Time to move on.

[lloydroid]

I couldn't believe Clark admitted that when Troy gets hurt, the entire mental state of the defense is in shambles. If this is the case, then it's time to move on. Plus, what is Troy scheduled to make next year? If
he can't stay healthy, then don't drag the entire future of the team down. I am so sick of it. Look at McClendon as an example: Not high profile at all. He was an undrafted free agent out of Troy, for cripes sake. And yet, as we see, when you allow players to develop - and don't just hold on to vets playing time for too long - you will replenish the players. But you don't do that when holding on too long to over 30 vets who can't stay healthy; you have to move on. McClendon is obvious much more of a force than Hampton; but we would never know that if they endlessly held onto just playing CH. Time to move on from TP. Time to move to replace Foote. Time to shake the trees and find better CBs than we have. I am not saying so much this season, but certainly after it. Also, Worild showed he might be worth getting on the field more. I am just so sick of the "Steeler way" of not letting young players on the field and seeing what they can do. DL is so over the top with his "vets play only" BS. It's holding the team's development back, big time. Look at all the $ and time wasted on Aaron Smith, for cripe's sake. That is an example of futility. Get disciplined or get lost. Or should we see if we can add Kirkland, Chad Scott, Steed, Gildon, etc. to the roster while we are at it?

Fact is, Clark admitted when Troy gets hurt, the mindset of the D gets depressed. That's great. Let's get more of that going.

[flippy]

That was code for no one trusts Mundy.

[Slapstick]

Right. Get rid of a player that can still play well and commands the respect of the offense because the rest of the defense feels the absence of a DPOY and an all-time great...

[hawaiiansteel]

Polamalu ruled out for Titans game

By Alan Robinson
Published: Monday, October 8, 2012

Troy Polamalu will miss the Steelers’ quick turnaround game Thursday at Tennessee after aggravating the right calf injury that kept him out of two of the team’s first three games.

Polamalu was one of three injured Steelers to return for the 16-14 win Sunday over Philadelphia, but he lasted less than a quarter before reinjuring the calf while driving Eagles receiver Jason Avant out of bounds. Polamalu first injured the calf last season and then reinjured it in the season-opening game in Denver. Running back Rashard Mendenhall (knee) and linebacker James Harrison (knee) played the full game, the first time they have played this season.

“We will evaluate him when we get back from Tennessee,” coach Mike Tomlin said.

Tomlin said outside linebacker LaMarr Woodley’s hamstring injury is not as severe as Polamalu’s, but he is unlikely to play Thursday. Tomlin would not rule Woodley out but, with only three full days between games, it is uncommon for players to return so quickly with such an injury for a Thursday game.

This is the first season the NFL has played a Thursday game during nearly every week of the season. In recent seasons, the Thursday night schedule didn’t begin until midseason and did not involve every team. All 32 NFL teams are playing in a Thursday game or the equivalent this season.

The Steelers (2-2) have played at least one Thursday night game every season since 2006, going 7-1 with the only loss coming at Cleveland in 2009. They are 8-5 overall in Thursday night games dating to 1980.

http://triblive.com/sports/2738139-85/game-thursday-season-polamalu-played-calf-games-injury-steelers-tomlin#ixzz28jB3sog3

[lloydroid]

Right. Get rid of a player that can still play well and commands the respect of the offense because the rest of the defense feels the absence of a DPOY and an all-time great...

I don't know a single player who "plays well and commands respect" from the bench. And Clark came out and admitted than when TP goes down, it negatively effects the D's mental state. I'd rather have them just not have the possibility (likelihood) of the D's mentality sinking when TP limps off the field. By the way, I never said to get him off team in midseason, but if this continues, I see no reason to bring him back, other than likely disappointment and a giant waste of cap space. Let's not forgot: This is the same calf injury that he had LAST YEAR. So after all these months, he's still not recovered? Mendy blew an ACL and he is already back in form. Dear God, what the poo poo is wrong with you, Polamalu?

I'd rather take my chances with a young, aggressive team, who has some chance to staying healthy, then hanging on to once-great retreads. That is _NOT_ the formula for success in the NFL. They need to go back to the formula where you RARELY sign a player to a new deal when they are in their 30s. This is not sustainable.

[SidSmythe]

Yeah lets cut him so we don't have to put Ryan Clark on Anti-Depresant Meds!!

[Steelgal]

I'm sure if you asked the offensive line how they'd feel if Ben got hurt and was out you'd get a similar response. Well, they may not come out and say it, but I'm sure they'd be thinking it. Troy is to the defense, what Ben is to the offense. I'm sure you'd get a similar response if you asked Rats players on how big of an impact it would be to lose Ray Lewis. Some players are more instrumental to their teams than others.

[lloydroid]

I'm sure if you asked the offensive line how they'd feel if Ben got hurt and was out you'd get a similar response. Well, they may not come out and say it, but I'm sure they'd be thinking it. Troy is to the defense, what Ben is to the offense. I'm sure you'd get a similar response if you asked Rats players on how big of an impact it would be to lose Ray Lewis. Some players are more instrumental to their teams than others.

Only things that's wrong with your comparisons is that Ben, Lewis, etc. don't miss endless games. Troy is a China doll at this point, and putting your hopes on him playing puts the team in position for a bummed out mindset. Might as well just move on and find our next wave of players who can contribute, such as McClendon has provided at NT. I am sick of the "Steeler way" with making players sit forever, while old dudes do nothing but get hurt again, or stink.

[Dee Dub]

Major over-reaction here. Troy played in all 16 games last year. When healthy he is a game changer and one of the best players in the game. But you want to cut him? Wow!

[SteelBucks]

That was code for no one trusts Mundy.

I'd rather play with ten on defense than have Mundy out there. (I'm only partially kidding)

[SS Laser]

In a way it is time to move on. Troy is a great player still but is fast becoming old. It is time for the steelers D to relearn how to play winning football without Troy. Which should help ease some of the pain when he does not get resigned or hangs it up himself. They will never replace Troy. So it is time to figure out if the face of this defence can be the ILB's or maybe even Dline. Can Spence and Timmons be special? Or will it take another 1st or 2nd rd ILB and a rotation of players to be special. I still have high hopes that the Dline could be great. I think that is/was the idea with the high draft picks. The next 2 or 3 years will be interesting with the steelers D. Heck the Ravens are in the same trouble with Reed and Ray.

[NW Steeler]

Well the future SS is not on the current roster, so all this hand-wringing right now doesn't do much good. If Troy is able to play he is obviously our best option. When the season is over and we start talking 2013 draft, we can start talking about a future SS. That said, calling Troy a retread is not very accurate.

[BURGH86STEEL]

It's a good thing that the Steeler's organization has more patience then fans. The organization understands that injuries are part of the game. It's unfortunate that Troy can't play right now. I don't think Troys career is over yet and neither should anyone else.

[NW Steeler]

It's a good thing that the Steeler's organization has more patience then fans. The organization understands that injuries are part of the game. It's unfortunate that Troy can't play right now. I don't think Troys career is over yet and neither should anyone else.

Agreed. And even if they draft an heir-apparent, he'll be 2 years away from starting.

[Iron Shiek]

I agree steel bucks. He's worthless.

[Oviedo]

I'd rather play with ten on defense than have Mundy out there. (I'm only partially kidding)

What is really troublesome is how bad is Will Allen that he can't push or provide an option to Mundy????????

Of course we know none of the young guys would ever get a chance to even play a few series. Therein lies part of the problem of why we are so unprepared for the end of Troy's career and therefore must rely on Mundy.

[NorthCoast]

I couldn't believe Clark admitted that when Troy gets hurt, the entire mental state of the defense is in shambles. If this is the case, then it's time to move on. Plus, what is Troy scheduled to make next year? If
he can't stay healthy, then don't drag the entire future of the team down. I am so sick of it. Look at McClendon as an example: Not high profile at all. He was an undrafted free agent out of Troy, for cripes sake. And yet, as we see, when you allow players to develop - and don't just hold on to vets playing time for too long - you will replenish the players. But you don't do that when holding on too long to over 30 vets who can't stay healthy; you have to move on. McClendon is obvious much more of a force than Hampton; but we would never know that if they endlessly held onto just playing CH. Time to move on from TP. Time to move to replace Foote. Time to shake the trees and find better CBs than we have. I am not saying so much this season, but certainly after it. Also, Worild showed he might be worth getting on the field more. I am just so sick of the "Steeler way" of not letting young players on the field and seeing what they can do. DL is so over the top with his "vets play only" BS. It's holding the team's development back, big time. Look at all the $ and time wasted on Aaron Smith, for cripe's sake. That is an example of futility. Get disciplined or get lost. Or should we see if we can add Kirkland, Chad Scott, Steed, Gildon, etc. to the roster while we are at it?

Fact is, Clark admitted when Troy gets hurt, the mindset of the D gets depressed. That's great. Let's get more of that going.

Fact is the Steelers have done remarkably well at retaining or letting talent go when they thought their time was done. Another team might get a year out of a player, but that's about it. Faneca, Porter, Brown, the only one they missed on was Rod Woodson, who could have been a great safety for the Steelers.
And character-wise Troy seems the type that would retire if he thought he couldn't contribute at a high level anymore.

[lloydroid]

Well the future SS is not on the current roster, so all this hand-wringing right now doesn't do much good. If Troy is able to play he is obviously our best option. When the season is over and we start talking 2013 draft, we can start talking about a future SS. That said, calling Troy a retread is not very accurate.

I never advocated to make any moves now. This season is this season, we have little wiggle room. But after this season? Unless there is evidence that TP is some how magically healthy for the long haul, we got to make a move. Say good bye to TP, Big Snack, Colon, Foote.....they better not F up like that did with Kirkland, Steed, Gildon, Scott, Stewart...that was a major crapping of the pants then and repeating the same kind of "hold on to old guys and paying them way too much" will kill us for the next few years too.

[lloydroid]

Fact is the Steelers have done remarkably well at retaining or letting talent go when they thought their time was done. Another team might get a year out of a player, but that's about it. Faneca, Porter, Brown, the only one they missed on was Rod Woodson, who could have been a great safety for the Steelers.
And character-wise Troy seems the type that would retire if he thought he couldn't contribute at a high level anymore.

Pgh has done amazing on knowing when to let players go - not perfect - but very well. But you did forget at least one other: Kevin Greene. He had 3 good years left, but they had Gildon in the wings, who did have some good years, considering he is the all-time sack leader of the team.

[birtikidis]

I would think the offense would go into the same mentallity if Ben went down

[lloydroid]

What is really troublesome is how bad is Will Allen that he can't push or provide an option to Mundy????????

Of course we know none of the young guys would ever get a chance to even play a few series. Therein lies part of the problem of why we are so unprepared for the end of Troy's career and therefore must rely on Mundy.

One may argue that you can't prepare for every hole in the dike, but, regardless, it seems the team fell too in love with every old guy they got and didn't do enough to prepare for their absence. You know damn well there is a love affair between Troy, DL and Tomlin, and they weren't about to insult him my bringing in a high draft pick for his position. In hindsight, our top 4 picks are likely to do little or nothing (Maybe DeCastro will end up helping) and Rainey is looking like he didn't deserve to be taken any higher than when he was (I know many of us thought he was a steal in the 5th, but so far, not so much.)

[lloydroid]

Agreed. And even if they draft an heir-apparent, he'll be 2 years away from starting.

He doesn't have to be; only in the tricky Dick system does it take 10 years to know how to play in the system.

[SteelCrazy]

Worilds showed how easy it is to sack an unsuspecting QB when left unblocked. Other than that Worilds didnt show me a thing.

[Shoe]

I am just so sick of the "Steeler way" of not letting young players on the field and seeing what they can do. DL is so over the top with his "vets play only" BS. It's holding the team's development back, big time.

Let's not see the forest for the trees... the "Steeler way" (since LeBeau's been a part of the team, basically since '92) has kept us relevant for basically 20 years straight. Yeah, we had a couple down seasons in there. I doubt any other team, over the last 20 years, can match our winning consistency. So that "way" has merit. You cannot argue with success.

[lloydroid]

Let's not see the forest for the trees... the "Steeler way" (since LeBeau's been a part of the team, basically since '92) has kept us relevant for basically 20 years straight. Yeah, we had a couple down seasons in there. I doubt any other team, over the last 20 years, can match our winning consistency. So that "way" has merit. You cannot argue with success.

Using that logic, one could say Green Bay should stay with the "Green Bay way" from the 1950s through 60s and use it from the 1970s on. At some point the "way" becomes outdated. It used to be, the best "way" to get around was a horse buggy.

[Shoe]

Using that logic, one could say Green Bay should stay with the "Green Bay way" from the 1950s through 60s and use it from the 1970s on. At some point the "way" becomes outdated. It used to be, the best "way" to get around was a horse buggy.

No because what you are talking about is Dick Lebeau and his adherence to veteran players. Lebeau has basically been with this team since Cowher took over. Green Bay has had a number of regimes come and go through the years, so different philosophies. And besides, they were sorry for basically a couple of decades in their (70's and 80's) so why adher at that point.

The Steelers have been amazingly consistent over Lebeau's tenure, in which he gives vets preferential treatment. Unless you can cite some systemic rule change or something (e.g. adhering to a running game when passing rules changed in the late 90's), why should he change his philosophy now?

[stopplayn]

I'm sure if you asked the offensive line how they'd feel if Ben got hurt and was out you'd get a similar response. Well, they may not come out and say it, but I'm sure they'd be thinking it. Troy is to the defense, what Ben is to the offense. I'm sure you'd get a similar response if you asked Rats players on how big of an impact it would be to lose Ray Lewis. Some players are more instrumental to their teams than others.

I highly doubt that. They have won before without Ben. Not so much without Troy. Troy is the BEST SS in the NFL. Might be the best all time. I believe he is better than Lott. Ben is not the best QB in the league nor the best of all time. I think the Steeler players regard Troy Polamalu higher than Ben and this statement proves it. The NFL players (Those who play against us) certainly regard Troy the highest among Steelers, even Deebo and rightfully so.

[hawaiiansteel]

He doesn't have to be; only in the tricky Dick system does it take 10 years to know how to play in the system.

don't exaggerate, it only takes 8 years...:smile:

[NW Steeler]

Worilds showed how easy it is to sack an unsuspecting QB when left unblocked. Other than that Worilds didnt show me a thing.


Gildon V2.

[lloydroid]

No because what you are talking about is Dick Lebeau and his adherence to veteran players. Lebeau has basically been with this team since Cowher took over. Green Bay has had a number of regimes come and go through the years, so different philosophies. And besides, they were sorry for basically a couple of decades in their (70's and 80's) so why adher at that point.

The Steelers have been amazingly consistent over Lebeau's tenure, in which he gives vets preferential treatment. Unless you can cite some systemic rule change or something (e.g. adhering to a running game when passing rules changed in the late 90's), why should he change his philosophy now?

The staying with vets things didn't work when they kept Kirkland, Gildon, Scott, Steed etc. in the 90s. They are approaching that same situation now. If you don't learn from history you are doomed to repeat it. They admitted, back in those days, that a bunch of older guys got big contracts and then everyone pretty much got lazy and we had some bad seasons.

[lloydroid]

Gildon V2.

He wishes he was Gildon V2. Gildon has the all-time sack record for the franchise. I am going to make a bold prediction and say Worilds won't ever reach half that production in his career.

[lloydroid]

don't exaggerate, it only takes 8 years...:smile:

In today's game, you need production from younger players; you don't have 3 years to wait. The only time Pgh gets production from young guys is when they are FORCED into it (ala Ben). I know you are kidding but the trend ticks me off.

[ikestops85]

I love all this crap some of you folks like to throw around about players sitting on the bench and learning. You are the same folks who would call for the youngsters head after 2 games if they hadn't played like superstars. You'd be calling them a bust and complaining about the bad picks Tomlin and Cobert are making. You need to get some patience.

I'm sorry but our defensive scheme requires our players to perform specific tasks for it to work. Younger players are known for making mistakes. Isn't this what Foote just said about the system? That you have to trust it.

:tt2:tt2

[RuthlessBurgher]

Just for the record, who are the young players on defense that are being held back right now?

In the secondary, Keenan Lewis is starting, Cortez Allen is on the field for at least half the defensive snaps as the nickle corner, and Mundy has been in the lineup at FS or SS for 15 out of the 16 quarters so far this season (either Troy or Clark has been out for all but the first quarter against the Eagles). Curtis Brown and DeMarcus Van Dyke are contributing on special teams.

At linebacker, Chris Carter and Jason Worilds have had to fill in at OLB for 15 out of the 16 quarters so far this season (either Harrison or Woodley has been out for all but the first quarter against the Eagles). Sylvester finally saw his first action of the year this weekend following an injury, and Spence is already on I.R. for the season.

On the d-line, Hood is a starter, McLendon is rotating in with Hampton, and Heyward is rotating in with Keisel. The only young player on our roster not getting any playing time whatsoever is Alameda Ta-Amu, who has been a healthy scratch in every game so far.

Seems to me that it has been an "all hands on deck" mentality, with even the young guys contributing, not being held back on the sidelines.

[hawaiiansteel]

posted by Dale Lolley

TUESDAY, OCTOBER 09, 2012


@ On the subject of Polamalu, it's ridiculous that some are ready to jettison one of the team's greatest players.

"He's too injury-prone, blah, blah, blah," the critics say.

I pretty much tune them out when they start that garbage.

Last I checked, Polamalu played all 16 games in 2011. He played 14 games in 2010, when he won the NFL Defensive Player of the Year award.

Yes, he missed 11 games in 2009, but really, that was the exception, not the norm.

This is a player who is as special as any man who has ever put on a uniform, not just for the Steelers, but for any team.

He'll go out on his own terms. And he will be back this season and will again be a difference maker.

In fact, many of the same bozos saying this is the end for Polamalu were probably the same people saying the Steelers should release Mendenhall.

Polamalu's all-out style of play is going to lead to an injury here or there. But he's still one of the biggest difference makers in the league.

http://www.observer-reporter.com/or/sidelines/