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View Full Version : It turns out, Te'o ain't all that



lloydroid
01-08-2013, 03:30 PM
http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/blog/eye-on-college-football/21512815/manti-teo-a-non-factor-in-bcs-blowout

Did you see him in the BCS championship? I was excited to watch him, mostly due to the enthusiasm from some here, saying how awesome a player he is. He was a nobody out there. He looked small, and played small. He missed tackles all night. And, by the way, anyone who thought ND has a prayer in that game doesn't follow college football. The SEC champ vs. any other conference is a joke. The Irish were like boys against men. It wasn't even class.

supersteeler
01-08-2013, 03:40 PM
He's overated, good prospects can have an off day, but his play was more than off it was terrible to showcase his talent or lack of on a national scene.
A team playing for the National title that struggles to beat Pitt, isn't that good, and it we seen it in high definition last night that confirmed it.

SidSmythe
01-08-2013, 03:40 PM
Te'O will be a GREAT NFL LB. Not going to defend his play last night but i'm also not stupid enough to think 1 game takes away from his talent and ability to grow in the NFL.

The sad part is Notre Dame isn't in a CONFERENCE and didn't have to beat a top 5 team to get in the Championship Game. What a joke this whole thing was....face it, College Football will do anything to get Notre Dame in the Spotlight b/c of VIEWERSHIP

Slapstick
01-08-2013, 03:47 PM
Like it or not, Notre Dame earned the right to be thrashed in the BCS title game by virtue of being undefeated...

Because of all the BS polls, preseason polls, computer algorithms, etc., we were treated to that spectacle...

Sometimes, an underdog can defeat a more talented team in a one-off game...this is the entire reason Boise State is famous...

Sometimes, in a title game, you can have one for the ages (the 2003 Fiesta Bowl comes to mind - Miami vs. Ohio State)...other times, you have games like last night...

I think Te'o is a good player...I still think he's first round worthy...

supersteeler
01-08-2013, 03:57 PM
Anyone see the play where Chance Warmack pancaked T'eo on a block? Then he got faked out on another play thinking run and Bama licked their chops right over T for the T..d.

I can't say he won't be a good player in the NFL based on one game, but for me, when a player with the rep he has gets dominated like he's a child out there, it very questionable how good he'll be in the NFL.

Slapstick
01-08-2013, 04:03 PM
Please, everyone, beware passing judgment on a player due to the results of one game against "NFL level" competition...

That kind of thinking landed us Troy Edwards in the first round...

SidSmythe
01-08-2013, 04:06 PM
Anyone see the play where Chance Warmack pancaked T'eo on a block? Then he got faked out on another play thinking run and Bama licked their chops right over T for the T..d.

I can't say he won't be a good player in the NFL based on one game, but for me, when a player with the rep he has gets dominated like he's a child out there, it very questionable how good he'll be in the NFL.

Ever see a college QB light it up in the Bowl Game only to suck in the NFL???

That's why they evaluate these guys.
Personally I'd interview the kid and make him convince me he's HUNGRY. Not gonna call him "overrated" just yet.

Some people jump the gun......i mean the person who started the thread would trade Ben for a bowl of wheaties if that says anything

Dee Dub
01-08-2013, 04:08 PM
Ever see a college QB light it up in the Bowl Game only to suck in the NFL???

That's why they evaluate these guys.
Personally I'd interview the kid and make him convince me he's HUNGRY. Not gonna call him "overrated" just yet.

Some people jump the gun......i mean the person who started the thread would trade Ben for a bowl of wheaties if that says anything

Cha-ching!! Very well said Sid.

BigRob
01-08-2013, 04:09 PM
Was it really necessary to start another thread on the same exact topic?

BigRob
01-08-2013, 04:14 PM
Cha-ching!! Very well said Sid.

What this game will do is confirm the concerns scouts have about Te'o. Their study of him will intensify now that the season is over. Still a very good ILB.

His game is not head and shoulders above Ogletree and Minter.

lloydroid
01-08-2013, 04:19 PM
Like it or not, Notre Dame earned the right to be thrashed in the BCS title game by virtue of being undefeated...

Because of all the BS polls, preseason polls, computer algorithms, etc., we were treated to that spectacle...

Sometimes, an underdog can defeat a more talented team in a one-off game...this is the entire reason Boise State is famous...

Sometimes, in a title game, you can have one for the ages (the 2003 Fiesta Bowl comes to mind - Miami vs. Ohio State)...other times, you have games like last night...

I think Te'o is a good player...I still think he's first round worthy...

First of all, it's rare for an ILB to be 1st-round worthy; not extremely rare, but not the general rule. Yes, Ray Lewis, Patrick Willis et al are worth first round picks, obviously. But I agree with another poster who said Te'o is about as good as Ray Maualuga, who is decent, just not as good as his hype was either. And, I don't think this game is merely just "one bad game." It was the first time he played a legit top team, and they blew him away, running right at him. He missed tackle after tackle. No way is he a top 10 talent - not even close.

Dee Dub
01-08-2013, 04:22 PM
What this game will do is confirm the concerns scouts have about Te'o. Their study of him will intensify now that the season is over. Still a very good ILB.

His game is not head and shoulders above Ogletree and Minter.

Again..Ogletree and Minter have a boat load of first round picks on the defenses they play in. Te'o doesnt. That is a reality. And it makes a huge difference.

feltdizz
01-08-2013, 04:23 PM
When hype goes wrong.... the kid is good but some made him out to be the next Willis. He looked like Arnold last night.

BigRob
01-08-2013, 04:27 PM
Again..Ogletree and Minter have a boat load of first round picks on the defenses they play in. Te'o doesnt. That is a reality. And it makes a huge difference.

Placing way way too much on this point. Your scrambling.

There is not much difference between him and the other top ILB prospects. Plain and simple.

feltdizz
01-08-2013, 04:31 PM
Again..Ogletree and Minter have a boat load of first round picks on the defenses they play in. Te'o doesnt. That is a reality. And it makes a huge difference.

you can't make excuses for the way Te'o was run through by the Bama RB's... I think most people who are shocked expected Te'o to be the one guy who wouldn't get overwhelmed by Bama's talent.

Kind of reminds me of Brian Bozworth after Bo Jackson ran him over... it's hard to look at Te'o the same after watching that game. I'm curious to see how he does at the Senior Bowl.

SS Laser
01-08-2013, 04:39 PM
It has been said that Te'o will put up avg. numbers at the combine. Maybe he drops to the second were we pick? How nice would that be. Look at the bengals and burfict.

Dee Dub
01-08-2013, 04:43 PM
you can't make excuses for the way Te'o was run through by the Bama RB's... I think most people who are shocked expected Te'o to be the one guy who wouldn't get overwhelmed by Bama's talent.

Kind of reminds me of Brian Bozworth after Bo Jackson ran him over... it's hard to look at Te'o the same after watching that game. I'm curious to see how he does at the Senior Bowl.

I have no excuse...he played poorly last night. But he was never run over by a RB. He missed a few tackles on RB's but never run over by one. That is slightly different thatn waht happened to Brian Bosworth. Now..he did get engulfed and push back a few times by an Alabama O -lineman but what LB wouldnt have?

Saying that it isnt fair to compare Te'o to Ogletree and Minter isnt fair since they have a ton of NFL talent around them and Te'o doesnt. That has nothing to do with excusing his play last night. Minter has maybe 3 NFL first round picks playing in front of him. Ogletree has at least two.

feltdizz
01-08-2013, 04:48 PM
I have no excuse...he played poorly last night. But he was never run over by a RB. He missed a few tackles on RB's but never run over by one. That is slightly different thatn waht happened to Brian Bosworth. Now..he did get engulfed and push back a few times by an Alabama O -lineman but what LB wouldnt have?

Saying that it isnt fair to compare Te'o to Ogletree and Minter isnt fair since they have a ton of NFL talent around them and Te'o doesnt. That has nothing to do with excusing his play last night. Minter has maybe 3 NFL first round picks playing in front of him. Ogletree has at least two.

I don't care about Minter or Ogletree.... you kept touting Te'o for weeks on here and he looked bad. The kid feasted on 10 teams with 5 losses... let's keep it in perspective. He is a good player but he played a really good team last night and he looked small and played small.

steelblood
01-08-2013, 04:53 PM
Again..Ogletree and Minter have a boat load of first round picks on the defenses they play in. Te'o doesnt. That is a reality. And it makes a huge difference.

This is true. Notre Dame doesn't have as many top picks overall.

However, they may have the best 3-4 defensive linemen in all of college football. Nix is the top rated sophomore defensive tackle according to Cooney's Sports Exchange (draftscout.com). Tuitt is the second rated sophomore DE behind Clowney. Kapron Lewis-Moore got hurt in the game, but he is also a good 3-4 DE who was expected to be drafted in the middle rounds (before he blew his knee out last night). Te'o's fellow linebackers and DBs are not as talented as others. But that front is as good as Georgia's starting 3-4 linemen and Alabama's 3-4 starting linemen, and probably better. As Steeler fans, we know that 3-4 linemen have a lot to do with a linebacker's success, especially against the run. Te'o is not playing with chopped liver as you suggest.

My point is not that I think this game shows that he is a poor prospect. In fact, I still like him and think he'll be a good pro. But, this game raised some red flags. And a lot of the excuses for him are ringing a little hollow.

supersteeler
01-08-2013, 04:55 PM
It has been said that Te'o will put up avg. numbers at the combine. Maybe he drops to the second were we pick? How nice would that be. Look at the bengals and burfict.

In Burficts case, NFL teams considered him a problem with off field issues, he was a playmaker on the field but also a loose cannon with several personal foul calls against him.
Marvin Lewis took a chance on him, they were successful, having some discipline now and a pay check, he realizes whats at stake so he plays hard without the dumb penalties that give the opponent new life.

BTW, led the team in tackles. With T'eo, people who evaluate prospects want to see more, if he screws up in the senior bowl, I might consider the taxi squad.:lol:

SS Laser
01-08-2013, 05:03 PM
In Burficts case, NFL teams considered him a problem with off field issues, he was a playmaker on the field but also a loose cannon with several personal foul calls against him.
Marvin Lewis took a chance on him, they were successful, having some discipline now and a pay check, he realizes whats at stake so he plays hard without the dumb penalties that give the opponent new life.

BTW, led the team in tackles. With T'eo, people who evaluate prospects want to see more, if he screws up in the senior bowl, I might consider the taxi squad.:lol:

Yes sir know all about Burfict's "problems". He also had a bad combine. Fell from a 1st rd pick to UDFA. Big fall but proved he can still play in the nfl if he can stay out of trouble.
The senior bowl will be interesting. Even then he is still not a practice squad player.

Steelton Maniac
01-08-2013, 05:31 PM
Plus, Burfict had a totally half-a**ed final year. He looked out of shape and unmotivated.

He probably had too much fun at ASU.

lloydroid
01-08-2013, 06:03 PM
When hype goes wrong.... the kid is good but some made him out to be the next Willis. He looked like Arnold last night.

What you talkin bout Willis?

supersteeler
01-08-2013, 06:16 PM
Yes sir know all about Burfict's "problems". He also had a bad combine. Fell from a 1st rd pick to UDFA. Big fall but proved he can still play in the nfl if he can stay out of trouble.
The senior bowl will be interesting. Even then he is still not a practice squad player.

Laser, I wasn't serious about him regarding the practice squad, just trying to add some levity. Seriously he may turn into a good NFL prospect, but he has to put that vision of himself last night out of everyones mind. For one, MLB's don't usually go high in the draft in this pass happy league, teams are looking for shut down corners and OLB's first to have better success at shutting down pass plays.

Mister Pittsburgh
01-08-2013, 08:14 PM
So Te'o is sitting there for us in the second round....we draft him right?

jj28west
01-08-2013, 08:22 PM
Good point about Notre Dame and competition integrity or lack of


Te'O will be a GREAT NFL LB. Not going to defend his play last night but i'm also not stupid enough to think 1 game takes away from his talent and ability to grow in the NFL.

The sad part is Notre Dame isn't in a CONFERENCE and didn't have to beat a top 5 team to get in the Championship Game. What a joke this whole thing was....face it, College Football will do anything to get Notre Dame in the Spotlight b/c of VIEWERSHIP

NorthCoast
01-08-2013, 08:29 PM
I said it before. The Steelers 1st rd pick HAS to be a 'cant' miss'. There are way too many needs on this team. We got enough Ziggys and Heywards. Steelers need a season 1 contributor whether offense or defense.

In the interest of full disclosure, I seen Teo in a total of 1 game this season... last night. What I seen did not look very impressive. Some said it was because the DL didn't eat up blockers. NEWSFLASH: this is exactly what an ILB will see on this Steelers team until the DL is upgraded. So do we watch Teo get dominated for 2 or 3 yrs waiting for that to happen or do we upgrade the guys in front of him??

Would rather the Steelers target the BPA NT or maybe DE.

Chadman
01-08-2013, 08:40 PM
I said it before. The Steelers 1st rd pick HAS to be a 'cant' miss'. There are way too many needs on this team. We got enough Ziggys and Heywards. Steelers need a season 1 contributor whether offense or defense.

In the interest of full disclosure, I seen Teo in a total of 1 game this season... last night. What I seen did not look very impressive. Some said it was because the DL didn't eat up blockers. NEWSFLASH: this is exactly what an ILB will see on this Steelers team until the DL is upgraded. So do we watch Teo get dominated for 2 or 3 yrs waiting for that to happen or do we upgrade the guys in front of him??

Would rather the Steelers target the BPA NT or maybe DE.

Can't disagree with the NT part. Spot on. The key to the Steelers D going from 'good' to 'special' is the ability of the DL to soak up the blockers & get those high paid LB's making 'splash plays'.

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
01-08-2013, 08:58 PM
Good point about Notre Dame and competition integrity or lack of

Like 'em or not, you can't fault Notre Dame for the schedule they sign up every year. Take a look at this article, which was written before last night's game: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1473885-what-we-learned-about-notre-dame-alabama-from-opponents-bowl-games

From this article.......


Alabama squared off with seven bowl teams, while Notre Dame faced nine this year.


Alabama’s schedule featured seven teams that made bowl games this fall. The overall record for those teams in the postseason was 3-4.


Overall, the Alabama schedule (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1178154-alabama-2012-football-schedule-keys-to-each-game) was not that difficult once the season concluded, and the dust has since settled. The Tide did win the games they should have, and they did it convincingly. Former opponents have had mixed bowl success, but every team has been competitive.


The Irish faced nine teams this year that finished the season as bowl eligible. The overall record of their bowl opponents was 3-6.


Notre Dame entered year with what was expected to be the toughest schedule in the country, but as the season progressed, it was apparent that the lineup was not as tough as originally thought.


It became obvious that the Notre Dame and Alabama schedules were not that strong this year. They both found ways to win, but when faced with elite talent, they struggled.

Because of their exposure, Notre Dame never has the option of playing the "North Dakota States" of the world. They have other schools clamoring to face them and they - or more likely NBC - oblige. They may not have played a top 5 team, but they routinely play high profile teams from major conferences each and every year.

hawaiiansteel
01-08-2013, 08:58 PM
Walterfootball is a very knowledgeable and reputable draft site:

1(17) Pittsburgh Steelers: Manti Te'o, ILB, Notre Dame

I think this is a good spot for Manti Te'o. He was brutal in the national championship, but that shouldn't erase all of his other great tape. He's still the favorite to be the first inside linebacker off the board, and the 16-25 range seems right for him. Besides, this is the type of move the Steelers normally make. They often are able to snag talented prospects who fall to them later in the first round for whatever reason.

The Steelers have shown interest in first-round inside linebackers. They wanted Dont'a Hightower last April, but David DeCastro was just too good to pass up at No. 24 overall. Pittsburgh still has to find an inside linebacker because Larry Foote was awful this year. He finished near the top of dubious rankings like missed tackles and touchdowns allowed by players at his position.

Pick change; previously Barkevious Mingo, DE/OLB LSU

http://www.walterfootball.com/draft2013_1.php

NorthCoast
01-08-2013, 09:05 PM
Walterfootball is a very knowledgeable and reputable draft site:

1(17) Pittsburgh Steelers: Manti Te'o, ILB, Notre Dame

..........

The Steelers have shown interest in first-round inside linebackers. They wanted Dont'a Hightower last April, but David DeCastro was just too good to pass up at No. 24 overall. Pittsburgh still has to find an inside linebacker because Larry Foote was awful this year. He finished near the top of dubious rankings like missed tackles and touchdowns allowed by players at his position.

Pick change; previously Barkevious Mingo, DE/OLB LSU

http://www.walterfootball.com/draft2013_1.php

This statement makes me question Walterfootball's expertise. I would not describe Foote's season as "awful".

hawaiiansteel
01-08-2013, 09:23 PM
17. Pittsburgh Steelers

Arthur Brown, ILB, Kansas State

In last week's mock draft, the Pittsburgh Steelers were able to pick up Manti Te'o. This week doesn't reward them with Te'o, but they may have a better NFL linebacker in Arthur Brown.

If you haven't seen Brown play yet, do yourself a favor and at least YouTube clips of the Kansas State inside linebacker. Wearing No. 4, Brown has been a wrecking ball for the defense, showing off rare speed moving laterally and great vision to locate and get to the football.

Brown won't enter the league with the hype of Manti Te'o, but he's a more athletic option at inside linebacker. For the Pittsburgh Steelers, that's not a bad thing. Put Brown next to Lawrence Timmons at middle linebacker, and you have a duo to rival the one in San Francisco.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...ayoffs/page/18 (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1472715-2013-nfl-mock-draft-latest-projections-after-wildcard-playoffs/page/18)

-- Matt Miller, Bleacher Report

Ghost
01-08-2013, 10:46 PM
"but they miss the flaws -- namely his lack of physicality and his difficulty in taking on and getting off blocks". - this was from the article. If it's even remotely true, then you have to pass on this kid. The Steelers have taken a couple of first rounders that are looking to be mediocre with a ceiling of slightly above average. Can't have that in too many drafts. Need a home run. I'm not judging him on one game but sure not thinking can't miss after watching him get trucked. Great players step up on the biggest stage, not look barely serviceable.

hawaiiansteel
01-08-2013, 10:50 PM
This statement makes me question Walterfootball's expertise. I would not describe Foote's season as "awful".

I agree, I didn't think Larry Foote was awful this past season either. nevertheless, Foote did finish near the top of dubious rankings like missed tackles and touchdowns allowed by players at his position.

jj28west
01-09-2013, 06:44 AM
I boldly predicted Foote would be someone the opposition would exploit and would be a dissapointment overall back in August.

I was proven wrong but he still was a liability against large TE's in coverage and got swallowed up at times at the goalline.


I agree, I didn't think Larry Foote was awful this past season either. nevertheless, Foote did finish near the top of dubious rankings like missed tackles and touchdowns allowed by players at his position.

jj28west
01-09-2013, 06:47 AM
Great find HS!


17. Pittsburgh Steelers

Arthur Brown, ILB, Kansas State

In last week's mock draft, the Pittsburgh Steelers were able to pick up Manti Te'o. This week doesn't reward them with Te'o, but they may have a better NFL linebacker in Arthur Brown.

If you haven't seen Brown play yet, do yourself a favor and at least YouTube clips of the Kansas State inside linebacker. Wearing No. 4, Brown has been a wrecking ball for the defense, showing off rare speed moving laterally and great vision to locate and get to the football.

Brown won't enter the league with the hype of Manti Te'o, but he's a more athletic option at inside linebacker. For the Pittsburgh Steelers, that's not a bad thing. Put Brown next to Lawrence Timmons at middle linebacker, and you have a duo to rival the one in San Francisco.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...ayoffs/page/18 (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1472715-2013-nfl-mock-draft-latest-projections-after-wildcard-playoffs/page/18)

-- Matt Miller, Bleacher Report

Oviedo
01-09-2013, 08:46 AM
17. Pittsburgh Steelers

Arthur Brown, ILB, Kansas State

In last week's mock draft, the Pittsburgh Steelers were able to pick up Manti Te'o. This week doesn't reward them with Te'o, but they may have a better NFL linebacker in Arthur Brown.

If you haven't seen Brown play yet, do yourself a favor and at least YouTube clips of the Kansas State inside linebacker. Wearing No. 4, Brown has been a wrecking ball for the defense, showing off rare speed moving laterally and great vision to locate and get to the football.

Brown won't enter the league with the hype of Manti Te'o, but he's a more athletic option at inside linebacker. For the Pittsburgh Steelers, that's not a bad thing. Put Brown next to Lawrence Timmons at middle linebacker, and you have a duo to rival the one in San Francisco.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...ayoffs/page/18 (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1472715-2013-nfl-mock-draft-latest-projections-after-wildcard-playoffs/page/18)

-- Matt Miller, Bleacher Report

Jon Bostic out of Florida two rounds later is a player who will do the same as Brown. Isn't Brown kinda light for ILB at 225-30 pounds? Bostic is a solid 240-245.

Slapstick
01-09-2013, 09:45 AM
Jon Bostic out of Florida two rounds later is a player who will do the same as Brown. Isn't Brown kinda light for ILB at 225-30 pounds? Bostic is a solid 240-245.

Timmons was 231 out of college...the same as Brown...

Ghost
01-09-2013, 10:20 AM
Timmons was 231 out of college...the same as Brown...

yeah, but he's a bust... ;)

Shoe
01-09-2013, 09:08 PM
"but they miss the flaws -- namely his lack of physicality and his difficulty in taking on and getting off blocks". - this was from the article. If it's even remotely true, then you have to pass on this kid. The Steelers have taken a couple of first rounders that are looking to be mediocre with a ceiling of slightly above average. Can't have that in too many drafts. Need a home run. I'm not judging him on one game but sure not thinking can't miss after watching him get trucked. Great players step up on the biggest stage, not look barely serviceable.

Isn't it funny how so-called professionals could have such diverging opinions about the same thing? Just the day of the BCS game, I was looking for scouting reports on Te'o. I had to scrounge around a bit, but this was from a guy bleacher report columnist named Dan Snyder (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1465992-steelers-scoutbook-notre-dame-inside-linebacker-manti-teo), who said that, among other things (Te'o is):

"Downhill player who uses his strength to shed blocks at a high level"

"Exceptionally strong upper body with great explosion to drive through blockers"

"One of the best tackle-to-tackle linebackers you're going to see; makes all kinds of plays inside the box"

Now, I don't know who Dan Snyder is, or the guy Ghost quotes above, but it's funny how divergent the opinions of two experts can be when talking specifically about a player's characteristic (i.e. in-the-box play, shedding). If we were holding out hope of landing a defensive playmaker of this caliber, this is probably a blessing in disguise.

I would still be elated to see him picked at 17, for a team desperate for a young defensive playmaker. One last thing: Don't compare Te'o to Burfict. I was impressed with Burfict's play this year too, TBH. But Burfict is like any other "character" guy. He will fail, due to his lack of it.

steelz09
01-09-2013, 10:06 PM
yeah, but he's a bust... ;)

Yeah, and at 230, Timmons was too small for ILB.

Guarantee Timmons is close to 255 right now.