Dallas post game thoughts

[steeler_george]

Finally, I have time to watch my beloved Steelers and contribute to this board... I missed all you losers!

(I only watched two games this season, damn work schedule!)

Here are my thoughts :

Dale Lolley ( best steeler beat writer IMHO) said it the best in his article, "wins are wins in this league".

*I am going to get flack for this, probably the best coaching of the season by Tomlin.

We came out flat, caught off guard, but we pulled the win.
He showed balls and was the right call to go for it, instead of taking the 3 points. It failed, but even if we went up by 8, the game was not over a TD and 2 point conversion. If we got that one yard, we could have sealed the win the game there.

*This game remind me of last year's team, but with a healthy Ben.

All heart! We could of easily lost this game, but back to Tomlin, we never lost control, where as Dallas did a Cincy reduex and gave us plays ( yards on stupid penalties) to win the game.

Oh man, that defense was remanence of '19, push to shove it never gave up, somehow always getting the ball back, and putting position to win that game. Just wait till the calvary arrive with Alaula, Hilton and Williamson. Only negative on that one Dallas TD, it looked like we had #92 deep in coverage? WTF

* This offense is crazy loaded and poised to great things with Ben at helm.

Loved that empty backfield set, reminded me of the '94 O'Donnell 5 WR set ( including Eric Green), but with much more talent at WR.
Speaking of WR, Claypool is a star, even though he had more drops in this 1 game than he had all season and he is hell of a blocker. Juju is the heart of the group, he is Wardish. DJ18 this kid just makes plays. Did Ray- Ray pass up JW in snaps?

Ebron is the man, he is what this team was looking for ever since Heath retired. ( He needs to learn to block better. Can't recall did he get alled for holding on that WR screen or did he just wiff? By the way did you see Claypool's blocking on that wow!)

RBs, game script failed them.
Negative, that 4 and 1, shows we need a FB, maybe we should of kept Edmonds as back up FB.
Positives, I didn't see Samuels. It looks like Mcfarland got his snaps.

* ST failed big time... don't need too comment, it was clear. However, quick question did the release of Edmonds and uptick of snaps on O by Ray-Ray and Claypool hurt our coverage team? Did Spiel stop playing coverage as well?


Here we go Steelers.... this win got me more excited than ever love how this team is playing with heart!

[Ghost]

I think the discussions today would be very different if not for a very, very lucky roughing the passer call when Smith hit Ben in the helmet with his hand on the last TD drive. It was the right call, and gets called every time against every team, but wow. Ben had thrown 3 incompletions and it would have been 4th down and 10 on our own 21 w/ 4:03 left in the game. A definite punt. Would the D have held and given the O another shot?

TJ Watt was definitely in coverage about 20 yards down field getting burned by a WR for a TD. Why is the best rusher in coverage?

Harping on this over multiple posts but the deep shotgun handoff on short yardage is a big fail. So are the repeated 1-2 yard passes for nothing. Get rid of those.

Until we get FB Watt back from injury; I say, line up Mondeaux as the full back (did it once last game) and give the other team something to think about. Or run it behind him. Also, has Ben just told the coaches he refuses to QB sneak?

Hopefully reviewing tape this week will illuminate what went so terribly wrong with blocking on extra points. That was a nightmare.

8-0 :tt2

[flippy]

I think the discussions today would be very different if not for a very, very lucky roughing the passer call when Smith hit Ben in the helmet with his hand on the last TD drive.

Isn't that the truth. In the heat of the moment, I had a gut feeling we needed some penalties from Dallas to help us down the field. Thankfully they came thru.

@George I gotta agree on Tomlin. I actually verbalized that we should go for it on 4th down because those freaks were going to block the kick or we'd just miss it. Glad he went that direction, although I hated the play call.

As a different aside, was the Dallas player leaping over the center legal? I thought it might not be at first, but no one said anything. Was it that he lined up slightly to the side of the center before leaping over him? My gut reaction is Dallas is going to do that against everyone from here on out and it seems like something that should be reviewed by the league. And if it's allowed, we should do that too.

[Steel Maniac]

I wanted them to kick but since they went for it, I thought they would put the ball in Ben's hands instead. Something short to Ebron or Juju.

[Steel Maniac]

As a different aside, was the Dallas player leaping over the center legal? I thought it might not be at first, but no one said anything. Was it that he lined up slightly to the side of the center before leaping over him? My gut reaction is Dallas is going to do that against everyone from here on out and it seems like something that should be reviewed by the league. And if it's allowed, we should do that too.

I too thought that was illegal but no one said anything. Obviously, Dallas has found a loophole on that. And I'm sure that within the inner circles of the NFL , that is a major discussion today.

[NorthCoast]

I too thought that was illegal but no one said anything. Obviously, Dallas has found a loophole on that. And I'm sure that within the inner circles of the NFL , that is a major discussion today.It is a legal play as long as the defender is within a yd of the line:

Leaping Penalty
Leaping to block a kick may be illegal under Rule 12, Section 3, Article 1(q) of the NFL rules. Article 1 of Section 3 lists all acts that the NFL considers to be unsportsmanlike conduct, which includes, “Running forward and leaping in an obvious attempt to block a field goal or (extra point) …” Players lined up within 1 yard of the line of scrimmage when the ball is snapped are exempt from the leaping penalty. The NCAA has a similarly worded rule that applies to college football, although the college penalty is considered a personal foul.

[Ghost]

Just watched the blocked extra point. Dallas guy doesn't leap over the center. He's lined up in the gap b/t center and guard and flat out beats Canaday who doesn't even get an arm on him. Just bad O-line play.

[Steel Maniac]

Just watched the blocked extra point. Dallas guy doesn't leap over the center. He's lined up in the gap b/t center and guard and flat out beats Canaday who doesn't even get an arm on him. Just bad O-line play.

I followed you and looked at it on line and that is exactly what happened. Going to be a long week of practice for the special team guys. LOL

[Northern_Blitz]

I think the discussions today would be very different if not for a very, very lucky roughing the passer call when Smith hit Ben in the helmet with his hand on the last TD drive. It was the right call, and gets called every time against every team, but wow. Ben had thrown 3 incompletions and it would have been 4th down and 10 on our own 21 w/ 4:03 left in the game. A definite punt. Would the D have held and given the O another shot?

TJ Watt was definitely in coverage about 20 yards down field getting burned by a WR for a TD. Why is the best rusher in coverage?

Harping on this over multiple posts but the deep shotgun handoff on short yardage is a big fail. So are the repeated 1-2 yard passes for nothing. Get rid of those.

Until we get FB Watt back from injury; I say, line up Mondeaux as the full back (did it once last game) and give the other team something to think about. Or run it behind him. Also, has Ben just told the coaches he refuses to QB sneak?

Hopefully reviewing tape this week will illuminate what went so terribly wrong with blocking on extra points. That was a nightmare.

8-0 :tt2

I think the roughing call on vdE was fortunate too.

Could have easily been a no call or offsetting penalties.

I would have been pissed if that went against us (although it's almost always the retaliation that gets caught.

Good teams win even when they don't play their best games. And we did that.

But there are at least 2 things I'm worried about going forward.
1) Our run defense seems to suck now after being dominant. Hopefully the eventual return of Alualu helps here (I think he's supposed to be back, but I haven't seen a time table.

2) I don't think other teams are afraid of Ben throwing an accurate deep ball any more. Hopefully we can burn a couple of teams that consistently play a single deep safety like Romo was talking about yesterday. Maybe that keeps them more honest and frees up some room to run / work underneath.

[NorthCoast]

The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly:

Good:


Roethlisberger - short and intermediate passing saved the game once again; even though he wasn't sharp he made enough plays to put points on the board and that's all that counts.
Fitzpatrick - starting to get his mojo back; nice fumble recovery after Sutton jogged it loose. The INT in the EZ was critical to securing the win and of course the last play of the game for the second week in a row!
Highsmith gets his first sack; this guy is making progress in every game... who said you can only find players from the big schools? Great scouting by the Steelers.
JJSS with another strong game inside; I like how he fights for every yard, he's becoming more and more Ward-like with each game.
J Berry - did he get his leg juiced before the game?... averaged over 50 yds for the day.
Washington - very nice route to get open in the EZ; sad he can't get more targets.
Penalties - very clean game; 3 for 16 yds, I'll take that anytime.


Bad:

Roethlisberger - he must figure out his long ball. A few should have been caught but he hasn't been very consistent with accuracy.
Fichtner - his unit underperformed against a bad defense, period. Yet another poor opening drive. Then gave up waaay early on the run game, almost like they went into panic mode. I don't know how much input other guys have on gameplanning but I hope someone has some ideas to improve.
Zone defense - made yet another backup look like second coming of TB; whoever thought it was good to have the edge rushers in coverage should make sure that is ripped out of the playbook. Watt on the fastest WR on the team?!... just no. Once they started pressuring Gilby later in the game it started to looking better.
OL - no push in run blocking; Conner 9 rushes for 22 yds; Snell 3 for 1 yd; and shifty McFly 3 for 7 yds.... how many more weeks will they rely on the QB to carry the offense?
3rd down conversions - 5 of 13 is a big step back from recent games.


Ugly:

ST (minus Berry) - you all saw it, nothing more to say there except have been wondering whether they took some guys off ST and put in some new faces? They were doing so well up to this game.
K. Canaday - fyi, there are two parts to being a long snapper. I think you forgot the second part where you have to block.
Rudolph - without a run game he was put in charge with passing; 2 completions for 3 yds... um, not gonna get it done. Maybe he needs more reps with first team so at least he looks prepared to go into a game?
4th and 1 playcall - so all game long Roethlisberger is carving em up with short throws and in one of the most important plays of the game, you go back to what wasn't working earlier in the game?... I get that an incomplete pass stops the clock but man, you have to trust your HOF QB to make a quick slant for a yd.

[Steel Maniac]

4th and 1 playcall - so all game long Roethlisberger is carving em up with short throws and in one of the most important plays of the game, you go back to what wasn't working earlier in the game?... I get that an incomplete pass stops the clock but man, you have to trust your HOF QB to make a quick slant for a yd.
[/LIST]

Yeah..no way I'm not putting that ball in Ben's hands on 4 & 1.

And the running game is an issue as well. I'm on Whisper's train now as far as us upgrading at runningback. We need a runningback with weight behind him that has a real burst/explosivness. Something we need to invest in next draft. Conner seems like he's slowing down now..plodding a bit.

[hawaiiansteel]

And the running game is an issue as well. I'm on Whisper's train now as far as us upgrading at runningback. We need a runningback with weight behind him that has a real burst/explosivness. Something we need to invest in next draft. Conner seems like he's slowing down now..plodding a bit.

I remember you arguing with Ruthless with you saying Conner was going to be an elite RB.

guess that's another thing you have been wrong about, I'll add it to the long list.

[Oviedo]

I think the discussions today would be very different if not for a very, very lucky roughing the passer call when Smith hit Ben in the helmet with his hand on the last TD drive. It was the right call, and gets called every time against every team, but wow. Ben had thrown 3 incompletions and it would have been 4th down and 10 on our own 21 w/ 4:03 left in the game. A definite punt. Would the D have held and given the O another shot?

TJ Watt was definitely in coverage about 20 yards down field getting burned by a WR for a TD. Why is the best rusher in coverage?

Harping on this over multiple posts but the deep shotgun handoff on short yardage is a big fail. So are the repeated 1-2 yard passes for nothing. Get rid of those.

Until we get FB Watt back from injury; I say, line up Mondeaux as the full back (did it once last game) and give the other team something to think about. Or run it behind him. Also, has Ben just told the coaches he refuses to QB sneak?

Hopefully reviewing tape this week will illuminate what went so terribly wrong with blocking on extra points. That was a nightmare.

8-0 :tt2


"Luck" happens to both teams in a game. Dallas was lucky 95% of the holding call they had were never called

Dallas was lucky we had the number of drops we did or it would have been a run away

[BURGH86STEEL]

Yeah..no way I'm not putting that ball in Ben's hands on 4 & 1.

And the running game is an issue as well. I'm on Whisper's train now as far as us upgrading at runningback. We need a runningback with weight behind him that has a real burst/explosivness. Something we need to invest in next draft. Conner seems like he's slowing down now..plodding a bit.
Not going to matter who is at RB if the Oline doesn't block better.

[NorthCoast]

Yeah..no way I'm not putting that ball in Ben's hands on 4 & 1.

And the running game is an issue as well. I'm on Whisper's train now as far as us upgrading at runningback. We need a runningback with weight behind him that has a real burst/explosivness. Something we need to invest in next draft. Conner seems like he's slowing down now..plodding a bit.So you don't put the ball in the QB's hands but the running game is an issue as well.... I think that leaves maybe the kicker or a pooch punt.

[Steel Maniac]

So you don't put the ball in the QB's hands but the running game is an issue as well.... I think that leaves maybe the kicker or a pooch punt.

No. I said there would be no way that I wouldn't put the ball in Ben's hands. Ben should have been throwing it on 4 & 1. Because the running game is an issue.

[Steel Maniac]

Not going to matter who is at RB if the Oline doesn't block better.

I think it's a combination of O-line and a better runningback now. 65-35 towards the O-line thou.

[NorthCoast]

No. I said there would be no way that I wouldn't put the ball in Ben's hands. Ben should have been throwing it on 4 & 1. Because the running game is an issue.

My bad, misread your post.

[Starlifter]

two games in a row we couldn't get a yard to secure the first down and the victory - giving the rats/cowboys a chance for a miracle. It's an issue that needs addressed. If Watt is too hurt to play right now - for crying out loud turn Mondeaux into the Fridge and have a lead block. Either way, if this team needs to run wide or pass to pick up a critical yard - that's going to be the difference at some point.

[BURGH86STEEL]

two games in a row we couldn't get a yard to secure the first down and the victory - giving the rats/cowboys a chance for a miracle. It's an issue that needs addressed. If Watt is too hurt to play right now - for crying out loud turn Mondeaux into the Fridge and have a lead block. Either way, if this team needs to run wide or pass to pick up a critical yard - that's going to be the difference at some point.
They probably don't want to risk a Dlineman blocking as a FB with the injuries and way they are rotating their Dlinemen.

[Steel Maniac]

If anybody needs a fullback in front of them it's Conner.

[Starlifter]

They probably don't want to risk a Dlineman blocking as a FB with the injuries and way they are rotating their Dlinemen.

understandable. but with the current lineup they are risking being unable to gain a yard.

tough call which way to go.....

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

What about putting in Dobbs on 4th and 1? Typically I'm not a fan of bringing in a lesser qb in place of a HOFer but it is obvious that Ben will not sneak it and we should give the D one more thing to worry about.

[Ghost]

What about putting in Dobbs on 4th and 1? Typically I'm not a fan of bringing in a lesser qb in place of a HOFer but it is obvious that Ben will not sneak it and we should give the D one more thing to worry about.

He's been inactive for every single game. You' d have to leave another player of the game day roster in the off chance Dobbs was needed for 1 or 2 plays a game. Don't see Tomlin doing that.

[whisper]

Yeah..no way I'm not putting that ball in Ben's hands on 4 & 1.

And the running game is an issue as well. I'm on Whisper's train now as far as us upgrading at runningback. We need a runningback with weight behind him that has a real burst/explosivness. Something we need to invest in next draft. Conner seems like he's slowing down now..plodding a bit.

I think he's also running to not get hurt. Can't say I blame him, but he is not an above average NFL back. I'm not saying we need a top 3 RB to win a ring, but I'm not sure Conner as your #1 doesn't put you at a disadvantage.

[Steel Maniac]

I think the line is mostly to blame but if we had a more elite type of runningback, that would help compensate for the lack of great line play. Nothing personal; I like Conner but we need either more from him or way better run blocking from the line.

[Bluto]

He's been inactive for every single game. You' d have to leave another player of the game day roster in the off chance Dobbs was needed for 1 or 2 plays a game. Don't see Tomlin doing that.

After watching Mason for a couple snaps he looked terrified out there. I would rather have Dobbs playing instead of him if we had to play any games without Ben.

[Starlifter]

What about putting in Dobbs on 4th and 1? Typically I'm not a fan of bringing in a lesser qb in place of a HOFer but it is obvious that Ben will not sneak it and we should give the D one more thing to worry about.

not Dobbs - but Tomlin HAS run the wildcat before. I'm pretty sure we could achieve the same result with Dionte for example.

[ikestops85]

I think the line is mostly to blame but if we had a more elite type of runningback, that would help compensate for the lack of great line play. Nothing personal; I like Conner but we need either more from him or way better run blocking from the line.

I'm not sure where this is coming from on Conner but he has been running well this year. He is our only back that has shown vision when running with the ball. His feet are deceptively quick and he can make people miss. I'm not saying he is a great running back but he is very good. He runs hard and has shown the ability to get in the end zone when we are down close. Granted, he isn't going to break off a 70 yard TD run but I like him in our backfield.

[Steel Maniac]

I'm not sure where this is coming from on Conner but he has been running well this year. He is our only back that has shown vision when running with the ball. His feet are deceptively quick and he can make people miss. I'm not saying he is a great running back but he is very good. He runs hard and has shown the ability to get in the end zone when we are down close. Granted, he isn't going to break off a 70 yard TD run but I like him in our backfield.

I don't think he's ran that well this year. I think he's been just "ok" but again, the line play in general isn't that great either.

[Captain Lemming]

I don't think he's ran that well this year. I think he's been just "ok" but again, the line play in general isn't that great either.

I agree. Mostly line deficiency.

Of note...we seem to never have an issue running with Dotson in the game. Love me some Decastro but just sayin.

[NorthCoast]

What about putting in Dobbs on 4th and 1? Typically I'm not a fan of bringing in a lesser qb in place of a HOFer but it is obvious that Ben will not sneak it and we should give the D one more thing to worry about.Why not? Coach Payton does it all the time with Hill coming in for Brees and it has been very successful.

[hawaiiansteel]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-m559H2Uh84

[NorthCoast]

The Depot with a nice writeup on the defense against Dallas. Seems it was all on the scheme Butler/Tomlin decided to deploy in game going with base 3-4 for much of it. Lots of soft zone, and left LBs in coverage with the obvious fails in doing that.
Now it just could be that the coaches were smarter than they looked. It is possible they didn't want to give CIN any clues as to what they would try to use against them next week so they went very generic on purpose. At least, that's what I'm hoping it was and not some mind-numbing overthinking.

[feltdizz]

The Depot with a nice writeup on the defense against Dallas. Seems it was all on the scheme Butler/Tomlin decided to deploy in game going with base 3-4 for much of it. Lots of soft zone, and left LBs in coverage with the obvious fails in doing that.
Now it just could be that the coaches were smarter than they looked. It is possible they didn't want to give CIN any clues as to what they would try to use against them next week so they went very generic on purpose. At least, that's what I'm hoping it was and not some mind-numbing overthinking.

seems like we always play vanilla D vs back up QB’s we are facing for the first time.

I think we will see a much more aggressive D vs LB to baptize him for his first game vs us. Burrow scares me though, that kid can ball and he moves well in the pocket while looking downfield.

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

It seems that in the earlier part of the season, the D was terrorizing opposing QBs with an average of around 5 sacks a game against lesser opponents. Then came the Cleveland game against a top running game and the D switched up by playing to shut down the run. Next game the toughest runner in the game and the Steelers again focused on shutting down Henry. The following week the focus was on letting Lamar get loose. All worked to a certain degree.

Last week I thought they would get back to the strategy of harassing the QB. Why not? First career start you want to rattle him. Instead they decided to give him an opportunity to throw and see if he can hit his targets. I'm never a fan of that strategy. IMO the D should have been chasing him all game long.

[Steel Maniac]

It seems that in the earlier part of the season, the D was terrorizing opposing QBs with an average of around 5 sacks a game against lesser opponents. Then came the Cleveland game against a top running game and the D switched up by playing to shut down the run. Next game the toughest runner in the game and the Steelers again focused on shutting down Henry. The following week the focus was on letting Lamar get loose. All worked to a certain degree.

Last week I thought they would get back to the strategy of harassing the QB. Why not? First career start you want to rattle him. Instead they decided to give him an opportunity to throw and see if he can hit his targets. I'm never a fan of that strategy. IMO the D should have been chasing him all game long.

Boom.......

[whisper]

The Depot with a nice writeup on the defense against Dallas. Seems it was all on the scheme Butler/Tomlin decided to deploy in game going with base 3-4 for much of it. Lots of soft zone, and left LBs in coverage with the obvious fails in doing that.
Now it just could be that the coaches were smarter than they looked. It is possible they didn't want to give CIN any clues as to what they would try to use against them next week so they went very generic on purpose. At least, that's what I'm hoping it was and not some mind-numbing overthinking.

I cringe everytime I see a LB covering a WR, but is happened under Cowher too.

[SidSmythe]

The Steelers are the least dominant 8-0 team in the Superbowl Era.

I think they have room and the ability to get better on Offense....I'd rather play my best ball at the end of the season so here's to a big 2nd half for Ebron, JuJu & DJ.

[Steel Maniac]

I'm really looking for good things from DJ and Ebron.