PDA

View Full Version : Today is the day that changes the NFL Draft for all teams!!!



Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 12:14 PM
Yep, yep!......;)

thor75
03-27-2013, 12:37 PM
Is K.C. trading out of the first overall?

Mister Pittsburgh
03-27-2013, 12:40 PM
Expand on this thought please....'Whatch'ou talkin' bout Willis'?

Rara
03-27-2013, 12:41 PM
Yeah...enlighten us?

Mister Pittsburgh
03-27-2013, 12:43 PM
Matt Flynn traded to a top 10 pick team? Raidah's or Bills or Jags???

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 12:43 PM
Oh my goodness!! I have been saying it for months now. Matt Barkley is going to change everything today at his pro day. He is going to show he has a lot more arm strength than many had thought. And when he does he will then show that he actually has all the tools to be an NFL QB. The dominoes will fall thereafter.

Shawn
03-27-2013, 12:44 PM
This is just Dubs being Dubs...nothing to see here.

Shawn
03-27-2013, 12:44 PM
Oh my goodness!! I have been saying it for months now. Matt Barkley is going to change everything today at his pro day. He is going to show he has a lot more arm strength than many had thought. And when he does he will then show that he actually has all the tools to be an NFL QB. The dominoes will fall thereafter.

Like I said. :/

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 12:48 PM
Like I said. :/

Have you seen a mock draft that has Barkley in the first round lately? Has him in the top 15? Top 10? You will after today.;)

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 12:49 PM
April Fools is on the 1st Dub

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 12:55 PM
It is all about his arm strength. This time last year all had no questions about his arm strength. He was seen as a lock for the first QB drafted overall and some thought maybe even the first player taken. He hurt his shoulder this year and now he is seen as not having NFL arm strength. Teams want to see what he does today in his throws outside the deep hash. Me personally...I already know that outcome. ;)

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
03-27-2013, 01:02 PM
Me personally...I already know that outcome. ;)

So, where do you think this workout will put him on the QB list? It is an underwhelming year this year for the QB class.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 01:04 PM
So, where do you think this workout will put him on the QB list? It is an underwhelming year this year for the QB class.

I have said all along, he is the best QB in this draft. I believe in the right situation, he is a franchise QB. He is not Mark Sanchez. He is far superior. And a lot more experience going into the NFL.

SteelerOfDeVille
03-27-2013, 01:13 PM
Have you seen a mock draft that has Barkley in the first round lately? Has him in the top 15? Top 10? You will after today.;)
and some fool will take him way early... you either show it on the field, or you aint got it!! combines and pro days dont' change that... they should only "confirm" or "prove innacurate" or "raise flags"... with a good impression, you may move a few slots (ahead of the next guy at your position) and with a bad performance, you may slide a slot or two... but, 1st rounder is still 1st rounder (see Jarvis Jones)... but, not jump from 2nd round to top 10...

RuthlessBurgher
03-27-2013, 01:16 PM
He is not Mark Sanchez. He is far superior.

Mark Sanchez isn't exactly the measuring stick for QB excellence that NFL GM's are looking for.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 01:32 PM
Mark Sanchez isn't exactly the measuring stick for QB excellence that NFL GM's are looking for.

You probably arent saying that after Sanchez's first 3 years in the league. But having said that I see your point. My point is they are not the same but many have made that comparison because they went to the same school.

I think Matt Barkley is more Drew Brees than Mark Sanchez. And Drew Brees was knocked for arm strength. Put him in the right system with weapons and he is a franchise QB.

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 01:37 PM
Arm strength was a concern BEFORE the injury...

His accuracy in the 15 to 30 range is sketchy as well...

He is best suited for a West Coast offense... he won't be a star though...

I think I'm the only one to use USC and star QB in the same sentence.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 01:38 PM
and some fool will take him way early... you either show it on the field, or you aint got it!! combines and pro days dont' change that... they should only "confirm" or "prove innacurate" or "raise flags"... with a good impression, you may move a few slots (ahead of the next guy at your position) and with a bad performance, you may slide a slot or two... but, 1st rounder is still 1st rounder (see Jarvis Jones)... but, not jump from 2nd round to top 10...

But you are forgetting the most important factor here, Matt Barkley hasnt been able to work out or show up-close his ability to scouts and NFL personal. If he was healthy a month ago at the combine you would have seen him in many mock drafts as a first round talent.

For a player that had a "down" year Matt Barkley still threw 36 TD's, over 3200 yards, and completed 63.6% of his passes. Think about that. For a team that had an injured offensive line and had a horrible defense and had to play from behind in most of their games, that says a lot more to me.

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 01:39 PM
You probably arent saying that after Sanchez's first 3 years in the league. But having said that I see your point. My point is they are not the same but many have made that comparison because they went to the same school.

I think Matt Barkley is more Drew Brees than Mark Sanchez. And Drew Brees was knocked for arm strength. Put him in the right system with weapons and he is a franchise QB.

Dirty handed the ball off 90% of the time his first 3 years and anytime he had to wing it he failed. The only play he can run is the play action post... anything else is a toss up.

That dude sucks so bad.. why would you even use him as a measuring stick? Ugh..

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 01:41 PM
But you are forgetting the most important factor here, Matt Barkley hasnt been able to work out or show up-close his ability to scouts and NFL personal. If he was healthy a month ago at the combine you would have seen him in many mock drafts as a first round talent.

For a player that had a "down" year Matt Barkley still threw 36 TD's, over 3200 yards, and completed 63.6% of his passes. Think about that. For a team that had an injured offensive line and had a horrible defense and had to play from behind in most of their games, that says a lot more to me.

so it's all game tape with Te'o... and all combine with Barkley? Gotcha...

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 01:43 PM
Arm strength was a concern BEFORE the injury...

His accuracy in the 15 to 30 range is sketchy as well...

He is best suited for a West Coast offense... he won't be a star though...

I think I'm the only one to use USC and star QB in the same sentence.


Show me a report from this time last year questioning his arm strength. How do many experts (this time last year), call him the number one overall QB for 2013 and possibly the number one overall pick with questionable arm strength? Makes no sense. The arm strength issue came up this year. And he got hurt. Shoulder.

His 64.1% 4 year completion percentage says that you are not correct in his accuracy from 15-30 yards. Remember he started as a true freshman.

But you really dont know much about him and we know this. ;)

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 01:46 PM
so it's all game tape with Te'o... and all combine with Barkley? Gotcha...

Are you kidding me? We are talking about an arm/shoulder injury for a QB. The work out is very important for him. But hey...go to the tape on Barkley for all 4 years. What do you see?

You lose. :)

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 01:48 PM
Dirty handed the ball off 90% of the time his first 3 years and anytime he had to wing it he failed. The only play he can run is the play action post... anything else is a toss up.

That dude sucks so bad.. why would you even use him as a measuring stick? Ugh..

I said Barkley was far superior to Sanchez. Did you not read that? And the only reason I mentioned Sanchez is because of uninformed posters like you have made that compassion based on them playing at the same school. And that is pretty intelligent. :)

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 01:56 PM
In a comparison with Luck in 2011

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/ncf/story/_/id/7150631/stanford-andrew-luck-vs-usc-matt-barkley-tale-tape

Accuracy
Barkley (2): He's very accurate in short to intermediate throws. He has good touch on the ball in shallow crosses and slants and allows the receiver to maximize yards after the catch. He delivers accurate balls when his feet aren't set. He needs big improvement on deep balls. He doesn't put enough touch on it. You don't know how strong overall his arm is, so he needs to drive a lot of balls to get distance. He can't really float it and let the receiver adjust to it. He's very accurate on the move outside the pocket rolling right and left.

Arm Strength
Barkley (3): This is Barkley's downfall, where we have him rated the lowest. He has the ability to change release points, but his arm strength is adequate to maybe slightly above average. He doesn't have the prototypical ability to drive the ball downfield, like Joe Flacco or Landry Jones. His deep ball tends to hang up there. He's a guy we believe is a West Coast system-type guy.

One of the biggest marks against USC quarterback prospect Matt Barkley has been his lack of arm strength. That is why many draft pundits scattered across the web have put a low grade on him, doubting that he gets drafted in the first round. He has shown that he likes to check the ball down far too often and can't get enough velocity under his throw for the deep ball.
Those concerns were only made greater after Barkley injured his throwing shoulder towards the latter end of last season. Because of the injury, he was not able to throw at the NFL Combine. Instead, he continues to rehab it and hopes to throw at his Pro Day at USC. And when he does, he says that his arm will be even stronger than it was before.

There are tons of stories on his average arm strength BEFORE the injury. It's always been a concern.

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 01:59 PM
I said Barkley was far superior to Sanchez. Did you not read that? And the only reason I mentioned Sanchez is because of uninformed posters like you have made that compassion based on them playing at the same school. And that is pretty intelligent. :)

I don't think I've ever compared these 2... I may have said all USC QB's suck but c'mon... no one uses Sanchez as anything more than a prime example of a USC bum.

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 02:05 PM
and another one..

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000098453/article/matt-barkley-doesnt-resemble-elite-quarterback-prospect-in-2012

Now, it is important to note that Barkley was not a lock to be a top-10 pick a season ago. In fact, scouts told me last spring that Barkley wasn't a cinch to be the third quarterback in the 2012 draft class, despite having a more impressive collegiate résumé than Texas A&M's Ryan Tannehill (http://www.nfl.com/player/ryantannehill/2532956/profile) (who went to the Miami Dolphins (http://www.nfl.com/teams/miamidolphins/profile?team=MIA) with the eighth overall pick) and Oklahoma State's Brandon Weeden (http://www.nfl.com/player/brandonweeden/2532970/profile) (drafted by the Cleveland Browns (http://www.nfl.com/teams/clevelandbrowns/profile?team=CLE) at 22nd overall). Evaluators cited Barkley's lack of elite physical tools (height, arm talent and athleticism) as major concerns. Although Barkley was listed at 6-foot-2, 230 pounds, scouts questioned whether he was tall enough to play the position at the next level, and worried that his lack of athleticism would make him a sitting duck in the pocket

Scouts also worried about Barkley's lack of elite arm strength. Although he displayed the capacity to make short and intermediate throws with zip and velocity, he didn't blow evaluators away with his deep-ball range, accuracy or touch. Barkley routinely underthrew his receivers on vertical throws, relying on Marqise Lee and Robert Woods to make plays on the ball. Both playmakers are regarded as future elite NFL prospects; some wonder if Barkley's production is a byproduct of their remarkable skills.

Barkley is a classic drop-back passer with sound throwing mechanics and a smooth delivery. He shows a compact windup and an over-the-top throwing motion with a quick release. Barkley displays good (but not great) arm strength on intermediate and deep throws. Although his balls tend to flutter on out-breaking routes that are longer than 15 yards, he shows adequate zip and velocity on his throws. Barkley can certainly fit balls into tight windows on intermediate throws inside the numbers, but he lacks the overpowering arm strength to complete the deep comeback from the opposite hash on a rope against tight coverage. The exceptional speed and quickness of NFL defensive backs will result in break-ups or interceptions, unless Barkley shows extraordinary timing and anticipation, releasing the ball well before the receiver comes out of his break.
On deep throws, Barkley shows a throwing range of about 50 to 55 yards. He has routinely connected with Lee and Nelson Agholor on vertical routes down the field. While most of those completions have resulted from his exceptional timing and anticipation, Barkley has shown the arm strength to throw the ball over the top of the defense when defenders squat on routes. This was particularly evident against Oregon on Nov. 3, when he connected on 75- and 76-yard touchdowns on deep post routes to Lee and Agholor, respectively. In my mind, these throws certainly squelched some of the concern about his deep-ball ability. However, the fallout from "Inflate Gate" could alter that opinion. (A USC ball boy was reprimanded following that game for deflating footballs, which he later admitted to doing; the use of underinflated balls makes it easier for quarterbacks to throw the ball down the field with greater zip and velocity.)

phillyesq
03-27-2013, 02:06 PM
Dub, I hope that you are right. If Barkley moves up, that will knock somebody else back for the Steelers.

BigRob
03-27-2013, 02:11 PM
If a pro-day for a QB changes the draft, then that team is an idiot. Teams aren't going to change their opinion about Barkley based on a pro-day, especially where the QB is throwing in shorts to his receivers.

The tape is the basis for QB evaluation. If a team liked his tape, they still do regardless of what he does today. The medical eval is the main thing for him.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 02:12 PM
In a comparison with Luck in 2011

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/ncf/story/_/id/7150631/stanford-andrew-luck-vs-usc-matt-barkley-tale-tape

Accuracy
Barkley (2): He's very accurate in short to intermediate throws. He has good touch on the ball in shallow crosses and slants and allows the receiver to maximize yards after the catch. He delivers accurate balls when his feet aren't set. He needs big improvement on deep balls. He doesn't put enough touch on it. You don't know how strong overall his arm is, so he needs to drive a lot of balls to get distance. He can't really float it and let the receiver adjust to it. He's very accurate on the move outside the pocket rolling right and left.

Arm Strength
Barkley (3): This is Barkley's downfall, where we have him rated the lowest. He has the ability to change release points, but his arm strength is adequate to maybe slightly above average. He doesn't have the prototypical ability to drive the ball downfield, like Joe Flacco or Landry Jones. His deep ball tends to hang up there. He's a guy we believe is a West Coast system-type guy.

One of the biggest marks against USC quarterback prospect Matt Barkley has been his lack of arm strength. That is why many draft pundits scattered across the web have put a low grade on him, doubting that he gets drafted in the first round. He has shown that he likes to check the ball down far too often and can't get enough velocity under his throw for the deep ball.
Those concerns were only made greater after Barkley injured his throwing shoulder towards the latter end of last season. Because of the injury, he was not able to throw at the NFL Combine. Instead, he continues to rehab it and hopes to throw at his Pro Day at USC. And when he does, he says that his arm will be even stronger than it was before.

There are tons of stories on his average arm strength BEFORE the injury. It's always been a concern.

feltdizz, talking to you about something you really dont know much about is silly. You dont even stay on topic. The issue has been that Barkley has below average arm strength. You have shown me a report from last year that says he has adequate to slightly above average arm strength. Then you hi-light the injury last years as something that contributed to it?.......Duh!!!

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 02:14 PM
If a pro-day for a QB changes the draft, then that team is an idiot. Teams aren't going to change their opinion about Barkley based on a pro-day, especially where the QB is throwing in shorts to his receivers.

The tape is the basis for QB evaluation. If a team liked his tape, they still do regardless of what he does today. The medical eval is the main thing for him.

I dont think this is the same here. We are talking about a QB who had a shoulder injury. Apples to Oranges. Did scouts like his tape last year? You bet they did.

hawaiiansteel
03-27-2013, 02:16 PM
Have you seen a mock draft that has Barkley in the first round lately? Has him in the top 15? Top 10? You will after today.;)

I hope you're right, that will move one more player we may want to us at #17.

papillon
03-27-2013, 02:46 PM
Haden, Salsbury, Peete, Marinovich, Palmer, Cassell, Sanchez, Booty, and Leinart all USC quarterbacks that didn't quite have the splash expected in the NFL. I'm not certain what happens from USC golden boy to average or below average NFL quarterback, but it happens like clockwork. I suspect Barkley will be the same.

Pappy

Slapstick
03-27-2013, 02:50 PM
Haden, Salsbury, Peete, Marinovich, Palmer, Cassell, Sanchez, Booty, and Leinart all USC quarterbacks that didn't quite have the splash expected in the NFL. I'm not certain what happens from USC golden boy to average or below average NFL quarterback, but it happens like clockwork. I suspect Barkley will be the same.

Pappy

I wouldn't necessarily lump Carson Palmer in there...he was fine until his knee injury...

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 02:55 PM
ESPN just posted this...

Final 2 years in college for passes of 20 yards or more

Matt Barkley------40.8% completion percentage and 24 TD's and 2 INT's
Andrew Luck------43.1% completion percentage and 13 TD's and 5 INT's
Robert Griffen III--38.2% completion percentage and 33 TD's and 5 Int's

I think that speaks volume for accuracy.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 02:56 PM
Haden, Salsbury, Peete, Marinovich, Palmer, Cassell, Sanchez, Booty, and Leinart all USC quarterbacks that didn't quite have the splash expected in the NFL. I'm not certain what happens from USC golden boy to average or below average NFL quarterback, but it happens like clockwork. I suspect Barkley will be the same.

Pappy

Did they all run the same offense? Did they all start 4 years and as a true freshman?

As a result I suspect Barkley wont be the same.

Shawn
03-27-2013, 03:04 PM
It is all about his arm strength. This time last year all had no questions about his arm strength. He was seen as a lock for the first QB drafted overall and some thought maybe even the first player taken. He hurt his shoulder this year and now he is seen as not having NFL arm strength. Teams want to see what he does today in his throws outside the deep hash. Me personally...I already know that outcome. ;)

You should really consider becoming an NFL scout.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 03:13 PM
Barkley ran an unofficial 40 at 4.87. Not bad and that was better than most thought he would do.

Oviedo
03-27-2013, 03:26 PM
Mark Sanchez isn't exactly the measuring stick for QB excellence that NFL GM's are looking for.

Has any USC QB ever been the measuring stick for QB excellence in the NFL. Stay away from USC QBs.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 03:30 PM
Has any USC QB ever been the measuring stick for QB excellence in the NFL. Stay away from USC QBs.

Has any USC QB had the success as Matt Barkley for 4 years and as a true freshman?

If your answer is no and we know it is, then how can you compare them? Oh I get it..it's because they all went to USC. Great insight Ovi. Real Man of Genius there.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 03:34 PM
Has any USC QB ever been the measuring stick for QB excellence in the NFL. Stay away from USC QBs.

Oh and has any Baylor QB ever been the measuring stick fro excellence in the NFL before RGIII? UCLA before Troy Aikman? Louisiana State before Terry Bradshaw? Cal before Aaron Rodgers? Tennessee before Peyton Manning?

Get the point?

BigRob
03-27-2013, 03:40 PM
I dont think this is the same here. We are talking about a QB who had a shoulder injury. Apples to Oranges. Did scouts like his tape last year? You bet they did.

Let me ask you a question Dub. Would you take him at 17 if he falls?

I still happen to think he will go top 10 along with Geno Smith. I see him going to the Cardinals.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 03:46 PM
Let me ask you a question Dub. Would you take him at 17 if he falls?

I still happen to think he will go top 10 along with Geno Smith. I see him going to the Cardinals.

No the Steelers have a QB. Now if if Ben were traded...yes I would draft him 17. Then draft Eddie Lacy in rounds two and watch Barkley flourish in a run first, smash mouth, play action offense.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 03:48 PM
By the way Barkley's 40 time of 4.87 is very impressive considering it is a very slow track they are running on. How slow? Robert Woods ran a 4.51 at the combine and today ran a 4.8.

BigRob
03-27-2013, 03:59 PM
No the Steelers have a QB. Now if if Ben were traded...yes I would draft him 17. Then draft Eddie Lacy in rounds two and watch Barkley flourish in a run first, smash mouth, play action offense.

Why? You believe him to be a top 10 QB. What if he is the next Aaron Rodgers? Ben is getting old and his decline will come quickly as the injuries continue to pile up.

You don't pass on a QB you believe to be a top 10 pick if you think he is special.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 04:17 PM
Why? You believe him to be a top 10 QB. What if he is the next Aaron Rodgers? Ben is getting old and his decline will come quickly as the injuries continue to pile up.

You don't pass on a QB you believe to be a top 10 pick if you think he is special.

Honestly I wouldn't have a problem with it Rob but I think the iron is still hot for the Steelers. I think they can get another championship now with Ben and it would help to use that pick on an immediate need.

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 04:18 PM
feltdizz, talking to you about something you really dont know much about is silly. You dont even stay on topic. The issue has been that Barkley has below average arm strength. You have shown me a report from last year that says he has adequate to slightly above average arm strength. Then you hi-light the injury last years as something that contributed to it?.......Duh!!!

Nice try... previously you said there were no concerns about his arm strength prior to his injury.. I proved you wrong. No one ever said he had below average arm strength. You made that one up yourself.

The other highlight says the CONCERNS were made GREATER after the injury which means they were concerned before he was injured...

again... nice try.

Sugar
03-27-2013, 04:30 PM
I'd take Barkley in a heartbeat if we didn't have Ben. The guy is a model player and has nerves of steel. Somebody else will get him and be lucky to have him.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 04:35 PM
Nice try... previously you said there were no concerns about his arm strength prior to his injury.. I proved you wrong. No one ever said he had below average arm strength. You made that one up yourself.

The other highlight says the CONCERNS were made GREATER after the injury which means they were concerned before he was injured...

again... nice try.

Ok how ever you want to spin it...how is adequate to above average arm strength (which you yourself posted), a concern?

Makes no sense. That falls in the category of "No Concern".

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 04:37 PM
I'd take Barkley in a heartbeat if we didn't have Ben. The guy is a model player and has nerves of steel. Somebody else will get him and be lucky to have him.

Me too. Agreed.

A freshman starter at Mater Dei. He has been in this position (at the highest levels), as a starter for the past two levels he has played at for 8 years. Think about that.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 04:46 PM
Like I said there is nothing wrong with Barkley's arm. He is showing that he has above average arm strength. Now...

He was taller than scouts thought.
He was faster than scouts thought.
His arm is stronger than scouts thought.

Add his leadership, experience, mechanics, and on-field performance...

Let the transcend up the draft board begin. ;)

steelblood
03-27-2013, 04:51 PM
Dub,

I'm liking your mock. It is very realistic and would really help this team. Nice job. I reallly like Earl Wold and Slay. Both are future starters imo.

Mine is more pie in the sky. I need an update.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 04:57 PM
Dub,

I'm liking your mock. It is very realistic and would really help this team. Nice job. I reallly like Earl Wold and Slay. Both are future starters imo.

Mine is more pie in the sky. I need an update.

Thanks Blood. Keenan Allen is being compared to a young Anquan Boldin. Allen isnt the fasted (straight line speed), but in the open field he is elusive and can break tackles. And he is probably the most complete receiver in this draft. He can block like Hines Ward and loves to do it too. I believe because of his injury he is one of the most under-looked at player in this draft.

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 05:41 PM
Ok how ever you want to spin it...how is adequate to above average arm strength (which you yourself posted), a concern?

Makes no sense. That falls in the category of "No Concern".

Damn dude... ask the scouts that question. They had concerns and you even acknowledged it so Im not sure why you keep twisting in the wind over it.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 05:46 PM
A couple of tid bits about Barkley's pro day.

Foot work was exceptional.
Mechanics were exceptional.
Arm strength was above average and very accurate on the deep outs.
He chose a routine that was far more difficult than what most QB 's use on their pro days.
And he chose to throw into the wind today.

Sugar
03-27-2013, 05:46 PM
Me too. Agreed.

A freshman starter at Mater Dei. He has been in this position (at the highest levels), as a starter for the past two levels he has played at for 8 years. Think about that.

I don't watch much amateur football, but I remember him as a freshman playing at Ohio State. That kid wasn't fazed in prime time against the Buckeyes and 100,000 fans that wanted to see him crushed. I've only caught glimpses of him here and there, but have always thought that he was the kind of guy that I would want to lead a team.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 05:54 PM
Damn dude... ask the scouts that question. They had concerns and you even acknowledged it so Im not sure why you keep twisting in the wind over it.

Back tracking again. You are easy. Just corner you and you cower into a little ball. :)

I have disagreed with the assessment about him having a below average arm. I would hardly think that is acknowledging what scouts have said about it.

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 06:22 PM
Back tracking again. You are easy. Just corner you and you cower into a little ball. :)

I have disagreed with the assessment about him having a below average arm. I would hardly think that is acknowledging what scouts have said about it.

LOL... its not back tracking buddy... you asked for proof that scouts questioned his arm strength before the injury... I provided proof. Then you said you were talking about below average arm strength... I have no idea where that assessment came from.

You can spin all you want but scouts have questioned his arm strength from the jump.

http://m.nfl.com/news/0ap1000000154608/matt-barkleys-usc-pro-day-draws-mixed-reviews/

Once again... some scouts are talking about his passes fluttering in the wind.

Im in a corner... sooooo scared.

Siggy00
03-27-2013, 06:31 PM
"There's no knock (against him)," Mayock added. "His arm strength is what I thought it was. It's good. It's just not elite."

NFL.com's Daniel Jeremiah, a former NFL scout, wasn't as sold on Barkley's arm talent. "You just want to see a little more giddy up to use a baseball term," Jeremiah said. "You want to see a little more life on his fastball.
______________________________

Terrific, another Philip Rivers minus the meat head.

hawaiiansteel
03-27-2013, 06:31 PM
I don't watch much amateur football, but I remember him as a freshman playing at Ohio State. That kid wasn't fazed in prime time against the Buckeyes and 100,000 fans that wanted to see him crushed. I've only caught glimpses of him here and there, but have always thought that he was the kind of guy that I would want to lead a team.

Matt Barkley is the first 3-time captain ever at USC, I think that says a lot.

D Rock
03-27-2013, 06:38 PM
Matt Barkley is the first 3-time captain ever at USC, I think that says a lot.


considering the downslide USC has had under his captaincy (two 5 loss seasons), culminating in a locker room brawl started when people questioned his leadership, I certainly agree that a lot is said by that.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 07:23 PM
"There's no knock (against him)," Mayock added. "His arm strength is what I thought it was. It's good. It's just not elite."

NFL.com's Daniel Jeremiah, a former NFL scout, wasn't as sold on Barkley's arm talent. "You just want to see a little more giddy up to use a baseball term," Jeremiah said. "You want to see a little more life on his fastball.
______________________________

Terrific, another Philip Rivers minus the meat head.

You mean like Jamarcus Russell arm strength? Or Jeff George arm strength? No thanks. This kid has the it factor. And it starts with what those elite arms lacked. What is between his ears. 8 years as starter in a pro style offense.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 07:26 PM
LOL... its not back tracking buddy... you asked for proof that scouts questioned his arm strength before the injury... I provided proof. Then you said you were talking about below average arm strength... I have no idea where that assessment came from.

You can spin all you want but scouts have questioned his arm strength from the jump.

http://m.nfl.com/news/0ap1000000154608/matt-barkleys-usc-pro-day-draws-mixed-reviews/

Once again... some scouts are talking about his passes fluttering in the wind.

Im in a corner... sooooo scared.


His passes fluttering in the wind? It was the deep 9 route. It happened twice yet he still got the ball to the receiver. And he chose to throw in the wind. Think about that.

How many deep 9 routes are thrown in an NFL game feltdizz?

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 07:32 PM
considering the downslide USC has had under his captaincy (two 5 loss seasons), culminating in a locker room brawl started when people questioned his leadership, I certainly agree that a lot is said by that.

Those 5 loss seasons weren't his fault. Look at his numbers. He flat out lit it up. The Trojans have had horrible defenses for the past couple of years and no running game.

And he didnt play in that last game. Not sure how his leadership could be questioned in a game he didnt play??? But this is an example of reading what is said and not actually watching the kid on the field.

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 07:38 PM
His passes fluttering in the wind? It was the deep 9 route. It happened twice yet he still got the ball to the receiver. And he chose to throw in the wind. Think about that.

How many deep 9 routes are thrown in an NFL game feltdizz?

Depends on the OC and the circumstances... he better play in a dome.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 07:42 PM
"There's no knock (against him)," Mayock added. "His arm strength is what I thought it was. It's good. It's just not elite."

NFL.com's Daniel Jeremiah, a former NFL scout, wasn't as sold on Barkley's arm talent. "You just want to see a little more giddy up to use a baseball term," Jeremiah said. "You want to see a little more life on his fastball.
______________________________

Terrific, another Philip Rivers minus the meat head.

I could see why Daniel Jeremiah is no longer and NFL Scout. You would think he of all people would understand that these pro days are set up for guys with elite arm strength to excel.

It is probably why he missed on the likes of Tom Brady, Drew Brees, etc. And why he was so high on guys like JaMarcus Russell. Hilarious. :p

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 07:48 PM
Depends on the OC and the circumstances... he better play in a dome.

Did you see him throw today? I know you didnt. That is why you sound as one talking out the side of his neck. He was very impressive throwing the ball. And factor in he threw into a wind was even more impressive. He also deliberately chose a play set/routine that was far more difficult than what most QB's do in their pro days.

By the way he only fluttered a couple of passes today. He still competed them. And there were a couple of deep passes where the crowed actually cheered/wooed them loudly after they were caught.

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 07:58 PM
Did you see him throw today? I know you didnt. That is why you sound as one talking out the side of his neck. He was very impressive throwing the ball. And factor in he threw into a wind was even more impressive. He also deliberately chose a play set/routine that was far more difficult than what most QB's do in their pro days.

By the way he only fluttered a couple of passes today. He still competed them. And there were a couple of deep passes where the crowed actually cheered/wooed them loudly after they were caught.

I watched some of it on NFLN... I didnt see the whole thing.

Crowds cheering at a pro day... ok.

hawaiiansteel
03-27-2013, 07:59 PM
Matt Barkley's USC pro day draws mixed reviews

By Chris Wesseling
Around the League Writer
Published: March 27, 2013

Multiple NFL executives predicted to NFL.com's Albert Breer earlier this month that USC's Matt Barkley could catch West Virginia's Geno Smith as the top quarterback leading up to the 2013 NFL draft.

After sitting out of passing drills at the NFL Scouting Combine, Barkley had an opportunity to dispel concerns about his arm strength at the Trojans' pro day Wednesday.

NFL Network draft analyst Mike Mayock would have liked to have seen a tighter spiral on throws that fluttered a bit against the wind, but noted that Barkley's deep-ball accuracy was a strong part of the workout.

Everything underneath and between the hashes looked "great" Mayock said. Mayock timed Barkley at 4.95 seconds and 4.97 in the 40-yard dash.

"There's no knock (against him)," Mayock added. "His arm strength is what I thought it was. It's good. It's just not elite."

NFL.com's Daniel Jeremiah, a former NFL scout, wasn't as sold on Barkley's arm talent. "You just want to see a little more giddy up to use a baseball term," Jeremiah said. "You want to see a little more life on his fastball.

"There was a widespread belief that, even with his intangibles and rare football IQ, Barkley would need a great pro day to put himself in position to be the first quarterback off the board next month."

Although NFL Network analyst Charles Davis thought Barkley "did a good job," it was not enough to "knock Geno Smith off his pedestal."

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000154608/article/matt-barkleys-usc-pro-day-draws-mixed-reviewshttp://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000154608/article/matt-barkleys-usc-pro-day-draws-mixed-reviews

feltdizz
03-27-2013, 09:25 PM
I could see why Daniel Jeremiah is no longer and NFL Scout. You would think he of all people would understand that these pro days are set up for guys with elite arm strength to excel.

It is probably why he missed on the likes of Tom Brady, Drew Brees, etc. And why he was so high on guys like JaMarcus Russell. Hilarious. :p

Everyone missed on Tom Brady... lol.

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 09:44 PM
Great article on one who actually get's it. And why this ex-QB thinks BArkley should be the number 1 overall QB taken in this draft. Here are some bits and pieces of it.

Barkley: 41 percent completion percentage, 24 TDs, 2 INTs
Luck: 43 percent, 13 TDs, 5 INTs
Griffin: 38 percent, 33 TDs, 5 INTs
And according to ESPN Stats & Info, Barkley was far more likely to overthrow his receivers on deep passes than underthrow them -- another point in favor of his arm strength.

More importantly, third down was an area of growth and improvement for Barkley throughout his career, and even as USC's season fell apart in 2012, Barkley's poise on third down didn't. In fact, his 2012 production surpassed his 2011 output, and his 61 percent completion rate with 11 TDs and 4 INTs equated to an NFL QB rating of 104.8 on the make-or-break down.

last two seasons Barkley's 42 touchdown passes on 116 attempts in the red zone speak loudly to the signal-caller's vast experience and productivity in that part of the field. Over that same stretch, Barkley was intercepted and sacked just three times.

Without an elite rushing attack in 2012 (the Trojans ranked 72nd in the FBS in rushing yards per game), the onus was on the passing game to finish at the end of the field where the game speeds up, the windows tighten and the field condenses. Touch, accuracy, anticipation and instincts jump off the film 20 yards and in, and no one in the history of the conference has done it better than Barkley.
Barkley has completed more than 65 percent of his passes with 23 touchdowns and three interceptions when outside the pocket in his career, including 16 touchdowns on designed roll-outs.

Barkley started 47 of 51 games over his four years in Los Angeles.

Unlike his USC QB brethren Matt Leinart, Carson Palmer and Mark Sanchez, Barkley didn't have Pete Carroll's elite defenses to lighten his burden, especially down the home stretch of his career. There was no Clay Matthews or Lofa Tatupu or Brian Cushing. No, the defenses during Barkley's stay were some of the worst statistical units in school history, and Barkley had to carry the load as a result.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft2013/story/_/id/9103319/2013-nfl-draft-why-matt-barkley-first-qb-taken

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 10:31 PM
Yep..I was right. This day did change things for all teams. Now Mayock is saying Barkley is a solid first round pick. This will snow ball with in the next 4 weeks. And the bang wagon is going to get a lot more heavier.

Mayock: USC quarterback Matt Barkley can 'step in and run a pro offense quickly'
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-draft/0ap2000000154396/Mayock-Barkley-can-step-in-and-run-a-pro-offense-quickly

Oh and look at these down field throws. Pretty above average arm strength if you ask me. And oh into the wind. ;)

Dee Dub
03-27-2013, 10:46 PM
Only five of the 60-plus passes Barkley threw hit the ground, with two of those being perfectly thrown passes which slipped through the fingers of Woods and Byrd, respectively.
"I was impressed by the number of passes threw today," said St. Louis general manager Les Snead. "Since he was injured to end his career, this was his recital. It was an overall very good day for him."
Snead was one of three general managers on hand. Chicago's Phil Emery and Jacksonville'sDavid Caldwell (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1251030/david-caldwell) also attended.
Caldwell was one of several representatives from the Jaguars, including senior vice president Tony Khan, head coach Gus Bradley and offensive coordinator Jedd Fisch.
While Jacksonville sent a large contingent to the workout, only one scout was on hand for the Arizona Cardinals. The Buffalo Bills, an organization that has been quite transparent in its plans to draft a quarterback, were conspicuous in their apparent absence from the workout.
Although they rate well below what is ascertained in game films, Pro Day workouts do have value. Unlike during a game in which there are multiple moving parts which can distract the eye, scouts are allowed to stand on the sideline and simply focus on the quarterback's throwing motion, gauge his velocity and read the expression on his face from snap to snap.
Putting Barkley's workout in perspective is critical to understanding what impact it might have on his landing spot on draft day. Scouts are as split on the quarterback rankings this year as any in the past 10 years. [B]As such, Barkley's strong effort could lead to a significant jump up draft boards.
Barkley wasn't dynamic. Several of his deeper passes wobbled and he forced wideouts to adjust their routes a few times on in-breaking routes. However, the first part of his passing workout was into a slight wind.
He was very impressive during the "quick game" so critical to the West Coast offense, demonstrating the efficient set-up and delivery and impressive accuracy when rolling out. He was particularly accurate on the wheel and corner routes, two passes considered among the more difficult throws critical to this attack.
Barkley's workout wasn't as good as the one Andrew Luck (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/1631912/andrew-luck) had a year ago in Palo Alto, some of which was into a stiff breeze. He didn't show the elite combination of velocity and ball placement that Sam Bradford (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/1123599/sam-bradford) demonstrated inside the Oklahoma practice bubble in 2010.
The Southern Cal passer, however, carried out quarterback guru Chris Weinke's scripted session with efficiency and impressive accuracy, overall. The workout was comparable to recent sessions by Jake Locker (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/1117861/jake-locker) and Mark Sanchez (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/559373/mark-sanchez), each of whom rode their showings to top-eight selections in their respective draft classes.
Barkley's passing was the critical element to his day but he also boosted his cause by clocking between 4.92 and 4.97-seconds in the 40-yard dash at a solid 230 pounds. The 40-yard dash was the only measured drill Barkley participated in.
That wasn't the case for his primary target, Woods, who shaved nearly a tenth-of-a-second off the 4.47-second 20-yard shuttle drill he'd run at the combine with a time of 4.38 seconds. He was even better in the three-cone drill, where he was timed as fast as 6.84 seconds after being clocked at a disappointing 7.15 seconds in the drill in Indianapolis.
As impressive as Woods was in timed drills, he was even better during the positional drills, exploding out of his breaks and catching nearly every pass thrown to him, including a dazzling one-handed catch deep down the right sideline.
Woods' one drop came on a deep post on Barkley's final throw against the wind in which the receiver simply lost his concentration.
While the hype centered around the "skill position" players Wednesday, the big winner may have been safety, T.J. McDonald (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1664157/tj-mcdonald), who drew praise from Kansas City Chiefs' scout and defensive backs' coach Drae Harris, who, along with Pittsburgh Steelers' defensive backs coach Carnell Lake, put USC's cornerbacks and safety through extended drills.
"[McDonald] is an explosive athlete who is quickly able to take what we were asking him to do and apply it to the field. He's so explosive out of his cuts and covers such ground."
McDonald, who measured in at 6-3, 213 pounds, led each of the defensive back drills. He caught every pass thrown to him, consistently using his height to his advantage by extending far beyond his frame to secure the ball.
Reserve safety Drew McAllister (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1688806/drew-mcallister) also helped his cause with a strong effort during positional drills, showing similar ball skills as his more well-known former teammate.
This wasn't the case for cornerback Nickell Robey (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1737252/nickell-robey), however, who dropped several potential "interceptions" in drills. Robey wowed scouts with a 40.5-inch vertical jump Wednesday morning but he didn't use his explosiveness when it mattered most, often leaping as the ball arrived only to catch the ball at chest-level or lower.
It was a similarly disappointing day for USC center Khaled Holmes (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1631885/khaled-holmes), who cited a strained pectoral at the combine as the reason why he was unable to lift Wednesday.
Holmes characterized the injury as "not serious" but said he had no plans at this time to lift for scouts before the draft. He did say that he had a number of private workouts lined up in the coming weeks, including a workout on campus Friday with the Philadelphia Eagles.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/blog/rob-rang/21960061/pro-day-barkley-gets-passing-grade-but-others-steal-the-show

SS Laser
03-28-2013, 12:26 AM
All I know is Woods has some NICE hands from the couple mins on ESPN I watched. He went up and caught it one handed on what I would call a high throw.

Jooser
03-28-2013, 06:04 AM
Barkley’s imperfect Pro Day may not have been good enough

Posted by Mike Florio on March 27, 2013, 6:48 PM EDT
http://nbcprofootballtalk.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/350x-148.jpg?w=250
AP
With USC quarterback Matt Barkley (http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/7421/matt-barkley) not throwing at the Scouting Combine due to a shoulder injur suffered in November, his entire allotment of eggs landed in his Pro Day basket.

The good news is that he may be able to make an omelet.

Barkley completed 56 of 62 passes against a defense consisting of Manti Te’o (http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/8442/manti-teo)’s late girlfriend and 10 of her family members. PerUSA Today, two were considered to be drops (http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2013/03/27/matt-barkley-pro-day-usc/2026329/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter). The others, then, represented misfires by a quarterback who was playing catch with his college teammates.

From what I saw of the workout, several of the completions came in high, with the receiver have to extend his arms — and in turn to expose his midsection to a big hit from one of the Kukua clan. On at least two of the deep routes, the receiver had to slow down and wait for the ball.

“I thought it was a good day,” Barkley said, via USA Today. “You always want to be perfect, especially on a day like this.”
Barkley wasn’t perfect. And that may not be good enough to put him into the top 10.

RuthlessBurgher
03-28-2013, 12:22 PM
Cosell sees Barkley as a fourth-round talent
Posted by Mike Florio on March 28, 2013, 10:05 AM EDT

So much for that post-Pro Day lift.

A day after USC quarterback Matt Barkley completed 56 of 62 passes against the Kukua defense, the buzz isn’t entirely positive. Greg Cosell of NFL Films characterized Barkley as a fourth-round talent on The Dan Patrick Show.

“In the NFL, you’ve got to be able to make throws,” Cosell said. “Often in difficult situations against very challenging defenses.”

Cosell said that Barkley has an average arm at best, and that he’s not particularly athletic in and around the pocket. While Cosell acknowledged that Barkley could still be a first-round pick, Cosell said, “I think there are too many limitations.”

But what about the fact (as Dan mentioned during the segment and as Ross Tucker said on last night’s edition of Pro Football Talk) that Barkley was viewed as a consensus top-five or top-10 talent if he had come out in 2012?

“Consensus by whom?” Cosell said. “That was essentially media talk. We don’t know because how NFL teams would have evaluated him.”

All it takes is one team to evaluate Barkley as a first-round pick to make him a first-round pick. Perhaps more accurately, all it takes is one owner to insist on taking Barkley in the first round to make him a first-round pick.

We’ll find out in four weeks whether any team or owner feels that way about the next possibly not-so-great USC quarterback.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/28/cosell-sees-barkley-as-a-fourth-round-talent/

BigRob
03-28-2013, 12:39 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/28/cosell-sees-barkley-as-a-fourth-round-talent/

Give me Cosell's analysis all day every day over most other draft guru's.

steelz09
03-28-2013, 12:44 PM
I would take Barkley over Geno Smith. Geno will get WAAYY overdrafted.

Teams need a franchise QB to win a SB so teams, at the expense of potential overdrafting will draft both of these guys with the hope that they turn into their franchise QB. I am willing to bet Barkley is picked before the Steelers pick essentially causing a domino effect for all players still undrafted which is a good thing for us.

SteelerOfDeVille
03-28-2013, 01:13 PM
All I know is Woods has some NICE hands from the couple mins on ESPN I watched. He went up and caught it one handed on what I would call a high throw.

THAT would be one of my short-list picks for early in the draft...

SteelerOfDeVille
03-28-2013, 01:33 PM
But you are forgetting the most important factor here, Matt Barkley hasnt been able to work out or show up-close his ability to scouts and NFL personal. If he was healthy a month ago at the combine you would have seen him in many mock drafts as a first round talent.

For a player that had a "down" year Matt Barkley still threw 36 TD's, over 3200 yards, and completed 63.6% of his passes. Think about that. For a team that had an injured offensive line and had a horrible defense and had to play from behind in most of their games, that says a lot more to me.

As Mayock has already said, I didn't disagree - i said somebody will take him way early... I just think that's a mistake. Mayock is a "drills" guy - which is why he moved Cutler so high in the draft...

IMO, arm strength is less significant than these guys make it out to be... sufficient is sufficient. Once you cross that line, having stronger arm doesn't make you a better QB... Intelligence is a bigger factor differentiates QB... and not IQ, but, football intelligence... Throw in toughness and a pure desire to win... Leaf vs Manning to get the purest example... but, look at guys like Brees, Brady... those 3 are arugably the 3 best QBs in the NFL today, all have intelligence, toughness, "sufficient arms" and just a pure desire to win...

If I were gonna take a QB, pro day wouldn't sway me much... just saying... :-)

feltdizz
03-28-2013, 01:38 PM
I would take Barkley over Geno Smith. Geno will get WAAYY overdrafted.

Teams need a franchise QB to win a SB so teams, at the expense of potential overdrafting will draft both of these guys with the hope that they turn into their franchise QB. I am willing to bet Barkley is picked before the Steelers pick essentially causing a domino effect for all players still undrafted which is a good thing for us.

So would I if I had to... but thank goodness we don't have to because I think both are soft mentally. Geno doesn't seem like he has the fortitude to overcome when things aren't going his way.

hawaiiansteel
03-28-2013, 01:38 PM
If I were gonna take a QB, pro day wouldn't sway me much... just saying... :-)

I agree with you.

Jamarcus Russell had one of the greatest pro days ever, and we all know how his career turned out.

feltdizz
03-28-2013, 01:40 PM
We’ll find out in four weeks whether any team or owner feels that way about the next possibly not-so-great USC quarterback.

Damn that's cold... pretty unprofessional if you ask me.

feltdizz
03-28-2013, 01:41 PM
I agree with you.

Jamarcus Russell had one of the greatest pro days ever, and we all know how his career turned out.

dude had all the tools but he was lazy, addicted to syrup and couldn't formulate a sentence...

hawaiiansteel
03-28-2013, 01:59 PM
dude had all the tools but he was lazy, addicted to syrup and couldn't formulate a sentence...

that's right, I forgot about that.

what was the name of that syrup that he liked to drink?

feltdizz
03-28-2013, 02:58 PM
that's right, I forgot about that.

what was the name of that syrup that he liked to drink?

syzurp.. aka purple drank

prescription cough syrup with codeine and a mixer beverage such Mountain Dew, Kool-Aid or fruit punch.


Side effects include hallucination, seizures, drowsiness... and EXTREME constipation.

hawaiiansteel
03-28-2013, 04:45 PM
syzurp.. aka purple drank

prescription cough syrup with codeine and a mixer beverage such Mountain Dew, Kool-Aid or fruit punch.

Side effects include hallucination, seizures, drowsiness... and EXTREME constipation.





thanks felt, you would think when you signed a contract for the kind of $ Jamarcus did that you could find some better drugs than "purple drank"...

hawaiiansteel
03-28-2013, 04:46 PM
» Cosell's lukewarm view on Matt Barkley is no state secret. After grading the USC quarterback as a fourth-round talent (and he's not alone on that front), Cosell wrote Thursday on Yahoo! Sports that Barkley "will struggle to be anything more than a mid-level starter in the NFL. He just does not have enough arm. His ball tended to hang and lose energy on the back end, even on 18-25 yard throws ... Overall, he's an average athlete without the kind of lower body explosiveness that you'd like to see, the kind that defines a quarterback like Drew Brees."

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000154928/article/nfl-draft-buzz-49ers-dolphins-looking-to-trade-up

feltdizz
04-05-2013, 02:34 PM
well... here is another article with a few NFL scouts throwing dirt on that awesome arm strength of Barkley's.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--2013-qb-draft-class-may-be-nfl-s-most-lowly-regarded-in-more-than-a-decade-060530895.html

excerpt from an AFC scout.

Meanwhile, Barkley has been taken to task for lack of arm strength on key throws.

"The kid has all the intangibles you could imagine," one of the AFC executives said. "You couldn't ask for a better kid or a harder worker. But he just doesn't have the arm on the deep stuff."


More specifically, scouts have said that Barkley doesn't have the ability to fire passes to tight spots on the field, relying mostly on timing to land throws. With that in mind, Barkley sounds like Pennington.


"That's the comparison I would make," the AFC executive said. "That's what people said about Pennington way back then."

Dee Dub
04-05-2013, 02:41 PM
well... here is another article with a few NFL scouts throwing dirt on that awesome arm strength of Barkley's.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--2013-qb-draft-class-may-be-nfl-s-most-lowly-regarded-in-more-than-a-decade-060530895.html

excerpt from an AFC scout.

Meanwhile, Barkley has been taken to task for lack of arm strength on key throws.

"The kid has all the intangibles you could imagine," one of the AFC executives said. "You couldn't ask for a better kid or a harder worker. But he just doesn't have the arm on the deep stuff."


More specifically, scouts have said that Barkley doesn't have the ability to fire passes to tight spots on the field, relying mostly on timing to land throws. With that in mind, Barkley sounds like Pennington.


"That's the comparison I would make," the AFC executive said. "That's what people said about Pennington way back then."

How about Drew Brees? How's his arm strength? Joe Montana? Steve Young? Fran Tarkenton? Elite arm strength is highly over-rated. What is more important is the system a QB is in. Put Barkley in the right system like Brees, where the ball comes out quickly, and he will thrive.

feltdizz
04-05-2013, 03:03 PM
How about Drew Brees? How's his arm strength? Joe Montana? Steve Young? Fran Tarkenton? Elite arm strength is highly over-rated. What is more important is the system a QB is in. Put Barkley in the right system like Brees, where the ball comes out quickly, and he will thrive.

On this I agree... I said long ago in this thread he needs to be in a West Coast system...

he's gonna suck tho... sorry. lol

Captain Lemming
04-05-2013, 03:55 PM
How about Drew Brees? How's his arm strength? Joe Montana? Steve Young? Fran Tarkenton? Elite arm strength is highly over-rated. What is more important is the system a QB is in. Put Barkley in the right system like Brees, where the ball comes out quickly, and he will thrive.

You said:
"He is going to show he has a lot more arm strength than many had thought."

Seems to me that this DID NOT happen.

You can argue the relative importance of arm strength, but that was not your original contention.

We knew he was accurate, his arm is nothing special. Only "surprise" I gather is that he is faster than we thought.

I hope some team is stupid enough to draft him early as you contend, but I do not see any basis to change ones opinion based on his pro day.

feltdizz
04-05-2013, 04:11 PM
He also said his pro day was going to change EVERYTHING!!! LOL

Dee Dub
04-05-2013, 09:51 PM
You said:
"He is going to show he has a lot more arm strength than many had thought."

Seems to me that this DID NOT happen.

You can argue the relative importance of arm strength, but that was not your original contention.

We knew he was accurate, his arm is nothing special. Only "surprise" I gather is that he is faster than we thought.

I hope some team is stupid enough to draft him early as you contend, but I do not see any basis to change ones opinion based on his pro day.

Personally from what I saw and heard from the likes f Mayock while the pro day was going on was that he did show that he had above average arm strength. Elite? No but above average. He deliberately threw into the wind and of all his passes he had two that fluttered yet still make it to his receiver. And on the deep out his arm strength was solid.

Some in the media have been trying to make it out that he has below average arm strength. That is far from the case.

Dee Dub
04-05-2013, 09:52 PM
He also said his pro day was going to change EVERYTHING!!! LOL

That really has yet to be determined. If he gets drafted in the top 15 or top 10 then his pro day did exactly. that. ;)