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Chadman
01-17-2012, 08:34 PM
Chadman has been doing this kind of thread for a couple of years now, so we'll keep this going until we get bored of it...or not.

The aim is to see if history can show us trends in drafting for the Steelers to help us better evaluate which direction the team might go, to keep an eye on the FA moves & how they effect the off-season rebuilding for next season, to discuss rookies, to formulate ideas, to post mock drafts...basically, whatever you want to jot down- go for it.

Chadman will, as time permits, put a few stats together, some theories as we go forward- that sort of thing.

Hopefully it won't be boring. But if it is, feel free to start another Tebow thread... :stirpot

SidSmythe
01-17-2012, 09:02 PM
Chadman has been doing this kind of thread for a couple of years now, so we'll keep this going until we get bored of it...or not.

The aim is to see if history can show us trends in drafting for the Steelers to help us better evaluate which direction the team might go, to keep an eye on the FA moves & how they effect the off-season rebuilding for next season, to discuss rookies, to formulate ideas, to post mock drafts...basically, whatever you want to jot down- go for it.

Chadman will, as time permits, put a few stats together, some theories as we go forward- that sort of thing.

Hopefully it won't be boring. But if it is, feel free to start another Tebow thread... :stirpot

What's wrong w/ Tebow threads?? He could be our starting QB someday :Beer

Chadman
01-17-2012, 11:28 PM
We'll start this year with a look at the Steelers financial stand-point heading towards March 1 & Free Agency.

Things look grim, there is no doubt. No official figure has been given for the Salary Cap for next season, but most 'experts' have the cap sitting around $125 million to $130 million. For arguments sake, let's go down the middle & say $127 million will be the Cap for next season.

So, where is the Steelers money tied up? Let's have a look at the players under contract for next season & their base salary, cap charge, and year of contract expiration- highest to lowest-

1. Ben Roethlisberger $11,600,000.00 $16,920,000.00 Contract End 2015
2. LaMarr Woodley $3,400,000.00 $11,500,000.00 2016
3. Troy Polamalu $6,250,000.00 $11,300,000.00 2014 (He resigned-not sure)
4. Lawrence Timmons $2,625,000.00 $9,125,000.00 2016
5. James Harrison $5,565,000.00 $9,030,000.00 2014
6. Casey Hampton $4,890,000.00 $8,056,668.00 2012
7. Ike Taylor $5,750,000.00 $7,562,500.00 2014
8. Heath Miller $4,274,000.00 $7,070,500.00 2014
9. Willie Colon $4,500,000.00 $5,700,000.00 2015
10. Chris Kemoeatu $3,577,000.00 $5,261,666.00 2013
11. Hines Ward $4,000,000.00 $4,610,000.00 2013
12. Brett Keisel $2,825,000.00 $4,500,000.00 2013
13. Ryan Clark $3,000,000.00 $4,250,000.00 2013
14. James Farrior $2,825,000.00 $3,825,000.00 2012
15. Larry Foote $3,000,000.00 $3,600,000.00 2012
16. Aaron Smith $875,000.00 $2,984,191.00 2012
17. Jonathon Scott $2,200,000.00 $2,700,000.00 2012
18. Bryant McFadden $2,500,000.00 $2,666,668.00 2012
19. Maurkice Pouncey $666,125.00 $2,166,750.00 2014
20. Rashard Mendenhall $700,000.00 $2,077,500.00 2012
21. Ziggy Hood $615,000.00 $1,743,535.00 2013
22. Shaun Suisham $1,350,000.00 $1,687,500.00 2014
23. Will Allen $1,280,000.00 $1,605,000.00 2012
24. Cam Heyward $679,774.00 $1,523,870.00 2014
25. Arnaz Battle $1,037,500.00 $1,362,500.00 2012
26. Greg Warren $825,000.00 $925,000.00 2012
27. Jason Worilds $540,000.00 $895,000.00 2013
28. Emmanual Sanders $540,000.00 $735,357.00 2012
29. Marcus Gilbert $465,000.00 $733,503.00 2014
30. Curtis Brown $465,000.00 $595,300.00 2014
31. Stevenson Sylvester $540,000.00 $578,854.00 2012
33. Jonathon Dwyer $540,000.00 $565,948.00 2012
34. Antonio Brown $540,000.00 $564,359.00 2012
35. Cortez Allen $465,000.00 $562,875.00 2014
36. Al Woods $540,000.00 $540,000.00 2012
37. Chris Carter $465,000.00 $505,700.00 2013
38. Baron Batch $465,000.00 $476,628.00 2014
39. Wesleye Saunders $465,000.00 $478,628.00 2013
40. Miguel Chavis $465,000.00 $465,000.00 2012
41. Morrty Ivy $465,000.00 $465,000.00 2012
42. Damon Cromartie-Smith $465,000.00 $465,000.00 2012
43. Eric Clanton $465,000.00 $465,000.00 2012
44. John Clay $390,000.00 $396,667.00 2012
45. Chad Spann $390,000.00 $390,000.00 2012

These are the players under contract for next season for the Steelers, not including the new "Future Contract" players signed- Troy Smith, Myron Rolle, Marshall McFadden, Mike Blanc, Trevis Turner, Jamie McCoy, John Malecki, Corbin Bryant & Jarred Johnson- as Chadman does not have the cap figures they were signed to.

The total salaries add up to $143,380,391.00.

If you then include "dead money"- money that we lose through previous roster cuts & signing bonus penaties- $2,432,992.00 (most due to cutting Max Starks)- the new Steelers salary total is..

$145,813,678.00!

This puts the Steelers at a "not so friendly" $18,813,678.00 over the 'projected' cap of $127,000,000.00!

Now- the cap projection could be under the real salary cap. It could be up around $130 million. That said- it could be lower too. Steelers fans should hope for higher!

So the Steelers are, approximately, roughly around $19 million over where they need to be! Time to panic yet?

The list above doesn't include our UFA's, RFA's & ERFA's either. If the Steelers are to re-sign any of these, further money from the exsisting roster must be found.

UFA'S
QB- Charlie Batch, Byron Leftwich, Dennis Dixon

RB- Mewelde Moore

WR- Jerricho Cotchery

OL- Max Starks, Trai Essex, Doug Legursky

DL- Chris Hoke

CB- William Gay

ST- Dan Sepulveda, Jason Kapinos

RFA & ERFA-

RB- Isaac Redman

WR- Mike Wallace

TE- David Johnson

OL- Jamon Meredith, Dorian Brooks, Ramon Foster

DL- Steve McLendon

CB- Keenan Lewis

S- Ryan Mundy

focosteeler
01-18-2012, 12:11 AM
Casey Hampton $8,056,668.00
Chris Kemoeatu $5,261,666.00
Aaron Smith $2,984,191.00
Bryant McFadden $2,666,668.00
Will Allen $1,605,000.00
Arnaz Battle $1,362,500.00

these 6 add up to ....$21,936,693.00

if we need more room

Hines Ward $4,610,000.00
James Farrior $3,825,000.00

add in these 2 to the first 6.....$ 30,371,693.00

Hopefully my math is good. What kind of penalties would we be facing if we got rid of these guys?

Slapstick
01-18-2012, 12:29 AM
Most of those guys are either in the final season or in the next-to-final season of their contracts...by that point, most of the cap figure is salary (unless it's a first contract, like Mendenhall!), but there will be dead money from their signing bonuses as well...

Don't forget Foote and J. Scott, who count another $6+ million combined against the cap...

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
01-18-2012, 01:17 AM
Casey Hampton $8,056,668.00
Chris Kemoeatu $5,261,666.00
Aaron Smith $2,984,191.00
Bryant McFadden $2,666,668.00
Will Allen $1,605,000.00
Arnaz Battle $1,362,500.00

these 6 add up to ....$21,936,693.00

if we need more room

Hines Ward $4,610,000.00
James Farrior $3,825,000.00

add in these 2 to the first 6.....$ 30,371,693.00

Hopefully my math is good. What kind of penalties would we be facing if we got rid of these guys?

The numbers here for these guys are their cap hits, not their salaries. Teams save the salary and any unclaimed bonuses (like a roster bonus due prior to next season) but still must account for the pro rated SB and any other bonuses collected along the way. That would give us the following (if my numbers are right) for the players you listed:

Hampton $4.89M
Kemo $3.577 and we have to decide to carry dead money in '13 or take extra hit now
Smith $875K this was supposed to be his last year but it looks like he deferred some of last year's money to restructure and we have to pay up now.
BMac $2.5M
Allen $1.28M
Battle $1.0375

Other candidates (who would also be in their last seasons so no additional penalty)

Farrior $2.825M
Foote $3M
J. Scott $2.2M

papillon
01-18-2012, 01:27 AM
Heath Miller - 7 million, who knew? :shock:

Pappy

Chadman
01-18-2012, 01:49 AM
Sorry all- now updated with their 2012 salary & contract end year..

Chadman
01-18-2012, 02:17 AM
Looking at the Salary list, here's a few thouhgts on how money can be saved-

1. Extend Ben's contract by a year or 2. Give him some or all of his salary as a signing bonus & stretch him out. It'll bite the FO on the bum in future years, but it might keep this team competitive through Ben's career. Not sure of the figures, but if you gave Ben his 2012 salary as a signing bonus, pretty sure the Steelers will save somewhere around the $3-$4 million mark.

2. Cut/Extend/Re-do Casey Hampton's contract. If the Steelers cut Hampton before March 1, they are believed to be saving $5.89 million. That would obviously go a long way. By cutting him outright, the Steelers run the very real risk of him signing elsewhere as there are not a lot of quality NT's available. If the FO feels they need him going forward, an extension with his salary converted to signing bonus is a possibility. NT's can play until mid-to-late 30's, but we saw something of a drop-off of Casey's play this year.

3. Kemo- cutting Kemo before March 1 saves the team $2.4 million. This seems the likely course of action.

4. James Farrior- at 37, he'll cost nearly $4 mill against the cap for a player that will get rotated out of the game by a younger player. Cutting him saves $2.825 million.

5. Larry Foote- probably will find his career as a Steeler depends on James Farrior. If cut, he'll save $3 million. However, if Farrior is let go or retires, Foote could get an extension & walk into the starting line-up. Given the potential upheavel of the team, this is a strong possibility.

6. Aaron Smith- should retire, saving $2.9 million.

7. Hines Ward- cutting Hines saves around $4 million. That said- he might take an outright pay-cut & save the Steelers $2 million or so to stay as the #4 WR.

8. Bryant McFadden- given that the younger CB's looked ok this season, Chadman expects McFadden will be cut, saving $2.5 million.

9. Jonathon Scott- signed a surprisingly well paid contract, then lost his job. Now will likely be cut. Could get re-signed to be the swing OT, or the Steelers could just bring back Essex. Cutting Scott saves $2.2 million. This situation might be directly influenced by what happens with Max Starks.

10. Will Allen. Can't beat out Mundy, and Mundy is only ok. Good ST player, but given the cap situation, you can't pay someone this sort of money to be a ST player. Cutting Allen saves $1.3 million.

11. Arnaz Battle- see Will Allen. Cutting Battle saves a little over $1 million

Chadman
01-18-2012, 02:31 AM
If the Steelers follow the "Chadman Way" and do all the suggested cuts, minus Larry Foote who survives due to Farrior being cut, they will save, by Chadman's calculations, $28.04 million.

Now, some of you are saying "You've gone too far Chadman! we only need to lose $20 million!". But that's not true. $20 million only gets the Steelers under the cap. They will only have around 40 players on the books. They'll need to sign their draftees & a few FA's before the season starts.

$28 million is about the right amount of money required...maybe a little far...but not much.

Factor in that Wallace & Redman will likelt get significant pay increases, along with Keenan Lewis & Steve McLendon too. And if Hampton is cut, re-signing Hoke becomes pretty important.

The money will dry up quickly.

2 other players that might be able to be restructured are the LB brothers- Timmons & Woodley. Both only just got their pay increase, but there is a little trick included in both contracts. Both have 'Roster Bonus Payments" attached for this upcoming season- Woodley gets $5.5 million & Timmons gets $4.4 million. If the Steelers guarentee those roster bonus payments, before a certain time in March (not sure of the date), they can absorb those roster bonus payments over the life of the contract- similar to Signing Bonus payments. If both players do this, roughly $8 million is saved.

RuthlessBurgher
01-18-2012, 03:17 AM
Factor in that Wallace & Redman will likelt get significant pay increases, along with Keenan Lewis & Steve McLendon too. And if Hampton is cut, re-signing Hoke becomes pretty important.

Here were the RFA tender amounts for this past season (the 2012 figures aren't out yet, but I'd expect a slight increase for this year, but not by much...maybe $100-$150K more for each or something like that).

$3,317,000 - 1st & 3rd round compensation
$2,611,000 - 1st round compensation
$1,835,000 - 2nd round compensation
$1,200,000 - original round compensation

If I had to guess, the team wants to keep both Wallace and Lewis, and in order to guarantee that they do so, they'd probably give Wallace the highest tender (requiring 1st and 3rd compensation) and Lewis the lowest tender (requiring original round compensation, which in his case would be a 3rd round pick). No one is going to give up a huge blockbuster contract plus a 1st and a 3rd for Wallace, and no one is going to give up a significant contract (one that our front office wouldn't match) and give us a 3rd round pick for Lewis.

McLendon and Redman are exclusive rights free agents, so they aren't breaking the bank by any means. All we need to do is offer then a minimal level contract (not sure of the exact figure, but I don't think it's even more than a half million), and the only choice they have is to take it or leave it...they cannot negotiate with any other teams at this point. Essentially, at this point in their young careers, the team has them by the short and curlies.

I think Hoke is done regardless (had a metal plate put in his neck). His ability to enjoy life with his wife and 4 kids is much more important than playing another year of football.

Mister Pittsburgh
01-18-2012, 09:30 AM
From what I gather the Hokester is done. Mister Pittsburgh is thinking draft a NT in Rnd 1 or 2, get Casey down to a low salary to stick around, and have Zigmeister flash as the emergency NT. Let's get real here...doesn't take a rocket scientist to be a huge manbeast in the middle of the Dline and eat up blockers unless you are not strong enough coming out so a rookie could start at NT with Hampton backing him up and rotating here and there.

Chadman
01-18-2012, 10:19 AM
From what I gather the Hokester is done. Mister Pittsburgh is thinking draft a NT in Rnd 1 or 2, get Casey down to a low salary to stick around, and have Zigmeister flash as the emergency NT. Let's get real here...doesn't take a rocket scientist to be a huge manbeast in the middle of the Dline and eat up blockers unless you are not strong enough coming out so a rookie could start at NT with Hampton backing him up and rotating here and there.

Could agree with that. Could you draft a rookie & have him alternate with McLendon & Hood perhaps?

steelblood
01-18-2012, 10:31 AM
I'd cut Hampton, Ward, Smith, Kemo, Foote, Farrior, Battle (23 million).

I'd give Wallace the high 1st and third round tender and a 2nd round tender to Keenan Lewis. I wouldn't offer any of UFAs a contract to start FA except Legursky and it would be a club friendly offer of about 900K.

Then, I'd restructure as needed to get under the cap (which Rooney believes will be only 124K) to sign a budget UFA or two and sign draft picks.

It really isn't that painful. Most of the guys we are cutting are either done or on a steady decline. It is time for them to go.

Mister Pittsburgh
01-18-2012, 10:54 AM
From what I gather the Hokester is done. Mister Pittsburgh is thinking draft a NT in Rnd 1 or 2, get Casey down to a low salary to stick around, and have Zigmeister flash as the emergency NT. Let's get real here...doesn't take a rocket scientist to be a huge manbeast in the middle of the Dline and eat up blockers unless you are not strong enough coming out so a rookie could start at NT with Hampton backing him up and rotating here and there.

Could agree with that. Could you draft a rookie & have him alternate with McLendon & Hood perhaps?

If they get a rookie NT they feel can play day one, sure.

RuthlessBurgher
01-18-2012, 11:23 AM
From what I gather the Hokester is done. Mister Pittsburgh is thinking draft a NT in Rnd 1 or 2, get Casey down to a low salary to stick around, and have Zigmeister flash as the emergency NT. Let's get real here...doesn't take a rocket scientist to be a huge manbeast in the middle of the Dline and eat up blockers unless you are not strong enough coming out so a rookie could start at NT with Hampton backing him up and rotating here and there.

Referring to onesself in the third person in a Chadman thread...not sure if that is a fitting tribute or outright blasphemy. :lol:

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
01-18-2012, 12:49 PM
Heath Miller - 7 million, who knew? :shock:

Pappy

I'll bet Heath was well aware :lol:

Mister Pittsburgh
01-18-2012, 01:09 PM
From what I gather the Hokester is done. Mister Pittsburgh is thinking draft a NT in Rnd 1 or 2, get Casey down to a low salary to stick around, and have Zigmeister flash as the emergency NT. Let's get real here...doesn't take a rocket scientist to be a huge manbeast in the middle of the Dline and eat up blockers unless you are not strong enough coming out so a rookie could start at NT with Hampton backing him up and rotating here and there.

Referring to onesself in the third person in a Chadman thread...not sure if that is a fitting tribute or outright blasphemy. :lol:

Mister Pittsburgh purely did it as a tribute to Chadman....I always enjoy reading his stuff and think he has some good input! :Cheers

Dee Dub
01-18-2012, 01:16 PM
Chadman I was looking at your Steeler mock draft in your signature and have to say I dont think Poe would be a good idea at #24. He, like Hiloti Ngata, is best suited as the DT in a 3-4 and the Steelers are pretty well covered at that positions. Plus there is talk that Hood will move to NT. Since they dont know yet that Hood can do that I think drafting another DT at #24 isnt a good idea. Just my thoughts. Caring on.

Slapstick
01-18-2012, 01:30 PM
The Ravens play a 3-4...

Mister Pittsburgh
01-18-2012, 02:03 PM
We are covered at NT in the 3-4??? :shock:

Hoke - Broken Neck (not really but jacked up neck to point he has to retire)
Snack - ACL & OLD
McLendon - Unproven
Hood - Unproven at NT

I think we need to draft a NT in the first 3...seems there are some quality prospects available this year.

Dee Dub
01-18-2012, 03:05 PM
We are covered at NT in the 3-4??? :shock:

That isnt what I said. I said....

He (Poe), like Hiloti Ngata, is best suited as the DT in a 3-4 and the Steelers are pretty well covered at that positions.




I think we need to draft a NT in the first 3...seems there are some quality prospects available this year.

Agreed. See my signature.

Mister Pittsburgh
01-18-2012, 03:12 PM
[quote="Mister Pittsburgh":3f84pt34]We are covered at NT in the 3-4??? :shock:

That isnt what I said. I said....

He (Poe), like Hiloti Ngata, is best suited as the DT in a 3-4 and the Steelers are pretty well covered at that positions.




I think we need to draft a NT in the first 3...seems there are some quality prospects available this year.

Agreed. See my signature.[/quote:3f84pt34]

I am confused. The 3-4 is two DE's and a NT correct? Is it two DT's and a NT? If Ngata is best at DT, do you mean DE?

Dee Dub
01-18-2012, 03:44 PM
[quote="Dee Dub":2edjrohd][quote="Mister Pittsburgh":2edjrohd]We are covered at NT in the 3-4??? :shock:

That isnt what I said. I said....

He (Poe), like Hiloti Ngata, is best suited as the DT in a 3-4 and the Steelers are pretty well covered at that positions.




I think we need to draft a NT in the first 3...seems there are some quality prospects available this year.

Agreed. See my signature.[/quote:2edjrohd]

I am confused. The 3-4 is two DE's and a NT correct? Is it two DT's and a NT? If Ngata is best at DT, do you mean DE?[/quote:2edjrohd]


:lol: Well you see I am old school and we use to call them DT. Anything inside the tackle was called as such. The OLB in the 3-4 who lines up where a 4-3 DE lines up was considered the DE. But I get what you are saying.

Oviedo
01-18-2012, 04:15 PM
Go to a 4-3 and you will eliminate the NT issue which is going to be more and more problematic as more teams play the 3-4. Just sayin' so I don't disappoint anyone :wink:

Chadman
01-18-2012, 11:55 PM
Chadman I was looking at your Steeler mock draft in your signature and have to say I dont think Poe would be a good idea at #24. He, like Hiloti Ngata, is best suited as the DT in a 3-4 and the Steelers are pretty well covered at that positions. Plus there is talk that Hood will move to NT. Since they dont know yet that Hood can do that I think drafting another DT at #24 isnt a good idea. Just my thoughts. Caring on.

No worries DD, this is only an early version of the mock anyway. Chances are, as Chadman sifts through this thread there will be a much more in-depth look at Chadman's mock to come.

Curious about your comparison of Poe to Ngata though. Poe is a plug at 350lbs, with really only short area quickness, not the same sort of pass rushing threat as Ngata. Poe strength is...his strength. Even his strength conditioning coach agrees- he's stated that Poe could give up football & be a competitive weight lifter if he put his mind to it. With that sort of strength & size, he'd be an ideal NT, along the lines of Joel Steed in the past.

For those posters that have a hard time drafting DL early in the 3-4, don't get caught up in 'how it used to be' drafting for the 3-4. With more teams moving in this direction, the popularity of big 3-4 DL players increases, which raises draft stocl. So the guys you used to be able to draft in the 3rd round onwards are suddenly 1st round guys.

And of all the 3-4 positions that are 'priority', NT is the #1- it's from this position that you get the follow-on pressure from the DE's, your OLB's & your ILB's. It's the play of the NT that determines the effectiveness of the run defense. Be it a pass rushing NT, or a run stuffing NT- if he can'y occupy at least 2 blockers, the rest of the 3-4 Defense struggles to play effectively.

Just because we've been spoiled with stellar play from Steed & then Hampton does not make it an 'easy' position to fill.

Chadman
01-19-2012, 11:06 PM
Ok, moving along slightly...

If there is one thing we all pretty much know, it's that the Steelers under Coach Cowher, and now Coach Tomlin, rarely put themselves in a position where a Rookie HAS to start. Even if they expect the Rookie to win the job soon, they will always cover themselves with a Vet to help ease the transition period.

Rookies are not handed starting jobs.

Let's go through the positions on the roster that will face change & see how the Steelers will prepare, most likely, for a season that might see some fairly significant roster changes.

QB- Ben is securely under contract & no threat of losing his job. It would seem likely that Dennis Dixon will move on. Jerod Johnson was signed the other day & might very well be pencilled in as #3 QB going forward. The #2 position is unfilled at this point. Both Leftwich & Batch are UFA's. It's pretty reasonable to predict that Leftwich will be resigned, as interest in him should border on non-exsistant, at least so far as being more than a back-up. He provides a steady Vet, if healthy, that could easily step in if Ben was hurt & give decent service at QB. Batch has been around for some time, and the coaches obviously feel comfortable with him. However, when inserted he isn't trusted with too much throwing responsibility- this is likely a sign that his arm isn't what it used to be. Batch may go to Training Camp, but likely won't come out of it with a jersey. He's only a phone call away if needed anyway.

RB- Mendenhall will be brought back for the last year of his contract. His injury makes his complete return somewhat doubtful, but no point moving on without him at this stage. He won't be re-signed before the beginning of next season, which makes the guys behind him a little more interesting. Isaac Redman is an ERFA, which essentially means he's staying a Steeler. He's a good back-up RB, and might steal some carries away from Mendy next season. Jonathon Dwyer, John Clay, Chad Spann & Baron Batch will fight it out for 1 or 2 spots. Mewelde Moore is an UFA & may be brought back if Batch doesn't carry on where he left off last TC. You would think if Batch plays even close to his level last TC that he's got 3rd down RB duties covered. That leaves 1 spot for Dwyer, Clay & Spann. Here's betting Dwyer is retained.

TE- Heath Miller is about as safe a roster spot as you get. Behind him Wes Saunders looked decent as an UDFA in his first year. But he's not a blocker. David Johnson is a RFA. His play is up & down, but mostly down. His blocking is willing, if unispiring. He'll likely get tendered the lowest tender & challenged by a draft pick, low end UFA or another UDFA in Training Camp.

OL- Pouncey, Gilbert & Colon appear safe- no real chance of being cut. Chris Kemoeatu lost his starting spot to such awe-inspiring OG's as Doug Legursky, Ramon Foster & Trai Essex. This is a bad sign. And with his inflated contract, one of the most likely cuts on the roster. Legursky, Foster & Essex are all FA's this season (Foster is RFA). Foster will likely get a low tender, Legursky could get a multi-year low-end deal. Essex? Not sure. His value may be tied to the outcome of the OT position, where Jonathon Scott is a candidate for release, Max Starks is an UFA & Jamon Meredith is a RFA. Can't see Scott surviving on his contract number. Gilbert is moving to LT, Colon back to RT. This could signal the goodbye for Max Starks, who is unlikely to come back 'cheap'. Scott could be brought back at a friendlier cap number to be the swing OT, but is it cheaper to just get Essex to do that job? Meredith is no guarentee to stick. Chris scott is the only guy not really mentioned. He had good wraps from the FO going into camp, then proceeded to be worse than our already crap interior OL. Given that the Steelers are unlikely to hand a starting spot to any rookie, expect at least 2 OG's & 1 OT to be brought back- Chadman's guess is Legursky, Foster & Essex. 1 or 2 rookies could be added here, maybe even a UFA from outside of the team too.

pick6
01-20-2012, 12:35 AM
Ok, moving along slightly...

If there is one thing we all pretty much know, it's that the Steelers under Coach Cowher, and now Coach Tomlin, rarely put themselves in a position where a Rookie HAS to start. Even if they expect the Rookie to win the job soon, they will always cover themselves with a Vet to help ease the transition period.

Rookies are not handed starting jobs.

Let's go through the positions on the roster that will face change & see how the Steelers will prepare, most likely, for a season that might see some fairly significant roster changes.

QB- Ben is securely under contract & no threat of losing his job. It would seem likely that Dennis Dixon will move on. Jerod Johnson was signed the other day & might very well be pencilled in as #3 QB going forward. The #2 position is unfilled at this point. Both Leftwich & Batch are UFA's. It's pretty reasonable to predict that Leftwich will be resigned, as interest in him should border on non-exsistant, at least so far as being more than a back-up. He provides a steady Vet, if healthy, that could easily step in if Ben was hurt & give decent service at QB. Batch has been around for some time, and the coaches obviously feel comfortable with him. However, when inserted he isn't trusted with too much throwing responsibility- this is likely a sign that his arm isn't what it used to be. Batch may go to Training Camp, but likely won't come out of it with a jersey. He's only a phone call away if needed anyway.

RB- Mendenhall will be brought back for the last year of his contract. His injury makes his complete return somewhat doubtful, but no point moving on without him at this stage. He won't be re-signed before the beginning of next season, which makes the guys behind him a little more interesting. Isaac Redman is an ERFA, which essentially means he's staying a Steeler. He's a good back-up RB, and might steal some carries away from Mendy next season. Jonathon Dwyer, John Clay, Chad Spann & Baron Batch will fight it out for 1 or 2 spots. Mewelde Moore is an UFA & may be brought back if Batch doesn't carry on where he left off last TC. You would think if Batch plays even close to his level last TC that he's got 3rd down RB duties covered. That leaves 1 spot for Dwyer, Clay & Spann. Here's betting Dwyer is retained.

TE- Heath Miller is about as safe a roster spot as you get. Behind him Wes Saunders looked decent as an UDFA in his first year. But he's not a blocker. David Johnson is a RFA. His play is up & down, but mostly down. His blocking is willing, if unispiring. He'll likely get tendered the lowest tender & challenged by a draft pick, low end UFA or another UDFA in Training Camp.

OL- Pouncey, Gilbert & Colon appear safe- no real chance of being cut. Chris Kemoeatu lost his starting spot to such awe-inspiring OG's as Doug Legursky, Ramon Foster & Trai Essex. This is a bad sign. And with his inflated contract, one of the most likely cuts on the roster. Legursky, Foster & Essex are all FA's this season (Foster is RFA). Foster will likely get a low tender, Legursky could get a multi-year low-end deal. Essex? Not sure. His value may be tied to the outcome of the OT position, where Jonathon Scott is a candidate for release, Max Starks is an UFA & Jamon Meredith is a RFA. Can't see Scott surviving on his contract number. Gilbert is moving to LT, Colon back to RT. This could signal the goodbye for Max Starks, who is unlikely to come back 'cheap'. Scott could be brought back at a friendlier cap number to be the swing OT, but is it cheaper to just get Essex to do that job? Meredith is no guarentee to stick. Chris scott is the only guy not really mentioned. He had good wraps from the FO going into camp, then proceeded to be worse than our already crap interior OL. Given that the Steelers are unlikely to hand a starting spot to any rookie, expect at least 2 OG's & 1 OT to be brought back- Chadman's guess is Legursky, Foster & Essex. 1 or 2 rookies could be added here, maybe even a UFA from outside of the team too.


Great thread Chadman. Cant find this kind of stuff anywhere else. And apparently, many Steeler fans could moonlight as GMs. Some of you really know your football. I doubt if other team boards get into like this.

So basically I am still stuck on building our team for the Ravens. The birds have obsessed over us for a decade and they are now pounding us in the trenches. Our cap maneuvers, draft, and free agency acquisitions must be predicated upon not just getting better in the trenches but getting excellent in the trenches. This is how we go back to beating the birds twice a year and obtaining the 1 or 2 seed with the much needed bye and some home field games in the post season. Pouncey needs help in the middle. If we can get someone who is strong enough to give Ngata & company some trouble or combined with Pouncey blow a friggin hole in that line like the good old days and make the 3rd and 3 an easier situation for us we will be sitting pretty. Conversely, on the dline, love Casey, and he has an important role to play, I also really like McClendon, but we need another awesome NT who blows things up in the middle. Let's face it Bmore has a very strong oline and they have been giving us the business as of these last few years. If we can stop Ray Rice then Flacco is put on the spot and I like our chances sans that last drive he had against us ( a complete anomaly lol). Buckle down and get excellent in the trenches legursky and foster are overachievers and I appreciate that but they need to play a more periphery role as we try to go on a serious run while we still have Ben.


Ok, I agree with the "Chadman Way" for the most part. I would keep Hines, Foote, and of course Casey, but would cut their money in half or as much as I could. I don't know if Casey would go for that as he knows how important he will be next year. Maybe some kind of restructure to get us some cap space.

Here's the tough part. A. smith,Farrior, Bmac, W. allen and A. battle, and Kemoeatu would all be cut. Not yet sure what to do with OL J. Scott. My 2 cents so far.

Chadman
01-20-2012, 01:07 AM
Wide Reciever- The Steelers have one of the youngest & most exciting groups in the NFL with Brown, Wallace & Sanders emerging. Experienced players like ward & Cotchery just enhance an already good group. That said- Wallace as we know is a RFA. And Cotchery is an UFA. Ward is 1000 years old & cost $4 million as the 4th/5th WR. Chadman would be absolutely shocked if Wallace is allowed to leave. He'll recieve the #1 tender & get paid around $3.5 million, unless he gets a multi-year deal (which Chadman predicts will happen). There isn't room for both Cotchery & Ward, at least, not at their current salary levels. Both may come back if Ward takes a significant pay-cut, and Cotchery is happy with the #4 WR role. Ward's pay-cut seems more likely than Cotchery's happiness. Arnaz Battle is a WR by name only, and costs too much for a guy that only play's ST. Rookies can do that job, cheaper. Expect Arnaz to be one of the first to go.

DL- The area that could experience the greatest change. Aaron Smith & Chris Hoke are likely retiring. This removes 1 starter & a quality back-up. Casey Hampton could also go as his contract number & his age/injuries don't equate to a good deal. Steve McLendon, the #3 NT is an ERFA, and will likely be kept around. Depending on what the team does with Hampton, it is possible McLendon becomes the starting NT. Keep in mind, McLendon is largly untested, so relying on him is quite a risk- an unusual move for the Steelers. Cam Heyward, Brett Keisel & Ziggy Hood will be holdovers next season. Corbin Bryant & Al Woods may get a look. If Smith, Hoke & Hampton are removed from the line-up, it is extremely likely an early draft pick will be used to help fill this group, as well as a potential UFA signing to help with the rotation. At the very least, if both Hoke & Hampton are removed, a rookie NT will be added to support McLendon.

Chadman
01-20-2012, 01:23 AM
Linebacker- No FA's at all in the LB group. However, James Farrior is on the wrong side of 35, let alone 30, and his playing time is reducing. He is, however, paid like a starter. He might retire (unlikely), asked to take a paycut (likely) or be released (very possible). Either way, he won't be paid as a starter going forward, you would assume. The situation with Farrior effects 2 players. First, Larry Foote. Foote is 32, and knows the system well. If Farrior is removed from the roster, it is a very safe bet that Foote steps up as the starter. He might be in line for an extension on his contract to reduce his cap number. If Farrior is brought back, Foote & Farrior could split time. This is unlikely, however, as both would need to take paycuts for this situation to be viable & affordable. If Farrior takes a paycut & splits time, it's more likely to be with the Second player effected by Farrior's status- Stevenson Sylvester. He is largely untested, like McLendon, so the same theory stands- it's unlikely he'll get the starting job without some cover in the way of an experienced Vet around. Either Farrior or Foote could be that guy. Morrty Ivy is more a ST player than LB, but his cap value makes him a good player to have around. LaMarr Woodley & Timmons both got contract upgrades last summer. Both are safe on the roster. Both are due Roster Bonus payments, which might be absorbed into their signing bonus & spread out over the length of their contracts in order to save cap room. James Harrison is 33 & one of the highest paid players on the roster. It is unlikely that he'll be a casualty of cap economics though, as his level of play is still good. Behind Harrison is Jason Worilds who got good gametime this season. Although not a stand-out, he didn't look out of place, and provides solid support to Harrison & Woodley. Chris Carter is untested, but promising. Changes will come to the unit, but it's hard to tell just how significant. This group may return largely intact.

pick6
01-20-2012, 01:23 AM
Wide Reciever- The Steelers have one of the youngest & most exciting groups in the NFL with Brown, Wallace & Sanders emerging. Experienced players like ward & Cotchery just enhance an already good group. That said- Wallace as we know is a RFA. And Cotchery is an UFA. Ward is 1000 years old & cost $4 million as the 4th/5th WR. Chadman would be absolutely shocked if Wallace is allowed to leave. He'll recieve the #1 tender & get paid around $3.5 million, unless he gets a multi-year deal (which Chadman predicts will happen). There isn't room for both Cotchery & Ward, at least, not at their current salary levels. Both may come back if Ward takes a significant pay-cut, and Cotchery is happy with the #4 WR role. Ward's pay-cut seems more likely than Cotchery's happiness. Arnaz Battle is a WR by name only, and costs too much for a guy that only play's ST. Rookies can do that job, cheaper. Expect Arnaz to be one of the first to go.

DL- The area that could experience the greatest change. Aaron Smith & Chris Hoke are likely retiring. This removes 1 starter & a quality back-up. Casey Hampton could also go as his contract number & his age/injuries don't equate to a good deal. Steve McLendon, the #3 NT is an ERFA, and will likely be kept around. Depending on what the team does with Hampton, it is possible McLendon becomes the starting NT. Keep in mind, McLendon is largly untested, so relying on him is quite a risk- an unusual move for the Steelers. Cam Heyward, Brett Keisel & Ziggy Hood will be holdovers next season. Corbin Bryant & Al Woods may get a look. If Smith, Hoke & Hampton are removed from the line-up, it is extremely likely an early draft pick will be used to help fill this group, as well as a potential UFA signing to help with the rotation. At the very least, if both Hoke & Hampton are removed, a rookie NT will be added to support McLendon.


I really think we should add a rookie NT, first 3 rounds, even if Hampton stays for less money.

Chadman
01-20-2012, 01:55 AM
DB's- The Steelers have Willie Gay (UFA) & Keenan Lewis (RFA) as FA CB's, with Ryan Mundy (RFA) the only FA Safety. Both Lewis & Mundy should get tenders, with Lewis in line to recieve a reasonably high tender. Mundy should get the base tender. Willie Gay may recieve some interest on the FA market, making it hard to resign him. If he does re-sign, it could be at the detriment of some of the younger CB's on the roster- Keenan Lewis, Cortez Allen & Curtis Brown. It is quite possible that the Steelers move forward without Gay as they invested in the CB position quite well over the last 3 years. Bryant McFadden is a walking cap casualty- his cap figure is too high, his playing level too low. If both Gay & McFadden are removed, it is possible the Steelers might look for a low-level UFA CB to add some experience. Troy Polamalu & Ryan Clark are safe. they will return as the starters next season. Mundy looks the #1 back-up at this point. Will Allen is #2 back-up, but his cap figure puts him at extreme risk of being cut. A rookie Safety may be on the agenda this season.

ST- Dan Sepulveda was overdrafted, he's currently over-priced, and it may well be just plain over for him as a Steeler. Kapinos probably enters camp as #1 but don't be surprised if he is challenged in Camp. Shawn Suisham is well paid for an average kicker. A challenger here is likely.

Chadman
01-20-2012, 02:11 AM
The interesting positions to look at in regards to "inserting an untested player without Vet competition already in place" appears to be-

LG- With Kemo likely gone, Legursky will be 'slated' as the starting LG if he is signed. It's likely the Steelers will look at an OG or two in the draft, but expect a Vet like Legursky to be brought back to 'hold' the position until it becomes apparent the player behind him is better. The other option is to sign an UFA, but given the cap situation at the moment, it is difficult to find a player that can be guarenteed a starter on Vet minimum money. The likely scenario- Legursky #1 on a cap friendly multi-year contract, and a rookie backing him up.

RG- Ramon Foster is a RFA, and will likely be tendered. Once that is done, he'll likely be named the starter at RG. A rookie or UFA could be brought in to challange this spot however as the FO seem to be constantly trying to replace Foster.

NT- Hoke & Hampton could be gone, and McLendon is an ERFA. McLendon is likely to come back, Hoke is likely to retire. Hampton? Chances are they'll want to restructure his contract. but if Casey is reluctant, or if the cap hit is still too high, the Steelers could just cut him & draft a guy to 'challenge' McLendon. Chadman doubts that the Steelers would feel comfortable going forward with McLendon #1, Rookie #2 at NT though.

ILB- Farrior holds the key to a number of issues- Larry Foote's status, Stevenson Sylvester's playing time, and the draft investment in an ILB. Chadman 'expects' Farrior to take a paycut, then split time with Sylvester. Or retire. But likely a paycut. That would mean the end for Larry Foote, who is quite possibly the better ILB at this point. If the Steelres don't think Sylvester is the future, drafting an ILB on draft day is very likely.

So the key players as far as Chadman sees it here are Legursky, Kemo, Foster, Hampton, McLendon, Farrior & Foote. These guys will be the biggest influences as far as their contract/status will impact the season coming up.

Realistically, what happens with guys like Hines Ward, Aaron Smith, Arnaz Battle, Bryant McFadden, Dennis Dixon, Chris Hoke & Max Starks may have very little impact on the team next season. They are either already replaced, or very replaceable.

The 'variable' impact player may be Willie Gay, who stepped up his game this season. If the rookies/young players are ready to step in to Gay's role, the Steelers are fine at CB. But if they haven't developed as hoped, Gay may become a priority signing.

RuthlessBurgher
01-21-2012, 09:16 PM
Both Lewis & Mundy should get tenders, with Lewis in line to recieve a reasonably high tender. Mundy should get the base tender.

A team signing an RFA with a base tender requires compensation of a draft pick in the round in which the player was originally drafted. Since Lewis was originally drafted in the 3rd round, and Mundy in the 6th, we could likely get by giving them each a base tender (no reason to give Lewis a higher tender for 2nd or 1st round protection, in my mind).

Chadman
01-30-2012, 07:41 PM
One thing the Steelers seem to do every year is go into a draft with no obvious 'need'.

That is to say- they will have a vet player pencilled in for every position, and rookies are generally expected to be back-ups (unless they outplay the incumbant- which rarely happens).

Given that we have discussed who might get cut, and thrown out nearly every possible name, Chadman will try to disect it a little to see who are the more likely cuts, and who are the more likely contract restructures..

Chris Kemoeatu- is a likely cut, as he no longer holds a starters role & costs more than the guys that play in front of him. However, he'll only be cut if the Steelers get Legursky & Foster back (both are likely).

Casey Hampton- Given that Chris Hoke has now retired, and the only other NT on the roster is McLendon, Chadman believes Casey will get an extension. The Steelers might still draft a NT, even possibly early, but Hampton will probably hold the spot for a year or 2 yet. If Hampton is cut, chances are a FA vet NT will be brought in before the draft.

James Farrior & Larry Foote- get grouped together because it's likely 1 goes & the other stays at this point. The Steelers have given little indication that Sylvester is ready to step in, which indicates to Chadman that 1 of the 2 vets will start next season. Heart says Farrior, head says Foote would be the better player at this point. A draft pick at ILB seems a logical assumption.

Jonathon Scott & Trai Essex- like Farrior & Foote, one of these 2 will likely be back next season, at a budget price. Essex is a FA, Scott under contract. Chadman is betting Scott gets asked to take a paycut & sticks as the back-up OT. Unless there is zero interest in Max Starks across the NFL, Starks will likely be let walk due to him costing too much.

Bryant McFadden- 5th on the depth chart kinda says all you need to know. That said- if the Steelers lose Willie Gay in FA, and they are not convinced Lewis/Brown/Allen are ready to start- he might be due a restructure until he gets outplayed.

Chadman
02-08-2012, 06:43 PM
2 other players that might be able to be restructured are the LB brothers- Timmons & Woodley. Both only just got their pay increase, but there is a little trick included in both contracts. Both have 'Roster Bonus Payments" attached for this upcoming season- Woodley gets $5.5 million & Timmons gets $4.4 million. If the Steelers guarentee those roster bonus payments, before a certain time in March (not sure of the date), they can absorb those roster bonus payments over the life of the contract- similar to Signing Bonus payments. If both players do this, roughly $8 million is saved.


jimwexell James C Wexell
Learn how Steelers already dropped $6.5m in cap money by restructuring Woodley: mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=68&f Timmons next. Great job by Omar LY.

Ahem..... :tt2

Jooser
02-08-2012, 07:14 PM
Yep, good call Chadman. So, between the Woodley restructuring and the two players cut today, the Steelers have made up approximately $10 million towards the cap? Not a bad days work. They can make this work, I'm confident in that.

RuthlessBurgher
02-08-2012, 09:19 PM
Yep, good call Chadman. So, between the Woodley restructuring and the two players cut today, the Steelers have made up approximately $10 million towards the cap? Not a bad days work. They can make this work, I'm confident in that.

Now they just need to double that...restructure Lawrence Timmons tomorrow while also cutting Chris Kemoeatu and Will Allen. Done!

:Clap

pfelix73
02-08-2012, 11:33 PM
I would not count on the FO letting go of Kemo so fast...If he continues to stay on the team, its a sure sign that they are going to put more emphasis on the running game this year. Let's not forget that Kemo is a pretty good run blocker. It's gonna depend on what the FO and the new OC decides to do, but if we see Kemo on the roster throughout the spring, don't be surprised...

:tt1

Jooser
02-09-2012, 05:59 AM
Also, Smitty is still hanging around, but I'm not surprised. I think that he and Big Snack can be restructured as well. Smitty wouldn't be a bad backup to keep on the roster for cheap IMO. Will Allen needs cut, DJ needs cut, Kemo will probably be cut, but could take a pay cut to stay around.

Steel Life
02-09-2012, 08:37 AM
I would not count on the FO letting go of Kemo so fast...If he continues to stay on the team, its a sure sign that they are going to put more emphasis on the running game this year. Let's not forget that Kemo is a pretty good run blocker. It's gonna depend on what the FO and the new OC decides to do, but if we see Kemo on the roster throughout the spring, don't be surprised...

:tt1
I don't know about that Felix...Kemo just wasn't playing well at all last season & his penchant for penalties really can't be tolerated any longer. At this point he's a million dollar talent with a 10 cent head...let him go.

Oviedo
02-09-2012, 08:54 AM
I would not count on the FO letting go of Kemo so fast...If he continues to stay on the team, its a sure sign that they are going to put more emphasis on the running game this year. Let's not forget that Kemo is a pretty good run blocker. It's gonna depend on what the FO and the new OC decides to do, but if we see Kemo on the roster throughout the spring, don't be surprised...

:tt1
I don't know about that Felix...Kemo just wasn't playing well at all last season & his penchant for penalties really can't be tolerated any longer. At this point he's a million dollar talent with a 10 cent head...let him go.


If Kemo stays then he is my odds on favorite as the player that Haley goes ballistic on during a game after he gets another of his bonehead penalties.

Chadman
02-09-2012, 10:37 AM
Kemo may not be cut until Legursky & Foster are re-signed. Chadman highly doubts that the Steelers will go into the 2012 Draft with only Kemo on the books as a potential starter at OG.

That said, if both Legs & Foster are re-signed, could be the end of the road for Kemo.

Willie Gay's re-signing/ non-signing could also determine if the Steelers ask Bryant McFadden to come back at a lower contract cost. Don't be surprised if we have not seen the end of B-Mac...

Chadman
02-09-2012, 07:06 PM
2 other players that might be able to be restructured are the LB brothers- Timmons & Woodley. Both only just got their pay increase, but there is a little trick included in both contracts. Both have 'Roster Bonus Payments" attached for this upcoming season- Woodley gets $5.5 million & Timmons gets $4.4 million. If the Steelers guarentee those roster bonus payments, before a certain time in March (not sure of the date), they can absorb those roster bonus payments over the life of the contract- similar to Signing Bonus payments. If both players do this, roughly $8 million is saved.



Steelers reportedly restructured the contract of ILB Lawrence Timmons, freeing up $5.14 million in salary cap space.
The Steelers have saved $11.7 million against the 2012 cap by restructuring Timmons and LaMarr Woodley. Timmons' base salary was reduced to $700,000, but he's now due a $6.425 million signing bonus prorated at $1.285 million per over the next five years. The Steelers may not be done restructuring, as they need to free enough space to match offers for Mike Wallace now that the maximum tender for restricted free agents is at the first-round level.

Ahem! Ahem!

:Beer

Jooser
02-09-2012, 07:21 PM
Roll on Chadman, roll on! LOL

:tt1

RuthlessBurgher
02-09-2012, 07:57 PM
[quote]2 other players that might be able to be restructured are the LB brothers- Timmons & Woodley. Both only just got their pay increase, but there is a little trick included in both contracts. Both have 'Roster Bonus Payments" attached for this upcoming season- Woodley gets $5.5 million & Timmons gets $4.4 million. If the Steelers guarentee those roster bonus payments, before a certain time in March (not sure of the date), they can absorb those roster bonus payments over the life of the contract- similar to Signing Bonus payments. If both players do this, roughly $8 million is saved.



Steelers reportedly restructured the contract of ILB Lawrence Timmons, freeing up $5.14 million in salary cap space.
The Steelers have saved $11.7 million against the 2012 cap by restructuring Timmons and LaMarr Woodley. Timmons' base salary was reduced to $700,000, but he's now due a $6.425 million signing bonus prorated at $1.285 million per over the next five years. The Steelers may not be done restructuring, as they need to free enough space to match offers for Mike Wallace now that the maximum tender for restricted free agents is at the first-round level.

Ahem! Ahem!

:Beer[/quote:1m0sfkz7]

While the extra cap room we get from the Timmons restructure is great new, this part of the press release was news to me. I thought the maximum RFA tender would bring back a 1st and 3rd round pick in return if we didn't match (it used to be). Now it's only a 1st (oof...this could be bad). Think about what New England's offense needs more than anything else...someone to stretch the field.

They could offer Mike Wallace a monster tender that we would not be able to match because of our current cap woes. Then, if we could not match that contract, the only thing that they'd owe us would be the 31st overall pick in this draft (which I'm sure they wouldn't mind parting with, since they 27th pick from New Orleans and two 2nd round picks as well).

Our WR room would suddenly weaken dramatically...Antonio Brown has been blossoming, but Sanders has been hurt as often as he's been healthy, Hines is over the hill and will need to accept a major pay cut to stick around, and Cotchery is an unrestricted free agent.

pfelix73
02-09-2012, 10:39 PM
Maybe they'll put the tag on him. Alshon Jeffery would be a good pick then if that were the case.

:tt1

Chadman
02-10-2012, 01:24 AM
Ruthless- before you go quasi-Chicken Little on us, name the last player the Steelers lost in FA that they really wanted to keep....

Jooser
02-10-2012, 07:26 AM
Ruthless- before you go quasi-Chicken Little on us, name the last player the Steelers lost in FA that they really wanted to keep....

:D

That's good stuff.

Oviedo
02-10-2012, 09:08 AM
[quote]2 other players that might be able to be restructured are the LB brothers- Timmons & Woodley. Both only just got their pay increase, but there is a little trick included in both contracts. Both have 'Roster Bonus Payments" attached for this upcoming season- Woodley gets $5.5 million & Timmons gets $4.4 million. If the Steelers guarentee those roster bonus payments, before a certain time in March (not sure of the date), they can absorb those roster bonus payments over the life of the contract- similar to Signing Bonus payments. If both players do this, roughly $8 million is saved.



Steelers reportedly restructured the contract of ILB Lawrence Timmons, freeing up $5.14 million in salary cap space.
The Steelers have saved $11.7 million against the 2012 cap by restructuring Timmons and LaMarr Woodley. Timmons' base salary was reduced to $700,000, but he's now due a $6.425 million signing bonus prorated at $1.285 million per over the next five years. The Steelers may not be done restructuring, as they need to free enough space to match offers for Mike Wallace now that the maximum tender for restricted free agents is at the first-round level.

Ahem! Ahem!

:Beer

While the extra cap room we get from the Timmons restructure is great new, this part of the press release was news to me. I thought the maximum RFA tender would bring back a 1st and 3rd round pick in return if we didn't match (it used to be). Now it's only a 1st (oof...this could be bad). Think about what New England's offense needs more than anything else...someone to stretch the field.

They could offer Mike Wallace a monster tender that we would not be able to match because of our current cap woes. Then, if we could not match that contract, the only thing that they'd owe us would be the 31st overall pick in this draft (which I'm sure they wouldn't mind parting with, since they 27th pick from New Orleans and two 2nd round picks as well).

Our WR room would suddenly weaken dramatically...Antonio Brown has been blossoming, but Sanders has been hurt as often as he's been healthy, Hines is over the hill and will need to accept a major pay cut to stick around, and Cotchery is an unrestricted free agent.[/quote:25b29mzo]


I'd have no issue with Wallace signing with NE and us getting a #1 back. There are a number of really good WRs who are available at #31 that we could get as replacements. It's not like Wallace is Jerry Rice as we saw when he faded badly in the second half of last season. What we need to consider is that he maybe topped out already and he can't beat those double teams thrown at him.

Don't get me wrong, I'd like Wallace to stay but not ready to break the bank on him especially given we have to really start to spend some money on the OL or Wallace won't have anyone to throw him the ball anyway. One potential benefit of his leaving is that maybe Ben doesn't hold the ball and wait for him to get open.

phillyesq
02-10-2012, 09:40 AM
While the extra cap room we get from the Timmons restructure is great new, this part of the press release was news to me. I thought the maximum RFA tender would bring back a 1st and 3rd round pick in return if we didn't match (it used to be). Now it's only a 1st (oof...this could be bad). Think about what New England's offense needs more than anything else...someone to stretch the field.

They could offer Mike Wallace a monster tender that we would not be able to match because of our current cap woes. Then, if we could not match that contract, the only thing that they'd owe us would be the 31st overall pick in this draft (which I'm sure they wouldn't mind parting with, since they 27th pick from New Orleans and two 2nd round picks as well).

Our WR room would suddenly weaken dramatically...Antonio Brown has been blossoming, but Sanders has been hurt as often as he's been healthy, Hines is over the hill and will need to accept a major pay cut to stick around, and Cotchery is an unrestricted free agent.

Ruthless, I have shared your concern over Wallace for a while. The Pats* have a lot of picks, as usual. They also have a very poor recent history on the picks that they've actually used. Wallace taking the top off the D, with the TEs and Welker underneath, would be a pretty lethal offense.

I hope that the Steelers are able to retain Wallace, and if they want to, I think they will. However, the threat from the Pats* if he is not locked up is worth considering.

RuthlessBurgher
02-10-2012, 11:08 AM
Ruthless- before you go quasi-Chicken Little on us, name the last player the Steelers lost in FA that they really wanted to keep....

True, but that's when we are doing the negotiating...we are typically able to work things out in a manner that keeps both the player and the team happy. But in this case, with an RFA, other teams doing the negotiating for us...we have no control whatsoever over the types of offers he'll receive. If they give Wallace a blockbuster $50 million deal with $30 guaranteed in the first year (or something else ridiculous like that)...with our salary cap situation, we simply can't match something like that no matter how much we want to.

To prevent this possibility, we'll need to work out a long term deal with Wallace before the RFA period starts. Restructuring Woodley and Timmons, and cutting McFadden and Battle now is a good start, but we have more work to do if we don't want to tempt New England (or other teams) from wanting to make Wallace an offer that he can't refuse (and that our salary cap will force us to refuse).

NW Steeler
02-10-2012, 12:50 PM
I'd have no issue with Wallace signing with NE and us getting a #1 back. There are a number of really good WRs who are available at #31 that we could get as replacements. It's not like Wallace is Jerry Rice as we saw when he faded badly in the second half of last season. What we need to consider is that he maybe topped out already and he can't beat those double teams thrown at him.

Don't get me wrong, I'd like Wallace to stay but not ready to break the bank on him especially given we have to really start to spend some money on the OL or Wallace won't have anyone to throw him the ball anyway. One potential benefit of his leaving is that maybe Ben doesn't hold the ball and wait for him to get open.

I totally agree with you Ovi. I like Wallace too, but if someone is going to offer him a ridiculous contract I can see the Steelers allowing him to walk and spending the pick on another receiver - a BIG receiver with good hands. It seems only obvious that NE may make a play for him.

SteelerOfDeVille
02-10-2012, 07:55 PM
Chadman's a man after my own heart. Apart from the season itself, peicing together next year's team is the most exciting part.

Having said that, my targets (apart from the restructures that have already happened).

Restructure:
James Harrison - I think he'd follow suit now that Woodley and Timmons have restructured. This one alone may get the team under the cap now.
Troy - that's a mighty big number there son. Help me help you; cut that number.
Hines - This is a "can't cut". Hines in any other uni is like Emmitt smith in a AZ Cardinals uni... Besides, I believe he'd restructure.
Ben - i'd save that one for a little later in the offseason - let him know he's helping to sign his new protection (or replacement for Wallace) - not just cuz he has a big contract.

Cuts:
1. Larry Foote - at 97 years old, Farrior is still better. I still think we're a year late in drafting an ILB, but, maybe we get lucky.

Notes:
I want to do something with Colon and Kemoeatu, but, just can't at this point. FA linemen will be too expensive and Pouncey can't do it alone.

-Not expecting many glamor picks in this draft; between the draft and FA, i see the team acquiring:
NT, OG, ILB and likely OT.

Expect to re-sign Antonio Brown this offseason to an long-term, mid-tier contract. I say 5 years, 20 million. In the end, it'll be a steal. I'd take him before Wallace 7 days a week and twice on Sunday. By year's end, he turned into Az Hakim. Having said that, i wanna keep Wallace - he'll just be the #2.

Finally, looking at this roster and the contracts up in the next 2-3 years, this roster will be significantly different in a season or two. They really need to knock some drafts out of the park. I imagine that starting the 2014 season, they will no longer have:
Ike, Casey, Kemo, Hines, Keisel, Farrior, Aaron Smith, Foote. That's more than half of your top 15 paid players.

NJ-STEELER
02-11-2012, 11:13 AM
here's the thing if your the Pats (or any other team looking to sign wallace)

if there are WRs rated highly at around the 31 pick, (where we say we can find a good replacement). then why wouldnt that team just draft that guy instead of signing wallace?

to pry wallace away, any team would have to offer a lot more then the steelers are willing to pay. with the new rookie pay scale from last years CBA, a team would probably opt to draft a WR and save money on their cap.

i'd be more worried if he were an UFA. giving up a draft pick and paying him a big contract seems to me to be a bit much for any team to give up

DrCalculus
02-11-2012, 12:51 PM
here's the thing if your the Pats (or any other team looking to sign wallace)

if there are WRs rated highly at around the 31 pick, (where we say we can find a good replacement). then why wouldnt that team just draft that guy instead of signing wallace?

to pry wallace away, any team would have to offer a lot more then the steelers are willing to pay. with the new rookie pay scale from last years CBA, a team would probably opt to draft a WR and save money on their cap.

i'd be more worried if he were an UFA. giving up a draft pick and paying him a big contract seems to me to be a bit much for any team to give up


I share your opinion on this one, Jersey. Why give up the big contract AND lose the pick?

If they want a quality young receiver, they can just use the pick and spend the money to shore up the defense with free agents.

On the other hand, if they want a veteran WR, there are oodles of UFA types they can throw the same kind of money at without surrendering the pick --- Dwayne Bowe, Reggie Wayne, Vincent Jackson, Marques Colston, Pierre Garcon, Roy Williams, Earl Bennett, Mario Manningham, Plaxico Burress, Stevie Johnson, Robert Meachem, Brandon Lloyd, & Laurent Robinson. They can get any of those guys without any draft pick compensation. Then use the draft pick on a DL.

Oh, and add to all of this that the PATS need to resign Brady's two favorites to keep him from being a pissy little girl: WELKER & BRANCH are UFAs, too. And the entire interior of their OL will be UFAs. And Shaun Ellis, Andre Carter, half their LB crew, etc.

NJ-STEELER
02-11-2012, 01:24 PM
whoa, i didnt even realize all those guys are UFAs

makes it even more likely they dont go after wally



PS, i wonder if ties with Bowe might help haley lure him here. i'd trade wallace for a even a 2nd rouder if we could bowe

Captain Lemming
02-11-2012, 01:44 PM
here's the thing if your the Pats (or any other team looking to sign wallace)

if there are WRs rated highly at around the 31 pick, (where we say we can find a good replacement). then why wouldnt that team just draft that guy instead of signing wallace?

to pry wallace away, any team would have to offer a lot more then the steelers are willing to pay. with the new rookie pay scale from last years CBA, a team would probably opt to draft a WR and save money on their cap.

i'd be more worried if he were an UFA. giving up a draft pick and paying him a big contract seems to me to be a bit much for any team to give up


I share your opinion on this one, Jersey. Why give up the big contract AND lose the pick?

If they want a quality young receiver, they can just use the pick and spend the money to shore up the defense with free agents.

On the other hand, if they want a veteran WR, there are oodles of UFA types they can throw the same kind of money at without surrendering the pick --- Dwayne Bowe, Reggie Wayne, Vincent Jackson, Marques Colston, Pierre Garcon, Roy Williams, Earl Bennett, Mario Manningham, Plaxico Burress, Stevie Johnson, Robert Meachem, Brandon Lloyd, & Laurent Robinson. They can get any of those guys without any draft pick compensation. Then use the draft pick on a DL.

Oh, and add to all of this that the PATS need to resign Brady's two favorites to keep him from being a pissy little girl: WELKER & BRANCH are UFAs, too. And the entire interior of their OL will be UFAs. And Shaun Ellis, Andre Carter, half their LB crew, etc.

Because NOBODY has Wallace's speed.
Wallace is indeed a one trick pony. He is not as complete as some others.

But that one trick is more valuable to the huge hole in the Pats offensethan any other alternative.

The back to the future Delorian had many flaws (bad millage, flux capacitor taking up back seat space etc ). But it did one thing really well, time travel. You don't always need to be complete to be more valuable, especially if that skill is a perfect fit for a need.

NJ-STEELER
02-11-2012, 02:47 PM
i disagree. you're seeing more and more of that speed come out each year

torrey smith has that kind of speed, tj ford too

im sure they'll be a couple of guys coming out this year as well


i love wallace and what he brings to the team. dont know if he's worth top wideout money though. in my eyes he's the perfect #2 receiver. a deep threat at all times. with a bonafide #1 guy next to him.... that duo would be scary

RuthlessBurgher
02-11-2012, 03:15 PM
By year's end, he turned into Az Hakim.

Antonio Brown is already better than Az Hakim ever was.

In just his second year, he had 69 catches for 1108 yards.

Hakim's best year out of 9 in the NFL was 53 catches for 734 yards.

steelblood
02-11-2012, 05:44 PM
Wallace is great right now. But, guys whose entire game is dependent on speed usually don't have long careers. Add to that Wallace's long skinny legs and duck foot style which leaves him more prone to injury, I would not mind if the Steelers simply offered him the highest tender and then franchised him next season if he is dominating again. I doubt that someone is going to pay him top money and give up a 1st and 3rd round pick. If they do, at least we got a great return on our investment (for a 3rd round pick we got 3 years of production and a couple of nice picks).

RuthlessBurgher
02-11-2012, 05:51 PM
Wallace is great right now. But, guys whose entire game is dependent on speed usually don't have long careers. Add to that Wallace's long skinny legs and duck foot style which leaves him more prone to injury, I would not mind if the Steelers simply offered him the highest tender and then franchised him next season if he is dominating again. I doubt that someone is going to pay him top money and give up a 1st and 3rd round pick. If they do, at least we got a great return on our investment (for a 3rd round pick we got 3 years of production and a couple of nice picks).

The highest RFA tender that we could give him right now would only result in 1st round compensation (not 1st and 3rd) under this new CBA.

papillon
02-12-2012, 10:37 PM
The interesting positions to look at in regards to "inserting an untested player without Vet competition already in place" appears to be-

LG- With Kemo likely gone, Legursky will be 'slated' as the starting LG if he is signed. It's likely the Steelers will look at an OG or two in the draft, but expect a Vet like Legursky to be brought back to 'hold' the position until it becomes apparent the player behind him is better. The other option is to sign an UFA, but given the cap situation at the moment, it is difficult to find a player that can be guarenteed a starter on Vet minimum money. The likely scenario- Legursky #1 on a cap friendly multi-year contract, and a rookie backing him up.

RG- Ramon Foster is a RFA, and will likely be tendered. Once that is done, he'll likely be named the starter at RG. A rookie or UFA could be brought in to challange this spot however as the FO seem to be constantly trying to replace Foster.

NT- Hoke & Hampton could be gone, and McLendon is an ERFA. McLendon is likely to come back, Hoke is likely to retire. Hampton? Chances are they'll want to restructure his contract. but if Casey is reluctant, or if the cap hit is still too high, the Steelers could just cut him & draft a guy to 'challenge' McLendon. Chadman doubts that the Steelers would feel comfortable going forward with McLendon #1, Rookie #2 at NT though.

ILB- Farrior holds the key to a number of issues- Larry Foote's status, Stevenson Sylvester's playing time, and the draft investment in an ILB. Chadman 'expects' Farrior to take a paycut, then split time with Sylvester. Or retire. But likely a paycut. That would mean the end for Larry Foote, who is quite possibly the better ILB at this point. If the Steelres don't think Sylvester is the future, drafting an ILB on draft day is very likely.

So the key players as far as Chadman sees it here are Legursky, Kemo, Foster, Hampton, McLendon, Farrior & Foote. These guys will be the biggest influences as far as their contract/status will impact the season coming up.

Realistically, what happens with guys like Hines Ward, Aaron Smith, Arnaz Battle, Bryant McFadden, Dennis Dixon, Chris Hoke & Max Starks may have very little impact on the team next season. They are either already replaced, or very replaceable.

The 'variable' impact player may be Willie Gay, who stepped up his game this season. If the rookies/young players are ready to step in to Gay's role, the Steelers are fine at CB. But if they haven't developed as hoped, Gay may become a priority signing.

How about this plan for left guard and it helps the salary cap situation, because we wouldn't be signing Wallace to a contract and we would be getting the best guard in the draft?

The board has been bantering around Mike Wallace and his worth or lack of it for the past few weeks. Prior to the current CBA a top tender for a player that will become an RFA was a 1st and a 3rd round pick. The current CBA limits it to a first round only (I think).

The Patriots need help on the outside (and their draft position is very late) and the Steelers need help at guard. what if the Steelers could get New England's first (1.31) and their third round (3.95) for Wallace? Then the Steelers try to trade into the 12th, 13th or 14th spot by using their 1st and 2nd round picks (and they may have to throw in a late round selection as well) to grab Decastro. This would leave the Steelers with DeCastro, and picks at 1.31, 3.88 and 3.95 in the first three rounds, but they wouldn't have Wallace any longer or their second round pick.

Would it be worth it?

Pappy

Chadman
02-26-2012, 10:42 AM
As we draw near the start of FA, the Steelers have done either a remarkable job of getting their contracts in-line with the Salary Cap, or they've doomed the franchise to cap Hell in the near future, depending on your point of view.

Lawrence Timmons, LaMarr Woodley, Ike Taylor, Ben Roethlisberger & Willie Colon have all restructured to free up millions, coupled with the release of Bryany McFadden & Arnaz Battle- somewhere around the $29 million mark has now been shaved off the Salary Cap- that's some handy maths right there.

Of course, the Steelers still have FA's to sign, so the cuts/ re-structures may not have ended yet.

Still in 'the firing line' would seem to be James Farrior, Larry Foote, Casey Hampton, Troy Polamalu, Hines Ward, James Harrison, Jonathon Scott, Chris Kemoeatu, Aaron Smith & Will Allen.

Colbert has already stated he wants Casey back- so a re-structure seems likely there.

It seems most likely that 1 of either Farrior or Foote will return- most likely Farrior, but you never know. It's most likely the other LB will be released.

Polamalu & Harrison might still be asked to restructure their deals if things get tight.

Jonathon Scott & Will Allen seem to be dead men walking & are just waiting for their marching orders. That said- wouldn't be surprised to either or even both brought back post-draft if depth is required.

Kemo is interesting. Logic would suggest he should already be cut- but the Steelers are nothing if not 'safe'. Outside of Kemo they have no OG's with starting experience on the roster. If/when Legursky & Foster reach agreements with the Steelers, Kemo might be sent packing at that point.

Ward & Smith will be the 2 heart breakers for many, if cut. The longer it goes on, the more Chadman just starts to wonder though- if Casey doesn't restructure, and if Ziggy goes to NT...could Smith stay on? Chances are- no...but he has given no indication he's retiring at this point. Ward...here's betting he'll get cut. That said- if Wallace flies the coup, and Cotchery asks for too much...maybe there is a spot for Hines afterall...

Chadman
02-26-2012, 10:48 AM
So we turn our heads for now to the Combine & the 2012 NFL Draft.

Chadman will try to update the reported visits/conversations/scouts in attendance/ love notes slipped inside the school books for Steelers targets as they become apparent on THIS post.

So far:
Steelers are scheduled to talk to Alabama ILB Dant'a Hightower
Steelers have spoken to Pitt OG Lucas Nix
Steelers have spoken to Cincinnatti RB Isiah Pead
Steelers have interviewed WVU OLB Bruce Irvin

Chadman
02-26-2012, 10:58 AM
Not sure if any of you remember an interview Kevin Colbert did a few years back on how they ensure they don't reach for picks in each round by grouping the prospects in "Draft Bubbles"- essentially, groups of ten players that the Steelers feel will be available at or around their pick in each respective round, then ranked 1-10. As they come off the board, they mark the name off & then when their pick arrives- they take their selection from the remaining names in that 'bubble'.

As Chadman is not an actual scout, and doesn't have access to any inside information, Chadman will attempt to create "Draft Bubbles" for each round using several mock draft/ draft information sites as the guide. Chadman will list the 7 players either side of the projected Steeler pick, along with the projected Steeler pick- to give 15 potential names from each mock draft site. Then we'll sift through the names, find the 10 that figure most closely to the projected Steeler pick, and put those names in 'the bubble'.

As in previous years, Chadman will stick with the Big School/ Big Production theory for the first 2 rounds, as the Steelers certainly seem to stick with that plan with ever increasing success. So players that fall with 7 picks of the projected Steeler pick that don't pass big school/ big production- will be removed.

Also, players with questionable character will be removed as we all know the Steelers don't take risks early in the draft.

To give the mock draft sites selections value (in order to take away too much personal preference in the 'system'), Chadman will give players 7 picks from the Steelers a 1 point value, 6 picks from the Steelers a 2 point value, and so on...so that we'll have the 10 players that score the highest as our selections.

Chadman
02-26-2012, 11:27 AM
WALTER FOOTBALL
1 Point- CB Dre Kirkpatrick, OLB Vinny Curry
2 Points- TE Coby Fleener, SS Mark Barron
3 Points- WR Micheal Floyd, ILB Donta Hightower
4 Points- OC Peter Konz, DE Whitney Marcilus
5 Points- RB Lamar Miller, DT/DE Fletcher Cox
6 Points- WR Alshon Jeffery, OT Mike Adams
7 Points- DE/OLB Nick Perry, DT/DE Devon Still
16 Points- (Double points for being the exact pick)- OG Cordy Glenn

CBS- Rob Rang
1 Point- OG David DeCastro, DE Nick Perry
2 Points- CB Alfonzo Dennard, OLB Melvin Ingram
3 Points- WR Micheal Floyd, OC Peter Konz
4 Points- DE Whitney Marcilus, DT/DE Kendall Reyes
5 Points- DT/DE Fletcher Cox, DT Dontari Poe
6 Points- QB Ryan Tannehill, WR Ruben Randle
7 Points- DT/DE Jerel Worthy, CB Janoris Jenkins
16 Points- OG Cordy Glenn

CBS- Dane Brugler
1 Point- CB Janoris Jenkins, CB Brandon Boykin
2 Points- DE Nick Perry, CB Alfonzo Dennard
3 Points- OC Peter Konz, WR Kendall wright
4 Points- DT/DE Devon Still, DT/DE Fletcher Cox
5 Points- DE Whitney Marcilus, SS Mark Barron
6 Points- WR Micheal Floyd, WR Rueben Randle
7 Points- TE Dwayne Allen, OT Mike Adams
16 Points- DT Dontari Poe

DRAFT TEK-
1 Point- CB Janoris Jenkins, CB Stephon Gilmore
2 Points- WR Mohamed Sanu, OG David DeCastro
3 Points- WR Micheal Floyd, ILB Vontaze Burfect
4 Points- DE/OLB Nick Perry, OC Peter Konz
5 Points- SS Mark Barron, DE Michael Brockers
6 Points- DT Dontari Poe, WR Kendall Wright
7 Points- OG Brandon Washington, DT/DE Fletcher Cox
16 Points- Dont'a Hightower

SIDELINE SCOUTING-
1 Point- CB Alfonzo Dennard, CB Janoris Jenkins
2 Points- WR Kendall Wright, WR Mohamed Sanu
3 Points- ILB Dont'a Hightower, OC Peter Konz
4 Points- OLB/DE Nick Perry, OLB Courtney Upshaw
5 Points- Luke Kuechly, SS Mark Barron
6 Points- DT Dontari Poe, OG Cordy Glenn
7 Points- DT/DE Jerel Worthy, OLB/DE Whitney Marcilus
16 Points- DT Brandon Thompson

DRAFT COUNTDOWN-
1 Point- OG David DeCastro, CB Janoris Jenkins
2 Points- OG Cordy Glenn, OLB Melvin Ingram
3 Points- WR Alshon Jeffery, ILB Vontaze Burfect
4 Points- OC Peter Konz, DE/OLB Whitney Marcilus
5 Points- RB David Wilson, OLB Nick Perry
6 Points- DT/DE Fletcher Cox, WR Kendall Wright
7 Points- OT Mike Adams, CB Alfonzo Dennard
16 Points- OG Kevin Zeitler

Chadman
02-26-2012, 11:53 AM
Our "Mock Bubble" point results are-

CB's- Dre Kirkpatrick 1 Point, Alfonzo Dennard 12 Points, Janoris Jenkins 11 Points, Stephon Gilmore 1 Point, Brandon Boykin 1 Point

SS- Mark Barron 17 Points

OLB- Nick Perry 21 Points, Vinny Curry 1 Point, Whitney Marcilus 24 Points, Melvin Ingram 4 Points, Courtney Upshaw 4 Points

ILB- Vontaze Burfect 6 Points, Dont'a Hightower 22 Points, Luke Keuchly 5 Points

NT/DE- Fletcher Cox 27 Points, Brandon Thompson 16 Points, Devon Still 11 Points, Dontari Poe 33 Points, Jerel Worthy 14 Points, Kendell Reyes 4 Points, Micheal Brockers 5 Points

OG/OC- Peter Konz 21 Points, Kevin Zeitler 16 Points, Cordy Glenn 40 Points, David DeCastro 4 Points, Brandon Washington 7 Points

OT- Mike Adams 20 Points

TE- Dwayne Allen 7 Points, Coby Fleener 2 Points

WR- Michael Floyd 15 Points, Kendall Wright 17 Points, Alshon Jeffery 9 Points, Mohamed Sanu 4 Points, Reuben Randle- 6 Points

RB- Lamar Miller 5 Points, David Wilson 5 Points

QB- Ryan Tannehill 6 Points

Chadman
02-26-2012, 12:00 PM
Before we tally up points, the Steelers will not be drafting a QB or a RB in Round 1. We shall eliminate both positions from calculations.

This makes our "Mock Bubble" Top 10 players-
Cordy Glenn OG
Dontari Poe NT
Fletcher Cox DE/NT
Whitney Marcilus OLB
Dont'a Hightower ILB
Peter Konz OC/OG
Nick Perry OLB
Mike Adams OT
Kendall Wright WR
Mark Barron SS

Chadman
02-26-2012, 12:22 PM
Given that we know that the Steelers like to draft-

Big School- Big Production

Juniors

Character

Chadman will attempt to rank these players...
1. Peter Konz
2. Fletcher Cox
3. Dont'a Hightower
4. Cordy Glenn
5. Mark Barron
6. Whitney Marcilus
7. Kendall Wright
8. Nick Perry
9. Dontari Poe
10. Mike Adams

These rankings are based on the fact that both Konz & Fletcher fit all the 3 requirements- big schools, productive, juniors & good character. Konz probably edges Cox for 2 reasons- position of need & the Steelers might want to give new OC a shiny new toy. Oh- and it's the Offenses turn in the DEF-OFF-DEF rotation.

Hightower fits all except the Junior tag, and Glenn is the same (although there are questions about consistancy with Glenn).

Barron fits everything except the Junior status, but also doesn't play a 'position of need' just yet. That isn't to say he wouldn't be looked at- Clark & Polamalu can't play forever.

OLB & WR are not big needs, but Marcilus, Perry & Wright fit on many levels if you overlook 'need'. If Wallace leaves- Wright would be an excellent replacement. If the Steelers are not sold on Worilds...

Poe seems to fit on so many levels, but his level of competition makes him a risk, and therefore unlikely. The Steelers might even attempt to trade down if it got to him on the list.

Adams has a history of character concerns as well as inconsistancy. He's a very unlikely choice.

Chadman
02-27-2012, 01:09 AM
Now for a little "What do the Steelers look for at the Combine"..

We'll start with one of the positions the Steelers may look at in 2012- WR...

Looking at the results from 2006 to 2012, we see:

40 Yard- 2 Steelers players were drafted that finished in the Top 10 WR 40's in this time period- Mike Wallace is 6th overall at 4.33 & Willie Reid is equal 7th at 4.34.

In 2006 Willie Reid was #2 overall. 2009 gave us the #2 WR in Mike Wallace. 2010 gave us the equal 2nd WR in Manny Sanders.

Bench Press- Not 1 Steeler player fits in the leaderboard of WR Bench Press.

In 2009 Mike Wallace did come in 12th for Bench Press.

Vertical Jump- No Steeler player is within the top 15 of Vertical Jump testing.

2006 Willie Reid did finish 7th for his Vertical Jump. 2008 gave us Limas Sweed & his 7th placed finish. Mike Wallace finished 4th overall in 2009. Manny Sanders came in 5th in 2010.

Broad Jump- 1 Steeler draftee fits in here- Dallas Baker is equal 7th with 10' 9"

Dallas Baker actually finished 1st overall in 2007. Mike Wallace was equal 1st in 2009. Amazingly- Manny Sanders was #1 overall in 2010.

3 Cone- 1 Steeler again finished here- Manny Sanders is equal 9th with 6.60

Dallas Baker came in 5th in 2007. Mike Wallace finished equal 13th in 2009. Manny Sanders was 2nd overall in 2010.

20 Yard Shuttle- No Steelers have finished in the top 15 overall.

Dallas Baker came in equal 7th in 2007. Manny Sanders finished 3rd in 2010. Antonio Brown finished 7th.

60 Yard Shuttle- No Steelers have finished in the Top 15 overall.

Antonio Brown finished 3rd in 2010.

Going over the history of recent Steeler WR draft picks shows that nearly all of the picks were up around the top of the class in quite a few of the athletic tests. Mike Wallace obviously proved to be an athletic freak at the combine, but Manny Sanders & Willie Reid should not be sneezed at for their athletic contributions. Adding to that- Antonio Brown finished just outside the top group for most of his tests too.

With this in mind, it is quite logical to actually look at Combine numbers for WR's as far as Steeler targets go. With the WR group looking pretty strong, an early round WR seems unlikely- however here are a few names to keep under your hat:

Chris Owusu - Stanford
A.J. Jenkins- Illinois
Danny Coale- Virginia Tech
Jerrell Jackson- Missouri
Junior Hemmingway- Michigan
Kashif Moore- Connecticut
Keshawn Martin- Michigan St

Nearly all of these players are expected to go in the middle to later rounds, and all of them fit within the boundaries the Steelers have drafted within at WR in recent history. In particular- guys like Coale, Martin & Hemmingway also have a career record that indicates these guys are more than 'just Combine guys'. They might not be 'Big Names'- but they could fit nicely into a 4th or 5th WR role for the near future.

SS Laser
02-27-2012, 02:27 AM
NICE work with the WR's Chadman. I don't want to muck up your thread. But could you do DE next? The steelers took 2 in the last three drafts. And have missed on every late round DE since Keisel. There was 4 DE's drafted late rounds. So I still think there is a late round need at back up DE. So a break down like the WR would be interesting for sure. Also top of the interesting list would be CB also. There have been a bunch since Ike Taylor was drafted.

Thanks for a great thread Chadman! :Boobs :tt1

Chadman
02-28-2012, 02:13 AM
DE it will be SS! :Beer

Let it not be said that Chadman is not, at the least- quite accomodating.

The DE's will be teamed with the NT's (Should be a short list) for arguments sake, but we'll avoid using simply the Combine for the DL players as the results are quite unhelpful Chadman has found after trying a few on for size. So for the project's purposes, we'll use Pro Days where applicable to fill in the necessary stats. And we'll do this lot by player, not year...just because. Actually, not 'just because'- the Combine includes both 3-4 DL & 4-3 DL together, so in effect, 3-4 DE's are competing with 3-4 OLB's for the same results- which is unfair.

1. Cameron Heyward- 2011
6'5" 295lb
40 Yard- 4.95
Vertical- 35"

Cameron was recovering from surgery and was, as a result, unable to perform certain tasks. Of note- both Mike Tomlin & Bad Word LeBeau attended his Pro Day.

2. Doug Worthington- 2010 7th Round pick
6'5" 292lb
40 Yard- 5.02
Bench- 19 Reps
Vertical- 35.5"
Broad- 10'01"

3. Ziggy Hood- 2009 1st Round pick
6'3" 300lb
40 Yard- 4.83
Bench- 34 Reps (4th at Combine)
Vertical- 33" (12th at Combine)
Broad- 9'00"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.55
3 Cone- 7.50

4. RaShon Harris- 2009 6th Round pick
6'4" 298lb
40 Yard- 5.05
Bench- 28 Reps
Vertical- 25.5"
Broad- 10'06"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.87
3 Cone- 8.18

5. Ryan McBean- 2007 4th Round pick
6'5" 286lb
40 Yard- 4.98
Bench- 27 reps
Vertical- 28"
Broad- 9'00"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.46
3 Cone- 7.79


Going over the stats, Chadman comes up with the following-

6'5"ish is about the right height for a Steelers DE. Add to these players Aaron Smith & Brett Keisel, and the trend continues.

Add to the height, a weight of around 290lb-300lb is ideal. Again, when you include both Smith & Keisel you start to see a trend.

Speed-wise, it seems that around 5.00 is acceptable for the Steelers. It's quite possible that this stat means very little.

Bench- It would appear a mark of high 20's to 30's is about the target. Interesting that Ziggy should have the highest Rep count- we don't assosciate Ziggy with his strength in general.

Vertical- both the vertical & broad jump should indicate a level of explosiveness. No surprise that both Hood & Heyward excelled here, where later round picks like Harris & McBean were not as impressive.

Broad- See Vertical. Ziggy didn't jump as well as the Steelers seem to like- but could this be partly due to being shorter & stumpy?

20 Yard Shuttle & 3-Cone- These tests tend to try & show agility. No surprise that Ziggy should test well here as he seems quite shifty in his play. Surprisingly...or perhaps not seeing as how he now starts for the Broncos- Ryan McBean was not far off Hood on measurables.

So what did we learn? Steelers 3-4 DE's should be up around the 6'5", 290lb area, be able to run at around 5.00, bench around 27-30 (higher is good), jump up around 30". Higher the jump- higher the draft round. That appears to be the main criterea for Steelers 3-4 DE draft picks.

As no NT was selected under the Colbert-Tomlin era, it is hard to guage what they will look for in a NT.

Chadman
02-28-2012, 02:43 AM
So- who fits as far as 2012 goes? Let's see..

Players that are 6'5" (ish) & 290+ lbs..

Dontari Poe 6'4" 346lbs
Fletcher Cox 6'4" 298lbs
Devon Still 6'5" 303lbs
Kendall Reyes 6'4" 299lbs
Kheeston Randall 6'5" 293lbs
Akiem Hicks 6'5" 318lbs
Derek Wolfe 6'5" 295lbs
Billy Wynn 6'4" 294lbs
Ryan Van Bergen 6'6" 288lbs

From those guys- players that run around 5.00...(or under)

Fletcher Cox- 4.79 (Outstanding!)
Kendall Reyes- 4.95
Dontari Poe- 4.98
Kheeston Randall- 5.00
Billy Wynn- 5.00
Derek Wolfe- 5.01

And then Benched more than 27 Reps...

Dontari Poe 44
Kendell Reyes 36
Derek Wolfe 33
Fletcher Cox 30
Kheeston Randall 28

Vertical Jump of 28"+...

Kendell Reyes 34.5"
Kheeston Randall 34"
Derek Wolfe 33.5"
Dontari Poe 29.5"



So there you have it- based on Steeler history, the 4 men we have above us here are the perfect examples of a Steeler 3-4 DE, based on their athletic abilities alone.

The chances of the Steelers drafting a 3-4 DE are slim- but could grow somewhat if Ziggy Hood is moved to NT, or if the plan is to move him eventually. If no obvious NT is drafted, the chances of a DE improve again.

1st round DE appears unlikely 2 years in a row, but a mid round guy like Kheeston Randall out of Texas might be worth considering as an option. He fits the criteria of a Steelers 3-4 DE perfectly.

Northern_Blitz
02-28-2012, 07:56 AM
The interesting positions to look at in regards to "inserting an untested player without Vet competition already in place" appears to be-

LG- With Kemo likely gone, Legursky will be 'slated' as the starting LG if he is signed. It's likely the Steelers will look at an OG or two in the draft, but expect a Vet like Legursky to be brought back to 'hold' the position until it becomes apparent the player behind him is better. The other option is to sign an UFA, but given the cap situation at the moment, it is difficult to find a player that can be guarenteed a starter on Vet minimum money. The likely scenario- Legursky #1 on a cap friendly multi-year contract, and a rookie backing him up.

RG- Ramon Foster is a RFA, and will likely be tendered. Once that is done, he'll likely be named the starter at RG. A rookie or UFA could be brought in to challange this spot however as the FO seem to be constantly trying to replace Foster.

NT- Hoke & Hampton could be gone, and McLendon is an ERFA. McLendon is likely to come back, Hoke is likely to retire. Hampton? Chances are they'll want to restructure his contract. but if Casey is reluctant, or if the cap hit is still too high, the Steelers could just cut him & draft a guy to 'challenge' McLendon. Chadman doubts that the Steelers would feel comfortable going forward with McLendon #1, Rookie #2 at NT though.

ILB- Farrior holds the key to a number of issues- Larry Foote's status, Stevenson Sylvester's playing time, and the draft investment in an ILB. Chadman 'expects' Farrior to take a paycut, then split time with Sylvester. Or retire. But likely a paycut. That would mean the end for Larry Foote, who is quite possibly the better ILB at this point. If the Steelres don't think Sylvester is the future, drafting an ILB on draft day is very likely.

So the key players as far as Chadman sees it here are Legursky, Kemo, Foster, Hampton, McLendon, Farrior & Foote. These guys will be the biggest influences as far as their contract/status will impact the season coming up.

Realistically, what happens with guys like Hines Ward, Aaron Smith, Arnaz Battle, Bryant McFadden, Dennis Dixon, Chris Hoke & Max Starks may have very little impact on the team next season. They are either already replaced, or very replaceable.

The 'variable' impact player may be Willie Gay, who stepped up his game this season. If the rookies/young players are ready to step in to Gay's role, the Steelers are fine at CB. But if they haven't developed as hoped, Gay may become a priority signing.

How about this plan for left guard and it helps the salary cap situation, because we wouldn't be signing Wallace to a contract and we would be getting the best guard in the draft?

The board has been bantering around Mike Wallace and his worth or lack of it for the past few weeks. Prior to the current CBA a top tender for a player that will become an RFA was a 1st and a 3rd round pick. The current CBA limits it to a first round only (I think).

The Patriots need help on the outside (and their draft position is very late) and the Steelers need help at guard. what if the Steelers could get New England's first (1.31) and their third round (3.95) for Wallace? Then the Steelers try to trade into the 12th, 13th or 14th spot by using their 1st and 2nd round picks (and they may have to throw in a late round selection as well) to grab Decastro. This would leave the Steelers with DeCastro, and picks at 1.31, 3.88 and 3.95 in the first three rounds, but they wouldn't have Wallace any longer or their second round pick.

Would it be worth it?

Pappy


I think that the Pats will first sign Welker to a deal. He'll get a big deal because he's been amazingly productive.

After they do that, I don't think they'd be willing to give Wallace a big deal and forfeit (even a late) 1st round pick.

That would be a lot to sacrifice when their biggest problems are on D.

RuthlessBurgher
02-28-2012, 02:38 PM
Chadman is truly the K.C. Joyner (Football Scientist) of our board's draft season. :tt2 :tt1

Chadman
02-28-2012, 06:06 PM
So far, the Steelers have been reported to be in contact with:

Steelers are scheduled to talk to Alabama ILB Dant'a Hightower
Steelers have spoken to Pitt OG Lucas Nix
Steelers have spoken to Cincinnatti RB Isiah Pead
Steelers have interviewed WVU OLB Bruce Irvin


Chadman will update this regularly.

SS Laser
02-28-2012, 07:02 PM
Thank you very much Chadman! Nice work on the DE's! Keep it coming. I vote for ILB next or CB. Heck do whatever you fell like doing. I am enjoying it all sir.

Chadman
02-29-2012, 02:09 AM
Next on our list of Breakdowns will be "The Linebackers".

We won't seperate ILB from OLB because, essentially, they are not seperated at the Combine.

A look at the Steelers LB's selected under Tomlin-Colbert-

1. Lawrence Timmons- 2007 Round 1
6'1" 234lbs
40 Yard- 4.66
Bench- 25 Reps
Vertical- 35"
Broad- 10'03"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.32
3 Cone- 6.92

2. LaMarr Woodley- 2007 Round 2
6'2" 266lbs
40 Yard- 4.74
Bench- 29 Reps
Vertical- 38.5"
Broad- 9'9"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.42

3. Bruce Davis- 2008 Round 3
6'3" 252lbs
40 Yard- 4.78
Bench- 19 Reps
Vertical- 29"
Broad- 9'01"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.47
3 Cone- 7.34

4. Mike Humpal- 2008 Round 6
6'3" 244lbs
40 Yard- 4.82
Bench- 20 Reps
Vertical- 31"
Broad- 9'11"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.25
3 Cone- 7.07

5. Jason Worilds- 2010 Round 2
6'1" 254lbs
40 Yard- 4.51
Bench- 24 Reps
Vertical- 38"
Broad-
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.29
3 Cone- 6.95

6. Thaddeus Gibson- 2010 Round 4
6'2" 243lbs
40 Yard- 4.58
Bench- 32 Reps
Vertical-
Broad-
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.27
3 Cone- 6.84

7. Stevenson Sylvester- 2010 Round 5
6'2" 231lbs
40 Yard- 4.71
Bench- 23 reps
Vertical- 30.5"
Broad- 8'09"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.50
3 Cone- 7.22

8. Chris Carter- 2011 Round 5
6'1" 248lbs
40 Yard- 4.66
Bench- 27 Reps
Vertical- 36"
Broad- 9'06"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.34
3 Cone- 6.88

RuthlessBurgher
02-29-2012, 04:53 PM
3. Bruce Davis- 2008 Round 3
6'3" 252lbs
40 Yard- 4.78
Bench- 19 Reps
Vertical- 29"
Broad- 9'01"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.47
3 Cone- 7.34

These combine numbers seem to indicate someone who is not particularly fast, not particularly strong, and not a particularly explosive athlete either. There you have it...sometimes the Combine drills can predict precisely what type of player you can expect to get...way to go Combine!!! :lol:

Chadman
02-29-2012, 05:34 PM
3. Bruce Davis- 2008 Round 3
6'3" 252lbs
40 Yard- 4.78
Bench- 19 Reps
Vertical- 29"
Broad- 9'01"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.47
3 Cone- 7.34

These combine numbers seem to indicate someone who is not particularly fast, not particularly strong, and not a particularly explosive athlete either. There you have it...sometimes the Combine drills can predict precisely what type of player you can expect to get...way to go Combine!!! :lol:

Exactly Ruthless. Also Mike Humpal is a guy that can't run & can't bench- and he's out of the NFL too.

LB might just be one of the positions that the Combine actually IS a good indicator.

Another interesting piece of information in there is how similar Worilds & Timmons are athletically.

With the Steelers having shown interest in Bruce Irvin- another OLB- could there be moves a-foot to move Worilds inside?

Chadman
03-01-2012, 02:38 AM
So let's take a look & see which LB's fit "The Steelers Mold"-

Height & weight should be between 6'1" & 6'3", and between 230-250lbs. Why? Don't really know- could be because of leverege, could be that the Steelers feel that their best combination of speed/agility etc comes from this physical dimension.

40 time should be between 4.6 & 4.75- any slower seems to result in non-success. Benching should be between 25 & 35 reps. Vertical jump numbers should be high 20's upwards- the higher the better. Broad jump is all over the place & can probably be disregarded.

Shuttle numbers should fit between 4.2 & 4.5 seconds while 3 Cone should be about 6.80 to 7.00- higher than this is rarely selected/succeed.

Who fits the Height/Weight?
Luke Kuechly 6'3" 242lbs
Donta Hightower 6'2" 265lbs (a little heavy, but for DD's sake, we'll pass him here)
Vontaze Burfect 6'1" 248lbs
James Micheal Johnson 6'1" 241lbs
Jerry Franklin 6'1" 241lbs
Zach Brown 6'1" 244lbs
Lavonte David 6'1" 233lbs
Bruce Irvin 6'3" 245lbs
Nigel Bradham 6'2" 241lbs
Demario Davis 6'2" 235lbs
Travis Lewis 6'1" 246lbs
Emmanual Acho 6'1" 238lbs
Tank Carder 6'2" 236lbs
Jacquies Smith 6'3" 253lbs

Of these, who ran 4.6-4.75 (or better)
Zach Brown 4.50
Bruce Irvin 4.50
Luke Kuechly 4.58
Demario Davis 4.61
Nigel Bradham 4.64
Lavonte David 4.65
Donta Hightower 4.68
James-Micheal Johnson 4.68
Tank Carder 4.69
Emmanual Acho 4.73

Bench Pressed 25 upwards...(there abouts)
Demario Davis 33 Reps
Luke Kuechley 27 Reps
Emmanual Acho 24 Reps
Nigel Bradham 24 Reps
Bruce Irvin 23 Reps
James-Michael Johnson 23 Reps

And then performed a Vertical Jump of 28" or higher..
Demario Davis 38.5"
Luke Kuechly 38"
Nigel Bradham 37"
James-Michael Johnson 37"
Emmanual Acho 35.5"
Bruce Irvin 33.5"
Donta Hightower 32"

Ran a Shuttle drill between 4.2 & 4.5 seconds..
Bruce Irvin 4.03
Luke Kuechly 4.12
Demario Davis 4.28
Nigel Bradham 4.37
James-Michael Johnson 4.37
(Acho, Hightower did not run this drill)

And a 3 Cone drill no higher than 7 seconds..
Bruce Irvin 6.70
Luke Kuechly 6.92
(Again, neither Acho or Hightower ran this drill)

So according to the stats, only 2 players fit every catagory, and one of those guys should be gone by the time the Steelers draft. Interesting that the Steelers interviewed Bruce Irvin at the Combine- his stats sure indicate he could be a powerful force at OLB in a 3-4.

Hightower & Acho did not complete all the drills, but were passing the tests reasonably well at that stage.

Add to this- MANY of the prospects are 'nearly' in the range, or miss on 1 drill. Guys like Demario Davis, Nigel Bradham, Tank Carder & James-Michael Johnson are certainly, by the numbers, better prospects than Bruce Davis, Mike Humpal & even Stephenson Sylvester are/were.

Lavonte David & Zach Brown did not show enough strength to be Steelers LB's, in Chadman's opinion.

SS Laser
03-01-2012, 02:56 AM
On come on Chadman you forgot a undrafted LB named Patrick Bailey! Who is still in the NFL. :stirpot He is 6-4 235 had a 40 of 4.79 with no other stats. But I am just busting your chops! :Beer

Nice Job once again. :Bow

Chadman
03-01-2012, 11:51 AM
On come on Chadman you forgot a undrafted LB named Patrick Bailey! Who is still in the NFL. :stirpot He is 6-4 235 had a 40 of 4.79 with no other stats. But I am just busting your chops! :Beer

Nice Job once again. :Bow

:lol:

Yeah, but he wasn't DRAFTED by the Steelers...

LB's are now completed.

Steel Life
03-02-2012, 12:28 AM
Chad...where would Bobby Wagner fit in your profile? Or even Miles Burris as an ILB convert? And even though he doesn't fit from a height aspect, I'd like to get your opinion on Mychal Kendricks...the kid is a beast.

Chadman
03-02-2012, 08:46 PM
So far, the Steelers have been reported to be in contact with:

Steelers are scheduled to talk to Alabama ILB Dant'a Hightower
Steelers have spoken to Pitt OG Lucas Nix
Steelers have spoken to Cincinnatti RB Isiah Pead
Steelers have interviewed WVU OLB Bruce Irvin
Steelers interviewed Michigan NT Mike Martin at the Combine
Steelers attended Cincinnatti Pro Day- RB Isiah Pead DE Derek Wolfe


Chadman will update this regularly.

Chadman
03-02-2012, 09:07 PM
Chad...where would Bobby Wagner fit in your profile? Or even Miles Burris as an ILB convert? And even though he doesn't fit from a height aspect, I'd like to get your opinion on Mychal Kendricks...the kid is a beast.

Steel Life- Bobby Wagner didn't attend the Combine, so we can't match his measurables...yet. Once he's had his Pro Day, we an revise him.

Miles Burris only completed a few drills- at 6'2" 246lbs, he fits the size requirements. He also did 31 Reps on the Bench which is good. 37.5" Vertical certainly puts him in the frame as well. Unfortunately we can't compare his speed drills as he didn't complete this. Again, after his Pro Day, we might get a better idea. If he can prove to be fast enough- he definately fits the rest of the requirements.

Mychal Kendricks did, however, complete all the drills. The only knock on him is size- 5'11" is not good. His weight is fine- 240lbs is perfect, but his height really puts him out of the Steeler ratios. His every other measurable however, is good. 4.47 40 Yard, 24 Reps, 39.5" Vertical, 127" Broad jump, 4.19 20 Yard Shuttle...all good.

If the Steelers can look past his height, Kendricks certainly ticks a lot of boxes. For Chadman, however- Burris looks the best fit of those guys.

Chadman
03-03-2012, 01:51 AM
So far, the Steelers have been reported to be in contact with:

Steelers are scheduled to talk to Alabama ILB Dant'a Hightower
Steelers have spoken to Pitt OG Lucas Nix
Steelers have spoken to Cincinnatti RB Isiah Pead
Steelers have interviewed WVU OLB Bruce Irvin
Steelers interviewed Michigan NT Mike Martin at the Combine
Steelers attended Cincinnatti Pro Day- RB Isiah Pead DE Derek Wolfe
Steelers worked out/attended Miami Ohio OG Brandon Brooks

Chadman will update this regularly.

Chadman
03-03-2012, 06:18 AM
Off topic slightly...but if Peyton Hilis can't find the FA deal he's looking for, he'd be a great RB for a team like Pittsburgh...

Chadman
03-03-2012, 09:40 AM
Let's ramp this up a bit before we get to FA..

Defensive Backs.

Would you believe, under the Tomlin-Colbert regime, the Steelers have only ever drafted 1 safety? It's true- Ryan Mundy. This will make analysing Safeties a little difficult, so Chadman will add in Troy Polamalu's stats, as well as a couple of other Safeties we've seen in Pittsburgh in that time just to get a clearer picture on what the Steelers look for, athletically.

SAFETIES-
2008
Ryan Mundy
6'1 215lbs
4.55 40 Yard
21 Reps
36" Vertical
10'10" Broad
4.33 20 Yard Shuttle
6.81 3-Cone

Troy Polamalu
5'10" 206lbs
4.35 40 Yard
29 Reps
43" Vertical
4.06 20 Yard Shuttle
6.75 3-Cone

Will Allen
6'1" 202lbs
4.58 40 Yard
36" Vertical
4.25 20 Yard Shuttle
7.06 3-Cone

Damon Cromartie-Smith
6'2" 206lbs
4.56 40 Yard
20 Reps
32" Vertical
9'09" Broad
4.47 20 Yard Shuttle
7.24 3-Cone

Obviously Troy was a workout freak, and it's unfair to include his numbers when looking for some kind of pattern. What we can work out from Mundy, Allen & Cromartie-Smith is that, normally, the Steelers look for-
Height/Weight- Around 6' to 6'2" and about 200lbs
40 Yard- 4.5 seems about right.
Bench- 20 Reps seems about right.
Vertical- Mid 30" area seems the likely target
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.3 to 4.5 looks the target range
3-Cone- It seems the Steelers will look as high as 7.2, but Mundy/Polamalu are well under 7.2. We'll say 7 as the cut-off.

Those that pass the criteria are:
Harrison Smith 6'2" 213lbs
4.57 40 Yard
19 Reps
34" Vertical
4.12 20 Yard
6.63 3-Cone

Sean Richardson 6'2" 216lbs
4.52 40 Yard
22 Reps
38.5" Vertical
4.44 20 Yard
7.01 3-Cone

As is the case with many positions- there are a nuber of prospects that 'nearly' fit the statistics. Add to this, the #1 Safety- Mark Barron, did not complete any drills at the combine. Other names that got close- Christian Thompson, Delano Howell, Duke Ihenacho & Trent Robinson.

Chadman
03-04-2012, 10:55 AM
We'll come back to do the CB's soon, but for now- let's look at a "Position of Need" for the Steelers- NT.

As Chadman stated earlier, there isn't a lot of Combine info to work on as the last drafted NT for the Steelers was Chris Hoke- who just retired. Casey Hampton obviously has been around a long time now. The only other guy to work with is undrafted 2nd year guy- Steve McLendon. We'll do what we can...

Casey Hampton
6'1" 314lbs
40 Yard- 5.25
Bench- 34 Reps


Steve McLendon
6'2" 306lbs
40 Yard- 5.15
Bench- 31 Reps
Vertical- 29.5"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.45
3-Cone- 7.35

Chris Hoke
6'2" 305lbs


Chadman would love to tell you more about the Pro Day/ Combine numbers of Casey & Hokey, but they just don't seem to exist.

So, we work with what we've got.

Obviously, height we can judge. 6'1" or 6'2" seems ideal. Probably very good for leverage reasons. What is interesting is that none of these guys were 'massive' coming out of college. Hoke never really did bulk up. Obviously Casey has, and Chadman believes McLendon is still around the 300lbs area. (Official site has him at 280lbs- there is no way he's 280lbs!)

What this tells us is that the Steelers are not locked in to the 330lb monsters at NT. Functional strength (Casey 34 reps, McLendon 31 reps) seem more important.

We'll also use McLendon's 30" vertical as a guide to 'explosiveness' and if applicable, the 3-cone of 7.35 as the minimum requirement to determine short area quickness.

The Combine Candidates- Height & Weight (6'1" to 6'3" 300lbs-340lbs)
Jerel Worthy 6'2" 308lbs
Brandon Thompson 6'2" 314lbs
Mike Martin 6'1" 306lbs
Alameda Ta'amu 6'3" 348lbs
Marcus Forston 6'1" 301lbs
Hebron Fangupo 6'1" 323lbs

Bench Press of 30+
Hebron Fangupo 36 reps
Mike Martin 36 reps
Marcus Forston 35 reps
Alameda Ta'amu 35 reps
Brandon Thompson 35 reps
Jerel Worthy DNP

Vertical of 30"+
Mike Martin 33.5"
Hebron Fangupo 31.5"
Brandon Thompson 31"
Jerel Worthy 28.5"
Marcus Forston 28"
Alameda Ta'amu 26"

3-Cone of 7.35 or lower
Mike Martin 7.19
Jerel Worthy 7.60
Marcus Forston 7.64
Hebron Fangupo 7.94
Brandon Thompson 7.97
Alameda Ta'amu DNP

The results are pretty clear- Michigan's NT Mike Martin is, statistically, the best fit for the Steelers. To add to this, the Steelers HAVE interviewed him at the Combine. He's as much an athletic freak as you'll see at NT. Most likely, he'd be a similar type of player to Hoke, rather than Hampton. But he could add 10lbs & be a more traditional run plugger.

The other 2 names to keep on the radar are Hebron Fangupo & Brandon Thompson. Both pass a number of the criteria, but fail in the short area quickness. If the Steelers are looking for just a 2-down run plugger, both of these guys might be suitable. Keep in mind- the Steelers have not been afraid to draft from BYU in the past- Hoke & Keisel are good examples of that. Fangupo also brings versatility as he has played NT & DE at BYU.

SS Laser
03-04-2012, 03:28 PM
We'll come back to do the CB's soon, but for now- let's look at a "Position of Need" for the Steelers- NT.

As Chadman stated earlier, there isn't a lot of Combine info to work on as the last drafted NT for the Steelers was Chris Hoke- who just retired. Casey Hampton obviously has been around a long time now. The only other guy to work with is undrafted 2nd year guy- Steve McLendon. We'll do what we can...

Casey Hampton
6'1" 314lbs
40 Yard- 5.25
Bench- 34 Reps


Steve McLendon
6'2" 306lbs
40 Yard- 5.15
Bench- 31 Reps
Vertical- 29.5"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.45
3-Cone- 7.35

Chris Hoke
6'2" 305lbs


Chadman would love to tell you more about the Pro Day/ Combine numbers of Casey & Hokey, but they just don't seem to exist.

So, we work with what we've got.

Obviously, height we can judge. 6'1" or 6'2" seems ideal. Probably very good for leverage reasons. What is interesting is that none of these guys were 'massive' coming out of college. Hoke never really did bulk up. Obviously Casey has, and Chadman believes McLendon is still around the 300lbs area. (Official site has him at 280lbs- there is no way he's 280lbs!)

What this tells us is that the Steelers are not locked in to the 330lb monsters at NT. Functional strength (Casey 34 reps, McLendon 31 reps) seem more important.

We'll also use McLendon's 30" vertical as a guide to 'explosiveness' and if applicable, the 3-cone of 7.35 as the minimum requirement to determine short area quickness.

The Combine Candidates- Height & Weight (6'1" to 6'3" 300lbs-340lbs)
Jerel Worthy 6'2" 308lbs
Brandon Thompson 6'2" 314lbs
Mike Martin 6'1" 306lbs
Alameda Ta'amu 6'3" 348lbs
Marcus Forston 6'1" 301lbs
Hebron Fangupo 6'1" 323lbs

Bench Press of 30+
Hebron Fangupo 36 reps
Mike Martin 36 reps
Marcus Forston 35 reps
Alameda Ta'amu 35 reps
Brandon Thompson 35 reps
Jerel Worthy DNP

Vertical of 30"+
Mike Martin 33.5"
Hebron Fangupo 31.5"
Brandon Thompson 31"
Jerel Worthy 28.5"
Marcus Forston 28"
Alameda Ta'amu 26"

3-Cone of 7.35 or lower
Mike Martin 7.19
Jerel Worthy 7.60
Marcus Forston 7.64
Hebron Fangupo 7.94
Brandon Thompson 7.97
Alameda Ta'amu DNP

The results are pretty clear- Michigan's NT Mike Martin is, statistically, the best fit for the Steelers. To add to this, the Steelers HAVE interviewed him at the Combine. He's as much an athletic freak as you'll see at NT. Most likely, he'd be a similar type of player to Hoke, rather than Hampton. But he could add 10lbs & be a more traditional run plugger.

The other 2 names to keep on the radar are Hebron Fangupo & Brandon Thompson. Both pass a number of the criteria, but fail in the short area quickness. If the Steelers are looking for just a 2-down run plugger, both of these guys might be suitable. Keep in mind- the Steelers have not been afraid to draft from BYU in the past- Hoke & Keisel are good examples of that. Fangupo also brings versatility as he has played NT & DE at BYU.

I am being to wonder if Hood has grown into more of a NT for the steelers? And would DE be a eariler pick then we all think.

3. Ziggy Hood- 2009 1st Round pick
6'3" 300lb
40 Yard- 4.83
Bench- 34 Reps (4th at Combine)
Vertical- 33" (12th at Combine)
Broad- 9'00"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.55
3 Cone- 7.50

Chadman
03-04-2012, 05:22 PM
We'll come back to do the CB's soon, but for now- let's look at a "Position of Need" for the Steelers- NT.

As Chadman stated earlier, there isn't a lot of Combine info to work on as the last drafted NT for the Steelers was Chris Hoke- who just retired. Casey Hampton obviously has been around a long time now. The only other guy to work with is undrafted 2nd year guy- Steve McLendon. We'll do what we can...

Casey Hampton
6'1" 314lbs
40 Yard- 5.25
Bench- 34 Reps


Steve McLendon
6'2" 306lbs
40 Yard- 5.15
Bench- 31 Reps
Vertical- 29.5"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.45
3-Cone- 7.35

Chris Hoke
6'2" 305lbs


Chadman would love to tell you more about the Pro Day/ Combine numbers of Casey & Hokey, but they just don't seem to exist.

So, we work with what we've got.

Obviously, height we can judge. 6'1" or 6'2" seems ideal. Probably very good for leverage reasons. What is interesting is that none of these guys were 'massive' coming out of college. Hoke never really did bulk up. Obviously Casey has, and Chadman believes McLendon is still around the 300lbs area. (Official site has him at 280lbs- there is no way he's 280lbs!)

What this tells us is that the Steelers are not locked in to the 330lb monsters at NT. Functional strength (Casey 34 reps, McLendon 31 reps) seem more important.

We'll also use McLendon's 30" vertical as a guide to 'explosiveness' and if applicable, the 3-cone of 7.35 as the minimum requirement to determine short area quickness.

The Combine Candidates- Height & Weight (6'1" to 6'3" 300lbs-340lbs)
Jerel Worthy 6'2" 308lbs
Brandon Thompson 6'2" 314lbs
Mike Martin 6'1" 306lbs
Alameda Ta'amu 6'3" 348lbs
Marcus Forston 6'1" 301lbs
Hebron Fangupo 6'1" 323lbs

Bench Press of 30+
Hebron Fangupo 36 reps
Mike Martin 36 reps
Marcus Forston 35 reps
Alameda Ta'amu 35 reps
Brandon Thompson 35 reps
Jerel Worthy DNP

Vertical of 30"+
Mike Martin 33.5"
Hebron Fangupo 31.5"
Brandon Thompson 31"
Jerel Worthy 28.5"
Marcus Forston 28"
Alameda Ta'amu 26"

3-Cone of 7.35 or lower
Mike Martin 7.19
Jerel Worthy 7.60
Marcus Forston 7.64
Hebron Fangupo 7.94
Brandon Thompson 7.97
Alameda Ta'amu DNP

The results are pretty clear- Michigan's NT Mike Martin is, statistically, the best fit for the Steelers. To add to this, the Steelers HAVE interviewed him at the Combine. He's as much an athletic freak as you'll see at NT. Most likely, he'd be a similar type of player to Hoke, rather than Hampton. But he could add 10lbs & be a more traditional run plugger.

The other 2 names to keep on the radar are Hebron Fangupo & Brandon Thompson. Both pass a number of the criteria, but fail in the short area quickness. If the Steelers are looking for just a 2-down run plugger, both of these guys might be suitable. Keep in mind- the Steelers have not been afraid to draft from BYU in the past- Hoke & Keisel are good examples of that. Fangupo also brings versatility as he has played NT & DE at BYU.

I am being to wonder if Hood has grown into more of a NT for the steelers? And would DE be a eariler pick then we all think.

3. Ziggy Hood- 2009 1st Round pick
6'3" 300lb
40 Yard- 4.83
Bench- 34 Reps (4th at Combine)
Vertical- 33" (12th at Combine)
Broad- 9'00"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.55
3 Cone- 7.50

Excellent point. And there's quite a nice group of 3-4 DE's available....

RuthlessBurgher
03-05-2012, 04:30 PM
Mychal Kendricks did, however, complete all the drills. The only knock on him is size- 5'11" is not good. His weight is fine- 240lbs is perfect, but his height really puts him out of the Steeler ratios. His every other measurable however, is good. 4.47 40 Yard, 24 Reps, 39.5" Vertical, 127" Broad jump, 4.19 20 Yard Shuttle...all good.

This guy's listed as being 6'0" 242 lbs. But I'd bet he's closer to the 5'11" side than the 6'1" side.

http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/multimedia/photo_gallery/1107/james.harrison.rare.pics/images/james-harrison-lbs.jpg

I'm not overly worried about a linebacker's height. Gary Brackett of the Colts has been an effective inside backer at 5'11". Back in the day, Sam Mills was 5'9" and he made the Pro Bowl 5 times.

Oviedo
03-05-2012, 04:41 PM
We'll come back to do the CB's soon, but for now- let's look at a "Position of Need" for the Steelers- NT.

As Chadman stated earlier, there isn't a lot of Combine info to work on as the last drafted NT for the Steelers was Chris Hoke- who just retired. Casey Hampton obviously has been around a long time now. The only other guy to work with is undrafted 2nd year guy- Steve McLendon. We'll do what we can...

Casey Hampton
6'1" 314lbs
40 Yard- 5.25
Bench- 34 Reps


Steve McLendon
6'2" 306lbs
40 Yard- 5.15
Bench- 31 Reps
Vertical- 29.5"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.45
3-Cone- 7.35

Chris Hoke
6'2" 305lbs


Chadman would love to tell you more about the Pro Day/ Combine numbers of Casey & Hokey, but they just don't seem to exist.

So, we work with what we've got.

Obviously, height we can judge. 6'1" or 6'2" seems ideal. Probably very good for leverage reasons. What is interesting is that none of these guys were 'massive' coming out of college. Hoke never really did bulk up. Obviously Casey has, and Chadman believes McLendon is still around the 300lbs area. (Official site has him at 280lbs- there is no way he's 280lbs!)

What this tells us is that the Steelers are not locked in to the 330lb monsters at NT. Functional strength (Casey 34 reps, McLendon 31 reps) seem more important.

We'll also use McLendon's 30" vertical as a guide to 'explosiveness' and if applicable, the 3-cone of 7.35 as the minimum requirement to determine short area quickness.

The Combine Candidates- Height & Weight (6'1" to 6'3" 300lbs-340lbs)
Jerel Worthy 6'2" 308lbs
Brandon Thompson 6'2" 314lbs
Mike Martin 6'1" 306lbs
Alameda Ta'amu 6'3" 348lbs
Marcus Forston 6'1" 301lbs
Hebron Fangupo 6'1" 323lbs

Bench Press of 30+
Hebron Fangupo 36 reps
Mike Martin 36 reps
Marcus Forston 35 reps
Alameda Ta'amu 35 reps
Brandon Thompson 35 reps
Jerel Worthy DNP

Vertical of 30"+
Mike Martin 33.5"
Hebron Fangupo 31.5"
Brandon Thompson 31"
Jerel Worthy 28.5"
Marcus Forston 28"
Alameda Ta'amu 26"

3-Cone of 7.35 or lower
Mike Martin 7.19
Jerel Worthy 7.60
Marcus Forston 7.64
Hebron Fangupo 7.94
Brandon Thompson 7.97
Alameda Ta'amu DNP

The results are pretty clear- Michigan's NT Mike Martin is, statistically, the best fit for the Steelers. To add to this, the Steelers HAVE interviewed him at the Combine. He's as much an athletic freak as you'll see at NT. Most likely, he'd be a similar type of player to Hoke, rather than Hampton. But he could add 10lbs & be a more traditional run plugger.

The other 2 names to keep on the radar are Hebron Fangupo & Brandon Thompson. Both pass a number of the criteria, but fail in the short area quickness. If the Steelers are looking for just a 2-down run plugger, both of these guys might be suitable. Keep in mind- the Steelers have not been afraid to draft from BYU in the past- Hoke & Keisel are good examples of that. Fangupo also brings versatility as he has played NT & DE at BYU.


I'd prefer we get more of a penetrating, attacking NT than the Hampton style of "blocker occupier." Need to get away from the 2-down run stopper. The pass will beat us not the run.

SS Laser
03-05-2012, 04:58 PM
We'll come back to do the CB's soon, but for now- let's look at a "Position of Need" for the Steelers- NT.

As Chadman stated earlier, there isn't a lot of Combine info to work on as the last drafted NT for the Steelers was Chris Hoke- who just retired. Casey Hampton obviously has been around a long time now. The only other guy to work with is undrafted 2nd year guy- Steve McLendon. We'll do what we can...

Casey Hampton
6'1" 314lbs
40 Yard- 5.25
Bench- 34 Reps


Steve McLendon
6'2" 306lbs
40 Yard- 5.15
Bench- 31 Reps
Vertical- 29.5"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.45
3-Cone- 7.35

Chris Hoke
6'2" 305lbs


Chadman would love to tell you more about the Pro Day/ Combine numbers of Casey & Hokey, but they just don't seem to exist.

So, we work with what we've got.

Obviously, height we can judge. 6'1" or 6'2" seems ideal. Probably very good for leverage reasons. What is interesting is that none of these guys were 'massive' coming out of college. Hoke never really did bulk up. Obviously Casey has, and Chadman believes McLendon is still around the 300lbs area. (Official site has him at 280lbs- there is no way he's 280lbs!)

What this tells us is that the Steelers are not locked in to the 330lb monsters at NT. Functional strength (Casey 34 reps, McLendon 31 reps) seem more important.

We'll also use McLendon's 30" vertical as a guide to 'explosiveness' and if applicable, the 3-cone of 7.35 as the minimum requirement to determine short area quickness.

The Combine Candidates- Height & Weight (6'1" to 6'3" 300lbs-340lbs)
Jerel Worthy 6'2" 308lbs
Brandon Thompson 6'2" 314lbs
Mike Martin 6'1" 306lbs
Alameda Ta'amu 6'3" 348lbs
Marcus Forston 6'1" 301lbs
Hebron Fangupo 6'1" 323lbs

Bench Press of 30+
Hebron Fangupo 36 reps
Mike Martin 36 reps
Marcus Forston 35 reps
Alameda Ta'amu 35 reps
Brandon Thompson 35 reps
Jerel Worthy DNP

Vertical of 30"+
Mike Martin 33.5"
Hebron Fangupo 31.5"
Brandon Thompson 31"
Jerel Worthy 28.5"
Marcus Forston 28"
Alameda Ta'amu 26"

3-Cone of 7.35 or lower
Mike Martin 7.19
Jerel Worthy 7.60
Marcus Forston 7.64
Hebron Fangupo 7.94
Brandon Thompson 7.97
Alameda Ta'amu DNP

The results are pretty clear- Michigan's NT Mike Martin is, statistically, the best fit for the Steelers. To add to this, the Steelers HAVE interviewed him at the Combine. He's as much an athletic freak as you'll see at NT. Most likely, he'd be a similar type of player to Hoke, rather than Hampton. But he could add 10lbs & be a more traditional run plugger.

The other 2 names to keep on the radar are Hebron Fangupo & Brandon Thompson. Both pass a number of the criteria, but fail in the short area quickness. If the Steelers are looking for just a 2-down run plugger, both of these guys might be suitable. Keep in mind- the Steelers have not been afraid to draft from BYU in the past- Hoke & Keisel are good examples of that. Fangupo also brings versatility as he has played NT & DE at BYU.


I'd prefer we get more of a penetrating, attacking NT than the Hampton style of "blocker occupier." Need to get away from the 2-down run stopper. The pass will beat us not the run.

I am not sure that will happen in this defense. I think they try to have both. A serious run stopper like Hampton and more of a rush guy in Hoke. But was Hoke really that guy?

What would you consider Hood at NT? I think Hood could be really good at NT with Heyward in his spot and Da Beard. But at that point we need Keisel's back up/replacement. Not sure if any of the DE's on the roster/pratice squad are the answer. We have not seen any time for them guys that I remember. And maybe another back up for NT incase McLendon is not the answer. He also might be more of a rush/pressure NT.

focosteeler
03-05-2012, 05:45 PM
We'll come back to do the CB's soon, but for now- let's look at a "Position of Need" for the Steelers- NT.

As Chadman stated earlier, there isn't a lot of Combine info to work on as the last drafted NT for the Steelers was Chris Hoke- who just retired. Casey Hampton obviously has been around a long time now. The only other guy to work with is undrafted 2nd year guy- Steve McLendon. We'll do what we can...

Casey Hampton
6'1" 314lbs
40 Yard- 5.25
Bench- 34 Reps


Steve McLendon
6'2" 306lbs
40 Yard- 5.15
Bench- 31 Reps
Vertical- 29.5"
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.45
3-Cone- 7.35

Chris Hoke
6'2" 305lbs


Chadman would love to tell you more about the Pro Day/ Combine numbers of Casey & Hokey, but they just don't seem to exist.

So, we work with what we've got.

Obviously, height we can judge. 6'1" or 6'2" seems ideal. Probably very good for leverage reasons. What is interesting is that none of these guys were 'massive' coming out of college. Hoke never really did bulk up. Obviously Casey has, and Chadman believes McLendon is still around the 300lbs area. (Official site has him at 280lbs- there is no way he's 280lbs!)

What this tells us is that the Steelers are not locked in to the 330lb monsters at NT. Functional strength (Casey 34 reps, McLendon 31 reps) seem more important.

We'll also use McLendon's 30" vertical as a guide to 'explosiveness' and if applicable, the 3-cone of 7.35 as the minimum requirement to determine short area quickness.

The Combine Candidates- Height & Weight (6'1" to 6'3" 300lbs-340lbs)
Jerel Worthy 6'2" 308lbs
Brandon Thompson 6'2" 314lbs
Mike Martin 6'1" 306lbs
Alameda Ta'amu 6'3" 348lbs
Marcus Forston 6'1" 301lbs
Hebron Fangupo 6'1" 323lbs

Bench Press of 30+
Hebron Fangupo 36 reps
Mike Martin 36 reps
Marcus Forston 35 reps
Alameda Ta'amu 35 reps
Brandon Thompson 35 reps
Jerel Worthy DNP

Vertical of 30"+
Mike Martin 33.5"
Hebron Fangupo 31.5"
Brandon Thompson 31"
Jerel Worthy 28.5"
Marcus Forston 28"
Alameda Ta'amu 26"

3-Cone of 7.35 or lower
Mike Martin 7.19
Jerel Worthy 7.60
Marcus Forston 7.64
Hebron Fangupo 7.94
Brandon Thompson 7.97
Alameda Ta'amu DNP

The results are pretty clear- Michigan's NT Mike Martin is, statistically, the best fit for the Steelers. To add to this, the Steelers HAVE interviewed him at the Combine. He's as much an athletic freak as you'll see at NT. Most likely, he'd be a similar type of player to Hoke, rather than Hampton. But he could add 10lbs & be a more traditional run plugger.

The other 2 names to keep on the radar are Hebron Fangupo & Brandon Thompson. Both pass a number of the criteria, but fail in the short area quickness. If the Steelers are looking for just a 2-down run plugger, both of these guys might be suitable. Keep in mind- the Steelers have not been afraid to draft from BYU in the past- Hoke & Keisel are good examples of that. Fangupo also brings versatility as he has played NT & DE at BYU.


I'd prefer we get more of a penetrating, attacking NT than the Hampton style of "blocker occupier." Need to get away from the 2-down run stopper. The pass will beat us not the run.

I am not sure that will happen in this defense. I think they try to have both. A serious run stopper like Hampton and more of a rush guy in Hoke. But was Hoke really that guy?

What would you consider Hood at NT? I think Hood could be really good at NT with Heyward in his spot and Da Beard. But at that point we need Keisel's back up/replacement. Not sure if any of the DE's on the roster/pratice squad are the answer. We have not seen any time for them guys that I remember. And maybe another back up for NT incase McLendon is not the answer. He also might be more of a rush/pressure NT.

Hood does fit the 'type' really well. I would like to see how he would do playing between Heyward and Keisel. I say start force feeding him protein bars and draft a guy late like Kheeston Randall for a back up.

SS Laser
03-05-2012, 06:00 PM
I am not sure you need to force feed Hood to much. If his is still listed at 300 I bet it is 10 or 20lbs higher, maybe more if he was told he wll play more NT this season. With his strength that is enough weight I think. Does our NT really need to be 350?

Also Mclendon looks bigger then 280 but not a big belly guy. I bet he is 300 or so now. But I agree grab another NT in this draft later on. See if he can be coached up grow into it.

Sorry to derail your thread Chadman! Waiting on the CB's.

steelz09
03-05-2012, 06:10 PM
Casey Hampton
6'1" 314lbs <---------------

Yeah, sure.. 314 lbs. lol. His playing weight these days have to be around 350-360 and that's likely on an empty stomach.

Chadman
03-05-2012, 06:45 PM
Casey Hampton
6'1" 314lbs <---------------

Yeah, sure.. 314 lbs. lol. His playing weight these days have to be around 350-360 and that's likely on an empty stomach.

Completely agree jhansle- but 314lbs was his listed weight when he was drafted. He added his weight after being drafted.

All the weights Chadman has listed have been at draft time, not current weight, to give an indication of what the Steelers were looking at, at that time.

Chadman
03-05-2012, 06:46 PM
Sorry to derail your thread Chadman! Waiting on the CB's.

Don't be sorry- this is good- discuss, debate...it's not just a thread for Chadman..

Chadman
03-05-2012, 06:48 PM
I'm not overly worried about a linebacker's height. Gary Brackett of the Colts has been an effective inside backer at 5'11". Back in the day, Sam Mills was 5'9" and he made the Pro Bowl 5 times.

Chadman agrees with you Ruthless- but for the purpose of "history", Chadman finds that the Steelers tend to shy away from guys under 6'1".

That said, Kendricks looks a player.

Chadman
03-05-2012, 06:50 PM
Hood does fit the 'type' really well. I would like to see how he would do playing between Heyward and Keisel. I say start force feeding him protein bars and draft a guy late like Kheeston Randall for a back up.

Not only that- Kheeston Randall hits on numerous levels as far as his physical make-up goes, as well as big college/ big production.

Hood is definately in the Steelers NT mold- just a question now of if the Steelers feel there are better options in the draft at NT.

Chadman
03-05-2012, 06:53 PM
I'd prefer we get more of a penetrating, attacking NT than the Hampton style of "blocker occupier." Need to get away from the 2-down run stopper. The pass will beat us not the run.

Could Hood be that guy O? If you watch tape of Mike Martin from Michigan, you also see a smaller, penetrating type NT. Martin is very strong, and a wrestling background would suggest he knows leverege.

Chadman
03-05-2012, 06:56 PM
What would you consider Hood at NT? I think Hood could be really good at NT with Heyward in his spot and Da Beard. But at that point we need Keisel's back up/replacement. Not sure if any of the DE's on the roster/pratice squad are the answer. We have not seen any time for them guys that I remember. And maybe another back up for NT incase McLendon is not the answer. He also might be more of a rush/pressure NT.

If Hood is pencilled in as the next NT, you'll likely see him splitting time between NT & DE, particularly as Hampton looks like being brought back this season. Chances are we'd see a high to mid round DE added this year, to learn the position, in preparation to become the #1 back-up when Hood shifts to NT/Heyward becomes the starter at DE. Then this year's pick would be expected to be the eventual replacement to Keisel..

focosteeler
03-05-2012, 07:01 PM
I am not sure you need to force feed Hood to much. If his is still listed at 300 I bet it is 10 or 20lbs higher, maybe more if he was told he wll play more NT this season. With his strength that is enough weight I think. Does our NT really need to be 350?

Also Mclendon looks bigger then 280 but not a big belly guy. I bet he is 300 or so now. But I agree grab another NT in this draft later on. See if he can be coached up grow into it.

Sorry to derail your thread Chadman! Waiting on the CB's.

oops :oops: I assumed he was like 280 or something. Thats me, not reading whats right in front of me saying he was 300lbs at the combine :HeadBanger

BTW Chadman.... :Bow the info in this thread is amazing

SS Laser
03-06-2012, 02:25 AM
This thread is by far and away the BEST draft thread EVER. Thanks Chadman! :Bow

Still waiting on the other big uglies! And CB's. Come on Chadman! :tt1

Chadman
03-06-2012, 05:26 AM
CB's next...soon... :D

Thank you for the praise guys- Chadman enjoys this sort of thread- just lots of stats to sift through & find the ones you want to work with.

Before it's all said & done, we'll look at draft trends under Tomlin/Colbert, draft trends in the first round, FA moves & then, in the end- Chadman will try to put together a mock draft using everything we find out in this thread. We're learning together- most of this stuff Chadman just finds out before typing- no real prior knowledge.

Anything you want to include, feel free- glad for extra information to be added.

Slapstick
03-06-2012, 09:53 AM
If the Steelers do slide Hood in the lineup at NT, where I think he would perform even better than at the 5-tech DE, then the idea of a 2-down thumper at ILB becomes less of a bad idea...In the last few years, Farrior played at a lot lighter weight at ILB than I ever thought he would, but with Casey at the nose, it made sense...

Chadman
03-06-2012, 09:57 AM
If the Steelers do slide Hood in the lineup at NT, where I think he would perform even better than at the 5-tech DE, then the idea of a 2-down thumper at ILB becomes less of a bad idea...In the last few years, Farrior played at a lot lighter weight at ILB than I ever thought he would, but with Casey at the nose, it made sense...

The other argument is if the Steelers adopt a more penetrating front 3, they could get more athletic pass defenders in behind them instead of having to blitz any of the front 7 all the time...

Slapstick
03-06-2012, 10:09 AM
The other argument is if the Steelers adopt a more penetrating front 3, they could get more athletic pass defenders in behind them instead of having to blitz any of the front 7 all the time...

But I'm not referring to blitzing...I'm referring to solidifying the interior run defense behind a more penetrating NT as opposed to a "roadblock" NT...

Sending a more penetrating NT after the QB might create pressure, but would leave the D more vulnerable to running plays and misdirection plays like draws...

Having an ILB smart enough to read and react properly and tough enough to fill the hole and/or make a sure tackle quickly would be an asset in that case...

Just saying...

Chadman
03-06-2012, 10:15 AM
The other argument is if the Steelers adopt a more penetrating front 3, they could get more athletic pass defenders in behind them instead of having to blitz any of the front 7 all the time...

But I'm not referring to blitzing...I'm referring to solidifying the interior run defense behind a more penetrating NT as opposed to a "roadblock" NT...

Sending a more penetrating NT after the QB might create pressure, but would leave the D more vulnerable to running plays and misdirection plays like draws...

Having an ILB smart enough to read and react properly and tough enough to fill the hole and/or make a sure tackle quickly would be an asset in that case...

Just saying...

Not disagreeing with you- it's a good theory.

Chadman
03-07-2012, 01:51 AM
Alright, alright...here we go- CB's:

Since the Colbert-Tomlin marriage started, the Steelers have drafted a number of CB's. Let's see if we can find a common thread throuhg the years...

2007
CB William Gay
5'10" 187lbs
40-Yard-4.48
Bench- 16 Reps
Vertical- 38.5"
Broad- 9'10"
3-Cone- 6.89
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.15

2009
CB Joe Burnett
5'10" 192lbs
40-Yard- 4.58
Bench- 22 Reps
Vertical- 35.5"
Broad- 9'10"
3-Cone- 6.68
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.25

CB Keenan Lewis
6'1" 195lbs
40-Yard- 4.47
Bench- 19 Reps
Vertical- 33.5"
Broad- 10'03"
3-Cone- 6.89
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.42

2010
CB Crezdon Butler
6'0" 191lbs
40-Yard- 4.43
Bench- 17 Reps
Vertical- 39.5"
Broad- 10'01"
3-Cone- 7.08
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.23

2011
CB Cortez Allen
6'1" 197lbs
40-Yard- 4.51
Bench- 18 Reps
Vertical- 35.5"
Broad- 10'09"
3-Cone- 6.76
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.01

CB Curtis Brown
6'0" 185lbs
40-Yard- 4.51
Bench- 10 reps
Vertical- 39.5"
Broad- 10'08"
3-Cone- 6.59
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.00


So...what can we work out? Well, firstly- size. The first 2 CB's on the list were 5'10". Every other CB since then has been at the 6'0" range. The trend is, the Steelers are looking more & more for the taller CB- not too tall, mind you. Let's say that 6'0" and 6'1" are ideal. We'll accept 5'11".

Weight- that 190lbs range appears about right. We'll give them 5lbs either way as variance.

Speed- Ok, surprisingly- speed doesn't appear to be a huge factor. The mid 4.4's seems about right- not slow, but certainly not blazing either. We'll discount Joe Burnett's 4.58. It would seem logical that the Steelers wouldn't turn their nose up from faster than 4.4- but it doesn't seem to be a deciding factor either.

Strength- Benching around the 20 mark seems about right- discounting Curtis Brown's paltry 10 reps.

Vertical- Here we see a measurement that seems important to the Steelers. 33.5" from Keenan Lewis is the lowest recorded for a Steeler draft pick- we'll use that as our cut-off as every other jump was higher (sometimes significantly).

Broad- It would seem around 10' looks like the target.

3-Cone- Another stat that seems important. Crezdon Butler's 7.+ was the anomoly. It would seem sub-7.0 is the target.

20 Yard- When Keenan Lewis' 4.42 is your highest mark, we'll be safe in assuming this is an important target for the Steelers. We'll speculate that the 4.3 mark is about the target range.

Chadman
03-07-2012, 02:46 AM
So, Jimmy Ideal- the perfect Steelers CB would look like this..

6'0" 190lbs
40-Yard- 4.45
Bench- 20 Reps
Vertical- 37"
Broad- 10'00"
3-Cone- 6.6
20 Yard- 4.1

We'll take variants either side, but only slight to limit just how many names Chadman has to put down..

CB's that pass the 40-Yard at the Combine:
Josh Robinson 4.33
Ron Brooks- 4.37
Stephon Gilmore- 4.40
Coty Sensabaugh- 4.42
Dwight Bentley- 4.43
Janoris Jenkins- 4.46
Jayron Hosely- 4.47
Asa Jackson- 4.49

CB's that pass the Bench (Target- Approx 15-20):
Omar Bolden 24 Reps
Jamell Fleming 23 Reps
Antonio Fenelus 20 Reps
Jeremy Jones- 20 Reps
Justin Bethel- 19 Reps
Casey Heyward- 19 Reps
Asa Jackson- 19 Reps
Trumaine Johnson- 19 Reps
Charles Brown- 18 Reps
Trevin Wade- 18 Reps
D'Anton Lynn- 17 Reps
Chaz Powell- 17 Reps
Josh Robinson- 17 Reps
Terrence Fredrick- 16 Reps
Stephon Gilmore- 15 Reps
Leonard Johnson- 15 Reps
Coty Sensabaugh- 15 Reps

Vertical Jump of 37" (Thereabouts)
Justin Bethel 39.5"
Josh Robinson 38.5"
Ron Brooks 38"
Alfonzo Dennard 37"
Coryell Judie 37"
Coty Sensabaugh 37"
Antwuan Reed 36.5"
Stephon Gilmore 36"
Mike Harris 36"
Cliff Harris 36"
Charles Brown 35.5"
Trumaine Johnson 35.5"
Terrence Frederick 35"

Broad Jump of 10'00" (120" or so)
Josh Robinson 133"
Justin Bethel 131"
Coryell Judie 126"
Jamell Fleming 125"
Josh Norman 124"
Antwuan Reed 124"
Stephon Gilmore 124"
Trumaine Johnson 122"
Coty Sensabaugh 122"
Alfonzo Dennard 121"
Terrence Frederick 121"
Janoris Jenkins 121"
Chaz Powell 121"
Ryan Steed 121"
Ron Brooks 120"
Leonard Johnson 120"
Dre Kirkpatrick 120"
Casey Heyward 119"
Asa Jackson 118"
Cliff Harris 118"
Morris Claiborne 118"
Mike Harris 117"

3-Cone Drill at around 6.6 seconds..(7 seconds cut-off)
Josh Robinson 6.55
Terrence Frederick 6.59
Coty Sensabaugh 6.60
Stephon Gilmore 6.61
Robert Blanton 6.71
Jamell Fleming 6.71
Casey Heyward 6.76
Justin Bethel 6.79
Cliff Harris 6.79
Antonio Fenelus 6.80
Mike Harris 6.81
Chaz Powell 6.84
Trevin Wade 6.87
Charles Brown 6.94
Ryan Steed 6.94
Janoris Jackson 6.95
Leonard Johnson 6.96
Asa Jackson 6.97
Dwight Bentley 6.99

20 Yard Shuttle at 4.1 Seconds (There abouts..)
Casey Heyward 3.90
Stephon Gilmore 3.94
Robert Blanton 3.97
Jamell Fleming 3.97
Josh Robinson 3.97
Trevin Wade 4.00
Terrence Frederick 4.03
Asa Jackson 4.03
Charles Brown 4.06
Coty Sensabaugh 4.06
Mike Harris 4.07
Morris Claiborne 4.12
Janoris Jackson 4.13
Trumaine Johnson 4.15
Leonard Johnson 4.15
Chaz Powell 4.16
Cliff Harris 4.19
Antonio Fenelus 4.2
Antwuan Reed 4.2
Ryan Steed 4.22

Shawn
03-07-2012, 09:28 AM
We are covered at NT in the 3-4??? :shock:

Hoke - Broken Neck (not really but jacked up neck to point he has to retire)
Snack - ACL & OLD
McLendon - Unproven
Hood - Unproven at NT

I think we need to draft a NT in the first 3...seems there are some quality prospects available this year.

Covered is a bad word. But, I would agree it's less of a need than ILB and OG.

Oviedo
03-07-2012, 09:46 AM
The other argument is if the Steelers adopt a more penetrating front 3, they could get more athletic pass defenders in behind them instead of having to blitz any of the front 7 all the time...

But I'm not referring to blitzing...I'm referring to solidifying the interior run defense behind a more penetrating NT as opposed to a "roadblock" NT...

Sending a more penetrating NT after the QB might create pressure, but would leave the D more vulnerable to running plays and misdirection plays like draws...

Having an ILB smart enough to read and react properly and tough enough to fill the hole and/or make a sure tackle quickly would be an asset in that case...

Just saying...


A penetrating DL is music to my ears but won't happen with the stubborn conductor of our defensive orchestra.

There is no down side to attacking and disrupting because it forces the opponents to react to you instead of you reacting to the opponent.

Slapstick
03-07-2012, 09:55 AM
But, it isn't...

While LeBeau preferred to have Hampton in the lineup, the defense did not miss a beat during Hoke's starts...and Hoke absolutely did not play NT the same way as Hampton...

If you give LeBeau Hood at NT, he will make it work...

Also, I never understood the idea of drafting unproven commodities because you feel that the players that you have on your roster, that you see in games every week, that coaches see in practice every day, are somehow unproven...

McClendon played in 7 games in 2010 and 14 games in 2011...before that, he spent a year on the practice squad...McClendon is proven...

However, if NT can possibly benefit from an upgrade at the position, that is a different story...and that is the gamble that is the draft...

Oviedo
03-07-2012, 10:32 AM
But, it isn't...

While LeBeau preferred to have Hampton in the lineup, the defense did not miss a beat during Hoke's starts...and Hoke absolutely did not play NT the same way as Hampton...

If you give LeBeau Hood at NT, he will make it work...

Also, I never understood the idea of drafting unproven commodities because you feel that the players that you have on your roster, that you see in games every week, that coaches see in practice every day, are somehow unproven...

McClendon played in 7 games in 2010 and 14 games in 2011...before that, he spent a year on the practice squad...McClendon is proven...

However, if NT can possibly benefit from an upgrade at the position, that is a different story...and that is the gamble that is the draft...


I agree about McLendon. I too think he is proven and I prefer his style of playing the NT over Hampton's "roadblock" style.

Chadman
03-07-2012, 10:47 AM
S the names highlighted in green on the CB lists are the guys that pased our "Steelers Ratio" at each position. Chadman has attached extended lists because so many players were 'just off'- so we are not excluding them completely, just pointing out they don't pass every criteria.

If we sift through the lists & use history as our guide- the following players may be of MOST interest to the Steelers:

Josh Robinson- Round 3
Central Florida
5'10" 195lbs (Willie Gay!)
40- 4.33
Bench- 17
Vertical- 38.5"
Broad- 133"
3-Cone- 6.55
20 Yard- 3.97

Stephon Gilmore- Round 2 (Maybe Round 1)
South Carolina
6'0" 190lbs (Ideal!!)
40- 4.40
Bench- 15
Vertical- 36"
Broad- 123"
3-Cone- 6.61
20 Yard- 3.94

Coty Sensabaugh- Round 6-7
Clemson
5'11" 189lbs
40- 4.42
Bench- 15
Vertical- 37"
Broad- 122"
3-Cone- 6.60
20 Yard- 4.06

Asa Jackson- Round 5-6
Cal-Poly
5'10" 191lbs
40- 4.49
Bench- 19
Vertical- 34.5"
Broad- 118"
3-Cone- 6.97
20 Yard- 4.03

Jamell Fleming- Round 3
Oklahoma
5'11" 206lbs
40- 4.53
Bench- 23
Vertical- 34"
Broad- 125"
3-Cone- 6.71
20 Yard- 3.97

Slapstick
03-07-2012, 11:44 AM
Now, which CBs are willing tacklers?

Because that's the "intangible" criteria that the Steelers CBs need...

Chadman
03-08-2012, 07:34 PM
7 Steeler coaches, including Mike Tomlin, are in attendance at the Miami Pro Day. Other coaches include- Haley, Colbert, Hunt, Butler, Kreidler & Montgomery.

Lamar Miller, Sean Spence, Brandon Washington, Marcus Forston, Tommy Streeter, Olivier Vernon, Chase Ford, Tyler Horn, Aldarius Johnson, Travis Benjamin, Jacory Harris, JoJo Nicholas, LaRon Byrd, Micanor Regis, Adewale Ojomo or Mike Williams- who were they there to see?

ikestops85
03-08-2012, 08:17 PM
7 Steeler coaches, including Mike Tomlin, are in attendance at the Miami Pro Day. Other coaches include- Haley, Colbert, Hunt, Butler, Kreidler & Montgomery.

Lamar Miller, Sean Spence, Brandon Washington, Marcus Forston, Tommy Streeter, Olivier Vernon, Chase Ford, Tyler Horn, Aldarius Johnson, Travis Benjamin, Jacory Harris, JoJo Nicholas, LaRon Byrd, Micanor Regis, Adewale Ojomo or Mike Williams- who were they there to see?

and only Colbert attended the Alabama pro day? Hmm, I guess they weren't very interested in a certain linebacker. :stirpot

RuthlessBurgher
03-08-2012, 08:38 PM
7 Steeler coaches, including Mike Tomlin, are in attendance at the Miami Pro Day. Other coaches include- Haley, Colbert, Hunt, Butler, Kreidler & Montgomery.

Lamar Miller, Sean Spence, Brandon Washington, Marcus Forston, Tommy Streeter, Olivier Vernon, Chase Ford, Tyler Horn, Aldarius Johnson, Travis Benjamin, Jacory Harris, JoJo Nicholas, LaRon Byrd, Micanor Regis, Adewale Ojomo or Mike Williams- who were they there to see?

Brandon Washington and Sean Spence could both be day 2 possibilities. Perhaps a later round flyer on Chase Ford as developmental TE prospect (not very much production, but has some tools you could work with).

Chadman
03-08-2012, 09:00 PM
Agree with Spence, but if they were there to see Washington- why no Coach Kugs?

Chadman's bet- Streeter & Spence with a dash of Forston...

Chadman
03-08-2012, 09:25 PM
So far, the Steelers have been reported to be in contact with:

Steelers are scheduled to talk to Alabama ILB Dant'a Hightower
Steelers have spoken to Pitt OG Lucas Nix
Steelers have spoken to Cincinnatti RB Isiah Pead
Steelers have interviewed WVU OLB Bruce Irvin
Steelers interviewed Michigan NT Mike Martin at the Combine
Steelers attended Cincinnatti Pro Day- RB Isiah Pead DE Derek Wolfe
Steelers worked out/attended Miami Ohio OG Brandon Brooks

Chadman will update this regularly.

A total of 18 teams were on hand Thursday to watch Mississippi State’s pro day, where the performance of DT Fletcher Cox likely cemented his status as a late first-round pick.

The defensive line coaches for the Steelers and Chiefs were on hand, as well as Packers director of college scouting John Dorsey, who usually shows up at a workout when there’s a prospect he’s interested in.

Cox, DT (6-3 3/4, 299) — Had a 26-inch vertical and a 9-foot broad jump. Looked good in the drills and showed a lot of quickness while moving very well. He’s now a lower first-round pick. He’s comparable to Memphis DT Dontari Poe but not quite as strong or fast.

Chadman
03-08-2012, 09:33 PM
Thirty teams were in attendance for the University of Alabama’s pro day on Wednesday, with 14 players working out out indoors. The Bears and the Rams were the only two teams not in Tuscaloosa, while the GMs from the Bills, Titans and Steelers all showed up.

Brad Smelley, TE (6-2, 237) — He’s a guy we need to add. Ran 4.77- and 4.76-second 40s; also had a 9-4 broad jump, 4.49 short shuttle, 7.15 cone drill and had 13 strength lifts. He didn’t do the vertical jump. He’ll be drafted by a team that runs a west-coast offense.

Can we PLEASE draft Smelley & have him line up next Willie Colon on a couple of series?

Chadman
03-09-2012, 10:36 AM
Moving forward, we'll now take a look at the Steelers OL draft choices under Tomlin/Colbert.

2007
OG Cameron Stephenson
6'3" 306lbs
40 Yard- 5.40
Bench- 34 (Tied 3rd at Combine)
Vertical- 28.5" (Equal 13th)
Broad- 8'05"
3-Cone- 7.72
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.81

2008
OT Tony Hills
6'5" 309lbs
40 Yard- 5.16
Bench- 24
Vertical- DNP
Broad- DNP
3-Cone- DNP
20 Yard Shuttle- DNP
(Hills was recovering from a significant lower leg injury & was limited in his workouts)

2009
OG Kraig Urbik
6'5" 328lbs
40 Yard- 5.37
Bench- 29 (Equal 14th)
Vertical- 24"
Broad- 7'10"
3-Cone- 7.87
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.89

OC A.Q. Shipley
6'1" 304lbs
40 Yard- 5.19
Bench- 33 (Equal 4th)
Vertical- 31" (Equal 6th)
Broad- 8'04"
3-Cone- 7.46 (Equal 4th)
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.40 (Equal 2nd)

(Although not drafted by the Steelers- he's on our roster)
OT Jamon Meredith
6'5" 304lbs
40 Yard- 4.99 (2nd)
Bench- 31 (Equal 8th)
Vertical- 28"
Broad- 8'09" (Equal 10th)
3-Cone- 8.01
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.82

2010-
OC Maurkice Pouncey
6'5" 304lbs
40 Yard- 5.25
Bench- 25
Vertical- 27"
Broad- 7'11"
3-Cone- 7.74
20 Yard Shuttle- 4.92

OG Chris Scott
6'5" 319lbs
40 Yard- 5.52
Bench- 19
Vertical- 22.5"
Broad- 7'06"
3-Cone- 8.24
20 Yard Shuttle- 5.03

2011
OT Marcus Gilbert
6'6" 330lbs
40 Yard- 5.41
Bench- 30 (Equal 6th)
Vertical- 30.5" (Equal 8th)
Broad- 8'02"
3-Cone- DNP
20 Yard Shuttle- 5.02

OG Keith Williams
6'4" 314lbs
40 Yard- 5.28
Bench- 23
Vertical- 24.5"
Broad- 7'09"
3-Cone- 8.42
20 Yard Shuttle- 5.03

Chadman
03-09-2012, 11:15 AM
After going over the stats/results- Chadman has realised that nearly every OL player at the Combine passes the majority of the Steelers-results. Naming all the players that fit may actually end up more confusing. For arguments sake, we'll assume that 6'3" to 6'5" is the ideal height range. 310lbs upwards is the ideal weight range. And a Bench press result above 27 is ideal, but NOT a deal breaker.

RuthlessBurgher
03-09-2012, 11:18 AM
Agree with Spence, but if they were there to see Washington- why no Coach Kugs?

Chadman's bet- Streeter & Spence with a dash of Forston...

Spence only putting up 225 lbs. a dozen times is a red flag, though. The only players with less reps than Spence were a few corners and wideouts (there were actually more than 50 corners and wideouts who lifted more than Spence). As much as it tells you about his strength (or lack thereof), it also indirectly can unearth a possible work ethic issue (this is the most important job interview of your life, you should have been preparing for it for months, and all you can do is lift the bar 12 times? Seriously?). I wonder the same thing about mammoth OT Mike Adams only putting up the bar 19 times as well. The strength coaches at Miami and Ohio State likely did massive facepalms when they saw those Combine lifting performances.

Chadman
03-09-2012, 11:53 AM
Changing our direction slightly- let's look at some Steeler "Draft Trends" in relation to college divisions, and the rounds that we see the Steelers under Colbert/Tomlin choose players from these divisions.

Starting from the obvious position-

ROUND 1
2007- ACC Florida State
2008- BIG 10 Illinois
2009- BIG 12 Missouri
2010- SEC Florida
2011- BIG 10 Ohio State

ROUND 2-
2007- BIG 10 Michigan
2008- BIG 12 Texas
2009- No Pick
2010- ACC Virginia Tech
2011- SEC Florida

ROUND 3-
2007- BIG 10 Minnesota
2008- PAC 12 UCLA
2009- BIG 10 Wisconsin
- SEC Mississippi
- PAC 12 Oregon State
2010- CONFERENCE USA Southern Methodist
2011- BIG 12 Texas

ROUND 4-
2007- BIG 12 Baylor
- BIG 12 Oklahoma State
2008- BIG 12 Texas
2009- No Selection
2010- BIG 10 Ohio State
2011- SOUTHERN Citadel

ROUND 5-
2007- BIG EAST Rutgers
- BIG EAST Louiseville
2008- PAC 12 Oregon
2009- CONFERENCE USA Central Florida
- MOUNTAIN WEST UNLV
2010- SEC Tennessee
- ACC Clemson
- PAC 12 Utah
2011- WAC Fresno State

ROUND 6
2007- No Selection
2008- BIG TEN Iowa
- BIG EAST West Virginia
2009- PAC 12 Oregon
2010- ACC Georgia Tech
- MID AMERICAN Central Michigan
2011- BIG 10 Nebraska

ROUND 7
2007- SEC Florida
2008- No Selection
2009- BIG TEN Penn State
- SUN BELT Arkansas State
2010- BIG 10 Ohio State
2011- BIG 12 Texas Tech

Chadman
03-10-2012, 12:59 AM
We can instantly see that 4 divisions dominate the Steelers draft choices- in particular the first 2 rounds of the draft- Big 10, Big 12, SEC & ACC.

In fact, 10 of the 41 Tomlin/Colbert draft picks are from the Big 10. 7 are from the Big 12. That's nearly 50% of Tomlin/Colbert's draft choices coming from 2 divisions. Coincidence?

Chadman
03-10-2012, 01:04 AM
PAC 12 has added 5 players to the roster, 5 from the SEC & 4 from the ACC. That's 31 of 41 picks out of 5 divisions.

Not surprisingly- only 1 player under Tomlin/Colbert comes outside of Division 1-A. That was Cortez Allen last season out of Citidel.

SS Laser
03-11-2012, 02:16 AM
Very interesting Chadman. Nice work!:Bow

Also got to thinking about the OL. Maybe some posters here are very correct that the steelers can't pick OL. Why does so many match up. Or do the steelers not put much stock in numbers for the OL? Is it just about the tape for OL? There has been more coach turnover for OL then other positons since Cowher. Last 2 picks have been better.

Chadman
03-11-2012, 08:15 PM
Very interesting Chadman. Nice work!:Bow

Also got to thinking about the OL. Maybe some posters here are very correct that the steelers can't pick OL. Why does so many match up. Or do the steelers not put much stock in numbers for the OL? Is it just about the tape for OL? There has been more coach turnover for OL then other positons since Cowher. Last 2 picks have been better.

Honestly- there could be multiple reasons. Not putting enough value in the position is a strong possibility- possibly a good reason why the "good 2" OL picks- Pouncey & Gilbert- were 1st & 2nd rounders. Thing is- the NFL is littered with OL guys that were picked outside of those rounds- so the Steelers SHOULD, theoretically- have hit on at least 1 lower round OL guy.

Another reason why we might not have seen the position as 'valued' is that Tomlin inherited a few long-term starters- Max Starks, Willie Colon & Chris Kemoeatu. While their relative merits are questioned often- they have been constants on an unstable position. Chadman believes the theory in OL development is LT first, Center 2nd, RT third, LG fourth & RG fifth as far as 'importance' goes. Well, Starks & Colon were targets 1 & 3. Kemo had #4 down. And Tomlin's first FA signing was Sean Mahan- even thouhg he was terrible, you can see that Tomlin tried to fix #2 immediately. Then when that didn't work out- Justin Hartwig was brought in. So it's not like Tomlin/Colbert have not tried to solve the issue- it's just that the players they've used have not been up to the level required. Pouncey was an immediate upgrade. He was also a highly touted college player. Gilbert fit in nicely & looks a better version of Max Starks at this point. Ideally, Chadman would like to see Gilbert continue at RT in the future. Colon's injuries could not be forcast- and despite many people's dislike of Colon, he's a steady player. He could very well be a guy playing out of position too- although Chadman would not assume LG would suit either- most likely RG. Kemo has progressively gotten worse each year to the point where he was replaced by every OL on the roster it seemed. While it was obvious he was regressing, the Steelers had invested a fair bit of money in him & might have been obliged to let him play it out until he became untenable in his position.

The Steelers have also gotten decent service out of Legursky & Foster- 2 undrafted guys that have overachieved. While we may all wish for better- they are servicable at the least. If they were both competing for 1 spot- RG- chances are most of the OL woes would diminish considerably. But because we are having them man both starting spots, we see the Steelers playing marginally talented guys on either side of the line.

Trai Essex & Jonathon Scott have been disappointments- although Chadman feels a little sorry for Scott as he always seem to be thrust into the starting line-up when he has to face Terrell Suggs- who simply owns him. Both, however, could be easily replaced.

Do the Steelers need to draft early round OL? Theoretically- no. However it seems that they have trouble scouting talent for the OL, so perhaps it's safer to just pick the more highly touted guys. It seems the Steelers will feel that they have Center, LT & RT sorted- positions 1, 2 & 3. Chadman disagrees however & thinks that the Steelers have #2, #3 & #5 positions as a 'strength' (Really- if Pouncey, Colon, Gilbert were the right side, we'd look pretty good), but lack positions #1 & #4.

Perhaps instead of an elite LG, the Steelers should look at an LT early & sign a mid to low range LG in FA? It might present them with a better overall OL than simply grabbing an elite LG & have him play alongside a marginal LT.

OR- re-sign Max Starks to play LT & draft your elite LG?

Lastly- the Steelers OL has been, by & large, a round peg trying to fit a square hole. When Tomlin came in, he switched the blocking from the "power blocking" under Cowher to the "Zone blocking" under Zeirlein. The players, however, stayed the same. So you had power blockers sudden;y being asked to be more agile. The Steelers started to move towards zone blockers, drafted Urbik, obtained Legursky & Foster...then sacked Zeirlein & inserted Kugler- who seems to be reverting back towards the more power blocking technique. It might suit the Steelers to just decide what they are trying to achieve- and insert players according to that scheme.

Chadman
03-11-2012, 11:28 PM
Now let's look at a few more Steelers-Tomlin/Colbert draft trends:

1. 1st round pick...2007- Def, 2008- Off, 2009- Def, 2010- Off, 2011- Def, 2012- ?

2. Early draft picks (Rounds 1 & 2) consist of the following positions- ILB, OLB, RB, WR, DE, OC, OLB, DE, OT. Only 2 picks out of 9 are for 'skill' positions. 2 picks for QB protection. 5 for pocket collapsing or QB rushing positions. Do Tomlin/Colbert value pass rushers & pocket collapsers higher?

3. 8 LB's have been drafted under Tomlin/Colbert. In 2009 the Steelers drafted 0 LB's. In 2010 the Steelers drafted 3 LB's to make up for missing a year.

4. 6 CB's have been drafted under Tomlin/Colbert. Curtis Brown was the highest CB selection at the 31st pick in the 3rd round.

5. 8 OL players have been selected. 2 OC's have been selected, 2 OT's & 4 OG's. Steelers weakest position? OG.

6. Steelers have selected a RB in every draft outside of Tomlin/Colbert's first in 2007.

Chadman
03-11-2012, 11:43 PM
Lawrence Timmons was drafted in 2007. He was a starter in 2009.

Rashard Mendenhall was drafted in 2008. He was a starter in 2010.

Ziggy Hood was drafted in 2009. He was a rotational starter in 2011.

Maurkice Pouncey was drafted in 2010. He started in 2010.

Cameron Heyward was drafted in 2011. He has not started as yet.

Outside of Pouncey, who came into a team that was so bereft of talent at Center at the time, it has taken each 1st round pick 2 years to assume the starters role. It is safe to assume that the Steelers do not draft for immediate need in the 1st round.

Ask yourself- which players on the Steelers roster will be looking to be replaced within 2 years? Hampton? Keisel? Ryan Clark? Polamalu? Miller? Ike Taylor?

NJ-STEELER
03-12-2012, 12:12 AM
there is still a bereft of talent at multiple OL positions

but wouldnt mind your mocked #1 pick. but would have to go OL in the 2nd

we have tons of talent at LB so no to hightower...

multiple high draft picks hopefully ready to make big contributions on the DL...

but in the secondary we only have troy (with ike being pretty decent). troy and clark are both getting up there in age. so we need a young play maker to get ready to step in soon

edit..and mendy would have split time if not taken over in his rookie year if he wasnt hurt

Chadman
03-12-2012, 01:02 AM
We'll switch our interests now to FA & a few players Chadman thinks might be worthy of consideration for the Steelers- knowing that Salary Cap space could be an issue..

With Max Starks gone, the Steelers currently have Marcus Gilbert pencilled in at LT with Jonathon Scott as the primary back-up. As you will see later in Chadman's next mock- drafting a LT isn't a bad option at some point in the upcoming draft. That said- it's unlikely a rookie would start. Gilbert, realistically, is a leap of faith solution to LT at this point. Signing an experienced, solid LT to start in 2012 is not a terrible idea. Chadman has a name that might be worth targetting- St Louis back-up LT Adam Goldberg. He's been a starter in the NFL, can slide inside to OG if a young OT can win/hold the LT job- and shouldn't be too expensive to sign. He's at the worst- an upgrade to Scott at this point. Another name of interest if the Steelers look to upgrade the OL in FA is former Pitt OG Mike McGlynn. He's similar in many respects to 2012 OG prospect Lucas Nix, but with perhaps a little more position flexibility. The Steelers can't spend a lot on FA's, so these low profile types are the most likely target range. McGlynn could, realistically, be viewed as a potential long-term solution at LG.

Moving to the other side of the ball, a potential NT option could be Bengal DT Pat Sims. At 6'2" 325lbs, he's the ideal size. He's already indicated he'll test the FA market, so there is a very real chance he'll land elsewhere than Bengal-land this offseason. If he were to be a potential signing, chances are the Steelers would be put in a position where they'd need to release Casey Hampton. Sims could be viewed as a long term NT option.

Another name that could be of use to the Steelers will be familiar to most- ILB Keyaron Fox. With Farrior moving on, and with Foote moving into the starting ILB role, there is an opening at the back-up ILB position. If the Steelers feel that Stevenson Sylvester is, indeed, the future ILB but needs time to develop, then Fox would be a great fill-in guy due to his knowledge of LeBeau's defense as well as his ST abilities.

Back on Offense- Todd Haley might like to get an upgrade at the 2nd TE position- and going with what he knows could snag him former Chief TE Leonard Pope. He's a big guy, and a good blocker- so a nice fit. Shouldn't cost that much either.

Lastly- depending on the amount of Salary Cap room available, and the expected return date of Mendenhall- what about signing Tim Hightower to split carries with Redman?

Chadman
03-12-2012, 01:24 AM
So, with a majority of the pre-FA/Draft analysis done, Chadman feels it is now time to provide a pre-FA Mock Draft. We'll have to come back in a couple of weeks to see how FA & Pro Day visits will change the mock- but it's always fun to throw these out there for consumption..

ROUND 1.

Using the Big School/Big Production theory- and sticking within the Steelers favoured Conferences for the selection, Chadman has narrowed down his selections. Size, strength etc have been calculated. Chadman notes that Steelers coaches, including Mike Tomlin & Kevin Colbert have decended, once more, on the Ohio State Pro Day. Ohio State is, of course, a BIG 10 school- fitting within the Steelers peramiters. Todd Haley has just joined the team, and as is often the way- the team will likely want to give him a shiny new toy to add to his collection. Besides- it's the Offenses turn in the 1st Round merry-go-round...In Round 1, the Steelers pick..

OT MIKE ADAMS OHIO STATE
6'6" 320lbs

418

The Steelers get themselves an enormous LT, who would be close to ready to start on Day 1, much the same as Maurkice Pouncey was, due to lack of real competition. This selection could move Marcus Gilbert to either RT or RG, depending on what the Steelers wish to do with Willie Colon.

Chadman
03-12-2012, 01:38 AM
Round 2 will see the Steelers sticking with the Big School/ Big Production line, and also sticking with Big 10/Big 12/ SEC/ ACC conferences....

FS MARKELLE MARTIN OKLAHOMA STATE
6'1" 207lbs

419

Knowing that the Steelers are always "looking ahead", Chadman predicts we see Ryan Clark's replacement added on Draft Day. there are very few better options than Martin in this draft.

Chadman
03-12-2012, 01:43 AM
Round 3 comes around & it's time to do what the Steelers always do- if in doubt, draft a LB..

ROUND 3

ILB NIGEL BRADHAM FLORIDA STATE
6'2" 240lbs

420

Those of you that have seen Bradham play know that he has a ferocity in his style that we'll come to love. Hard hitter, motivated, athletic. Very much a Tomlin "Run & Hit" guy.

Chadman suggests you watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVq1KvVZNwM to see what he means...

Chadman
03-12-2012, 01:54 AM
Moving on to Round 4, Chadman looks to add another weapon for Todd Haley & his Steelers Offense..


ROUND 4

WR TOMMY STREETER MIAMI
6'5" 219lbs

421

You think the Steelers passing game is dangerous now? Wait till this guy joins in..

Chadman
03-12-2012, 01:59 AM
Don't worry- Chadman hasn't forgotten the D-Line. Chadman gets the feeling Ed Bouchette may be on to something however- Ziggy Hood could very well move to NT in the future, allowing Cam Heyward to slide in as a starter. Brett Keisel can't go forever, however....

ROUND 5

DE DEREK WOLFE CINCINNATTI
6'5" 295lbs

422

He gets the time to learn the ropes, build his strength & move up the rotation chain while learning from one of the best in Deisel..

Chadman
03-12-2012, 02:13 AM
Round 6 finds us looking to give Todd Haley another weapon with which to TOTALLY DESTROY the rest of the NFL with. knowing his like of recieving RB's, Chadman adds...

ROUND 6

RB DEVIN MEGGETT MARYLAND
5'8" 211lbs


423

A multiple type threat for Haley to incorporate into the Steeler offense, replacing Mewelde Moore & giving a nice change of pace weapon to Redman until Mendy is fit to play.

Chadman
03-12-2012, 02:25 AM
Alas dear friends- we come to the final round. Again, Chadman will delve into the Offensive bags of tricks & give Todd Haley one last weapon with which to obtain NFL DOMINATION- a pass catching TE...

ROUND 7

TE BEAU RELIFORD FLORIDA
6'5" 256lbs

424

No doubt Haley could incorporate him into the Red Zone offense along with Streeter, giving the Steelers some significant firepower around the goalline...

Oviedo
03-12-2012, 08:09 AM
Great effort Chadman, but don't forget we already have a Devin Meggitt named Baron Batch. Kid had a whole year to get stronger and I expect he has a great camp and challenges as the third down back.

Chadman
03-12-2012, 10:01 AM
Thanks O.

Batch might be "that guy"- but he's unproven as yet. Can't hurt to have options incase it turns out he's not actually "that guy"..

Oviedo
03-12-2012, 11:26 AM
Thanks O.

Batch might be "that guy"- but he's unproven as yet. Can't hurt to have options incase it turns out he's not actually "that guy"..

I'm also not 100% sold on Adams. He was in the middle of the whole Pryor tatoo "scandal" and I had read he was once busted for drug paraphenalia. He's also been considered an underachiever by many.


Intangibles: Took time to understand the mental aspects of the college game, but took a big step forward as a junior. Suspended the first two games of the 2009 season for violating team rules, cited in January 2009 for misdemeanor possession of drug paraphernalia (charges were eventually dropped) after being stopped for running a stop sign. One of five players suspended for first five games of 2011 season for receiving benefits from a tattoo parlor owner, selling championship rings, jerseys and awards; Adams was required to pay back $1,000 for the ring he sold.


He may not make the character cut.

RuthlessBurgher
03-12-2012, 01:32 PM
I'm also not 100% sold on Adams. He was in the middle of the whole Pryor tatoo "scandal" and I had read he was once busted for drug paraphenalia. He's also been considered an underachiever by many.



He may not make the character cut.

Add this to the fact that this 6'7" 323 lbs. behemoth was only able to put up 225 lbs. 19 times at the combine, and that shows me that he's just not that hard of a worker. When cornerbacks who are nearly half your size are able to put up as many (or more) reps on the bench, that's an issue. The only LT prospect I would consider in round 1 would be if Stanford's Jonathan Martin were to fall within range of a reasonable trade-up.

Chadman
03-12-2012, 05:43 PM
The strength issue is probably more related to his arm length than anything else. He just completed 21 reps in front of Tomlin & Colbert at his Pro Day. That's in-keeping with a number of the other 1st round OT's from last year.

As for the charachter concerns- we're not talking a hardened criminal here. His "Drug paraphenalia" charge was dropped, and he was forced to pay back $1000 for selling his championship ring in return for ink-work. Not exactly beating up old ladies on a regular basis. The problem's at Ohio St don't stem from Mike Adams so much as it seems Adams got caught up in the problems stemming from Ohio St. It's easy for young men to make poor decisions when all those around them are following the same path. Does that make him guilt-free? No- but it's not like the Steelers have upheld the "High Character" mantra at all times- Marvel Smith, Santonio Holmes, Plaxico Burress...

As for the theory that Adams has underachieved, something must be amiss because we are talking about a guy that is pretty much a consensus 1st round pick. He must have done something to earn that projection.

NJ-STEELER
03-13-2012, 01:21 AM
not sure about adams, but like the rest of your mock

Chadman
03-13-2012, 01:28 AM
Thanks NJ.


What's your issue with Adams?

Would be interested to hear SKY's take on Adams too...

Chadman
03-13-2012, 01:43 AM
So we officially start to close in on FA.

Who would you guys like the Steelers to chase? How realistic is the chances of a signing or two?

Here's a link to help you with your "Who is a FA?" questions:
http://www.kffl.com/static/nfl/features/freeagents/fa.php?y=2012

Chadman will start with what he thinks might be realistic targets- NT Pat Sims, ILB Keyaron Fox, TE Leonard Pope, OG Mike McGlynn &...if the money is right...RB Tim Hightower.

Chadman believes they all offer good value for the role they'd be asked to play. Sims could feasably replace Hampton immediately, & then the Steelers could release Hampton & free up his salary. Fox knows LeBeau's system well & could fill the back-up ILB role until a younger player earns that role. McGlynn would have a great shot at unseating Legursky & Foster at OG, and likely not break the bank in the process. Pope is your large, blocking TE that is familiar with Haley's systems. And Hightower is the perfect RB for Todd Haley's offence.

Will the Steelers get all those guys- no. But that is who Chadman would be looking at.

You play GM for a bit...

Chadman
03-13-2012, 01:56 AM
If the Steelers were to lose Mike Wallace in FA, Chadman would suggest that the money 'saved' would be WELL spent on charger RB Mike Tolbert.

Losing Wallace would remove the effectiveness of the Steelers ariel attack, which would mean a greater reliance on the run game. Tolbert could carry the load for the Steelers & force the opposition to crowd the line of scrimmage- likely leaving Brown or Sanders in single coverage & giving them greater opportunity to get open, the way Wallace does for them now.

What do you think?

Chadman
03-13-2012, 02:03 AM
Steelers | Have spoken with Mike Wallace's agent (http://www.planetsteelers.com/forums/gnews.php?id=774578-steelers-have-spoken-with-mike-wallace's-agent)
Mon, 12 Mar 2012 15:56:52 -0700
The Pittsburgh Steelers (http://www.planetsteelers.com/team/30/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers) have spoken with the agent for restricted free-agent WR Mike Wallace (http://www.planetsteelers.com/player/20873/nfl/mike-wallace) about a long-term contract but no deal is close at this point.

Chadman
03-13-2012, 02:11 AM
The Pittsburgh Steelers (http://www.planetsteelers.com/team/30/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers) have tendered offers to restricted free-agent TE David Johnson (http://www.planetsteelers.com/player/20969/nfl/david-johnson), OGs Ramon Foster (http://www.planetsteelers.com/player/20995/nfl/ramon-foster) and Doug Legursky (http://www.planetsteelers.com/player/19326/nfl/doug-legursky), CB Keenan Lewis (http://www.planetsteelers.com/player/20841/nfl/keenan-lewis) and FS Ryan Mundy (http://www.planetsteelers.com/player/19577/nfl/ryan-mundy). The levels of the tenders were not disclosed.


The Minnesota Vikings (http://www.planetsteelers.com/team/23/nfl/minnesota-vikings) could show interest in Pittsburgh Steelers (http://www.planetsteelers.com/team/30/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers) impending free-agent CB William Gay (http://www.planetsteelers.com/player/16738/nfl/william-gay) because he would likely be in the team's price range and could help the team.

NJ-STEELER
03-13-2012, 03:14 AM
just things i've heard about him. he does have the measurables of being a franchise LT. and where we're picking at #24 you know there will be some questions with who ever we draft, sometimes you have to take a chance in order to get that type of talent. i wouldnt hate the pick. Glenn or the higher rated OLs would be my choice if they're available

PS. read that martin didnt work out at his pro day cause of a knee injury. if that keeps him from working out before the draft, he may drop

Slapstick
03-13-2012, 09:31 AM
Mike Adams would benefit from being placed in a good environment, I think...

If you put him in a locker room with these players and in meeting rooms with coaches like Tomlin and Kugler, and he would be fine...

Chadman
03-13-2012, 10:27 AM
Mike Adams would benefit from being placed in a good environment, I think...

If you put him in a locker room with these players and in meeting rooms with coaches like Tomlin and Kugler, and he would be fine...

Tend to agree with that. The Steelers team environment is diffent from that at Ohio St, etc.

And you can't manufacture Adams physical traits- the man is a monster, and talented enough to hold the LT position for years.

RuthlessBurgher
03-13-2012, 01:12 PM
just things i've heard about him. he does have the measurables of being a franchise LT. and where we're picking at #24 you know there will be some questions with who ever we draft, sometimes you have to take a chance in order to get that type of talent. i wouldnt hate the pick. Glenn or the higher rated OLs would be my choice if they're available

PS. read that martin didnt work out at his pro day cause of a knee injury. if that keeps him from working out before the draft, he may drop

I'd rather draft Jonathan Martin with a knee injury than a healthy Mike Adams. If Martin falls because he is unable to work out for teams prior to the draft, it could be a Heath-Miller-sports-hernia-like coup.

Chadman
03-13-2012, 07:25 PM
The Pittsburgh Steelers (http://www.planetsteelers.com/team/30/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers) interviewed Pittsburgh CB Buddy Jackson (http://www.planetsteelers.com/player/26373/nfl/buddy-jackson) Tuesday, March 13. Jackson ran a 4.26-second and 4.29 40-second dash at his Pro Day.

Chadman
03-13-2012, 07:31 PM
So far, the Steelers have been reported to be in contact with:

Steelers are scheduled to talk to Alabama ILB Dant'a Hightower
Steelers have spoken to Pitt OG Lucas Nix
Steelers have spoken to Cincinnatti RB Isiah Pead
Steelers have interviewed WVU OLB Bruce Irvin
Steelers interviewed Michigan NT Mike Martin at the Combine
Steelers attended Cincinnatti Pro Day- RB Isiah Pead DE Derek Wolfe
Steelers worked out/attended Miami Ohio OG Brandon Brooks
Steelers send 7 FO Personel, including Tomlin, Colbert & Haley to Miami Pro Day
Steelers DL Coach John Mitchell attends Mississippi Pro Day (Fletcher Cox)
Steelers GM Kevin Colbert attends Alabama Pro Day
Steelers HC Mike Tomlin & GM Kevin Colbert attend Ohio St Pro Day
Steelers interview Pitt CB Buddy Jackson
Chadman will update this regularly.

Chadman
03-14-2012, 01:21 AM
And now- a little more analysis to ponder..

By position, the Steelers under Tomlin/Colbert have drafted-

QB- 1
RB/FB- 4
WR- 5
TE- 2
OT- 2
OG- 4
OC- 2
DE- 5
DT- 0
LB- 8
CB- 6
S- 1
ST- 1

Chadman
03-14-2012, 01:23 AM
Of course, much of this would be dictated by the current roster & often the position the Steelers draft- which might directly effect how often they would draft, say, an OT. Interesting to note how many LB's, CB's, DE's & WR's are in the list.

Broken down by ROUND-
1ST ROUND- 1 LB, 1 RB, 2 DE, 1 OC
2ND ROUND- 2 LB's, 1 WR, 1 OT
3RD ROUND- 1 TE, 1 LB, 1 OG, 2 WR's, 2 CB
4TH ROUND- 1 ST, 1 DE, 1 OT, 1 LB, 1 CB
5TH ROUND- 2 OG's, 3 CB's, 1 QB, 1 FB, 2 LB's
6TH ROUND- 1 LB, 1 S, 1 DE, 1 RB, 1 WR, 1 OG
7TH ROUND- 1 WR, 1 OC, 1 TE, 1 DE, 1 RB

Chadman
03-14-2012, 01:54 AM
TEAM NEEDS.

There's 2 words we often debate every off season, yet we all come up with different variations of 'need'. So how do we work out the 'greater need' for the Steelers, and also figure out how they will attempt to fill that need?

Well, obviously you use Chadman's logic, and his 2012 Off Season Analysis thread to help you.

The Steelers under Mike Tomlin/Kevin Colbert have a history of looking for young, athletic players that have shown some level of production against good competition in the first round. They have a history of looking for Juniors. They rarely reach.

They also tend to select players that fill a need- not necessarily an immediate need- but certainly a need for the near future. If we assume that all the RFA players that recieved their tenders do not sign long term contracts (we can ammend this as time goes on), the following players become UFA's at the end of the 2012/13 season (i.e.- next offseason):
WR Mike Wallace
TE David Johnson
OG's Ramon Foster & Doug Legursky
RB's Isaac Redman & Rashard Mendenhall
CB Keenan Lewis
FS Ryan Mundy
OT Jonathon Scott
NT Casey Hampton
SS Will Allen
ILB Larry Foote
TE Heath Miller

The following players become RFA's
WR's Antonio Brown & Emmanual Sanders
RB Jonathon Dwyer
ILB Stevenson Sylvester

Chadman
03-14-2012, 02:13 AM
What we can see here is that "Future Need" will certainly apply to the following positions:

RB- Mendenhall, Redman & Dwyer will all be FA's of some description at the end of next season. This would leave Baron Batch & John Clay as the RB's under contract at that time. Either Redman will get an extended contract offer, or the Steelers will look at RB in the draft in order to not leave them short handed next season.

WR- Mike Wallace, Antonio Brown & Emmanual Sanders all hit FA next season (yes- 2 RFA's in there). Chadman is pretty sure 2, if not all 3, will get extended contracts.

TE- Both Heath Miller & David Johnson become UFA's next season. This will leave Wesleye Saunders as the only contracted TE.

OG- Both starting OG's become UFA's next season, and there are currently no OG's (outside of Malecki- who??) on the roster behind these 2.

FS/SS- Both back-up Safeties become FA's next season, while the 2 starters will be in their 30's.

NT- Depending on what the team does this season with Ziggy Hood- NT becomes a need. If Hood moves to NT, DE becomes a moderate need as well.

ILB- Farrior is gone now, Foote is a FA next year & Sylvester a RFA next season. This leaves the team very thin.


Conversly- QB, CB, OC, OT & OLB are low needs as they have long-term starters in place, as well as invested draft picks into the position recently. All is not as it seems though- as depth at QB & OT will be required (immediately perhaps) & a decision on the quality of the OLB depth might be needed soon in order to prepare for Harrison's eventual career end.

Chadman
03-14-2012, 02:31 AM
The Steelers signed a number of Future Contract FA's recently- can any of these have a future on the Steelers roster?

QB- Troy Smith & Jerrod Johnson

RB- Chad Spann

WR- Derrick Williams, Jimmy Young, Jaumorris Stewart, David Gilreath & Tyler Beiler

TE- Jamie McCoy

OT- Chris Scott, Trevis Turner

OG- John Malecki

DE- Corbin Bryant, Al Woods, Mike Blanc

DT- Steve McLendon, Kade Weston

LB- Brandon Hicks, Marshall McFadden

CB- Antonio Smith, Walter McFadden

S- Damon Cromartie-Smith, Myron Rolle

Interesting to note the number of WR's and DL the Steelers added this off season- an indication that the 4th/5th/6th WR/DE/NT type positions will go to low-priced players perhaps?

Crash
03-14-2012, 02:56 AM
Miller's contract expires after 2014.

Chadman
03-14-2012, 06:26 AM
Miller's contract expires after 2014.

That's odd- Rotoworld has him finishing after this season..

Chadman
03-14-2012, 10:37 PM
So far, the Steelers have been reported to be in contact with:

Steelers are scheduled to talk to Alabama ILB Dant'a Hightower
Steelers have spoken to Pitt OG Lucas Nix
Steelers have spoken to Cincinnatti RB Isiah Pead
Steelers have interviewed WVU OLB Bruce Irvin
Steelers interviewed Michigan NT Mike Martin at the Combine
Steelers attended Cincinnatti Pro Day- RB Isiah Pead DE Derek Wolfe
Steelers worked out/attended Miami Ohio OG Brandon Brooks
Steelers send 7 FO Personel, including Tomlin, Colbert & Haley to Miami Pro Day
Steelers DL Coach John Mitchell attends Mississippi Pro Day (Fletcher Cox)
Steelers GM Kevin Colbert attends Alabama Pro Day
Steelers HC Mike Tomlin & GM Kevin Colbert attend Ohio St Pro Day
Steelers interview Pitt CB Buddy Jackson.
Steelers HC Mike Tomlin dines with Michigan St QB Kirk Cousins
Steelers HC Mike Tomlin & GM Kevin Colbert pay attention to Michigan St FS Trent Robinson
Steelers HC Mike Tomlin & GM Kevin Colbert seen chatting extensively with Michigan St DT Jerel Worthy


Chadman will update this regularly.

Chadman
03-16-2012, 02:17 AM
QB- Troy Smith & Jerrod Johnson

RB- Chad Spann

WR- Derrick Williams, Jimmy Young, Jaumorris Stewart, David Gilreath & Tyler Beiler

TE- Jamie McCoy

OT- Chris Scott, Trevis Turner

OG- John Malecki

DE- Corbin Bryant, Al Woods, Mike Blanc

DT- Steve McLendon, Kade Weston

LB- Brandon Hicks, Marshall McFadden

CB- Antonio Smith, Walter McFadden

S- Damon Cromartie-Smith, Myron Rolle

Given the Steelers financial situation, signing experienced FA's to fill back-up spots on the roster could be difficult. This is where some of these guys above COULD very well figure as back-ups, depth or role players for the upcoming season.

Some interesting scenarios could play out-

QB- With both Batch & Leftwich unsigned, and Dixon most certainly not coming back, Troy Smith &/or Jerrod Johnson have a shot at making the roster- both at Cap friendly prices. Kevin Colbert has said he wants Leftwich & Batch back, however economics may play a role in which of the 2 can return. Troy Smith is an interesting proposition- is he good enough to be the back-up QB? Is he too old to be the developmental QB? Johnson is quite impressive, physically- in fact, similar to Ben in some respects. He certainly is a candidate for 3rd QB/ Developmental player, but not the Back-up QB. Steelers tend to go into TC with 4 QB's on the roster. Batch may not get re-signed, leaving Leftwich to battle Smith for the back-up role, and Johnson trying to press his case to stick as the 3rd QB.

Chadman
03-16-2012, 02:27 AM
WR Derrick Williams has a genuine chance of making the roster as the 5th WR & punt returner. He was a highly thouhgt of draft choice- selected in the 3rd round. Kind of a possession WR type. With Ward gone & Cotchery not signed- could Williams find a position in the rotation?

TE McCoy has a strong chance of at the worst, pushing for the 3rd TE position.

There is very little depth along the OL at this point, so both Chris Scott & Trevis Turner have a shot at pushing to make the roster. If the Steelers choose OL early in the draft though- both might find the active roster out of their reach.

On the DL, Al Woods & Corbin Bryant are pretty good young players- certainly capable of sticking around in a Nick Eason type role. NT Kade Weston is interesting- big guy playing a definate position of need. However, the draft may offer up a player early in his position putting him in a bad position to continue as a Steelers. A candidate for the PS though. McLendon is pretty much a lock to make the roster at this point.

All 4 DB's- Smith, McFadden, Cromartie-Smith & Rolle have some chance of staying. It will depend largely on how the draft plays out, but with Willie Gay an UFA, there is an opening at CB for Smith & McFadden. Steelers drafted 2 CB's last season & may be reluctant to draft another this season. With Taylor, Lewis, Allen & Brown locked in, there is still room for a 5th CB. Drafting a Safety will be another decider for these young players. If the Steelers do draft a Safety- it would be unlikely that Rolle & Cromartie-Smith would surplant either the drafted rookie or Ryan Mundy. If no Safety is drafted, however- both of these young guys offer some interesting skills.

NJ-STEELER
03-17-2012, 09:10 AM
i liked what i saw out of bryant. and the FO has brought back woods a 2nd time so they must like what they see out of him

Chadman
03-18-2012, 06:30 PM
Now we'll have a look at some draft trends across the NFL in Round 1 in the Tomlin Era- that is, the last 5 years.

Let's start with the top spot- QB

QB's
2011- 4 selected- #1, #8, #10. #12
2010- 2 selected- #1, #25
2009- 3 selected- #1, #5, #17
2008- 2 selected- #3, #18
2007- 2 selected- #1, #22

13 QB's selected in 5 years gives us an average of between 2-3 QB's per year. What this indicates is that, on average, 2 will definately be selected, with the possibility of a 3rd sneaking in- likely toward the end of the Round. No surprises- QB has been the #1 pick 4 out of 5 years, and will be again.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 06:36 PM
Next we'll look at the RB position..

RB's
2011- 1 selected- #28
2010- 3 selected- #9, #12, #30
2009- 3 selected- #12, #27, #31
2008- 5 selected- #4, #13, #22, #23, #24
2007- 2 selected- #7, #12

14 RB's selected in Round 1 in the last 5 years puts them slightly higher than QB- but still in the 2-3 a year range. Closer to 3 really. This indicates that as we get toward the tail end of the draft, teams might look at the 3rd best RB over other positions. Only 3 RB's have been selected Top 10- an indication that RB's no longer hold the 'Premium Position' ranking it may have once held.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 06:43 PM
WR is the next position on the list..

WR
2011- 3 selected- #4, #6, #26
2010- 2 selected- #22, #24
2009- 6 selected- #7, #10, #19, #22, #29, #30
2008- 0 selected
2007- 6 selected- #2, #9, #23, #27, #30, #32

17 WR's selected in 5 years puts the position in the 3-4 per year range. Obviously, 2 big years have skewed the rankings a little, but this in itself might lead to other trends (some will be shown later). One that we might see right here is, if it's considered a 'good' year for WR, teams will be happy to selected the 5th or even 6th best talent at the position in the 1st Round. Also, 6 out of 16 picks are Top 10- an indication that WR holds a good rank as far as position importance goes on Draft day.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 09:28 PM
TE's are next on the list..

TE's
2011- 0 selected
2010- 1 selected- #21
2009- 1 selected- #20
2008- 1 selected- #30
2007- 1 selected- #31

Only 4 TE's in 5 years selected in the 1st Round- at an average, obviously, of less than 1 per year. This will likely hold close to true this year as Fleener is the only TE considered a possible 1st Round pick- and as history shows, a late pick at that.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 09:56 PM
Next we'll take a look at everyone's favourite position- Center. After all, who hasn't, at some point, asked "Can he play Center?"

Center's
2011- 0 selected
2010- 1 selected- #18
2009- 2 selected- #21, #28
2008- 0 selected
2007- 0 selected

Only 3 OC's in 5 years- less than TE's. Obviously, less than 1 per year is the average. This is strange, as it is commonly believed that after LT, then OC is the 'next most important position' on the OL.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 10:30 PM
Moving to the side of Center, we now look at the other big hogs- OG's..

OG's
2011- 2 selected- #15, #23
2010- 1 selected- #17
2009- 0 selected
2008- 1 selected- #15
2007- 1 selected- #29

5 OG's in 5 years gives us a nice, neat 1 per year average. More OG's are selected than OC's in Round 1 which is mildly surprising on face value, but there are, of course, double the amount of OG's on the field at any one time. Such a low average number of selections at OG does tend to lend weight to the "OG's are not Round 1 ability players" argument, but it doesn't completely write OG off the Round 1 board. Simply put- the BEST OG player will generally be a Round 1 pick. The 2nd best is generally a 2nd Round pick.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 10:43 PM
We'll now look at the book-ends, the OT's..

OT's
2011- 6 selected- #9, #17, #22, #25, #29, #32
2010- 4 selected- #4, #6, #11, #23
2009- 4 selected- #2, #6, #8, #23
2008- 7 selected- #1, #12, #14, #17, #19, #21, #26
2007- 3 selected- #3, #5, #28

24 OT's selected in 5 years at a healthy average of just under 5 each season. 9 of the 24 were Top 10 picks & 15 of the 24 were Top 20 picks. Only twice has the #3 selected OT been outside the Top 20 in 5 years. This is, obviously, an extremely highly valued position & one that generally sees the 4th, 5th or even 6th best player in the position selected within the Top 32 picks.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 11:01 PM
Now we'll switch over to the Defense, and in particular, the DE position. Chadman will show players selected that were ranked as DE's as they entered the draft- we won't be seperating 4-3 DE's from 3-4 OLB's in other words.

DE's
2011- 6 selected- #7, #11, #14, #20, #24, #31
2010- 3 selected- #10, #15, #16
2009- 3 selected- #3, #11, #18
2008- 4 selected- #2, #6, #8, #28
2007- 5 selected- #4, #8, #13, #17, #26

21 DE's selected in 5 years at an average of just over 4 per year. Of the 4 selected per year, the 3rd best DE is generally off the board by Pick 20. So, not only is this a position that is selected often, it's also selected high. 16 of 21 picks have been Top 20- that's quite a strike rate. It also shows that the NFL values pass rushers/pocket collapsers very highly.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 11:09 PM
Continuing with our Defensive Line selections, we turn our eyes inside toward the DT's. This will not seperate NT's from 4-3 DT's, or even 3-4 DE's- it's simply looking at players that were considered DT's as they entered the Draft.

DT's
2011- 5 selected- #3, #13, #18, #21, #30
2010- 4 selected- #2, #3, #26, #28
2009- 3 selected- #9, #24, #32
2008- 3 selected- #5, #7, #29
2007- 2 selected- #10, #16

17 selected in 5 years at an average of 3-4 DT's per year. 10 of the 17 were Top 20 selections. Another position that obviously holds a lot of importance as far as NFL teams see things in Round 1.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 11:15 PM
Moving on we now turn our eyes to the more athlteic players of the Defense's Front 7- the LB's. For the purpose of this thread, we'll combine ILB's & OLB's as they can be interchangable in many systems.

LB's
2011- 2 selected- #2, #16
2010- 4 selected- #8, #13, #19, #31
2009- 5 selected- #4, #13, #15, #16, #26
2008- 2 selected- #9, #10
2007- 3 selected- #11, #15, #25

16 selected, which puts LB in line with DT at 3-4 per year (closer to 3). Interestingly- 13 of the 16 are Top 20 picks- that makes for a lot of DE's, DT's & LB's being selected Top 20 every year.

Chadman
03-18-2012, 11:27 PM
Lastly, we turn our eyes to the DB's. Again, we won't seperate CB's from Safeties as some CB's can play FS in different systems.

DB's
2011- 3 selected- #5, #19, #27
2010- 7 selected- #5, #7, #14, #20, #27, #29, #32
2009- 2 selected- #14, #25
2008- 6 selected- #11, #16, #20, #25, #27, #31
2007- 7 selected- #6, #14, #18, #19, #20, #21, #24

25 DB's selected in 5 years has them sitting at the average of 5 per year. While only 4 of the 25 were Top 10 picks, 12 of the 25 are Top 20 picks- pretty much half. Interestingly, in 2007 6 WR's were selected in Round 1. In 2008, 6 DB's were selected in Round 1. In 2009 6 WR's were selected in Round 1. In 2010, 7 DB's were selected in Round 1. Reactionary? Well, in 2008, 0 WR's were selected in Round 1. In 2009 only 2 DB's were selected. 2010, only 2 WR's selected. 2011, 3 DB's..2011- 3 WR's.....2012- DB's?? Chadman might predict slightly lower than average- perhaps 4 DB's?

Chadman
03-18-2012, 11:34 PM
Now, let's not kid ourselves- some of you are now asking "what was the point of that?". Well, let's see...now we can use history to identify a rough estimate of what positions should be selected in Round 1- we'll shoot on the low side of each average-
2 QB's
2 RB's
3 WR's
0 TE's
0 OC's
1 OG
5 OT's
4 DE's
3 DT's
3 LB's
5 DB's

That's 28 of the 32 picks, position-wise, that should be selected on average. The "half" selections will fill the other 4 picks in....

Chadman's History Related Round 1 mock....

insanesteelersfan
03-18-2012, 11:51 PM
Mike Adams would be the worst player we could ever select in round 1, with the exception of Vontaze Burfict. He is slow, weak, and gives up on too many plays. I wouldn't touch this clown in the 3rd round. Let alone the 1st. Same with Martin in round 2...way too high. And there are better safeties further down the draft who can be better.

Chadman
03-19-2012, 12:48 AM
We'll now look at the players that fill our "Historic" needs..(that is- the top rated prospects in each position & +1 more than is historically chosen, in order to fill the missing 4 picks)

QB's (3)- Andrew Luck, Robert Griffin III, Ryan Tannehill
RB's (3)- Trent Richardson, David Wilson, Doug Martin/ Lamar Miller
WR's (4)- Justin Blackmon, Michael Floyd, Kendall Wright, Rueben Randle/Stephen Hill/Alshon Jeffery
TE's (1)- Coby Fleener
OC's (1)- Peter Konz
OG's (2)- David DeCastro, Cordy Glenn
OT's (5)- Matt Kalil, Riley Reiff, Jonathon Martin, Mike Adams, Zebrie Sanders
DE's (5)- Quinton Coples, Melvin Ingram, Whitney Mercilus, Nick Perry, Andre Branch
DT's (5)- Dontari Poe, Fletcher Cox, Michael Brockers, Devon Still, Jerel Worthy
LB's (4)- Dont'e Hightower, Luke Keuchly, Courtney Upshaw, Zach Brown
DB's (5)- Morris Claiborne, Dre Kirkpatrick, Stephon Gilmore, Janoris Jenkins, Mark Barron

That gives us 38 players to fit into 32 positions...

Chadman
03-19-2012, 12:51 AM
Mike Adams would be the worst player we could ever select in round 1, with the exception of Vontaze Burfict. He is slow, weak, and gives up on too many plays. I wouldn't touch this clown in the 3rd round. Let alone the 1st. Same with Martin in round 2...way too high. And there are better safeties further down the draft who can be better.

Yeah- but what do you REALLY think of Chadman's mock?

:D

Chadman
03-19-2012, 01:29 AM
Next step is to list each team's "Draft Needs". Chadman will name 3 positions for each team, except for Indianapolis & Washington..

1. Indianapolis- QB
2. Washington- QB
3. Minnesota- LT/CB/WR
4. Cleveland- QB/WR/OT
5. Tampa Bay- CB/LB/OT
6. St Louis- OT/WR/DT
7. Jacksonville- WR/CB/DE
8. Miami- QB/WR/OT
9. Carolina- DT/CB/OG
10. Buffalo- DE/WR/OT
11. Kansas City- NT/OG/OC
12. Seattle- DE/OG/LB
13. Arizona- OT/WR/LB
14. Dallas- DT/OC/OG
15. Philadelphia- LB/CB/SS
16. New York Jets- OT/LB/S
17. Cincinnati- RB/OG/WR/DE
18. San Diego- OT/OG/CB
19. Chicago- OT/CB/OG
20. Tennessee- OC/DE/OG
21. Cincinnati- RB/OG/WR/DE
22. Cleveland- QB/WR/OT
23. Detroit- CB/SS/OC
24. Pittsburgh- DT/OG/LB
25. Denver- DT/CB/OT
26. Houston- WR/DE/OC
27. New England- LB/DE/S
28. Green Bay- LB/DE/OC
29. Baltimore- LB/OG/S
30. San Fransico- OT/DE/TE
31. New England- LB/DE/S
32. New York Giants- OG/LB/RB

Chadman
03-19-2012, 02:04 AM
So now, using HISTORY as a guide, here's is Chadman's 2012 NFL Mock 1st Round!! (Bells, whistles, girls in short skirts etc)

1. Colts- QB Andrew Luck
2. Redskins- QB Robert Griffin III
3. Vikings- OT Matt Kalil
4. Browns- WR Justin Blackmon
5. Buccaneers- CB Morris Claiborne
6. Rams- OT Reilly Reiff
7. Jaguars- DE Quinton Coples
8. Dolphins- QB Ryan Tannehill
9. Panthers- DT Dontari Poe
10. Bills- DE Whitney Mercilus
11. Chiefs- OG David DeCastro
12. Seahawks- OLB Melvin Ingram
13. Cardinals- WR Michael Floyd
14. Cowboys- DT Michael Brockers
15. Eagles- LB Luke Kuechley
16. Jets- OT Jonathon Martin
17. Bengals- RB Trent Richardson
18. Chargers- CB Dre Kirkpatrick
19. Bears- CB Stephon Gilmore
20. Titans- DE Whitney Mercilus
21. Bengals- OG Cordy Glenn
22. Browns- WR Kendall Wright
23. Lions- CB Janoris Jenkins
24. Steelers- DT Fletcher Cox
25. Broncos- DT Devon Still
26. Texans- WR Reuben Randle
27. Patriots- LB Courtney Upshaw
28. Packers- DE Nick Perry
29. Ravens- LB Dant'a Hightower
30. 49ers- TE Coby Fleener
31. Patriots- SS Mark Barron
32. Giants- RB David Wilson

Chadman
03-19-2012, 02:09 AM
With this mock we get:
3 QB's (1 above average)
2 RB's (average)
4 WR's (average)
1 TE (1 above average)
0 OC (average)
2 OG's (1 above average)
3 OT's (2 below average)
4 DE's (average)
4 DT's (average)
4 LB's (average)
5 DB's (average)

RuthlessBurgher
03-19-2012, 01:40 PM
So now, using HISTORY as a guide, here's is Chadman's 2012 NFL Mock 1st Round!! (Bells, whistles, girls in short skirts etc)

1. Colts- QB Andrew Luck
2. Redskins- QB Robert Griffin III
3. Vikings- OT Matt Kalil
4. Browns- WR Justin Blackmon
5. Buccaneers- CB Morris Claiborne
6. Rams- OT Reilly Reiff
7. Jaguars- DE Quinton Coples
8. Dolphins- QB Ryan Tannehill
9. Panthers- DT Dontari Poe
10. Bills- DE Whitney Mercilus
11. Chiefs- OG David DeCastro
12. Seahawks- OLB Melvin Ingram
13. Cardinals- WR Michael Floyd
14. Cowboys- DT Michael Brockers
15. Eagles- LB Luke Kuechley
16. Jets- OT Jonathon Martin
17. Bengals- RB Trent Richardson
18. Chargers- CB Dre Kirkpatrick
19. Bears- CB Stephon Gilmore
20. Titans- DE Whitney Mercilus
21. Bengals- OG Cordy Glenn
22. Browns- WR Kendall Wright
23. Lions- CB Janoris Jenkins
24. Steelers- DT Fletcher Cox
25. Broncos- DT Devon Still
26. Texans- WR Reuben Randle
27. Patriots- LB Courtney Upshaw
28. Packers- DE Nick Perry
29. Ravens- LB Dant'a Hightower
30. 49ers- TE Coby Fleener
31. Patriots- SS Mark Barron
32. Giants- RB David Wilson

Whitney Mercilus rules!!! He can tell his friends that he is a top 10 pick AND a top 20 pick as well. The Niners should consider him at #30 as well. :p

Chadman
03-19-2012, 05:28 PM
Whitney Mercilus rules!!! He can tell his friends that he is a top 10 pick AND a top 20 pick as well. The Niners should consider him at #30 as well. :p

That's what you get for rushing things....

Chadman
03-19-2012, 05:29 PM
Actually, if Chadman puts Whitney Marcilus down for every team in the 1st round, he's bound to get at least one right.


So long as he's a 1st rounder that is.

Chadman
03-19-2012, 08:04 PM
Reports are now saying the Steelers have signed former West Virginia TE/Fullback Will Johnson & also former Steeler WR Wes Lyons. Both could push for reserve roles for next season.

Lyons is obviously well known for being 6'9". He also seemed to have a solid Camp last season.

Johnson could feasably contest the 3rd TE/ H-Back/ Fullback spot that David Johnson currently holds.

Chadman
03-20-2012, 12:38 AM
Now we'll turn our sights to some of the potential Steeler draft targets- after all, wouldn't it be good to know the guy before he gets here?

We'll start with one of the board favourites, some dude from Georgia..

CORDY GLENN
6'5" 345lbs
OFFENSIVE GUARD
GEORGIA (SEC)

435

02/25/2012 - Georgia's Cordy Glenn weighed in as one of the largest offensive line prospects at the Combine, tipping the scale at 345 pounds. And after his 40-yard dash, he might also be considered one of the most athletic. Glenn ran an unofficial 4.96 in his first 40-yard dash attempt Saturday morning, including a 1.76 yard 10-yard split. Glenn is expected to participate in every drill this week, already lifting 31 times on the bench, an impressive feat for a player with 36" arms. He played most of his collegiate career inside at guard before moving out to left tackle as a senior in 2011. Scouts question whether or not he can protect the blindside at the next level, but Glenn helped answer some of those concerns with a positive week at the Senior Bowl. If he performs well athletically in drills this week, showing NFL scouts he can play outside in the NFL, Glenn's draft stock could jump into the top-20 discussion. Glenn currently ranks as NFLDraftScout.com's No. 2 rated guard



A standout wherever the Georgia Bulldogs needed him, Cordy Glenn enters the NFL having started 49 games at left guard (28), right guard (four) and left tackle (17). Scouts aren't only impressed with his versatility, they're left in awe at the athleticism demonstrated by the 6-5, 338 pound mountain of a man.
Glenn was a highly touted prep prospect who stepped into the starting lineup early after redshirting in 2007. While appearing in 13 games, he started ten times; seven games at left guard and three games on the right side. Glenn's ability to play multiple positions was tested even more in 2009 as injuries to teammates forced the Bulldogs to move Glenn from right guard in the season-opener against Oklahoma State to left tackle for four games and back to left guard for the final eight contests. Glenn enjoyed his finest season as a junior, starting all 13 games at left guard. Glenn explored his NFL options following the 2010 season, but elected to return for his senior campaign and was promptly moved again -- this time back to the all-important left tackle position.
Glenn was a first-team All-SEC left tackle in 2011, his only season at the position, but projects as a guard for most teams -- but not all. He's susceptible to speed and counter moves at tackle, but is surprisingly nimble which could convince some NFL teams to envision him operating at this position. Scouts know he's dominant and powerful inside. Considering his size and versatility, Glenn should compete to be the first senior offensive lineman drafted in 2012 and a likely first-round pick.




Pass blocking: Surprisingly agile for a big man but is susceptible to speed rushes which likely will force him back inside or to right tackle after starting the entire 2011 season on the blindside for the Bulldogs. Eases out of his stance and waits for the defender to come to him. Possesses long arms and is very powerful, often easily controlling his opponent. Naturally balanced with good lateral agility to mirror the defender. Wide-bodied so opponents can rarely get past him and has an excellent anchor so bull rushes are futile. Nitpicking, but can be a bit inconsistent with his recognition on combination blocks. Typically gets an initial punch in on the defensive tackle before switching off to take on the blitzing linebacker, but can be fooled and miss his assignment. Can get a bit lazy with his hand placement, making him vulnerable to swim moves.

Run blocking: Excellent size and strength as a drive blocker. Can get fundamentally lazy, at times, playing too high and/or being a beat late off the snap. As such, he can miss with his initial punch and fail to push back his target. More often, he shows good hand placement and the leg drive to clear a hole. Powerful. Can knock defenders off the ball, providing impressive pancake blocks against even talented opponents. Good recognition in combination blocks in the running game. Good, powerful initial shove to the defensive tackle and gets to the second level with good quickness. Shows the ability to adjust his path to locate and attack his target. Rare body control for a man of his size when blocking at the second level.

Pulling/trapping: Shows surprising quickness and fluidity when pulling from left guard to lead on the toss and counter. Light on his feet and can adjust to hit the moving target at the second level.

Initial Quickness: A bit inconsistent with his initial get-off, though this may be simply a concentration issue with the snap-count. Demonstrates good initial quickness off the snap (especially for a man of his size) when pulling, but can be a beat late off the snap on other plays. Rarely is he actually beaten when late off the snap, however, due to his girth and long, powerful arms to catch and contain his assignment.

Downfield: Perhaps his most impressive trait, which is saying something. Gets to the second level quickly and consistently erases linebackers from the play. Doesn't waste his energy with pancake blocks, but instead seals off the defender completely, assuring that his assignment isn't in position to impact the ball-carrier.

Intangibles: Had four starts at left tackle over his career (all in 2009) entering the 2011 season. Turned in his paperwork to the NFL Draft Advisory Committee following last season but elected to return based partially on the plan to see more time at left tackle in 2011. Never missed a game due to injury while at Georgia.

Oviedo
03-20-2012, 08:40 AM
Reports are now saying the Steelers have signed former West Virginia TE/Fullback Will Johnson & also former Steeler WR Wes Lyons. Both could push for reserve roles for next season.

Lyons is obviously well known for being 6'9". He also seemed to have a solid Camp last season.

Johnson could feasably contest the 3rd TE/ H-Back/ Fullback spot that David Johnson currently holds.

Anyone who pushes Johnson off the roster is welcome although I would have preferred FA FB Owen Schmitt.

Chadman
03-24-2012, 03:06 AM
As we reach the last week of March, it is now time for Chadman to update his mock draft- we'll call this the pre-complex visit mock draft....

Or Mock Draft 3.1...might be easier...

ROUND 1

MIKE ADAMS OT
OHIO STATE
6'7" 323lbs
34" Arms
11" Hands

439

Chadman still finds no reason to move away from the big fella from Ohio St. He fits on numerous levels, fills a need, and improves a position of weakness. It's not often the Steelers get a chance at a "top tier" talent at OT, & Chadman would suggest that they should grab that chance while they have it.

To add some fuel to the fire, so to speak, the Steelers had Mike Tomlin, Sean Kugler & Todd Haley at the Ohio St Pro Day (see video attached):


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=im3oo8-ijaU&amp;feature=related

Reports out of the Pro Day were, to quote, that Adams was 'the apple of the Steelers eye'. How much you can believe of that is debatable- but they were certainly there in numbers to see him work out.



At this point Adams lacks the great technique that would make him a reliable left tackle to protect a right-handed quarterback's blind side. Given time he certainly could learn.
Meantime, Adams already moves well enough to get into linebackers on the second level. He has a substantial frame with conspicuous muscle in the right places and the footwork of a dancer, albeit more like hip hop than ballet. On film he did well handling Wisconsin's J.J. Watt (drafted No. 11 overall by Texas last year), but was befuddled by the nifty moves of Purdue's Ryan Kerrigan (drafted No. 16 overall by Washington last year). In his final two seasons as a starter, Adams had issues on and off the field. He underwent shoulder surgery and then a season-ending left foot injury, both in 2008. Adams missed five games in 2009 with knee injury and was suspended for two games the same year for violating team rules. He as one of five players suspended first five games last year for receiving benefits from selling collectibles through a tattoo parlor and had to pay back $1,000 he received for a ring.




Pass blocking: Tall, long, athletic pass protector. Generally gets out of three-point stance with good knee bend and a wide base. Improving his ability to use his hands to redirect rushers and late blitzers away from the pocket. Power rushers lose most battles. Has an adequate anchor in close quarters, will reset hands and move feet to sustain. Stops his feet after initial contact, relying on length but allowing defender to get the corner or spin inside.
Run blocking: Solid positional run blocker who flashes the nasty demeanor and killer instinct scouts covet. Attacks when necessary, though he won't consistently dominate and can lose balance when overextending. Quick feet to get inside of defensive tackles to wall off inside and reach linebackers at the second level. Nice punch which he uses to knock down smaller defenders with one extension. Height can be a detriment in short-yardage, defender can get under his pads to hold the line. Flashes the ability to move his man with his hands, but is not yet consistent in this area.
Pulling/trapping: Best on the outside because of his height and athleticism, but is capable of blocking on the move. Effective in space and usually drops his hips to get leverage and sustain against shorter defenders.
Initial Quickness: Excellent quick-twitch movement off the snap in pass protection and as a run blocker. Finds defenders with his hands immediately and gets feet moving to engage and sustain. Can be beat off the edge coming out of his stance lunging to reach speedy wide rushers.
Downfield: Quick out of his stance with the footwork to be effective in front of screens. Willing to get out in front of ballcarriers to take out defensive backs and linebackers. Used at tight end on unbalanced lines. Intangibles: Suspended the first two games of the 2009 season for violating team rules, cited in January 2009 for misdemeanor possession of drug paraphernalia (charges were eventually dropped) after being stopped for running a stop sign. One of five players suspended for first five games of 2011 season for receiving benefits from a tattoo parlor owner, selling championship rings, jerseys and awards; Adams was required to pay back $1,000 for the ring he sold.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xx6k8TkQypk&amp;feature=related

Chadman
03-24-2012, 03:19 AM
ROUND 2

MIKE MARTIN DT
MICHIGAN
6'1" 306lbs
32" Arms
9" Hands


440


Casey Hampton will be in his last season in Pittsburgh. Chris Hoke & Aaron Smith have already moved on. Martin is somewhat similar in size to Chris Hoke. There are unconfirmed reports that Mike Tomlin actually prefers shorter, faster DL players (per Jim Wexell of all people) & the Steelers certainly put both Martin & Ryan Van Bergen through DL drills at Michigan's Pro Day. A very strong, compact player that uses leverage well. Has experience at NT. No character concerns, big school, big production.


A lifelong fan of the Wolverines, there was little doubt where the 2007 Michigan Gatorade Player of the Year would choose to matriculate. A four-star recruit by all of the major high school scouting services, Martin also won the Michigan Wrestling State Championship in his junior season (after having no prior wrestling experience), and broke T.J. Duckett's former Michigan high school shot put record on his way to a state championship.
Martin used that combination of strength and hand/foot control to earn Freshman All American honors after his first year in Ann Arbor. Appearing in 12 games as a reserve defender and on special teams, he made 20 tackles with 4.5 for loss and two sacks. He continued his development in 2009, starting all 12 games on the nose. He was credited with 51 tackles, 6.5 for loss and 2.0 sacks, and received the Richard Katcher Award as the team's best defensive lineman.
In his junior year, Martin won that prestigious award again, along with second-team All-Big Ten honors from league coaches, after he started 12 games, registering 37 tackles, six for loss and 2.5 sacks. He missed the Purdue Game on Nov. 13, 2010, due to an ankle injury that plagued him for the rest of the season.
Martin earned second-team All-Big Ten honors in 2011, racking up a career-high 54 tackles and three sacks to go along with six tackles for loss.
At 6-1, Martin is undersized height-wise, but he has a thick, compact build on his wrestler's frame. He fires off the snap with a relentless attitude and uses his low pad level and violent hands to tear through blockers.
Martin's long arms allow him to keep his opponents from grasping a firm hold of him. With good lateral agility, power and a relentless motor, Martin got the better of Ohio State's Michael Brewster, a possible top 100 pick, on numerous occasions during Senior Bowl practices.Martin is an undersized nose tackle with loads of experience in a 3-4 defense. But he lacks a consistent anchor against double teams and just does not have the right frame to be an NFL starter. Because of his ability to penetrate against one-on-one blocks, Martin could be a solid rotation player in a 4-3 scheme as a three-technique tackle and move to the nose on passing downs.




Pass rush: Provides some secondary interior pass rush, getting most penetration when playing three-technique. Possesses only adequate burst off the snap even when directly over the ball, and his initial pop leaves room to be desired. Hands could be much more violent when trying to gain control of the block. Can bull rush his way past running backs in pass protection. Preferred pass rush move is an arm-over swim move while simultaneously pulling lineman forward. Once momentum is stopped, lacks a critical counter move to progress into the backfield. Spies the quarterback if stoned at the line, but lacks the height and vertical to knock down passes.
Run defense: Uses more hustle than brute strength to stop the run. Gets skinny to split double teams, using good short-area quickness to make a play in the backfield. Runs the line very well, making plays on the ball when he beats blocks on the backside. Rarely goes to the ground, showing good balance from his high school wrestling days. Constantly moving his hands, readjusting them into proper placement. Occasionally too high (despite his short stature), and bows out his arms, hampering his ability to press and lock out. Does not hold his ground while facing a double team, first instinct is to roll away to make a play, which can create a large hole.
Explosion: Does not test offensive linemen with quickness or strong initial punch. Rarely first off the snap. Able to swim past single blockers to penetrate into the backfield. Does not attempt to split double-teams, takes a step back and waits to chase down plays.
Strength: Low center of gravity and generally low pad level allows him to play with initial strength and leverage at the point of attack. Upper-body only average, however, struggles to shed one-on-one blocks or sustain leverage once out of his stance. Pad level rises late in the game.
Tackling: Catch-and-drag tackler who rarely drives ballcarriers to the ground. Very good short-area quickness to make plays between the tackles. Displays agility and secure tackling to corral backs in the backfield, also chases plays from the backside to prevent cutbacks. Intangibles: High-motor, high-character leader. Worked at Ndamukong Suh's summer football camp. Played through two sprained ankles (Iowa, 10/16; Penn State 10/30), missed only Purdue (11/13). Won team's Richard Katcher award the past two seasons for being the team's best defensive lineman.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV_d1N83y54&amp;feature=related

Chadman
03-24-2012, 03:31 AM
ROUND 3

KEENAN ROBINSON LB
TEXAS
6'3" 242lbs
33" Arms
10" Hands

441

Call this one a 'hunch'. The Steelers always attend Texas Pro Days in force & this season was no different. The Steelers obviously need to look for the long term replacement for James Farrior, and lucky for them, there are multiple options in this season's draft. But why Robinson? Well- the Steelers have valued the Texas program under Tomlin- nearly ALWAYS selecting at least 1 Longhorn in each draft. Also- the Steelers lost their 'signal caller' in Farrior- and no doubt they'll be looking for a player with the ability to call the plays in the future. Watch the video attached later & you will see that Robinson is often calling the defensive plays for Texas. Robinson isn't a 'flashy' player- but he's solid, doesn't make many mistakes & is familiar with playing 3-4 defences & signal calling. It's a pretty good fit.


Robinson joins fellow senior linebacker Emmanuel Acho to give Texas its second top 150-prospect duos at the second level in the past three years; Sergio Kindle (2nd round, #43, Baltimore) and Roddrick Muckelroy (4th, #131, Cincinnati) both heard their names called in the 2005 draft.
As a redshirt freshman, Robinson led the Longhorns with 10 special teams tackles and saw time on defense as a reserve (24 tackles, two for loss, pass break-up). He then earned honorable mention All-Big 12 honors by starting every game as a sophomore, posting 74 tackles, five for loss and 1.5 sacks, and five PBUs. Robinson produced enough in 2010 (96 tackles, eight for loss, two sacks, two interceptions) to again earn honorable mention notice from league coaches, as well as second-team all-conference honors from the Associated Press.Robinson shined in Texas' 2010 match-up against Oklahoma (as did Acho), making 19 tackles, including 10 solo stops and two behind the line of scrimmage. If he uses his size/speed combination to its fullest by improving his tackling consistency, and produce like he did in last year's Red River Shootout, Robinson will be one of the best true 4-3 linebacker prospects come April.



Read & React: Possesses average instincts, more likely to make plays with quick reactions than diagnosing. Handles misdirection well with quick change of direction ability. Comes downhill quickly against the run when he has an open lane.
Run defense: Gives effort between the tackles to find the ball, willing to take on linemen to fill a hole. Flashes strength to punch or stiff-arm to get off lineman blocks, but is inconsistent feeling them when not head-up. Stays with plays downfield, often making tackles, even after being hit by multiple linemen. Lacks pop and strength to anchor, though. Most effective when uncovered inside and chasing stretch plays to the sideline.
Pass defense: Displays nice agility and awareness in coverage. Capable of dropping deep quickly off the snap, also coming off a seam route to make tackles on underneath route. Stays with tight end and larger receivers in his zone, fights for the ball if its thrown in his area. Finds the first down marker and will bait quarterbacks into making throws to that receiver. Closes on receivers on front of him, does whatever it takes to bring them down immediately after the catch. Lacks elite quickness and change of direction ability to handle NFL slot receivers after initial contact.
Tackling: Chaser with speed to reach either sideline, closing ability to take down ballcarriers behind the line of scrimmage. Owns strength and length to bring down backs in the open field and receivers on bubble screens. Does not blow up targets. Many inside tackles are catch-and-drags, which will be more difficult to make at the next level. Plays upright. Ducks his head and fail to wrap at times. Also leaves his feet too often and shoulders ballcarriers, trying to make the big hit. Inconsistent giving full effort to be the second man in the play.
Pass Rush/Blitz: Not asked to go after the quarterback often in Texas' stack. Has the size and speed to be effective, but must learn to use hands to beat lineman and running back blocks.Intangibles: Plays a bit nasty, sometimes drawing flags for unnecessary roughness. Stepped forward as a leader through his words and action over the past year. Good student in the classroom and the film room. No work ethic or character issues. Brother, Aubrey Smith, played cornerback at NAIA's Missouri Valley College.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJAg8_osV88&amp;feature=related

Chadman
03-24-2012, 03:38 AM
ROUND 4

LUCAS NIX OG
PITTSBURGH
6'5" 317lbs
33.5" Arms
10" Hands

442

Big, rough & tough. And plays another position that could use an upgrade. How often have Tomlin/Colbert 'double dipped' on a position in a draft? Put down Adams & Nix as your next 'double dip'. The Steelers could, essentially, sure up the future of the OL with these 2 selections combined with what is currently on the roster.


Pittsburgh's offensive line struggles forced coaches' hand during the 2010 season. Desparate to protect quarterback Tino Sunseri and run future fifth-round pick Dion Lewis more effectively, they shifted Nix from right tackle to right guard and moved 6-7, 315-pound junior Jordan Gibbs into the starting line-up at Nix's old spot. The team won seven of its last 10 games, averaging nearly 28 points a game and topping 200 rushing yards in four contests.
Nix spent his first two years with the Panthers at right tackle, playing six games as a reserve in his true freshman season before moving into the starting line-up in all 13 games in 2009.While Nix could get a chance at tackle at the next level, he may face difficulties against NFL speed on the outside without substantial improvement in his lateral movement. Playing inside allows him take advantage of his strength and toughness at the point of attack and fair mobility to the second level, which will gain him favor among NFL scouts and offensive line coaches alike during the draft season.



Pass blocking: Works hard to keep his quarterback clean but lacks lateral movement to stay outside at the next level. Anchors well when leaning into defenders and uses effort and length to ride defenders around or through the pocket. Bends at the waist, and will overextend at times, due to a lack of upper-body and hip flexibility. Stronger defenders can also get under his pads to push him back. Uses effort and length to recover, but NFL defenders with strong hands will get him off-balance (especially one-on-one in space) easily unless his stance and knee bend improves.
Run blocking: Solid drive-blocker who gets push off the snap and churns his legs to move the pile. Pushes around second-level defenders when his head is up and feet underneath him. Has upper-body strength and tenacity to turn defenders out of the hole. Forward momentum allows him to move on to the next target if his man goes to the ground. Does not latch onto defenders with his hands consistently, they can roll off his block after initial contact to get involved in plays. Struggles to get low in his stance. Generally effective as a cut blocker, though pro tackles could defeat him with their hands more easily.
Pulling/trapping: Possesses the mobility to trap effectively inside and move outside the tackle on occasion. Hit-and-miss connecting and sustaining against targets, though, as he regularly bends at the waist, drops his head and sometimes leaves his feet to make the block. Gets down quickly to put defenders getting into the backfield on the ground. Inconsistent attacking linebackers at the second level, hesitates at times, allowing quicker defenders to elude him.
Initial Quickness: Inconsistent quickness off the snap, sometimes coming up last. Come off low and hard on run plays when in sync with the center. Gets to second level quickly when uncovered, but Has trouble stopping to adjust to quick linebackers and defensive backs because he lacks bend and flexibility.
Downfield: Lacks foot speed to be a major threat as a lead blocker outside, but flashes the ability to reach linebackers and safeties outside the box. Excellent hustle on extended plays, constantly follows the ballcarriers into (or past) the second level to help push them for an extra yard. Effective cut blocker, stays low out of his stance, get down quickly to take out defenders just below the knees. Intangibles: Full-effort player with a team-first attitude. Cited for disorderly conduct in March 2009. Brother, Nate, is a senior defensive end at Pitt.

Chadman
03-24-2012, 03:51 AM
ROUND 5

BRANDON TAYLOR SAFETY
5'11" 209lbs
31" Arms
9.5" Hands


443


There is no doubt that the Steelers will need depth & youth at both SS & FS in the near future. Both Mike Tomlin & Ryan Clark were at LSU's Pro Day- no doubt they would have cast an eye over Brandon Taylor.

A three-year starter at strong safety Voted one of five permanent team captains for LSU's SEC Championship and national runner-up team in 2011 Played in 49 games with 33 starts during his career with the Tigers Capped career with 160 tackles, 11.5 tackles for loss, 15 pass breakups and four interceptions One of the newest traditions at LSU is for the player that best represents what it means to be a Tiger - on and off the field - to wear No. 18 He was selected by Coach Miles and former No. 18s - Matt Mauck, Jacob Hester, Richard Dickson and Richard Murphy - to inherit that number as a senior in 2011 One of three members of his family to earn a football scholarship to LSU His brother Curtis played on LSU's national title team in 2007 and was drafted in the 2008 NFL Draft by the San Francisco 49ers Another brother Jhyryn spent two years at LSU before transferring to a junior college in the spring of 2010.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xTD745Yepw

Chadman
03-24-2012, 04:07 AM
ROUND 6

RYAN VAN BERGEN DE
MICHIGAN
6'6" 288lbs


444


After losing both Hoke & Smith, there are 2 positions open on the roster. Looking at a late round DE might not be a bad move.

Michigan Pro Day: Despite leading Michigan in both tackles for loss (12.5) and sacks last year (5.5), Ryan Van Bergen didn't receive an invitation to the NFL Combine last month. He bounced between defensive end and defensive tackle over his career as the Wolverines changed schemes and coaches. But regardless of where he lined up on the field, Van Bergen was always moving at full-go and that intensity was on display Thursday during Michigan's Pro Day in Ann Arbor. Van Bergen, who weighed in a 291 pounds, ran a 4.90 40-yard dash and put up 31 reps of 225 pounds on the bench press. He suffered a right foot injury in the Sugar Bowl in January and has been feverishly rehabbing to work out for NFL teams. - Dane Brugler, NFLDraftScout.com

Chadman
03-24-2012, 04:12 AM
ROUND 7

LENNON CREER RB
LOUISIANA TECH
5'11" 219lbs
31.5" Arms
9" Hands

445

Pretty sure the Steelers will look at a RB at some point in this draft- just a matter of who & where. Creer offers low risk in Round 7, but potentially high upside.


Creer was a top-10 running back recruit at the prep level, choosing Tennessee over Texas, Oklahoma, Alabama and several other prominent programs. He saw immediate action in 2007 as a true freshman, recording 214 yards on 36 carries (5.9) and 1 touchdown. Fighting with Arian Foster and Montario Hardesty for playing time, Creer was a back-up in 2008 as a sophomore, finishing second on the team with 388 yards on 73 carries (5.3) and 4 scores. He decided to transfer prior to the 2009 season and chose Louisiana Tech over Baylor, TCU and Rice, sitting out that year due to transfer rules. Creer was a rotational starter in 2010 as a junior with 6 starts, recording a team-best 1,181 yards on 212 carries (5.6) and 10 touchdowns with 25 catches for 181 yards (7.2), earning Second Team All-WAC honors. He was hampered by injuries in 2011 as a senior and wasn?t as productive (10 starts), finishing with 838 yards on 198 attempts (4.2) for 9 scores, adding 18 catches for 93 yards (5.2) and 1 touchdown.Creer is a linear, one-speed runner with good instincts and vision, but struggles to stay balanced through contact and won?t break a lot of tackles. He decided to leave Tennessee after several run-ins with coaches and carries some character and maturity concerns. Creer has good speed for a player his size, but is very average across the board with several durability concerns and will struggle to stick on a roster at the next level ? late round prospect at-best.



Strengths: A quick, smooth athlete with the footwork to make sharp cuts and redirect his momentum in a flash. Shows good vision and patience with natural running instincts. Has good straight-line speed with quick acceleration and a second gear downfield. Has a good-sized frame to add some bulk and get stronger. Has reliable hands out of the backfield with a combined 43 receptions the past two years. Shows very good effort in pass protection, giving up his body and taking on blocks. Has some experience as a return man on kickoffs.Weaknesses: An upright runner with a lean torso and not a lot of bulk on his frame. A one-speed runner and lacks any explosive qualities with tight hips. Has poor balance and has the bad habit of losing coordination when changing directions ? his feet and upper body look to be on two different pages. Goes down too easily upon contact and needs to do a better job staying on his feet and anticipating hits. Needs to be more of a finisher and run with more purpose and determination. Has battled several injuries the past two seasons, including an ankle issue that plagued him through his senior year and caused him to miss the final two games of the 2011 regular season (didn?t even practice). Has had maturity and coachability issues at both Tennessee and Louisiana Tech ? questionable passion and work ethic to make it as a pro. Allowed himself to be academically ineligible for the 2011 bowl game and his final game in college.

RuthlessBurgher
03-25-2012, 12:10 AM
To add some fuel to the fire, so to speak, the Steelers had Mike Tomlin, Sean Kugler & Todd Haley at the Ohio St Pro Day

Don't we always show up en masse at OSU? It's a piece-of-cake 3 hour commute on I-70 from Pittsburgh to Columbus, so it is no big deal for those guys to take a quick day trip like this...if all of our big guns were flying across multiple time zones for a Pro Day, then that might shed some light on our intentions. We have drafted several Buckeye in recent seasons, but they have all been toys for OSU alum Dick LeBeau to play with (Cam Heyward, Thaddeus Gibson, Doug Worthington). The last OSU player on offense we took was pre-Tomlin (the trade up for Santonio).

Chadman
03-25-2012, 12:20 AM
Don't we always show up en masse at OSU? It's a piece-of-cake 3 hour commute on I-70 from Pittsburgh to Columbus, so it is no big deal for those guys to take a quick day trip like this...if all of our big guns were flying across multiple time zones for a Pro Day, then that might shed some light on our intentions. We have drafted several Buckeye in recent seasons, but they have all been toys for OSU alum Dick LeBeau to play with (Cam Heyward, Thaddeus Gibson, Doug Worthington). The last OSU player on offense we took was pre-Tomlin (the trade up for Santonio).

That's very true. But then, under Tomlin/Colbert the Steeler have drafted from ONLY 4 college conferences within the first 2 rounds- Big 10, Big 12, ACC & SEC. Does that mean they'll only draft from those 4 conferences in the first 2 rounds this year? The Steelers also always send a large contingent of FO types to LSU, Florida State, Texas & Michigan. It could just be that the FO appreciates the big program school prospects more. But using history as a guide Ruthless- you are spot on. Adams won't be 'the guy' if history proves true.

Chadman
04-03-2012, 11:34 PM
Been a few days since we visited this site, so Chadman has had some time to think about the direction the Steelers MIGHT go as far as the 1st Round is concerned.

Here's what we KNOW about the Steelers when it comes to the 1st Round-
1. They don't necessarily draft for 'need' so much as value compared to need- ie, Mendenhall's selection- they had a starting RB in place, but when Mendy fell to them, he was simply best value compared to the need for an eventual successor to Parker.
2. Big school, big production is important- possibly vital.
3. Rarely take risks on 1st Round picks- character/injury/consistancy are important factors.
4. Juniors get a favourable look.
5. 1st round picks are generally selected with a view to learning off a vet who is nearing the end of their Steelers career- ie Heyward/Hood behind Smith/Keisel, Timmons behind Foote/Farrior, Mendy behind Parker.
6. Picks will often have been checked out by Colbert or Tomlin- or both at Pro Days, visits.
7. The Steelers appear to prefer to pick players rated as the best or 2nd best at their respective positions in the draft class- the exception being when drafting at #32/#31 where it comes down to BPA (although it can be argued that both Heyward & Hood were within the top 2 3-4 DE's of their class.) Timmons was the 2nd LB drafted, Pouncey the 1st C, Mendy the 2nd RB. This is, of course, in comparison to say, drafting the 4th or 5th OT/DE/DT/WR of their class.

Chadman
04-04-2012, 01:51 AM
So, which players are really potential 1st Round selections for the Steelers? Chadman will list the most likely candidates as far as he sees them, in no particular order:

LB Luke Keuchley
LB Donta Hightower
NT Jerrel Worthy
NT Dontari Poe
OG Cordy Glenn
OT Mike Adams
WR Kendall Wright
SS Mark Barron
CB Stephon Gilmore
RB Doug Martin
RB David Wilson
RB Lamar Miller
WR Stephen Hill
OC Peter Konz
TE Coby Fleener

That would be, really, the likely possibilities, at this point in time. Of that group Keuchley, Poe & Stephen Hill are likely to be selected before the Steelers pick. Cordy Glenn is a strong possibility to have gone by #24 as well, but not as certain. Hill might not be considered, even if he was to fall to #24, due to a log-jam of young, talented WR's at the Steelers. That isn't to say he wouldn't be considered, but it's unlikely. Keuchley would get serious consideration if he fell to #24. Poe...is interesting. Physically, he's perfect, but his body of work is average & his level of competition doesn't fit. Chadman would suggest that Poe, even if he fell to #24, might be overlooked by the Steelers regardless. Cordy Glenn, however, would get serious consideration.

Peter Konz, David Wilson & Lamar Miller could be considered 'reaches' at #24, and areunlikely to be selected by the Steelers.

Kendall Wright, while a great player, is similar to Stephen Hill in that he is a value player, but in a position where there might be too much recent investment to seriously consider a 1st round selection.

Mike Adams, as has been mentioned numerous times, has some questionable character issues that might strike him from the board. He would have to do some serious great interviewing to be an actual consideration.

This leaves us with Jerrel Worthy, Mark Barron, Donta Hightower, Stephon Gilmore, Doug Martin & Coby Fleener as the 'most likely' players to be considered by the Steelers at #24.

Worthy would be considered a NT for the Steelers if selected. He's not the prototype 3-4 NT, he's more a highly talented Chris Hoke type of player. The Steelers went en masse to Michigan St, so you would assume that they cast an eye over him while there. He IS a junior, so he ticks that box too.

Barron is the #1 Safety in the draft- a proposition that might prove enticing to the Steelers. Both Polamalu & Clark are aging, and the only real back-up of note is Ryan Mundy who is, realistically, not the long term answer. Barron might be more of a priority than many fans have made him, and with Kevin Colbert having attended all of Alabama's Pro Days (How many have they had? 3?), the Steelers would know a little about him.

Hightower, Barron's Alabama mate, is a board favourite. "Massive Brilliance" fills many needs as far as perception goes. He's a physical, explosive player that has experience as a 3-4 ILB. Very few questions about him, outside of minor concern about his injuries. He 'makes sense' as a selection. That said- there are several ILB's in this draft, many predicted to fall into the Rounds 2-4 range, that, while not as talented as Massive Brilliance, don't offer too much of a significant drop-off in terms of value. That isn't to say he's 'out', just that the need to draft one in Round 1 isn't that pressing. Add to that, Larry Foote will move into the starting role this season, removing the immdiate need for a replacement, as well as the Steelers potential belief that Stevenson Sylvester might be able to assume the ILB role in the future. It would not surprise Chadman if, despite fans view of the pressing need for an ILB, that the Steelers view the need as more of a secondary or even lower need.

Gilmore might be the best player available at #24. He ticks a lot of boxes as far as Steeler CB's in history go. That said, the Steelers invested a 3rd & 4th round pick on CB's last season, as well as a 3rd round pick on Keenan Lewis. Chadman will assume that these guys might reduce the need for a high-round CB selection.

Fleener is the #1 TE on the board, so like Barron, this might prove an attractive lure. He could start at #2 TE almost immediately through default as there is no real competition for that role. While not often considered by fans, this selection might hold more merit than we give it credit for.

Lastly, Doug Martin. Mendenhall will miss significant playing time through his injury this season, leaving the RB stocks at Redman, an UDFA with 2 starts to his name, Dwyer, a 6th round pick with 1 100 yard game to his name, Clay, another UDFA that scored a TD once, and Batch, a 7th round pick that never made it out of Camp. Just how comfortable are the Steelers with the RB situation? Particularly when you think that the memo from the Rooney's a year ago was to improve the running game- a memo that, when 'ignored', cost Arians his job. So enter Todd Haley- a man known to rely on pass catching RB's like Hightower & Charles. With Mendy in his last season in Pittsburgh, and no proven replacement in place- Chadman is going to assume that RB might have a higher priority than originally thought too. The question is though- is Martin the #2 RB? Or Wilson? Or Miller? Which one fits the Steelers best?

Chadman
04-04-2012, 02:00 AM
If Chadman had to order the 'likely' selections, it would go:
1. RB Martin
2. SS Barron
3. NT Worthy
4. TE Fleener
5. ILB Hightower

The "Wild Cards" are Keuchley (unlikely) or Glenn (more likely, but questionable) falling to #24. To counteract that- Keuchley is in the same boat as Hightower- potentially more a "Fan Selection" than a Steeler selection while Kevin Colbert has already identified the OG class to be very deep.

Chadman
04-04-2012, 02:22 AM
There is....one other player....that Chadman has left off the list, until now.


Did you know that Levon Kirkland's cousin is available in this draft?

And that he has a meeting scheduled (he may have had it already) with the Steelers?

Now, he doesn't seem to fit a 'position of need' unless there is some shuffling of players on the current roster, but one Pittsburgh journo has already alluded to that possibility...

Chadman presents to you, Devon Still.

http://pit.scout.com/2/1162366.html

If he was selected- and he should fall right in about #24, Ziggy Hood could be moved inside to play NT once Casey Hampton moves on. This would give the Steelers 3 very talented DL players moving forward.

In Chadman's opinion, Still is the most disruptive DL in this draft class, and should be considered a potential pick at #24

Chadman
04-04-2012, 07:43 PM
A couple of interesting points to add- the Steelers have shown great interest in Isiah Pead, but today reports are that the Ravens are now sniffing around too. This could force the Steelers to draft him a little higher than they probably had invisioned if they really do like him.

Conversely, there was a LARGE contingent of Steeler coaches at the Miami Pro Day, including new OC Todd Haley. While there are certainly several players of interest in that squad, it's not a real stretch to believe they were there to look at Lamar Miller..almost a Jamal Charles clone.

Bobby Massie has come in for talks now...so that Mike Adams, Demetrius Bell & now Massie...Chadman will stick to his theory- OT is on the draft agenda.

BigRob
04-04-2012, 07:51 PM
A couple of interesting points to add- the Steelers have shown great interest in Isiah Pead, but today reports are that the Ravens are now sniffing around too. This could force the Steelers to draft him a little higher than they probably had invisioned if they really do like him.

Conversely, there was a LARGE contingent of Steeler coaches at the Miami Pro Day, including new OC Todd Haley. While there are certainly several players of interest in that squad, it's not a real stretch to believe they were there to look at Lamar Miller..almost a Jamal Charles clone.

Bobby Massie has come in for talks now...so that Mike Adams, Demetrius Bell & now Massie...Chadman will stick to his theory- OT is on the draft agenda.

And several others to boot. How about Brandon Washington and Sean Spence?

Chadman
04-05-2012, 03:01 AM
And several others to boot. How about Brandon Washington and Sean Spence?

Yes- Spence & Washington would be of interest, but probably not so much for Todd Haley, as Chadman had mentioned..but for Kugs & Butler- absolutely.

Oviedo
04-05-2012, 07:49 AM
Yes- Spence & Washington would be of interest, but probably not so much for Todd Haley, as Chadman had mentioned..but for Kugs & Butler- absolutely.

I wouldn't be surprised to see the Steelers interested in TE Chase Ford or WR Tommy Streeter. Both of those Miami players are later round guys who Haley would naturally want to see first hand and could fill some holes in the roster. Ford is a big TE and Streeter is that elusive "tall WR"

steelblood
04-05-2012, 07:54 AM
Bobby Massie is a good player. He may be better than Jonathan Martin.

Chadman
04-05-2012, 09:36 AM
I wouldn't be surprised to see the Steelers interested in TE Chase Ford or WR Tommy Streeter. Both of those Miami players are later round guys who Haley would naturally want to see first hand and could fill some holes in the roster. Ford is a big TE and Streeter is that elusive "tall WR"

Fair point Ovi- both Ford & Streeter are worth looking at. But if we agree that a late round TE & a mid round WR are worth looking at, can we agree that sending numerous FO types, including your HC & OC might indicate that they might also be looking at the high round RB?

Particularly when that high round RB is similar in many ways to the RB our new OC used to perfection at KC?

Chadman
04-05-2012, 09:41 AM
Bobby Massie is a good player. He may be better than Jonathan Martin.

Agree- Massie seems very strong at the point. It's a funny draft this one- not many 'sure fire' picks, but plenty of good players throughout that have holes in their game. When Chadman looks at it, only Luck, Kalil, DeCastro & maybe RG3 stand out as guys with few holes in their game- the rest you sort of go "yeah, he's good...but..."...

That said, there looks to be good, solid depth through the first 4 rounds, so while we might see a draft crop that are not exactly perfect- they might provide plenty of good roster players for years to come.

Funny draft..

Chadman
04-08-2012, 08:56 AM
Ok, so since the last Mock draft, Chadman has had some time to re-evaluate where he believes this upcoming draft may lead. When Chadman suggested Mike Adams as the potential #1 selection for the Steelers, various degrees of apoplexy were had by several board members. You know what guys? You might be right. Adams is a risk- and one thing the Steelers just don't do, is take risks early. So, rest easy- Adams is no longer the #1 pick. After going over several old Pro Day reports on the various options Chadman had penciled in as potential #1 guys, there were a few scratchings from the list for guys that hadn't performed up to the expected level at college, guys with athletic question marks, character concerns & simple reaches. Unlike quite a few posters on here, Chadman believes the Steelers will feel they enter the draft with the starting positions for next season in place, and that the rookies are viewed as future starters. That isn't to say that the rookie won't start- just that the Steelers won't draft with the idea that this player, or that player MUST be ready to start. You'll find selections that might go against the grain, you might find some positions not given the consideration some might feel they require. That's ok- from Chadman's understanding, his musings are just that...musings. and the Steelers very rarely actually listen to Chadman.

Except of course when they listened about Lawrence Timmons. And LaMarr Woodley. And Cameron Heyward. Oh, and Marcus Gilbert.

But other than those times- they don't really listen to Chadman.

Seriously.

Chadman
04-08-2012, 09:14 AM
ROUND 1

KEVIN ZEITLER
OG WISCONSIN
6'4" 314lbs

467

If there is 1 thing some of you would have learned over time, it's that Chadman does not normally advocate drafting OG's in Round 1. For Chadman, these guys are usually better value in the 2nd or 3rd Rounds. However, here we are selecting an OG in Round 1, and one from Wisconsin, the same college that gave us Kraig Urbik....ahh, memories.

So- why Zeitler? Well, for starters all 32 teams attended the Badgers 1st Pro Day, which is no surprise as they seem to churn out several decent players every year. But the fact that the Steelers were there is important. Zeitler performed all his tasks well, and from reports interviewed well too. He's 'officially' the 3rd highest rated OG in the draft, but with such a poor OT class this season, Cordy Glenn could well be viewed as a RT instead of OG, making Zeitler the #2 OG on the board after DeCastro. Here's the thing about Zeitler- there are no real weaknesses. When Chadman goes over the reports on other players considered with this pick, there are weaknesses- not athletic, poor level of competition/production, character concerns etc. Not with Zeitler. He might not be the best athlete. He might not be a "wow" player. But the chances of him failing...are slim. Remember- the Steelers don't take risks early. The reports on Zeitler are that he's a perfectionist, he WANTS to get his game right. He gets upset with himself when he makes mistakes. That's a good attitude to have. Also, watching tape- this is a guy that is very effective on the move, something the Steelers will ask him to do, no doubt. He played RG at Wisconsin, but it's not inconceivable he could play LG in Pittsburgh. And you know what? This is a guy who COULD outplay Legursky & Foster in TC & get a start in his rookie year. Is he a slight reach at #24? Possibly. The Steelers might even try to trade down if they can find a suitable trade partner- but even if selected at #24, he'll provide great value.

Kevin Zeitler, Wisconsin, 6-4, 314...A perfectionist, Zeitler expects more out of himself than anybody else could in class, the weight room and on the field. His anxious nitpicking is noticed and not always well-accepted by classmates, teachers and teammates. But it is opposing defenders who pay the price when the sum of his hard work pays off on the field. So, as expected, scouting reports show he does just about everything according to the book to his best ability -- and he has plenty of ability. Zeitler added a significant amount of lean mass in his college career and used it well. According NFL Draft Report statistics, he led college football with 142 knockdown blocks and had 33 blocks that resulted in touchdowns, obviously a major reason Wisconsin had a per-game average of 44.62 points and 467 total yards, including 237 on the ground.


Pass blocking: Anchors against larger defenders in the middle, resets hands to maintain distance. Athletic enough to help on nose tackle then pick up twist or late blitzer. Mirrors quick interior rushers. Looks to help the center, or even the tackle a few yards upfield, if he is uncovered.
Run blocking: Good fit in a zone system, uses mobility and strength to move defender down the line. Dips shoulder and moves his feet to get outside leverage when needed. Strong and low coming out of his stance, effective in short-yardage situations. Finds the mike quickly and negates him when it is his responsibility. Gives effort to hit as many targets as possible, even if on the ground. Need to work on keeping outside leverage when doubling on the nose.
Pulling/trapping: Good foot quickness working behind the line, though losing a few extra pounds around the middle would help his agility. Brings hips to knock back linebackers in his way, maintains block until running back finds the hole behind him. Gets down low quickly to defeat defenders trying to cut down running backs. Ducks his head at times, must keep his posture to see and sustain against his target.
Initial Quickness: Possesses adequate quickness off the snap to get his hands into defenders and attack linebackers at the second level, but is not elite in this category and can be a step late at times.
Downfield: Regularly hits second-level targets, uses strong hands to latch on, and keeps legs churning to carry them out of the play. Knows correct blocking angles inside, gets into position with good footwork. Will punch at smaller defenders at times instead of latching on, allowing them to get off the block.Intangibles: Dependable, no-nonsense mauler who works hard in the weight room and on the field. Did not start the first four games of 2010 due to a high ankle sprain suffered during the summer.

Chadman
04-08-2012, 09:25 AM
ROUND 2

ISAIAH PEAD
RB CINCINNATI
5'10" 200lbs

468

The Steelers have shown some very obvious interest in Pead, and for good reason. Chadman has pointed out the state of the Steelers RB's a few times- without Mendenhall we are going into the season with 2 UDFA's, 1 6th Round RB & 1 7th Round RB with a combined 3 starts to their name. This, is not good. And Mendenhall is off contract next season. But you know what? Even those reasons are not the best reasons for Pead. Todd Haley has used Tim Hightower in Arizona, and Jamaal Charles in KC to great effect as RB/Receiver types, smaller, quicker guys that can be used in multiple ways. Pead could split time with Redman & be very effective in that sort of role. Very quick, tougher than he looks.

Running back Isaiah Pead of the University of Cincinnati is visiting the Steelers today, the latest prospect of 30 permitted to do so before the draft. Pead was named the MVP of the Senior Bowl in Mobile, Ala., this year. In four years with the Bearcats, he rushed for 3,288 yards on 545 carries. He is listed at 5-11, 200 pounds. - Ed Bouchette, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette


Pead beat two-time Heisman Trophy winner Archie Griffin's high school rushing records (including 2,204 yards, 39 TD as a senior) and won the Ohio Player of the Year award in his division in 2006 and 2007. But instead of staying in his hometown of Columbus to play for the Buckeyes, where they have him just a cursory look, Pead opted to be "the man" for a rising Cincinnati squad.
He was third on the depth chart as a freshman, carrying the ball just 30 times for 194 yards and catching two passes for 11 yards. And though Pead started just three games in 2009, he led the team in carries and yards (121-806-9, 20-201-2 rec). He finally becoming the team's primary ballcarrier as a junior, earning second-team All-Big East honors (157-1,029-6 rush, 26-190-1 rec).Pead may have the best straight-line speed of any running back in the 2012 senior class. Though not elite in his vision or strength, he has enough all-around game (including effort as a blocker) to be a three-down player at the next level--which is often the difference between being valued as an early-round and mid-round prospect.



Inside: North-south runner with quick feet to feel his way through creases. Makes small, quick cuts through creases and side-steps defenders in or past the hole to find room to get into his stride. Does not run over defenders often, but keeps legs moving near the goal line to make his way in. Holds the ball low at times, but has generally good ball security (no fumbles in 2009, two in 2010). Does not always show a burst in the box, anticipates contact. Quick draws make him run with shoulders not square to the line.
Outside: Excellent straight-line speed makes him a legitimate breakaway threat anytime he finds open field. Lowers his pads to create contact at the second level when seeing defenders coming straight-on. Usually switches the ball to his outside hand when cutting to his left side. Inconsistent power in his cuts, stops on a dime at times to allow defenders to run him by but will round on stretch plays or take a couple of steps to change directions.
Breaking tackles: Flashes the ability to keep his balance through arm tackles inside and run through high tackle attempts. Spins off tackles to free himself or at least extend for two extra yards. Good one-on-one stiff-arm and swipes away oncoming defenders with his off-arm. Gets tripped up too easily on first contact at times.
Blocking: Gives effort as a pass protector, could stay on the field on third downs in the NFL. Punches and extends when helping tackles double on the edge. Stands up against defenders attacking the pocket, usually effective cutting them down, and lays out to reach those coming from other side of formation. Lacks great strength, will be ripped off, but tries to get back into the play.
Receiving: Flashes quick feet and shimmy to leave linebackers in the dust as a route-runner. Threat to cut to either side or run down the seam when leaving the backfield. Fair hands, grabs screen passes in traffic and can extend to snare wide throws. Secures catch before trying to move upfield.Intangibles: Plays with a chip on his shoulder. Limited by left knee injury for parts of two games early in 2010, rallied his teammates on the sidelines. Ohio 400 meter champion as a senior in high school.

Chadman
04-08-2012, 09:42 AM
ROUND 3

MIKE MARTIN
NT MICHIGAN
6'1" 306lbs

469


Mike Martin makes it back on to Chadman's mock draft due to a few aspects- his familiarity with the 3-4 NT position, his high character, his work rate, his level of competition & because the Steelers, Mike Tomlin in particular, but him through a pretty hefty workout at his Pro Day. He's more your Chris Hoke than your Casey Hampton- he doesn't look like a guy that'll play a 350lbs in the future. In fact- he looks more like a condomn packed with walnuts- see below-

470

Jim Wexell has mentioned in the past that Mike Tomlin is more a fan of the quicker, more agile players on the DL- Martin is certainly that. What Martin isn't, however, is your classic Zero Technique, 2 Gap NT. He'll force the Steelers to use the DL players differently going forward as he simply doesn't carry the bulk to hold the point in Zero Technique.



A lifelong fan of the Wolverines, there was little doubt where the 2007 Michigan Gatorade Player of the Year would choose to matriculate. A four-star recruit by all of the major high school scouting services, Martin also won the Michigan Wrestling State Championship in his junior season (after having no prior wrestling experience), and broke T.J. Duckett's former Michigan high school shot put record on his way to a state championship.
Martin used that combination of strength and hand/foot control to earn Freshman All American honors after his first year in Ann Arbor. Appearing in 12 games as a reserve defender and on special teams, he made 20 tackles with 4.5 for loss and two sacks. He continued his development in 2009, starting all 12 games on the nose. He was credited with 51 tackles, 6.5 for loss and 2.0 sacks, and received the Richard Katcher Award as the team's best defensive lineman.
In his junior year, Martin won that prestigious award again, along with second-team All-Big Ten honors from league coaches, after he started 12 games, registering 37 tackles, six for loss and 2.5 sacks. He missed the Purdue Game on Nov. 13, 2010, due to an ankle injury that plagued him for the rest of the season.
Martin earned second-team All-Big Ten honors in 2011, racking up a career-high 54 tackles and three sacks to go along with six tackles for loss.
At 6-1, Martin is undersized height-wise, but he has a thick, compact build on his wrestler's frame. He fires off the snap with a relentless attitude and uses his low pad level and violent hands to tear through blockers.
Martin's long arms allow him to keep his opponents from grasping a firm hold of him. With good lateral agility, power and a relentless motor, Martin got the better of Ohio State's Michael Brewster, a possible top 100 pick, on numerous occasions during Senior Bowl practices.Martin is an undersized nose tackle with loads of experience in a 3-4 defense. But he lacks a consistent anchor against double teams and just does not have the right frame to be an NFL starter. Because of his ability to penetrate against one-on-one blocks, Martin could be a solid rotation player in a 4-3 scheme as a three-technique tackle and move to the nose on passing downs.



Pass rush: Provides some secondary interior pass rush, getting most penetration when playing three-technique. Possesses only adequate burst off the snap even when directly over the ball, and his initial pop leaves room to be desired. Hands could be much more violent when trying to gain control of the block. Can bull rush his way past running backs in pass protection. Preferred pass rush move is an arm-over swim move while simultaneously pulling lineman forward. Once momentum is stopped, lacks a critical counter move to progress into the backfield. Spies the quarterback if stoned at the line, but lacks the height and vertical to knock down passes.
Run defense: Uses more hustle than brute strength to stop the run. Gets skinny to split double teams, using good short-area quickness to make a play in the backfield. Runs the line very well, making plays on the ball when he beats blocks on the backside. Rarely goes to the ground, showing good balance from his high school wrestling days. Constantly moving his hands, readjusting them into proper placement. Occasionally too high (despite his short stature), and bows out his arms, hampering his ability to press and lock out. Does not hold his ground while facing a double team, first instinct is to roll away to make a play, which can create a large hole.
Explosion: Does not test offensive linemen with quickness or strong initial punch. Rarely first off the snap. Able to swim past single blockers to penetrate into the backfield. Does not attempt to split double-teams, takes a step back and waits to chase down plays.
Strength: Low center of gravity and generally low pad level allows him to play with initial strength and leverage at the point of attack. Upper-body only average, however, struggles to shed one-on-one blocks or sustain leverage once out of his stance. Pad level rises late in the game.
Tackling: Catch-and-drag tackler who rarely drives ballcarriers to the ground. Very good short-area quickness to make plays between the tackles. Displays agility and secure tackling to corral backs in the backfield, also chases plays from the backside to prevent cutbacks. Intangibles: High-motor, high-character leader. Worked at Ndamukong Suh's summer football camp. Played through two sprained ankles (Iowa, 10/16; Penn State 10/30), missed only Purdue (11/13). Won team's Richard Katcher award the past two seasons for being the team's best defensive lineman.

Chadman
04-08-2012, 09:52 AM
ROUND 4

EMMANUAL ACHO
ILB TEXAS
6'2" 238lbs

471

The Steelers converged, en masse, to the Texas Pro Day- as they seem to do every year. Think back, if you will, to last season. Mike Tomlin spent a long period of time chatting with Sam Acho at the Pro Day, which in itself means very little. However, Tomlin was reported to be enamoured with Acho's personality. Emmanual is, by all reports, a similar person. He might not be as exciting as some of the other options at ILB, but he's a smart player that knows his role, with excellent character, at a big school where we know the Steelers have visited for the Pro Day- that's a lot of ticked boxes.


Emmanuel had been in his brother Sam's shadow since high school, but with the former Texas defensive end in the National Football League (fourth-round pick in 2011), Emmanuel got his chance to shine for the Longhorns in 2011, when he was named first-team All-Big 12 with a team-best 131 tackles, including 19 for loss, three sacks and 18 quarterback pressure.
Acho has the same strong character and production his brother did, and his athleticism and versatility should make him a mid-round pick for 4-3 teams as a chase, second-level defender. Multiple first-team Academic All-Big 12 selection. Missed three games due to knee injury in 2008. Had surgery on his hip before 2010 spring practice. Acho has the same strong character and production his brother did coming into last year's draft process, but Sam fell a bit in the draft because scouts weren't sure if his best NFL fit was as a 4-3 end or 3-4 linebacker. There's no question with Emmanuel, whose athleticism and versatility should make him a top 100 pick for 4-3 teams as a chase second-level defender.



Read & React: Intelligent player who can play mike linebacker despite his lack of size because of his instincts and ability to find the ball in traffic. Reads quarterbacks' eyes and reacts quickly to targets in zone coverage.
Run defense: Best on the edge, bends around the tackle to stop backs before they get to the hole, forces off-tackle plays inside, and uses his speed to cut off plays to the sideline. Wiggles through creases to find the ball inside, though, and can stand up backs in the hole. Often avoids lineman blocks to survive between the tackles, which gives backs running lanes, but will stiff-arm lineman to stay free on some plays.
Pass defense: Athletic enough to stay with running backs out of the backfield, though he will jump at hesitation routes. Lines up against slot receivers, needs to get a hand on them at the line to keep up down the seam. Knocks receivers running crosses off their route within five-yard area. Adept at knocking down passes with good hand-eye coordination but needs to create the turnover more often. Caught with the eyes in the backfield at times, has recovery speed to get back into plays in the flat if a step late. Drops into zones while keeping an eye on underneath routes, also aware of crossers behind him.
Tackling: Reliable open field tackler, wrapping up ballcarriers and at times throwing them to the ground with aggression. Adds himself to piles and churns his legs to push back ballcarriers from getting the extra yard. Strong backs can run through his tackle attempts, though, if he's not in position. Occasionally overruns plays due to aggressive nature.
Pass Rush/Blitz: Displays some ability here, though he's not regularly used in this capacity. Closes quickly off the edge and is reliable in wrapping up quarterbacks in the backfield. Hesitates when facing running back blocks, tries to shimmy past instead of exploding into them or moving the blocker with his hands.Intangibles: Excellent character and work ethic. Multiple first-team Academic All-Big 12 selections. Parents born in Nigeria. His middle name, Cinedum, means "God guides me." Missed three games due to knee injury in 2008. Had surgery on his hip before spring 2010 practices.

Chadman
04-08-2012, 10:00 AM
ROUND 5

T.Y. HILTON
WR FLORIDA INTERNATIONAL
5'10" 183lbs

472

This is the sort of player the Steelers could add as a slot WR, or just a situational guy if needed, that puts enough fear into the Defense that they need to account for him. The Steelers have shown some interest & have had him in for a visit.


Release: Good quickness off the line, eats up cushion against overmatched safeties and slower corners from the slot and can throttle down when necessary. Rarely gets challenged in press, will need to prove he can shake and make the crisp cut to free himself from the jam.
Hands: Very good hands, accepts the ball fluidly on most throws and is ready to make a play afterwards. Extends for throws, looks the ball all the way in. Makes catches in traffic, even going up over taller defenders with vertical and toughness. Tracks the ball over his shoulder. Competitive player who takes the occasional drop very hard.
Route running: Flashes the foot quickness and toughness to handle slot duties at the next level. Lines up all over the field, in the slot, outside, put into motion. Agile enough to avoid linebackers to find soft spots in zones, understands spacing to make himself available. Makes strong cuts but also extends his arm to create separation when heading downfield. Stems his routes, only drifting inside to set up defender on out cut. Can threaten the seam with speed on verticals. Will take an extra step before making the right-angle cut over the middle. NFL defenders may be able to knock him off his route because of his slight frame.
After the catch: Dangerous with the ball in his hands. Combines speed, balance, quickness, vision and crisp cuts to leave defensive backs and linebackers in the dust. Spins off or jumps through arm tackles, maintains downfield vision to set up next defender. Runs the Wildcat formation, usually in the red zone, as the team's biggest offensive weapon. Elite quickness and elusiveness in the open field as a returner; flies through creases and runs through arm tackles. Does not transfer ball to outside hand consistently. Stronger defenders can rip the ball from his hands.
Blocking: Willing to take larger defenders head on despite his wiry frame. Gives great effort downfield to allow teammates running lanes, punching his man or grabbing the numbers to sustain. Hits multiple targets. Effective cut blocker in space, slows or stops his man from going forward to enter the play. Stronger defenders can push him to the ground when ready to be physical.Intangibles: Strong family connections, work ethic and character. Parents were exceptional athletes. Stayed in school for senior season to graduate. Nicknamed "Good-Bye" for his speed. Has son, Eugene, Jr., with long-time girlfriend/fiance.

Chadman
04-08-2012, 10:10 AM
ROUND 6

RYAN VAN BERGEN
DE MICHIGAN
6'5" 290lbs

473

Whie the Steelers were working out Mike Martin, they were also working out Van Bergen, who has ideal size to play the 3-4 DE role. The Steelers have looked at multiple guys that can play 3-4 DE, so Chadman expects a selection in this draft for the position.

Despite leading Michigan in both tackles for loss (12.5) and sacks last year (5.5), Ryan Van Bergen didn't receive an invitation to the NFL Combine last month. He bounced between defensive end and defensive tackle over his career as the Wolverines changed schemes and coaches. But regardless of where he lined up on the field, Van Bergen was always moving at full-go and that intensity was on display Thursday during Michigan's Pro Day in Ann Arbor. Van Bergen, who weighed in a 291 pounds, ran a 4.90 40-yard dash and put up 31 reps of 225 pounds on the bench press. He suffered a right foot injury in the Sugar Bowl in January and has been feverishly rehabbing to work out for NFL teams

Chadman
04-08-2012, 10:24 AM
ROUND 7

A)
BUDDY JACKSON
CB PITTSBURGH
6'0" 187lbs

474

B)
BRODERICK BINNS
OLB IOWA
6'1" 261lbs

475

C)
JOHN CULLEN
OT UTAH
6'5" 297lbs

476


D)
SEAN CATTOUSE
SS CALIFORNIA
6'2" 211lbs

477

RuthlessBurgher
04-08-2012, 07:46 PM
he looks more like a condomn packed with walnuts

Just imagine if we draft "Massive Brilliance" and the "Condom Packed With Walnuts" in the same draft...:p

Oviedo
04-09-2012, 07:58 AM
Very nice Chadman. I am also starting to see Zeitler as a Round 1 possibility. Not sure they wait as long as you do to get that second Offensive Lineman. I think Round 3 or 4 would be more appropriate but excellent effort.

Chadman
04-14-2012, 11:14 AM
Chadman's final mock will be coming soon, after we see who the Steelers have brought through the doors for the interviews.

Anyone else find it interesting just how many OLB types the Steelers are looking at? And not all late-round guys- Upshaw, Perry, Irvin...

Chadman
04-16-2012, 10:35 PM
The official Pre-Draft visit list now looks like this-
QB- 0
RB- 2 Isiah Pead (Cincinnati), LaMichael James (Oregon)
WR- 3 Toney Clemons (Colorado), T.Y. Hilton (Florida International), Keshawn Martin (Michigan State)
TE- 3 Micheal Egnew (Missouri), David Paulson (Oregon), Ladarius Green (LA Lafayette)
OL- 5 OG Lucas Nix (Pittsburgh), OT Mike Adams (Ohio St), OG Brandon Brooks (Miami of Ohio), OT Bobby Massie (Missouri), OG Amini Silatolu (Midwestern St)
DL- 5 Chas Alecxih (3-4 DE Pittsburgh), Derrick Wolfe (3-4 DE Cincinnati), Akiem Hicks (3-4 DE Regina), Hebron Fangupo (NT BYU), John Hughes (NT Cincinnati)
OLB- 7 Brandon Lindsay (Pittsburgh), Jerrel Harris (Alabama), Cam Johnson (Virginia), Olivier Vernon (Miami), Nick Perry (USC), Andre Branch (Clemson), Greg Williams (Pittsburgh)
ILB- 3 Max Gruder (Pittsburgh), Mychal Kendricks (California), Dont'a Hightower (Alabama)
CB- 2 Antwuan Reed (Pittsburgh), Keith Tandy (West Virginia)
S- 1 Jeremy Jones (Weber St)

That's 25 players when you exclude the locals...

Chadman
04-16-2012, 11:03 PM
A few other names that the Steelers have been associated with in terms to Pro Days/Interest include:

OLB Bruce Irvin West Virginia (Combine/Pro Day links)
OLB Shea McLellin Boise St (Combine link)
CB Ron Brooks LSU (Pro Day link)
CB Buddy Jackson Pittsburgh (Pro Day link)
OLB Courtney Upshaw Alabama (Not confirmed visit as yet)
OLB Broderick Binns Iowa (Pro Day link)
NT Jerrel Worthy Michigan St (Pro Day link- worked out by Tomlin)
NT/DE Devon Still Penn St (Combine Interview/ Pro Day link- worked out by Tomlin)
NT Mike Martin Michigan (Pro Day link- worked out by Tomlin)
DE Kheeston Randall (Pro Day link- worked out by Mean Joe Green)
DE Ryan Van Bergen Michigan (Pro Day link- worked out by Tomlin)
FS Trenton Robinson Michigan St (Pro Day link)
OG Kevin Zeitler Wisconsin (Pro Day link)
OG Brandon Washington Miami (Pro Day link)
OT Jonathon Martin Stanford (Unconfirmed visit)
QB Kirk Cousins Michigan St (Pro Day link)
RB Lamar Miller Miami (Pro Day link)
RB Edwin Baker Michigan St (Pro Day link)
TE Chase Ford Miami (Pro Day link)
WR Tommy Streeter Miami (Pro Day link)
WR Derrick Moye Penn St (Pro Day link- Todd Haley in attendance)

focosteeler
04-16-2012, 11:07 PM
The official Pre-Draft visit list now looks like this-
QB- 0
RB- 2 Isiah Pead (Cincinnati), LaMichael James (Oregon)
WR- 3 Toney Clemons (Colorado), T.Y. Hilton (Florida International), Keshawn Martin (Michigan State)
TE- 3 Micheal Egnew (Missouri), David Paulson (Oregon), Ladarius Green (LA Lafayette)
OL- 5 OG Lucas Nix (Pittsburgh), OT Mike Adams (Ohio St), OG Brandon Brooks (Miami of Ohio), OT Bobby Massie (Missouri), OG Amini Silatolu (Midwestern St)
DL- 5 Chas Alecxih (3-4 DE Pittsburgh), Derrick Wolfe (3-4 DE Cincinnati), Akiem Hicks (3-4 DE Regina), Hebron Fangupo (NT BYU), John Hughes (NT Cincinnati)
OLB- 7 Brandon Lindsay (Pittsburgh), Jerrel Harris (Alabama), Cam Johnson (Virginia), Olivier Vernon (Miami), Nick Perry (USC), Andre Branch (Clemson), Greg Williams (Pittsburgh)
ILB- 3 Max Gruder (Pittsburgh), Mychal Kendricks (California), Dont'a Hightower (Alabama)
CB- 2 Antwuan Reed (Pittsburgh), Keith Tandy (West Virginia)
S- 1 Jeremy Jones (Weber St)

That's 25 players when you exclude the locals...

if my math and research is right....

out of all the players we brough in for a visit in 2009, we drafted 3

out of all the players we brough in for a visit in 2010, we drafted 3

out of all the players we brough in for a visit in 2011, we drafted 4, with 2 additional free agents.

Chadman
04-18-2012, 12:11 AM
The official Pre-Draft visit list now looks like this-
QB- 0
RB- 2 Isiah Pead (Cincinnati), LaMichael James (Oregon)
WR- 4 Toney Clemons (Colorado), T.Y. Hilton (Florida International), Keshawn Martin (Michigan State), Stephen Hill (Georgia)
TE- 3 Micheal Egnew (Missouri), David Paulson (Oregon), Ladarius Green (LA Lafayette)
OL- 6 OG Lucas Nix (Pittsburgh), OT Mike Adams (Ohio St), OG Brandon Brooks (Miami of Ohio), OT Bobby Massie (Missouri), OG Amini Silatolu (Midwestern St), OT Mitchell Schwartz (California)
DL- 5 Chas Alecxih (3-4 DE Pittsburgh), Derrick Wolfe (3-4 DE Cincinnati), Akiem Hicks (3-4 DE Regina), Hebron Fangupo (NT BYU), John Hughes (NT Cincinnati)
OLB- 7 Brandon Lindsay (Pittsburgh), Jerrel Harris (Alabama), Cam Johnson (Virginia), Olivier Vernon (Miami), Nick Perry (USC), Andre Branch (Clemson), Greg Williams (Pittsburgh)
ILB- 3 Max Gruder (Pittsburgh), Mychal Kendricks (California), Dont'a Hightower (Alabama)
CB- 2 Antwuan Reed (Pittsburgh), Keith Tandy (West Virginia)
S- 1 Jeremy Jones (Weber St)

That's 27 players when you exclude the locals...

Chadman
04-18-2012, 03:28 AM
Next thing to do is to decide on the 23 most likely players to be gone by the time the Steelrs pick- leaving us with the most likely players left to choose from at #24...

In no team pick order, just a player value/likely picked by #24 type order:

1-18
QB Andrew Luck
QB Robert Griffin III
OT Matt Kalil
OG David DeCastro
QB Ryan Tannehill
RB Trent Richardson
CB Morris Claiborne
WR Justin Blackmon
WR Michael Floyd
OT Reilly Reiff
DT Fletcher Cox
LB Luke Keuchley
OLB Melvin Ingram
DE Quinton Coples
CB Dre Kirkpatrick
OLB Courtney Upshaw
DT Michael Brockers
CB Stephon Gilmore

18-33 (The Floaters)
DT Dontari Poe
OT Jonathon Martin
OG Cordy Glenn
LB Donta Hightower
SS Mark Barron
WR Kendall Wright
OT Mike Adams
OLB Whitney Mercilus
WR Stephen Hill
OLB Nick Perry
OC Peter Konz
OLB Andre Branch
DT Devon Still
DT Jerrel Worthy
TE Coby Fleener
CB Janoris Jenkins
OG Kevin Zeitler
WR Reuben Randle
LB Shea McLellin


Players in RED Chadman considers risks. Players in GREEN are unlikely. PURPLE means a slight reach. ORANGE presents decent value.

BLUE, of course, are BLUE CHIP types, and the most likely to be Steeler selections.

Chadman
04-18-2012, 05:47 PM
The official Pre-Draft visit list now looks like this-
QB- 0
RB- 2 Isiah Pead (Cincinnati), LaMichael James (Oregon)
WR- 5 Toney Clemons (Colorado), T.Y. Hilton (Florida International), Keshawn Martin (Michigan State), Stephen Hill (Georgia), Greg Childs (Arkansas)
TE- 4 Micheal Egnew (Missouri), David Paulson (Oregon), Ladarius Green (LA Lafayette) Adrein Robinson (Cincinnati)
OL- 6 OG Lucas Nix (Pittsburgh), OT Mike Adams (Ohio St), OG Brandon Brooks (Miami of Ohio), OT Bobby Massie (Missouri), OG Amini Silatolu (Midwestern St), OT Mitchell Schwartz (California), Kelvin Beachem (SMU)
DL- 6 Chas Alecxih (3-4 DE Pittsburgh), Derrick Wolfe (3-4 DE Cincinnati), Akiem Hicks (3-4 DE Regina), Hebron Fangupo (NT BYU), John Hughes (NT Cincinnati), Dontari Poe (Memphis)
OLB- 7 Brandon Lindsay (Pittsburgh), Jerrel Harris (Alabama), Cam Johnson (Virginia), Olivier Vernon (Miami), Nick Perry (USC), Andre Branch (Clemson), Greg Williams (Pittsburgh)
ILB- 3 Max Gruder (Pittsburgh), Mychal Kendricks (California), Dont'a Hightower (Alabama)
CB- 2 Antwuan Reed (Pittsburgh), Keith Tandy (West Virginia)
S- 1 Jeremy Jones (Weber St)

That's 31 players when you exclude the locals... did Chadman count wrong?

Chadman
04-18-2012, 05:53 PM
Wait...does Mike Adams count?

RuthlessBurgher
04-18-2012, 07:31 PM
Wait...does Mike Adams count?

Toney Clemons might not count (even though he went to school in Colorado), because they mention that he is from the Pittsburgh area (went to a local high school). Not sure if that's how it works, but maybe.

Chadman
04-20-2012, 12:19 AM
Ladies & Gentlemen, boys & girls- Chadman presents to you the final 2012 Chadman Mock Draft, this time using bits & pieces of information gathered over the last few weeks, history as we've discussed on this thread numerous times & a little bit of guess power.

It won't please everyone. Steelers drafts never do anyway. But it'll be Chadman's best guess at the direction the Steelers will be going in a week's time.

The players might be different come draft day, the rounds selected might be different too. But Chadman is moderately confident he'll be on the right path at least.


Here we go....

Chadman
04-20-2012, 12:50 AM
ROUND 1

PETER KONZ OC/OG
WISCONSIN
6'5" 314lbs

509

OK- so WHY Peter Konz?

Firstly, the easy one- Kevin Colbert has attended the Wisconsin Pro Day, so we know that the Steelers had representation there. This is always important because we know the Steelers will have cross-checked everything on their potential 1st round pick.

Secondly, he fits the College conference requirements, being a player from the BIG-10.

Third- he plays a position of need, well, interior OL anyway, while presenting better value than his Wisconsin mate Kevin Zeitler, who is really a 2nd round guy. So he's not a reach.

Fourth- High character, intelligent, college production of note.

Now we get a few sneaky reasons-

Fifth- the Steelers have had reported interest in both Jerel Worthy & Devon Still- 2 guys that reports suggest Konz & Zeitler played their best games against.

Sixth- The Ravens are reported to be interested in Konz too, so having NOT brought in Konz is a smart move- not tipping the Ravens off early & giving them reason to look to trade up.

Seventh- The report now that Mike Adams failed his drug test probably pushes him out of Round 1, raising the draft value of both Jonathan Martin & Cordy Glenn- 2 other players the Steelers could have looked at with #24. This makes selecting those 2 guys very difficult without trading up.

Konz makes sense, and is an instant upgrade at LG.


Pass blocking: Possesses a solidly-built frame with a filled-out body and solid muscle definition. Naturally wide base off the snap. Does a nice job sinking his hips and playing with consistent pad level, sitting in his stance with steady balance. Shoots his hands into defenders with very good placement, flashing strong hands to sustain blocks for an extended period of time. Taller for the center position and will allow his upper body to get high at times. Understands blocking angles.
Run blocking: A physical run blocker with raw power and strength at the point of attack. Gets very good initial push off the snap. Does a nice job with body positioning, walling off defenders to seal run lanes. Not a quick-twitch mover and looks a tad uncoordinated in tight spaces.
Pulling/trapping: Athletic and mobile, blocking well in space and pulling towards either sideline. Shows natural instincts with a very good feel for the position, keeping his eyes elevated and always looking for someone to block.
Initial Quickness: Sets up quickly and gets into his stance in a flash. Stout and aggressive at the point of attack and is tough to move because he plays with such good leverage -- sticky blocker. Konz is a bit stiff in his core and struggles to quickly redirect. Not naturally explosive.
Downfield: Rangy blocker with the foot quickness to cover a lot of ground and easily get to the second level. Takes on defenders with toughness and aggression, looking to finish and dominate. Intangibles: Intelligent with strong football character, working hard on and off the field. Has good starting experience with 30 career starts at center over the past three seasons. Offers some versatility with the skill-set to line up at other offensive line spots. Has strong durability concerns, missing time each of the past three seasons with various injuries -- missed three games towards the end of 2011, including the Big Ten Championship Game, with a left ankle injury.

Chadman
04-20-2012, 01:07 AM
ROUND 2

LAMAR MILLER RB
MIAMI
5'11" 212lbs

510


The Steelers have had Isiaih Pead & LeMicheal James in for talks, but they also attended the Miami Pro-Day en masse, including sending Todd Haley along. Why is that important? Because Haley has a habit of making pass-catching RB's effective. The Steelers have no proven RB ready to start the season with Mendenhall recovering from his ACL injury. Miller could, realistically, contribute as a split carry RB with Redman almost instantly, as well as giving Haley his pass catching RB. Miller is similar to Jamaal Charles at KC.


Inside: Balanced athlete with dynamic start/stop ability and smooth change-of-direction skills to stay patient before bursting upfield. Has very good vision and cutback ability, doing a nice job finding the run lanes. Follows his blocks and stays patient behind the line of scrimmage. Not overly explosive and goes down too easily, struggling to create on his own. Too patient at times and looks indecisive - questionable feel and instincts between the tackles. Freelances a lot and needs to allow the designed play to develop. Relies too much on the big play and needs to learn to be content with positive gains.
Outside: Accelerates and gets to top speed quickly when he sees daylight. Has nimble feet to make defenders miss and shows an extra gear to run away from them as well. Very good at forcing defenders to take poor angles with his lateral quickness and natural burst. Fast through the hole and a home run threat. Looks most comfortable on the outside and in space.
Breaking tackles: An upright runner with a narrow frame -- won't break many tackles. Has improved body strength and stays coordinated through contact -- runs hard and fights for every yard. Lacks much strength to power through tackles and doesn't have the body type to withstand a heavy beating. Suspect ball security and tends to wear down over the course of a game.
Blocking: Wasn't asked to stay in the pocket much as a pass protector and needs extensive technique work in this area.
Receiving: Effective pass catcher with good ball skills and body control to make tough grabs. Had only 28 catches over his collegiate career and has limited experience in this area. Intangibles: Has experience as a return man on kickoffs with 15 returns for 376 yards (25.1-yard average) and one touchdown in his career. Good production but suspect durability, playing most of the past season with a shoulder issue and will struggle with injuries. Started the 2011 season with five straight 100-yard games, but finished with just two in the final seven games. Lacks the size to be a bell-cow back. Still growing at the position and is not yet a finished product -- will he put in the necessary work to reach his potential?

Chadman
04-20-2012, 01:13 AM
ROUND 3


JOSH CHAPMAN NT
ALABAMA
6'1" 319lbs

511


It's entirely possible a trade-up may be required here as nearly every 3-4 team will think "we could just grab Chapman in Round 3..".

This is a guy that just plays 3-4 NT, and plays it well. Won't wow you, but will allow the LB's to wow you by doing his job.

Kevin Colbert has been in attendance to both Alabama Pro Days.




Pass rush: Possesses at least average burst off the snap, but lacks the lateral agility and closing speed to be a consistent pass rush threat at the NFL level. Uses his excellent weight room strength to shove his opponent upfield and can disengage with quick hands and a reasonably effective swim move (either arm). Good effort.
Run defense: Clearly his best trait. Has a short, stumpy build so he typically wins the leverage battle. When he does so, Chapman can be tough to move, even showing the ability to handle double-teams. Excellent weight room strength translates well onto the field. Good stack and shed defender. Alert defender who recognizes the trap block and possesses enough quickness to beat his opponent to the spot. Lacks the sustained speed to chase down ball-carriers, but puts good effort into his lateral pursuit.
Explosion: Has an explosive initial punch to push the offensive lineman back onto his heels. Can generate a big hit when he gets moving. Not an explosive athlete, overall, despite his gaudy weight room numbers.
Strength: Violent hands and good upper body strength to hold up inside versus the run. Flashes some explosiveness as a hitter. Can rag doll ball-carriers, tossing them to the ground easily.
Tackling: An effective drag down tackler due to his upper body strength. Lacks the lateral agility and balance to handle quick ball-carriers in open spaces. Appears to have only average arm length. As such, ball-carriers too often are able to shield him with a stiff-arm and run away from him. Shows good effort in lateral pursuit to the tackle box, but tires quickly and doesn't show enough effort to follow downfield. Intangibles: Has struggled with conditioning at times over his career. Possesses a good motor, however, and will pursue to the sideline and downfield. Possesses excellent weight room strength. Was the team's strongest player as early as his redshirt freshman season, owning a 480 pound bench press in 2008. He left Alabama benching closer to 580 pounds, according to the Alabama strength and conditioning staff and has a 630-pound squat when healthy. Played most of the 2011 season with a torn ACL which required postseason surgery.

Chadman
04-20-2012, 05:53 AM
ROUND 4


KEITH TANDY CB/FS
WEST VIRGINIA
5'10" 202lbs

512

Why Tandy here? Well, the Steelers need a FS of the future- fast. Ryan Clark is 32, and he can't play in Denver. We start our season in Denver. Not suggesting Tandy starts Day 1, but the fact that this means Ryan Mundy will be starting game 1 shows the need for some quality young depth coming through to take the position down the line. Tandy was a CB in college, but Chadman suggests he might prove to be a good FS. This is possibly a round early for Tandy- but with that said, pretty sure he's visited all 32 NFL teams this off season...at least, it seems that way everytime Chadman goes to KFFL.com & sees updates with Keith Tandy every day..


Positives: Best fit is in a zone scheme and lacks the vertical speed to shadow elite receivers. Keeps the ball and man in front of him in zone and might be a candidate to convert to safety. Thickly built for a corner and closes with intent, chasing laterally and is effective bringing down bigger targets. Negatives: Zone-specific prospect who is likely only a fit in nickel or dime packages with predominantly man-to-man teams. Not consistent with his footwork, is a bit choppy in transition and is slow to find the ball on deep routes.

Chadman
04-20-2012, 06:02 AM
ROUND 5


TONEY CLEMONS WR
COLORADO
6'2" 210lbs

513


The Steelers have a very promising WR group, but they lack 1 thing- a physical, 'big' WR. This is where Clemons fits. A big, fast guy that can get open, he wouldn't be expected to see much playing time right away, but with contracts running out in the next 2 years for our 3 stud young WR's- Wallace, Brown & Sanders- it can't hurt to have a guy backing them up that can play the role when required. Wasn't the last Colorado WR we got Charles Johnson? If he could be half the player Johnson was in this round, he's a bargain.

Pro days can lead to pay days in the NFL. One head-turning performance by a college standout can draw that fine line between the beginnings of a pro career and selling insurance for a living. Valley grad Toney Clemons had one of those attention-grabbing pro days earlier this month in Boulder, Colo., and it could have unlocked a door into the NFL. "It came down to 80 yards," said Clemons, a 6-foot-2, 210-pound wide receiver who wasn't invited to the NFL Scouting Combine but played in a senior all-star game in Arkansas. "Two 40 (-yard dashes). I had a quiet confidence and was ready to compete that day." The Colorado grad blistered the 40-yard dash in 4.36 seconds -- the fastest 40 time in the former track star's career. "Officially, it's the fastest," said Clemons, 23. "You have some great athletes running the 10 split in 1.50 or 1.49. I did it in 1.47. You want to be able to perform when it counts most." "I have the draftable grades," Clemons said. "To be picked would be a great thing. I feel I have done what I needed to do. It's incredible to be in a position where I once saw myself getting to."

Chadman
04-20-2012, 06:08 AM
ROUND 6


KELVIN BEACHUM OT/OG
SOUTHERN METHODIST
6'3" 302lbs

514


Beachum comes from the same school as Manny Sanders, and has been a productive player for a number of years at LT for SMU. He probably doesn't have the skills to stay at LT, but he could be our next "Trai Essex" and be able to play a number of positions- a valuabe guy to have dressed on gameday.

Beachum is an undersized offensive tackle from SMU who started every game in his career after redshirting as a freshman. He is undersized for the position in the NFL, but he improved steadily throughout his career and displays the level of athletic ability, body control and footwork to be drafted in the late rounds of the draft. Beachum has significant strength deficiencies which are constantly evident in his play. His ability to physically develop within an NFL program in his first year will likely be the driving force of his football future.
AnalysisStrengths Beachum is very quick off the ball and has an obvious sense of urgency to his play. He has a good first step to get out in front and gain position. When working up field, he has very impressive short area quickness and footwork. He is able to throttle down his weight instantly to fit on moving linebackers, and he really impressed in the limited exposure he had working in space while playing tackle. Beachum shows smooth, controlled lateral agility when engaging his pass set. Weaknesses Beachum is a soft prospect after putting four years on film. Although he comes off the ball and moves quickly, he is a non-explosive type who struggles to generate push on his man off the snap. He struggles in the run blocking game, which doesn't bode well for his development and projected move inside to guard. He didn't get many opportunities to showcase classic run blocking within SMU's scheme, and for NFL teams it will be somewhat of a crap shoot in terms of projecting his ability to effectively move to guard. Kelvin is a mirror and patty cake blocker who was effective and productive at SMU, but he has questionable NFL-transferable skills.

Chadman
04-20-2012, 06:29 AM
ROUND 7

A)
JERRELL HARRIS OLB
ALABAMA
6'2" 239lbs

515

B)
AKIEM HICKS DE
REGINA
6'5" 318lbs

516


C)
RYAN VAN BERGEN DE
MICHIGAN
6'5" 290lbs

517


D)
BRODERICK BINNS OLB
IOWA
6'0" 258lbs

518

Oviedo
04-20-2012, 07:58 AM
Chadman--great effort. You focus on the OL first which is what we need to do instead of continuing to invest in defense and then complaining about the offense. Your selections are well balanced between the offense and defense.

The one problem is that you got the wrong Wisconsin OL. Zeitler is more of a sure thing. Konz has had far more injury issues in college than Zeitler. I keep hearing that he is a Round 2 pick...BS. He will be the highest rated Guard available when we draft at #24. We need to improve both OG positions significantly. He should be the pick.

In a perfect world we trade down some and get additional picks and still get Zeitler, but Zeitler is the right answer for us if guys like Martin and Glenn are gone.

Chadman
04-21-2012, 11:03 AM
Chadman--great effort. You focus on the OL first which is what we need to do instead of continuing to invest in defense and then complaining about the offense. Your selections are well balanced between the offense and defense.

The one problem is that you got the wrong Wisconsin OL. Zeitler is more of a sure thing. Konz has had far more injury issues in college than Zeitler. I keep hearing that he is a Round 2 pick...BS. He will be the highest rated Guard available when we draft at #24. We need to improve both OG positions significantly. He should be the pick.

In a perfect world we trade down some and get additional picks and still get Zeitler, but Zeitler is the right answer for us if guys like Martin and Glenn are gone.

As you know Ovi, Chadman has no problem with Zeitler as the pick- but curious- why do rate Zeitler ahead of Konz? Every report is very positive on Konz- and unlike Zeitler, he is generally referred to as a 1st round quality player. The big selling point for Chadman (that he now realises he left out) is that Konz is a junior- and we know that Tomlin & Colbert value juniors coming out of college.

Also- in the Defense/Offense 1st round pick rotation, it's the Offenses turn this year. Another reason Chadman forgot to add.

Oh- and position flexibility...we know the Steelers like that too...geez- Chadman's memory is playing up...