelers give it back after a 3 and out.

Most teams in the league cant consistently move the ball by run when the whole world knows its coming.
I'm not convinced that we cant run the football.. our system is more by design (as has been stated numerous times).

[feltdizz]

Unfortunately, the Steelers have not been able to consistently run the ball at points where everybody knew they were going to. The end result is typically 2 minutes come off the clock and the Steelers give it back after a 3 and out.

yep. We’ve seen it in a few games but luckily the defense held on at the end.

[feltdizz]

Most teams in the league cant consistently move the ball by run when the whole world knows its coming.
I'm not convinced that we cant run the football.. our system is more by design (as has been stated numerous times).

good rushing attacks can still grind out yards. Maybe we just aren’t that good this year.

[Ernie]

good rushing attacks can still grind out yards. Maybe we just aren’t that good this year.

What are we ranked in the league in terms of # of rushes per game? I see Conner having 4.4 yards per rush.. perhaps the run/pass ratio is the primary reason why we arent ranked higher?

We arent committed to the run... but I'm more inclined to believe it's because it's because of our weapons and scheme. Getting stuffed in a few situations when the whole world knows it's coming (loading up boxes) isnt enough evidence in my mind to suggest we "Arent that good"

[feltdizz]

What are we ranked in the league in terms of # of rushes per game? I see Conner having 4.4 yards per rush.. perhaps the run/pass ratio is the primary reason why we arent ranked higher?

We arent committed to the run... but I'm more inclined to believe it's because it's because of our weapons and scheme. Getting stuffed in a few situations when the whole world knows it's coming (loading up boxes) isnt enough evidence in my mind to suggest we "Arent that good"

Saying we aren’t that good doesn’t mean we can’t run at all or stink at it. Just means we aren’t as good as we would like to be.

You keep using the 4.4 but who cares when we aren’t getting yards when we really need them on the ground?

Tomlin said we are below the line running the football. Merril Hoge said Conner isn’t being patient and using his blockers correctly. I would trust their assessment over that 4.4 stat line up high could be misleading.

prior to yesterday Conner averaged 3.2 the last 3 games. We need to improve a bit at running the football.

[Ernie]

I tend to believe our issues with the run lean more towards the scheme... being pass heavy all game.. getting leads...and then being run heavy towards the end when the whole world knows it's coming. If you want to call that "Not being very good this year".. so be it. Theres no reason at all to think we couldnt have a more balanced attack... earlier in games...and become more in sync with the running game. It seems like we abandon the run completely at different points in the game...and that's not because of Conner/Snell/McFarland's fault.

[NorthCoast]

What are we ranked in the league in terms of # of rushes per game? I see Conner having 4.4 yards per rush.. perhaps the run/pass ratio is the primary reason why we arent ranked higher?

We arent committed to the run... but I'm more inclined to believe it's because it's because of our weapons and scheme. Getting stuffed in a few situations when the whole world knows it's coming (loading up boxes) isnt enough evidence in my mind to suggest we "Arent that good"4.4 yds/att sounds cool and all but the success rate is poor. The stat gets skewed by a few long runs. Yesterday was prime example. Only a handful of Conners 13 rushes were successful in terms of line to gain. But because Conner had a few longer runs the yds/att looks OK. Contrast that with the running by Robinson who had similar stats but was more successful in those runs.

btw, not complaining here. I am hopeful yesterday was the beginning of a turnaround for the run game. It certainly was better than they have looked in the past. And did you see they actually used play action toward the end of the game?

[Ernie]

4.4 yds/att sounds cool and all but the success rate is poor. The stat gets skewed by a few long runs. Yesterday was prime example. Only a handful of Conners 13 rushes were successful in terms of line to gain. But because Conner had a few longer runs the yds/att looks OK. Contrast that with the running by Robinson who had similar stats but was more successful in those runs.

btw, not complaining here. I am hopeful yesterday was the beginning of a turnaround for the run game. It certainly was better than they have looked in the past. And did you see they actually used play action toward the end of the game?

You said it... 13 carries. We dont committ to the run. I'm not willing to say its substandard until we fail on a larger scale

[NorthCoast]

You said it... 13 carries. We dont committ to the run. I'm not willing to say its substandard until we fail on a larger scaleWhen you get behind on down and distance, it pretty much forces a pass. This is what happens in the run game where Conner gets 1 or 2 yds on first or second down. They need to win those downs to build a sustaining run game.

[whisper]

I was never a big Vance fan due to his injuries. He always seems to be dinged up.

We aren’t going to run with a FB all game. It’s not what we do. We will continue to do what we do until they stop it.

I am going to endorse more plays with a FB AND that SHOULD mean a higher % of runs more north and south as opposed to running Conner wide, which fails more than not - he is too slow for those plays to succeed. Vs. the Jags they finally sent JC either between the OTs or just off tackle and we finally had some decent rushes.

Why a professional staff, in the most elite league, had not realized this before is beyond me.

[Ernie]

When you get behind on down and distance, it pretty much forces a pass. This is what happens in the run game where Conner gets 1 or 2 yds on first or second down. They need to win those downs to build a sustaining run game.

Thats a valid point.. but I believe it's more complex than that.. You can win em by throwing the ball on 1st down and setting up the run.. going against tendencies etc

[Mr.wizard]

Do not! I repeat do not go with a FB and try to be power run team, if you do this we will lose. Our best player is Ben he makes the entire offense go, why on earth would you take it out of his hands? Our line isnt built for power running, our back is mediocre, and we would be neglecting all of our size and speed on the outside. Also why would we mimic the Patriots, we beat the Ravens with only 48 yards rushing.

[feltdizz]

Do not! I repeat do not go with a FB and try to be power run team, if you do this we will lose. Our best player is Ben he makes the entire offense go, why on earth would you take it out of his hands? Our line isnt built for power running, our back is mediocre, and we would be neglecting all of our size and speed on the outside. Also why would we mimic the Patriots, we beat the Ravens with only 48 yards rushing.

Aren’t we the undefeated team? Why would we copy what these other teams needed to do to beat Baltimore?

Pats game was a monsoon.

Tennessee is run heavy with a beast at RB.

[flippy]

Aren’t we the undefeated team? Why would we copy what these other teams needed to do to beat Baltimore?

Pats game was a monsoon.

Tennessee is run heavy with a beast at RB.

Exactly. We should start the game like our O played in the 2nd half of the last game. And our D should be our D again.

Wouldn't be bad to see Ray Ray take one to the house for good measure.

[NorthCoast]

Because they held on to win on the effort of the defense, not because the offense was stellar. Roethlisberger had 182 yds on 32 attempts. Conner with less than 50 yds. Do you really want them to field the same offense a second time??? (someone on this board even said that game is a loss 9 out of 10 times).

Be honest, it took the last play of the game to decide the winner. As Tomlin says, there are a bunch of warts this team still needs to fix and the run game is the elephant.

[Northern_Blitz]

Since it's a short week before the game here's a hint to Fichtner for gameplanning against BAL. When NE played against them they primarily used Harris at RB in 21 personnel on 70% of offensive plays. He had 22 carries on the day for 121 yds. But here is the key; on every single one of his rushes they used a FB to block. The genius part of this was that it kept BAL in their base defense for the most part. This helped both running and passing. This is not something BAL likes to use a lot of and Newton was generally successful in passing on a lousy day, completing 13 of 17 attempts.

....you can thank me later RF... cheers!

I think this is good to know.

I think last time we played them, we also showed that they don't really have the ability to cover 4WRs (although it was only late in the game, so maybe it isn't repeatable?).

Hopefully that gives us a scheme we can use when we want to be heavy with the pass or the run.

[flippy]

Because they held on to win on the effort of the defense, not because the offense was stellar. Roethlisberger had 182 yds on 32 attempts. Conner with less than 50 yds. Do you really want them to field the same offense a second time??? (someone on this board even said that game is a loss 9 out of 10 times).

Be honest, it took the last play of the game to decide the winner. As Tomlin says, there are a bunch of warts this team still needs to fix and the run game is the elephant.


We outscored them 14-7 in the 2nd half. Do that for 2 halves and we beat em 28-14 :)

I dunno. However you slice it, this game will likely be close as they usually are.

[Mr.wizard]

Aren’t we the undefeated team? Why would we copy what these other teams needed to do to beat Baltimore?

Pats game was a monsoon.

Tennessee is run heavy with a beast at RB.

Exactly, we beat the Ravens by putting pressure on them to score points, not by trying to grind clock.

[feltdizz]

Because they held on to win on the effort of the defense, not because the offense was stellar. Roethlisberger had 182 yds on 32 attempts. Conner with less than 50 yds. Do you really want them to field the same offense a second time??? (someone on this board even said that game is a loss 9 out of 10 times).

Be honest, it took the last play of the game to decide the winner. As Tomlin says, there are a bunch of warts this team still needs to fix and the run game is the elephant.

I think we had more success in the second half with more up tempo, no huddle offense.

[Shawn]

Because they held on to win on the effort of the defense, not because the offense was stellar. Roethlisberger had 182 yds on 32 attempts. Conner with less than 50 yds. Do you really want them to field the same offense a second time??? (someone on this board even said that game is a loss 9 out of 10 times).

Be honest, it took the last play of the game to decide the winner. As Tomlin says, there are a bunch of warts this team still needs to fix and the run game is the elephant. The run game is very uninspired. McFarland is a rhythm runner. He needs carries. I would love to see what he could do getting the rock 20 times a game.

[Mr.wizard]

Because they held on to win on the effort of the defense, not because the offense was stellar. Roethlisberger had 182 yds on 32 attempts. Conner with less than 50 yds. Do you really want them to field the same offense a second time??? (someone on this board even said that game is a loss 9 out of 10 times).

Be honest, it took the last play of the game to decide the winner. As Tomlin says, there are a bunch of warts this team still needs to fix and the run game is the elephant.

Yes same offense as the first 10 wins.

[Steelerphile]

Saying we aren’t that good doesn’t mean we can’t run at all or stink at it. Just means we aren’t as good as we would like to be.

You keep using the 4.4 but who cares when we aren’t getting yards when we really need them on the ground?

Tomlin said we are below the line running the football. Merril Hoge said Conner isn’t being patient and using his blockers correctly. I would trust their assessment over that 4.4 stat line up high could be misleading.

prior to yesterday Conner averaged 3.2 the last 3 games. We need to improve a bit at running the football.

I know you have never been a Conner fan so you try to bring him down as much as possible and overinflate anything Le'Veon Bell does.

I don't think the running game has been successful as it could be because Conner has gotten little help from the depth backs Snell and McFarland.

There are days that I think Conner looks every bit an elite back. but other days he doesn't. He is by the way 8th in total running yards in the NFL with 4.4 average. When Le'Veon averaged 4.0 with the Steelers his last season you wanted him to get paid $17 mil a year.

Snell had one good game against the Giants and since then as a spot ball carrier, he hasn't done that well. He has averaged 3.4. I don't think Snell is the player Conner is but I was hoping for more from him. Maybe he would do better with volume carries instead of one or two here and there. I wouldn't be opposed to giving Snell a spot start once in while just to switch things up. But to me Conner is still the best back but cannot sustain a high level for 16 games.

McFarland has also been a bit of disappointment. I expect him to get better with maturity. There were times it seemed he had open grass but instead of turning on the speed, he stopped and stutter stepped and got taken down. But the running game should not be all put on Conner's shoulders. Last game the openings were not there and Conner did a good job of using vision and moves and getting some good gains. His speed is underrated. The line and the backups are also culprits.

[Mr.wizard]

Conners problem is his vision and he cant make guys miss in tight spaces, which is why he isnt a good short yardage back. The online is taking alot of blame but there are alot mistakes being made by Conner. Not every play is going to gash the defense, sometimes you have to pick the hole that is going to get you 3 or 4 yards and not try and bounce it. Conner just isnt that good, hes okay, hes the best we got. In my opinion if you want Conner to have another probowl year then you get him involved in the short passing game and get him in space.

[Steelerphile]

Conners problem is his vision and he cant make guys miss in tight spaces, which is why he isnt a good short yardage back. The online is taking alot of blame but there are alot mistakes being made by Conner. Not every play is going to gash the defense, sometimes you have to pick the hole that is going to get you 3 or 4 yards and not try and bounce it.

I don't think you know what you are saying. I completely disagree with you all the time

[NorthCoast]

Exactly, we beat the Ravens by putting pressure on them to score points, not by trying to grind clock. The Steelers got the ball back with 2 min left after a 4th down stop by the D. The offense promptly went 3 and out. If they could have managed a 3rd and 2 yds they could have closed the game out right then and there without the defensive heroics at the end. Grinding clock at the end of a game with the lead is not a bad thing.

[Mr.wizard]

I don't think you know what you are saying. I completely disagree with you all the time

Ya I dont really care, the fact of the matter is Conner has bad vision and bad feet, which is why he struggles to be consistent.

[Mr.wizard]

The Steelers got the ball back with 2 min left after a 4th down stop by the D. The offense promptly went 3 and out. If they could have managed a 3rd and 2 yds they could have closed the game out right then and there without the defensive heroics at the end. Grinding clock at the end of a game with the lead is not a bad thing.

Ya you're talking about not executing one play, that is different then coming out and trying to play smash mouth football for the entire game.

[Ernie]

I don't think you know what you are saying. I completely disagree with you all the time

As "Mediocre" and "Inconsistent" as Conner is... hes on pace to have well over 1000 all purpose yards. To hear Whiz describe him... Conner doesnt belong in the league.

[Mr.wizard]

As "Mediocre" and "Inconsistent" as Conner is... hes on pace to have well over 1000 all purpose yards. To hear Whiz describe him... Conner doesnt belong in the league.

Ya he will get 1000 all purpose yards because he is always on the field, which honestly isnt that difficult to do for a back playing 3 downs. He just isnt good at reading blocks or setting up blocks and its what makes him inconsistent.

[Mr.wizard]

Take a guy like Dalvin Cook, why can he shred teams on the ground consistently week in and week out? Is it because his oline is so good? Do the Vikings ever put a fullback on the field? The answer is No, he is good because he has great vision and and the ability to make guys miss in tight spaces.

[Ernie]

Ya he will get 1000 all purpose yards because he is always on the field, which honestly isnt that difficult to do for a back playing 3 downs. He just isnt good at reading blocks or setting up blocks and its what makes him inconsistent.

Hes not the only back that sees the field.. and considering how many weapons we have... as well as Conner's lack of touches... I have to disagree with the "Easy getting 1000" statement.

I also think the organization disagrees with your assessment of Conner as a RB.. or else he wouldnt be starting.

[NorthCoast]

Ya you're talking about not executing one play, that is different then coming out and trying to play smash mouth football for the entire game.Nice try. I'm talking about balance, not 'smash mouth football for the entire game'.

[Mr.wizard]

Nice try. I'm talking about balance, not 'smash mouth football for the entire game'.

Still what does balance have to do with that play? Are you saying if we balanced the offense we would have converted that 3rd down.

[Mr.wizard]

Hes not the only back that sees the field.. and considering how many weapons we have... as well as Conner's lack of touches... I have to disagree with the "Easy getting 1000" statement.

I also think the organization disagrees with your assessment of Conner as a RB.. or else he wouldnt be starting.

Ya the other guys get hardly any touches, and 1000 all pupose yards is very easy for a 3 down back, its almost impossible not to get in a 16 game season. The organization may or may not agree with my assessment, Conner is still the best all around back we have, and in my opinion the reason he starts is because we dont have anyone else who is elite at running, he is the best pass catcher and pass protector, which has alot of value in the type of offense we run.

[Ernie]

Ya the other guys get hardly any touches, and 1000 all pupose yards is very easy for a 3 down back, its almost impossible not to get in a 16 game season. The organization may or may not agree with my assessment, Conner is still the best all around back we have, and in my opinion the reason he starts is because we dont have anyone else who is elite at running, he is the best pass catcher and pass protector, which has alot of value in the type of offense we run.

I think the organization's thoughts...as well as his stats.. suggest otherwise.
You are certainly entitled to you opinion though..

[Mr.wizard]

I think the organization's thoughts...as well as his stats.. suggest otherwise.
You are certainly entitled to you opinion though..

Dont know but the Steelers desire to pass rather than run seems to indicate that the organization thinks he is more a complimentary piece in the passing attack, rather than a runner that we are going to lean on in any sense.

[Ernie]

Dont know but the Steelers desire to pass rather than run seems to indicate that the organization thinks he is more a complimentary piece in the passing attack, rather than a runner that we are going to lean on in any sense.

I think that has more to do with the quality of the weapons that we have at WR and TE.. but that's just me..
By your rationale you are suggesting the the Chiefs all world rookie is no more than a complimentary piece... because they lean heavily on their other weapons

[feltdizz]

Take a guy like Dalvin Cook, why can he shred teams on the ground consistently week in and week out? Is it because his oline is so good? Do the Vikings ever put a fullback on the field? The answer is No, he is good because he has great vision and and the ability to make guys miss in tight spaces.

Dalvin is unreal. That dude reaches the second level quick. I got him in fantasy by accident and it’s worked out well.

and yes. 1000 all purpose yards isn’t hard at all in today’s NFL, especially for this team. Remember when everyone said our OL was awesome at run blocking. Now they get all the blame.

[whisper]

Ya the other guys get hardly any touches, and 1000 all pupose yards is very easy for a 3 down back, its almost impossible not to get in a 16 game season. The organization may or may not agree with my assessment, Conner is still the best all around back we have, and in my opinion the reason he starts is because we dont have anyone else who is elite at running, he is the best pass catcher and pass protector, which has alot of value in the type of offense we run.

They should have spent more capital improving our RB unit. I said it before the draft, after the draft, during free agency and before the season. A lot were high on McFarland, but he hasn't had a decent run through 10 games. Oh, but Conner is from W PA so..........

[feltdizz]

I think that has more to do with the quality of the weapons that we have at WR and TE.. but that's just me..
By your rationale you are suggesting the the Chiefs all world rookie is no more than a complimentary piece... because they lean heavily on their other weapons

all world rookie? Who said that? Someone else on here called him a bust a few weeks ago. Why does everything have to be Black and White on here?

[whisper]

Dalvin is unreal. That dude reaches the second level quick. I got him in fantasy by accident and it’s worked out well.

and yes. 1000 all purpose yards isn’t hard at all in today’s NFL, especially for this team. Remember when everyone said our OL was awesome at run blocking. Now they get all the blame.

Yea, maybe because it's 2020, not 2018 anymore. Pouncy has taken a step back for a while. Big Al has not been above average since Munch left, etc. I don't see the OL creating holes or space.

[Ernie]

Dalvin is unreal. That dude reaches the second level quick. I got him in fantasy by accident and it’s worked out well.

and yes. 1000 all purpose yards isn’t hard at all in today’s NFL, especially for this team. Remember when everyone said our OL was awesome at run blocking. Now they get all the blame.

I remember when "Everyone" said our OL was awesome at run blocking.. it's been a while though.. and the core group has gotten older. I dont see anyone giving them "All the blame though". Why does everything have to be black and white? :rolleyes:

[BURGH86STEEL]

The Steelers are not a power run blocking Oline or TEs. I doubt lining up with a FB in the back field will improve the run game to become a more consistent force. The Ravens will more than likely shut it down.

[NorthCoast]

The Steelers are not a power run blocking Oline or TEs. I doubt lining up with a FB in the back field will improve the run game to become a more consistent force. The Ravens will more than likely shut it down.

Even bottom dwellers have shut down the run game. Not too difficult.

[Ernie]

The Steelers are not a power run blocking Oline or TEs. I doubt lining up with a FB in the back field will improve the run game to become a more consistent force. The Ravens will more than likely shut it down.

That is correct. We don't have a bunch of road graders on our O-line. They do a solid job of pass pro...with Ben having the fastest average release time in the league. Weve got a road grader waiting in the wings (Dotson)... but hes not going to supplant Decastro or Feiler anytime soon

[Mr.wizard]

I think that has more to do with the quality of the weapons that we have at WR and TE.. but that's just me..
By your rationale you are suggesting the the Chiefs all world rookie is no more than a complimentary piece... because they lean heavily on their other weapons

Yes I am absolutely suggesting that, if CEH left that team tomorrow there would be no drop in production and no change to the game plan., because it all runs through Mahomes, Hill, and Kelce.

[Ernie]

Yes I am absolutely suggesting that, if CEH left that team tomorrow there would be no drop in production and no change to the game plan., because it all runs through Mahomes, Hill, and Kelce.

Right... but it's not because CEH is "Mediocre" that they choose to spread it around. Same goes with Conner.. his production would increase with opportunities...
he will well surpass 1000 yards regardless.

[Mr.wizard]

Right... but it's not because CEH is "Mediocre" that they choose to spread it around. Same goes with Conner.. his production would increase with opportunities...
he will well surpass 1000 yards regardless.

The stats don't matter, im talking about Conner not being a dynamic runner and why he is so inconsistent. He is just a straight line runner, he isn't shifty, he isn't speedy, he isn't overly powerful, and his vision is poor.

[Buzz]

The stats don't matter, im talking about Conner not being a dynamic runner and why he is so inconsistent. He is just a straight line runner, he isn't shifty, he isn't speedy, he isn't overly powerful, and his vision is poor.

Other than that, you like him?:)

[Ernie]

Other than that, you like him?:)

Kinda makes you wonder what the Steelers organization sees in him, doesnt it?

[flippy]

Kinda makes you wonder what the Steelers organization sees in him, doesnt it?

I think Conner is changing his running style this season to attempt to avoid injury.

Conner is the most violent runner I’ve even seen. In the past, he lowered his head and shoulder and he someone before he got hit on most runs. He was getting more yards after contact than any other back. But this running style was killing him.

Now he’s tried to be lighter and quicker and a more traditional back. And some of his limitations show up.

I still don’t think he’s the problem. I think it’s the play calling, the Oline, and Ben not hitting throws downfield to stretch the D. We don’t use a FB and don’t really have a TE that can block either.

If we’ve become a pass first team and you want to give your franchise QB more time to throw, Conner is the best back at picking up a blitz by far and it’s a no brained you want him in there to benefit Ben.

The only issue I have is I want the violent Conner back sometimes.

[Mr.wizard]

Other than that, you like him?:)

He is okay for our offense he is a good pass catcher and a good pass protector, but this notion that our o-line cant run block or if we just put a fullback in he will run wild just isn't reality. I think our run game struggles and is inconsistent because Conner is just a mediocre runner.

[Steel Maniac]

Even bottom dwellers have shut down the run game. Not too difficult.

And that's why I think it's some of both; Upgrade the line and upgrade the runner.

[feltdizz]

And that's why I think it's some of both; Upgrade the line and upgrade the runner.

I would give Snell a few games as the starter.

[NorthCoast]

I would give Snell a few games as the starter.I agree. But I also think if Tomlin felt it was mostly on the RB he would have made this change. As Tomlin has preached throughout his career, 'performance determines your number of opportunities'. And because Conner is still the starter tells me he thinks there are other problems that need fixed beyond the RB.

[Eich]

I'm not sure that Jerome Bettis in his prime would fair much better. Just too much penetration at the line.

[feltdizz]

I agree. But I also think if Tomlin felt it was mostly on the RB he would have made this change. As Tomlin has preached throughout his career, 'performance determines your number of opportunities'. And because Conner is still the starter tells me he thinks there are other problems that need fixed beyond the RB.

I’m one of Tomlin’s biggest fans but I think he has a special place in his heart for Conner. I know Snell had a few fumbles but I still think a change at RB would be a better option than drafting another RB to see if the OL is truly the problem. I think it’s a combo of both.

[Northern_Blitz]

Does anyone have a read on Snell in pass-pro?

If he's not good at it, maybe that's why Conner is getting more touches?

I think that's at least part of it. Conner is more versatile, and having him in doesn't telegraph what's coming. Although maybe playing Snell more would end up telegraphing his plays less too?

[Buzz]

Does anyone have a read on Snell in pass-pro?

If he's not good at it, maybe that's why Conner is getting more touches?

I think that's at least part of it. Conner is more versatile, and having him in doesn't telegraph what's coming.

Yes, I think this is a big part of it ... this along with Snell's fumbling problem.

https://steelersdepot.com/2020/11/film-room-james-conners-pass-pro-key-component-to-steelers-offense/

[The Man of Steel]

The Rams only had 37 total yards rushing last night while the Bucs had an incredible 42 yards on the ground. Running the football to win football games ain’t what it used to be.

[Oviedo]

I'm not sure that Jerome Bettis in his prime would fair much better. Just too much penetration at the line.

This...Pouncey and Feiler are getting blown up a whole bunch

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

all world rookie? Who said that? Someone else on here called him a bust a few weeks ago. Why does everything have to be Black and White on here?

Yes, but an all-world bust. :D

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

That is correct. We don't have a bunch of road graders on our O-line. They do a solid job of pass pro...with Ben having the fastest average release time in the league. Weve got a road grader waiting in the wings (Dotson)... but hes not going to supplant Decastro or Feiler anytime soon

It's interesting that Feiler was moved from a premium line position (RT) where he did a competent job to a lower position of importance (LG) because it was assumed he would be great there. I don't think he is panning out as expected. Considering that Dotson has looked good as a pass protector as well in limited exposure, can a move be coming? At least for next season where we have AV as a FA, can we see Feiler moved back to RT, Chuks to LT, and Dotson starting at guard?

[Steel Maniac]

I agree. But I also think if Tomlin felt it was mostly on the RB he would have made this change. As Tomlin has preached throughout his career, 'performance determines your number of opportunities'. And because Conner is still the starter tells me he thinks there are other problems that need fixed beyond the RB.

That's how I've looked at it; O-line issues first. But they have to call the right running plays that work to Conner's strengths.

[hawaiiansteel]

At least for next season where we have AV as a FA, can we see Feiler moved back to RT, Chuks to LT, and Dotson starting at guard?

Feiler is an unrestricted free agent next season, we would have to re-sign him first.

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

Feiler is an unrestricted free agent next season, we would have to re-sign him first.

Yes, but he shouldn't be too expensive to sign.

[feltdizz]

That's how I've looked at it; O-line issues first. But they have to call the right running plays that work to Conner's strengths.

I think Conner gets the start because of his blocking and pass catching. I’m really interested in seeing if Snell is the future.

[hawaiiansteel]

Yes, but he shouldn't be too expensive to sign.

neither should Banner...

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

neither should Banner...

Agreed. And would like to have both battling it out at RT on the cheap with the other being the backup.

[Northern_Blitz]

Yes, but he shouldn't be too expensive to sign.

I think this is true, but we'll be tight for cash and I think Juju will be expensive and we usually don't let home grown talent like him leave. But we do have WR depth.

Hilton and Sutton are UFAs next year too. If like to keep one of we can. Likely Sutton because I think Hilton is going to make lots of money.

Banner will probably be cheaper than Fieler too.

[flippy]

I think this is true, but we'll be tight for cash and I think Juju will be expensive and we usually don't let home grown talent like him leave. But we do have WR depth.

Hilton and Sutton are UFAs next year too. If like to keep one of we can. Likely Sutton because I think Hilton is going to make lots of money.

Banner will probably be cheaper than Fieler too.

Not to mention some guys are going to get really expensive after we win the SuperBowl ;)

[NorthCoast]

Feiler is an unrestricted free agent next season, we would have to re-sign him first.Feiler is a backup in my opinion based on what I have seen this season. Steelers need to search for another starter or two.