pre-draft position outlook

[steeler_george]

https://steelersdepot.com/2019/04/steelers-pre-draft-positional-outlook/

good article, but don't agree with everything

intresting tidbits:

1) They also sent TE coach James Daniel to Iowa’s Pro Day and apparently they are very interested in Noah Fant.

2) the Steelers are making it clear that they want a guy who can play outside and move around too. All these guys have the ability to play outside and still shift inside as well. The Steelers are making it known — receiver will be addressed early.

3) dl-The Steelers might be looking at this a bit earlier than we thought initially.

4) the Steelers seem bent on making the necessary pick to fix their Mack ILB spot and give this team some athleticism in the middle, but it seems they simply will not reach if the value isn’t there.

[hawaiiansteel]

good read, thanks for posting! :Cheers

[Steel Maniac]

Thanks George.

[Steel Maniac]

https://steelersdepot.com/2019/04/steelers-pre-draft-positional-outlook/

good article, but don't agree with everything

intresting tidbits:

1) They also sent TE coach James Daniel to Iowa’s Pro Day and apparently they are very interested in Noah Fant.

2) the Steelers are making it clear that they want a guy who can play outside and move around too. All these guys have the ability to play outside and still shift inside as well. The Steelers are making it known — receiver will be addressed early.

3) dl-The Steelers might be looking at this a bit earlier than we thought initially.

4) the Steelers seem bent on making the necessary pick to fix their Mack ILB spot and give this team some athleticism in the middle, but it seems they simply will not reach if the value isn’t there.

It all adds up to us standing pat and not trading up

[hawaiiansteel]

It all adds up to us standing pat and not trading up

we could use one draft choice on each of the following positions: (in no particular order)

WR
TE
RB
OL
DL
ILB
OLB
CB
S

that's 9, leaving us room to double dip at one of those positions...

[Steel Maniac]

Yeah.. double dip at linebacker please!!

[RuthlessBurgher]

we could use one draft choice on each of the following positions: (in no particular order)

WR
TE
RB
OL
DL
ILB
OLB
CB
S

that's 9, leaving us room to double dip at one of those positions...

Or use that 10th pick to bring in competition at kicker or punter.

[Rara]

I'm still for getting Nauta in the fourth.

[Shawn]

If we draft fant in the first (maybe the most overrated TE in recent memory) I will lose my mind.

[hawaiiansteel]

If we draft fant in the first (maybe the most overrated TE in recent memory) I will lose my mind.

Fant had a great Combine, running a 4.50 forty at 249 lbs is pretty impressive.

[Shawn]

Fant had a great Combine, running a 4.50 forty at 249 lbs is pretty impressive. Congrats for him but check out his game film and you point out what impresses you about him as a player. I don’t much care for the combine personally. I do not want to see a guy run without pads on a track. I want to see what he looks like running with pads through traffic. His route running is average, his speed is good but I also seen much production on blown coverage. He doesn’t run the yac with authority. He cant run people over or make them miss. He is a seam splitter and a guy who could present some match up issues. But that isn’t a first round TE.

[SidSmythe]

Congrats for him but check out his game film and you point out what impresses you about him as a player. I don’t much care for the combine personally. I do not want to see a guy run without pads on a track. I want to see what he looks like running with pads through traffic. His route running is average, his speed is good but I also seen much production on blown coverage. He doesn’t run the yac with authority. He cant run people over or make them miss. He is a seam splitter and a guy who could present some match up issues. But that isn’t a first round TE.

I'm with you - not impressed by his track skills - Steelers Depot watched his film and said no way is he a 1st round guy - he also had double digit drops.

[Shawn]

I'm with you - not impressed by his track skills - Steelers Depot watched his film and said no way is he a 1st round guy - he also had double digit drops. I'm glad I'm not the only one seeing this.

[hawaiiansteel]

20 STEELERS

Noah Fant, TE, Iowa

Antonio Brown is gone and the Steelers could offset some of his lost production by taking the most athletic tight end in a stacked draft class.


https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/three-round-2019-nfl-mock-draft-four-qbs-go-in-top-15-but-broncos-wait-until-round-3-steelers-target-offense/

[RuthlessBurgher]

I much prefer well-rounded TE's who are beneficial in both the run game as well as the pass game. These guys are worth their weight in gold to me. If you can block like a tackle, and also sniff out holes in zones and catch passes like a possession receiver, and then break tackles like a smashmouth RB, there is always a place for you out there. Vance could be like this when healthy, and adding another one could be revolutionary to our offense as we transition away from the Brown and Bell era.

Drafting the athletic TE who does very little blocking (essentially a "big WR" who splits out rather than lines up next to a tackle) tends to lead to disappointment. If that is all that you are looking for, you'd be better off just drafting a pure WR who is even more athletic.

It's kind of like drafting a corner who doesn't want to give any effort to tackle anyone in run support. Those guys may be able to make plays that "wow" you on occasion, but they aren't the kind of guys I'm looking for when building my team.

[Steel Maniac]

I'm with you - not impressed by his track skills - Steelers Depot watched his film and said no way is he a 1st round guy - he also had double digit drops.

convinced.

[steeler_george]

I'm with you - not impressed by his track skills - Steelers Depot watched his film and said no way is he a 1st round guy - he also had double digit drops.

As deep as they say this draft is, they say there are only maybe 13-20 first round graded players in this draft. So maybe we are really stuck drafting a 2nd round graded talent in the first.

[Steel Maniac]

As deep as they say this draft is, they say there are only maybe 13-20 first round graded players in this draft. So maybe we are really stuck drafting a 2nd round graded talent in the first.

Really? where did you read that. I'd like to take a peek at it myself.

[steeler_george]

Really? where did you read that. I'd like to take a peek at it myself.


https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/this-week-in-scouting-my-2019-nfl-draft-1st-round-grades-to-date

I just did a quick google to show you that it has been reported. Here is a quote from there:


So who gets the illustrious title of a "first round grade"? Thus far, I have nineteen of them. One thing I'd like to stress? I haven't watched everyone! So before we get into who has a first round grade, I'd like to recognize some potential candidates that I have not noted as of this date.

Not yet graded: Duke QB Daniel Jones, Alabama RB Joshua Jacobs, Georgia WR Riley Ridley, Alabama TE Irv Smith Jr, Wisconsin OT David Edwards, Florida EDGE Jachai Polite, Alabama LB Mack Wilson, Penn State CB Amani Oruwariye, Alabama FS Deionte Thompson, Florida S Chauncey Gardner-Johnson

[Steel Maniac]

Thanks George

[hawaiiansteel]

Iowa tight end Noah Fant getting lots of Top 10 interest

Posted by Darin Gantt on March 28, 2019

At a time when a future Hall of Fame tight end has walked away, there’s one in this year’s draft who will walk in with high expectations.

Via Tom Pelissero of NFL Network, Iowa tight end Noah Fant is going to be a busy man for the next month.

He has 10 pre-draft visits set, and seven of the visits or workouts are with teams picking in the Top 10 in the NFL Draft.

Fant caught 39 passes for 519 and seven touchdowns this season, and his athleticism is going to make him a potentially immediate offensive threat.


https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/03/28/iowa-tight-end-noah-fant-getting-lots-of-top-10-interest/

[Steel Maniac]

I think Foster Moreau in the third round would be a better option for us.

[Ghost]

I think Foster Moreau in the third round would be a better option for us.

I'd take that. This kid has good size and is nasty in run blocking. Would also be a good special teams addition right away.

[RuthlessBurgher]

Yeah, Moreau would come in strictly as a blocking TE as a rookie (hopefully he'd be able to develop in the pass game as well in subsequent seasons).

If we drafted Moreau, Vance would be the starting TE, Grimble would be the backup TE we might incorporate in passing situations, and Moreau would be the backup TE we might incorporate in running situations.

Ideally, I would like to be able to add a TE who would be an asset in both the pass game as well as the run game, someone who could be a 1a/1b along with Vance in 2 TE sets that we could pass or run out of with essentially equal effectiveness without needing to sub new players in or out all the time (if we don't need to substitute, then we could go no huddle and force the defense to keep the same personnel out there as well and start to take advantage of potential mismatches).

[RuthlessBurgher]

Among the mid-round TE prospects, rather than targets one of the board favorite such as Foster Moreau (who could be an asset as a blocker right away, but his contributions in the pass game may never catch up to make him a complete TE), or Jace Sternberger (who could be an asset as a pass catcher right away, but his contributions as a blocker in the run game may never catch up to make him a complete TE), I would prefer to look for guys who are reasonably solid in both respects and therefore could be a solid #2 behind Vance with eventual starter potential.

Guys like Josh Oliver from San Jose State, Kahale Warring from San Diego State, and Dawson Knox from Ole Miss would all be on my radar in that 3b/4 area.

[Steel Maniac]

Chris Hogan was just signed by the Panthers; So the Pats are down another WR. Gotta think that they are taking a WR at the end of round one. Maybe Butler?

[Mick'sTeam]

Honest question about the TE's - it's rare for college TE's to have crazy high production. Neither Hockenson or Fant have insane college numbers (45-55 catches ~600 yards). I looked back and those numbers are similar to Heath's, Vernon Davis who was highly touted out of college but I'm not sure lived up to the hype in the NFL, Gronk & David Njoku (I just randomly picked a few guys to check out college stats).
So I'm genuinely curious - what is it about Hockenson or Fant that seem to make them "no miss" prospects? I know all draft picks, particularly first rounders have the potential to not live up to the hype, so perhaps they're no more a sure thing than any other option. But some on the board are big on both of them, so I'm just wondering what it is about them that sets them apart?

[RuthlessBurgher]

Honest question about the TE's - it's rare for college TE's to have crazy high production. Neither Hockenson or Fant have insane college numbers (45-55 catches ~600 yards). I looked back and those numbers are similar to Heath's, Vernon Davis who was highly touted out of college but I'm not sure lived up to the hype in the NFL, Gronk & David Njoku (I just randomly picked a few guys to check out college stats).
So I'm genuinely curious - what is it about Hockenson or Fant that seem to make them "no miss" prospects? I know all draft picks, particularly first rounders have the potential to not live up to the hype, so perhaps they're no more a sure thing than any other option. But some on the board are big on both of them, so I'm just wondering what it is about them that sets them apart?

Hock combines the competitiveness with the athleticism and the intelligence. He already has experience as an inline blocker, and possess a good hand punch, solid feet, and he is able to lock in to someone and finish his block. Although he is not the freaky elite level of athlete that Fant is, he certainly possess above-average athleticism, which is more than enough to create separation vs. linebackers and safeties. He runs sharp routes and is able to accelerate out of his cuts and box out defenders in close. Provides a wide catch radius and hands like glue. Considering that he had another first-round talent on the same team, he was still very productive in a major conference with 49 catches for 760 yards and 6 TD's. I literally have difficulty coming up with negatives when talking about this guy. I actually think he is already very Heath-like and can only improve from there.

Fant, on the other hand, I'm not nearly as sold on. His production is good and the measurables are absolutely eye-popping, but he's more of a "big WR" type than a true TE. It's funny that you mention Vernon Davis, because that's kind of how I see Fant. Davis also had ridiculous combine numbers, and although he's had a reasonably solid NFL career, he was nowhere near the dynamic talent that many thought he could be.

I think Hock is a significantly better blocker who also has better hands, runs crisper routes, is better at finding holes in zones, etc. Really, the only thing that Fant does better than Hock is run faster in a straight line, jump higher, etc. In my mind, Hockenson is a sure thing, while with Fant there may be some...I don't want to say bust potential because I don't think he'll be a bust...so I guess disappointment potential...he could be a solid enough receiver at the next level but may not be the dominant gamebreaker that many are hoping for. We'll see.

[hawaiiansteel]

Chris Hogan was just signed by the Panthers; So the Pats are down another WR. Gotta think that they are taking a WR at the end of round one. Maybe Butler?

or maybe a TE, they lost Gronk also.

[Steel Maniac]

or maybe a TE, they lost Gronk also.

Now if Hockenson fell to them or Fant, yeah. But if not, I could see them taking Butler. And the Cardinals like Butler too.

[RuthlessBurgher]

Now if Hockenson fell to them or Fant, yeah. But if not, I could see them taking Butler. And the Cardinals like Butler too.

I thought you didn't believe in taking a TE in the first round since you can always find a Gronk or Kelce in a later round?

But now it's fine and dandy if New England does it?

[tiproast]

I thought you didn't believe in taking a TE in the first round since you can always find a Gronk or Kelce in a later round?

But now it's fine and dandy if New England does it?

Belichick has shown that he will use a first round draft pick on a TE (Daniel Graham, Ben Watson).

And he will trade to move up in the first round (Chandler Jones, Dont'a Hightower).

But will he trade to move up in the first for a TE? I think he would have to do that to get one of the Iowa TEs.

I don't see that happening - more likely the Pats are looking at Sternberger on day 2 for their TE, and using their first round pick for a big body, like Dexter Lawrence, and hoping he turns out to be Wilfork-like.

[Mick'sTeam]

Hock combines the competitiveness with the athleticism and the intelligence. He already has experience as an inline blocker, and possess a good hand punch, solid feet, and he is able to lock in to someone and finish his block. Although he is not the freaky elite level of athlete that Fant is, he certainly possess above-average athleticism, which is more than enough to create separation vs. linebackers and safeties. He runs sharp routes and is able to accelerate out of his cuts and box out defenders in close. Provides a wide catch radius and hands like glue. Considering that he had another first-round talent on the same team, he was still very productive in a major conference with 49 catches for 760 yards and 6 TD's. I literally have difficulty coming up with negatives when talking about this guy. I actually think he is already very Heath-like and can only improve from there.

Fant, on the other hand, I'm not nearly as sold on. His production is good and the measurables are absolutely eye-popping, but he's more of a "big WR" type than a true TE. It's funny that you mention Vernon Davis, because that's kind of how I see Fant. Davis also had ridiculous combine numbers, and although he's had a reasonably solid NFL career, he was nowhere near the dynamic talent that many thought he could be.

I think Hock is a significantly better blocker who also has better hands, runs crisper routes, is better at finding holes in zones, etc. Really, the only thing that Fant does better than Hock is run faster in a straight line, jump higher, etc. In my mind, Hockenson is a sure thing, while with Fant there may be some...I don't want to say bust potential because I don't think he'll be a bust...so I guess disappointment potential...he could be a solid enough receiver at the next level but may not be the dominant gamebreaker that many are hoping for. We'll see.

Thank you for the insight! If Hock isn't there at 20, is Fant worth the pick there?