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View Full Version : Offense sells tickets but defense wins championships!!



Dee Dub
02-06-2012, 12:10 PM
The game has changed over the years but the core of it remains the same. We get enamored with these high powered offenses but the reality of what this game is all about showed itself again yesterday in the Super Bowl. A great defense can and will stop a high powered offense. I hope the Steelers get back to their roots and what they are and not what this league has become.

Last I checked the organization has won more Super Bowls than any team in the NFL and they have done all of them with great defenses.

BDESteel
02-06-2012, 12:32 PM
That's true, but a good offense also plays defense by keeping the ball from the opposing team's offense. Which is what I believe the Steelers are trying to do by hiring a new OC.

Our defense was put into too many last minute 4th qtr stands, when our offense should've been running the clock out.

Let's hope our new OC can make the difference next year.

:Cheers

Dee Dub
02-06-2012, 12:47 PM
That's true, but a good offense also plays defense by keeping the ball from the opposing team's offense. Which is what I believe the Steelers are trying to do by hiring a new OC.

Our defense was put into too many last minute 4th qtr stands, when our offense should've been running the clock out.

Let's hope our new OC can make the difference next year.

:Cheers

But all 6 of the Steelers Championship defenses would have stopped any and all 4th quarter comebacks.

This defense the Steelers currently have, couldn't because they are not great.

Ya see the point? :wink:

D Rock
02-06-2012, 01:30 PM
That's true, but a good offense also plays defense by keeping the ball from the opposing team's offense. Which is what I believe the Steelers are trying to do by hiring a new OC.

Our defense was put into too many last minute 4th qtr stands, when our offense should've been running the clock out.

Let's hope our new OC can make the difference next year.

:Cheers

But all 6 of the Steelers Championship defenses would have stopped any and all 4th quarter comebacks.

This defense the Steelers currently have, couldn't because they are not great.

Ya see the point? :wink:

The '08 squad doesn't see your point. They are still busy watching Fitzgerald run away from them.

Dee Dub
02-06-2012, 02:09 PM
[quote=BDESteel]That's true, but a good offense also plays defense by keeping the ball from the opposing team's offense. Which is what I believe the Steelers are trying to do by hiring a new OC.

Our defense was put into too many last minute 4th qtr stands, when our offense should've been running the clock out.

Let's hope our new OC can make the difference next year.

:Cheers

But all 6 of the Steelers Championship defenses would have stopped any and all 4th quarter comebacks.

This defense the Steelers currently have, couldn't because they are not great.

Ya see the point? :wink:

The '08 squad doesn't see your point. They are still busy watching Fitzgerald run away from them.[/quote:1to5t0tq]

Uhhhhhhhhh..that wasnt the last time the Cards had the ball. When that defense had to get it done on the last play of the first half as well as the last play of the game, they did.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
02-06-2012, 02:38 PM
Defense wins championships, sure - but without the highest powered offense you won't even get to the big game.

You need to spend LOTS of $$ on an offense that can score LOTS of points in almost every game, to make it there.

THEN, how much you have left under the cap to spend on defense - + coaching + player character - will make the difference in who wins the Superbowl. Gotta remember - the "new" rules under Goodell would be just like shackles and chains on our guys from the 70s (just look up some old Mel Blount videos to see what I mean!).

In other words - the salary cap is not big enough to buy both an offense like the Giants/Packers/*s etc., AND have enough left over to buy the Steel Curtain.

Just my :2c

RuthlessBurgher
02-06-2012, 02:46 PM
Caveat: Defense plus an elite QB wins championships. Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson were flukes (dominant defenses with barely marginal quarterbacking). Since then, the Super Bowl winning QB's have been named Brady, Roethlisberger, a couple of Mannings, Brees, and Rodgers. And before that, it was Warner, Elway, Favre, Aikman, Young, etc.

flippy
02-06-2012, 03:12 PM
There's a lot of luck in these championships.

Dropped passes.

Punts inside the 10 that lead to safeties.

Manning making a throw that he probably makes 1 out of 10 times.

Injuries.

Forced fumbles that don't get turned over.

The Pats were close to winning. Just one of those fumbles by the Giants bouncing the right way and the team with the worse defense woulda won.

Glad they didn't, but that's beside the point :)

feltdizz
02-06-2012, 03:14 PM
There's a lot of luck in these championships.

Dropped passes.

Punts inside the 10 that lead to safeties.

Manning making a throw that he probably makes 1 out of 10 times.

Injuries.

Forced fumbles that don't get turned over.

The Pats were close to winning. Just one of those fumbles by the Giants bouncing the right way and the team with the worse defense woulda won.

Glad they didn't, but that's beside the point :)

:Agree

Dee Dub
02-06-2012, 03:31 PM
.......

You need to spend LOTS of $$ on an offense that can score LOTS of points in almost every game, to make it there.

Manningham, Nicks, and Cruz? There isnt much money invested in those three WR's for the Giants. And for that matter, other than Eli, the rest of the Giants offense as well...

Ballard, Bradshaw, Jacobs, Hynoski, and Pascoe.

steelblood
02-06-2012, 03:45 PM
I think there is more than one way to win a championship. The Giants showed that balance and flexibility is the modern formula. The Giants defense can stop the run heavy teams and the pass heavy teams when healthy. They create sacks, turnovers, and score points. The Giants offense can line up with two TEs and a FB and run you over. They can also spread you out and go no huddle with the best of them.

When the Packers won last season they had that sort of balance. When the Pats won their Super Bowls they had that sort of complete team. Most of the Steelers Super Bowl winners featured that sort of flexibility and balance. Same with the great Cowboy and 49er teams. You need to be able to win in various conditions and against different types of teams. You adapt, adjust, and grow. That is how you build a dynasty.

BradshawsHairdresser
02-06-2012, 03:57 PM
According to one writer, the era of defense winning championships is over:

By Dejan Kovacevic, PITTSBURGH TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Monday, February 6, 2012
Last updated: 10:19 am

INDIANAPOLIS Ahmad Bradshaw darted through a hole in the defensive line so immense, so inviting he could have strutted those half-dozen yards untouched into the end zone. And it should have been glorious. A go-ahead touchdown in the Super Bowl with a minute to go. The stuff of NFL Films from now until eternity.

Only he didn't want to.

He stutter-stepped as he neared the goal line.

Then screeched to a near-crawl.

Then precariously planted his right foot a millimeter shy of the chalk.

Then, finally, spun 180 degrees to try to buy an extra millisecond before tipping backward into the end zone.

The most powerful facet of Super Bowl XLVI, as with any, is the outcome: New York Giants 21, New England Patriots 17. Eli Manning was named MVP after an 88-yard drive that resulted in Bradshaw's reluctant touchdown. And Tom Brady, bidding to match Terry Bradshaw and Joe Montana as four-ring quarterbacks, lost only after a midfield heave dropped in the end zone.

All good stuff.

Highly entertaining, as has been the case annually in recent years.

"One of the great Super Bowls you'll see," New York coach Tom Coughlin said.

But a backward game-winning touchdown that the defense wanted and the offense didn't?

Let this go down as, symbolically if not officially, the day defense died in the NFL. Or at least greatly diminished in importance.

The reason Ahmad Bradshaw tried to forfeit his touchdown was that Manning yelled out to do so. And the reason Manning yelled out was that he saw New England's defense part its own sea to invite Bradshaw to score the go-ahead points, trusting not in their defense but in Brady if he got the ball back. And the reason Manning and Bradshaw sought at the last second to stall their score was, of course, out of respect to Brady.

Quite a show of respect there.

Again, this was the scenario: The Patriots had a 17-15 lead, the Giants had second-and-goal at the 6, and the Patriots called their second of three allotted timeouts with 1:04 left.

Was it a sure thing the Giants would wind the clock down and settle for a field goal and one-point lead?

Not according to Coughlin, who said no order came from the sideline for anyone to lie down.

"You've got to understand a field goal wasn't necessarily going to win that game," Coughlin said.

Manning confirmed it didn't come from the huddle, either.

"That's on me," he said. "Once you saw the way their defense just kind of got out of the way, it's up to me to let Ahmad know he shouldn't score there. He tried."

Was it a sure thing the Giants would score a touchdown there?

That they wouldn't fumble?

That they'd make the field goal?

That Brady wouldn't be able to capitalize on a shorter field if needing only to counter with a field goal?

Belichick was asked if he allowed the Giants to score and replied: "Right." He did not elaborate.

But linebacker Brandon Spikes did when asked how it felt to give that up: "It killed me. When the call came in to let them score, I was like, 'What?' I'm here to do a job. It was tough, though."

And hey, not to let the Giants off the hook, is it universally accepted wisdom to not score the go-ahead touchdown in the final minute of the Super Bowl?

Look, the merits of the strategy can be argued either way. But this was the most bizarre big-time moment in Super Bowl history. And if you think that`s hyperbole, just try to imagine the John Facenda narration for it.

"The autumn wind is a pirate and both teams simply lay down."

Moreover, it came on a stage in which the NFL's no-touch, pass-happy policy might have reached its pinnacle.

Manning completed 30 of 40 passes for 296 yards and a touchdown. He had time to throw, found multiple options and hit them far more often than not.

Brady nearly matched him, completing 27 of 41 for 276 yards and two touchdowns. That included an astounding 10-for-10, 100-yard drive, and a run of 16 consecutive passes that topped Montana's record by three.

Isn't it all starting to look a little too easy?

Is it any wonder so much fuss has kicked up among the Steelers' faithful and within their South Side offices, apparently about the importance of passing versus a more traditional approach?

Does Art Rooney II really want to see his team abandon the pass when everyone can do it and even the best teams can't stop it?

The Green Bay Packers, the NFL's best regular-season team, had the league's worst pass defense. The Patriots were next-to-last. The Giants ranked 29th and won it all.

Afterward, the Giants' chatty kicker, Lawrence Tynes, was brought into the main news conference room for 10 minutes of questioning. Not one defensive player took to that podium.

Read more: Kovacevic: The day defense died in the NFL - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsbu ... z1ldKyCApp (http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_780192.html#ixzz1ldKyCApp)

feltdizz
02-06-2012, 04:27 PM
great read...

The last TD was the worst ending I've ever seen for a game winning SB touchdown.

pick6
02-06-2012, 06:10 PM
There's a lot of luck in these championships.

Dropped passes.

Punts inside the 10 that lead to safeties.

Manning making a throw that he probably makes 1 out of 10 times.

Injuries.

Forced fumbles that don't get turned over.

The Pats were close to winning. Just one of those fumbles by the Giants bouncing the right way and the team with the worse defense woulda won.

Glad they didn't, but that's beside the point :)


Whats up Flip.

Yeah about those Patsies. They wouldn't even be there if not for a dropped TD pass vs Ravens and a missed chip shot FG.

Manning keeps making these great throws in big games. Gotta give him some credit. Only one real drop by the cheats Hernandez. The others were bad throws and tips.

Those lames went into the game knowing that they couldn't stop the 9-7 NYG so they game planned to strip the ball and still could not cover multiple fumbles which the giants were able to recover. That's heart by the Giants not luck.

Dropping those punts deep in the zone is pure skill. That punter is hardcore. not only pinning his opponents deep but they have a horrible long snapper on FGs and he always corrals terrible snaps and places the ball perfectly for the kicker.

And that safety. That's just a wussie who is petrified of contact trying to get rid of the ball so as not to take a shot. (Brady can take a hit, I must admit). No luck.

The tuck rule is lucky (cheating).

Carolinas kicker, one of the best ever I think, inexplicably kicking the ball out of bounds on a kickoff, giving the cheats the ball at the 40 yard line when they only need a FG, is pretty lucky.

And Mcnabb, vomiting at the end of the game and moving at the speed of molasses in the 2 min offense was pretty fortunate as well.

Im just being contrary I guess but I really hate the cheatriots and the just got beat flat out.

papillon
02-06-2012, 11:41 PM
[quote="Dee Dub":35x7tbvi][quote=BDESteel]That's true, but a good offense also plays defense by keeping the ball from the opposing team's offense. Which is what I believe the Steelers are trying to do by hiring a new OC.

Our defense was put into too many last minute 4th qtr stands, when our offense should've been running the clock out.

Let's hope our new OC can make the difference next year.

:Cheers

But all 6 of the Steelers Championship defenses would have stopped any and all 4th quarter comebacks.

This defense the Steelers currently have, couldn't because they are not great.

Ya see the point? :wink:

The '08 squad doesn't see your point. They are still busy watching Fitzgerald run away from them.[/quote:35x7tbvi]

Uhhhhhhhhh..that wasnt the last time the Cards had the ball. When that defense had to get it done on the last play of the first half as well as the last play of the game, they did.[/quote:35x7tbvi]

They were defending a hail Mary, that's hardly stopping an offense. The Cardinals handed it to them in the second half of that game. The offense pulled it out and asked the defense to defend a hail Mary without giving up a TD.

The 2008 squad was a great defense, just not in the second half of that Super Bowl.

Pappy