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View Full Version : Backup Quarterback Situation - Steeler organization to blame



Sword
11-26-2012, 08:58 AM
exactly...

This team has nobody to blame but themselves for their backup Quarterback situation, and deserve to reap what they sow right now. How or why veterans like Byron Leftwich and Charlie Batch were left on this roster without a young, Pro-Style, and potentially effective Quarterback also being groomed behind Big Ben over the last seven seasons is a downright joke. Omar Jacobs? Brian St. Pierre? Tyler Palko? Dennis Dixon? Jerrod Johnson? Troy Smith? These guys were not the answers in the least bit, and should have never been considered viable options in the first place! Sure, the Brian Hoyer signing is nice, but a “too little, too late” move in terms of him doing anything of relevance this season. Even with Hoyer’s addition, I still hope this team can bring in some competition from somewhere else this off-season to really solidify the depth behind Big Ben. Remember, Roethlisberger will be entering his 10th season in 2013, and it would be comforting to have some depth behind him that is not calcifying by the day or at the very least can lead the Offense on a scoring drive or two if they must replace him.


http://nicepickcowher.com/2012/11/26/my-thoughts-on-the-steelers-garbage-laden-performance-on-sunday/

SanAntonioSteelerFan
11-26-2012, 09:34 AM
exactly...

This team has nobody to blame but themselves for their backup Quarterback situation, and deserve to reap what they sow right now. How or why veterans like Byron Leftwich and Charlie Batch were left on this roster without a young, Pro-Style, and potentially effective Quarterback also being groomed behind Big Ben over the last seven seasons is a downright joke. Omar Jacobs? Brian St. Pierre? Tyler Palko? Dennis Dixon? Jerrod Johnson? Troy Smith? These guys were not the answers in the least bit, and should have never been considered viable options in the first place! Sure, the Brian Hoyer signing is nice, but a “too little, too late” move in terms of him doing anything of relevance this season. Even with Hoyer’s addition, I still hope this team can bring in some competition from somewhere else this off-season to really solidify the depth behind Big Ben. Remember, Roethlisberger will be entering his 10th season in 2013, and it would be comforting to have some depth behind him that is not calcifying by the day or at the very least can lead the Offense on a scoring drive or two if they must replace him.


http://nicepickcowher.com/2012/11/26/my-thoughts-on-the-steelers-garbage-laden-performance-on-sunday/

I have ALWAYS quaked in fear when Lefty took the field, but I suppose it wasn't as obvious a fail to have him as the #2 back up as having Batch as a #3.

Thinking they must have known that Batch had no arm anymore, I agree the FO has to shoulder the blame at least for not having a viable 3rd QB option on the roster. Or at least a young gun who is just as bad, but has the potential to improve. As has been said elsewhere, Batch and Lefty aren't getting younger, and the odds are their best performances might have been their last ones (how crazy is that?).

Shawn
11-26-2012, 09:44 AM
I think Lefty would have been ok if he hadn't hurt his shoulder and ribs in that game...looked like it effected him. With that said, not having a young pro style QB in the wings is inexcuseable. We knew this day was coming...yet didn't prepare?

papillon
11-26-2012, 10:02 AM
It's easy to blame the organization with 20/20 hindsight. Coming out of training camp many NFL pundits believed that the Steelers backup quarterback situation was as good as it gets in the NFL. The past two weekends have proven differently, there's no way to determine who will or won't perform, but the things you look for in a backup quarterback are experience in game situations and some one that can manage a game successfully. The Steelers believed they had that in Leftwich (a former starter) and Batch (old reliable). You can't assume that a player will get injured, regardless of what we believe as armchair GMs.

The Ravens have Tyrod Taylor as their backup. Is he winning any games if Flacco gets injured? Doubtful How about Bruce Gradkowski or Colt McCoy? Highly unlikely

How Graham Harrell? Exactly, who you say, he backs up Aaron Rogers
Like McCown? Matt Ryan's backup
TJ Yates? Doubtful

Every team is in the same place with backup quarterbacks, it's someone that can finish a game and not lose it. If the backup has to play more than two or three games the season is finished for that team. You can't win in the NFL if only 2 of the 3 facets of the game are functioning at an NFL caliber level. Right now would I liked to have had Jerrod Johnson or Hoyer from the beginning? Of course, but coming out of training camp I believed the Steelers to be in a sound position should they need to play a couple games without Ben. Leftwich and Batch have proven otherwise, but there's no way of knowing that in August and September, IMO.

Pappy

SanAntonioSteelerFan
11-26-2012, 10:51 AM
100% agree that betting on a backup to take over a season and bringing home Lombardi #7 is foolish! (Not even Ben did that when he took over for Tommy Gun).

The FO should have known the (in-)capability of our backup situation, even if the talking heads and we Steeler fans erroneously thought we were in a good position.

Taking it one step further, it's almost inconceivable that they DIDN'T know how bad Batch was. So what remains is that they knew, and made a calculated decision that for one reason or another it was better to keep him than get a young buck, or to just run with 2 QBs on the roster.

How much is Batch getting paid ... maybe not much and we're putting those $$ into the contract of our skill players? Does he have incriminating photos of Mr. Rooney "doing the Irish"?

Mister Pittsburgh
11-26-2012, 10:56 AM
It's easy to blame the organization with 20/20 hindsight. Coming out of training camp many NFL pundits believed that the Steelers backup quarterback situation was as good as it gets in the NFL. The past two weekends have proven differently, there's no way to determine who will or won't perform, but the things you look for in a backup quarterback are experience in game situations and some one that can manage a game successfully. The Steelers believed they had that in Leftwich (a former starter) and Batch (old reliable). You can't assume that a player will get injured, regardless of what we believe as armchair GMs.

The Ravens have Tyrod Taylor as their backup. Is he winning any games if Flacco gets injured? Doubtful How about Bruce Gradkowski or Colt McCoy? Highly unlikely

How Graham Harrell? Exactly, who you say, he backs up Aaron Rogers
Like McCown? Matt Ryan's backup
TJ Yates? Doubtful

Every team is in the same place with backup quarterbacks, it's someone that can finish a game and not lose it. If the backup has to play more than two or three games the season is finished for that team. You can't win in the NFL if only 2 of the 3 facets of the game are functioning at an NFL caliber level. Right now would I liked to have had Jerrod Johnson or Hoyer from the beginning? Of course, but coming out of training camp I believed the Steelers to be in a sound position should they need to play a couple games without Ben. Leftwich and Batch have proven otherwise, but there's no way of knowing that in August and September, IMO.

Pappy

Sorry Pap, but this fan here was smarter than the pundits on this one and has been calling for us to draft a QB to groom the past 3 drafts....I wanted John Skelton the one year. He seems like he would of been a good backup type QB.

Shawn
11-26-2012, 11:06 AM
Yeah, I'm not buying it Pappy. It has nothing to do with 20/20 hindsight and more to do with smart planning. If you want to keep one savvy vet...great. But, holding onto Batch who turns like what 89 next week...instead of a young guy to develop makes zero sense. And I'm not buying into all these young guys not having what it takes. I have seen several play very well...Troy Smith and Johnson being two I would rather have than Batch.

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
11-26-2012, 11:10 AM
I don't think that you can judge Lefty's effectiveness based on his performance last week. After the first drive he was unable to throw due to injury.......

Now, if you want to say that he shouldn't be the backup because he is injury prone, then that is another story. ;)

BURGH86STEEL
11-26-2012, 11:20 AM
Yeah, I'm not buying it Pappy. It has nothing to do with 20/20 hindsight and more to do with smart planning. If you want to keep one savvy vet...great. But, holding onto Batch who turns like what 89 next week...instead of a young guy to develop makes zero sense. And I'm not buying into all these young guys not having what it takes. I have seen several play very well...Troy Smith and Johnson being two I would rather have than Batch.
This is a case of the other guy would be a better option. The facts show differently. Troy Smith or Johnson are not on NFL rosters.
Several teams don't carry a 3rd QB on the roster. The results would more the likely be the same regardless who came in as the 3rd QB for the Steelers. I don't recall a 3rd string QB coming in playing well, do you?

BURGH86STEEL
11-26-2012, 11:22 AM
Sorry Pap, but this fan here was smarter than the pundits on this one and has been calling for us to draft a QB to groom the past 3 drafts....I wanted John Skelton the one year. He seems like he would of been a good backup type QB.
Unless the Steelers draft a QB to groom in the first round the chances are slim that they will be able to draft a quality backup in the later rounds of the draft. John Skelton played as well as Batch and Leftwich. I don't see the Steelers drafting a QB in the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd round as long as Ben is the starter.

Bottom line on all of this is that there are not enough quality QB's to go around. It's really that simple.

Ghost
11-26-2012, 12:01 PM
But a first round QB is a crap-shoot as well. Pennington, Carr, Harrington, Ramsey, Leftwich, Boller, Grossman, Losman, Campbell, Young, Leinert, Russel, Quinn, Sanchez. Holy Yikes!!!!

Shawn
11-26-2012, 12:52 PM
This is a case of the other guy would be a better option. The facts show differently. Troy Smith or Johnson are not on NFL rosters.
Several teams don't carry a 3rd QB on the roster. The results would more the likely be the same regardless who came in as the 3rd QB for the Steelers. I don't recall a 3rd string QB coming in playing well, do you?

You are right...the other guys are better options than an ancient, noodle armed third stringer. Not developing a young guy so you can keep Batch shouldn't even be defended.

Shawn
11-26-2012, 12:55 PM
Unless the Steelers draft a QB to groom in the first round the chances are slim that they will be able to draft a quality backup in the later rounds of the draft. John Skelton played as well as Batch and Leftwich. I don't see the Steelers drafting a QB in the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd round as long as Ben is the starter.

Bottom line on all of this is that there are not enough quality QB's to go around. It's really that simple.

What round was Brady taken in? To say only Qbs in the first can be effective back ups is short sighted at best. So unless we draft a QBS in the first, we should just settle on a terrible ancient back up? Not buying it.

RuthlessBurgher
11-26-2012, 01:39 PM
In a given practice week, the backup QB gets minimal reps with the starters (like, single digits), and the 3rd QB gets none (he runs the scout team).

All things considered, you'd prefer to have backup QB's with NFL experience, because if your QB gets injured, they will be entering the game with very few practice reps with the starters (if any) that week.

It would be one thing if Jerrod Johnson had a strong preseason and Leftwich and Batch stunk up the joint, but that wasn't the case. Here are the preseason stats:

Leftwich: 8-13, 61.5%, 119 yards, 3 TD, 0 INT
Batch: 18-24, 75.0%, 186 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT
Johnson: 14-21, 66.7% 236 yards, 2 TD, 0 INT

All of those guys had impressive preseasons, but Leftwich and Batch had more experience (and therefore wouldn't require a ton of reps during the week like Johnson would to progress), plus Johnson tended to play the latest in the preseason games, where the talent he was playing against was the poorest overall.

BURGH86STEEL
11-26-2012, 02:06 PM
You are right...the other guys are better options than an ancient, noodle armed third stringer. Not developing a young guy so you can keep Batch shouldn't even be defended.

The results would more then likely be the same with any 2nd or 3rd string QB. If you don't believe in the percentages go take a look at the back up QB's around the league and how they perform when called upon. The %'s are against you in that regard. Some teams think so much of a third QB that they don't carry one on the 53 man roster.

BURGH86STEEL
11-26-2012, 02:15 PM
What round was Brady taken in? To say only Qbs in the first can be effective back ups is short sighted at best. So unless we draft a QBS in the first, we should just settle on a terrible ancient back up? Not buying it.

Brady was a once in a a hundred year phenomenon. Some would suggest Brady was a miracle of epic proportion.

It's not so short sighted when one actually pays attention to the past and what's out there at the QB position. Most 2nd and 3rd string QB's marginal to terrible players. If they were better players they would be starters in the league. Why is that so difficult to understand? If it was easy to find a Tom Brady in the 6th round of the draft every team would have one waiting in the wings.

RuthlessBurgher
11-26-2012, 02:17 PM
If it was easy to find a Tom Brady in the 6th round of the draft every team would have one waiting in the wings.

I want to add the "except the Browns" zinger, but I'm finding it difficult to do so after yesterday.

Shawn
11-26-2012, 02:54 PM
In a given practice week, the backup QB gets minimal reps with the starters (like, single digits), and the 3rd QB gets none (he runs the scout team).

All things considered, you'd prefer to have backup QB's with NFL experience, because if your QB gets injured, they will be entering the game with very few practice reps with the starters (if any) that week.

It would be one thing if Jerrod Johnson had a strong preseason and Leftwich and Batch stunk up the joint, but that wasn't the case. Here are the preseason stats:

Leftwich: 8-13, 61.5%, 119 yards, 3 TD, 0 INT
Batch: 18-24, 75.0%, 186 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT
Johnson: 14-21, 66.7% 236 yards, 2 TD, 0 INT

All of those guys had impressive preseasons, but Leftwich and Batch had more experience (and therefore wouldn't require a ton of reps during the week like Johnson would to progress), plus Johnson tended to play the latest in the preseason games, where the talent he was playing against was the poorest overall.

I buy that...except for the 3rd stringer. That is where you usually have the luxury of keeping a younger guy to develop. Keeping Batch has proven to serve no purpose other than keeping a younger more athletic guy from this squad.

steelz09
11-26-2012, 03:03 PM
Unless the Steelers draft a QB to groom in the first round the chances are slim that they will be able to draft a quality backup in the later rounds of the draft. John Skelton played as well as Batch and Leftwich. I don't see the Steelers drafting a QB in the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd round as long as Ben is the starter.

Bottom line on all of this is that there are not enough quality QB's to go around. It's really that simple.

Sorry but I'm not buying what you're selling. You don't need a 1st, 2nd or 3rd rounder to be a legit backup.

steelz09
11-26-2012, 03:08 PM
It's easy to blame the organization with 20/20 hindsight. Coming out of training camp many NFL pundits believed that the Steelers backup quarterback situation was as good as it gets in the NFL. The past two weekends have proven differently, there's no way to determine who will or won't perform, but the things you look for in a backup quarterback are experience in game situations and some one that can manage a game successfully. The Steelers believed they had that in Leftwich (a former starter) and Batch (old reliable). You can't assume that a player will get injured, regardless of what we believe as armchair GMs.

The Ravens have Tyrod Taylor as their backup. Is he winning any games if Flacco gets injured? Doubtful How about Bruce Gradkowski or Colt McCoy? Highly unlikely

How Graham Harrell? Exactly, who you say, he backs up Aaron Rogers
Like McCown? Matt Ryan's backup
TJ Yates? Doubtful

Every team is in the same place with backup quarterbacks, it's someone that can finish a game and not lose it. If the backup has to play more than two or three games the season is finished for that team. You can't win in the NFL if only 2 of the 3 facets of the game are functioning at an NFL caliber level. Right now would I liked to have had Jerrod Johnson or Hoyer from the beginning? Of course, but coming out of training camp I believed the Steelers to be in a sound position should they need to play a couple games without Ben. Leftwich and Batch have proven otherwise, but there's no way of knowing that in August and September, IMO.

Pappy

I would take Yates or McCown. If you remember, the Packers backup signed a huge deal with Seattle to become the starter. Instead, they decided to go with Russell Wilson.

Gradkowski? Well, he was good enough to torch the Steelers D a few years back. McCoy? I'd take him over our backups any day.

steelz09
11-26-2012, 03:13 PM
This is a case of the other guy would be a better option. The facts show differently. Troy Smith or Johnson are not on NFL rosters.
Several teams don't carry a 3rd QB on the roster. The results would more the likely be the same regardless who came in as the 3rd QB for the Steelers. I don't recall a 3rd string QB coming in playing well, do you?

Your acting like GMs never make any mistakes.

So, Johnson isn't on a NFL roster for a reason. For the same reason's Brady lasted to the 7th round? For the same reasons Harrison was cut SEVERAL times? For the same reasons, Kurt Warner was bagging groceries?

SidSmythe
11-26-2012, 03:16 PM
Who really wins with their 3rd QB??

I really doubt Josh Johnson is the answer. A veteran is your only hope unless you have a good prospect waiting in the wings. Josh Johnson is NOT that guy.

BURGH86STEEL
11-26-2012, 03:42 PM
Sorry but I'm not buying what you're selling. You don't need a 1st, 2nd or 3rd rounder to be a legit backup.

I guess that depends on how one defines a legit backup. The Steelers believed they had legit backups. People will often say they prefer this player or that player until that guys steps into the line up to play. Similar to when fans were clamoring for Batch to play when Leftwich played last week. This week, people think the guys that are no longer in the NFL would be better options, go figure.

The problem that exists is fan's expectations are often unrealistic. All someone needs to do is take a look at the backup QB's in the league to be brought back to reality. Many were given the opportunity to be number 1's at some point of their careers. Here is a list of the backup QB's before the season starter.
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/football/nfl/story/2012/09/13/sp-nfl-backups-quarterbacks-rankings.html

Chadman
11-26-2012, 06:13 PM
Being honest here, Leftwich is a fine back-up QB. He didn't do anything to lose the game last week, and if he hadn't been injured, Chadman is willing to bet he'd have beaten the Browns. Having a 31 year old Leftwich to back-up Ben is not a bad situation to be in.

Batch is more questionable. But instead of looking at it as a question of HOW did Charlie get a roster spot- maybe we should ask WHY Charlie retained a roster spot? It's not for his ability to play- that is obvious (although his pre-season stats were quite decent, and history has shown him to be a decent spot guy). But we all know that Charlie is a suedo-mentor to Ben on the sideline. His value is more in his ability to pass information onto Ben on the sideline, offer assistance, guidance- that sort of thing. We've SEEN this at work- how many times do we see Charlie in Ben's ear during a game?

Troy Smith looked like he never stood a chance of making the roster. Johnson, however, was a popular pre-season guy. Maybe the Steelers should have stashed him on the PS?

ikestops85
11-26-2012, 06:38 PM
I was hoping they would keep Johnson on the roster and let Batch be a coach/player to be signed if needed. I still think the criticism of Batch, and Leftwich for that matter, based on one game is not fair.

papillon
11-26-2012, 07:23 PM
Sorry Pap, but this fan here was smarter than the pundits on this one and has been calling for us to draft a QB to groom the past 3 drafts....I wanted John Skelton the one year. He seems like he would of been a good backup type QB.

Occasionally we all get something right (the blind squirrel and nut rule). Having Skelton around would have been great, I doubt he would have wanted to be Ben's backup for a decade. Someone mentioned Troy Smith, really? Leftwich would have been fine if not for the freak injury when hi tripped and fell. He managed to get through the game taking big hits and continuing to play. The hits aren't what did him in.

Leftwich can win games in the NFL for the Steelers with the defense playing well right now. Batch can not and I'm with everyone on this one he should have been let go and JJ kept on the roster, IMO. No other team would pick him up and he would be there in a pinch for the Steelers.

They had the guy they believed could handle a few games (Leftwich) and the guy to finish a game if necessary and nothing more (Batch). It just didn't work out.

Pappy

steelz09
11-26-2012, 08:13 PM
You have two injury prone players in Batch and Leftwich. Add in the fact that Ben is also injury prone and all of this makes no sense.

If someone sneezes on Leftwich, he gets injury. Batch is about the same.

Slapstick
11-26-2012, 08:35 PM
I would take Yates or McCown. If you remember, the Packers backup signed a huge deal with Seattle to become the starter. Instead, they decided to go with Russell Wilson.

Gradkowski? Well, he was good enough to torch the Steelers D a few years back. McCoy? I'd take him over our backups any day.

I would also take Colt McCoy...especially with this Todd Haley offense that emphasizes short throws with the occasional deep pass...

BradshawsHairdresser
11-26-2012, 08:37 PM
Kordell's kicking himself for retiring a few weeks too soon...:D