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View Full Version : Steelers sign Worilds to 1 year deal...9.7 mill



feltdizz
03-04-2014, 01:42 PM
http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/steelers/2014/03/04/Linebacker-Jason-Worilds-signs-one-year-contract-with-Steelers/stories/201403040168

7 UP
03-04-2014, 02:17 PM
Question for all resident salary cap experts. If this deal stays as is what does it do to our cap situation? I take it Woodley is now a Summer cut for sure.

papillon
03-04-2014, 02:18 PM
http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/steelers/2014/03/04/Linebacker-Jason-Worilds-signs-one-year-contract-with-Steelers/stories/201403040168

I don't think I'm too thrilled with this turn of events. We all knew something had to happen with Worilds and Woodley, but Worilds signing on for almost 10 million wasn't an option that I was thinking would come to fruition. I think the Steelers are going to end up with a contract similar to Woodley's that pushes money to the end and eats up cap space. So, are the Steelers looking at 5 years 40 million like Kruger? Plus Woodley?

Dang, the next moves should be interesting to say the least.

I think Ike should be considering where he's going to be playing next year and probably Woodley as well, Troy might hang around, but the Steelers will be on the hook for a big salary there.

Pappy

flippy
03-04-2014, 02:22 PM
I think this just means Woodley's gonna get a chance to play on the right this year.

feltdizz
03-04-2014, 02:23 PM
I think they can move some of this money around for cap space.... I hope so, I don't think Worilds is a 10 mill man.

Jooser
03-04-2014, 02:36 PM
Way over paid for Worilds, one year, 9.1 mill, can't justify it. This is pretty disappointing to me, I hope he produces, but what if he's injured again?

steelz09
03-04-2014, 02:40 PM
I don't think the Steelers are planning to pay Worilds over 9 mil. I think they fully anticipate getting a long term deal worked out.

papillon
03-04-2014, 02:54 PM
I don't think the Steelers are planning to pay Worilds over 9 mil. I think they fully anticipate getting a long term deal worked out.

But, realistically how do you see that being structured? Kruger received 40 million for 5 years, whether he's worth it or not is irrelevant, he got it.

Pappy

SteelerOfDeVille
03-04-2014, 02:55 PM
I don't think the Steelers are planning to pay Worilds over 9 mil. I think they fully anticipate getting a long term deal worked out.
Exactly what I'm thinking. Signing a 1-year deal doesn't preclude him from signing a long-term deal. It just means he's off the table for other teams. I think Worilds inking the deal means he WANTS to be a Steeler and this is a showing of good faith.

I would imagine there is little to no signing bonus with being tagged, so, it would benefit the player to get a long-term deal with a signing bonus -- i.e., money NOW.

sick beats
03-04-2014, 03:05 PM
Exactly what I'm thinking. Signing a 1-year deal doesn't preclude him from signing a long-term deal. It just means he's off the table for other teams. I think Worilds inking the deal means he WANTS to be a Steeler and this is a showing of good faith.

I would imagine there is little to no signing bonus with being tagged, so, it would benefit the player to get a long-term deal with a signing bonus -- i.e., money NOW.

I don't know Deville, even without a longer deal with a signing bonus, JW still stands to make $10 million if things stand as they are now. Even without a signing bonus, JW making $10 mill is still a nice payday, even if it's not long term. That's not chump change.

pittpete
03-04-2014, 03:05 PM
Its not staying this way...
OMG, use your heads guys.

feltdizz
03-04-2014, 03:08 PM
Its not staying this way...
OMG, use your heads guys.

calm down Pete... people are asking questions and speculating on what was just announced.

What if Worilds says no to the long term deal? LOL...

hawaiiansteel
03-04-2014, 03:08 PM
What Worilds Deal Means

By Ed Bouchette
Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Good morning,

The Steelers traded one gamble for another when they gave linebacker Jason Worilds their transition tag. They went from gambling they would lose him, to gambling they can afford him.

But it also opens up a way for them to release LaMarr Woodley if they so choose. We will get to that below.

With a one-year salary of $9,754,000 on the books for Worilds, the Steelers salary cap for their top 51 player contracts is now estimated to be $144 million and change (thanks to Sportrac.com and OverTheCap.com for many of these figures). Each teamís salary cap has been set at $133 million but teams also can carry over unused cap from last season and for the Steelers that was $1.4 million.

So, they are roughly $10 million over the salary cap on their top 51 contracts, which is all that counts in the offseason. Including all of their players under contract, plus the transition number on Worilds, for 2014, they are about $14 million over the cap for the entire roster. But they only have to be in compliance in the offseason with the top 51. They have until the start of the 2014 regular season to get all of their players under the cap.

So, right now, they must find another $10 million to lop off their salary cap and that wonít be hard.

As we noted, they are working on a restructuring of Heath Millerís contract, which can only mean they are trying to sign him to an extension. Ian Rapoport of the NFL Network reported yesterday that the deal was done; our sources as of Monday evening say not quite.

There is no way Millerís agent, Tom Condon, is going to take a one-year reduction in his clientís $6 million base salary without an extension. So they have to be working on an extension that would allow them to reduce his 2014 salary cap hit by reducing his salary and giving him a signing bonus. Bonuses are pro-rated over the life of the contract. Say Miller would take a $1 million salary this year and the Steelers would give him a $9 million bonus spread over, say, three years. That bonus would count $3 million per year, so it would reduce his cap by $2 million this year ($3 million pro-rated bonus plus $1 million salary equals $4 million, replacing his $6 million salary now on the books). Thatís not much, but itís a start.

By Worilds getting the big number, it does not bode well for Ike Taylor one way or another. Taylor is scheduled to make $7 million in this the final year of his contract. Heís not going to get that. They could release him, of course, and save $7 million. But no matter how you think he played last season, they have no depth at cornerback. They could ask him to take $2-$3 million and shave their cap by another $4-5 million. Letís say Taylor takes the $3 million salary and Miller gets the contract extension I suggested above (merely pulled out of a hat, by the way, with no knowledge of their negotiations with Condon).

Those two things would create $6 million in cap space. Cut tackle Levi Brown and his $6.25 million due this season and thatís $12.25 million. Bang, they are under the cap for next Tuesday before they even get to some of the more difficult decisions.

Among those decisions is what to do with Troy Polamaluís $8,250,000 salary in his final year (ask him to take a cut? Extend?) and whether to restructure Lawrence Timmons, Ben Roethlisberger (or extend) and Antonio Brown.

Also, they can reduce Jason Worilds current salary cap number of more than $9 million by signing him to a long-term deal. If they, say, give him a $24 million signing bonus on a six-year, $60 million deal, they could give him a $2 million salary this year (with guarantees for a few years) and still reduce his cap by $2-3 million from where it is now for 2014.

There is a lot of room to work there with all of that..

As for Woodley, he counts $13,590,000 against their salary cap this year, including an $8 million salary. If they cut him now, because of the cap rules, all of his pro-rated bonus money would count now. Iíve done the math before, he would count $14.17 million if they cut him now (but wipe him off their books for 2015 and 2016).

However, if they cut him after June 1, he would count only $5.59 million this year (and still be on their books for 2015).

So here is what the Steelers can do: Come to terms on a long-term deal with Worilds, essentially giving him what Woodley would have made, an average of $10 million per year. They could do that and actually lower his current salary cap hit for 2014 of $9,754,00, giving them even more savings.

But remember in all of these moves that would create salary cap room: The Steelers are going to need it. They have essentially no halfbacks behind LeíVeon Bell, no defensive ends other than Cameron Heyward under contract, little depth in the secondary and they need to sign Cotchery and/or another wide receiver.

And while they seem to be OK with their starting offensive line, there is little depth there as well.

It should make for a fun March, which already has come in like a lion with the Worilds deal.

http://sportsblogs.post-gazette.com/sports/steelers-steelers-blog/2014/03/04/What-Worilds-Deal-Means.html

steelsnis
03-04-2014, 03:09 PM
I don't think the Steelers are planning to pay Worilds over 9 mil. I think they fully anticipate getting a long term deal worked out.Def looking at a long term. A 1-year deal like this splits up the money into 17 game checks. Guys would much rather get money up front and that gets accomplished by signing a long-term deal.

pittpete
03-04-2014, 03:12 PM
calm down Pete... people are asking questions and speculating on what was just announced.

What if Worilds says no to the long term deal? LOL...

I got ya, but wasn't this announced this morning?

K Train
03-04-2014, 03:33 PM
He can definitely hold them hostage on $9.7 million and not sign a long term deal if they dont open the wallet enough. Sucks

hawaiiansteel
03-04-2014, 03:41 PM
He can definitely hold them hostage on $9.7 million and not sign a long term deal if they dont open the wallet enough. Sucks

that's exactly what Max Starks did...

K Train
03-04-2014, 03:50 PM
Sure, you can say "players want the long term security"...but realistically, $10 million is $10 million. He could mike wallace it for a year to "prevent injury".

Signing this is not a loyalty thing on "he wants to stay", signing this is a payday until a long term pay day presents itself.

Steelers dug their grave on this one if they arent prepared to pay the man

squidkid
03-04-2014, 04:01 PM
this was a bad move by the FO only to be out done by a worse one once worilds signs the long term deal that will be offered.

feltdizz
03-04-2014, 04:16 PM
I got ya, but wasn't this announced this morning?

yep... but if the long term numbers look a little fuzzy I could see Worilds taking a one year deal. $10 mill is $10 mill.... I want security but if the security isn't to my liking I take one year and bounce...

Slapstick
03-04-2014, 04:18 PM
Were they supposed to just let him go?

steelsnis
03-04-2014, 04:46 PM
You guys are nuts! This is great news. If Worilds left, this place would have been in FULL FREAK OUT MODE for giving up a 26-year old pass rusher. Now, by all accounts, Worilds quickly signed the 1-year deal, eliminated any chance of signing with another team, and is expecting to work out a long term deal that will lower the cap # and keep him in Pittsburgh for years to come.

What's everyone bit**ing about???

Oviedo
03-04-2014, 04:53 PM
You guys are nuts! This is great news. If Worilds left, this place would have been in FULL FREAK OUT MODE for giving up a 26-year old pass rusher. Now, by all accounts, Worilds quickly signed the 1-year deal, eliminated any chance of signing with another team, and is expecting to work out a long term deal that will lower the cap # and keep him in Pittsburgh for years to come.

What's everyone bit**ing about???

So true. If he walked next week it would had been cited as another Colbert/Tomlin failure. Keeping Worilds is a good thing.

papillon
03-04-2014, 05:15 PM
You guys are nuts! This is great news. If Worilds left, this place would have been in FULL FREAK OUT MODE for giving up a 26-year old pass rusher. Now, by all accounts, Worilds quickly signed the 1-year deal, eliminated any chance of signing with another team, and is expecting to work out a long term deal that will lower the cap # and keep him in Pittsburgh for years to come.

What's everyone bit**ing about???

I don't think we're b****ing about it, but we are questioning the salary number and getting him under the cap, and allowing rookies to be signed and participate a bit FA, that's all. Not to mention many believe that he's as injury prone as Woodley and he doesn't have a complete season under his belt as the starter. The Steelers just basically gave a backup 10 million dollars for one year, we're curious is all.

Pappy

feltdizz
03-04-2014, 05:29 PM
You guys are nuts! This is great news. If Worilds left, this place would have been in FULL FREAK OUT MODE for giving up a 26-year old pass rusher. Now, by all accounts, Worilds quickly signed the 1-year deal, eliminated any chance of signing with another team, and is expecting to work out a long term deal that will lower the cap # and keep him in Pittsburgh for years to come.

What's everyone bit**ing about???

the numbers... 10 mill is hard to fathom. I know the chances of a long term deal and money being spread out is high. If he gets hurt early or looks like he did before the last 8 games it's a big number to swallow.

K Train
03-04-2014, 05:30 PM
I think worilds is about half the player hes being made out to be.

And getting paid for double what he would deserve...ironic

Ernie
03-04-2014, 05:34 PM
Way over paid for Worilds, one year, 9.1 mill, can't justify it. This is pretty disappointing to me, I hope he produces, but what if he's injured again?

If he gets injured again.... that's a familiar scenario (ie Woodley, Polamalu, Pouncey, etc).

Ernie
03-04-2014, 05:35 PM
I don't understand the one year deal. Would have been fine with signing him to a 3-4 year deal. Definitely going to be some speculation as to who is cut, etc to compensate for this signing

Shawn
03-04-2014, 05:57 PM
Actually, I think it's smart. Worilds was a half season wonder. On the open market, some ignorant team would have signed him to a large long term contract. So the Steelers transition him, making it tougher for teams to come in and sign him. Yes, they overpaid for his serviced this year...but it give them an additional season to evaluate Worilds talent. If he continues with his dominance...then they sign him long term. If not, then they dodged a 50 million dollar bullet.

Shawn
03-04-2014, 06:00 PM
I suspect Troy might be the the cap casualty and not Woodley. I believe the Steelers save around 8 million by cutting Troy. Woodley would give some relief but there is so much dead money...and the Steelers hate dead money. Not to mention JJ is an unknown commodity. I suspect JJ won't find his own until the 2015 season.

Ernie
03-04-2014, 06:03 PM
Actually, I think it's smart. Worilds was a half season wonder. On the open market, some ignorant team would have signed him to a large long term contract. So the Steelers transition him, making it tougher for teams to come in and sign him. Yes, they overpaid for his serviced this year...but it give them an additional season to evaluate Worilds talent. If he continues with his dominance...then they sign him long term. If not, then they dodged a 50 million dollar bullet.


Fair enough. Gotta wonder if they will try to sign him fairly early in the year to an extension or wait it out? If he dominates as expected, will they be able to afford to pay him a 3-4 year deal?

Shawn
03-04-2014, 06:12 PM
Fair enough. Gotta wonder if they will try to sign him fairly early in the year to an extension or wait it out? If he dominates as expected, will they be able to afford to pay him a 3-4 year deal?

The Steelers don't work contracts during the season. Also, I don't see an advantage to doing so. Now, if the Steelers would have actually seen some talent in him before last season, they could have him locked up on the cheap for the next 5 years. Oh well.

Ernie
03-04-2014, 06:33 PM
The Steelers don't work contracts during the season. Also, I don't see an advantage to doing so. Now, if the Steelers would have actually seen some talent in him before last season, they could have him locked up on the cheap for the next 5 years. Oh well.


I could see how that would be a distraction to Worilds and the team both... One thing's for sure, it won't be "On the cheap" from here on out. Oh well, hopefully he earns his keep.

Slapstick
03-04-2014, 07:22 PM
The Steelers don't work contracts during the season. Also, I don't see an advantage to doing so. Now, if the Steelers would have actually seen some talent in him before last season, they could have him locked up on the cheap for the next 5 years. Oh well.

If they had, people would have complained like they did when Brown signed...

SteelCrazy
03-04-2014, 08:13 PM
This is a smart move by Worilds. He is going to get 10 mil to play one season and sign anywhere again next year with a signing bonus and a fat contract. Of course, he could sign a multi year deal with us and bail the team out a little with the cap, but if not, so what. I think this was a knee jerk reaction because of some recent history. Bad move by the Steelers, unless they can work out a good deal for the team.

NorthCoast
03-04-2014, 08:56 PM
This is a smart move by Worilds. He is going to get 10 mil to play one season and sign anywhere again next year with a signing bonus and a fat contract. Of course, he could sign a multi year deal with us and bail the team out a little with the cap, but if not, so what. I think this was a knee jerk reaction because of some recent history. Bad move by the Steelers, unless they can work out a good deal for the team.


All speculation. You are making the big assumption that Worilds V.2014 >= Worilds V.2013, allowing him to 'cash in'. To the contrary, most of the risk is on Worilds. He gets injured, he won't make near what he is making this season.
This could very well be a 'show me more before we pony up' season for the Steelers.... as in JJ show me more, Worilds show me more, Spence show me more, Williams show me more.

Woodley isn't worth $14M, but the Steelers are paying him that.

Captain Lemming
03-04-2014, 09:00 PM
You guys are nuts! This is great news. If Worilds left, this place would have been in FULL FREAK OUT MODE for giving up a 26-year old pass rusher. Now, by all accounts, Worilds quickly signed the 1-year deal, eliminated any chance of signing with another team, and is expecting to work out a long term deal that will lower the cap # and keep him in Pittsburgh for years to come.

What's everyone bit**ing about???

We did that with a guy who was not yet injury prone and regret it.
Worilds IS injury prone BEFORE signing and THAT is supposed to be smart?

Captain Lemming
03-04-2014, 09:02 PM
All speculation. You are making the big assumption that Worilds V.2014 >= Worilds V.2013, allowing him to 'cash in'. To the contrary, most of the risk is on Worilds. He gets injured, he won't make near what he is making this season.
This could very well be a 'show me more before we pony up' season for the Steelers.... as in JJ show me more, Worilds show me more, Spence show me more, Williams show me more.

Woodley isn't worth $14M, but the Steelers are paying him that.

Actually I can see this POV.
Would NOT sign him long term now.

K Train
03-04-2014, 09:02 PM
im taking 1 year 10 million over a low ball offer over 5 years every time if im worilds.....he will never make 10 mil over the course of any one season and he can cash in next season on a long term deal because he'll only be what? 26?

hawaiiansteel
03-04-2014, 09:50 PM
im taking 1 year 10 million over a low ball offer over 5 years every time if im worilds.....he will never make 10 mil over the course of any one season and he can cash in next season on a long term deal because he'll only be what? 26?

but that's assuming Worilds has a great season AND stays injury-free.

Worilds is the one taking the risk and he knows it which is why I expect him to sign a long-term deal with the Steelers before the season starts.

birtikidis
03-04-2014, 10:22 PM
Knee Jerk reactions all around!
We've already started working on an extension. Transition tag just gives the team the opportunity to not lose Jason without a fight.
i don't know if I want to go past page one of this thread.
EVERY YEAR WE HAVE 100 POSTERS WHO FLIP OUT ABOUT SOMETHING TOTALLY RIDICULOUS. THIS IS THIS YEARS VERSION.

birtikidis
03-04-2014, 10:24 PM
I suspect Troy might be the the cap casualty and not Woodley. I believe the Steelers save around 8 million by cutting Troy. Woodley would give some relief but there is so much dead money...and the Steelers hate dead money. Not to mention JJ is an unknown commodity. I suspect JJ won't find his own until the 2015 season.
buuuut cuttign woodley frees up money over the next several seasons. Cutting troy only saves them for a season.

K Train
03-04-2014, 11:33 PM
my money is on they dont get a deal done by opening day

birtikidis
03-05-2014, 12:09 AM
my money is on they dont get a deal done by opening day
I don't bet cash, but I'll bet you .1 of a bitcoin they do

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
03-05-2014, 12:11 AM
I suspect Troy might be the the cap casualty and not Woodley. I believe the Steelers save around 8 million by cutting Troy. Woodley would give some relief but there is so much dead money...and the Steelers hate dead money. Not to mention JJ is an unknown commodity. I suspect JJ won't find his own until the 2015 season.

The two moves are exclusive of each other. Cutting one does not mean that the other is safe. Same goes for Ike.

That being said, I thought that the team would live with Woodley for one more year and let Worilds walk. All else being even I would choose Worilds over Woodley at this point, but one was not under contract at the time and the other has $13M to eat if you let him walk. As much as the team hates dead money, I have to think that this signals the end of Woodley. Worilds is only a LOLB, and Woodley has such limited experience on the right side and does not fit the mold of a ROLB. Unless the team has zero faith that Jones can improve in his second year then the team will buck their trend and cut Woodley (unless he accepts a major cut in pay). I don't think he will or should take a drastic paycut because he will be relegated to backup duty or moved to his off side. If he is willing to accept less, then find a team willing to give him a chance to start - at least a legit shot to compete for a starting spot because he will be starting from behind in Pittsburgh. The only question left in my mind is pre or post June 1.

Then you have the questions in the secondary. Ike or Troy...or both? The bigger question is Gay/Allen or Shark. I think that the team would feel more comfortable starting Gay/Allen with a high pick coming in than Shark. Look for a substantial reduction from Ike if he is going to return - at least $4M of his $7M salary. I also can't see them keeping Troy at $8.25, and he is less dead money than Ike if cut. They need him more than they need Ike, look for a smaller request for reduction, maybe to $5M or $6M.

K Train
03-05-2014, 08:34 AM
I don't bet cash, but I'll bet you .1 of a bitcoin they do

I'll do that

SteelerOfDeVille
03-05-2014, 11:19 AM
im taking 1 year 10 million over a low ball offer over 5 years every time if im worilds.....he will never make 10 mil over the course of any one season and he can cash in next season on a long term deal because he'll only be what? 26?

You guys are missing the bus. He'd likely make more than $10 million by simply signing a long-term deal. Somthing simple like, 5 years, $30 million with a $12 million signing bonus gives him the $12 million + his salary THIS year. He'd stand to make closer to $15 million THIS year, AND guarantee himself $30 million over the long haul, instead of risking that he makes nothing else (i.e., long-term injury this year).

You'd take that in a heartbeat, if you're Worilds.

sick beats
03-05-2014, 01:18 PM
Knee Jerk reactions all around!
We've already started working on an extension. Transition tag just gives the team the opportunity to not lose Jason without a fight.
i don't know if I want to go past page one of this thread.
EVERY YEAR WE HAVE 100 POSTERS WHO FLIP OUT ABOUT SOMETHING TOTALLY RIDICULOUS. THIS IS THIS YEARS VERSION.

I don't think there is even 100 active posters in this whole board. I don't see many posters freaking out.

Shoe
03-05-2014, 09:22 PM
What are we going to do about depth now? What if Worilds gets hurt? Or what if Jarvis is still a 1-sack/year man? What is our contingency? I hope to god we aren't going in thinking CRIS effen Carter is a viable back-up? And since it seems apparent to anyone paying attention, that we need to bring in a starter quality back-up via the Draft, why wouldn't we just draft a young guy and have a short-term guy as our contingency (e.g. Woodley, Shaun Phillips).

I mean, aren't we going to have to bring in a young guy in any case?

Oviedo
03-06-2014, 08:13 AM
What are we going to do about depth now? What if Worilds gets hurt? Or what if Jarvis is still a 1-sack/year man? What is our contingency? I hope to god we aren't going in thinking CRIS effen Carter is a viable back-up? And since it seems apparent to anyone paying attention, that we need to bring in a starter quality back-up via the Draft, why wouldn't we just draft a young guy and have a short-term guy as our contingency (e.g. Woodley, Shaun Phillips).

I mean, aren't we going to have to bring in a young guy in any case?

What is really frightening is Chris Carter and Jarvis Jones may end up being almost equal. Would love to add Trent Murphy in round 2

K Train
03-06-2014, 09:32 AM
What is really frightening is Chris Carter and Jarvis Jones may end up being almost equal. Would love to add Trent Murphy in round 2

You are horribly down on jones arent you?

Slapstick
03-06-2014, 10:25 AM
You are horribly down on jones arent you?

Yup. To many posters, any Steeler that isn't All-Pro in year one is automatically a bust...

Polamalu, Heyward, DeCastro...and now Jones...

K Train
03-06-2014, 10:40 AM
Its a shame, Jones was a complete stud in college and while that doesnt automatically translate to the pros the concept of "thinking rather than reacting" holds true for many many rookies. Game will slow down. Jones did some good things last year, he set the edge better than expected, and was not nearly as horrible as some make him out to be.

He will not be chris carter, thats absurd

SidSmythe
03-06-2014, 11:02 AM
I thought JONES was going to be a bust from Day 1, so his rookie season wasn't a surprise to me

ikestops85
03-06-2014, 11:25 AM
Its a shame, Jones was a complete stud in college and while that doesnt automatically translate to the pros the concept of "thinking rather than reacting" holds true for many many rookies. Game will slow down. Jones did some good things last year, he set the edge better than expected, and was not nearly as horrible as some make him out to be.

He will not be chris carter, thats absurd

Jones made some plays in pre-season and early in the year because he was reacting. Unfortunately teams used that to draw him out of position and give up big plays. Then he started thinking and his production went down. I agree that the game will slow down for him and he will go back to using his instincts to react instead of think. The difference being that now he will have learned not to move out of position. I still think Jones will be an excellent linebacker for us. I am a big believer of tape over measurables and Jones put together some awesome film in his college career.

Oviedo
03-06-2014, 12:59 PM
You are horribly down on jones arent you?

I hope he is the next Kevin Greene but I just have this nagging suspicion he may be the first Roind 1 pick we have missed on in a long time. I just don't see the explosiveness and power we typically have in that position.

Worilds had to get stronger but he always seemed to have the speed and explosiveness off the edge. I just don't see that yet in Jones

squidkid
03-06-2014, 01:15 PM
Yup. To many posters, any Steeler that isn't All-Pro in year one is automatically a bust...

Polamalu, Heyward, DeCastro...and now Jones...


why isnt it fair to call jones(or any other player a bust) after one year if they performed at a bust level that first year?
sure seems a lot more accurate and sensible then saying he's great or gonna be great after a terrible first year.

feltdizz
03-06-2014, 01:39 PM
why isnt it fair to call jones(or any other player a bust) after one year if they performed at a bust level that first year?
sure seems a lot more accurate and sensible then saying he's great or gonna be great after a terrible first year.

because career's aren't made in the first year...

was Troy a bust?

Oviedo
03-06-2014, 01:49 PM
because career's aren't made in the first year...

was Troy a bust?

But with Troy you always saw off the charts physical abilities so you always knew the potential greatness was coming. Do you see that with Jones? I don't

Slapstick
03-06-2014, 02:30 PM
why isnt it fair to call jones(or any other player a bust) after one year if they performed at a bust level that first year?
sure seems a lot more accurate and sensible then saying he's great or gonna be great after a terrible first year.

You can call him whatever you want...but, that doesn't make it correct...

grotonsteel
03-06-2014, 03:32 PM
I saw Jones beat Joe Thomas few times...now if he beat the best LT in NFL i think he can develop into a nice player.

2nd year will tell us if he has improved.

feltdizz
03-06-2014, 03:40 PM
But with Troy you always saw off the charts physical abilities so you always knew the potential greatness was coming. Do you see that with Jones? I don't

I HEARD Jones first tackle before I saw it... that CJ hit was bone crushing.

Preseason he was all over the field but it was probably because we were in our base D the whole time.

ST's Jones is always in on the tackle.

I think we saw Troy running late to plays with hair flying so it had the ohhh we see something. Seeing JJ almost get a sack doesn't impress people like you. You need production to see it because you don't want to see the little things he did that showed he has something. He also is honest in his assessment and THAT is the best thing about him. He knows he needs to fix things and has no problem admitting his faults.

hawaiiansteel
04-14-2014, 03:46 PM
Jason Worilds unlikely to sign a new contract anytime soon

By Simon Chester on Apr 14 2014

http://cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/31575821/20120909_jel_ac4_317.0_standard_709.0.jpg

Steeler fans are hoping to see a number of players in the final year of their contracts extended in the coming months. Just don't expect Jason Worilds to be one of them.

When Jason Worilds was hit with the transition tag at the start of March it was seen as a precursor to an expected long term extension by most fans. By placing the transition tag on him the Steelers reduced the amount they were guaranteed to pay him by about $2 million compared to the more commonly used franchise tag and it gave them right of first refusal should he receive a contract offer elsewhere while he shopped his services around the league.

Only unlike with the Cleveland Browns and Alex Mack that was never an issue.

Perhaps even more surprising than the Steelers breaking out the seldom used transition tag, less than 24 hours after they had tagged him, Worilds signed the offer sheet. Worilds rejected his opportunity to talk with other clubs despite reported interest from a number of teams, in particular the Philadelphia Eagles and signed the deal that will pay him a guaranteed $9.754 Million in 2014.

There can be no doubt the Steelers have made efforts to sign Worilds to a long term deal way before the start of free agency and beyond. It would be illogical to think with their cap issues the Steelers are happy to take up almost $10 million of it keeping one player but without a deal in place there wasn't much else they could do as the deadline rolled around to keep him off the free market.

The Steelers are not a team that has used the permitted tags very often. The last time the Steelers used the transition tag was on Max Starks in 2008. Despite all expectations of a new contract Starks played the year under the tag worth just under $7 million. In 2009 he was this time franchised tagged after they still had not reached agreement on a long term deal. Eventually in 2009, as training camp was starting he signed a $26.3 million, four-year contract that included a $10 million bonus.

In just two years Starks had banked $17 million in cash plus his base salary for 2009 pushing him over $20 million for two years work. If he had signed back in 2008 he would have banked around $16 million in that same time frame. The agents for Starks did their job for their client and it paid off handsomely.

With that history in mind the speed at which Worilds signed his deal should have set off alarm bells for fans and front office staff alike.

When Starks signed his tag it was clear he was not worth $7 million a year coming off a season where he had lost his starting job to Willie Colon after a number of years of average to poor play. An injury to Colon gave him his job back through the playoffs but he was not worth elite money.

Worilds is not worth elite money, his career history certainly supports that statement yet right now that is what he will be getting. He will be the fifth highest paid OLB in 2014.

There is little doubt the agent for Worilds had an idea of his market value and the tag the Steelers placed on him went beyond that, otherwise why would you sign so fast and not test the market to try and get a little bit more.

When Paul Kruger signed with the Browns last year many where shocked at the scale of his deal. He signed a five year $40.5 million deal with $13 million guaranteed and will take home $20 million in the first two years. His stats and career history in the four years before that were strikingly similar if not better than that of Worilds.

At $2.754 million more in 2014 that Kruger will earn, clearly Worilds is getting a great deal this year.

So all of this begs the question if you are Worilds why would you WANT to sign a new deal right now. It certainly wont pay you any more money. Any deal the Steelers offer will look to reduce his cap hit this year. They could look to make that up by offering a signing bonus in excess of the almost $10 million he is set to earn but if Worilds waits the season out he will be in position for a big signing bonus with a new deal next year and like Starks would be in position to bank far more money than he would get otherwise over the two years and beyond.

With a full year on tape as a starter Worilds could well expect a signing bonus in excess of $13 million as part of a new deal in 2015 and with his $9.754 million of 2014 he has just banked over $25 million plus with base salary in two years.

If he signs today with the Steelers he will not be taking home $25 million over the first two years of any deal.

The incentive suggested for Worilds signing a long term deal is that he may get injured and his career could be over. It does happen but when was the last time you remember it happening ? Who is the last high profile starter you can remember it happening to ? The chance of it happening is real but relatively unlikely.

Something like an ACL injury that drops his stock and raises concerns is possible. But not career ending. He is a young man and it is likely he feels somewhat invincible, as many seem to at that age in his profession.

If the Worilds camp have faith in his skills that he will be a dominant player, If they have faith that he will have a good year and if they have faith in his body and ability to remain healthy they will roll the dice against a possible injury and look to score big again next year as a free agent, rejecting any offer that doesn't blow them away.

While all of this is clear to the Worilds camp it would be naive to think the Steelers front office don't know all this too and a quick glance at the list of players the team has expressed interest in ahead of the draft suggests they have already started looking into plan B.

So far the position that has been invited for a pre-draft visit to Pittsburgh the most is outside linebacker with six players linked so far. These players range from potential high first round picks to fourth round selections. For a team that spent a first round pick on one last year it certainly seem like they are expecting a need for another one soon and you don't draft for depth that high if you expect to have both current young starters locked up for the next 4 years or more.

When the draft is done there might be more clarity about the Steelers long term plans for Jason Worilds but it seems like a good idea to wait before rushing out to buy a No. 93 jersey.

http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2014/4/14/5611210/steelers-jason-worilds-contract-extension-transition-tag-2014-free-agency

K Train
04-14-2014, 04:00 PM
Knee Jerk reactions all around!
We've already started working on an extension. Transition tag just gives the team the opportunity to not lose Jason without a fight.
i don't know if I want to go past page one of this thread.
EVERY YEAR WE HAVE 100 POSTERS WHO FLIP OUT ABOUT SOMETHING TOTALLY RIDICULOUS. THIS IS THIS YEARS VERSION.


my money is on they dont get a deal done by opening day


I don't bet cash, but I'll bet you .1 of a bitcoin they do


I'll do that

Chances of me receiving this when worilds doesnt sign a deal? hmmmm

SanAntonioSteelerFan
04-14-2014, 04:01 PM
Although I like the idea of his suiting up this year, I think the only reason we overpaid him by such an absurd amount is the Rooneys took the accusation made elsewhere on this board (that they are too cheap and stingy) to heart in a big way. I didn't realize they were so thin-skinned! Maybe tougher owners is what we need to put us over the top this coming season ...

SidSmythe
04-14-2014, 05:46 PM
The Steelers shouldn't sign WORILDS to a long term deal. Losing WORILDS would have left us with 1 Veteran OLB and that would have been WOODLEY.

SO...... give WORILDS a chance to prove he's worth a Long Term Deal. He can be signed at the end of next year (at the same price tag he'd want now) if he proves he's legit. If NOT, then he walks and the Steelers have $9.7 million in cap space to work with. It's a Win/Win.

The STEELERS are not in cap trouble with WOODLEY's Deal falling off June 1st.

Oviedo
04-14-2014, 06:29 PM
The Steelers shouldn't sign WORILDS to a long term deal. Losing WORILDS would have left us with 1 Veteran OLB and that would have been WOODLEY.

SO...... give WORILDS a chance to prove he's worth a Long Term Deal. He can be signed at the end of next year (at the same price tag he'd want now) if he proves he's legit. If NOT, then he walks and the Steelers have $9.7 million in cap space to work with. It's a Win/Win.

The STEELERS are not in cap trouble with WOODLEY's Deal falling off June 1st.

The problem is if you wait and Worilds has a 10 sack season this year, you won't be able to keep him so you are in the same situation with no depth at the most important position on your defense and a still unproven J Jones on the other side. If Jones doesn't really come on (jury is still really out) you are in a worst situation.

Shawn
04-14-2014, 06:50 PM
The problem is if you wait and Worilds has a 10 sack season this year, you won't be able to keep him so you are in the same situation with no depth at the most important position on your defense and a still unproven J Jones on the other side. If Jones doesn't really come on (jury is still really out) you are in a worst situation.

It can also be said that you dodged a bullet if Worilds gets more injuries, or was just a flash in the pan. The fact is this...the Steelers missed on yet again evaluating their own talent. Worilds would have been an easy sign in 2012. But, they didn't think much of him...now they are paying the guy 10 mill? That's a pretty poor evaluation of talent if you ask me.

Shoe
04-14-2014, 08:14 PM
It can also be said that you dodged a bullet if Worilds gets more injuries, or was just a flash in the pan. The fact is this...the Steelers missed on yet again evaluating their own talent. Worilds would have been an easy sign in 2012. But, they didn't think much of him...now they are paying the guy 10 mill? That's a pretty poor evaluation of talent if you ask me.

For sure! It is a red-flag in that regard.

They thought so little of Worilds, that they drafted Jones to replace him. They (further) gave Jones (who obviously had a poor grasp of the system and admittedly poor strength and poor speed) the starting job ahead of the veteran Worilds. Worilds strings together a month and a half of good play... and he's the 5th highest paid OLB in football? I'm sorry--that is Oakland Raider/Cleveland Brown GM'ing if you ask me.

And someone (above) posed the statement: Let's let him prove if he's legit. Well, that if all fine and dandy, if he suddenly becomes James Harrison or Kevin Greene next year. No problem. But that is pretty unlikely, I think we'd all agree. MORE likely: He gives us another middling, 7-10 sack season, mixing good with not-so-good. What then? (This is what I envision for the guy, another year like he had last year.) That is still good production, though not "top 5" OLB money. You can't ask him to come back at less money.

Slapstick
04-14-2014, 08:22 PM
There is no reason to fret about Worilds' salary...it would be Cleveland Browns GMing if they signed him to a LaMarr Woodley type deal...

They didn't...

birtikidis
04-14-2014, 08:54 PM
Chances of me receiving this when worilds doesnt sign a deal? hmmmm
I always pay my debts, but don't blow your load just yet buddy.

Shawn
04-14-2014, 09:41 PM
For sure! It is a red-flag in that regard.

They thought so little of Worilds, that they drafted Jones to replace him. They (further) gave Jones (who obviously had a poor grasp of the system and admittedly poor strength and poor speed) the starting job ahead of the veteran Worilds. Worilds strings together a month and a half of good play... and he's the 5th highest paid OLB in football? I'm sorry--that is Oakland Raider/Cleveland Brown GM'ing if you ask me.

And someone (above) posed the statement: Let's let him prove if he's legit. Well, that if all fine and dandy, if he suddenly becomes James Harrison or Kevin Greene next year. No problem. But that is pretty unlikely, I think we'd all agree. MORE likely: He gives us another middling, 7-10 sack season, mixing good with not-so-good. What then? (This is what I envision for the guy, another year like he had last year.) That is still good production, though not "top 5" OLB money. You can't ask him to come back at less money.

And this is $$$$$$$.

birtikidis
04-17-2014, 11:57 AM
The Steelers shouldn't sign WORILDS to a long term deal. Losing WORILDS would have left us with 1 Veteran OLB and that would have been WOODLEY.

SO...... give WORILDS a chance to prove he's worth a Long Term Deal. He can be signed at the end of next year (at the same price tag he'd want now) if he proves he's legit. If NOT, then he walks and the Steelers have $9.7 million in cap space to work with. It's a Win/Win.

The STEELERS are not in cap trouble with WOODLEY's Deal falling off June 1st.
If they lock him up though, they can then start planning for Ben's long term deal. Just because they aren't cap strapped at this exact moment, doesn't mean they wouldn't want to open up some room for other extensions.

K Train
04-17-2014, 12:12 PM
If they lock him up though, they can then start planning for Ben's long term deal. Just because they aren't cap strapped at this exact moment, doesn't mean they wouldn't want to open up some room for other extensions.

They will also be handcuffed to a painfully average OLB

thor75
04-18-2014, 01:24 AM
They will also be handcuffed to a painfully average OLB

I don't think Jarvis's rookie contract will hinder us that much.

I know you're referring to Woirlds, but it applies.

K Train
04-18-2014, 08:30 AM
I don't think Jarvis's rookie contract will hinder us that much.

I know you're referring to Woirlds, but it applies.

Jarvis is still an unknown, they know plenty about worilds

hawaiiansteel
06-11-2014, 02:27 AM
Jason Worilds still hopeful about signing long-term deal

Posted by Josh Alper on June 10, 2014

http://nbcprofootballtalk.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/cd0ymzcznguwzdbhnduynddiytjhm2yyzthlmtjjotqwyyznpt exm2q4y2rhmgy0otvimzdkytzjzjgwywq2njhhywu3.jpeg?w= 250

Linebacker Jason Worilds didnít waste any time before signing the transition tag that the Steelers placed on him before free agency got underway this offseason, but there hasnít been the same kind of urgency when it comes to reaching agreement on a long-term deal that would keep Worilds in Pittsburgh beyond the 2014 season.

Worilds is guaranteed $9.745 million under the terms of the tag and the Steelersí overall cap situation left many thinking that theyíd like to find a way to sign Worilds because it would mean a lower cap number in 2014. The last three months have brought neither an agreement nor much sign that one is in the offing, although Worilds said Tuesday that he hasnít given up hope.

ďAbsolutely, as far as long term,Ē Worilds said, via the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review. ďYou put so much time and effort in with these guys, so you want to be here for the duration of your career.Ē

Worilds doesnít turn 27 until next March and set career highs in 2013 with 11 starts, eight sacks and 54 tackles. Building on that production would put Worilds in good position to get paid next offseason, although the Steelers would have the right to tag him again in order to assure his return to Pittsburgh.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/06/10/jason-worilds-still-hopeful-about-signing-long-term-deal/

Shawn
06-11-2014, 07:46 AM
I will say this...if Worilds doesn't pan out, or we can't get him signed the Steelers might be locked in going into next years draft. And that is a problem because I suspect Ike is on his way out. Which would mean OLB, and DB almost HAVE to be your top 2 picks. That is how teams get mediocre. Drafting for need.

Slapstick
06-11-2014, 08:03 AM
I will say this...if Worilds doesn't pan out, or we can't get him signed the Steelers might be locked in going into next years draft. And that is a problem because I suspect Ike is on his way out. Which would mean OLB, and DB almost HAVE to be your top 2 picks. That is how teams get mediocre. Drafting for need.

People thought DB was a need for us in the first three rounds this year, too...

Oviedo
06-11-2014, 08:24 AM
People thought DB was a need for us in the first three rounds this year, too...

It was a need, but we just resisted the temptation to draft for the need and got IMO better players. There was no DB in the draft who I would rather have than Shazier and Tuitt.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
06-11-2014, 09:14 AM
From the business side...Don't expect Worilds to rush back from any injury if he is on his tag. He is in no hurry to do ANYTHING. If Worilds has to play on his tag...He will not make his money until regular season. If a new deal gets done before the season....I'm sure he becomes healthy quick. Yes...There will be allot of negativity flying around...But I don't blame him at all.

Now that the personnel turnover is almost complete (Maybe a surprise signing) & the Steelers have plenty of cap room with Worilds on the tag....Why do the long term deal unless it works for the Steelers. Yes...There is a chance he plays lights out in '14. If you can't get a deal done because he increased his value..I still believe they can Franchise him in '15. 2014 LB Franchise was 11.5 mil. Eventually, he will have to make a decision about security & playing on game checks. I'm a Worilds fan & I know many others aren't...But I think you get a deal done only if it works for the Steelers.

Slapstick
06-11-2014, 09:40 AM
The only thing I fear is a Mike Wallace situation...

Poor attitude...sub par play...playing not to get injured...etc.

RuthlessBurgher
06-11-2014, 10:12 AM
I will say this...if Worilds doesn't pan out, or we can't get him signed the Steelers might be locked in going into next years draft. And that is a problem because I suspect Ike is on his way out. Which would mean OLB, and DB almost HAVE to be your top 2 picks. That is how teams get mediocre. Drafting for need.

Pouncey and Gilbert are also entering the final years of their contracts, so OL may be a pretty significant need as well, depending on who we re-sign and who we don't.

Shawn
06-11-2014, 10:59 AM
Pouncey and Gilbert are also entering the final years of their contracts, so OL may be a pretty significant need as well, depending on who we re-sign and who we don't.
This is true.

RobinCole
06-11-2014, 11:55 AM
I still haven't heard an explanation of how a player increases his market value by having a sub-par year, a poor attitude and playing not to get hurt. And by the way, if you're on the field, "playing not to get hurt" may be akin to putting a target on your back. Opponents can tell.

RuthlessBurgher
06-11-2014, 12:08 PM
I still haven't heard an explanation of how a player increases his market value by having a sub-par year, a poor attitude and playing not to get hurt.

Ask the Dolphins front office. Oh wait...they were all fired. Never mind. ;)

feltdizz
06-11-2014, 01:01 PM
ask the dolphins front office. Oh wait...they were all fired. Never mind. ;)

hilarious...

Slapstick
06-11-2014, 01:14 PM
Ask the Dolphins front office. Oh wait...they were all fired. Never mind. ;)

This is what I worry about...

Wallace was handsomely rewarded for his 2012 season...

Perhaps other FOs learned a lesson that will carry over...

birtikidis
06-11-2014, 01:14 PM
Pouncey and Gilbert are also entering the final years of their contracts, so OL may be a pretty significant need as well, depending on who we re-sign and who we don't.
Pouncey can be replaced by.. .just about anyone apparently.
Gilbert? I don't know... he hasn't been a whipping boy for a minute

RuthlessBurgher
06-11-2014, 01:15 PM
Pouncey can be replaced by.. .just about anyone apparently.

I hear that Sean Mahan and Justin Hartwig are still available, and can be had for cheap. Any takers?

feltdizz
06-11-2014, 01:50 PM
Pouncey can be replaced by.. .just about anyone apparently.

any guy in church on sunday can play center for the Steelers

Shawn
06-11-2014, 03:34 PM
I'm ready to play center at a moments notice. (Steelers call me).

BradshawsHairdresser
06-11-2014, 10:14 PM
I'm ready to play center at a moments notice. (Steelers call me).

Your last name isn't Mahan, is it?

K Train
06-12-2014, 09:40 AM
I always pay my debts, but don't blow your load just yet buddy.

Looking better and better :-)

RuthlessBurgher
06-12-2014, 10:09 AM
Your last name isn't Mahan, is it?

No. Shawn said that he COULD PLAY center. ;)

Shawn
06-12-2014, 10:31 AM
Your last name isn't Mahan, is it? I think I would actually be a better center than Mahan. I would be biting knee caps and using my "rubber glove skills" to throw these NTs off their game. I am a mean little man. :)

Shawn
06-12-2014, 10:31 AM
No. Shawn said that he COULD PLAY center. ;) Truth.....

RuthlessBurgher
06-12-2014, 10:34 AM
I could play center...in a YMCA recreational basketball league. :)

hawaiiansteel
06-12-2014, 02:50 PM
Steelers' Worilds looking toward an ambitious 2014 season

June 10, 2014 1
By Ed Bouchette / Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Jason Worilds has big goals for 2014.

Sacks?

"As many as possible."

And that would be?

"How many [pass rushes] do we get? ... 400!"

A more immediate and realistic goal might be to return to the field with his teammates sometime this week or next, when spring practices end with minicamp. The Steelers privately express little concern that Worilds has not participated in the past six spring practices after injuring his calf in the first one two weeks ago.

Worilds said he could not talk about his injury but did note that, "It's June."

Indeed it is, three months before they start teeing up the football in games that count. Right now, seeing their $9.7 million linebacker standing on the sideline wearing a Steelers ski cap, gloves, sweatpants and a gold muscle shirt does not make them anxious about his availability in September or his ability to get after the quarterback.

Joey Porter knows they need to do more of that.

Porter, now an assistant linebackers coach, is not yet permitted to talk to the media, but, if he were, he surely would be quick to point out that, in his years here and even several years beyond, the Steelers were among the best quarterback maulers in the NFL. It seems not that long ago, yet the Steelers last season ranked 27th in the NFL in sacks per pass play when they managed just 34. They had 37 the year before and 35 the year before that, which makes it very clear that their 27 total last season was far off the 48 they rang up in 2010 or the 51 they registered the most recent season they won a Super Bowl.

Coincidentally, their forced turnovers also have plunged, and they tied for fifth-fewest in the NFL with 20 in 2013.

Worilds, stamped into the starting 2014 lineup at left outside linebacker, wants to help change that.

"Coming off back-to-back 8-8 seasons, that's not what we expect around here. I'm excited to get back to the type of defense that we play."

Or, that they used to play, when they went to their most recent Super Bowl after the 2010 season. Since then, their defense has been more bark than bite. But few players remain from that 2010 defense -- or 2011 or 2012, for that matter.

Worilds is one of them, although he played only bit parts in his first two seasons of 2010 and 2011. He started to come on as a backup and fill-in starter in 2012, when he had five sacks. He emerged as a force last season, although not before first losing his starting job at right outside linebacker to rookie Jarvis Jones after one game.

Once he moved to the left side for the injured LaMarr Woodley, he blossomed. He played so well there that it prompted the Steelers to move Woodley to the right side when he became healthy, then prompted them to move Woodley right off the roster in March.

Worilds led the team with eight sacks and was second to defensive lineman Cam Heyward with 29 quarterback pressures. It was perfect timing, with his improved performance coming in his fourth and final year under contract. He was all set to become an unrestricted free agent when the Steelers slapped him with the transition tag that mandates he be paid $9.7 million this season.

There has been no progress in negotiating a long-term contract, although Worilds said Tuesday he would welcome one.

"Oh, absolutely, that's why it's long-term. You put so much time and effort into it with these guys, you want to be there for the duration of your career. That would be extremely significant."

What would be significant to a revitalized Steelers defense would be for Worilds and Jones to come through at outside linebacker the way others did so well in the past. The Steelers need to put more heat on quarterbacks than they have the past several seasons, and the outside linebacker positions are the two primary pass-rushing spots.

And like Worilds, Jones lost his starting job, too, last season.

Behind them is newcomer Arthur Moats, a free agent from Buffalo, and many others with small resumes.

Worilds could offer no reason why he was more effective on the left side than the right, other than settling in there over the second half of last season.

"I think, at that point of the season, I kind of knew that was where I was going to play. I think it's continuity more than anything."

The one thing the Steelers have had going for them through the years is a ferocious continuity at outside linebacker, until injuries to Woodley and James Harrison, then ineffectiveness took hold the past several seasons.

They need to return to the days when opposing quarterbacks feared those two positions. If not, everything else they do on defense won't matter much.

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/steelers/2014/06/10/Steelers-Worilds-l/stories/201406100241#ixzz34Rce4qnU

RuthlessBurgher
06-12-2014, 03:28 PM
I'm concerned about why the dude was wearing a ski cap and gloves in June. :confused: