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View Full Version : The Pittsburgh Steelers will not lose one player...



Dee Dub
02-07-2013, 06:57 PM
...that they want to keep!!! Would some of you guys chill out?! You act as if you just became Steeler fans. :HeadBanger I know it's the off-season but give it a break would ya?!

Shawn
02-07-2013, 07:50 PM
Agreed. Based on history the Steelers don't lose young talent unless they are a locker room cancer. That's why I believe Lewis will be our DB for many seasons to come.

RuthlessBurgher
02-07-2013, 08:07 PM
I agree. Lewis should be our primary target, even if we have to sacrifice a veteran Steeler mainstay to make it happen. I highly doubt that the team will just let a talented young guy just walk out the door like that.

BigRob
02-07-2013, 08:27 PM
...that they want to keep!!! Would some of you guys chill out?! You act as if you just became Steeler fans. :HeadBanger I know it's the off-season but give it a break would ya?!

I agree with you for the most part. However, that doesn't mean they won't fail in their plan.

There a quite a few teams that need a decent CB that have huge amounts of cap space in our division. Cleveland and Cincinatti. I could see Cinci going after Lewis.

If Lewis does leave, it may not because the Steelers intended it to happen that way. Of course they have contingencies in place, but it doesn't make them perfect at everything they do.

BradshawsHairdresser
02-07-2013, 10:52 PM
I don't agree. I think they'll lose at least a couple of players that they'd really like to keep. Whether or not they admit it is another matter.

The upcoming draft will be really important, as will whatever lower-level free agent signings they can manage.

AkronSteel
02-07-2013, 11:21 PM
The Steelers are currently about 14.2 million over the cap as we sit right now. I don't see James Harrison returning which will save the team 5.1 million. If Willie Colon is cut it will save the team 1.2 million. That's 6.3 million into that cap. The team will probably also rework deals for Ben, Antonio, Lamarr, and LT which will save anywhere between 18-22 million. That gives the team approximately 10 million to spend. If a contract is structured right for Keenan the team should be able to resign him and also possibly Legursky and Warren, while also being able to bring in a free agent TE to hold the position until Heath is healthy. I would say a fair contract for Lewis should be somewhere between 6-8 annually for 5 seasons. Khan is a master at getting this team in a position to work within the cap space. They will lose players like Foster and Starks which I'm sure they would rather not but it will just not work within the confines of the cap. Losing players like Wallace, Mendenhall, Hampton was all anticipated by the team. I agree for the most part that the team will not lose most players they want to keep but they will lose some. Saying all that they will be fine. This team is built through the draft and I would expect an OLB, WR, RB, and S to be addressed early in April.

pittpete
02-08-2013, 12:38 AM
Lewis for the next 5 years or Troy for the next 2?
Who would you rather have?

Oviedo
02-08-2013, 09:04 AM
I agree. Lewis should be our primary target, even if we have to sacrifice a veteran Steeler mainstay to make it happen. I highly doubt that the team will just let a talented young guy just walk out the door like that.


Like Mike Wallace?

Oviedo
02-08-2013, 09:06 AM
Lewis for the next 5 years or Troy for the next 2?
Who would you rather have?


Lewis. No confidence Troy plays 32 games over two full seasons.

BradshawsHairdresser
02-08-2013, 09:45 AM
Lewis. No confidence Troy plays 32 games over two full seasons.

$$$$$
I love Troy and all that he's done for this team, but at this point, the priority has got to be signing Lewis.
Maybe Troy will decide he's made enough money and will come back for a cut-rate deal...otherwise, I think he's gone, and probably should be. Same with James Harrison. It will hurt to lose him this coming season, but unless he comes back for cheap, I don't see him playing with the Steelers in 2013.

phillyesq
02-08-2013, 09:48 AM
I agree. Lewis should be our primary target, even if we have to sacrifice a veteran Steeler mainstay to make it happen. I highly doubt that the team will just let a talented young guy just walk out the door like that.

I agree. I think Lewis stays unless somebody offers him an obscene contract.

Shawn
02-08-2013, 01:15 PM
Like Mike Wallace?

When a player half azzes a season after turning down 10 million a year, it's fair to say the Steelers won't be so eager to sign that young talent.

BigRob
02-08-2013, 02:07 PM
The Steelers are currently about 14.2 million over the cap as we sit right now. I don't see James Harrison returning which will save the team 5.1 million. If Willie Colon is cut it will save the team 1.2 million. That's 6.3 million into that cap. The team will probably also rework deals for Ben, Antonio, Lamarr, and LT which will save anywhere between 18-22 million. That gives the team approximately 10 million to spend. If a contract is structured right for Keenan the team should be able to resign him and also possibly Legursky and Warren, while also being able to bring in a free agent TE to hold the position until Heath is healthy. I would say a fair contract for Lewis should be somewhere between 6-8 annually for 5 seasons. Khan is a master at getting this team in a position to work within the cap space. They will lose players like Foster and Starks which I'm sure they would rather not but it will just not work within the confines of the cap. Losing players like Wallace, Mendenhall, Hampton was all anticipated by the team. I agree for the most part that the team will not lose most players they want to keep but they will lose some. Saying all that they will be fine. This team is built through the draft and I would expect an OLB, WR, RB, and S to be addressed early in April.

It may have already been addressed, but you are not factoring in for the rookies that will be drafted. You have to have about 3-5 million in room on your cap to do this.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
02-08-2013, 02:21 PM
I believe past is past. The Steelers will lose people they wanted back. They may even cut a few they would have liked back for 2013. They just lose the "insurance" policy and put their faith in the young guys behind them. Really though...It isn't a big deal. It has to happen now or sometime soon.

Slapstick
02-08-2013, 02:34 PM
I believe past is past. The Steelers will lose people they wanted back. They may even cut a few they would have liked back for 2013.

I disagree...

I think the OP's point is that there is a difference between "wanting" a player back and a player they "would like to have"...

The latter is a luxury...the former is a necessity...

If the Steelers decide that they really want a player, they will work it out...

BigRob
02-08-2013, 02:45 PM
I disagree...

If the Steelers decide that they really want a player, they will work it out...

This can be a mistake as well. We shouldn't act like the Steelers are perfect because we are fans.

But neither should we act like the Steelers are dolts because we are fans.

BradshawsHairdresser
02-08-2013, 02:46 PM
I disagree...

I think the OP's point is that there is a difference between "wanting" a player back and a player they "would like to have"...

The latter is a luxury...the former is a necessity...

If the Steelers decide that they really want a player, they will work it out...

With that kind of rationale, couldn't the same be said of just about every team?

There are some players that the Steelers want to keep that they will not be able to keep because of salary cap constraints. But they're not going to sit there crying in their beer because they can't get it done...You're not going to hear them saying, "Dang, we couldn't get the guy we wanted, the sky is falling." Instead, they'll get to work and will find other, more affordable players to fill the roster slots. Hopefully, that will yield positive results on the field.

papillon
02-08-2013, 04:02 PM
With that kind of rationale, couldn't the same be said of just about every team?

There are some players that the Steelers want to keep that they will not be able to keep because of salary cap constraints. But they're not going to sit there crying in their beer because they can't get it done...You're not going to hear them saying, "Dang, we couldn't get the guy we wanted, the sky is falling." Instead, they'll get to work and will find other, more affordable players to fill the roster slots. Hopefully, that will yield positive results on the field.

I agree with BHD here we go...

Mike Wallace or drafted rookie
Rashard Mendenhall or Dwyer, Redmond or rookie
James Harrison or Jason Worilds
Troy Polamalu or Robert Golden
Ike Taylor or Lewis (this is probably the only one where the existing option is okay - Lewis)
Kiesel or Heyward/Hood (Kiesel outplayed them both last year)

The Steelers will be releaseing/cutting players because of their salary and the cap situation. I have to believe they want to keep these guys, but the cap situation is going to prevent it. They may try to find a way to fit Troy into the mis, but it isn't going to be easy.

Pappy

BigRob
02-08-2013, 04:19 PM
With that kind of rationale, couldn't the same be said of just about every team?

Yes, and it should be said about every team. Some teams endear themselves to more confidence and others do not.

lloydroid
02-08-2013, 04:28 PM
I don't agree. I think they'll lose at least a couple of players that they'd really like to keep. Whether or not they admit it is another matter.

The upcoming draft will be really important, as will whatever lower-level free agent signings they can manage.

I agree. I don't understand the "We won't lose one player we want" line of thinking. They most certainly will. Shoot, Cinci HAS to add a bunch of $ to their play payroll as they are BELOW the league minimum by quite a bit. They will gladly sign Lewis.

RuthlessBurgher
02-08-2013, 05:24 PM
Mike Wallace or drafted rookie

Mike was our #1 WR. A rookie isn't going to be able to replace that production (even in a down year by his standards). A drafted rookie would be our #4 WR on our depth chart behind Brown, Sanders, and Cotchery.

Rashard Mendenhall or Dwyer, Redmond or rookie

Dwyer and Redman can be retained for 1 more season with an RFA tender. However, a rookie RB should be drafted, because I doubt that either Dwyer or Redman will be with the team after 2013.

James Harrison or Jason Worilds

When healthy, Harrison is obviously the better player, but he's rarely been healthy and isn't getting any younger. Because we are so cap-strapped, there may be no choice but to keep the OLB with the 6-figure cap number over the OLB with the 8-figure cap number.

Troy Polamalu or Robert Golden

Is this really a question? Golden is an 2nd year UDFA special teams player, not a starting safety. If we had the equivalent of a Worilds as a backup safety, then Troy might be worried about being a cap casualty. But with Will Allen and Ryan Mundy free agents, and only Golden and Cromartie-Smith behind Troy and Clark, this is the most dire position on our team depth-wise (we may draft two safeties). You don't cut Hall-of-Fame caliber starters at positions where your backup situation is a huge liability. You just don't.

Ike Taylor or Lewis (this is probably the only one where the existing option is okay - Lewis)

I'd love to have both of them back, but if it takes sacrificing Taylor in order to retain Lewis, it's a move you have to make. You don't let go of players entering their prime in order to keep guys who are well past their prime. You just don't. Without Ike, I'm not super concerned about Lewis and Allen starting (although I am concerned about the depth behind them).

Kiesel or Heyward/Hood (Kiesel outplayed them both last year)

Keisel's a good guy to have in our DL rotation (and I think we'd only save a few million if we cut him). I'd prefer to keep him for one more year, but if we need those precious cap dollars elsewhere, then there are worse things in the world than having a couple of former 1st round picks starting at DE in our 3-4.

supersteeler
02-08-2013, 05:38 PM
I would retain Keisel, foote, and Troy as you mentioned who would be trusted to play safety.
As for running back, I believe a rookie could surplant either Redman or Dwyer, they just are average and we need more than average.
The Browns selected Richardson last season and he started day one so yes a back can be a starter as a rookie.

I have my sights on Le'veon Bell RB, he is strong not very fast, but has quickness can run either outside or between the tackles. He breaks a lot of tackles too and makes defenders miss, just ask T'eo when they played against each other.

lloydroid
02-08-2013, 07:49 PM
With that kind of rationale, couldn't the same be said of just about every team?

There are some players that the Steelers want to keep that they will not be able to keep because of salary cap constraints. But they're not going to sit there crying in their beer because they can't get it done...You're not going to hear them saying, "Dang, we couldn't get the guy we wanted, the sky is falling." Instead, they'll get to work and will find other, more affordable players to fill the roster slots. Hopefully, that will yield positive results on the field.

I really dislike when they go through the phase of overpaying players in their 30s and then come to regret it. It seems that once they get to the point of contending, they kind of feel like they have no choice but to keep the team together and end up over-paying some players and not getting a return on their investment. It's like they are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Last time they screwed up overpaying Gildong, Kirkland, Chad Scott, Kordell and a few others. This time they aren't getting a return on the $ going to Woodley, Hampton, Troy, Brown (yet) and Colon (per usual). The more they can stick with the __PREVIOUS__ Philly model of almost never paying big $ to players in their 30s, the better. That is how Philly used to stay good every year, and to a degree, Pgh as well. But like Colbert said, when you are going to Super Bowls and/or winning 12 games, you don't want to change much. God, they better draft well this April.

feltdizz
02-08-2013, 07:52 PM
We wont be able to keep all the players we want... its not possible.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
02-08-2013, 07:57 PM
I disagree...

I think the OP's point is that there is a difference between "wanting" a player back and a player they "would like to have"...

The latter is a luxury...the former is a necessity...

If the Steelers decide that they really want a player, they will work it out...

You can disagree slap...But the reality of the situation is obvious. They want to keep Foster, Wallace, and Lewis. They may only have a shot at Lewis and he may price himself out. They want Starks And Foote back but at min and backup depth. They want Harrison and any other cap casualty they discard but keeping them will injure the youth core of this team long term and is financially impossible at their contract numbers. If you think the Steelers just simply want to discard or let go of their "investments" before they are completely exhausted...you are mistaken. 2013 is about the ugly business come the start of the new league year and when the dust clears...It will be about the football. They are the Steelers...They will get through it. They made their bed....

papillon
02-08-2013, 09:29 PM
Mike Wallace or drafted rookie

Mike was our #1 WR. A rookie isn't going to be able to replace that production (even in a down year by his standards). A drafted rookie would be our #4 WR on our depth chart behind Brown, Sanders, and Cotchery.

Rashard Mendenhall or Dwyer, Redmond or rookie

Dwyer and Redman can be retained for 1 more season with an RFA tender. However, a rookie RB should be drafted, because I doubt that either Dwyer or Redman will be with the team after 2013.

James Harrison or Jason Worilds

When healthy, Harrison is obviously the better player, but he's rarely been healthy and isn't getting any younger. Because we are so cap-strapped, there may be no choice but to keep the OLB with the 6-figure cap number over the OLB with the 8-figure cap number.

Troy Polamalu or Robert Golden

Is this really a question? Golden is an 2nd year UDFA special teams player, not a starting safety. If we had the equivalent of a Worilds as a backup safety, then Troy might be worried about being a cap casualty. But with Will Allen and Ryan Mundy free agents, and only Golden and Cromartie-Smith behind Troy and Clark, this is the most dire position on our team depth-wise (we may draft two safeties). You don't cut Hall-of-Fame caliber starters at positions where your backup situation is a huge liability. You just don't.

Ike Taylor or Lewis (this is probably the only one where the existing option is okay - Lewis)

I'd love to have both of them back, but if it takes sacrificing Taylor in order to retain Lewis, it's a move you have to make. You don't let go of players entering their prime in order to keep guys who are well past their prime. You just don't. Without Ike, I'm not super concerned about Lewis and Allen starting (although I am concerned about the depth behind them).

Kiesel or Heyward/Hood (Kiesel outplayed them both last year)

Keisel's a good guy to have in our DL rotation (and I think we'd only save a few million if we cut him). I'd prefer to keep him for one more year, but if we need those precious cap dollars elsewhere, then there are worse things in the world than having a couple of former 1st round picks starting at DE in our 3-4.

You kind of proved my point that the Steelers want to keep the veterans because they are still head and shoulders better than the recent crops of draftees. Unfortunately, what they want and what they are going to be able to do are two entirely different things and the Steelers are going to suffer for it, IMO. Next year will be another year of retooling and rebuilding without some longtime veterans. The Steelers were unable to fill the leadership void left by Smith and Ward this year and they're in all likelihood losing more leadership this year.

I'm hoping that Ben really takes a step forward and starts to make this team march a bit to his beat, even more so than he's done in recent years. He's really going to be the veteran on this team come August.

Pappy

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
02-08-2013, 09:32 PM
I agree with BHD here we go...

Mike Wallace or drafted rookie
Rashard Mendenhall or Dwyer, Redmond or rookie
James Harrison or Jason Worilds
Troy Polamalu or Robert Golden
Ike Taylor or Lewis (this is probably the only one where the existing option is okay - Lewis)
Kiesel or Heyward/Hood (Kiesel outplayed them both last year)

The Steelers will be releaseing/cutting players because of their salary and the cap situation. I have to believe they want to keep these guys, but the cap situation is going to prevent it. They may try to find a way to fit Troy into the mis, but it isn't going to be easy.

Pappy

Wallace and Mendenhall are players, who by their off-field actions, are not desired back.

Honestly, a player who refused to sign his tender and then sat out of camp before returning. He then went out and played with lacklustre effort. This after coming off of a horrible second half of 2011.

Mendenhall came off of ACL surgery, had one decent game, and showed nothing else all year. When he was told that he would not dress for one game then he stayed home.

Neither is a player who the FO will be sad to see leave, nor will the consider it a failure on their part if they do.

papillon
02-08-2013, 09:41 PM
Wallace and Mendenhall are players, who by their off-field actions, are not desired back.

Honestly, a player who refused to sign his tender and then sat out of camp before returning. He then went out and played with lacklustre effort. This after coming off of a horrible second half of 2011.

Mendenhall came off of ACL surgery, had one decent game, and showed nothing else all year. When he was told that he would not dress for one game then he stayed home.

Neither is a player who the FO will be sad to see leave, nor will the consider it a failure on their part if they do.

Probably true, but they're still the best players the Steelers have at their positions. They wanted Wallace, but he wanted more than 10 million, but they wanted him. Shortly after the season I thought someone in the FO was saying that they're going to work with Mendenhall to get a contract done.

I think the Steelers want them, they're off field actions make them easy to say goodbye to, but at one point the Steelers wanted them, because, they're the best players at their position.

Pappy