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View Full Version : If the Steelers draft Warmack then.....



steelz09
01-23-2013, 07:00 PM
Which player do we NOT resign when the time comes for their second contract?

DeCastro
Pouncey
Warmack

If DeCastro and Warmack perform like we expect, I guarantee we won't be able to keep all three especially considering their 2nd contracts will be huge and we can't allocate all that money to just the o-line (2 being G)

Additionally, how can you wrap up all that money in two guards and a center without including a high-priced position like T (especially LT).

NW Steeler
01-23-2013, 07:16 PM
Another reason why we wont draft him.

BigRob
01-23-2013, 07:31 PM
Another reason why we wont draft him.

That won't stop them from drafting him if he is the BPA. O-line is still a position of need. Destro still has years on his contract. Pouncey will be taken care of first.

supersteeler
01-23-2013, 07:40 PM
I wonder how the 49ers are doing it. They have 3 PRO Bowlers on their offensive line.
We need a dominate interior O-line and then you will see our run game explode, if they have to worry about signings down the road then just hand the ball off to Dwyer hoping Beachum can open a lane for him or whoever is back there.

Sugar
01-23-2013, 08:03 PM
I know this is a "what if?" scenario, but I'm fairly comfortable with the fact that he won't be there at #10, let alone #17.

Dee Dub
01-23-2013, 08:12 PM
I know this is a "what if?" scenario, but I'm fairly comfortable with the fact that he won't be there at #10, let alone #17.

Yep...it is a pipe dream. He wont last past pick ten. I think he goes top 8. We might as well say what if, Jarvis Jones is there? Nearly the same thing.

Shoe
01-23-2013, 08:28 PM
Holy cow... Decastro just finished his rookie year, Pouncey has already made All-Pro in his career, and we're already talking about their potential ouster???

You gotta love Steeler fans.

Slapstick
01-23-2013, 09:13 PM
Seriously...unless Warmack plays OT, he will still be there at 17...

All of the stuff that's being said about Warmack was said about DeCastro...go back and read it...

I could be wrong, but history shows that I probably won't be...

Dee Dub
01-23-2013, 09:19 PM
Seriously...unless Warmack plays OT, he will still be there at 17...

All of the stuff that's being said about Warmack was said about DeCastro...go back and read it...

I could be wrong, but history shows that I probably won't be...

Dude Warmack is being graded out as a top 3 player in this entire draft. DeCastro never came close to Warmack. DeCastro is good but Warmack is on another level.

steelz09
01-23-2013, 09:21 PM
Seriously...unless Warmack plays OT, he will still be there at 17...

All of the stuff that's being said about Warmack was said about DeCastro...go back and read it...

I could be wrong, but history shows that I probably won't be...

Your right... That's why I laugh when people say "He'll be long gone by the time we pick"

Warmack won't be the pick. Allocating two first round picks to a guard position just doesn't make sense. You can't fill every o-line position with a 1st and 2nd round pick. You have to spread elite picks around the team. This time, it's defense.

ILB or S is my bet. OLB is a possibility. The ONLY offensive position I could as a round 1 pick is wide receiver.

Dee Dub
01-23-2013, 09:23 PM
Seriously...unless Warmack plays OT, he will still be there at 17...

All of the stuff that's being said about Warmack was said about DeCastro...go back and read it...

I could be wrong, but history shows that I probably won't be...

Gil Brandt is pretty good at scouting and he says...

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/0ap1000000126798/article/luke-joeckel-bjoern-werner-headline-2013-nfl-draft-prospects

steelz09
01-23-2013, 09:23 PM
I wonder how the 49ers are doing it. They have 3 PRO Bowlers on their offensive line.
We need a dominate interior O-line and then you will see our run game explode, if they have to worry about signings down the road then just hand the ball off to Dwyer hoping Beachum can open a lane for him or whoever is back there.

Dwyer is not a starting running back in this league.

supersteeler
01-23-2013, 09:33 PM
You could be right steelz09, but drafting a player like Warmack makes sense to me in that we would have the potential to dominate the interior of that line. With that our run game improves as well.
If we draft a OLB which we do need I doubt we are dominate with that unit without James Harrison no matter who we draft at OLB. We need to fill the ILB spot as well.

And just for the record, I agree with you that even if Warmack is there I doubt the Steelers would take him, its just that I would love to see him picked.

Dwyer is not a starting running back in this league.
I know that very well, we need a feature back but could use a feature LG as well.

Eddie Spaghetti
01-23-2013, 09:33 PM
what if eric fisher is sitting there? I could swallow that a lot better than another OG. I'm not sure what they have in gilbert, so it might be interesting if fisher is available at 17.

Dee Dub
01-23-2013, 09:38 PM
what if eric fisher is sitting there? I could swallow that a lot better than another OG. I'm not sure what they have in gilbert, so it might be interesting if fisher is available at 17.

Wow..Eddie you beat me to it. I am watching the tape of today's practice (Senior Bowl), and Eric Fisher is a stud. He is the guy that the Steelers may have a shot at. Great feet. Good hands. Long arms. Bonafide NFL LT.

I was just about to post about him.

Oviedo
01-23-2013, 09:39 PM
Those issues won't occur for 3-4 years. Use the dominant OL they would be in the meantime and sort that out at that time.

Eddie Spaghetti
01-23-2013, 09:46 PM
Wow..Eddie you beat me to it. I am watching the tape of today's practice (Senior Bowl), and Eric Fisher is a stud. He is the guy that the Steelers may have a shot at. Great feet. Good hands. Long arms. Bonafide NFL LT.

I was just about to post about him.

Everything I have read lately suggests his stock is rising, Dub

I think Adams can be a dominant RT and pairing him with Fisher might give us a great duo going forward. I just dont believe drafting another OG in the 1st is a wise move for this team.

Dee Dub
01-23-2013, 10:18 PM
Everything I have read lately suggests his stock is rising, Dub

I think Adams can be a dominant RT and pairing him with Fisher might give us a great duo going forward. I just dont believe drafting another OG in the 1st is a wise move for this team.

I would not have a problem if the Steelers drafted him. He looks real good. Problem is everyone is raving about him now and LT is a premium. He could move way up the board.

Shoe
01-23-2013, 11:04 PM
Dude Warmack is being graded out as a top 3 player in this entire draft. DeCastro never came close to Warmack. DeCastro is good but Warmack is on another level.

If he is a top 3 level talent playing Guard, I'd snap him up at 17 and make him a Tackle. Even if it isn't his "natural" position, one would think that he could succeed (if not thrive) at Tackle.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-23-2013, 11:25 PM
Warmack is a good football player. In a "normal" offseason I could see the Pick. If he is there as the highest rated player I still think the Steelers will be looking to get out. If they can't, they will stick to their board. Come draft time...You may all know what I'm talking about. There may be more holes on this roster than ever before in recent memory. The Steelers may not even have the option of signing a guy for vet min to fill any holes. The draft is your plugger now with the new CBA and the Steelers "reload" will be full swing.

As far as G, draft Brian Winters in the 3rd and you may have that missing piece on the OL.

Mister Pittsburgh
01-23-2013, 11:38 PM
what if eric fisher is sitting there? I could swallow that a lot better than another OG. I'm not sure what they have in gilbert, so it might be interesting if fisher is available at 17.

This. I would take OT Eric Fisher over Warmack. Start him at LT and Adams at RT. Gilbert backs up both.

papillon
01-23-2013, 11:42 PM
I wonder how the 49ers are doing it. They have 3 PRO Bowlers on their offensive line.
We need a dominate interior O-line and then you will see our run game explode, if they have to worry about signings down the road then just hand the ball off to Dwyer hoping Beachum can open a lane for him or whoever is back there.

Kaepernick is on his rookie contract, Gore is getting on in years, Crabtree is the biggest name in the WR corps and Vernon Davis might be their best offensive weapon and he's a tight end. There probably isn't a lot of money tied up in skill players, so they can afford the pro-bowl linemen.

Pappy

focosteeler
01-24-2013, 12:17 AM
Kaepernick is on his rookie contract, Gore is getting on in years, Crabtree is the biggest name in the WR corps and Vernon Davis might be their best offensive weapon and he's a tight end. There probably isn't a lot of money tied up in skill players, so they can afford the pro-bowl linemen.

Pappy

I honestly think that is how it should be done on offense. Pay for your franchise QB, 3 pro-bowl lineman and 2 other solid guys. cheap skill position guys that can get the job done. Rest of the money spent on D

Djfan
01-24-2013, 01:21 AM
I honestly think that is how it should be done on offense. Pay for your franchise QB, 3 pro-bowl lineman and 2 other solid guys. cheap skill position guys that can get the job done. Rest of the money spent on D

FWP agrees with you. That SB record run he had was a gift from a great OT!!

SS Laser
01-24-2013, 02:27 AM
This. I would take OT Eric Fisher over Warmack. Start him at LT and Adams at RT. Gilbert backs up both.

Ok I am on board here for this BPA pick of Fisher. Has Gilbert ever played guard? Could he maybe be better then Colon at OG? Why do I feel this talk of a OT to OG has happened before?:p

Also is there any chance we could trade Colon or Gilbert (if Adams is the RT for the future?) Just a crazy idea. Hate to go off topic but would any team trade for say Harrison, Troy, Woodley or Ike? If you just want to cut the money for the old or lazy dogs why not see if you can get something for them? Just another crazy thought. Hey there was a thread on trade Ben!:eek:

Slapstick
01-24-2013, 06:58 AM
Gil Brandt is pretty good at scouting and he says...

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/0ap1000000126798/article/luke-joeckel-bjoern-werner-headline-2013-nfl-draft-prospects

Gil Brandt is great at scouting...

That doesn't mean that a team will draft an OG in the top ten for the first time in 15 seasons...

Mister Pittsburgh
01-24-2013, 09:38 AM
Isn't the latest information that the Steelers will get rid of Colon and may try Beachum at LG because Todd Haley wants his linemen to be smaller, more stout, and more mobile? Is Warmack at 350lbs mobile at all? I watched Alabama a couple times this season but never keyed in on him specifically.

feltdizz
01-24-2013, 09:43 AM
we aren't drafting OL... we have more than enough young guys on the OL right now who haven't had time to develop or gel due to injuries.

steelblood
01-24-2013, 09:56 AM
When I look at O-line in this draft, I'm thinking Left Tackle. That is the most important position on the o-line, and we don't have one with Max likely gone. Adams, Beachum, and Gilbert all have struggled pass protecting on the right side so I have zero confidence they will suddenly figure it out against faster elite pass rushers on the left. I wouldn't be surprised if the Steelers see Beachum as a guard anyway. With Lane Johnson now considered a first round pick by many pundits, there is a chance that either he or (the more polished, but slightly less athletic) Eric Fisher may be available at 17. I think the Steelers should consider either player if available. Fisher is likely ready to start now and Johnson could end up developing into a pro bowler.

Warmack is a heck of a player, but I'll be fine if we don't get him. We have much more pressing needs.

Oviedo
01-24-2013, 11:58 AM
When I look at O-line in this draft, I'm thinking Left Tackle. That is the most important position on the o-line, and we don't have one with Max likely gone. Adams, Beachum, and Gilbert all have struggled pass protecting on the right side so I have zero confidence they will suddenly figure it out against faster elite pass rushers on the left. I wouldn't be surprised if the Steelers see Beachum as a guard anyway. With Lane Johnson now considered a first round pick by many pundits, there is a chance that either he or (the more polished, but slightly less athletic) Eric Fisher may be available at 17. I think the Steelers should consider either player if available. Fisher is likely ready to start now and Johnson could end up developing into a pro bowler.

Warmack is a heck of a player, but I'll be fine if we don't get him. We have much more pressing needs.

Lane Johnson, Eric Fisher or Chance Warmack would all be great Round 1 picks. If the OTs are on the board they are obviously the priority if we don't resign Starks. If we do the smart thing and resign Starks and give Adams and Gilbert time to grow into the LT position and fight for it go for Warmack.

supersteeler
01-24-2013, 12:47 PM
Lane Johnson, Eric Fisher or Chance Warmack would all be great Round 1 picks. If the OTs are on the board they are obviously the priority if we don't resign Starks. If we do the smart thing and resign Starks and give Adams and Gilbert time to grow into the LT position and fight for it go for Warmack.

I agree Ovi, fix it up front on the LOS and everything will fall into place, on the offense.

steelz09
01-24-2013, 01:05 PM
How many teams in the NFL have an o-line that consists entirely of 1st and 2nd round picks?

We will....

If Starks is not resigned and Gilbert starts at LT (which is the rumor) and we draft Warmack.

The problem?

We don't have a legit starting running back.

We have a QB that will still take to long to throw the ball and will probably get hurt in the process.

Mister Pittsburgh
01-24-2013, 01:13 PM
How many teams in the NFL have an o-line that consists entirely of 1st and 2nd round picks?

We will....

If Starks is not resigned and Gilbert starts at LT (which is the rumor) and we draft Warmack.

The problem?

We don't have a legit starting running back.

We have a QB that will still take to long to throw the ball and will probably get hurt in the process.

I have no problem with having a line consisting of first and second round picks. If we landed Fisher for LT though we would have 4 out of 5 being 1st or 2nd round picks with Beachum at LG being a 7th round pick. The STeelers have sucked at drafting and identifying guys in the trenches that can play some damn football after round 2.

steelz09
01-24-2013, 01:19 PM
I have no problem with having a line consisting of first and second round picks. If we landed Fisher for LT though we would have 4 out of 5 being 1st or 2nd round picks with Beachum at LG being a 7th round pick. The STeelers have sucked at drafting and identifying guys in the trenches that can play some damn football after round 2.

I am not saying that I disagree with that. But do you fix the underlying problem which appears to be:

1) The teaching and development of o-line and d-line
2) Talent evaluation at the o-line / d-line position. I think it has less to due with #2 and more to do with #1.

Or do you sacrifice every other position on the team because of #1 and/or #2. I'd prefer to fix the underlying problem myself instead of neglecting the rest of the team.

Mister Pittsburgh
01-24-2013, 01:27 PM
I am not saying that I disagree with that. But do you fix the underlying problem which appears to be:

1) The teaching and development of o-line and d-line
2) Talent evaluation at the o-line / d-line position. I think it has less to due with #2 and more to do with #1.

Or do you sacrifice every other position on the team because of #1 and/or #2. I'd prefer to fix the underlying problem myself instead of neglecting the rest of the team.

I would say it is mostly the players themselves. Kemoeatu was a moron. Colon is a walking injury. Foster seems fairly solid. Urbik should of remained a Steeler.

Everything I read about Kugler was that the players loved the guy and he was a great coach. Not real sure what to think about the DL because we have had Keisel-Smith-Hampton forever.....maybe Heyward and Hood will turn into solid players for us.

steelz09
01-24-2013, 01:38 PM
Tony Hills was a 4th round pick. Urbik was a 3rd round pick. I thought Hills was going to be solid but obviously, he didn't turn out. The Urbik situation is definitely a head scratcher.

The Kemo and Colon situation was a failure. They should have never been signed to long term deals.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-24-2013, 02:07 PM
If your draft & they play to their potential...Business side...You can't pay 3 1st round interior OL & 2 2nd round OTs. They will all have to be paid at the same time off their rookie deals. You will be talking 5 players who will earn in the 4-8 mil a year range. You are going to have to develop the "holes". Steelers had good luck over the past three drafts. Well..Luck has a price too. Pouncey is due. Maybe highest paid C. Gilbert to follow. A LT or RT is not cheap. Then Adams & DeCastro in the same year. LG will be open to Beachum and _____, ______, _______ . I have a hard time believing that list will contain a draft choice before the 3rd round given the Steelers sitaution.

I'm not sitting in Colberts & Rooneys meetings but I think the OL & DL are not at the Top of the list of concerns over the next several years. They have alot of high draft choices that need to see the field and they need to move out the vets in favor of them. They paid for a winner...And got 8-8. The next step is obvious.

Mister Pittsburgh
01-24-2013, 02:13 PM
If your draft & they play to their potential...Business side...You can't pay 3 1st round interior OL & 2 2nd round OTs. They will all have to be paid at the same time off their rookie deals. You will be talking 5 players who will earn in the 4-8 mil a year range. You are going to have to develop the "holes". Steelers had good luck over the past three drafts. Well..Luck has a price too. Pouncey is due. Maybe highest paid C. Gilbert to follow. A LT or RT is not cheap. Then Adams & DeCastro in the same year. LG will be open to Beachum and _____, ______, _______ . I have a hard time believing that list will contain a draft choice before the 3rd round given the Steelers sitaution.

I'm not sitting in Colberts & Rooneys meetings but I think the OL & DL are not at the Top of the list of concerns over the next several years. They have alot of high draft choices that need to see the field and they need to move out the vets in favor of them. They paid for a winner...And got 8-8. The next step is obvious.

To me, I would say the OT's and OC are the most important and you realistically should be able to draft mid round guys to play OG and have one ready and groomed every 4 years. Even RT's can be groomed. LT and OC are key. But they have drafted some absolute bums over the past few years.

Oviedo
01-24-2013, 02:33 PM
How many teams in the NFL have an o-line that consists entirely of 1st and 2nd round picks?

We will....

If Starks is not resigned and Gilbert starts at LT (which is the rumor) and we draft Warmack.

The problem?

We don't have a legit starting running back.

We have a QB that will still take to long to throw the ball and will probably get hurt in the process.

It doesn't matter where they were picked the day after the draft. What matters is the performance on the field. Right now we aren't getting that and if it means we have to add more talent then chock that up as a lesson learned and fix the problem. Don't ignore real problems or minimalize them because of who and when we drafted in the past---it is still a problems for any number of reasosn: injuries, coaching, etc.

According to that logic we shouldn't draft another defensive lineman in Round 1 or 2 for at least a few more years. That is just crazy logic to me.

Oviedo
01-24-2013, 02:37 PM
To me, I would say the OT's and OC are the most important and you realistically should be able to draft mid round guys to play OG and have one ready and groomed every 4 years. Even RT's can be groomed. LT and OC are key. But they have drafted some absolute bums over the past few years.

M.P.--a couple of years ago I was singing that song loud and clear too but I think the increased emphasis on passing over running and more passing on first down has changed that. You need better talent across the OL for pass protection against better pass rushers. Mid to late round guys rarely help now unless you get lucky.

I won't say we drafted bums because I don't think we have an adequete sample size of these guys staying healthy to say anything. But I don't think we can ignore the position just hoping all wil be well. If there is top OL talent at #17 we have to consider that for the long term and depth.

Mister Pittsburgh
01-24-2013, 02:45 PM
M.P.--a couple of years ago I was singing that song loud and clear too but I think the increased emphasis on passing over running and more passing on first down has changed that. You need better talent across the OL for pass protection against better pass rushers. Mid to late round guys rarely help now unless you get lucky.

I won't say we drafted bums because I don't think we have an adequete sample size of these guys staying healthy to say anything. But I don't think we can ignore the position just hoping all wil be well. If there is top OL talent at #17 we have to consider that for the long term and depth.

By bums I just meant the Tony Hills of the world....like these dudes...

6 196 Keith Williams G Nebraska
5 151 Chris Scott T Tennessee
7 226 A.Q. Shipley C Penn State
4 130 Tony Hills T Texas

5 156 Cameron Stephenson G Rutgers

BigRob
01-24-2013, 02:48 PM
Wow..Eddie you beat me to it. I am watching the tape of today's practice (Senior Bowl), and Eric Fisher is a stud. He is the guy that the Steelers may have a shot at. Great feet. Good hands. Long arms. Bonafide NFL LT.

I was just about to post about him.

Fishers a top ten pick. Lane Johnson would be the Tackle available at 17. I would take him as well.

Eddie Spaghetti
01-24-2013, 03:08 PM
I dont think we know that fisher is a top 10 pick. Coming from central michigan is going to push him down a little.

phillyesq
01-24-2013, 04:39 PM
Which player do we NOT resign when the time comes for their second contract?

DeCastro
Pouncey
Warmack

If DeCastro and Warmack perform like we expect, I guarantee we won't be able to keep all three especially considering their 2nd contracts will be huge and we can't allocate all that money to just the o-line (2 being G)

Additionally, how can you wrap up all that money in two guards and a center without including a high-priced position like T (especially LT).

If those guys all pan out and you have to pay the tackles, the offensive line will take up far more of the salary cap then is feasible. A more realistic approach is resigning Foster to a reasonable deal or signing a mid-level free agent or drafting a mid-round guard. At OT, I'd prefer to see Max return, but if he doesn't, the Steelers absolutely need to add depth at OT.

Oviedo
01-24-2013, 04:43 PM
If those guys all pan out and you have to pay the tackles, the offensive line will take up far more of the salary cap then is feasible. A more realistic approach is resigning Foster to a reasonable deal or signing a mid-level free agent or drafting a mid-round guard. At OT, I'd prefer to see Max return, but if he doesn't, the Steelers absolutely need to add depth at OT.

That is a good problem to have. If you have multiple good one you have trade bait or just let the one you don't want walk. You aren't forced to keep them all in the long term but we want options in the short term because we still have lots of unknowns. More and better talent is never a bad problem to have.

feltdizz
01-24-2013, 04:45 PM
You guys are killing me with this OL draft talk. Warmack won't change our OL. We have the guys on our team already it's just getting them to lose weight, get stronger and avoid the Gilbert injury bug. A rookie isn't going to come in and change this OL... same thing said about Warmack was said about DD.

BigRob
01-24-2013, 05:07 PM
I dont think we know that fisher is a top 10 pick. Coming from central michigan is going to push him down a little.

Bet on it. Fisher will be gone in the first 10 picks. Teams know they missed on Joe Staley and won't make the same mistake twice.

BigRob
01-24-2013, 05:08 PM
You guys are killing me with this OL draft talk. Warmack won't change our OL. We have the guys on our team already it's just getting them to lose weight, get stronger and avoid the Gilbert injury bug. A rookie isn't going to come in and change this OL... same thing said about Warmack was said about DD.

Different players. DD was athletic and could be a very good center. Warmack is the next guard with a combination of athletic ability, power, and will destroy everyone from day one.

All that being said....the Steelers are not taking him.

Not so sure why everyone is in love with our average players on the o-line.

Eddie Spaghetti
01-24-2013, 05:18 PM
Bet on it. Fisher will be gone in the first 10 picks. Teams know they missed on Joe Staley and won't make the same mistake twice.

hey, I'm not saying he won't, you seem to know more about the college game than I do. I'm just saying we don't know for sure he will go top 10 as you stated earlier. I bet he is gone before we pick though.

Eddie Spaghetti
01-24-2013, 05:20 PM
I also don't think we know what we have in DD. Everyone here assumes he is going to many pro-bowls, but nobody knows that for certain. In the small sample size we have, he hasn't jumped off the screen in a great way. I think he will be fine, but lets not send him to canton just yet.

steelz09
01-24-2013, 05:30 PM
It doesn't matter where they were picked the day after the draft. What matters is the performance on the field. Right now we aren't getting that and if it means we have to add more talent then chock that up as a lesson learned and fix the problem. Don't ignore real problems or minimalize them because of who and when we drafted in the past---it is still a problems for any number of reasosn: injuries, coaching, etc.

According to that logic we shouldn't draft another defensive lineman in Round 1 or 2 for at least a few more years. That is just crazy logic to me.

It's not crazy logic. It does matter where they got picked especially when you drafted a Guard and OT 1st and 2nd last year. If they think DeCastro is a bust then yea... draft Warmack.

Warmack won't be the pick. As JPN said... it doesn't make sense for the future of this team. What happens when these guys are due their 2nd (most lucrative) contracts. This brings me back to my original post... Let's say they all turn out to be good starters. You can't sign all of them. So, the team is just wasting these picks (1st and 2nd rounders) knowing that they'll only be on the team for their rookie contracts. Thats basically wasting a pick.

steelblood
01-24-2013, 05:53 PM
If your draft & they play to their potential...Business side...You can't pay 3 1st round interior OL & 2 2nd round OTs. They will all have to be paid at the same time off their rookie deals. You will be talking 5 players who will earn in the 4-8 mil a year range. You are going to have to develop the "holes". Steelers had good luck over the past three drafts. Well..Luck has a price too. Pouncey is due. Maybe highest paid C. Gilbert to follow. A LT or RT is not cheap. Then Adams & DeCastro in the same year. LG will be open to Beachum and _____, ______, _______ . I have a hard time believing that list will contain a draft choice before the 3rd round given the Steelers sitaution.

I'm not sitting in Colberts & Rooneys meetings but I think the OL & DL are not at the Top of the list of concerns over the next several years. They have alot of high draft choices that need to see the field and they need to move out the vets in favor of them. They paid for a winner...And got 8-8. The next step is obvious.

Why worry about having to pay Gilbert and Adams? First, they need to prove they deserve the money. I believe that one of them will probably pan out and be a good pro. But, both of them? That is some serious optimism at this point. Heck, it is just as likely that one of them will become injury prone or suffer a career threatening injury.

Also, if we draft a WR, pass rusher, or CB in the first and he pans out, we'll have to pay him the same sort of big bucks in 5 years time. I'm less concerned with the actual position and more concerned with getting an impact player at 17 even if he is an offensive linemen.

Finally, DeCastro's contract has an option for a fifth year so he and Adams will likely not come due at the same time.

steelz09
01-24-2013, 05:59 PM
Why worry about having to pay Gilbert and Adams? First, they need to prove they deserve the money. I believe that one of them will probably pan out and be a good pro. But, both of them? That is some serious optimism at this point. Heck, it is just as likely that one of them will become injury prone or suffer a career threatening injury.

Also, if we draft a WR, pass rusher, or CB in the first and he pans out, we'll have to pay him the same sort of big bucks in 5 years time. I'm less concerned with the actual position and more concerned with getting an impact player at 17 even if he is an offensive linemen.

Finally, DeCastro's contract has an option for a fifth year so he and Adams will likely not come due at the same time.

Exactly my point ...

#1 - They are impact players

#2 - The money won't be wrapped up in the same position

I'd rather spread out my 1st and 2nd picks and develop the entire team...not one aspect of it.

supersteeler
01-25-2013, 12:29 PM
I'll concede that the Steelers won't draft a G at least this early if any. I like Warmack but the Steelers have other plans I believe so even if he's there I don't think the Steelers would pick him.

I have a list of possible picks maybe not in order but positions we need to fill, it won't wow you but it seems reasonable to me considering the circumstances.


1. Xavier Rhodes Florida State / or another CB



2. Tyler Eifert TE ND



3. Sean Porter OLB Texas A&M



4. Le'Veon Bell RB Michigan State




5. Shawn Williams ss Georgia




6. Aaron Mellette WR Elon 6'3 - 216




7.A.J. KLEIN ILB Iowa State

papillon
01-25-2013, 12:40 PM
Chance Warmack is rated in the top 5 players (at any position) in this draft. If he falls to 1.17 the Steelers will take him and not look back, that's what they do, they draft BPA and I'm guessing that unless there are some drastic problems with the players rated ahead of Warmack they will all be gone by 1.17. You can't get enough value when you draft and Warmack would be tremendous value at 1.17, it's not like all the linemen drafted by the Steelers recently are lighting it up (regardless of reason). If he's there, he'll be a Steeler in my opinion.

I'm curious what you guys and gals would think about the following scenario. If Geno Smith (14th rated player) and/or Matt Barkley (20th rated player) are available at 1.17 do the Steelers consider either one of them? It looks like Smith will be gone, but who knows, I don't think either of these guys is in the same zip code as Luck, Griffin and Wilson as far as being ready to play in the NFL, so if one falls to 1.17 do the Steelers consider the future and groom one of them for the next three to four years? I've seen a lot of negative comments on Barkley and I think I would stay away from a USC quarterback (Palmer, Cassel, Sanchez and Leinart are enough reasons for me), but either of these guys could be a reasonably priced backup and potential replacement if you think they'll develop into an NFL caliber quarterback.

Just curious...

Pappy

Slapstick
01-25-2013, 12:48 PM
Chance Warmack is rated in the top 5 players (at any position) in this draft. If he falls to 1.17 the Steelers will take him and not look back, that's what they do, they draft BPA and I'm guessing that unless there are some drastic problems with the players rated ahead of Warmack they will all be gone by 1.17. You can't get enough value when you draft and Warmack would be tremendous value at 1.17, it's not like all the linemen drafted by the Steelers recently are lighting it up (regardless of reason). If he's there, he'll be a Steeler in my opinion.

Pappy

If Warmack is that good, I easily could see the Steelers trading back a few spots and getting more picks...if Warmack is that good, a team in the 20s will be willing to part with some picks to get him...

supersteeler
01-25-2013, 01:10 PM
I'm curious what you guys and gals would think about the following scenario. If Geno Smith (14th rated player) and/or Matt Barkley (20th rated player) are available at 1.17 do the Steelers consider either one of them? It looks like Smith will be gone, but who knows, I don't think either of these guys is in the same zip code as Luck, Griffin and Wilson as far as being ready to play in the NFL, so if one falls to 1.17 do the Steelers consider the future and groom one of them for the next three to four years? I've seen a lot of negative comments on Barkley and I think I would stay away from a USC quarterback (Palmer, Cassel, Sanchez and Leinart are enough reasons for me), but either of these guys could be a reasonably priced backup and potential replacement if you think they'll develop into an NFL caliber quarterback.

Just curious...

Pappy[/QUOTE]

Pappy, No on the QB.

I don't see any QB in this draft that could be the replacement for Ben down the road. Yeah, we could get a backup but we have so many pressing needs QB is down the list. I think next year the Steelers will look to draft a QB early maybe even in round one or move up to get one if there is a good draft for QB's.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-25-2013, 01:10 PM
Why worry about having to pay Gilbert and Adams? First, they need to prove they deserve the money. I believe that one of them will probably pan out and be a good pro. But, both of them? That is some serious optimism at this point. Heck, it is just as likely that one of them will become injury prone or suffer a career threatening injury.

Also, if we draft a WR, pass rusher, or CB in the first and he pans out, we'll have to pay him the same sort of big bucks in 5 years time. I'm less concerned with the actual position and more concerned with getting an impact player at 17 even if he is an offensive linemen.

Finally, DeCastro's contract has an option for a fifth year so he and Adams will likely not come due at the same time.

Having Negative optimism will negate talent where needed if you keep thinking like that. The Steelers injected talent on the OL & DL over the past several years early. You don't pass on a player because you are in that situation but you don't seek them out as a need until your investment matures.

The impact of drafting OL high over several years will create a log jam of cotracts. You don't draft a guy that high with the thoughts he will be a "quality" OL. Pouncey, Gilbert, Adams, and DeCastro were drafted high because of where they were at & who they thought they would become. Their bar is set high. There is no reason to believe at this point they will not ALL hit that level of play. All of them will come off their rookie deals over a three year period for the most part. The OL is not the area of concern...It is an area of youth, talent, and inexperience. You don't keep throwing logs on the fire until it starts burning hot enough for you. You have to give it time to catch.


With 4 of the 5 starters in place on the OL. 2-1st rounders & 2-2nd rounders with Avg. age of 23.

And....
If Wallace walks & Lewis is retained.
Foster, Starks, & Mendy gone.
Harrison & Colon are cut.
Hampton & Foote not brought back.
Miller & Spence on PUP.

You biggest impact player in the 1st for 2013 is a LG?

Interesting conclusion.

Dee Dub
01-25-2013, 01:14 PM
I'll concede that the Steelers won't draft a G at least this early if any. I like Warmack but the Steelers have other plans I believe so even if he's there I don't think the Steelers would pick him.

I have a list of possible picks maybe not in order but positions we need to fill, it won't wow you but it seems reasonable to me considering the circumstances.


1. Xavier Rhodes Florida State / or another CB



2. Tyler Eifert TE ND



3. Sean Porter OLB Texas A&M



4. Le'Veon Bell RB Michigan State




5. Shawn Williams ss Georgia




6. Aaron Mellette WR Elon 6'3 - 216




7.A.J. KLEIN ILB Iowa State

This is a good list. Xavier Rhodes is not in the top 5 corners in this draft, however, he is fit for the Steeler 3-4. Big, strong, physical, and long in length. He isnt great at man to man but he isnt horrible either. Shawn Williams is a prototypical SS thumper. He isnt going to win any coverage contests but at the LOS and inside the box he is going to bring it. I would prefer Zach Ertz over Eifert simply because he brings a dimension that Heath Miller does not have. He can stretch a defense. Take the top off the center of the field. A.J. Klein is a tackling machine. He is a good fit at ILB in a 3-4.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-25-2013, 01:54 PM
Chance Warmack is rated in the top 5 players (at any position) in this draft. If he falls to 1.17 the Steelers will take him and not look back, that's what they do, they draft BPA and I'm guessing that unless there are some drastic problems with the players rated ahead of Warmack they will all be gone by 1.17. You can't get enough value when you draft and Warmack would be tremendous value at 1.17, it's not like all the linemen drafted by the Steelers recently are lighting it up (regardless of reason). If he's there, he'll be a Steeler in my opinion.

I'm curious what you guys and gals would think about the following scenario. If Geno Smith (14th rated player) and/or Matt Barkley (20th rated player) are available at 1.17 do the Steelers consider either one of them? It looks like Smith will be gone, but who knows, I don't think either of these guys is in the same zip code as Luck, Griffin and Wilson as far as being ready to play in the NFL, so if one falls to 1.17 do the Steelers consider the future and groom one of them for the next three to four years? I've seen a lot of negative comments on Barkley and I think I would stay away from a USC quarterback (Palmer, Cassel, Sanchez and Leinart are enough reasons for me), but either of these guys could be a reasonably priced backup and potential replacement if you think they'll develop into an NFL caliber quarterback.

Just curious...

Pappy

If Warmack falls to #17 then there is something wrong with him. If any of Joekel, Milliner, Fisher, Werner, Moore, Jones, Lotulelei, Johnson, or Rhodes are there...I'm picking one of them before Warmack. If they are all gone, I'm hoping my phone rings. If they can't trade back...He would have to be the highest rated player on my board & It can't be close. There could be the Top at WR, S, & ILB on the baord too. We will see where they start grading out. There could be teams looking to jump up for a 4-3 DE or ILB or back in for a QB. That card will be walked to the podium in no hurry if they have to stick to their board & take a Warmack. I'm sure they will listen to trades at that point.


No to QB at #17. I don't like ANY of the 1st round QBs as true "franchise" guys. I don't think there is one single QB at the top who wouldn't be pushed out of the 1st if you add previous years 1st rounders. When the ceiling on guys like Bray, Jones, or Manuel are the same as the first rounders...Not a good year to be looking for a franchise QB.

BigRob
01-25-2013, 02:16 PM
If Warmack falls to #17 then there is something wrong with him. If any of Joekel, Milliner, Fisher, Werner, Moore, Jones, Lotulelei, Johnson, or Rhodes are there...I'm picking one of them before Warmack.

Johnson and Rhodes are the ones I see being available. Possibly Milliner. The rest will be gone. I would consider trading back 5 or 6 picks and taking Deandre Hopkins or Cordarelle Patterson at WR.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-25-2013, 03:07 PM
Johnson and Rhodes are the ones I see being available. Possibly Milliner. The rest will be gone. I would consider trading back 5 or 6 picks and taking Deandre Hopkins or Cordarelle Patterson at WR.

I think that is a very realistic possibility. Luxury versus need is out the window this year. If they are sitting there with an OT, CB, & OG graded there and no OLB...The best thing to do may be trading back.

Dee Dub
01-25-2013, 03:10 PM
Chance Warmack is rated in the top 5 players (at any position) in this draft. If he falls to 1.17 the Steelers will take him and not look back, that's what they do, they draft BPA and I'm guessing that unless there are some drastic problems with the players rated ahead of Warmack they will all be gone by 1.17. You can't get enough value when you draft and Warmack would be tremendous value at 1.17, it's not like all the linemen drafted by the Steelers recently are lighting it up (regardless of reason). If he's there, he'll be a Steeler in my opinion.

Totally agree with this Pap! This is what the Steelers do.



I'm curious what you guys and gals would think about the following scenario. If Geno Smith (14th rated player) and/or Matt Barkley (20th rated player) are available at 1.17 do the Steelers consider either one of them? It looks like Smith will be gone, but who knows, I don't think either of these guys is in the same zip code as Luck, Griffin and Wilson as far as being ready to play in the NFL, so if one falls to 1.17 do the Steelers consider the future and groom one of them for the next three to four years? I've seen a lot of negative comments on Barkley and I think I would stay away from a USC quarterback (Palmer, Cassel, Sanchez and Leinart are enough reasons for me), but either of these guys could be a reasonably priced backup and potential replacement if you think they'll develop into an NFL caliber quarterback.

Just curious...

Pappy

Only if this happens....;)

http://www.planetsteelers.com/forums/showthread.php/39862-Ben-to-Arizona-Cardinals-trade-would-you-do-this