James Harrison on Patriots*: ‘Cheaters never win’

[hawaiiansteel]

James Harrison on Patriots*: ‘Cheaters never win’

By Chris Chase | Shutdown Corner

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/.71Iz2A7htA8ZctZ1NsQbw--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/sptusnflexperts/harrison-clap2.jpg

James Harrison knows why the New England Patriots* lost Super Bowl XLVI.

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/dwXU3qvGTQ5SAmPBqC2GBg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTUwNg--/http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/sptusnflexperts/Screen-Shot-2012-02-06-at-9.54.50-AM.png

In the minutes after the New York Giants sealed a 21-17 victory on Sunday night, James Harrison took to Twitter to offer his insight into the game. Like any professional hater still hung up on events of five years ago, the Pittsburgh Steelers linebacker referenced the infamous Spygate incident in which Patriots* coaches were accused to illegal taping other teams.

Harrison is fortunate that the old idiom isn't about the lack of prosperity amongst unrepentant headhunters. Because judging by this year's results, they don't win either.

Early Monday morning, Harrison expressed surprise that his trolling tweet didn't get more attention. "Wow!," he wrote. "I didn't even trend with that, come on people love or hate me more!

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutd ... 48905.html (http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/james-harrison-patriotss-cheaters-never-win-150948905.html)

[Sugar]

James Harrison may have supplanted Jack Lambert as my favorite player of all time. That tweet was a really stupid thing to say, IMO.

[rpmpit]

If there is anything stupid here, its Chase's opinion. I think its ridiculous that Belicheat and Brady have basically been forgiven for cheating. Still calling Belicheat a "genius" and Brady the next Montana - give me a break already.

3-0 while cheating...0-2 not cheating. 'Nuf said :evil:

[Steelgal]

Leave it to James to tell you how he feels. He's certainly not always politically correct, but you know most of what he says a lot of people think or agree with. Just glad he didn't give an opinion on what he thought when the owners extended Goodell :stirpot

[RuthlessBurgher]

Leave it to James to tell you how he feels. He's certainly not always politically correct, but you know most of what he says a lot of people think or agree with. Just glad he didn't give an opinion on what he thought when the owners extended Goodell :stirpot

I bet he wouldn't piss on that contract if it were on fire either. :lol:

[pick6]

This is great. All of there Superbowls are in question now. Thats why this game was so important. Most of us have always known that they are frauds but this game was huge and the Cheatriots knew it. To them, a win would silence people like me. They could say, hey look we won one without cheating so therefore the 3 we got while cheating are somehow now validated or verified. Scumbag logic. I would have always called them what they are, frauds. But the media pundits and fanboys have been more than willing to ignore the fact that these guys are known cheaters and continue to mention them as greats and this legacy crap.

If you remove the illegal video tapes from the equation this is what has happened. For the cheats, no more video tapes means no more Superbowl wins with multiple 1 and done postseasons. For our Steelers, no more Cheatriot tapes result in 2 Superbowl wins and an AFC title for us. Does anyone see a pattern developing. Their cheating stole alot from us and we have to sit around and hear how great these guys are and just act like class acts and gee willickers great Americans and let it go... down with all fanboys, I smile with the pain you felt last night. As for the crown you thought they deserved.

"We decapitated them, they cant wear that anymore." Jacobs 2012

[Sugar]

This whole thing about them cheating is stupid. They haven't taped signals in years and yet they've still been one of the more successful teams in the NFL.

The SB came down to who actually made the plays. The Giants players stepped up and made some huge plays when it counted most. The Pat's receivers choked in clutch time. It had nothing to do with cheating. In the past, they made the plays they needed to to pull out close wins. These last two, they fell on the other side of the same equation in a tight ballgame.

[fezziwig]

People try to say the cheating is a wash because their organization was fined 500,000.00. their coach 250,000.00 and a first round draft pick.
What they pass by is, that is chump change to them plus, winning the Super Bowl makes them a lot more cash than what they have paid in fines. Another thing is, they had two number one picks that season so no, they didn't get penalized a number one draft pick.

Fine them all the money you want or say what you want, I'd rather know I played lost or won a game with everything being done honestly.
Bellicheat had been cheaingt for around eight season, got caught and warned. He continued to cheat so, he must have seen the value in it.
These annoucers and whom ever that brag the team , the coach and Brady up make me laugh. These are the same people that would be upset if a parking meter took their money.

[Sugar]

If the Pat's had suddenly gone into the toilet after they were caught, I would believe that the taping was the reason for their success. It obviously wasn't. Brady still has to make the throws and has had the most successful passing seasons of his career post spy-gate. As a team, they have continued to be one of the most successful in the league with only a few plays separating them from a couple more SB victories since the scandal.

[DukieBoy]

Leave it to James to tell you how he feels. He's certainly not always politically correct, but you know most of what he says a lot of people think or agree with. Just glad he didn't give an opinion on what he thought when the owners extended Goodell :stirpot

I bet he wouldn't piss on that contract if it were on fire either. :lol:

But, as the coup de grace, he might dump on it after the flames go out.

[Steelhere10]

If the Pat's had suddenly gone into the toilet after they were caught, I would believe that the taping was the reason for their success. It obviously wasn't. Brady still has to make the throws and has had the most successful passing seasons of his career post spy-gate. As a team, they have continued to be one of the most successful in the league with only a few plays separating them from a couple more SB victories since the scandal.Playing in the weakest division in the AFC is a reason for their success. Miami, Buff and the Jets .... Please First time they have made it post cheating, The year they got caught YEA they won 16 straight BUT HAND SIGNALS WAS still being used and who is to say that there were no more copies.

[hawaiiansteel]

Steelers' Harrison irks Pats fans on Twitter

By Pittsburgh Tribune-Review
Monday, February 6, 2012

http://files.pittsburghlive.com/photos/2012-02-06/FBNharrison-b.jpg

It didn't take long for Steelers Pro Bowl linebacker James Harrison to give his take on Super Bowl XLVI.

Harrison, following the Giants' 21-17 win over the Patriots on Sunday night, posted on his Twitter account "Told you cheaters never win!!!!!!!!!" The comment sparked the ire of Patriots fans, drawing many hateful responses.

Harrison made a similar post on his Facebook page, writing: "Told you, cheaters never win!!!!!!!!! LOl, I'm sorry I couldn't help it.. but congrats to the Giants."

Harrison, whose hate for the Patriots stems from the "Spygate" scandal, which might have helped the Patriots beat the Steelers in the 2004 AFC title game, later apologized for his posts writing that he was sorry.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsbu ... z1leG1ZXWE (http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_780223.html#ixzz1leG1ZXWE)

[Slapstick]

If the Pat's had suddenly gone into the toilet after they were caught, I would believe that the taping was the reason for their success. It obviously wasn't. Brady still has to make the throws and has had the most successful passing seasons of his career post spy-gate. As a team, they have continued to be one of the most successful in the league with only a few plays separating them from a couple more SB victories since the scandal.

And that, sir, is the point...

The cheating was enough to make a difference in their favor in those tight games...especially the three SBs they won by a total of 9 points...

[pick6]

If the Pat's had suddenly gone into the toilet after they were caught, I would believe that the taping was the reason for their success. It obviously wasn't. Brady still has to make the throws and has had the most successful passing seasons of his career post spy-gate. As a team, they have continued to be one of the most successful in the league with only a few plays separating them from a couple more SB victories since the scandal.


You are really confused. I have a post in this thread that makes things pretty clear. What don't you understand. I really think that the problem is a lack of understanding about football on a basic and fundamental level.

What you are doing is reconstructing the issue and the question in away that makes it easier for you to defend your position about this fraud of a team that you like and respect.

You want to argue that the cheats did not need to cheat in order to win those Superbowls. Typical fanboy response. Problem is that no one is disputing this. Sure it is possible that they could have won those Superbowls without cheating, but Sugar, the reality is that they did win those Superbowls by cheating. That's the reality that's tearing your little fanboy heart to pieces.

Can you imagine finishing law school at the top of your class with the respect of your profs. and colleagues alike and then be found to have received the highest score in the state on the bar exam with a copy of the exact questions and answers pre-written. Then you tell everybody, "Hey guys you see how talented and smart I am, I could have obtained this score without cheating cmon, Im awesome." What sort of perverted logic is this.

In the 1988 Summer Olympics, could Ben Johnson have defeated Carl Lewis without steroids. Yes that might have been possible. But he did cheat and he won while cheating so the fact that it was possible for him to win without cheating is moot. The victory is a fraud. The test score is a fraud. The Pats are frauds.

Let me bring this home for you. In your own words you say, "they have continued to be one of the most successful (teams) in the league WITH ONLY A FEW PLAYS SEPERATING THEM FROM A COUPLE MORE SB VICTORIES SINCE THE SCANDAL.'' Thats it. This is a game of inches and 1/2 seconds. So if you know whats coming then you are a second ahead of the competition. If you can kill one of the opponents drives or keep one of your drives going because you know what the opponent is doing by cheating then that's going to lead to victories in this league.

And to further cement the point, they have not been able to make those plays since the spygate. Not enough to win another one. Do you not realize that they won there Superbowls by a few plays here and there. Any edge in this game can lead to victories especially when you know what the other team is doing. Only a complete fool would dismiss this as coincidence.

Sugar, if it didn't matter and it wasn't significant enough to effect game outcomes then why did he continue to do it even after being warning. You're being unreasonable.

[pick6]

If the Pat's had suddenly gone into the toilet after they were caught, I would believe that the taping was the reason for their success. It obviously wasn't. Brady still has to make the throws and has had the most successful passing seasons of his career post spy-gate. As a team, they have continued to be one of the most successful in the league with only a few plays separating them from a couple more SB victories since the scandal.

And that, sir, is the point...

The cheating was enough to make a difference in their favor in those tight games...especially the three SBs they won by a total of 9 points...


Exactly

[Sugar]

If the Pat's had suddenly gone into the toilet after they were caught, I would believe that the taping was the reason for their success. It obviously wasn't. Brady still has to make the throws and has had the most successful passing seasons of his career post spy-gate. As a team, they have continued to be one of the most successful in the league with only a few plays separating them from a couple more SB victories since the scandal.


You are really confused. I have a post in this thread that makes things pretty clear. What don't you understand. I really think that the problem is a lack of understanding about football on a basic and fundamental level.

What you are doing is reconstructing the issue and the question in away that makes it easier for you to defend your position about this fraud of a team that you like and respect.

You want to argue that the cheats did not need to cheat in order to win those Superbowls. Typical fanboy response. Problem is that no one is disputing this. Sure it is possible that they could have won those Superbowls without cheating, but Sugar, the reality is that they did win those Superbowls by cheating. That's the reality that's tearing your little fanboy heart to pieces.

Can you imagine finishing law school at the top of your class with the respect of your profs. and colleagues alike and then be found to have received the highest score in the state on the bar exam with a copy of the exact questions and answers pre-written. Then you tell everybody, "Hey guys you see how talented and smart I am, I could have obtained this score without cheating cmon, Im awesome." What sort of perverted logic is this.

In the 1988 Summer Olympics, could Ben Johnson have defeated Carl Lewis without steroids. Yes that might have been possible. But he did cheat and he won while cheating so the fact that it was possible for him to win without cheating is moot. The victory is a fraud. The test score is a fraud. The Pats are frauds.

Let me bring this home for you. In your own words you say, "they have continued to be one of the most successful (teams) in the league WITH ONLY A FEW PLAYS SEPERATING THEM FROM A COUPLE MORE SB VICTORIES SINCE THE SCANDAL.'' Thats it. This is a game of inches and 1/2 seconds. So if you know whats coming then you are a second ahead of the competition. If you can kill one of the opponents drives or keep one of your drives going because you know what the opponent is doing by cheating then that's going to lead to victories in this league.

And to further cement the point, they have not been able to make those plays since the spygate. Not enough to win another one. Do you not realize that they won there Superbowls by a few plays here and there. Any edge in this game can lead to victories especially when you know what the other team is doing. Only a complete fool would dismiss this as coincidence.

Sugar, if it didn't matter and it wasn't significant enough to effect game outcomes then why did he continue to do it even after being warning. You're being unreasonable.

What kind of idiocy is this crap? I've never been a fan of the Pat's. The fans of theirs that I know would laugh at you to suggest that I was. You spent a lot of typing for nothing. Cheating or not doesn't make Welker, Hernandez and Branch drop catchable passes. David Tyree and Mario Manningham making plays that they normally don't helped the Giants. It's all about making the plays. That's the difference between winning and losing close games. It has nothing to do with cheating.

[sentinel33]

Wow, Sugar. How can you even come back on Pick6 after he so eloquently made the point. :roll:

[Shoe]

Sugar,
Your argument actually makes a lot of sense, and I would tend to agree with you, even with the fact that they did cheat us. The problem though, is that games are decided (for the most part) on the edge of a knife! Look at this game--if Welker makes that catch that he can make more than 9 times out of 10, the Patriots* win that Super Bowl. If Kyle Williams catches one punt, the Giants probably aren't even there! If Ben doesn't make a shoestring tackle on a DB, we don't win that SB (and maybe Peyton has two, like his brother).

By saying that cheating has nothing to do with why they've lost each SB, says that you think cheating did nothing to help them win those other SBs.

[DukieBoy]

Watching NBC Sports Talk. Florio is on there, along with Peter King. Florio the Hater is all over the Steelers. Said Brady got hurt from Tuck's hit causing him to become inaccurate but Brady is no drama queen like Ben who overdramatizes a hangnail and Brady wouldn't show his injury. Florio said it is High Drama time in Pgh, high drama coming between Ben and Haley,and he wants to be a fly on the wall (ha ha, Florio the Fly). Also called James and Clark classless for their Twitter comments about the cheating. All of this stuff said overemphatic, overstated, overexcited.

[BradshawsHairdresser]

Watching NBC Sports Talk. Florio is on there, along with Peter King. Florio the Hater is all over the Steelers. Said Brady got hurt from Tuck's hit causing him to become inaccurate but Brady is no drama queen like Ben who overdramatizes a hangnail and Brady wouldn't show his injury. Florio said it is High Drama time in Pgh, high drama coming between Ben and Haley,and he wants to be a fly on the wall (ha ha, Florio the Fly). Also called James and Clark classless for their Twitter comments about the cheating. All of this stuff said overemphatic, overstated, overexcited.

Florio is overrated.

And if Brady was truly hurt so badly he couldn't make accurate throws, wouldn't it have been better for his team if he DID show his injury so they could get someone in there who COULD make some throws?

I tend to think Florio is just making an excuse for another playoff choke job by Brady (which we've seen a lot of ever since the *'s got caught cheating). I'd rather hear Gisele's whining than Florio's. What a douche.

[Sugar]

Sugar,
Your argument actually makes a lot of sense, and I would tend to agree with you, even with the fact that they did cheat us. The problem though, is that games are decided (for the most part) on the edge of a knife! Look at this game--if Welker makes that catch that he can make more than 9 times out of 10, the Patriots* win that Super Bowl. If Kyle Williams catches one punt, the Giants probably aren't even there! If Ben doesn't make a shoestring tackle on a DB, we don't win that SB (and maybe Peyton has two, like his brother).

By saying that cheating has nothing to do with why they've lost each SB, says that you think cheating did nothing to help them win those other SBs.

I'm done going over this as it really isn't that important. But you seem to at least be reasonable. It's not like when Gruden went to the Bucs after being with the Raiders- In the SB, Bucs players were heard saying that it was like they knew everything the Raiders were going to do. Yes, it is my understanding that the Pat's did, in fact, cheat us years ago. However, they haven't cheated in years and still have one of the best franchises in the game year in and year out.

I enjoy beating them every time we do because we are beating an elite NFL team, not because of some past infraction.

[Sword]

sorry, cheating is to strong of a word.....just an easy word to use
when our team is not there and want to redirect anger....

Did they pay off the referee's? NO
Did they steal the other teams playbook? NO
Did they spike the players water? NO

What they did is what many other teams try to do and have done...
get the other teams signals...
If it's in the public view than it's up for grabs ...period!!!

Hell.. There are many times when teams are trying to throw the other team off by
giving wrong signals that aren't even in play...

here is an article on 14 other teams that were doing the same dam thing at the time...
http://www.thebrushback.com/cameras_full.htm




This is the actual rule they "violated"
"No video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game...All video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead."
The Patriots also did not view the tape until after the game was over... and signals change each week, so there was no real benefit.

here is the article about Vermeil talking about "spygate"
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/59723…






Actually, I think that most people do know what Spygate was, however, the problem is that most people believe that the Patriots are the only team to EVER to try and videotape/steal signals. Yet former coaches like Marty Schottenheimer, Bill Parcells, Jimmy Johnson, and Marv Levy all admitted to doing the same thing. The Oakland Raiders used to hire lip readers back in the 70's because they also used to steal signals, which is why, even today, most coaches will cover their mouths when speaking, with either a clipboard or a playsheet, if they are calling in a play.

If anything, it just shows how naive people are, thinking that only 1 team is trying to find an edge to win a game, yet chances are that EVERY team in the league is trying to bend the rules in one form or another, and its been happening for decades, not just in the last couple of years.




even Rams head coach Dick Vermeil came out this week and said it had no impact on the superbowl between the Rams and Patriots

OK here is one straight from Coach Cowher!!!!


Cowher also touched on the Patriots being penalized for illegal videotaping procedures in the context of whether that should taint the team's accomplishments.

"Listen, there's people stealing signals all the time before that," Cowher said. "You have ways to hide those things. We had wristbands for our defense. I remember trying to get offensive plays and see what the formations were. Everybody knows. ... You're trying to gain a competitive edge. Did that go beyond it? To a degree. Do I think that helped them win football games? No. You still have to go out and play the game. I still have a hard time believing that was a difference in a game."




I will keep saying this it takes talent to get a ball from point A to point B..period..
no cheating to it..

oh and by the way Mr. Harrison, it doesn't matter with the Steelers because, we are so dam predictable........
Hell.....I can tell you what we are going to do most of the time.....

so..please stop this cheating topics........


Sword

[Slapstick]

If the Patriots hadn't cheated (or been caught cheating) there would be no cheating topics...

Blame Bill Belicheat and his Cheatriots organization for cheating...not the fans and players who were cheated by the Patriots for feeling cheated...

We're not the ones who were guilty of any wrongdoing...they are...

[Sword]

If the Patriots hadn't cheated (or been caught cheating) there would be no cheating topics...

Blame Bill Belicheat and his Cheatriots organization for cheating...not the fans and players who were cheated by the Patriots for feeling cheated...

We're not the ones who were guilty of any wrongdoing...they are...

They were not caught cheating..They were caught breaking an NFL rule on where
to videotape\watch signals of the other team...
Which, all teams do!!!!

IT'S WHERE(location)! NOT WHAT THEY WERE DOING!!!

Sword

[Slapstick]

They were not caught cheating..They were caught breaking an NFL rule on where
to videotape\watch signals of the other team...
Which, all teams do!!!!

IT'S WHERE(location)! NOT WHAT THEY WERE DOING!!!

Sword

Did you read what you wrote?

Two definitions of the word "Cheating":

to violate rules or regulations: He cheats at cards.

to take an examination or test in a dishonest way, as by improper access to answers.

Both are applicable...

Trying to decode another teams signals is one thing...Breaking the rules by videotaping another team is cheating...

[feltdizz]

They cheated.. period. There is no excuse that can be made for what they did...

Some of you are acting like cheating means they will play a perfect game... won't miss any tackles, drop any passes or fumble. That isn't what cheating accomplishes.

Cheating the way the Pats did made it easier to recognize an audible or where the ball will be going on 3rd and 1. Cheating makes it easier for them to ignore a fake hand off or ignore a guy in the flat because they know what the play is... Cheating makes old vets make awesome tackles in the back field because they shot through a gap because they knew the play.

Does this mean they will never guess wrong or an opponents speed won't beat a guy in the open field? Of course not...

but it gives them a slight edge and that's all you need to help change the outcome of a game.

Gruden going from one team to another isn't cheating... it's taking information with you to a new team. Filming a walk through before a SB... taping signals, etc... that is cheating.

[Sword]

Cheating vs. Rule Breaking

If I want to cheat at cards, say by dealing off the bottom of the deck, I'm going to do it in such a way that attempts to mask what I'm up to. I'm not going to make it obvious what I'm doing . Rule breaking, by contrast, is done with a clear understanding of the costs.. they where not hiding what they were doing..

Sword

[Slapstick]

Cheating vs. Rule Breaking

If I want to cheat at cards, say by dealing off the bottom of the deck, I'm going to do it in such a way that attempts to mask what I'm up to. I'm not going to make it obvious what I'm doing . Rule breaking, by contrast, is done with a clear understanding of the costs.. they where not hiding what they were doing..

Sword

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Sword]

So, when Troy Polamalu slapped the ball against NE which is clearly against NFL rules..
does that make it cheating? NO

When Troy used the cell phone on the side line which is also against the NFL rules.
does that make it cheating? NO

these examples can go on and on...

Sword

[Slapstick]

So, when Troy Polamalu slapped the ball against NE which is clearly against NFL rules..
does that make it cheating? NO

When Troy used the cell phone on the side line which is also against the NFL rules.
does that make it cheating? NO

these examples can go on and on...

Sword

So, in both of those cases, Troy intentionally violated the rules to gain a strategic advantage after the NFL had issued a memo to all teams reiterating that slapping the ball and using a cell phone were strictly prohibited by NFL rules?

I suppose that, if you can prove that he intentionally violated those rules after being reminded strongly beforehand, you could call him a cheater...

But, you can't, because there is no proof...

There is proof that Belichick cheated...

[feltdizz]

So, when Troy Polamalu slapped the ball against NE which is clearly against NFL rules..
does that make it cheating? NO

When Troy used the cell phone on the side line which is also against the NFL rules.
does that make it cheating? NO

these examples can go on and on...

Sword

that's like saying holding is cheating... or PI is cheating...

If the Pats weren't cheating they wouldn't have been fined and the tapes wouldn't have been destroyed. It's so obvious they went beyond what others were doing... not sure why you feel the need to defend those bums.

[_SteeL_CurtaiN_]

Cheating or not doesn't make Welker, Hernandez and Branch drop catchable passes. David Tyree and Mario Manningham making plays that they normally don't helped the Giants. It's all about making the plays. That's the difference between winning and losing close games. It has nothing to do with cheating.

If Welker knows what the defense is playing he makes that catch, why because he can go where they aren't. Likewise if the Pats know what the offensive plays are they have a much better chance of covering Manningham. The Rams put in plays during their walk thru that they had never run before and yet the Pats were calling it out, same deal with the Steelers. How can you not see that?

The NFL says they stole hand signals, but this is from the people who DESTROYED the evidence, why would you do that if all they stole were hand signals? Answer because the video tapes were much more damming that what they state. We will never know and that is the problem. Innocent people proclaim their innocence loudly and forcefully, guilty people do what the NFL and the *'s did.

[feltdizz]

Cheating or not doesn't make Welker, Hernandez and Branch drop catchable passes. David Tyree and Mario Manningham making plays that they normally don't helped the Giants. It's all about making the plays. That's the difference between winning and losing close games. It has nothing to do with cheating.

If Welker knows what the defense is playing he makes that catch, why because he can go where they aren't. Likewise if the Pats know what the offensive plays are they have a much better chance of covering Manningham. The Rams put in plays during their walk thru that they had never run before and yet the Pats were calling it out, same deal with the Steelers. How can you not see that?

The NFL says they stole hand signals, but this is from the people who DESTROYED the evidence, why would you do that if all they stole were hand signals? Answer because the video tapes were much more damming that what they state. We will never know and that is the problem. Innocent people proclaim their innocence loudly and forcefully, guilty people do what the NFL and the *'s did.

knowing the D doesn't = completion... Brady still has to throw a good football and Welker has to catch it.

I agree on having a better chance to execute but it's still a game and players slip, miss play the ball etc.

[_SteeL_CurtaiN_]

Cheating or not doesn't make Welker, Hernandez and Branch drop catchable passes. David Tyree and Mario Manningham making plays that they normally don't helped the Giants. It's all about making the plays. That's the difference between winning and losing close games. It has nothing to do with cheating.

If Welker knows what the defense is playing he makes that catch, why because he can go where they aren't. Likewise if the Pats know what the offensive plays are they have a much better chance of covering Manningham. The Rams put in plays during their walk thru that they had never run before and yet the Pats were calling it out, same deal with the Steelers. How can you not see that?

The NFL says they stole hand signals, but this is from the people who DESTROYED the evidence, why would you do that if all they stole were hand signals? Answer because the video tapes were much more damming that what they state. We will never know and that is the problem. Innocent people proclaim their innocence loudly and forcefully, guilty people do what the NFL and the *'s did.

knowing the D doesn't = completion... Brady still has to throw a good football and Welker has to catch it.

I agree on having a better chance to execute but it's still a game and players slip, miss play the ball etc.

Yes, but if you know the d is in cover 2 the reciever and qb have a clear advantage and visa versa. That is the cheating plain and simple.