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Dee Dub
01-01-2013, 03:33 PM
Georgia in my opinion is the best defense in all of college. They are loaded with NFL players to be. They run a 3-4 defense.

Jarvis Jones is a flat out beast. Top 5 pick. Best pass rusher in college not named Jadeveon Clowney. Alec Olgeree ILB is a sideline to sideline great pursuit player. And in my opinion the best pure free safety in college is Bacarri Rambo. NT John Jenkins maybe the second or third best NT in college. Shawn Williams SS is a mid round pick who is not very good in coverage but he is an inside the box coming forward SS who can thump. Kwame Geathers DT is pretty solid too. I love watching this defense. 3-4 and talent all over the place.

pfelix73
01-01-2013, 05:32 PM
Yea, so far an avg Nebraska team has put 31 points on them.....

Dee Dub
01-01-2013, 05:55 PM
Yea, so far an avg Nebraska team has put 31 points on them.....

Dont buy into that. This is the first time all year Georgia faced a run-spread offense. With Georgia being a 3-4 zone blitz they were at times unprepared and out of alignment versus this offense. The Bulldogs have several NFL players on that defense. Jesse Palmer said this Georgia defense is as close to an NFL defense as you will find and he is right.

Oviedo
01-01-2013, 07:29 PM
Ogletree stood out. Didn't see much from Jenkins or Rambo but I was switching between games.

Jooser
01-01-2013, 07:33 PM
Saw a prospect from South Carolina today I liked:


http://youtu.be/W26Dcns1Mxg

Dee Dub
01-01-2013, 07:49 PM
Saw a prospect from South Carolina today I liked:


http://youtu.be/W26Dcns1Mxg

Yeah pencil him in as the number 1 overall pick next year and maybe even the Heisman Trophy winner. He is the fastest defensive player I have ever seen coming out of a 3-point stance. This acceleration on this play is jaw dropping. And he has an incredible swim move that is so quick.

steelz09
01-01-2013, 07:54 PM
That play was incredible.

He even recovered the fumble.

Dee Dub
01-01-2013, 07:55 PM
Ogletree stood out. Didn't see much from Jenkins or Rambo but I was switching between games.

Ogletree finished with 13 tackles, 3 TFL's, 1 FF, 1 FR, 1 Sack, and two QB hurries. This is all from the ILB position. Very impressive. He could play with the Steelers. Even though I dont think he is the more ideal fit next to Timmons as Minter is, but because of Ogletree's speed he could bring a new dimension inside. He and Timmons could be like the fasted inside LB combo's in the league.

Jarvis Jones had a great game too. He was putting pressure on all game. 8 tackles, 2 TFL's, 2 Sacks, and showed some ability to drop in coverage. Best defensive player in this draft.

supersteeler
01-01-2013, 08:19 PM
Ogletree stood out. Didn't see much from Jenkins or Rambo but I was switching between games.

Thats because Jenkins didn't play in the game.

SuperSize
01-01-2013, 09:37 PM
Lots of talk about all of the Georgia players, but I was intrigued by DE Eric Martin from Nebraska. What's the scoop on this guy?

Looked him up on-line, listed at 6'-0" & 250 lbs, runs a 4.7 40. Had a good pass rush all day today. He dropped into coverage a couple of times during zone blitzes, overall I thought he looked pretty athletic & was playing with a lot of emotion. He reminds me physically of #92 - short, quick, & powerful.


Pete

DBR96A
01-01-2013, 09:50 PM
As a resident of Athens, I'd love to see the Steelers draft Jarvis Jones in the first round and Bacarri Rambo in the second or third round.

Dee Dub
01-01-2013, 10:01 PM
Thats because Jenkins didn't play in the game.

Yep.. academically ineligible.

Dee Dub
01-01-2013, 10:02 PM
As a resident of Athens, I'd love to see the Steelers draft Jarvis Jones in the first round and Bacarri Rambo in the second or third round.

Me too but we have no chance at Jarvis Jones. He goes top 3 maybe number 1 overall. I love Bacarri Rambo. Been talking about him on this board for two years. Negative is his off season problem he had. True free safety who can also hit like a truck.

hawaiiansteel
01-01-2013, 10:06 PM
As a resident of Athens, I'd love to see the Steelers draft Jarvis Jones in the first round and Bacarri Rambo in the second or third round.

Jarvis Jones is a Top-5 pick, he'll be long gone by the time the Steelers pick at #17.

as for Rambo, I would take him no earlier than in the 3rd round. but it would be pretty cool to buy a Steelers jersey with the name "Rambo" on the back of it. :D

Dee Dub
01-01-2013, 10:31 PM
Jarvis Jones is a Top-5 pick, he'll be long gone by the time the Steelers pick at #17.

as for Rambo, I would take him no earlier than in the 3rd round. but it would be pretty cool to buy a Steelers jersey with the name "Rambo" on the back of it. :D

I think Rambo is worthy of a 2nd round pick. I dont think he will last till the Steelers pick in the 3rd round. 16 career picks, 34 PD's, and can hit like a truck. I've said it a million times, I think he is the best pure free safety in this draft. He has great ball skills. A legit center fielder.

Dee Dub
01-01-2013, 11:01 PM
Jarvis Jones is a Top-5 pick, he'll be long gone by the time the Steelers pick at #17.

as for Rambo, I would take him no earlier than in the 3rd round. but it would be pretty cool to buy a Steelers jersey with the name "Rambo" on the back of it. :D

And for what it is worth. Mel Kiper says this about Rambo, "Rambo is a player NFL teams will draft knowing he can start right away."

Oviedo
01-02-2013, 12:06 AM
And for what it is worth. Mel Kiper says this about Rambo, "Rambo is a player NFL teams will draft knowing he can start right away."






...except for D!ck LeBeau. Just the other 31 teams

DBR96A
01-02-2013, 12:11 AM
I think Rambo is worthy of a 2nd round pick. I dont think he will last till the Steelers pick in the 3rd round. 16 career picks, 34 PD's, and can hit like a truck. I've said it a million times, I think he is the best pure free safety in this draft. He has great ball skills. A legit center fielder.

So then let's draft him in the second round and a LB in the first round.

BigRob
01-02-2013, 01:41 AM
I'll take a pass on Rambo and go for D.J. Swearinger from South Carolina in the second. All told, I would also take Philip Thomas (A freakin Ballhawk) from Fresno in the second over Rambo.

Alec Ogletree needs to get his head out of his rear. If he actually has a work ethic to go along with his insane athletic ability, he'll be the best ILB or WLB in the league within one year.

He has several things that Colbert/Tomlin covet in 1st round prospects:

1. He has insane athletic ability and size 6'3 235 lbs. He has the frame to carry 245-250 lbs.
2. He's a Junior.
3. Did I mention his insance athleticism?

Unfortunately, he has something the Steelers hate in a player: Character Issues.

Tomlin did mention the ILB position as a point of concern now that this season is closed.

hawaiiansteel
01-02-2013, 01:46 AM
...except for D!ck LeBeau. Just the other 31 teams

well, it does take several years for rookies to learn Dick LeBeau's complicated defensive schemes...:stirpot

Oviedo
01-02-2013, 08:38 AM
well, it does take several years for rookies to learn Dick LeBeau's complicated defensive schemes...:stirpot

And the result is Keenan Lewis. The guy gets his one season to start and then he is a Unrestricted Free Agent who we will have to pay top dollar to keep. That is the problem with the "Lebeau way" when you finally get to see what a player can do it is a contract year or within one year of one. You essentially get minimal contribution for 2 years.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-02-2013, 10:03 AM
Hmmm...Things could get very interesting. Ogletree has declared & Clowney may challange NFL rule.

Oviedo
01-02-2013, 10:05 AM
Hmmm...Things could get very interesting. Ogletree has declared and Clowney may challenge the NFL rule.

Ogletree looked very good yesterday, howver I'm not willing to wait 2 years for him to be allowed to play which is why I would default to the offensive side of the ball in Round 1.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-02-2013, 10:17 AM
Ogletree looked very good yesterday, howver I'm not willing to wait 2 years for him to be allowed to play which is why I would default to the offensive side of the ball in Round 1.

If somone drafted high on the defensive side of the ball can't hit the field for the Steelers early next year then he is a bad draft choice. You keeping mentioning your 2-3 year DL theory but it doesn't exist with the veterans be shown the door. There is nobody in front of them that is cemented. The only offensive player I see as a possibility is in a trade down with Wallace going elsewhere. It would have to be a significant trade down because I do not like any of the WRs inside the Top 25.

ikestops85
01-02-2013, 01:36 PM
Please tell me what defensive starter should be replaced by a rookie. I really want to know. I'm sure many will say Foote but he had a very good year ... much better than a board favorite last year ... cough ... Hightower ... cough. Hightower with 60 tackles, 4 sacks and 2 FRs. Foote with 113 tackles, 4 sacks, 2 FFs and 2 FRs.

We could have been starting Lewis for years but he was horrible and it had nothing to do with DL's system. It had to do with him adjusting to the pro game
So board gurus ... do you go with the better player now or the rookie with the higher upside?

Dee Dub
01-02-2013, 01:55 PM
Please tell me what defensive starter should be replaced by a rookie. I really want to know. I'm sure many will say Foote but he had a very good year ... much better than a board favorite last year ... cough ... Hightower ... cough. Hightower with 60 tackles, 4 sacks and 2 FRs. Foote with 113 tackles, 4 sacks, 2 FFs and 2 FRs.

We could have been starting Lewis for years but he was horrible and it had nothing to do with DL's system. It had to do with him adjusting to the pro game
So board gurus ... do you go with the better player now or the rookie with the higher upside?

Goodness!! Can you imagine what Hightower will be down the road? If that is what he does his rookie year compared to what Foote did, 20 tackles, 0 sacks, 0 FF's and rarely on the field, then Hightower is going to be a monster. ;)

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-02-2013, 02:05 PM
Simply saying "replaced by a rookie" is a bold statement. Perhaps saying replaced by a player behind them or a rookie who wins out would be better. Based on performance, the Steelers transition, and cap situation:


Gone For 2013:


Harrison - (Worilds, Carter, Robinson, or Rookie) Not worth 10 mil or even the 5 mil min salary possible. Time to move on.

Hampton - (McClendon, Ta'amu, or Fangupo) His replacement is on the roster. Let them battle it out.

Foote - (Spence, Sylvester, or Rookie) I would be ok with him returning....But will he return at the Steelers price? May be best option if they feel Spence is the solution. Again, will he return if he knows he is not long term plan? Foote is probably looking for his last multi year deal. If you are going to say his stats reflect his game...You would be incorrect. Good against the run but still a liability in covergae. Stats don't tell you that.

Keisel - (Hayward) Keisel had a good year but he may be a cap cut. His replacement is already on the roster. He may last 2013.



Gone For 2014:


Polamalu - His replacement not on roster but should be drafted this year.

Taylor - May be cap cut.

Clark - His replacement may be on the roster.

Foote & Keisel if they are on the roster for 2013 won't be for 2014. Both are in contract years in 2013 & will be 35 by season start 2014.

Dee Dub
01-02-2013, 02:08 PM
I'll take a pass on Rambo and go for D.J. Swearinger from South Carolina in the second. All told, I would also take Philip Thomas (A freakin Ballhawk) from Fresno in the second over Rambo.

Not more of a ball hawk than Rambo. If you go by INT's. 16 to 13 over their careers. Or PD's for that matter. 34 to 14. It would appear that Rambo is around a lot more balls than Thomas. And I'd take the SEC player over the Mountain West Conference player.

BigRob
01-02-2013, 02:10 PM
Goodness!! Can you imagine what Hightower will be down the road? If that is what he does his rookie year compared to what Foote did, 20 tackles, 0 sacks, 0 FF's and rarely on the field, then Hightower is going to be a monster. ;)

This is a weak, weak response. One of these players was a 1st round draft pick and one was 4th round draft pick.

One stepped in for Kendrell Bell when he couldn't stay healthy and seized a starting spot he didn't let go of for 5 years. When Hightower can match Foote's career production, then you can come up with a better argument.

Hightower is what he is. He will be a good ILB. Just like Jerod Mayo of top ten fame is what he is. They are both decent ILB'ers.

BigRob
01-02-2013, 02:15 PM
Gone For 2014:


Polamalu - His replacement not on roster but should be drafted this year (D.J. Swearinger in the 2nd Rd).

Taylor - May be cap cut (Allen is his eventual replacement, or perhaps next year is Lewis is re-signed).

Clark - His replacement may be on the roster. (Robert Golden)



I agree with you a lot about this roster for 2014. 2013 is a little trickier. I think Hampton may come back on a vet minimum deal.

Harrison could come back after he is cut. His cap number is just too high and he is too old with a developing injury issue.

Keisel, Foote, and even Taylor are tough calls for 2013. If the Steelers sign K. Lewis, they may go with Allen, Lewis, and a high draft pick at CB.

Dee Dub
01-02-2013, 02:20 PM
This is a weak, weak response. One of these players was a 1st round draft pick and one was 4th round draft pick.

One stepped in for Kendrell Bell when he couldn't stay healthy and seized a starting spot he didn't let go of for 5 years. When Hightower can match Foote's career production, then you can come up with a better argument.

Hightower is what he is. He will be a good ILB. Just like Jerod Mayo of top ten fame is what he is. They are both decent ILB'ers.

Well then we agree somewhat. See I think comparing an established 11 year veterans stats to that of a rookie is weak. I think it is more appropriate to compare what each did in year one than for us to compare what one did in year 11 to what one did in year 1. Apples to Apples not Apples to Oranges.

BigRob
01-02-2013, 02:23 PM
Well then we agree somewhat. See I think comparing an established 11 year veterans stats to that of a rookie is weak. I think it is more appropriate to compare what each did in year one than for us to compare what one did in year 11 to what one did in year 1. Apples to Apples not Apples to Oranges.

See what I said, was come back to me when Hightower has a career that is even comparable to Foote's. I didn't say to compare them now. It is stupid to put year one comparisons on players with different draft slots.

If Hightower has the same type of career as Foote, he should be a very happy man. Good player, not a great one.

Dee Dub
01-02-2013, 02:45 PM
See what I said, was come back to me when Hightower has a career that is even comparable to Foote's. I didn't say to compare them now. It is stupid to put year one comparisons on players with different draft slots.

If Hightower has the same type of career as Foote, he should be a very happy man. Good player, not a great one.

But as usual you missed the entire point. ikestops85 was doing exactly that...and thus I responded to it. Maybe you should read what was actually said before I responded to it?

BigRob
01-02-2013, 02:47 PM
But as usual you missed the entire point. ikestops85 was doing exactly that...and thus I responded to it. Maybe you should read what was actually said before I responded to it?

No I get it, it was weak sauce by both of you.

ikestops85
01-02-2013, 06:32 PM
But as usual you missed the entire point. ikestops85 was doing exactly that...and thus I responded to it. Maybe you should read what was actually said before I responded to it?

and you both missed what I was trying to point out. There is a perception that the Steelers, and LeBeau specifically, doesn't play rookies because his system is too complicated. I was trying to point out that when you have a solid veteran in front of said rookie why should the rookie start.

To make my point I used the stats of Foote and Hightower. If we had drafted Hightower should he have started over Foote. I say he wouldn't and that is not because he is a rookie. It is because a veteran like Foote can outplay a rookie like Hightower. That doesn't mean that Hightower won't end up being a better linebacker than Foote. It just means that if you want your best 11 on the field you would go with Foote over Hightower this year.

So comparing veterans to rookies is like comparing apples to oranges. Coaches are forced to make that comparison game after game. On a team stacked with decent players like the steelers the apples are going to win except in very rare cases.

BigRob
01-02-2013, 06:51 PM
and you both missed what I was trying to point out. There is a perception that the Steelers, and LeBeau specifically, doesn't play rookies because his system is too complicated. I was trying to point out that when you have a solid veteran in front of said rookie why should the rookie start.

To make my point I used the stats of Foote and Hightower. If we had drafted Hightower should he have started over Foote. I say he wouldn't and that is not because he is a rookie. It is because a veteran like Foote can outplay a rookie like Hightower. That doesn't mean that Hightower won't end up being a better linebacker than Foote. It just means that if you want your best 11 on the field you would go with Foote over Hightower this year.

So comparing veterans to rookies is like comparing apples to oranges. Coaches are forced to make that comparison game after game. On a team stacked with decent players like the steelers the apples are going to win except in very rare cases.

It was weak sauce by both of you. How can you really compare players from different teams that play in different systems and call it apples to apples?

Hightower will be an average 3-4 ILB and Foote developed into an average 3-4 ILB. Big deal.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-03-2013, 11:18 AM
I agree with you a lot about this roster for 2014. 2013 is a little trickier. I think Hampton may come back on a vet minimum deal.

Harrison could come back after he is cut. His cap number is just too high and he is too old with a developing injury issue.

Keisel, Foote, and even Taylor are tough calls for 2013. If the Steelers sign K. Lewis, they may go with Allen, Lewis, and a high draft pick at CB.

Hampton may come back. I don't see a reason to bring him back. 2 down player who gives you a play every other series. I was so shocked what Mack did to him 1 on 1 game 1. He was a little better the 2nd but he should hang them up.

Steelers have brought former Steelers back but I can't recall them ever release & re-sign. Harrison was a great player for the Steelers & I will miss him. Releasing him will create 2-5 mil dead money. He has close to 3 mil "Misc" bonus in 2013 & 2014 that may be a roster bonus which can be avoided if the release him before due. That would put his dead money at 2 mil while freeing up 8 mil for 2013. Given his tenure, his vet min will probably be in the 1.5 mil range & guaranteed if he is on the roster week 1. I would say he may be an option if there is an injury after week 1 if he is still on the streets. I believe it is time to move on. They released Porter at 30 coming off a 7 sack year in March before he was due a 1 mil roster bonus. I believe Harrison's is in the 1.5 range. It may be the exact same situation.

I agree with the Keisel, Foote, & Taylor being difficult.

I have heard Foote will take less to return. That may be a good situation for the Steelers to explore. Insurance for Spence & will give him time to recover. Also could give Sylvester one last look. That is where the "mystery" lies right now. Only the Steelers will know about Spence. Pre injury...He was your 2013 starter & may have moved Foote to the bench in 2012. If they feel he will be healthy & return to form, I don't think the look early if Foote & Sylveter are here. But like I said...It is a mystery.

Keisel hasn't shown much drop off if any. Will be in a contract year in 2013. Releasing him frees up about 2.8 mil. If healthy, he may be a fall back plan "If" they need cap space.

Taylor is still playing at a high level. He has a 9.4 hit in 2013 & a 10.4 in 2014. It is hard sifting through Misc Bonuses after retructures but I believe cutting Taylor this year will only net 2.5 mil while creating 6.9 dead money. Releasing him next year will create about 3.4 dead money but have a savings of 7 mil.

Based on that, I belive Taylor will be here for 2013. Keisel should be unless they become cap strapped to sign Lewis and/or Wallace. Foote, if the reports are correct, may come back on a 1 year deal if he will take the "pay cut" he spoke of. Question is...What is a pay cut for him? Foote made 3.6 mil last season.

Oviedo
01-03-2013, 11:23 AM
Hampton may come back. I don't see a reason to bring him back. 2 down player who gives you a play every other series. I was so shocked what Mack did to him 1 on 1 game 1. He was a little better the 2nd but he should hang them up.

Steelers have brought former Steelers back but I can't recall them ever release & re-sign. Harrison was a great player for the Steelers & I will miss him. Releasing him will create 2-5 mil dead money. He has close to 3 mil "Misc" bonus in 2013 & 2014 that may be a roster bonus which can be avoided if the release him before due. That would put his dead money at 2 mil while freeing up 8 mil for 2013. Given his tenure, his vet min will probably be in the 1.5 mil range & guaranteed if he is on the roster week 1. I would say he may be an option if there is an injury after week 1 if he is still on the streets. I believe it is time to move on. They released Porter at 30 coming off a 7 sack year in March before he was due a 1 mil roster bonus. I believe Harrison's is in the 1.5 range. It may be the exact same situation.

I agree with the Keisel, Foote, & Taylor being difficult.

I have heard Foote will take less to return. That may be a good situation for the Steelers to explore. Insurance for Spence & will give him time to recover. Also could give Sylvester one last look. That is where the "mystery" lies right now. Only the Steelers will know about Spence. Pre injury...He was your 2013 starter & may have moved Foote to the bench in 2012. If they feel he will be healthy & return to form, I don't think the look early if Foote & Sylveter are here. But like I said...It is a mystery.

Keisel hasn't shown much drop off if any. Will be in a contract year in 2013. Releasing him frees up about 2.8 mil. If healthy, he may be a fall back plan "If" they need cap space.

Taylor is still playing at a high level. He has a 9.4 hit in 2013 & a 10.4 in 2014. It is hard sifting through Misc Bonuses after retructures but I believe cutting Taylor this year will only net 2.5 mil while creating 6.9 dead money. Releasing him next year will create about 3.4 dead money but have a savings of 7 mil.

Based on that, I belive Taylor will be here for 2013. Keisel should be unless they become cap strapped to sign Lewis and/or Wallace. Foote, if the reports are correct, may come back on a 1 year deal if he will take the "pay cut" he spoke of. Question is...What is a pay cut for him? Foote made 3.6 mil last season.


I think we have to all realize that it is highly unlikely Spence is ready to play in 2013...if ever. We have an issue at ILB that eithe Foote or anothe player will need to hold down for one more year.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
01-03-2013, 11:34 AM
I think we have to all realize that it is highly unlikely Spence is ready to play in 2013...if ever. We have an issue at ILB that eithe Foote or anothe player will need to hold down for one more year.

That is why it may make sense to bring Foote back "IF" he will take less. I don't think Spence will "never" return to form. I think he will be on the PUP worst case in 2013. If we were talking about a CB, S, WR, or RB...We may have to use the "until he shows it" approach in the draft. I think there is enough in Spence's favor & what the Steelers can do in 2013 to not panic. However, if a guy like Te'O or any ILB falls to them in the 1st two rounds that is graded high and shouldn't be on the board....You take him. You 4-3 guys will like an option that may arise down the road in 2014. ;)

phillyesq
01-03-2013, 11:49 AM
Please tell me what defensive starter should be replaced by a rookie. I really want to know. I'm sure many will say Foote but he had a very good year ... much better than a board favorite last year ... cough ... Hightower ... cough. Hightower with 60 tackles, 4 sacks and 2 FRs. Foote with 113 tackles, 4 sacks, 2 FFs and 2 FRs.

We could have been starting Lewis for years but he was horrible and it had nothing to do with DL's system. It had to do with him adjusting to the pro game
So board gurus ... do you go with the better player now or the rookie with the higher upside?

This is an excellent point and you will not get a meaningful response from those who complaint that it takes rookies too long to see the field with the Steelers. First, talented rookies with weak starters in front of them start early - guys like Hampton, Kendrell Bell, etc. Cortez Allen contributed as a rookie and played more this year because he showed that he was ready. Lewis didn't play early because he was not ready to play in the NFL. He had the meltdown in the preseason game last (or maybe two years ago) and was not ready.

Giving rookies a year or two to learn and be slowly worked into games is a luxury - not a problem that needs to be solved.

Moreover, look around the NFL. The rookies that start typically do so on bad teams. There are two reasons for this - first, bad teams pick higher in the draft and are able to select better players. Second, bad teams are bad for a reason - usually because their starters stink. Finally, if you're not playing for anything, you can allow a rookie to make mistakes.

A final point - most rookies are not stars. Leaguewide, a few guys step in and contribute as rookies, but they are the exception, not the rule. Many players, even those in - gasp - a 4-3 defense, take time to adjust to the NFL and take time before they contribute at a high level.

Oviedo
01-03-2013, 12:44 PM
This is an excellent point and you will not get a meaningful response from those who complaint that it takes rookies too long to see the field with the Steelers. First, talented rookies with weak starters in front of them start early - guys like Hampton, Kendrell Bell, etc. Cortez Allen contributed as a rookie and played more this year because he showed that he was ready. Lewis didn't play early because he was not ready to play in the NFL. He had the meltdown in the preseason game last (or maybe two years ago) and was not ready.

Giving rookies a year or two to learn and be slowly worked into games is a luxury - not a problem that needs to be solved.

Moreover, look around the NFL. The rookies that start typically do so on bad teams. There are two reasons for this - first, bad teams pick higher in the draft and are able to select better players. Second, bad teams are bad for a reason - usually because their starters stink. Finally, if you're not playing for anything, you can allow a rookie to make mistakes.

A final point - most rookies are not stars. Leaguewide, a few guys step in and contribute as rookies, but they are the exception, not the rule. Many players, even those in - gasp - a 4-3 defense, take time to adjust to the NFL and take time before they contribute at a high level.

Can you really afford the "luxury" when you constantly create a situation like we have with Keenan Lewis where you get a one full season sample size and then have to sign him to his second contract for big money? A rookie doesn't have to be a starter, but they should be able to get a lot more in game experience so you can both develop and evaluate him.

ikestops85
01-03-2013, 01:19 PM
Can you really afford the "luxury" when you constantly create a situation like we have with Keenan Lewis where you get a one full season sample size and then have to sign him to his second contract for big money? A rookie doesn't have to be a starter, but they should be able to get a lot more in game experience so you can both develop and evaluate him.

We tried that with Lewis and he constantly failed. We are currently doing that with Cortez Allen. He got playing time last year and even more this year.

Sometimes it takes years to develop the talent. That's just the way football is and it has nothing to do with DL.

RuthlessBurgher
01-03-2013, 02:49 PM
Can you really afford the "luxury" when you constantly create a situation like we have with Keenan Lewis where you get a one full season sample size and then have to sign him to his second contract for big money? A rookie doesn't have to be a starter, but they should be able to get a lot more in game experience so you can both develop and evaluate him.

We constantly create a situation like we have with Keenan Lewis where you get a one full season sample size and then have to sign him to his second contract for big money? He's one example. Who are all of the others?

Eddie Spaghetti
01-03-2013, 03:11 PM
We constantly create a situation like we have with Keenan Lewis where you get a one full season sample size and then have to sign him to his second contract for big money? He's one example. Who are all of the others?

I would like to hear the answer to this as well.

Dee Dub
01-03-2013, 03:23 PM
Sometimes it takes years to develop the talent. That's just the way football is and it has nothing to do with DL.

True but sometimes all it takes is giving one a shot as well. And that is something the Steelers rarely do.

phillyesq
01-03-2013, 04:23 PM
True but sometimes all it takes is giving one a shot as well. And that is something the Steelers rarely do.

Who would you have given a shot to this year, and who would you have benched?

Dee Dub
01-03-2013, 06:19 PM
Who would you have given a shot to this year, and who would you have benched?

I was one who thought at the beginning of the year that this teams wasn't going anywhere. As a result I would have given the positions to Cameron Hayward , Jason Worilds, and Jonathan Dwyer (not benched him because he fumbled a couple of times). And I would have drafted different. And it would have been with the thought of giving rookies a chance.

phillyesq
01-03-2013, 06:42 PM
I was one who thought at the beginning of the year that this teams wasn't going anywhere. As a result I would have given the positions to Cameron Hayward , Jason Worilds, and Jonathan Dwyer (not benched him because he fumbled a couple of times). And I would have drafted different. And it would have been with the thought of giving rookies a chance.

Fair enough, and I certainly respect that you answer the question. As for Heyward and Worilds, they both saw plenty of PT this year. Heyward has continued to grow, and I think that eventually he'll be a good starter at DE, but Keisel is a leader on the defense and I wouldn't have benched him. He may not be as good as he was a few years ago, but he is still an asset. I wouldn't bench Harrison or Woodley for Worilds (as a starter) and I think the coaching staff has seen enough of him that they can properly evaluate him. He seems to be a Clark Haggans level player - a solid 3-4 OLB, but not spectacular.

steelblood
01-03-2013, 07:06 PM
Georgia is the most talented defense this season, I believe. The problem is that they (as usual) underperformed.

Jarvis Jones is a beast and doesn't take plays off.

Ogeltree and Rambo are both uber talented but lack discipline. They are often out of position. Ogletree is not stout in any way. He is great in pursuit and in pass coverage. Rambo is a great talent, but I don't know if his head is screwed on well enough to be a Steeler. Against South Carolina, Rambo got beat deep, then let a smaller receiver take the ball away from him. Then, he topped it off by taking an awful personal foul. He could be a great value pick on day two and could turn out to be an all-pro with his ball skills and instincts. But, just seems like an Oakland Raider to me.

Jenkins is another guy with great talent, but often underperforms too often.

Shawn Williams allows too many big plays.

Sanders Commings has great size and athleticism but is very inconsistent.

Too me, Georgia is soft too often. Players from a team like this scare me a bit.