A few thoughts..

[Chadman]

I don't get to post as often as I'd like to lately, but I'm giving myself 15 minutes here to just put a few opinions out there because I tend to miss all the individual threads..

1. Troy is not as good as he used to be. And the lack of good CB play, and lack of pass rush, really shone a light on it. That said, if Shamarko Thomas isn't ready to step in at SS, I'm not sure letting Troy go at this point is an improvement. Will Allen is a career back-up for a reason. If Troy does come back, his role needs to be looked at- maybe Mitchell should be closer to the line & let Troy buzz about more in the backfield.

2. OLB's....we need more from them- whoever they are. The difference between the Steelers & Ravens the other day was when the Ravens needed to pressure Ben, they could. When the Steelers needed to get to Flacco, they couldn't. Whoever plays OLB next season, the Steelers need more pressure.

3. FA's & players to let go. I can't see Worilds signing a 'friendly' deal, but I expect the Steelers to retain Moats. I don't think James Harrison offers enough to bring back at this point. Ike will want to play on, but I can't see him starting. As a 4th CB- maybe. He's not holding back McCain or Blake, before you start. Neither of those guys are the answer. I liked what little I saw of Ben Tate as a back-up RB, and I would not be against having him back. Keisel could be brought back, but I'd hope its at Cam Thomas' expense, not another young player. The Steelers need to find another rotational DL.

4. ILB's- there's too many. I'm not saying that they are not good to have, but Timmons, Shazier, Williams, Spence & Garvin are too many. At a pinch, Moats can play ILB too. Garvin is a good ST player, so I'm inclined to believe he stays. But that's 5 spots out of 53 tied up on 2 playing positions, with a 6th player able to fill in. Either move Shazier to OLB (where there are not enough numbers) or trade Williams or Spence. I'd happily move Shazier to OLB, bring in Howard Jones & draft a pass rushing specialist to team with Moats/Jarvis Jones.

5. TE- the future is now. Miller played alright, but there are obvious aspects of his play that are diminishing. Not saying he's done, but they need the next TE on the roster.

6. The OL- much improved. Not sure if the Steelers need to upgrade the unit much- would be interested to see the army ranger guy make the roster next season.

7. I was wrong about McClendon. He saved his best game for the Ravens, constantly pushing Zuttah into the backfield. McCullers did too. We need more of that at NT. Improved NT play for the season will mean improved DE play.

8. Heyward could be the best D player the Steelers have.

9. I wouldn't replace any of the coaches- this team had more excuses than reasons to be in the play-offs or not, but showed enough while having players learn on the fly to finish first in the AFC North. We blame the coaches for missing the play-offs, give them credit for this one.

10. The D did pretty much what I expected- flashed a lot of good, showed a lot of bad. Very inconsistant, in keeping with the general age of the group. Transitioning from Warren Sapp's "Too old, too slow" D to this bunch of kids, while still remaining competitive, is overlooked by so many willing to call this D "terrible" without putting context into it.

11. LeVeon Bell makes Ben better. He is a great player.

12. I was wrong about Antonio Brown. He's proving to be the new Hines Ward- better than he 'should' be physically. Combined with Bryant & Wheaton, the Steelers are well served at WR. I'd let Lance Moore go, keep Heyward-Bey (plays ST). I'd be inclined to use Archer as the 5th WR & 3rd down RB hybrid- saving a roster spot for an extra LB or DB or RB.

13. This team is heading upward. We will see the best of them in a year or two I imagine. Think how good they were this year, and imagine them with more experience.

14. PRESSURE- the Steelers need more. I think the Steelers have enough 'starting" LB's right now, and with that in mind, I'd be looking at adding a 'pure pass rush threat' in the draft- even if he only plays 20 snaps a game, if he can hurry the QB, or sack the QB- then that is the right addition.

15.- Draft needs- CB x 2, Pass Rusher (OLB?), Rotational DL, Back-up RB, TE (Blocking! That guy from Ohio) & a QB to groom.

[Snatch98]

Great post. Is Howard Jones still on our practice squad? I can see troy coming back and his role changing. I can see ike coming back on the cheap, same for Harrison and keisel but none at the detriment of younger players. I'd welcome all those guys back on the cheap for situational football. The vet leadership also can't be ignored. Either way despite the bad loss I was very pleased with this team down the stretch. The put down a very strong foundation.

[Oviedo]

Nice read Chadman. Where I disagree is relying on our OLBs to increase pressure. They can't and we won't be able to get on in the draft who will make an immediate impact. As you correctly stated, we need more pressure more than anything and we don't have the right players to run the 3-4. Need to think outside the box on this one. IMO drafting a pass rushing DE to play DE will have more immediate impact than drafting another DE to learn a new position...when is the last time that has worked for us? Worilds? Bruce Davis? Chris Carter? Jarvis Jones? Hopefully you see my point.

[Ghost]

1. Agreed that letting Troy go really needs to be looked into. Is Shamarko ready to be a full time starter - his hamstrings are weaker than wet tissue paper. Haven't seen enough to even know if he's the answer if he stays healthy. Already need CBs and people want to release Troy and Mitchell. That's a lot of holes to fill. You'd have to bring in at least one FA.

3. I'd let Woirlds walk. I'd let Harrison come back. Certainly have to watch his snap count but situationally he could be a good to very good rusher. The triceps injury may be too much for Keisel to overcome, but a 1 armed beard is better than Thomas. What a horrible signing.

4. How much OLB did Shazier play at OSU? Think this would be a (semi) seamless transition?

5. Wonder what Branchflower can add at the TE spot. He's not Miller's replacement but maybe he's enough to get them through one more season without having to spend a high pick on a TE.

6. I think the Steelers like their line. I'd be surprised if they take an o-lineman in the first 3 rounds.

8. Imperative the Steelers get Hayward locked down. One of the top priorities for sure.

9. If there was a better special teams coach out there I'd let Smith go. Especially if he had anything to do with the fake punt play design.

10. D allowed 6 games of 300 + passing yards. 27th ranked pass defense. That's got to improve, a lot, for the team to make any sort of splash come post season time.

12. Letting go Moore and/or Heyward-Bey wouldn't adversely effect the team. And if Archer can't come in next camp and preseason and show some Special Teams prowess or more than just straight speed with no moves; I'd let him go. The fact that the staff inactivated him for most of the second half is telling. Either he's not good or they don't know how to use him. Either is a big problem.

13. Winning 5 of the last 6 was a huge accomplishment. Kudos to the coaching staff for keeping the team focused and winning. Still wish we were playing this week...

15. I don't intensely follow who will be available and when for the draft but is there a CB who may be available and be worth the pick when they draft in the low 20's? Guess it's time to start reading up on the mock drafts!

[Oviedo]

10. D allowed 6 games of 300 + passing yards. 27th ranked pass defense. That's got to improve, a lot, for the team to make any sort of splash come post season time.




This starts and ends with pressuring the CB. With the new rules forcing DBs to lay off of WRs if you can't get to the QB then you have no chance. Drafting another OLB "conversion project" isn't the answer. It hasn't worked for 4-5 years. Fortunately we got very, very lucky with Harrison who no one on earth would have expected he would become the player he did. However, luck is not a method and just about every other attempt we have made at a DE conversion has had an average or worst outcome.

[Vader]

This starts and ends with pressuring the CB. With the new rules forcing DBs to lay off of WRs if you can't get to the QB then you have no chance. Drafting another OLB "conversion project" isn't the answer. It hasn't worked for 4-5 years. Fortunately we got very, very lucky with Harrison who no one on earth would have expected he would become the player he did. However, luck is not a method and just about every other attempt we have made at a DE conversion has had an average or worst outcome.

What are you talking about? They've drafted Lbs the past few years not conversions as in the past. Jones, Shazier, Williams, Spence, and Timmons were all LBs in college. I think Worilds was the last DE conversion.

[RuthlessBurgher]

would be interested to see the army ranger guy make the roster next season.

Hopefully Munchak can work his magic with the kid, who seems to have all the intangibles you could ask for, plus an impressive frame as well (listed at 6'9", 277 lbs.). Perhaps he could become a bigger version of Matt Spaeth (listed at 6'7", 260 lbs.) as a situational TE. He would be a heck of an extra blocker out there, plus he wouldn't be entirely useless as a possible huge red zone target as a pass catcher as well. After all, he did play one season as a WR at West Point, catching 34 passes for 522 yards and 5
touchdowns in 2009.

[flippy]

Good post.

Funny how a few thoughts turns into a book of needs on this team. Not a comment on Chadman, but on this team. There's so many things that need to be fixed. Feels like we're stuck in a rebuilding cycle still at this point even though we got back into the playoffs.

[Oviedo]

What are you talking about? They've drafted Lbs the past few years not conversions as in the past. Jones, Shazier, Williams, Spence, and Timmons were all LBs in college. I think Worilds was the last DE conversion.

The discussion is about pass rushing OLBs. You identified 4 Inside LBs (Shazier, Williams, Spence, Timmons), not OLBs who are primary pass rushers. Then you cite Jones. Not making the case very well for good pass rushers at OLB are you?

[BradshawsHairdresser]

Though the Steelers' OL improved during the season, they showed that they're not good enough in that last game. Can't see it happening, but I wish they could get a true franchise LT. I like Beachum--I'd move him to RT, where he'd be an upgrade over Gilbert/Adams.

[flippy]

Though the Steelers' OL improved during the season, they showed that they're not good enough in that last game. Can't see it happening, but I wish they could get a true franchise LT. I like Beachum--I'd move him to RT, where he'd be an upgrade over Gilbert/Adams.

I've always thought Beachum and Foster would make better RTs. I wouldn't mind getting a better LT and a quick LG that can pull making it easier for Bell to run right.

[Vader]

The discussion is about pass rushing OLBs. You identified 4 Inside LBs (Shazier, Williams, Spence, Timmons), not OLBs who are primary pass rushers. Then you cite Jones. Not making the case very well for good pass rushers at OLB are you?

I never said they did a good job of finding anything. That's just you adding a strawman to the discussion. You said the past 4-5 years they've drafted conversion players and it didn't work out. Well that isn't true. Jones is NOT a conversion and even played in a 3-4 at Georgia. Also if you just look at OLB then who in the hell are you talking about? Jones took over for Harrison.. who was undrafted. Would you not have drafted Woodley at LOLB? Who are you talking about?

[Oviedo]

I never said they did a good job of finding anything. That's just you adding a strawman to the discussion. You said the past 4-5 years they've drafted conversion players and it didn't work out. Well that isn't true. Jones is NOT a conversion and even played in a 3-4 at Georgia. Also if you just look at OLB then who in the hell are you talking about? Jones took over for Harrison.. who was undrafted. Would you not have drafted Woodley at LOLB? Who are you talking about?

Thank you. You make my case even stronger that drafting DE conversions is a high risk bonehead philosophy because we have no evidence of success. My primary point of contention with LeBeau's 3-4 has always been it is high risk from a talent replacement standpoint. I feel it is high risk on two fronts: required position changes and time to learn a complex system. Loved it when we had the players but it was obvious that we were not replacing them successfully. IMO we got lucky with guys like A. Smith, Harrison, etc., and it skewed our views. Luck isn't a method and we need a more straight forward, simplified scheme similar to what the Seahawks do. Read the following:
Dave Boling: Seahawks ‘simple’ defense designed, coached to perfection
By Dave Boling
Staff writer January 3, 2015
2015-01-03T23:01:50ZAfter games each week, players whose teams just struggled to score points are asked what makes the Seattle Seahawks’ defense such an extraordinary unit.
The answer is always some variation of this: They don’t do anything fancy, they just do it better than anybody else.
As coach Pete Carroll said recently: “… we’re very simple in what we do.”
But this simple scheme is executed with precision and speed and aggressiveness.
As defensive coordinator Dan Quinn likes to say about the goals for his unit’s style of play: “Fast and physical.”
Leading the NFL in scoring defense three straight seasons is the culmination of a lengthy period of honing and revising the scheme Carroll developed with such success at USC.
It prizes speed over size at most positions, with competitive tenacity demanded at every position. Carroll seeks players with unique attributes and puts them in roles that will best exploit them.
Two interior tackles are meant to take up space and disrupt the rushing attack, along with a big, run-stopping end. The “Leo” at the other end is the best on-line pass rusher with the ability to quickly get off the line of scrimmage.
The interior defenders generally get replaced with better rushers on passing downs, and the rotation of the front four, throughout the game, helps keep them all fresh.
Along with good adjustments at halftime, that rotation contributed to a Seahawks’ 2014 defense that allowed an average of 2.7 points in third quarters this season, and a second-half average of fewer than 7 points.
Pursuit speed is critical at the linebacker positions. The strong-side linebacker needs to be a good pass rusher, with the middle and weak-side linebackers playing a more traditional position off the line of scrimmage.
The corners are expected to be long and physical; Richard Sherman and Byron Maxwell, for instance. They can not only cover receivers, but also knock them off their routes early.
Since the Seahawks play a great deal of zone with a single, high free safety, Earl Thomas serves as the last line of defense. He was drafted for his savvy and his sideline-to-sideline play-making ability.
Although his interception total slipped to one this season, he’s done his job as backstop better than ever. Once again the Seahawks led the NFL in fewest “explosive” plays (12-plus yards rushing or 16-plus yards passing).
In 2013, Seattle gave up 30 explosive plays via the rush. This season, that total dropped to 19. It’s due to better team tackling and swarming, but it’s also because Thomas has been so unerring at getting to the ball before the play develops.
The ideal strong safety, then, is versatile and physical enough to be brought toward the line of scrimmage to offer run support against strong rushing teams. Kam Chancellor was made for the job.
It all starts, though, with finding hyper-competitive players, fitting them to a role, and then coaching them to their tasks.
Quinn obviously has earned the players’ trust and confidence. Here’s how.
Against Houston last season, Quinn’s film study led him to note that in a specific situation, Texans quarterback Matt Schaub always dumped the ball to a certain receiver when he was blitzed from his right side.
At a crucial point in a tight game, Quinn called for Chancellor to blitz off the edge. Knowing where Schaub was going to bail with the ball, Sherman jumped the route, picked off the pass and returned it 58 yards for a touchdown.
Afterward, an impressed Sherman said it was as if Quinn had specifically diagrammed the interception.
And after the recent win at Arizona, Thomas said that every play the Cardinals ran, the Hawks had the right key for the play. It was as if they heard the plays being sent in from the sideline.
Having 11 players close in on the ball is another trait that has impressed opposing coaches.
“They do a fantastic job of diagnosing, running, hitting,” former San Francisco coach Jim Harbaugh said. “But they (also) do a tremendous job of playing team defense — very well-coached, very good at diagnosing.”
In December, Carroll cited not just the team play, but the impact of the leadership. He mentioned Thomas and Chancellor and Sherman and K.J. Wright and Bobby Wagner and Michael Bennett.
“All those guys have hung together with us to keep the message moving forward until we really figured it out and felt right,” Carroll said. “That’s what is most apparent for me.”
Yes, it all sounds simple.
But in the NFL, it is so very rare.

[feltdizz]

We didn't get lucky with JH and Smith we just had TIME on our side back then.

with the new CBA we don't have the luxury of waiting 5 years

[Oviedo]

We didn't get lucky with JH and Smith we just had TIME on our side back then.

with the new CBA we don't have the luxury of waiting 5 years
I completely agree which is why we need to, and have needed to, change what we are doing on defense. We can't expect to duplicate the success of the pass when the variables of the CBA and offensive rules have changed. Problem is LeBeau is not going to lead that change.

[Vader]

Thank you. You make my case even stronger that drafting DE conversions is a high risk bonehead philosophy because we have no evidence of success. My primary point of contention with LeBeau's 3-4 has always been it is high risk from a talent replacement standpoint. I feel it is high risk on two fronts: required position changes and time to learn a complex system. Loved it when we had the players but it was obvious that we were not replacing them successfully. IMO we got lucky with guys like A. Smith, Harrison, etc., and it skewed our views. Luck isn't a method and we need a more straight forward, simplified scheme similar to what the Seahawks do. Read the following:

Your point is invalid because you offered not ONE name. Who exactly have they drafted that was a conversion that didn't work out. Just one name please. I understand you don't have anything and that you just got caught. The FACT is that Jones is exactly what you want. He played LB in college and isn't a conversion project. Yet he is struggling.

[Oviedo]

Your point is invalid because you offered not ONE name. Who exactly have they drafted that was a conversion that didn't work out. Just one name please. I understand you don't have anything and that you just got caught. The FACT is that Jones is exactly what you want. He played LB in college and isn't a conversion project. Yet he is struggling.

Bruce Davis. Need I continue.

You do actually know who the Steelers have drafted and was on their roster don't you?

[Slapstick]

Bruce Davis? Who the Steelers drafted in 2008?

[Oviedo]

Bruce Davis? Who the Steelers drafted in 2008?
How about Chris Carter? Need another?

[Slapstick]

2011. Getting warmer.

Now, the question is, were Chris Carter and Bruce Davis failures because they were "conversion projects"? Or, were they just bad draft picks?