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View Full Version : Let's play "Who would you pick..."



steelblood
03-27-2012, 02:15 PM
If you were the Steelers GM on draft day, who would you pick if the top 23 picks were...
(This scenario supposes that you are unsuccessful trading up or down)

1. Andrew Luck QB Stanford
2. Robert Griffin QB Baylor
3. Matt Kalil OT USC
4. Trent Richardson RB Alabama
5. Morris Claiborne CB LSU
6. Justin Blackmon WR OSU
7. Michael Floyd WR Notre Dame
8. Ryan Tannehill QB Texas A&M
9. Quinton Coples DE N Carolina
10 Riley Reiff OT Iowa
11. Dontari Poe NT Memphis
12. Luke Kuechly LB Boston College
13. Melvin Ingram DE S Carolina
14. David DeCastro OG Stanford
15. Whitney Mercilus DE Illinois
16. Courtney Upshaw LB Alabama
17. Cordy Glenn OL Georgia
18. Donta Hightower LB Alabama
19. Michael Brockers DT LSU
20. Dre Kirkpatrick CB Alabama
21. Fletcher Cox DT Mississippi St
22. Mark Barron SS Alabama
23. Jonathan Martin OT Stanford

Some of the top players left on the board...

David Wilson RB Va Tech
Kendall Wright WR Baylor
Mike Adams OT Ohio State
Stephon Gilmore CB S Carolina
Alshon Jeffrey WR S Carolina
Devon Still DT PSU
Stephen Hill WR Georgia Tech
Zach Brown LB N Carolina
Nick Perry DE USC
Coby Fleener TE Stanford
Janoris Jenkins CB North Alabama
Peter Konz C Wisconsin
Alfonso Denard CB Nebraska
Kendall Reyes DT UConn
Jerel Worthy DT Michigan State
Lamar Miller RB Miami
Zerbie Sanders OT FSU
Andre Branch DE Clemson
Mychal Kendricks LB California
Kevin Zeitler OG Wisconsin

Dee Dub
03-27-2012, 02:42 PM
Some of the top players left on the board...

David Wilson RB Va Tech
Kendall Wright WR Baylor
Mike Adams OT Ohio State
Stephon Gilmore CB S Carolina
Alshon Jeffrey WR S Carolina
Devon Still DT PSU
Stephen Hill WR Georgia Tech
Zach Brown LB N Carolina
Nick Perry DE USC
Coby Fleener TE Stanford
Janoris Jenkins CB North Alabama
Peter Konz C Wisconsin
Alfonso Denard CB Nebraska
Kendall Reyes DT UConn
Jerel Worthy DT Michigan State
Lamar Miller RB Miami
Zerbie Sanders OT FSU
Andre Branch DE Clemson
Mychal Kendricks LB California
Kevin Zeitler OG Wisconsin

Gotta go with highest rated on your board. I am not reaching on a player (Mike Adams), just because it fills a need.

I would go with Stephone Gilmore or Alshon Jeffrey. Still and Worthy may be higher rated however, I see them playing in a 3-4 at a position where the Steelers already are covered. I do not see Jerel Worthy as a NT in a 3-4.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
03-27-2012, 02:46 PM
I will play on my board.

If it unfolds this way...First choice would be to trade out of the spot. My target would be Lamar Miller.

If I have to pick at that spot, it comes down to Perry or Hill. Now that would be difficult. They are both "potential" picks. Hard to pass up a pass rusher...Although Hill would contribute more year one. Being that the team struggled last year to pressure the QB when Harrison or Woodley was out...I would have to go with Perry.


In case you didn't notice...Don't like Adams or Worthy at #24.

grotonsteel
03-27-2012, 02:54 PM
I would go with Stephone Gilmore or Nick Perry or Jerel Worthy

Shawn
03-27-2012, 03:20 PM
Zack Brown or Jerel Worthy

steelerkeylargo
03-27-2012, 03:42 PM
Gilmore will be a top 18 pick so lets not even worry about it.

RuthlessBurgher
03-27-2012, 03:54 PM
Gotta go with highest rated on your board. I am not reaching on a player (Mike Adams), just because it fills a need.

I would go with Stephone Gilmore or Alshon Jeffrey. Still and Worthy may be higher rated however, I see them playing in a 3-4 at a position where the Steelers already are covered. I do not see Jerel Worthy as a NT in a 3-4.

Gilmore and Jeffrey are the two names on that list which stood out to me as well.

Oviedo
03-27-2012, 04:48 PM
I will play on my board.

If it unfolds this way...First choice would be to trade out of the spot. My target would be Lamar Miller.

If I have to pick at that spot, it comes down to Perry or Hill. Now that would be difficult. They are both "potential" picks. Hard to pass up a pass rusher...Although Hill would contribute more year one. Being that the team struggled last year to pressure the QB when Harrison or Woodley was out...I would have to go with Perry.


In case you didn't notice...Don't like Adams or Worthy at #24.

I also would not go Adams or Worthy.

I would select Peter Konz and have him pay Guard initially but get a player with the flexibility to step in at Center if Pouncey continues to lose time due to leg injuries. Konz is the highest rated player at his position left on the board and fills a position of need. I think if you can get the best player at his position in the draft at #24 then you seriously consider that.

If I view this purely as a luxury pick then I look at Coby Fleenor (Best TE in draft) or Stephen Hill.

steelblood
03-27-2012, 05:36 PM
Gilmore will be a top 18 pick so lets not even worry about it.

Perhaps. Many draft gurus have him going between 20 and 35. Still, even if you are correct, no reason for the attitude.

pittpete
03-27-2012, 05:56 PM
Peter Konz C Wisconsin

I would select Peter Konz and have him pay Guard initially but get a player with the flexibility to step in at Center if Pouncey continues to lose time due to leg injuries

I was thinking the same thing Oviedo

Eddie Spaghetti
03-27-2012, 06:02 PM
I would go jeffrey.

no way I touch konz at 24.

flippy
03-27-2012, 06:23 PM
I'd take a long hard look at Janoris Jenkins. That kid's got top end talent and shouldn't be on the board when we pick. If he is, it could be a huge gift.

NJ-STEELER
03-27-2012, 06:28 PM
i'd try like heck to get to 22 and draft martin (shouldnt cost too much moving uo 2 spots)

or pick jeffery or fleener at 24

RuthlessBurgher
03-27-2012, 06:37 PM
i'd try like heck to get to 22 and draft martin (shouldnt cost too much moving uo 2 spots)

or pick jeffery or fleener at 24

I'd give up a 4th rounder to leapfrog the Lions to take Martin (of course, that would mean that Cleveland would be willing to help us out, which is doubtful, since they own pick #22 from Atlanta).

pfelix73
03-27-2012, 10:15 PM
If Poe would be there- that would be the best pick. We need help right in the middle of the defense. Both the NG position and the LB position with the loss of Farrior are the 2 biggest needs on defense. You gotta be able to stop the run, or this team will be in trouble... If Poe is gone- it's gotta be Hightower.. Plus,I think both of these guys would contribute off the field in Pittsburgh as well. They both seem to be great human beings and what the Steelers look for.

Just my 2 cents..

Mister Pittsburgh
03-28-2012, 12:08 AM
Kendall Wright. Type his name into YouTube & watch the basketball highlight video to see what kind of athlete he is. You will see a person 5'11" dunking over people & throwing down alleyoops.

steelblood
03-28-2012, 08:30 AM
If Poe would be there- that would be the best pick. We need help right in the middle of the defense. Both the NG position and the LB position with the loss of Farrior are the 2 biggest needs on defense. You gotta be able to stop the run, or this team will be in trouble... If Poe is gone- it's gotta be Hightower.. Plus,I think both of these guys would contribute off the field in Pittsburgh as well. They both seem to be great human beings and what the Steelers look for.

Just my 2 cents..

Poe and Hightower are both off the board in this scenario.

pfelix73
03-28-2012, 09:48 AM
Oops. Sorry- Heck, I didn't look at that list too well.....

Good scenario. Let me think about it some and redo mine....

:D

Oviedo
03-28-2012, 09:56 AM
I would go jeffrey.

no way I touch konz at 24.

You are selling me more and more that Konz is the right choice:wink:

Eddie Spaghetti
03-28-2012, 10:12 AM
You are selling me more and more that Konz is the right choice:wink:

cj spiller!!!!!

phillyesq
03-28-2012, 10:24 AM
I'd go for the higher ranked of Still and Worthy, assuming that a trade back was not possible. I'd also consider Gilmore.

pfelix73
03-28-2012, 04:57 PM
I'd go with Worthy or even the RB out of Va Tech if we don't sign another RB before the draft.

insanesteelersfan
03-28-2012, 10:57 PM
There is no way the draft will go like that, so it is irrelevant. Jenkins will go to Cincy. He's too perfect for that bunch of criminals. Hightower WILL be at 24, And maybe even Glenn, but unlikely. I still say we trade down if Konz is there. Both Baltimore and Green Bay will want him.

Chadman
03-28-2012, 11:05 PM
Chadman's choice would be Devon Still- he's a beast. After that, Adams, Worthy or Kendall wright.

Chadman believes the Steelers would go Adams, Worthy, Still in this situation, however.

Honestly- would be happy with either of the players Chadman has mentioned- all good players.

Discipline of Steel
03-29-2012, 06:58 AM
I would go with Worthy for the simple facts that i am a Spartan and the timing for a dominant NT is here. 3-4...4-3... meh...

Oviedo
03-29-2012, 08:00 AM
Chadman's choice would be Devon Still- he's a beast. After that, Adams, Worthy or Kendall wright.

Chadman believes the Steelers would go Adams, Worthy, Still in this situation, however.

Honestly- would be happy with either of the players Chadman has mentioned- all good players.

Even as a huge Penn State fan and alumnus I would have real concerns about Still. He had one great season but also had lots of injuries. He also doesn't fix our greatest need...improve the OL! Keep our eye on the #1 priority...IMPROVE THE OL!!!!!

Slapstick
03-29-2012, 08:34 AM
Personally, I think that there is a very good possibility that either Glenn or DeCastro will be there...

While an OG being selected in the teens has happened in past drafts, it is certainly not a common thing...

Oviedo
03-29-2012, 08:56 AM
Personally, I think that there is a very good possibility that either Glenn or DeCastro will be there...

While an OG being selected in the teens has happened in past drafts, it is certainly not a common thing...

That would be nice but I think we would have to trade up to the #20 range to get one of them. IMO Glenn will go a little early because of the "possibility" he can play OT and DeCastro because he is #1 at his position. There just seems to be a trend over the past few years that teams are willing to use mid Round 1 picks on interior linemen which was rarely done in the past.

Chadman
03-29-2012, 09:41 AM
Even as a huge Penn State fan and alumnus I would have real concerns about Still. He had one great season but also had lots of injuries. He also doesn't fix our greatest need...improve the OL! Keep our eye on the #1 priority...IMPROVE THE OL!!!!!

You don't think a 2nd or 3rd round player could fix the OL? It has to be a 1st round player?

If the better value is in other positions, why reach?

Slapstick
03-29-2012, 10:10 AM
Is it really a trend? Let's see...I'm honestly not sure...

Interior linemen drafted in round 1 over the last 10 years:

2011 - Mike Pouncey #15; Danny Watkins #23
2010 - Mike Iupati #17; Maurkice Pouncey #18
2009 - Alex Mack #21; Eric Wood #28
2008 - None
2007 - Ben Grubbs #29
2006 - Davin Joseph #23; Nick Mangold #29
2005 - Logan Mankins #32
2004 - None
2003 - Jeff Faine #21
2002 - Kendall Simmons #30

Oviedo
03-29-2012, 10:48 AM
You don't think a 2nd or 3rd round player could fix the OL? It has to be a 1st round player?

If the better value is in other positions, why reach?


Not sure they provide the immediate help we need from day 1. Problem with us is that we are always at or near the bottom of Round 2 and 3. That means that we can't get a guy like Zeitler who I like alot.

RuthlessBurgher
03-29-2012, 10:54 AM
Not sure they provide the immediate help we need from day 1. Problem with us is that we are always at or near the bottom of Round 2 and 3. That means that we can't get a guy like Zeitler who I like alot.

Trading up isn't limited to the first round. You can take the best player available in round 1, then trade up for the o-lineman you want in round 2.

pfelix73
03-29-2012, 11:26 AM
Even as a huge Penn State fan and alumnus I would have real concerns about Still. He had one great season but also had lots of injuries. He also doesn't fix our greatest need...improve the OL! Keep our eye on the #1 priority...IMPROVE THE OL!!!!!

Again, this is just your perspective.. I believe we have greater needs elsewhere. Gotta be able to stop the run, or our offense won't be on the field all that much anyway.

With the losses we've just had from cuts, injuries, retirements, our greatest needs, in my opinion, are right up the middle of the defense. NG and ILB. And you can throw in CB too. And if Mendenhall isn't in their future plans, a RB albeit via FA or the draft is also a need.

:tt1

Oviedo
03-29-2012, 12:46 PM
Again, this is just your perspective.. I believe we have greater needs elsewhere. Gotta be able to stop the run, or our offense won't be on the field all that much anyway.

With the losses we've just had from cuts, injuries, retirements, our greatest needs, in my opinion, are right up the middle of the defense. NG and ILB. And you can throw in CB too. And if Mendenhall isn't in their future plans, a RB albeit via FA or the draft is also a need.

:tt1

I guess the emphasis on stopping the run is your perspective. How many teams beat us last year with the run? Passing will beat us and getting someone to get into a death grip with the Center is not going to win many games. If you want defense add another player who can actually cover man to man or actually play a game in Denver or get to the opposing QB. Getting holders and grapplers for the DL isn't what we need on defense we need pass defenders and attacking DL.

We mostly need OL to protect the most important player on our team who if he goes down for a length of time we aren't winning anything.

ikestops85
03-29-2012, 12:57 PM
I guess the emphasis on stopping the run is your perspective. How many teams beat us last year with the run? Passing will beat us and getting someone to get into a death grip with the Center is not going to win many games. If you want defense add another player who can actually cover man to man or actually play a game in Denver or get to the opposing QB. Getting holders and grapplers for the DL isn't what we need on defense we need pass defenders and attacking DL.

We mostly need OL to protect the most important player on our team who if he goes down for a length of time we aren't winning anything.

I do agree that we need to protect our QB. Ben is the difference between making the playoffs and winning a SB. He isn't getting any younger and it will start taking him longer to come back from injuries. In my mind I hope Glenn is still on the board @ 24 so we can get him. Improving the O line will go a long way to making the offense more consistent and not always relying on Ben pulling the rabbit out of the hat.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
03-29-2012, 01:39 PM
I would hope the Steelers try to trade out of #24 to take Adams if the likes of Kuechly, DeCastro, Poe, Glenn, are gone. Now seeing how the brass traveled and who they seemed to be very interested in...I would say Mike Adams & Lamar Miller are truely options the Steelers are looking at very seriously.

If they take Adams, one would assume they feel he is motivated. Adams on his game is a franchise LT...He has very good feet and body control. He is some coaching away on his technique from realizing it. That would also say that "Colon to G" happens or Gilbert to G. If they sit at #24 and take Adams..I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Adams playing to his potential could be a steal at #24. For that...Someone might value Adams and take him ahead of the Steelers.

I also wouldn't be surprised if Lamar Miller ends up being the pick if they could trade down. I know everyone loves Redman, so do I. We want to see Dwyer get his chance. Like I have said before, I don't like the top of this draft. If players are off the board that "could" fill a need and the Steelers get a partner who wants to come up and get a pass rusher...They will trade back. Sitting at the botom of round 1 and BPA could very well be Miller. Although RB isn't the biggest need in many views on this board...Mendy on the PUP and Todd Haley running the offense tells me he would be a welcomed pick. Big program...Just turning 21 at the draft...Ceiling "elite"....Don't be surprised. I will have two "Trade Down" mocks in my sig....The other will be with Miller.

grotonsteel
03-29-2012, 05:40 PM
I would hope the Steelers try to trade out of #24 to take Adams if the likes of Kuechly, DeCastro, Poe, Glenn, are gone. Now seeing how the brass traveled and who they seemed to be very interested in...I would say Mike Adams & Lamar Miller are truely options the Steelers are looking at very seriously.

If they take Adams, one would assume they feel he is motivated. Adams on his game is a franchise LT...He has very good feet and body control. He is some coaching away on his technique from realizing it. That would also say that "Colon to G" happens or Gilbert to G. If they sit at #24 and take Adams..I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Adams playing to his potential could be a steal at #24. For that...Someone might value Adams and take him ahead of the Steelers.

I also wouldn't be surprised if Lamar Miller ends up being the pick if they could trade down. I know everyone loves Redman, so do I. We want to see Dwyer get his chance. Like I have said before, I don't like the top of this draft. If players are off the board that "could" fill a need and the Steelers get a partner who wants to come up and get a pass rusher...They will trade back. Sitting at the botom of round 1 and BPA could very well be Miller. Although RB isn't the biggest need in many views on this board...Mendy on the PUP and Todd Haley running the offense tells me he would be a welcomed pick. Big program...Just turning 21 at the draft...Ceiling "elite"....Don't be surprised. I will have two "Trade Down" mocks in my sig....The other will be with Miller.

I have not seen Lamar Miller play much but i saw his highlights on You Tube and i think he is a home run threat.

Oviedo
03-29-2012, 06:19 PM
I would hope the Steelers try to trade out of #24 to take Adams if the likes of Kuechly, DeCastro, Poe, Glenn, are gone. Now seeing how the brass traveled and who they seemed to be very interested in...I would say Mike Adams & Lamar Miller are truely options the Steelers are looking at very seriously.

If they take Adams, one would assume they feel he is motivated. Adams on his game is a franchise LT...He has very good feet and body control. He is some coaching away on his technique from realizing it. That would also say that "Colon to G" happens or Gilbert to G. If they sit at #24 and take Adams..I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Adams playing to his potential could be a steal at #24. For that...Someone might value Adams and take him ahead of the Steelers.

I also wouldn't be surprised if Lamar Miller ends up being the pick if they could trade down. I know everyone loves Redman, so do I. We want to see Dwyer get his chance. Like I have said before, I don't like the top of this draft. If players are off the board that "could" fill a need and the Steelers get a partner who wants to come up and get a pass rusher...They will trade back. Sitting at the botom of round 1 and BPA could very well be Miller. Although RB isn't the biggest need in many views on this board...Mendy on the PUP and Todd Haley running the offense tells me he would be a welcomed pick. Big program...Just turning 21 at the draft...Ceiling "elite"....Don't be surprised. I will have two "Trade Down" mocks in my sig....The other will be with Miller.

We seem to hope every year to trade out of where we are in Round 1 but never do we find any joy or a trading partner. If Adams is the choice then I hope we do trade but won't hold my breath.

pfelix73
03-29-2012, 08:02 PM
My perspective regarding the middle of the defense and the lack thereof stems from Hampton being on the shelf with an injury, Hoke retiring, Farrior being cut, and then CB wise- Gay signing with the Cards. Our CB's seem to be avg. behind Ike, and sometimes I think he is avg. too. There is no depth at both ILB and NG. There are OL on this team that are young and can compete. They need to be given a chance. Let's face it- it's always the same when it comes to Ben and the OL. Whether it's 2007, 2009, or 2012. He winds up in situations where you can have an all-world caliber OL with all pro-bowlers and he's STILL gonna get sacked moreso than other QB's. That's just the nature of the beast.

But from a depth point of view- we have very little at NG and ILB. So, because of that, I would guess that's where they will spend most of their time drafting. Sure, draft an OG in the later rounds- OG is a deep position this year, so taking one in rounds 3 or 4 would be good move for more competition up front. Heck, I'd be for Zeitler in the 2nd if they could grab him. Need a RB in there too and probably a TE. But we don't need to draft 2 OG's and 2 OT's like some of these mock drafts people have on here- that's just not practical in my book....

RuthlessBurgher
03-30-2012, 10:16 AM
My perspective regarding the middle of the defense and the lack thereof stems from Hampton being on the shelf with an injury, Hoke retiring, Farrior being cut, and then CB wise- Gay signing with the Cards. Our CB's seem to be avg. behind Ike, and sometimes I think he is avg. too. There is no depth at both ILB and NG. There are OL on this team that are young and can compete. They need to be given a chance. Let's face it- it's always the same when it comes to Ben and the OL. Whether it's 2007, 2009, or 2012. He winds up in situations where you can have an all-world caliber OL with all pro-bowlers and he's STILL gonna get sacked moreso than other QB's. That's just the nature of the beast.

But from a depth point of view- we have very little at NG and ILB. So, because of that, I would guess that's where they will spend most of their time drafting. Sure, draft an OG in the later rounds- OG is a deep position this year, so taking one in rounds 3 or 4 would be good move for more competition up front. Heck, I'd be for Zeitler in the 2nd if they could grab him. Need a RB in there too and probably a TE. But we don't need to draft 2 OG's and 2 OT's like some of these mock drafts people have on here- that's just not practical in my book....

If Hampton gets hurt again, McLendon steps in. If McLendon gets hurt too, then we could move Hood to NT between Keisel and Heyward. We should also have someone like Al Woods or Kade Weston on the practice squad. That's reasonable depth. At ILB, Timmons and Foote start and are backed up by Sylvester and Mortty Ivy. Could we upgrade these spots with a look to the future (heir apparants to Hampton and Farrior)? Sure, we could. But we could also update on Legursky and Foster as our starting guards (your comment about Ben's style regardless of the OL talent holds water, but the guys we've had on the line in recent years cannot open up decent holes for the running game either, particular in short yardage and goalline situations). I see NT or ILB selections as picks for the future (depth for the present), while a dominant guard prospect could benefit us both now and later as well. The good thing is that Colbert's hands aren't tied to the point where he HAS TO use a premium selection on a certain position (because that leads to reaching and reaching is bad *cough*Troy Edwards*cough*). Using our premium selections on any of these positions would be helpful. I would not be surprised whatsoever if the front office through us a complete curveball and went for a Stephon Gilmore or a Mark Barron (if available as a BPA selection) instead of an o-lineman, d-lineman, or a linebacker as we all tend to be assuming.

Sugar
03-30-2012, 10:34 AM
IMO, we can and should go BPA. While I'd love to have Keuchly, if there's a better guy on the board when we pick we should take him (with the exception of a QB).

steelz09
03-30-2012, 02:47 PM
I'll admit that I'm not familiar with all of the players you listed but I would have to choose between these 3:

Gilmore
Worthy
Konz

Shoe
03-31-2012, 07:04 PM
Personally, I think that there is a very good possibility that either Glenn or DeCastro will be there...

While an OG being selected in the teens has happened in past drafts, it is certainly not a common thing...

DeCastro is a possibility? From what I've read, he's long-gone by time we pick. If he falls to anywhere near our neighborhood (i.e. #16-19), we need to go Troy Polamalu/2003, and trade up to get him.

People are citing our D-line woes... and yes: they've been more mediocre than anything else. But we can't keep spending #1's there, especially if all we're going to get are average guys like Hood/Heyward.

OTOH, look at our O-line. Right now, our most dependable guy may be Ramon Foster. Gilbert seemed to be nicked a lot last year, Colon is obvious, and POUNCEY. THe guy who is supposed to be our anchor... his ankle problems can probably be considered chronic at this point. People seem to be counting Pouncey as a sure-thing. He's FAR from a sure thing as far as I'm concerned.

That being the case, I guess I'd take Konz. Not thrilled about it though.

pittpete
04-01-2012, 01:23 AM
if all we're going to get are average guys like Hood/Heyward
I wouldnt label Heyward average just yet.
Give the rook a chance man;)

Shoe
04-01-2012, 02:10 AM
I wouldnt label Heyward average just yet.
Give the rook a chance man;)

Ha! No, you are right. I'm definitely guilty of pre-judging Heyward, based on Hood (who has basically shown himself as a ham & egger as far as I'm concerned). I'm not backing off my statement (i.e. I do think Heyward is just another guy), but I do hope he proves me wrong.

Chadman
04-01-2012, 06:00 AM
Given that the Steelers have tipped their hat & shown they are looking at LT's (Hello Demetrius Bell), Chadman is going to stick with Mike Adams at the top of the list unless Bell is signed. The team does not currently have a genuine LT on the roster...

insanesteelersfan
04-01-2012, 10:58 AM
Donatari' Poe ???? Well maybe, if you belive this report on Poe.


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/04/01/scout-on-dontari-poe-watch-him-play-he-didnt-do-anything/


Now I still think Poe will get drafted before 24. And I was never really sold on Poe for us even back when alot of experts had him going to us because they said we needed a NT. But Poe has never played NT before. But, the story saying Poe never really did anything at Memphis is a little inaccurate to me. Poe was on a very BAD Memphis defense. And Poe was double, and sometimes triple-teamed to make sure HE did not make the defensive play. Rather make the rest of the Memphis defensive players make the plays cause they were average players. So how any scout can say Poe is overrated based on the fact he didn't make alot of plays is unfair. If you say compare Poe to another pure junior player like DT " Fletcher Cox "...both of whom played the same 35 college games, Poe's total tackles and TFL's, and sacks actually are about the same. But Fletcher played on a Mississippi State team that DID have other very good defensive players, thereby not always seeing the attention by the opposing teams offensive players to prevent him from getting the opportunity to make plays.


But either way as I said, regardless of the story, I feel Poe will be gone by 24. And, I don't think Poe will ever be happy playing in a 3-4 defense....kinda like Albert Haynesworth.

Mister Pittsburgh
04-01-2012, 01:53 PM
I still think there is a chance we go 4-3 in the next couple years, which would negate the need for a NT. So I could sees 4-3 type DL or s LB they feel could play in the 4-3.

Shoe
04-01-2012, 05:16 PM
If all we want is a 34 NT, then why spend our 1st, when there are a few others who can do the same thing out there for less cost. Ta'amu has similar numbers (that being said, I don't want Ta'amu). Josh Chapman seems very much like Casey Hampton (even the bad knees! I would like Chapman, in Rd 2-4). Why spend on Poe here?

Besides, I think McLendon has the potential to fill that role. And as far as I know, the coaching staff may think so too.

steelz09
04-01-2012, 09:51 PM
Shoe,

I think Hood played "average" last year but I saw enough from Heyward that I have hopes that he'll be much better than Hood before long.

I also completely agree about Pouncey. Didn't his brother also struggle w/ ankle injuries this past year? Coincidence? I think not.

With all this being said, I would have no problem w/ trading up to get DeCastro or staying put and drafting Konz if Glenn is not available.

I know Tomlin loves "position flexibility" but I think he takes it too far and it has hurt this team.. I'd rather have an elite guy (& trade away a pick to get him) then another average guy that has "position flexibility". I think this team is staying too "average" at many positions and we need to get better.

insanesteelersfan
04-01-2012, 10:37 PM
Hood is a Monster. Far far better then Aaron Smith was when he was early on in his career. Hood led the league in QB pressures last season, something like 22 hurries. And QB pressure...not Sacks are what broke the pipe. Hood is an already proven Beast! To call him average is like saying " Reggie White " was an AVERAGE Player :-)

RuthlessBurgher
04-02-2012, 10:10 AM
I still think there is a chance we go 4-3 in the next couple years, which would negate the need for a NT. So I could sees 4-3 type DL or s LB they feel could play in the 4-3.

Even in a 4-3, you do typically employ a nose tackle type (he'd be a 1 technique lining up in the center-guard gap rather than a strict 3-4 NT zero-technique who lines up directly over the center, but he's still a big ole burly fellow) and then a 3-technique who is more of a penetrating DT. Think Pat Williams (with the Casey gut) and Kevin Williams (with the more athletic build) of the Vikings, respectively (well, Pat's not there anymore, but you get my drift).

http://www.wdaz.com/media/full/jpg/2009/10/14/williamswall.jpg

steelz09
04-02-2012, 10:18 AM
Hood is a Monster. Far far better then Aaron Smith was when he was early on in his career. Hood led the league in QB pressures last season, something like 22 hurries. And QB pressure...not Sacks are what broke the pipe. Hood is an already proven Beast! To call him average is like saying " Reggie White " was an AVERAGE Player :-)

I think I need to add an item to the code of conduct.

1) No mentioning of Reggie White and Ziggy Hood in the same sentence

just kidding :)

steelz09
04-02-2012, 10:27 AM
Even in a 4-3, you do typically employ a nose tackle type (he'd be a 1 technique lining up in the center-guard gap rather than a strict 3-4 NT zero-technique who lines up directly over the center, but he's still a big ole burly fellow) and then a 3-technique who is more of a penetrating DT. Think Pat Williams (with the Casey gut) and Kevin Williams (with the more athletic build) of the Vikings, respectively (well, Pat's not there anymore, but you get my drift).

http://www.wdaz.com/media/full/jpg/2009/10/14/williamswall.jpg


I personally think we should stay 3-4 but we need to make improvements that will allow us to get pressue on the QB without having to send the house.

I do think that a 4-3 is very possible and we may be more prepared for a transition now than ever before. A few thoughts:

- Heyward and Ziggy could play 4-3 DT
- Timmons would be better as a 4-3 ILB than a 3-4 ILB. Timmons is a good 3-4 ILB but he would be great in a 4-3.
- Woodley could play DE
- Keisel **could** play RDE but I wouldn't think that would be the long term answer. #1 would be his age and #2 I think we would want someone a bit more athletic.

RuthlessBurgher
04-02-2012, 12:07 PM
I personally think we should stay 3-4 but we need to make improvements that will allow us to get pressue on the QB without having to send the house.

I do think that a 4-3 is very possible and we may be more prepared for a transition now than ever before. A few thoughts:

- Heyward and Ziggy could play 4-3 DT
- Timmons would be better as a 4-3 ILB than a 3-4 ILB. Timmons is a good 3-4 ILB but he would be great in a 4-3.
- Woodley could play DE
- Keisel **could** play RDE but I wouldn't think that would be the long term answer. #1 would be his age and #2 I think we would want someone a bit more athletic.

We know for sure now that Timmons is a better 3-4 ILB than 3-4 OBL, but I think in the 4-3 defense, Timmons would be a better OLB than MLB (he's always been compared to a Derrick Brooks, who was a prototypical weakside 4-3 OLB).

A better 4-3 MLB would be someone like your pal Luke Kuechly. :stirpot (I couldn't help but go there). :p

Oviedo
04-02-2012, 01:36 PM
We know for sure now that Timmons is a better 3-4 ILB than 3-4 OBL, but I think in the 4-3 defense, Timmons would be a better OLB than MLB (he's always been compared to a Derrick Brooks, who was a prototypical weakside 4-3 OLB).

A better 4-3 MLB would be someone like your pal Luke Kuechly. :stirpot (I couldn't help but go there). :p

Yep...move Timmons to the outside in a 4-3. You would be wasting him inside. IMO Harrison would be the better MLB with Woodley playing his natural position at DE.

A switch to the 4-3 would not be hard as I have said for a couple of years. Most beneficial it would allow you to keep a stream of talent coming in from the college ranks and getting them to play positions they already play instead of "converting" over the course of 2-3 years and taking a chance they might be able to play a new position.

Shoe
04-02-2012, 08:10 PM
Let's not turn this into one of the hundreds of other 4-3 vs. 3-4 threads... To the one who called Ziggy Hood a monster, please push away from the paint chips. You compared him to Aaron Smith, and I looked it up... Smith had 8 sacks in his 3rd year. That's more than Ziggy's whole career.

Actually, I'm not even sure if you were being serious or not. If it was sarcasm, I apologize. I'm not usually that dense. :P

steelz09
04-03-2012, 12:42 PM
Let's not turn this into one of the hundreds of other 4-3 vs. 3-4 threads... To the one who called Ziggy Hood a monster, please push away from the paint chips. You compared him to Aaron Smith, and I looked it up... Smith had 8 sacks in his 3rd year. That's more than Ziggy's whole career.

Actually, I'm not even sure if you were being serious or not. If it was sarcasm, I apologize. I'm not usually that dense. :P

Come on now.... he said calling Hood average was like calling Reggie White average :)

Oviedo
04-03-2012, 01:11 PM
Let's not turn this into one of the hundreds of other 4-3 vs. 3-4 threads... To the one who called Ziggy Hood a monster, please push away from the paint chips. You compared him to Aaron Smith, and I looked it up... Smith had 8 sacks in his 3rd year. That's more than Ziggy's whole career.

Actually, I'm not even sure if you were being serious or not. If it was sarcasm, I apologize. I'm not usually that dense. :P

Why not discuss. We have at least 22,000 posts before we catch up to the "we hate Arians" world record.

Seriously though, the issue of 4-3 versus 3-4 is valid even though no change will occur as long as LeBeau sticks around. In our draft talk we see the effects of the 3-4 where many are wrapped around the handle about getting a underachieving but athletic NT, named Dontari Poe, because the whole scheme we run requires a unique skillset. That is a direct effect of choosing the 3-4.

The team that won the Super Bowl played a 4-3 so there must be some value to it.

RuthlessBurgher
04-03-2012, 01:21 PM
Why not discuss. We have at least 22,000 posts before we catch up to the "we hate Arians" world record.

Seriously though, the issue of 4-3 versus 3-4 is valid even though no change will occur as long as LeBeau sticks around. In our draft talk we see the effects of the 3-4 where many are wrapped around the handle about getting a underachieving but athletic NT, named Dontari Poe, because the whole scheme we run requires a unique skillset. That is a direct effect of choosing the 3-4.

The team that won the Super Bowl played a 4-3 so there must be some value to it.

Poe should actually fit a 4-3 better. In the 3-4, he's somewhat of a tweener (3-4 DE height, 3-4 NT weight). With his athletic ability, he should be a one-gap, one-technique DT in a 4-3, not a two-gap, zero technique NT in a 3-4.

When he blew up at the combine, people were suddenly thinking he could potentially be a Haloti Ngata type. Even if he somehow fulfilled that prophesy, note that Ngata himself isn't used as an NT in the Baltimore defense (Cody is their NT now, Kelly Gregg was their NT before that).

Word has it, though, that after Poe's stock shot up from late-first-round to possible-top-10, his stock seems to be sliding back down again. Perhaps he will be available after all...

hawaiiansteel
04-03-2012, 02:03 PM
Hood is a Monster. Far far better then Aaron Smith was when he was early on in his career. Hood led the league in QB pressures last season, something like 22 hurries. And QB pressure...not Sacks are what broke the pipe. Hood is an already proven Beast! To call him average is like saying " Reggie White " was an AVERAGE Player :-)


what are you, insane? :wft

ikestops85
04-04-2012, 09:30 AM
what are you, insane? :wft

Of course he is ... look at his user name. :lol:

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
04-04-2012, 10:17 AM
We seem to hope every year to trade out of where we are in Round 1 but never do we find any joy or a trading partner. If Adams is the choice then I hope we do trade but won't hold my breath.

2006 - Santonio Holmes
2003 - Troy Polamalu
2001 - Casey Hampton

Not every year, but not "never" either.

Oviedo
04-04-2012, 10:22 AM
2006 - Santonio Holmes
2003 - Troy Polamalu
2001 - Casey Hampton

Not every year, but not "never" either.

6 years since the last time is pretty long. I hope we do if it gets us DeCastro or preferrably Glenn but not holding my breath.

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
04-04-2012, 10:38 AM
6 years since the last time is pretty long. I hope we do if it gets us DeCastro or preferrably Glenn but not holding my breath.

Those would be my two choices of those that are possibilities.

As far as the trading of first round picks, I think that sometimes fans might want a move that the FO does not. Example is that fans were screaming for a trade down in 2007 after Revis came off the board just one pick in front of us. The fan thinking was that players like Beason, Poz, Timmons, Jarvis Moss, Anthony Spencer, Staley - and Timmons - all had around the same value so we should trade down and pick up the one who gets left behind. But maybe the FO was targeting Timmons and was not willing to risk losing out. We do know that the team is not against or afraid of the idea, but they have a different thought process than we do.

Shoe
04-09-2012, 11:54 PM
Poe should actually fit a 4-3 better. In the 3-4, he's somewhat of a tweener (3-4 DE height, 3-4 NT weight). With his athletic ability, he should be a one-gap, one-technique DT in a 4-3, not a two-gap, zero technique NT in a 3-4.

When he blew up at the combine, people were suddenly thinking he could potentially be a Haloti Ngata type. Even if he somehow fulfilled that prophesy, note that Ngata himself isn't used as an NT in the Baltimore defense (Cody is their NT now, Kelly Gregg was their NT before that).

Word has it, though, that after Poe's stock shot up from late-first-round to possible-top-10, his stock seems to be sliding back down again. Perhaps he will be available after all...

Let me get on the record and say that picking Dontari Poe at 24 would be a large mistake on our part. Poe actually reminds me a lot of guys like Ziggy Hood. Ziggy also wowed scouts at the combine (not to the extent Poe did). Adding Poe to our line of Hood and Heyward would, while maybe solid/dependable would be far from dominant.

I actually liken Poe to Big Daddy Wilkinson. Like Big Daddy, his workout numbers are eye-popping. And... he seems to be a solid worker, etc. LIKE Hood and Wilkinson. But in the end, they fail to distinguish themselves other than to be a solid starter (at best).

I think we can do better.

Oviedo
04-10-2012, 07:32 AM
Let me get on the record and say that picking Dontari Poe at 24 would be a large mistake on our part. Poe actually reminds me a lot of guys like Ziggy Hood. Ziggy also wowed scouts at the combine (not to the extent Poe did). Adding Poe to our line of Hood and Heyward would, while maybe solid/dependable would be far from dominant.

I actually liken Poe to Big Daddy Wilkinson. Like Big Daddy, his workout numbers are eye-popping. And... he seems to be a solid worker, etc. LIKE Hood and Wilkinson. But in the end, they fail to distinguish themselves other than to be a solid starter (at best).

I think we can do better.

No one that plays on our DL will ever be "dominant" because the system that leBeau employs won't allow them to do the things they could do. They are forced to play a restrained, disciplined role in the defense that does not allow them to go after QBs or make plays in the backfield. As long as we utilize the 3-4 there won't be a dominant defensive lineman on the team no matter what the talent level.

Chadman
04-10-2012, 09:49 AM
No one that plays on our DL will ever be "dominant" because the system that leBeau employs won't allow them to do the things they could do. They are forced to play a restrained, disciplined role in the defense that does not allow them to go after QBs or make plays in the backfield. As long as we utilize the 3-4 there won't be a dominant defensive lineman on the team no matter what the talent level.

Yes & no Ovi- Aaron Smith was dominant. Casey Hampton was dominant. They made the opposition account for them individually. They don't get the same sort of stats as say a 4-3 DL will get, but those guys put how many stellar Steelers front 7 seasons together?

Eddie Spaghetti
04-10-2012, 09:55 AM
No one that plays on our DL will ever be "dominant" because the system that leBeau employs won't allow them to do the things they could do. They are forced to play a restrained, disciplined role in the defense that does not allow them to go after QBs or make plays in the backfield. As long as we utilize the 3-4 there won't be a dominant defensive lineman on the team no matter what the talent level.

wow.

DL must have really peed in your cheerios.

RuthlessBurgher
04-10-2012, 01:41 PM
No one that plays on our DL will ever be "dominant" because the system that leBeau employs won't allow them to do the things they could do. They are forced to play a restrained, disciplined role in the defense that does not allow them to go after QBs or make plays in the backfield. As long as we utilize the 3-4 there won't be a dominant defensive lineman on the team no matter what the talent level.

In the base 3-4, yeah, there aren't as many opportunities for the d-line to make plays as compared to a 4-3 d-line. But as the league continues to morph more-and-more to a passing league, we will be using more-and-more nickle and dime defenses. The responsibilities of our d-line in the nickle and dime defenses are really no different than any other defense. In today's NFL, I'd say that we now spend at least half our time in specialty defenses, so we need d-lineman who will be able to rush the passer on a regular basis, not just eat up blockers all the time.

Oviedo
04-10-2012, 02:13 PM
wow.

DL must have really peed in your cheerios.

Sure. Let's just go with the default response...I just hate LeBeau.

Our defense has no faults or room for improvement. Why would anyone want a defensive line that makes splash plays by sacking the QB or getting into the opponents backfield to make plays. It is so much better to see them wrestle with the OL along the LOS.

Sugar
04-10-2012, 02:50 PM
Why would anyone want a defensive line that makes splash plays by sacking the QB or getting into the opponents backfield to make plays. It is so much better to see them wrestle with the OL along the LOS.

If this style results in a top-5 scoring D year after year, I'll take it!

phillyesq
04-10-2012, 03:13 PM
No one that plays on our DL will ever be "dominant" because the system that leBeau employs won't allow them to do the things they could do. They are forced to play a restrained, disciplined role in the defense that does not allow them to go after QBs or make plays in the backfield. As long as we utilize the 3-4 there won't be a dominant defensive lineman on the team no matter what the talent level.

I know this is your new mantra this year, that the DL just occupies blockers, but the reality is that this is a reflection, at least in part, of talent. Ziggy Hood rushes the passer in the nickel/dime, and I'm sure the Steelers would love to see him with more push/disrpution. At some point, it's an issue of talent. KVO pushed the pocket and caused disruption. Aaron Smith, in his prime, was dominant, as was Hampton.

In the 3-4, you want a player who is so disruptive that he cannot be controlled without a double team. Keisel is athletic and disruptive in his own way, but he isn't an Aaron Smith in his prime.