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hawaiiansteel
06-13-2012, 06:05 PM
Steelers' Rooney on Wallace: 'He should be here'

June 13, 2012
By Gerry Dulac / Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

http://profootballzone.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/mike-wallace1.jpg

Steelers president Art Rooney II has a message for Pro Bowl wide receiver Mike Wallace, who is absent from the team's three-day minicamp.

"He should be here," Rooney said today after the team concluded its morning workout.

The Steelers have until Friday to either reduce or pull the one-year, $2.7 million offer they tendered Wallace as a restricted free agent. The team is not expected to do that, though, and will continue to try to sign him to a long-term contract.

However, there has been little, if any, movement in negotiations.

Coach Mike Tomlin said he isn't worried about Wallace missing the conditioning aspect of the offseason training activities and minicamp. But he also said he would prefer that his fourth-year receiver be here with the rest of his teammates.

"Mike has always been guy who's in tip top condition over a 12-month calendar since we had him," Tomlin said. "He's a sharp guy. I'm sure he's working at the learning element of it. But there's no substitute for being here and being around your teammates and learning the nuances and learning from other people's mistakes."

"It's probably short-term misery. Hopefully there will be some closure to this and it will be in our rear view mirror. Right now, he'd be better served if he were here working."

http://www.post-gazette.com/stories/sports/steelers/rooney-on-wallace-he-should-be-here-640189/#ixzz1xhoBQMAm

squidkid
06-13-2012, 06:19 PM
reduce that tender ASAP!!!!

steelz09
06-13-2012, 06:22 PM
It's that damn lawyer speaking again. :stirpot

Crash
06-13-2012, 06:26 PM
He's a free agent Mr. II. He doesn't have to sign.

So STFU and get to work on the negotiations.

Slapstick
06-13-2012, 06:30 PM
He's a free agent Mr. II. He doesn't have to sign.



He does if he wants to enter free agency...

Crash
06-13-2012, 06:33 PM
He does if he wants to enter free agency...

Not true, the Steelers could tag him.

flippy
06-13-2012, 06:34 PM
If I were the Steelers, I'd reduce the tender and try to extend Brown and Sanders first.

Crash
06-13-2012, 06:36 PM
Yeah play hardball. That's the ticket.

Slapstick
06-13-2012, 06:38 PM
Not true, the Steelers could tag him.

If he sits out the entire season, the Steelers won't even need to tag him...they can just tender him again...

Crash
06-13-2012, 06:42 PM
If he sits out the entire season, the Steelers won't even need to tag him...they can just tender him again...

He's not going to sit all year, he'll show up at the last possible week, sign his tender, and get credit for the season.

So they either tag him, or they let him go.

squidkid
06-13-2012, 06:46 PM
let him go. ben cant throw deep enough to get him the ball in stride anyways. wallace's deep speed isnt really a benefit with a week arm.

Slapstick
06-13-2012, 06:51 PM
Or, if he drops the passes that do hit him...

squidkid
06-13-2012, 06:52 PM
Or, if he drops the passes that do hit him...

true............

phillyesq
06-13-2012, 06:54 PM
He's a free agent Mr. II. He doesn't have to sign.

So STFU and get to work on the negotiations.

You always demand context and that we listen to the whole interview when you are defending a statement made by Ben. For the sake of consistency, I would expect the same from you in this situation.

Also, ARII does not handle contract negotations. I'm sure he has to give ultimate approval (and, since it's his team, that is certainly reasonable) but this is the realm of Kahn and Colbert.

squidkid
06-13-2012, 07:27 PM
He's a free agent Mr. II. He doesn't have to sign.

So STFU and get to work on the negotiations.

the contract is done. all wallace has to do is sign it

Crash
06-13-2012, 07:27 PM
That's not a contract, that's an offer sheet.

Crash
06-13-2012, 07:31 PM
You always demand context and that we listen to the whole interview when you are defending a statement made by Ben. For the sake of consistency, I would expect the same from you in this situation

Saying that a free agent "should be here" is wrong. He shouldn't say that when all Wallace is doing is exercising right as a free agent per the CBA agreement. What he should say is "I understand the business side of this process, we hope to have Mike back with us soon".

Art II doesn't handle most PLAYER contracts. But he was the reason Bill Cowher quit after 2006.

squidkid
06-13-2012, 07:33 PM
That's not a contract, that's an offer sheet.

im not talking about the tender. im talking about the contract offer that wallace is refusuing to take.

Slapstick
06-13-2012, 07:45 PM
Saying that a free agent "should be here" is wrong. He shouldn't say that when all Wallace is doing is exercising right as a free agent per the CBA agreement. What he should say is "I understand the business side of this process, we hope to have Mike back with us soon".

Art II doesn't handle most PLAYER contracts. But he was the reason Bill Cowher quit after 2006.

If the negotiations are in good faith, why shouldn't Wallace be there?

Showing up would be taking the high road...

Crash
06-13-2012, 07:50 PM
If the negotiations are in good faith, why shouldn't Wallace be there?

Showing up would be taking the high road...

He has to sign the tender. He can't show up unsigned like DeCastro can.

Slapstick
06-13-2012, 07:55 PM
He has to sign the tender. He can't show up unsigned like DeCastro can.

So, if he signs the tender, is he then not allowed to continue negotiations?

Crash
06-13-2012, 08:05 PM
So, if he signs the tender, is he then not allowed to continue negotiations?

If he signs the tender he looses his leverage. The Steelers can simply tell him we're not talking anymore, go play for the $2.7 you signed for.

Slapstick
06-13-2012, 08:09 PM
The Steelers can tell him that anyway...

Or, worse, they could say sign the $2.7 mil or we'll reduce it to 110% of last year...

RFA's don't have a lot of leverage to begin with...I guess I'd try catching some flies with honey...

We know that the Steelers don't blink...

steelz09
06-13-2012, 08:13 PM
The bottom line is II can say what he wants, when he wants, and doesn't really need to answer to nobody except the other "investors". He's the face of the franchise from a business/ownership perspective. Whether you like it or not, you need to live with it.

And for the record, Wallace should be there. I would be willing to bet he has a 'decent' offer sheet at a minimum. I might go a bit further and say he has a 'fair' offer sheet. If thats the case, and I bet it is, he should be there. You say it's not fair to play "hardball". Wallace wants to play hard ball by not showing up for minicamp when he needs to be there to learn the new offense. The Steelers organization has every right to play hard ball and reduce his tender.

Crash
06-13-2012, 08:18 PM
The Steelers can tell him that anyway...

Then he'll sit at home, report at the last possible time, play for 6 weeks, and either become a UFA or earn top 5 money for 2013.

Wallace holds the cards Slap.


We know that the Steelers don't blink..

They blinked for Hines in 2005, which is why Faneca left, and why this one could get ugly.

Crash
06-13-2012, 08:20 PM
The bottom line is II can say what he wants, when he wants, and doesn't really need to answer to nobody except the other "investors". He's the face of the franchise from a business/ownership perspective. Whether you like it or not, you need to live with it.

And for the record, Wallace should be there. I would be willing to bet he has a 'decent' offer sheet at a minimum. I might go a bit further and say he has a 'fair' offer sheet. If thats the case, and I bet it is, he should be there. You say it's not fair to play "hardball". Wallace wants to play hard ball by not showing up for minicamp when he needs to be there to learn the new offense. The Steelers organization has every right to play hard ball and reduce his tender.

He's a free agent and he has his playbook. Nothing else really matters at this point.

The Steelers had a new OC in 2004 and Plax missed mini-camp. Then he went out and averaged 19 yards a pop when he showed up.

steelz09
06-13-2012, 08:23 PM
He's a free agent and he has his playbook. Nothing else really matters at this point.

The Steelers had a new OC in 2004 and Plax missed mini-camp. Then he went out and averaged 19 yards a pop when he showed up.

Reading a playbook is not the same as executing it w/ your teammates on the field.

Crash
06-13-2012, 08:25 PM
Reading a playbook is not the same as executing it w/ your teammates on the field.

He's a veteran. He'll be fine the first week he and Ben hit the practice field.

steelz09
06-13-2012, 08:34 PM
He's a veteran. He'll be fine the first week he and Ben hit the practice field.

Whatever... I'd like to see Sanders, and Brown get signed instead of dropping 50 mil on Wallace. I also think Maze is going to turn out to be a player. Then, I hope Wallace has a down year while Brown and Sanders have great years causing Wallace to probably lose 10-15 mil on his next contract (if he doesn't signed long term this year). That'll teach him to play hard ball.

Slapstick
06-13-2012, 09:11 PM
Wallace has no cards. So, he sits out and gets overpaid by another team next year...That'll teach the Steelers...

Also, Hines reported to camp before negotiations continued on his contract...he didn't sign and then report afterward..

Crash
06-13-2012, 09:19 PM
Also, Hines reported to camp before negotiations continued on his contract...he didn't sign and then report afterward..

Um, Hines held out while having a SIGNED CONTRACT.

I know how the organization feels on the Hines issue. They felt they gave into Hines, and they vowed never to do it again.

Slapstick
06-13-2012, 09:22 PM
I know...

Then, he stopped holding out and renegotiated a new contract...

He didn't get the contract until he came to camp...

Blitz-en
06-13-2012, 09:32 PM
Saying that a free agent "should be here" is wrong. He shouldn't say that when all Wallace is doing is exercising right as a free agent per the CBA agreement. What he should say is "I understand the business side of this process, we hope to have Mike back with us soon".

Art II doesn't handle most PLAYER contracts. But he was the reason Bill Cowher quit after 2006.

I wish we would stop referring to Wallace as a free agent to meet our agendas on this board. The word "restricted" belongs in front of that term. Wallace signed on for that when he entered the league. That portion of the CBA was designed to give that advantage to the teams. So, Wallace is bound by the CBA. He SHOULD be in camp. And, the Steelers do hold the cards. They will win just fine without him. He can either get on board and enjoy the successes or watch them from home.

But, he should be referred to as a " restricted" free agent, because he does not have the luxuries of a free agent

Crash
06-13-2012, 09:38 PM
I know...

Then, he stopped holding out and renegotiated a new contract...

He didn't get the contract until he came to camp...

They negotiated with him, via communication, BEFORE he walked into Latrobe. First via phone, then he had a face to face with Dan Rooney in private. Which they never do.

And THEN he reported.

Oviedo
06-13-2012, 09:41 PM
If he signs the tender he looses his leverage. The Steelers can simply tell him we're not talking anymore, go play for the $2.7 you signed for.

Newsflash: Wallace has no leverage. The Steelers control him this year and next year if they want to. He has nothing. They will not hesitate to proceed without him but the only way he gets a new contract is on the Steelers terms not his. That is how it is done. The organization has dealt with this a hundred times and they have never come out on the short end. They won't this time either.

Wallace is just being a petulant child. All he is doing is not learning the new offense. He is not pressuring the Steelers, can't and never will.

Sugar
06-13-2012, 09:48 PM
I guess I don't see why Wallace "should" be there. Unless the team can do a real deal for the man, he needs to just wait it out until the last possible minute. He'll be ready to go in no time when he does show and it'll give the younger guys more reps.

Crash
06-13-2012, 09:49 PM
Yep. Where was all this venom when Hines held out? It was "Pay the man", even though he was already under contract.

Wake me up when Wallace implies that he has to sell drugs to make his living.

steelz09
06-13-2012, 09:57 PM
I guess I don't see why Wallace "should" be there. Unless the team can do a real deal for the man, he needs to just wait it out until the last possible minute. He'll be ready to go in no time when he does show and it'll give the younger guys more reps.

How about doing it because it's his job?! These guys PLAY a game. The key word is game. Personally, I wish all salaries for all professional sports would not exceed 1 mil / year because all of this is getting out of hand. They play a game!

I feel so, so bad for Wallace and all these professional "game" players ..... even if he signs his miserable tender (sarcasm), he'll still get paid over 5 times the salary of the President of the United States. Think about that for a second...

Sugar
06-13-2012, 10:03 PM
How about doing it because it's his job?! These guys PLAY a game. The key word is game. Personally, I wish all salaries for all professional sports would not exceed 1 mil / year because all of this is getting out of hand. They play a game!

I feel so, so bad for Wallace and all these professional "game" players ..... even if he signs his miserable tender (sarcasm), he'll still get paid over 5 times the salary of the President of the United States. Think about that for a second...

He's worth more than the President, but this isn't a political thread... ;)

It's not his job if he's not under contract. When he signs a contract, then it's his job.

I'm sorry if you have some kind of angst about this, but it's just business.

steelz09
06-13-2012, 10:07 PM
First of all.... you can be sarcastic about it but he's not worth more than the president. That's just idiotic to say and I hope your joking.

It is his job. Like someone else pointed out, it's part of the CBA. If he doesn't like the CBA, then he can leave professional sports like the rest of the world. Problem is, most of these professional sports players couldn't make it in the real world.

Slapstick
06-13-2012, 10:08 PM
It doesn't bother me personally that Wallace is not there...

But, I think his luck would be better if he signed the tender and showed up...

steelz09
06-13-2012, 10:22 PM
It doesn't bother me personally that Wallace is not there...

But, I think his luck would be better if he signed the tender and showed up...

I just hope they either get a deal worked out that good for both parties ... or he signs the tender or the Steelers sign Brown and Sanders and lower the tender on Wallace.

hawaiiansteel
06-13-2012, 10:25 PM
Has Mike Wallace Lost His “Creds”?

Wednesday, June 13th, 2012 by Christina L. Rivers


Credentials - that which entitles one to confidence, credit or authority; Evidence or testimonials concerning one's right to credit, confidence or authority (Merriam-Webster Dictionary).

Creds - Credentials earned in life by experience. Credit given. (UrbanDictionary.com)

We've all been following the ongoing saga of receiver Mike Wallace's professional football career. Some have been as hooked to the story as they are to Jersey Shore. With all the rumors and statements made by Wallace and others, the only question left is whether or not Wallace's actions and words have cost him his "creds".

Wallace possesses confidence. There is no real dispute there. In 2011 he appeared much more comfortable running routes and exhibited more of his true talent on the field.

Toward the end of the season, Wallace was seeing more teams using double-coverage on him. Opponents, knowing he has exceptional speed, created defensive packages meant to limit his receptions, especially ones for long yardage. As a result, Wallace's stats began to drop a bit and Antonio Brown's stats began to rise.

Let's not get too carried away, though. In September, Wallace was outperforming Brown with 21 receptions to ten; 377 yards to 156. In December, Wallace had 16 receptions for 243 yards and two touchdowns. Brown made 15 receptions for 311 yards and one touchdown. Those numbers aren't close enough to say that Brown "outplayed" Wallace by any means. Wallace was still putting up healthy numbers.

Give Wallace credit where credit is due. He has made some incredible catches. There were even a few that seemed to be aided by divine intervention. So far, Wallace has met two of the three 'qualities' that make up credentials. The last one is authority; and this may be where Wallace falters a bit.

When someone is an "authority", we generally deduce that that person is an expert in their field. In Wallace's case, it would include the football field; literally and figuratively. Professional football is as much about business as it is about sport. Players want to be fairly compensated for their play, efforts and the risks inherent to the game. Anyone in business expects a fair price for their goods and services.

Wallace's authority is questioned by some because he is rumored to have asked for a contract that paid more than Arizona Cardinals receiver Larry Fitzgerald's 8-year, $120 million deal. Others question the fact that Wallace has stated he will not sign the one-year tender the Steelers have offered him at nearly $2.75 million. Cian Fahey, another writer here at Steelers Depot, says Wallace will be "unreliable" in 2012 due to the fact that he'll most likely be forced to suit up for the Steelers...but will his heart be in it?

Is Wallace in the top-10 of all receivers in the National Football League today? Many 'burgh faithful may adamantly declare, "yes", but that may not be the case. There is a lot of room for interpretation here. Recently Hines Ward was on NFL Total Access and listed his top-10; he put Wallace at 10th place.

I am an avid Wallace fan. I also collect football cards ravenously. I currently have a Mike Wallace high-value rookie card (Upper Deck - Sweet Swatches #SSW-63) that has a piece of his Ole Miss jersey inserted into it that is certified by Richard P. McWilliam of the Upper Deck company. As part of my charitable works, I offered for people to bid on the card in order to give the proceeds to Big Brothers, Big Sisters. The effort was to help kids. I didn't receive a single offer. Not one bid.

This experience raised questions for me about how football fans see Wallace today. Has his stock dropped because of his post-season attitude and hold-out that has kept him out of OTAs and now mandatory mini-camp? Are fans jumping off the Wallace party bus?

Ike Taylor was on Trib Live radio in May with host John Harris. During the Ike Taylor Show, Taylor insisted that Wallace wants to be with the team and is frustrated, but "Mike feels like he outperformed his last contract. But he's dealing with a monster, and that's the Pittsburgh Steelers ... they are not going to let you dictate to them on how you feel." Taylor admitted that he told Wallace, "Mike, you know, we do need you and we would love to have you at least in the building. You don't have to do nothing because it's voluntary, but just your presence being around, you know, it could help or might speed up the process." According to Taylor, Wallace is frustrated by seeing a lot of guys receiving big contracts. Taylor told Wallace, "Football don't need you; you need football." (You can see the interview and read Dave Bryan's article about the show.)

Head coach Mike Tomlin said the Wallace deal is business and that he has talked to Wallace. "We had good communications. This process is going to run its course... It'll be a little short term misery, but it won't be significant in the grand scheme of things hopefully." Wallace did pick up his playbook and has been working out on his own. This is a testimonial that Wallace needed. Even Ben Roethlisberger has said that Wallace is a great player and that "(Wallace) needs to get his fair market value."

For Wallace to take over that authority part of his "creds", he is going to have to show (like Ike Taylor did in the past) that he understands that he needs the game as much or more than the cash. I'd love to see Wallace walk into training camp with a new outlook and complete credentials because he is faithful to his teammates, his team and puts his self-respect first over whatever he personally defines himself in dollars and cents.

To answer the question - no, Mike Wallace hasn't lost his "creds", but he's hurting them every day he waits to make a decision.

http://network.yardbarker.com/nfl/article_external/ben_roethlisberger_says_hes_not_going_to_change_hi s_game/11006321

Crash
06-13-2012, 10:27 PM
They aren't going to sign Brown AND Sanders before Sunday and lower the Wallace tender.

That's not reality.

steelz09
06-13-2012, 10:33 PM
They aren't going to sign Brown AND Sanders before Sunday and lower the Wallace tender.

That's not reality.

I don't care how they do it. All I'm saying is that I'd rather have a Brown and healthy Sanders and potentially an up and comer in Maze than a huge contract for Wallace and then lose everyone else (likely Brown AND Sanders).

Crash
06-13-2012, 10:37 PM
So you would rather have Brown, an injury riddled Sanders (Believe me, I'm not a football player but I know about bad feet and injuries), and undrafted Marquis Maze and let one of the premier deep threats in the NFL walk?

OK then....

steelz09
06-13-2012, 10:43 PM
So you would rather have Brown, an injury riddled Sanders (Believe me, I'm not a football player but I know about bad feet and injuries), and undrafted Marquis Maze and let one of the premier deep threats in the NFL walk?

OK then....

I guess the words "a healthy Sanders" was somehow confusing for you. I'm not sure how I can clear that one up.

But yes.. I think Maze is going to be a solid WR. And yes, I think Maze, Brown, a HEALTHY Sanders, and a comp 3rd rounder (if we lose wallace) will be greater than having Wallace and losing all of the above except Maze.

Crash
06-13-2012, 10:52 PM
I guess the words "a healthy Sanders" was somehow confusing for you. I'm not sure how I can clear that one up.

He'll have feet issues for the remainder of his career. Btw, he sat out the morning session today with a sore knee.

steelz09
06-13-2012, 10:55 PM
maybe, maybe not... that's an opinion so don't state it like a fact.

Crash
06-13-2012, 11:05 PM
maybe, maybe not... that's an opinion so don't state it like a fact.

Two words: Bill Walton.

BradshawsHairdresser
06-13-2012, 11:05 PM
I feel no ill-will toward Wallace if he decides to sit out. It's wrong for a player who is under contract to hold out, IMO, but that's not the case with him. Should he decide not to sign the $2.7 million one-year tender, he may lose a huge chunk of change this season, so it might not be the smartest move for him, but he's doing nothing wrong.

I don't expect it will take him long to catch up with the new offense once he reports. In spite of some of the noise we've heard, this isn't rocket science, it's football. And Wallace still has that one quality that most makes him a special receiver: speed.

Enjoy it while he's here. I think chances are, we'll have him here for this season, and the next, and then he'll be gone-- unless he makes a dramatic adjustment in his salary expectations. I just can't see the Steelers giving him Fitz money.

Crash
06-13-2012, 11:47 PM
If he stays away all year and then shows up just to get his season credit no way do they tag him. In fact, if he did that? They wouldn't even PLAY HIM when he came back, they'd pay him 5 weeks to sit at home and not be a distraction IMO.

hawaiiansteel
06-14-2012, 02:00 AM
Steelers' Wallace not at OTAs, needs a contract decision by Friday

June 13, 2012
The Sports Xchange

Mike Wallace isn't reporting to Steelers' minicamp this week, but he has another decision to make by Friday.

Wallace, a restricted free agent, has until the June 15 deadline to sign his one-year, $2.7 million offer. If he doesn't, the Steelers can reduce the offer by 110 percent to $577,500.

The tactic isn't mandatory but has been used in prominent holdout cases such as those involving Logan Mankins of the Patriots and Vincent Jackson of the Chargers in 2010. Both players responded by holding out into October before reporting in time to be on the roster for the six games required to earn an accrued season toward the six needed to become an unrestricted free agent.

Wallace's position is that he expects the Steelers to offer him a long-term contract before the start of the season. Pittsburgh's salary-cap situation might preclude a landmark deal in line signed by Lions' wide receiver Calvin Johnson (eight years, $132 million) in March.

The Steelers' leading receiver with 72 receptions for 1,193 yards and eight touchdowns last season, Wallace's production slowed over the second half of last season, when Antonio Brown was the most-targeted Steelers' receiver.

http://www.mcall.com/sports/football/mc-steelers-wallace-contract-0613-20120613,0,3230659.story

hawaiiansteel
06-14-2012, 03:47 AM
NFL Rumors: Pittsburgh Steelers Owner Art Rooney Not Happy With Mike Wallace

by Jeff Shull
June 14, 2012

http://rantsports.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/redzonetalk/files/2012/06/Mike-Wallace-Holding-Out-from-Camp.jpg

Pittsburgh Steelers star wide receiver Mike Wallace was slapped with the franchise tag this off season with the hopes that the two sides could eventually sign a long term contract. Well, that hasn’t happened yet and not only has Wallace refused to sign his tag, but he is holding out of Steelers mini-camp.

Their president, Art Rooney II, is not happy about it. “He should be here,” the disgruntled owner said recently. The Steelers can apparently cut the offer from $2.7 million to $2 million or remove it altogether this Friday, but the club is not likely to use either option.

Head coach Mike Tomlin is not too worried about the situation, and believes it will work itself out in the end like most do. Though he is critical of Wallace not being at camp.

“Mike has always been guy who’s in tip top condition over a 12-month calendar since we had him,” Tomlin said. “He’s a sharp guy. I’m sure he’s working at the learning element of it. But there’s no substitute for being here and being around your teammates and learning the nuances and learning from other people’s mistakes.”

The Steelers are a first class organization and Wallace is a fantastic player and key piece to their offense. He’ll likely get what he’s looking for, but when is the only question. Wallace has averaged 66 receptions, 1,225 yards and nine touchdowns over the past two seasons. He is one of the best deep-threats in the league and opens up the offense for Ben Roethlisberger.

http://network.yardbarker.com/nfl/article_external/nfl_rumors_pittsburgh_steelers_owner_art_rooney_no t_happy_with_mike_wallace/11008835

flippy
06-14-2012, 05:31 AM
I don't expect it will take him long to catch up with the new offense once he reports.

Rumor has it, Haley put one play in the playbook for Wallace. Go deep. Should be pretty easy to figure out.

On a side note, it makes it easier for Ben to remember too.

Jooser
06-14-2012, 09:06 AM
Rumor has it, Haley put one play in the playbook for Wallace. Go deep. Should be pretty easy to figure out.

On a side note, it makes it easier for Ben to remember too.

:lol: L M A O ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

phillyesq
06-14-2012, 11:13 AM
Saying that a free agent "should be here" is wrong. He shouldn't say that when all Wallace is doing is exercising right as a free agent per the CBA agreement. What he should say is "I understand the business side of this process, we hope to have Mike back with us soon".

Art II doesn't handle most PLAYER contracts. But he was the reason Bill Cowher quit after 2006.

Again, you demand context for anything that Ben says. What was the context of this statement? Did you listen to the interview? If not, basd on the standards that you articulate, you have no business addressing this comment.

RuthlessBurgher
06-14-2012, 03:49 PM
Two words: Bill Walton.

Walton was a foot taller than Sanders...I would think that it would be tougher for feet to heal if they are supporting someone as big as a Sasquatch as opposed to a little guy like Sanders.

Slapstick
06-14-2012, 04:31 PM
Walton was a foot taller than Sanders...I would think that it would be tougher for feet to heal if they are supporting someone as big as a Sasquatch as opposed to a little guy like Sanders.

Walton also played for, like 20+ years on a hard court...

Hopefully, grass and field turf won't be as damaging to the feet...

Crash
06-14-2012, 04:33 PM
Sanders will be fine. I have all the faith in the world in him. I also agree with Art II, Wallace needs to sign the tender and get to work.

Slapstick
06-14-2012, 04:34 PM
I like the new Crash!

He's as happy and cheerful as his "Dilfatar"...

Edited to add: Now his "Barneytar"

Sugar
06-14-2012, 05:07 PM
I feel no ill-will toward Wallace if he decides to sit out. It's wrong for a player who is under contract to hold out, IMO, but that's not the case with him. Should he decide not to sign the $2.7 million one-year tender, he may lose a huge chunk of change this season, so it might not be the smartest move for him, but he's doing nothing wrong.

I don't expect it will take him long to catch up with the new offense once he reports. In spite of some of the noise we've heard, this isn't rocket science, it's football. And Wallace still has that one quality that most makes him a special receiver: speed.

Enjoy it while he's here. I think chances are, we'll have him here for this season, and the next, and then he'll be gone-- unless he makes a dramatic adjustment in his salary expectations. I just can't see the Steelers giving him Fitz money.

I tend to agree with this line of thinking. Wallace is doing nothing wrong here. It's his career and he knows what the team is currently offering him- we don't.

hawaiiansteel
06-14-2012, 07:41 PM
Pittsburgh Steelers front office says WR Mike Wallace should be with team

June 14, 2012
By Eric Schmidt

Pittsburgh Steelers Mike Wallace might be “60 Minutes” on the field but his time is running out to sign his tender offer with the franchise. Wallace, seeking a long-term contract with the club was slapped with the franchise tag, a move which will pay the productive receiver $2.7 million this season. In Wallace’s eyes, that is not enough and he continues to refuse to sign his tender offer, staying away from all team offseason activities.

The standoff between the receiver and the Steelers has been well documented this offseason but it is now drawing the ire of Pittsburgh’s ownership. Steelers owner Art Rooney II told the Pittsburgh Post-Gazzette, “He should be here.”

If Wallace does not sign his tender offer by Friday, the Steelers have the right to reduce his offer by as much as $2 million dollars. The Steelers have been up against the salary cap for most of the offseason and while Wallace is reportedly desiring a Larry Fitzgerald, $100 million dollar contract, that doesn’t appear to be a reasonable option at this point.

Wallace has missed all the team’s offseason workouts and the Steelers have hired Todd Haley as the new offensive coordinator. Several players have said that they are struggling to learn Haley’s new system with QB Ben Roethlisberger claiming he is struggling with the verbiage. Wallace is behind the learning curve in the team’s new offense.

Head coach Mike Tomlin told the Post-Gazette that he didn’t believe Wallace would be out of shape however when he eventually returns to camp. “Mike has always been a guy who’s in tip top condition over a 12-month calendar since we had him. He’s a sharp guy. I’m sure he’s working at the learning element of it. But there’s no substitute for being here and being around your teammates and learning the nuances and learning from other people’s mistakes.”

http://network.yardbarker.com/nfl/article_external/pittsburgh_steelers_front_office_says_wr_mike_wall ace_should_be_with_team/11011442

squidkid
06-14-2012, 09:54 PM
does anybody but me think that maybe rooney means 'wallaces needs to be here' meaning that he has a better chance at coming to a contract agreement by being here instead of playingh hardball?

Oviedo
06-14-2012, 10:14 PM
does anybody but me think that maybe rooney means 'wallaces needs to be here' meaning that he has a better chance at coming to a contract agreement by being here instead of playingh hardball?

Anyone who knows anything about the Steelers should know that because they won't negotiate with someone trying to pressure them. They win these decisions and staying away accomplishes nothing. They will never set the example that this type of tactic works and they will play the season without Wallace in a heartbeat. That is exactly how these things should be handled.

RuthlessBurgher
06-15-2012, 11:10 AM
When Merriweather had a signed contract and held out, they would not negotiate with him. The team would not hold contract talks with a guy under contract who was holding out, and he refused to report, so there was a stalemate. They made him sit out the whole year, then traded him the next year.

When Hines had a signed contract and held out, they would not negotiate with him until he returned to camp. They worked out a new deal while he was in Latrobe working out with his teammates.

Wallace is not in this situation. He does not have a signed contract, so he does not need to report before the team will begin negotiations.

Crash
06-15-2012, 12:11 PM
When Hines had a signed contract and held out, they would not negotiate with him until he returned to camp. They worked out a new deal while he was in Latrobe working out with his teammates.

Not true. They negotiated by phone, and then Dan Rooney had a "sit down" with Hines at Latrobe Airport.

THEN he showed up to camp.

And the Steelers always felt they gave into Hines, and they said they would never give in to another player again.

flippy
06-15-2012, 12:14 PM
Not true. They negotiated by phone, and then Dan Rooney had a "sit down" with Hines at Latrobe Airport.

THEN he showed up to camp.

And the Steelers always felt they gave into Hines, and they said they would never give in to another player again.


[/COLOR]

Hines just happened to have some leverage.

We didn't have others like Brown, Cotchery, Sanders on the roster when Hines was holding out. We'd have probably had big problems without Hines. If Wallace doesn't show up, we can move on without him.

Crash
06-15-2012, 12:18 PM
Hines just happened to have some leverage

Terrific, he used Plaxico's departure to shake down Dan Rooney for more money by refusing to honor his signed contract.

What a leader!

steelz09
06-15-2012, 12:19 PM
Hines just happened to have some leverage.

We didn't have others like Brown, Cotchery, Sanders on the roster when Hines was holding out. We'd have probably had big problems without Hines. If Wallace doesn't show up, we can move on without him.

Good point... I know he's 'fast' and all but the Steelers have a lot of talent at WR. We are not desperate like other teams which is why I don't see a 10/mil a year contract for Wallace.

RuthlessBurgher
06-15-2012, 12:19 PM
Dan Rooney had a "sit down" with Hines at Latrobe Airport.

In which he likely told him, we won't sign you to a new extension until you return to camp.

Crash
06-15-2012, 12:21 PM
In which he likely told him, we won't sign you to a new extension until you return to camp.

They also negotiated by phone prior to that. They broke their alleged policy for him. Over the years what they say their policies are, and what they actually DO, is not always the same thing.

Oviedo
06-15-2012, 12:42 PM
Hines just happened to have some leverage.

We didn't have others like Brown, Cotchery, Sanders on the roster when Hines was holding out. We'd have probably had big problems without Hines. If Wallace doesn't show up, we can move on without him.

Exactly. The Steelers are more than willing to wait to sign Wallace to a long term extension because of who they already have. The team knows these players better than anyone on this board and they saw the emergence of Brown last year and the "plateauing" of Wallace's performance. I've said all along that they are going to wait to see how they all perform this season before they commit the big dollars on who they really want long term.

That is why Wallace is screwing himself by not being a participant in learning the new offense.

hawaiiansteel
06-15-2012, 12:47 PM
Steelers won’t reduce Wallace’s tender

June 15, 2012

Steelers GM Kevin Colbert confirmed the franchise will not slash unsigned restricted free agent Mike Wallace's salary from $2.72 million to $577,000 by Friday's deadline.

The Mike Wallace saga has come upon yet another significant date with very much the same action being taken – nothing.

Today is the (only) day the Steelers can slash Wallace’s still-unsigned one-year restricted free agent tender worth $2.72 million to $577,000 for the upcoming season.

The Steelers won’t do that.

"That's never been an intention of ours," Colbert said. "We want him to get a long-term deal that he deserves and I am real confident that we will be able to do that because when both sides want the same thing, it is only a matter of time."

The next important date for the “Wallace Watch” will be July 25 – the first day of training camp. Still, there is no guarantee he will show up at St. Vincent College, either.

Wallace could hold out until after the Nov. 12 game against Kansas City and still become an unrestricted free agent after the season (Vincent Jackson did that two years ago then signed a 5-year, $55 million deal with Tampa this year).

If Wallace decides to hold out the entire year, he would lose an accrued season and still be a restricted free agent again next year, which would not be a road he would take.

If a long-term deal is not reached, the Steelers could still hold onto Wallace for up to three more years. The Steelers could franchise tag Wallace each of the next three seasons, but with that number pushing well past the $10 million mark next year alone, that too is unlikely.

http://blog.triblive.com/steel-mill/...llaces-tender/ (http://blog.triblive.com/steel-mill/2012/06/15/steelers-wont-reduce-wallaces-tender/)

flippy
06-15-2012, 12:49 PM
Terrific, he used Plaxico's departure to shake down Dan Rooney for more money by refusing to honor his signed contract.

What a leader!

Much like Ben leads with his off field escapades. :)

These guys are football players. They're violent. They do inhumane things between the whistles. Yet we expect them to be saints off the field. Probably too much to expect from any football player.

hawaiiansteel
06-15-2012, 03:13 PM
Steelers Break For Offseason: See You At Camp Mike?

Jun 15th, 2012 by KimmySteelers

http://nicepickcowher.com/files/2012/06/5856788-206x300.jpg?24478c

The Steelers are about to embark on their summer vacations before returning to Latrobe for the official start to the 2012-13 season. By all accounts OTAs and Minicamp were successful as the team transitions to a younger defense and a brand new offense. Of course it’s difficult if not impossible to truly judge how successful the team will be under these changes considering there were no pads or hitting involved, but most if not all of Steeler Nation is very optimistic about the upcoming season. However it’s not that easy to keep the warm and fuzzies about the situation considering there is some definite unfinished business to attend to. The question on everyone’s mind –besides whether or not Big Ben’s son will be born during the season or not- is how much longer will Mike Wallace go without signing?

Today marks the deadline the Wallace had to sign his $2.7 million tender before the Steelers were entitled to reduce the amount significantly. The organization has already stated they will not be lowering his tender at all and are committed to signing Mike to a long term deal. Unfortunately reports are that there has been little to no movement in negotiations at this point. Earlier this week at the beginning of Minicamp Steelers president Art Rooney II was questioned about Wallace’s absence from the team activities and he replied, “He should be here.”

With opinions being like a certain body part, this situation is no different. Everyone has a different view on what the Steelers should do about Wallace and what Wallace should do from here on out. Fans never like a hold out. The issue of money and contracts will forever be a source of disconnect between athletes and fans, there’s just no way around it. Most people say Wallace is being greedy and is just after the Megatron and Fitzgerald money he was rumored to be asking for during the free agency period. The Steelers have a certain reputation for rewarding player with the big contracts on their time, not the players’ expectations. So far that has worked for them, only rarely has a player successfully held out for more money or a longer contract and the last one to do that was Hines Ward in 2005.

The most common viewpoint on how this situation is going is that Wallace is trying to hold out for some giant payday and doesn’t really care about the Steelers or the fans or loyalty and he hates puppies. Well I’m not really sure about his feelings towards puppies but in reality we don’t really know his true position on the contract situation ether. It dawned on me, especially seeing as how he was unsuccessful at grabbing a big contract when he was testing the free agency waters that he might just be after a long term deal with the Steelers after all. No team was willing to give up a big contract plus a first round draft pick for Wallace as a RFA and if he doesn’t have a good season this year with the Steelers it’s unlikely another team will cough up a bunch of money for him next year.

Clearly the money is part of the issue as well or else a deal would have been done by now. But let’s not jump to conclusions that Wallace isn’t on board with the Steeler way of doing things and is only seeing dollar signs. I tend to think that neither he nor his agent are morons and have some misconception that they could be the first athlete/agent combo to strong arm the Steelers into giving up a bigger contract than they want to. I think they realize that there is a ceiling the Steelers won’t go over in the money category so it would be futile to blow the season in an attempt to make Wallace a top paid wide receiver. I would think that both sides can recognize that although Wallace had a less than stellar second half of last season he clearly outperformed his contract. It really only hurts Wallace if he’s going to hold out till November to sign so I seriously doubt that’s going to happen either. The Steelers can manage the season and be successful without Wallace in the lineup. Remember what Ike said “You need football more than football needs you.”

Honestly, I was expecting to get word on the 14th that Wallace had signed the tender and was going to show up for the last day of Minicamp at least. Unfortunately that was not the case. However, I’m somehow feeling more optimistic about the situation now than before. I realize that he just missed out on OTAs and Minicamp as well as the crazy hat contest, but he’s got the playbook, there’s no reason to think he’s not keeping himself in excellent condition, and there’s plenty of time from now until training camp opens. Since this has gone on longer than anyone had expected it’s making me lean towards the idea that Wallace is more after locking down a long term deal with the Steelers rather than just trying to hold their feet to the flame for big bucks. If I was a betting girl, I’d put money on Wallace being there with his pillows and gaming system ready to check into the dorms at St. Vincent College in July. I think the deal gets done sooner rather than later. But that could just be all the optimism I have about the younger defense and brand new offense spilling over.

http://nicepickcowher.com/2012/06/15/steelers-break-for-offseason-see-you-at-camp-mike/

squidkid
06-15-2012, 03:16 PM
Steelers won’t reduce Wallace’s tender

June 15, 2012

Steelers GM Kevin Colbert confirmed the franchise will not slash unsigned restricted free agent Mike Wallace's salary from $2.72 million to $577,000 by Friday's deadline.

The Mike Wallace saga has come upon yet another significant date with very much the same action being taken – nothing.

Today is the (only) day the Steelers can slash Wallace’s still-unsigned one-year restricted free agent tender worth $2.72 million to $577,000 for the upcoming season.

The Steelers won’t do that.

"That's never been an intention of ours," Colbert said. "We want him to get a long-term deal that he deserves and I am real confident that we will be able to do that because when both sides want the same thing, it is only a matter of time."

The next important date for the “Wallace Watch” will be July 25 – the first day of training camp. Still, there is no guarantee he will show up at St. Vincent College, either.

Wallace could hold out until after the Nov. 12 game against Kansas City and still become an unrestricted free agent after the season (Vincent Jackson did that two years ago then signed a 5-year, $55 million deal with Tampa this year).

If Wallace decides to hold out the entire year, he would lose an accrued season and still be a restricted free agent again next year, which would not be a road he would take.

If a long-term deal is not reached, the Steelers could still hold onto Wallace for up to three more years. The Steelers could franchise tag Wallace each of the next three seasons, but with that number pushing well past the $10 million mark next year alone, that too is unlikely.

http://blog.triblive.com/steel-mill/...llaces-tender/ (http://blog.triblive.com/steel-mill/2012/06/15/steelers-wont-reduce-wallaces-tender/)


absolute BS. cut that tender down.
so wallace can sit out the first 10 weeks and then come back so he gets his eligibilty to become an UFA next year(and leave) and will still get his portion of the 2.7 million this year?

hawaiiansteel
06-15-2012, 03:38 PM
absolute BS. cut that tender down.
so wallace can sit out the first 10 weeks and then come back so he gets his eligibilty to become an UFA next year(and leave) and will still get his portion of the 2.7 million this year?


yes, he would still be able to collect a little over a million dollars this season that way...

however, the Steelers are bargaining in good faith and believe a long-term deal will eventually get done. i'm not so sure, to me there's a higher likelihood that Wallace ends up signing the tender and becomes an UFA next season.

RuthlessBurgher
06-16-2012, 10:16 AM
absolute BS. cut that tender down.
so wallace can sit out the first 10 weeks and then come back so he gets his eligibilty to become an UFA next year(and leave) and will still get his portion of the 2.7 million this year?

On one hand, you could reduce the tender, angering him and making him bitter toward management, which could result in him sitting out until week 10 and leaving as a free agent next season.

On the other hand, you could not reduce the tender, which he could view as a measure of good faith, resulting in continued negotiations, and perhaps a long term deal worked out before training camp.

I wonder which of these two scenarios do I think Colbert and Khan would prefer?

squidkid
06-16-2012, 10:26 AM
On one hand, you could reduce the tender, angering him and making him bitter toward management, which could result in him sitting out until week 10 and leaving as a free agent next season.

On the other hand, you could not reduce the tender, which he could view as a measure of good faith, resulting in continued negotiations, and perhaps a long term deal worked out before training camp.

I wonder which of these two scenarios do I think Colbert and Khan would prefer?

sure, or wallace could have signed the tender and showed up to workouts(thus showing the organization good faith towards a long term deal) even if it was just to stand there and learn the new system.

Sugar
06-16-2012, 10:36 AM
sure, or wallace could have signed the tender and showed up to workouts(thus showing the organization good faith towards a long term deal) even if it was just to stand there and learn the new system.

Sure, but the team knows that they hold the upper hand in negotiations. A Ferrari driver doesn't feel the need to race the Camry next to him at a stoplight.

The fact is that they want a happy player contributing to the team. Playing unnecessary hardball in negotiations won't get the desired end.

BURGH86STEEL
06-16-2012, 11:08 AM
Exactly. The Steelers are more than willing to wait to sign Wallace to a long term extension because of who they already have. The team knows these players better than anyone on this board and they saw the emergence of Brown last year and the "plateauing" of Wallace's performance. I've said all along that they are going to wait to see how they all perform this season before they commit the big dollars on who they really want long term.

That is why Wallace is screwing himself by not being a participant in learning the new offense.

They wouldn't be talking long term extension with Wallace if that were the case. When will people realize that Wallace isn't screwing himself? One way or another, Wallace is going to make a lot of money if he doesn't get injured. The Steelers and other teams already know what Wallace can do on the football field.

RuthlessBurgher
06-16-2012, 01:34 PM
sure, or wallace could have signed the tender and showed up to workouts(thus showing the organization good faith towards a long term deal) even if it was just to stand there and learn the new system.

If he signed the deal, he would be expected to practice, not just stand there and learn the new system. In his mind, it is not worth risking a Hakeem-Nicks-like injury during OTA's until he has a signed long term deal in place. His show of good faith was coming to the team headquarters, talking to the coaches, and picking up his new playbook to study while his agent and the team brass do their best to work out a deal.

Oviedo
06-16-2012, 02:09 PM
If he signed the deal, he would be expected to practice, not just stand there and learn the new system. In his mind, it is not worth risking a Hakeem-Nicks-like injury during OTA's until he has a signed long term deal in place. His show of good faith was coming to the team headquarters, talking to the coaches, and picking up his new playbook to study while his agent and the team brass do their best to work out a deal.

Ruthless--you usually have a pretty good read on these thing. Seriously what percentage do you put on Wallace signing a long term deal for this season and beyond? I'm putting it at 25% or less. There is no reason for the Steelers to pay him anything like the contracts the recent FA WRs have signed in the off season. They control him for this year and next if they want to. Nothing he can do about that. If Wallace is looking for something in the $8M+/year range I don't see how that happens.

RuthlessBurgher
06-16-2012, 03:18 PM
Ruthless--you usually have a pretty good read on these thing. Seriously what percentage do you put on Wallace signing a long term deal for this season and beyond? I'm putting it at 25% or less. There is no reason for the Steelers to pay him anything like the contracts the recent FA WRs have signed in the off season. They control him for this year and next if they want to. Nothing he can do about that. If Wallace is looking for something in the $8M+/year range I don't see how that happens.

Ultimately, I could see a contract structured similarly to DeSean Jackson's recent 5 year, $51 million deal (the Eagles typically know what they are doing when constructing contracts, unlike some of the more spendthrift teams out there). Here is how that deal is broken down:


Breaking down DeSean Jackson's contract

Posted: Friday, March 16, 2012 12:00 am | Updated: 6:33 am, Fri Mar 16, 2012.

Jackson’s Deal

(according to Profootballtalk.com)

2012: $10 million signing bonus plus $750,000 base salary and a $250,000 workout bonus.

2013: Base salary of $6.75 million, $4 million of which is fully guaranteed. The other $2.75 million is guaranteed for injury only. He also will receive a $250,000 workout bonus.

2014: Base salary of $10.25 million, $250,000 of which is fully guaranteed and $250,000 of it is guaranteed for injury only. Those guarantees go away if he receives the workout bonus in 2012 and 2013. He also will be eligible for a $250,000 workout bonus.

2015: Base salary of $9.75 million, with a $250,000 workout bonus.

2016: Base salary of $8.25 million, with a $250,000 workout bonus.

Note. Jackson also could earn up to $4 million in escalators:

• $250,000 per year from 2012 through 2015 for making the Pro Bowl

• $250,000 per year from 2012 through 2015 for 1,300 or more receiving yards

• $250,000 per year from 2012 through 2015 for 10 or more receiving touchdowns

• $250,000 per year from 2012 through 2015 for Super Bowl wins


http://www.phillyburbs.com/sports/eagles/breaking-down-desean-jackson-s-contract/article_8f80aa4c-a6ab-57ec-bd14-16ae9b8da7f9.html

I would probably swap the 2014 and 2016 salaries myself (and maybe move a bit of the 2013 money into 2016 as well), but something like that would be manageable in general. A minimal first year salary plus $2 million worth of pro-rated signing bonus (he wouldn't get a workout bonus in 2012 after missing all of the OTA's and minicamps this year) would be manageable in our current tight cap situation. The cap hit would rise in year two, but additional space will be created when guys like Casey Hampton, Larry Foote, Will Allen, etc. are out the door after this season. Then the new TV contracts should kick in for 2014, and that should alleviate many of these current issues. As he gets later in this deal, if he loses some speed and is no longer the same receiver anymore, he can be cut without outlandish dead money still on our cap.

flippy
06-16-2012, 03:25 PM
Ultimately, I could see a contract structured similarly to DeSean Jackson's recent 5 year, $51 million deal (the Eagles typically know what they are doing when constructing contracts, unlike some of the more spendthrift teams out there). Here is how that deal is broken down:



http://www.phillyburbs.com/sports/eagles/breaking-down-desean-jackson-s-contract/article_8f80aa4c-a6ab-57ec-bd14-16ae9b8da7f9.html

I would probably swap the 2014 and 2016 salaries myself (and maybe move a bit of the 2013 money into 2016 as well), but something like that would be manageable in general. A minimal first year salary plus $2 million worth of pro-rated signing bonus (he wouldn't get a workout bonus in 2012 after missing all of the OTA's and minicamps this year) would be manageable in our current tight cap situation. The cap hit would rise in year two, but additional space will be created when guys like Casey Hampton, Larry Foote, Will Allen, etc. are out the door after this season. Then the new TV contracts should kick in for 2014, and that should alleviate many of these current issues. As he gets later in this deal, if he loses some speed and is no longer the same receiver anymore, he can be cut without outlandish dead money still on our cap.

Desean had a Franchise Tag. So Wallace should probably get ~$10M less.

hawaiiansteel
06-16-2012, 04:58 PM
Wallace's best opportunity came and went; now it's time for him to take deal

Jason La Canfora | CBS Sports NFL Insider

http://sports.cbsimg.net/u/photos/football/nfl/img19358779.jpg

If Wallace drags his holdout into training camp, it will hurt him more than the Steelers.

Mike Wallace is a wonderful football player, one of the more exciting young players in the NFL, and someone who certainly has outperformed his rookie contract. But his holdout has run its course. His leverage is only waning. And it's just about time to get back to Pittsburgh and get on with his career.

This is a war Wallace can't win, not under these circumstances.

Between the Steelers' organizational strength, their history in these cases, the new realities of the CBA, and the overall strength at wide receiver on Pittsburgh's roster, this can't string out more than a few more weeks. Come training camp, the rules shift even more in the team's favor, and, after skipping mandatory minicamp and raising some ire ("The Rooney family is not happy," one league source said), the wise move for the former 84th overall pick would be to use the weeks between now and the opening camp to hammer out the best deal possible.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/1...m-to-take-deal (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/19358780/wallaces-best-opportunity-came-and-went-now-its-time-for-him-to-take-deal)

Oviedo
06-16-2012, 11:54 PM
Wallace's best opportunity came and went; now it's time for him to take deal

Jason La Canfora | CBS Sports NFL Insider

http://sports.cbsimg.net/u/photos/football/nfl/img19358779.jpg

If Wallace drags his holdout into training camp, it will hurt him more than the Steelers.

Mike Wallace is a wonderful football player, one of the more exciting young players in the NFL, and someone who certainly has outperformed his rookie contract. But his holdout has run its course. His leverage is only waning. And it's just about time to get back to Pittsburgh and get on with his career.

This is a war Wallace can't win, not under these circumstances.

Between the Steelers' organizational strength, their history in these cases, the new realities of the CBA, and the overall strength at wide receiver on Pittsburgh's roster, this can't string out more than a few more weeks. Come training camp, the rules shift even more in the team's favor, and, after skipping mandatory minicamp and raising some ire ("The Rooney family is not happy," one league source said), the wise move for the former 84th overall pick would be to use the weeks between now and the opening camp to hammer out the best deal possible.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/1...m-to-take-deal (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/19358780/wallaces-best-opportunity-came-and-went-now-its-time-for-him-to-take-deal)

Right on the money. Wallace has no leverage. He should take whatever deal he gets and move on.

hawaiiansteel
06-19-2012, 01:40 AM
Colbert says Steelers want Mike Wallace to get the deal he deserves

Posted by Michael David Smith on June 18, 2012

http://nbcprofootballtalk.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/mikewallaceden-e1340033768751.jpg?w=250

The Steelers’ decision not to reduce the restricted free agent tender for receiver Mike Wallace was part of the franchise’s general belief that Wallace is a great player who deserves to be paid well, the team’s general manager says.

Kevin Colbert told 105.9 The X’s Mark Madden that the Steelers never gave any real consideration to dropping the tender offer.

“When we tendered Mike at the amount we did, the compensation through that tender, we really had no issue with that whatsoever because he is deserving of that,” Colbert said, via the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review.

Wallace, however, obviously thinks he deserves more than the $2.7 million restricted free agent tender, and that’s why he hasn’t signed it yet. Colbert said he still believes the Steelers and Wallace can reach a deal that’s acceptable to both sides.

“We want him to get a long-term deal that he deserves and I am real confident that we will be able to do that because when both sides want the same thing, it is only a matter of time,” Colbert said.

It remains to be seen how much time: Wallace and the Steelers may both want to get a contract done, but from all appearances they’re far apart on the financial details of that contract.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/06/18/colbert-says-steelers-want-mike-wallace-to-get-the-deal-he-deserves/

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
06-19-2012, 12:21 PM
While the fan in me wants him to be at camp, he is not required to be there since he is not currently under contract. That is not his requirement as per the CBA. He is not "holding out" and is simply in the middle of the bargaining process.

He may hurt his preparation, he may be hurting his image, but there is a huge difference between what he is doing and what a player who is signed to a contract does when he stays away.

hawaiiansteel
06-19-2012, 08:35 PM
Could the Pittsburgh Steelers Deal Mike Wallace to Minnesota Vikings?

June 19, 2012

http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Mike+Wallace+Cleveland+Browns+v+Pittsburgh+Ermulqn fbLFl.jpg

Mike Wallace Ben Roethlisberger #7 of the Pittsburgh Steelers celebrates a second quarter touchdown pass with Mike Wallace while playing the Cleveland Browns on October 17, 2010 at Heinz Field in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.

With a left tackle and a running back in place the time has come for the Minnesota Vikings to give their young quarterback a wide receiver. Do they have the ammo to take Mike Wallace from the Pittsburgh Steelers?

Jerome Simpson isn't enough to help Percy Harvin with Christian Ponder

The NFC championship heartbreak in 2009 seems so far away for Vikings fans. Gone is the Brett Favre magic, replaced by rebuilding reality. Hopes sit uneasily on the shoulders of quarterback Christian Ponder who came out of the draft with questions and hasn't had enough time to answer them. Worse yet the best offensive weapon Minnesota has in running back Adrian Peterson hasn't fully recovered from a torn ACL and MCL in his knee. That puts more pressure on Ponder and a suspect group of wide receivers to carry the load until he's back healthy. The Vikings do have a budding star in Percy Harvin but their hopes of giving him help settled on the acrobatic but erratic Jerome Simpson. It was Harvin who voiced his anger about where the team is. It's not clear what upsets him but from the way he says things must get sorted out before training camp it's easy to think he isn't satisfied with what the Minnesota Vikings coaches and front office have done. Would getting him some help in the passing game ease the fury?

Steelers risk angering Ben Roethlisberger if they don't get Wallace back

Minnesota sits in a tough spot. Not only is their roster filled with question marks but the team also signed a new lease to stay in one of the toughest divisions in the NFL. The Pittsburgh Steelers know all about that, expecting another season battling Baltimore and Cincinnati for playoff spots. That's why the team tries week after week to get Pro Bowl receiver Mike Wallace signed to either his franchise tender or a long-term deal. Neither offer suits the receiver, so his holdout continues. Team captain and quarterback Ben Roethlisberger isn't happy about it. He, more than anybody, knows what Wallace can do and believes the Steelers will need his talent and speed to stay on top. Management says the team wants to pay him but salary cap problems and a debate on Wallace's worth has created a deadlock. Unless he signs the tender or a deal gets worked out they risk losing him to free agency next season. That means they might have to lower their price in trade talks. Minnesota has both the cap and draft picks that could interest Pittsburgh. Wallace would go to team that plays indoors where speed counts for everything and give Ponder another reliable target besides Harvin.

Mike Wallace expects to stay with the Pittsburgh Steelers but if Ben Roethlisberger is right it won't happen until they pay him properly. The Minnesota Vikings settled for Jerome Simpson to help Christian Ponder, which didn't impress Percy Harvin. If the team wants to avoid rebuilding beyond 2012 they might want to think about a trade.

http://sports.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474981415242

Oviedo
06-20-2012, 08:02 AM
Could the Pittsburgh Steelers Deal Mike Wallace to Minnesota Vikings?

June 19, 2012

http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Mike+Wallace+Cleveland+Browns+v+Pittsburgh+Ermulqn fbLFl.jpg

Mike Wallace Ben Roethlisberger #7 of the Pittsburgh Steelers celebrates a second quarter touchdown pass with Mike Wallace while playing the Cleveland Browns on October 17, 2010 at Heinz Field in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.

With a left tackle and a running back in place the time has come for the Minnesota Vikings to give their young quarterback a wide receiver. Do they have the ammo to take Mike Wallace from the Pittsburgh Steelers?

Jerome Simpson isn't enough to help Percy Harvin with Christian Ponder

The NFC championship heartbreak in 2009 seems so far away for Vikings fans. Gone is the Brett Favre magic, replaced by rebuilding reality. Hopes sit uneasily on the shoulders of quarterback Christian Ponder who came out of the draft with questions and hasn't had enough time to answer them. Worse yet the best offensive weapon Minnesota has in running back Adrian Peterson hasn't fully recovered from a torn ACL and MCL in his knee. That puts more pressure on Ponder and a suspect group of wide receivers to carry the load until he's back healthy. The Vikings do have a budding star in Percy Harvin but their hopes of giving him help settled on the acrobatic but erratic Jerome Simpson. It was Harvin who voiced his anger about where the team is. It's not clear what upsets him but from the way he says things must get sorted out before training camp it's easy to think he isn't satisfied with what the Minnesota Vikings coaches and front office have done. Would getting him some help in the passing game ease the fury?

Steelers risk angering Ben Roethlisberger if they don't get Wallace back

Minnesota sits in a tough spot. Not only is their roster filled with question marks but the team also signed a new lease to stay in one of the toughest divisions in the NFL. The Pittsburgh Steelers know all about that, expecting another season battling Baltimore and Cincinnati for playoff spots. That's why the team tries week after week to get Pro Bowl receiver Mike Wallace signed to either his franchise tender or a long-term deal. Neither offer suits the receiver, so his holdout continues. Team captain and quarterback Ben Roethlisberger isn't happy about it. He, more than anybody, knows what Wallace can do and believes the Steelers will need his talent and speed to stay on top. Management says the team wants to pay him but salary cap problems and a debate on Wallace's worth has created a deadlock. Unless he signs the tender or a deal gets worked out they risk losing him to free agency next season. That means they might have to lower their price in trade talks. Minnesota has both the cap and draft picks that could interest Pittsburgh. Wallace would go to team that plays indoors where speed counts for everything and give Ponder another reliable target besides Harvin.

Mike Wallace expects to stay with the Pittsburgh Steelers but if Ben Roethlisberger is right it won't happen until they pay him properly. The Minnesota Vikings settled for Jerome Simpson to help Christian Ponder, which didn't impress Percy Harvin. If the team wants to avoid rebuilding beyond 2012 they might want to think about a trade.

http://sports.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474981415242

Ben needs to realize that he will be far more successful if he throws to Heath Miller and medium depth routes to Brown than his poorly thrown long bombs. Wallace can be with the Steelers anytime Wallace wants to be with the Steelers. The only person keeping him away is himself.

grotonsteel
06-20-2012, 11:07 AM
I am not sure where did the author get the idea " Ben is not happy". I don't recollect Ben saying anything like that. Ben has echoed similar views to Mike Tomlin in press. Maybe i missed something.

Hopefully Steelers FO and MW can agree to a long deal.

Ovi i am yet not sold on AB. Agreed he had a great season but he had only 2 TDs.

MW takes the top of the defense and it helps HM and AB. You just can't dink-dunk passes when there is no outside threat. DBs will start jumping the routes.

Who will be the speed merchant if MW is not there?

Oviedo
06-20-2012, 12:57 PM
I am not sure where did the author get the idea " Ben is not happy". I don't recollect Ben saying anything like that. Ben has echoed similar views to Mike Tomlin in press. Maybe i missed something.

Hopefully Steelers FO and MW can agree to a long deal.

Ovi i am yet not sold on AB. Agreed he had a great season but he had only 2 TDs.

MW takes the top of the defense and it helps HM and AB. You just can't dink-dunk passes when there is no outside threat. DBs will start jumping the routes.

Who will be the speed merchant if MW is not there?

I think Brown has the speed, not Wallace's, to go deep. He just isn't asked to run those routes with Wallace on the team. I think Wallace would have a much tougher time being successful running the routes Brown runs over the middle and in traffic than vice versa.

You are right though, having both makes each better and I hope we can keep it that way and we don't put all our eggs (and money) in the Wallace basket and then lose Brown.

Another poster said exactly what I believe. Brown will have more catches this year and Wallace will have more TDs...if he shows up.

RuthlessBurgher
06-20-2012, 01:14 PM
I am not sure where did the author get the idea " Ben is not happy". I don't recollect Ben saying anything like that. Ben has echoed similar views to Mike Tomlin in press. Maybe i missed something.

It would appear that the author is a Vikings fan who is not all that familiar with the Steelers (Wallace's "franchise tender" was referenced in the article).

RuthlessBurgher
06-20-2012, 01:38 PM
I think Wallace would have a much tougher time being successful running the routes Brown runs over the middle and in traffic than vice versa.

It's not as if Wallace only ever runs 9 routes and all balls thrown his way are 40+ yards downfield. Have you read the article that K.C. Joyner wrote last season (after 6 games) in which he compared Mike Wallace to Calvin Johnson in terms of short, medium, deep, bomb, vertical, stretch vertical, yards after catch, and overall yards per attempt? Joyner argued that Wallace is better than Calvin (I'm not arguing that...I had a bigger draft crush on Megatron in his draft year than I had on DeCastro this year, and that is saying something). By posting this, I'm not attempting to start up a Calvin vs. Mike debate (because I'd pick Calvin), but I just thought it was interesting to note how effective Mike has been with short/medium passes, and not just bombs/vertical/stretch vertical passes, as is widely believed. Also, his yards after catch numbers seem to dispel the notion that Wallace simply turtles after catching the ball as some fans seem to think.



Mike Wallace tops Calvin Johnson
It may surprise, but almost any way you look at it, the Pittsburgh WR has been better
Originally Published: October 19, 2011
By KC Joyner | ESPN Insider

Mike Wallace and Calvin Johnson are two of the best wide receivers in the NFL. But who's better?

After six weeks of the 2011 NFL season, there are a lot of questions still unanswered: Which team is the best? Will the Colts or Dolphins win a game? Will Tebowmania equal Beatlemania?



It might take a while for those queries to get clarification, but the one question that seems to have been definitively answered to the satisfaction of many is that Calvin Johnson is the best wide receiver in the NFL.



At some level, Johnson is certainly setting a pace that has not been equaled in a long time. According to ESPN Stats & Information, Megatron's nine touchdowns in the first five games were the most by any player through the first five games of any season dating back to 1940. They note that Johnson is on pace to break Randy Moss' NFL record 23 touchdown receptions set in 2007.



That might be enough to put Johnson in the top spot, but he is assisted by the drop-off of some of the other potential leading contenders, some because of injury (Miles Austin, Andre Johnson, Hakeem Nicks) and others because of reduced production (Larry Fitzgerald, Roddy White).

Before handing that honor to Johnson by acclamation, however, he should have to go through the same type of "challenge system" that Bear Bryant used to settle positional battles on his team. This method allowed any player to call for a one-on-one clash in a variety of areas to see who was the best at executing the key responsibilities of the position (as we did with Austin and Andre Johnson last season to see who was the best wideout in the league at that time). The winner gets to claim the prize as best wideout.



The big question is who should be chosen to challenge Johnson? Even with the aforementioned drop-off of the top contenders, there is one player who has more than enough to play the role of Optimus Prime -- Pittsburgh Steelers wide receiver Mike Wallace.



Wallace is almost never mentioned as one of the top five wideouts in the league, much less as the best, but look at how his numbers this season stack up against Johnson in a variety of categories. (Note: all attempt and yardage totals include penalty plays such as defensive holding, illegal contact, pass interference, etc.).




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Short passes (aerials thrown downfield 10 or fewer yards)



• Johnson has gained 202 yards on 27 short pass attempts, so 7.5 yards per attempt.



• Wallace has 205 yards on 22 short pass attempts, which equates to a 9.3 short pass YPA.



Medium passes (11-19 yards downfield)



• Johnson has racked up 163 yards on 16 medium pass attempts for a 10.2 medium YPA.



• Wallace has 117 yards on 11 medium pass attempts for a 10.6 medium YPA.



Deep passes (20-29 yards downfield)



• Johnson has posted 59 yards on six deep pass attempts for a 9.8 deep YPA.



• Wallace has been targeted on a deep pass only one time this season and it didn't result in a completion or a penalty, so he has zero yards in this category.



Bomb passes (30 or more yards downfield)



• Johnson has tallied 145 yards on six bomb pass attempts for a 24.2 bomb YPA.



• Wallace has 329 yards on nine bomb passes for a 36.6 bomb YPA.



Vertical (all medium, deep and bomb passes)



• Johnson has been targeted for 28 vertical passes and has gained 367 yards on those throws. That gives him a 13.1 vertical YPA.



• Wallace has been targeted for 21 vertical passes and posted 446 yards on those throws, giving him a 21.2 vertical YPA.



Stretch vertical (all deep/bomb passes -- the ones designed to really stretch defensive coverage)



• Johnson has 12 targets on stretch vertical passes and gained 204 yards on those aerials. That equates to a 17 stretch vertical YPA.



• Wallace has 10 targets on stretch vertical passes and posted 329 yards on those aerials. That equates to a 32.9 stretch vertical YPA.



Yards after catch



• Johnson has been credited with 129 yards after catch this season.



• Wallace has 183 yards after catch this season.



Overall YPA



• Add all of Johnson's totals up, and he has 569 yards on 55 targets, a 10.3 overall YPA.



• Wallace has 651 yards on 43 targets, or a 15.1 overall YPA.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



It's one thing to simply subscribe to the numbers and players must also pass the eye test, but these totals show Wallace as superior thus far in short, medium, bomb, vertical, stretch vertical, yards after catch and overall YPA categories. If he's not dominant in one, he's consistently better in all.



Not only that, Wallace has 82 more total yards than Johnson despite having 12 fewer targets.



That evidence alone would point to Wallace being the better wideout, but there are two potential arguments against this claim.



The first is that Johnson has a 9-4 lead on touchdown receptions. True, but consider this: Johnson has been thrown a pass in the end zone nine times this season and has converted five of those into touchdowns.



By contrast, Wallace has only four end zone targets this season. He has converted three into touchdowns and one into a pass interference penalty that gave the Steelers a first down at the opponent's 1-yard line. What this means is that when Pittsburgh gives Wallace a shot at an end zone pass, so far, he is even better at converting it into a touchdown than Johnson is.



The second argument is that Wallace can't be given this honor after only six games. It takes longer than that to establish someone as the best at his position.



The counter is that Wallace could make a claim as having been the most dominant wideout in the league in 2010 as well. His 13.8 overall YPA was by far the best in the league (it was 1.7 yards better than Kenny Britt's second-place finish in that category). Wallace was the only wideout to post a short pass YPA of higher than 10 yards (10.2). Wallace also ranked tied for third in vertical YPA (16.6) and was fifth in stretch vertical YPA among wide receivers with at least 20 targets at that depth (20.3).



That shows his overall dominance, but for the sake of this discussion, it should be noted that he gained 154 more yards than Johnson last season (1,295 to 1,141) despite being targeted 40 fewer times (134 for Johnson vs. 94 for Wallace). Wallace also had a better touchdown-to-target ratio (once every 9.4 passes vs. once every 11.2 targets for Johnson).



No matter which way you look at, Wallace bests Johnson. At the moment, that makes him the heavyweight champion of NFL wide receivers.



KC Joyner, aka the Football Scientist, is a regular contributor to ESPN Insider. He can be found on Twitter @kcjoynertfs and at his website. He is the author of an annual fantasy football draft guide, which is currently available, and "Blindsided: Why the Left Tackle is Overrated and Other Contrarian Football Thoughts."

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7122234/nfl-why-mike-wallace-bigger-gamebreaker-calvin-johnson

hawaiiansteel
06-22-2012, 02:05 PM
By Pat Kirwan | NFL Insider

June 20, 2012

The Steelers should spell out to Mike Wallace just how much money he can lose under the restricted tag and two franchise tags over the next three years versus doing a five-year deal now with significant guaranteed money in it. He will see $23.43 million over three years ($7.81 average) under the three tags IF he stays healthy. Keep in mind the franchise tag went down $2 million from 2011. A five-year deal now averaging just over $8 million should put $18 million guaranteed in his pocket now and close to $28 million over the first three years. He may be better than DeSean Jackson, who got $51 million over five years, but Jackson came into the NFL in 2008 and had a franchise tag on him this year. Wallace came in 2009 and is only a restricted free agent and simply doesn't have the same leverage. Both players were born in 1986, and Jackson now knows his contract expires as he turns 30. If Wallace plays on three tags he will be looking for a long term deal when he's going to be 28 and any serious injuries between now and then will hurt his market value.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/1...ing-with-mccoy (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/19392599/prevacation-cleanup-10-items-on-todo-list-starting-with-mccoy)

Oviedo
06-22-2012, 03:21 PM
By Pat Kirwan | NFL Insider

June 20, 2012

The Steelers should spell out to Mike Wallace just how much money he can lose under the restricted tag and two franchise tags over the next three years versus doing a five-year deal now with significant guaranteed money in it. He will see $23.43 million over three years ($7.81 average) under the three tags IF he stays healthy. Keep in mind the franchise tag went down $2 million from 2011. A five-year deal now averaging just over $8 million should put $18 million guaranteed in his pocket now and close to $28 million over the first three years. He may be better than DeSean Jackson, who got $51 million over five years, but Jackson came into the NFL in 2008 and had a franchise tag on him this year. Wallace came in 2009 and is only a restricted free agent and simply doesn't have the same leverage. Both players were born in 1986, and Jackson now knows his contract expires as he turns 30. If Wallace plays on three tags he will be looking for a long term deal when he's going to be 28 and any serious injuries between now and then will hurt his market value.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/1...ing-with-mccoy (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/19392599/prevacation-cleanup-10-items-on-todo-list-starting-with-mccoy)

Very well explained. The Steelers aren't going to give him DeSean jackson money so he would be wise to sign for what the Steelers offers and get possibly more guaranteed money. It's really all about the guaranteed money.

The Steelers control Wallace for the next two years and one injury would really hurt a guy whose whole game is based on speed. He needs to take what he can get.

hawaiiansteel
06-25-2012, 02:12 PM
Pittsburgh Steelers Cornerback Ike Taylor is Still Haunted by the Loss to Denver in the Playoffs

Submitted by Syndicated sources on June 24, 2012

Even with the excitement building for the 2012 season many Pittsburgh Steelers fans have the disappointing overtime loss to the Denver Broncos etched into their psyche. Like those fans, cornerback Ike Taylor still has the memory fresh in his head, going as far to tell the media during his annual football camp at Arden Cahill Academy in Gretna, Louisiana, that he will do everything in his power to make up for that final play.The Steelers will need another big season from Taylor as the make-up of the cornerback position looks to be a lot younger in 2012. In fact, the team will definitely look for him to provide leadership to a group of cornerbacks who lack starter experience. For a team with Super Bowl aspirations, that group of players will not only need to play hard, but they must be effective.

During this press session with Albert Burford of The Times-Picayune, Taylor also believes that teammate Mike Wallace and the Steelers will reach an agreement allowing the Pro Bowl wide receiver to enter camp on time. There is no denying that Wallace deserves a hefty raise from his rookie contract and the Steelers have likely offered him what they believe is fair market value for his services, the big question is if that is enough for Wallace.

At this point, he is looking at a battle he just cannot win. As soon as the draft was over, his advantage started dwindling, and now, the advantage has shifted to the Steelers. Yes, he could continue to hold out, but while league sources are saying the team will not lower his $2.7 million tender things could change. It is a known fact that while they are saying the right things, the Rooney family is not happy with this hold out and could decide to move that money elsewhere for 2012.

With two young and talented receivers besides Wallace already in the stable, it is clear that the Steelers will not break the bank for his services. In fact, it may be a case where the more Wallace upsets the front office and ownership, the worse it could be for him. According to the new CBA, the Steelers could potential own his rights until 2015 without hashing out a new deal by use of the franchise tag. By going that route, the team could own his services for roughly $26 – 27 million over that three-year span, ironically, still less than he is reportedly looking for.

http://network.yardbarker.com/nfl/ar...yoffs/11078729 (http://network.yardbarker.com/nfl/article_external/pittsburgh_steelers_cornerback_ike_taylor_is_still _haunted_by_the_loss_to_denver_in_the_playoffs/11078729)

Crash
06-25-2012, 02:19 PM
According to the new CBA, the Steelers could potential own his rights until 2015 without hashing out a new deal by use of the franchise tag. By going that route, the team could own his services for roughly $26 – 27 million over that three-year span, ironically, still less than he is reportedly looking for.

Have to remember though. That's $27 million HARD CAP dollars.

No working the cap, that's an iron clad up front number.

I don't think we could handle that.

flippy
06-25-2012, 02:30 PM
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7122234/nfl-why-mike-wallace-bigger-gamebreaker-calvin-johnson

I think this article nails it pretty well. IMHO if Wallace just had hands and could go up and get a ball in the air, he might be the best WR of all time.

Unfortunately for him, in the NFL, WRs are a dime a dozen.

Give me the best QB and defense possible. Don't waste too much on any WR.

Oviedo
06-25-2012, 03:14 PM
I think this article nails it pretty well. IMHO if Wallace just had hands and could go up and get a ball in the air, he might be the best WR of all time.

Unfortunately for him, in the NFL, WRs are a dime a dozen.

Give me the best QB and defense possible. Don't waste too much on any WR.

I agree. If Wallace's asking price is north of $8M per year then say no thank you and focus on resigning Brown and Sanders. We will be fine without Wallace.

feltdizz
06-25-2012, 03:29 PM
Have we ever paid 8 Mill per year for a WR? I just can't see it...

RuthlessBurgher
06-25-2012, 03:45 PM
Have we ever paid 8 Mill per year for a WR? I just can't see it...

No, but every time a top guy signs, that's the biggest contract at that position in team history because of inflation.

Troy Polamalu makes more than Donnie Shell and Carnell Lake ever made combined.

LaMarr Woodley makes more than Jack Ham and Greg Lloyd ever made combined.

Ike Taylor makes more than Mel Blount and Rod Woodson ever made combined.

Lawrence Timmons makes more than Jack Lambert and Levon Kirkland ever made combined.

Casey Hampton makes more than Joe Greene and Joel Steed ever made combined.

Oviedo
06-25-2012, 04:04 PM
No, but every time a top guy signs, that's the biggest contract at that position in team history because of inflation.

Troy Polamalu makes more than Donnie Shell and Carnell Lake ever made combined.

LaMarr Woodley makes more than Jack Ham and Greg Lloyd ever made combined.

Ike Taylor makes more than Mel Blount and Rod Woodson ever made combined.

Lawrence Timmons makes more than Jack Lambert and Levon Kirkland ever made combined.

Casey Hampton makes more than Joe Greene and Joel Steed ever made combined.

It's all driven by TV dollars and the negotiated players percentage of the total revenue take. There is just a bigger pool of money for the current players and when the mandatory minimum cap spending hits it will keep the players percentage consistently high.

That said just because some teams have spent "Franchise QB-like" salaries on WR this past off season does not mean we need to repeat the same mistake. WRs are not hard to replace and given that all these speed guys are one injury away from losing their greatest asset, and in Wallace's case his only elite asset, I would not spend more than $8M for a WR. Lock up Brown and Sanders now while you can get them on the cheap. Consider trading Wallace if he won't come in at the clubs desired price and get a draft pick. There will be lots of good WRs available next year. Too many fans fall in love with announcers talking about "fastest man in the NFL" on gameday and don't see that Wallace isn't the complete package.

Flasteel
06-25-2012, 05:27 PM
It's all driven by TV dollars and the negotiated players percentage of the total revenue take. There is just a bigger pool of money for the current players and when the mandatory minimum cap spending hits it will keep the players percentage consistently high.

That said just because some teams have spent "Franchise QB-like" salaries on WR this past off season does not mean we need to repeat the same mistake. WRs are not hard to replace and given that all these speed guys are one injury away from losing their greatest asset, and in Wallace's case his only elite asset, I would not spend more than $8M for a WR. Lock up Brown and Sanders now while you can get them on the cheap. Consider trading Wallace if he won't come in at the clubs desired price and get a draft pick. There will be lots of good WRs available next year. Too many fans fall in love with announcers talking about "fastest man in the NFL" on gameday and don't see that Wallace isn't the complete package.

The overall slice of pie is determined by the TV revenue and the players take, but the whole thing is driven by greed and ego. The "market value" is constantly pushed upward because one player can't stand that someone else at his position is making more. If they settle for less or continue to play for less than top dollar, then many players feel like they are embracing inferiority. If it's not them making the demands, then it's their agents...who obviously enjoy the same inflation of player contracts. Never mind if a contract offer is fair or if a player happens to find himself in the perfect system or perfect town for their family. Too many players and agents put all of their chips on the value of their contract compared to others. How else would the pot ever grow? [sarcasm].

I'm sure there are a few on this forum who support that type of mentality under the guise of "getting their money while they can". Some on here even advocate Wallace holding out of camp or until week 10 of the regular season, if the team isn't willing to give him what he thinks he's worth (as compared to Larry Fitzgerald). Can't say I'm in that camp.

I would no doubt rather have Wallace on this team than not. I don't have a problem with his hands and I believe the value of his speed to this offense is significant. That said, I don't believe he's on par with the likes of Fitzgerald, Megatron, A. Johnson, or a few other receivers who can consistently dominate the coverage. The team should offer him a fair contract and if Wallace refuses to sign it, then he should except the $2.8 M tender and use 2012 to prove that he deserves to be ranked with those other guys.

hawaiiansteel
06-25-2012, 05:54 PM
The team should offer him a fair contract and if Wallace refuses to sign it, then he should except the $2.8 M tender and use 2012 to prove that he deserves to be ranked with those other guys.


this is most likely exactly where the situation stands right now, the ball is in Wallace's court to see how he wants to play this out.

RuthlessBurgher
06-25-2012, 09:16 PM
We've all been comparing Wallace to other receivers (makes sense, right?).

The number's being passed around:

Larry Fitzgerald: 8 years, $128 million ($50 million guaranteed)
Vincent Jackson: 5 years, $55,555,555*** ($26 million guaranteed)
DeSean Jackson: 5 years, $47 million ($15 million guaranteed)
Marques Colston: 5 years, $36.3 million ($17.7 million guaranteed)

***Notice that the total value of VJax's contract is ocho cincos.

People have been saying that we have never paid such big dollars to a receiver.

Well, instead of comparing Wallace to other receivers around the league, let's compare him to other Steelers who signed extensions within the last year.

LaMarr Woodley: 6 years, $61.5 million ($22.5 million guaranteed, including a $13 million signing bonus)
Troy Polamalu: 4 years, $36.5 million ($10.55 million signing bonus)
Lawrence Timmons: 6 years, $50 million ($11 million signing bonus)
Ike Taylor: 4 years, $28 million ($7.25 million signing bonus)

In terms of overall importance to the team, where does a top-notch deep threat entering the prime of his NFL career rank in terms of overall importance to the team when compared to the two linebackers entering the primes of their careers or the two members of the secondary who are now over the age of 30?

I know many will hold firm to their notion that "anything over $8 million and we should send him packing," but if you compare him to other Steelers who got extensions recently, doesn't it seem like Wallace should be slotted somewhere between Timmons and Polamalu in the middle of those 4 contracts?

I suggested a while back that Mike Wallace's contract could end up looking like Sidney Crosby's last contract (which he should be extending next week for 10 more years). Sid's last deal was for 5 years, $43.5 million ($8.7 million per year). That is essentially right smack dab in between the Timmons and Polamalu deals.

The sticking point could be the amount of the signing bonus, which if we followed precedent from last year would be in the neighborhood of $11 million or so. That would give us a yearly cap hit of $2.2 worth of signing bonus...if we gave him a veteran minimum salary ($750,000) in year one, his overall cap hit would be $2.95 million for this season, which would fit under the cap as currently constituted (see the other thread which shows our current cap space as $3.58 million). If Wallace's contract was structured as such, that would leave us with $630,000 after a Wallace 5 year, $43.5 dollar extension with an $11 million signing bonus (which would be the second fewest in the league, but still a shade more than Baltimore's $606,000 of available cap space as we speak).

If we wanted to sign Max Starks if his rehab progresses as we move through camp and the preseason, then we'd have to cut Jon Scott in order to make room (but we knew that already...if we had a healthy Max, there would be no need for Jon Scott anyway).

Slapstick
06-25-2012, 09:35 PM
We've all been comparing Wallace to other receivers (makes sense, right?).

The number's being passed around:

Larry Fitzgerald: 8 years, $128 million ($50 million guaranteed)
Vincent Jackson: 5 years, $55,555,555*** ($26 million guaranteed)
DeSean Jackson: 5 years, $47 million ($15 million guaranteed)
Marques Colston: 5 years, $36.3 million ($17.7 million guaranteed)

***Notice that the total value of VJax's contract is ocho cincos.

People have been saying that we have never paid such big dollars to a receiver.

Well, instead of comparing Wallace to other receivers around the league, let's compare him to other Steelers who signed extensions within the last year.

LaMarr Woodley: 6 years, $61.5 million ($22.5 million guaranteed, including a $13 million signing bonus)
Troy Polamalu: 4 years, $36.5 million ($10.55 million signing bonus)
Lawrence Timmons: 6 years, $50 million ($11 million signing bonus)
Ike Taylor: 4 years, $28 million ($7.25 million signing bonus)

In terms of overall importance to the team, where does a top-notch deep threat entering the prime of his NFL career rank in terms of overall importance to the team when compared to the two linebackers entering the primes of their careers or the two members of the secondary who are now over the age of 30?

I know many will hold firm to their notion that "anything over $8 million and we should send him packing," but if you compare him to other Steelers who got extensions recently, doesn't it seem like Wallace should be slotted somewhere between Timmons and Polamalu in the middle of those 4 contracts?

I suggested a while back that Mike Wallace's contract could end up looking like Sidney Crosby's last contract (which he should be extending next week for 10 more years). Sid's last deal was for 5 years, $43.5 million ($8.7 million per year). That is essentially right smack dab in between the Timmons and Polamalu deals.

The sticking point could be the amount of the signing bonus, which if we followed precedent from last year would be in the neighborhood of $11 million or so. That would give us a yearly cap hit of $2.2 worth of signing bonus...if we gave him a veteran minimum salary ($750,000) in year one, his overall cap hit would be $2.95 million for this season, which would fit under the cap as currently constituted (see the other thread which shows our current cap space as $3.58 million). If Wallace's contract was structured as such, that would leave us with $630,000 after a Wallace 5 year, $43.5 dollar extension with an $11 million signing bonus (which would be the second fewest in the league, but still a shade more than Baltimore's $606,000 of available cap space as we speak).

If we wanted to sign Max Starks if his rehab progresses as we move through camp and the preseason, then we'd have to cut Jon Scott in order to make room (but we knew that already...if we had a healthy Max, there would be no need for Jon Scott anyway).

I believe that Wallace's 1st round RFA tender already counts against the Steelers' salary cap...I think that the $3.58 mil is in addition to that...

While Wallace hasn't signed the tender, the Steelers offered it, so they have to count it, IIRC...

RuthlessBurgher
06-25-2012, 10:00 PM
I believe that Wallace's 1st round RFA tender already counts against the Steelers' salary cap...I think that the $3.58 mil is in addition to that...

While Wallace hasn't signed the tender, the Steelers offered it, so they have to count it, IIRC...

You may be right...even though he hasn't officially signed it yet, the $2.7 million RFA tender may already be figured into that cap figure...even better!!! Good call...

In that case, if his cap hit is already counted as $2.7 million right now, and I figured that his 2012 cap hit could potentially be $2.95 million after my proposed extension, that means that the only additional cap hit would potentially be a quarter million (leaving us with $3.33 million to play with). Wanna extend Antonio Brown's contract now too? :)

papillon
06-25-2012, 10:04 PM
We've all been comparing Wallace to other receivers (makes sense, right?).

The number's being passed around:

Larry Fitzgerald: 8 years, $128 million ($50 million guaranteed)
Vincent Jackson: 5 years, $55,555,555*** ($26 million guaranteed)
DeSean Jackson: 5 years, $47 million ($15 million guaranteed)
Marques Colston: 5 years, $36.3 million ($17.7 million guaranteed)

***Notice that the total value of VJax's contract is ocho cincos.

People have been saying that we have never paid such big dollars to a receiver.

Well, instead of comparing Wallace to other receivers around the league, let's compare him to other Steelers who signed extensions within the last year.

LaMarr Woodley: 6 years, $61.5 million ($22.5 million guaranteed, including a $13 million signing bonus)
Troy Polamalu: 4 years, $36.5 million ($10.55 million signing bonus)
Lawrence Timmons: 6 years, $50 million ($11 million signing bonus)
Ike Taylor: 4 years, $28 million ($7.25 million signing bonus)

In terms of overall importance to the team, where does a top-notch deep threat entering the prime of his NFL career rank in terms of overall importance to the team when compared to the two linebackers entering the primes of their careers or the two members of the secondary who are now over the age of 30?

I know many will hold firm to their notion that "anything over $8 million and we should send him packing," but if you compare him to other Steelers who got extensions recently, doesn't it seem like Wallace should be slotted somewhere between Timmons and Polamalu in the middle of those 4 contracts?

I suggested a while back that Mike Wallace's contract could end up looking like Sidney Crosby's last contract (which he should be extending next week for 10 more years). Sid's last deal was for 5 years, $43.5 million ($8.7 million per year). That is essentially right smack dab in between the Timmons and Polamalu deals.

The sticking point could be the amount of the signing bonus, which if we followed precedent from last year would be in the neighborhood of $11 million or so. That would give us a yearly cap hit of $2.2 worth of signing bonus...if we gave him a veteran minimum salary ($750,000) in year one, his overall cap hit would be $2.95 million for this season, which would fit under the cap as currently constituted (see the other thread which shows our current cap space as $3.58 million). If Wallace's contract was structured as such, that would leave us with $630,000 after a Wallace 5 year, $43.5 dollar extension with an $11 million signing bonus (which would be the second fewest in the league, but still a shade more than Baltimore's $606,000 of available cap space as we speak).

If we wanted to sign Max Starks if his rehab progresses as we move through camp and the preseason, then we'd have to cut Jon Scott in order to make room (but we knew that already...if we had a healthy Max, there would be no need for Jon Scott anyway).

Wallace isn't as important to the offense as any one of those four defensive players are to the defense, IMHO. So, I wouldn't expect that the Steelers are going to pay him like any of those guys. Taylor's contract isn't too bad and if Wallace would take some thing like that the Steelers would probably do the deal. Of course, they would then have to cut some salary somewhere to clear the space with 3.58 million available and Wallacews being worth approximately 7 million per.

Pappy

RuthlessBurgher
06-25-2012, 10:13 PM
Of course, they would then have to cut some salary somewhere to clear the space with 3.58 million available and Wallacews being worth approximately 7 million per.

Not necessarily, Pap. Traditionally, in the first year of a new contract, the player gets only a veteran minimum salary in year one (plus the pro-rated portion of the signing bonus, of course), so his cap hit under an extension might be just a little bit more than the $2.7M RFA tender value he was scheduled to make in 2012 anyway...even though Wallace gets to pocket all of that signing bonus from the moment he puts pen to paper.

In hockey, the average salary over the length of the contract is the yearly cap hit...there is no massaging it from one year to the next. But in football, we can minimize his cap hit over the first two years while we are in cap jail, then have larger cap hits in 2014 and later when the new TV contract money is due to raise the cap significantly.

hawaiiansteel
06-25-2012, 10:43 PM
Wanna extend Antonio Brown's contract now too? :)

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Yes+Please+do_e50328_3582256.jpg