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View Full Version : much blame to go around BUT..



Starlifter
01-08-2012, 10:44 PM
I'm sorry, this falls squarely on Arians and Lebeau.

now I know there will be some who say:

1. overreacting.
2. spoiled
3. players gotta play
4. injuries etc....

those are just excuses.

Ben is clearly hobbled, we're never more than 2 scores down and running effectively - so let's keep throwing.

Bill Cowher says at half our offense is built around Ben's ability to scramble and extend plays. I can't think of a greater indictment of BA's ability. Really? the whole point of all your X's and O's is to let ben and the receivers play street ball and make plays? Ben is off his game and our offense collapses. GB sits out aaron rodgers and plugs the backup into THEIR system and he throws for over 400 yards.

Is there any doubt about the reason no other teams covet arians?

having said all that - we had the game tied.

Ike is getting torched all game and Lebeau completely sells out to stop the run back at the 20 putting Ike (again) man to man and Mundy oversells the blitz and takes himself out of position. game over.

Back to Ike. If your top guy is struggling to cover one on one - can we not give the brother a little help?

Poor game plans and lack of adjustments are the main reason we lost. yes, the players made some poor plays - just ask wallace, but I really think it's time for Tomlin to seriously consider what direction he wants to take these units.

Tim Tebow - 10 completions for 318. that says it all.

Summing up the season - the Steelers really only had 3 complete games (seahawks, pats, and bungles at home). We allowed curtis painter to look like a pro-bowler and needed tyler palko to throw multiple picks so we could eeek one out. The ravens built their team to overcome us and sure enough we gave them 92 yards to put a stranglehold on the division.

The playoffs worked as they should. all wildcard teams lost. winning the division and playing at home should mean something. it clearly did this year.

we still have an excellent team. I think we need to address O-line and D-line. lack of pressure on opposing QB's, and too much pressure on Ben were weaknesses we simply couldn't keep overcoming.

While I'm extremely disappointed with this loss - I had no faith we were going to go into NE and beat the pats. Even if we made the SB - did anyone think we have the ability to: stop the packers/saints OR put up 35 to stay with them?


I took vacation to be available for every playoff game. what the heck do I do now????.............

Steelers>NFL
01-08-2012, 10:47 PM
I'm sorry, this falls squarely on Arians and Lebeau.

now I know there will be some who say:

1. overreacting.
2. spoiled
3. players gotta play
4. injuries etc....

those are just excuses.

Ben is clearly hobbled, we're never more than 2 scores down and running effectively - so let's keep throwing.

Bill Cowher says at half our offense is built around Ben's ability to scramble and extend plays. I can't think of a greater indictment of BA's ability. Really? the whole point of all your X's and O's is to let ben and the receivers play street ball and make plays? Ben is off his game and our offense collapses. GB sits out aaron rodgers and plugs the backup into THEIR system and he throws for over 400 yards.

Is there any doubt about the reason no other teams covet arians?

having said all that - we had the game tied.

Ike is getting torched all game and Lebeau completely sells out to stop the run back at the 20 putting Ike (again) man to man and Mundy oversells the blitz and takes himself out of position. game over.

Back to Ike. If your top guy is struggling to cover one on one - can we not give the brother a little help?

Poor game plans and lack of adjustments are the main reason we lost. yes, the players made some poor plays - just ask wallace, but I really think it's time for Tomlin to seriously consider what direction he wants to take these units.

Tim Tebow - 10 completions for 318. that says it all.

Summing up the season - the Steelers really only had 3 complete games (seahawks, pats, and bungles at home). We allowed curtis painter to look like a pro-bowler and needed tyler palko to throw multiple picks so we could eeek one out. The ravens built their team to overcome us and sure enough we gave them 92 yards to put a stranglehold on the division.

The playoffs worked as they should. all wildcard teams lost. winning the division and playing at home should mean something. it clearly did this year.

we still have an excellent team. I think we need to address O-line and D-line. lack of pressure on opposing QB's, and too much pressure on Ben were weaknesses we simply couldn't keep overcoming.

While I'm extremely disappointed with this loss - I had no faith we were going to go into NE and beat the pats. Even if we made the SB - did anyone think we have the ability to: stop the packers/saints OR put up 35 to stay with them?


I took vacation to be available for every playoff game. what the heck do I do now????.............
Good post.

Leper Friend
01-08-2012, 10:49 PM
I'm sorry, this falls squarely on Arians and Lebeau.

now I know there will be some who say:

1. overreacting.
2. spoiled
3. players gotta play
4. injuries etc....

those are just excuses.

Ben is clearly hobbled, we're never more than 2 scores down and running effectively - so let's keep throwing.

Bill Cowher says at half our offense is built around Ben's ability to scramble and extend plays. I can't think of a greater indictment of BA's ability. Really? the whole point of all your X's and O's is to let ben and the receivers play street ball and make plays? Ben is off his game and our offense collapses. GB sits out aaron rodgers and plugs the backup into THEIR system and he throws for over 400 yards.

Is there any doubt about the reason no other teams covet arians?

having said all that - we had the game tied.

Ike is getting torched all game and Lebeau completely sells out to stop the run back at the 20 putting Ike (again) man to man and Mundy oversells the blitz and takes himself out of position. game over.

Back to Ike. If your top guy is struggling to cover one on one - can we not give the brother a little help?

Poor game plans and lack of adjustments are the main reason we lost. yes, the players made some poor plays - just ask wallace, but I really think it's time for Tomlin to seriously consider what direction he wants to take these units.

Tim Tebow - 10 completions for 318. that says it all.

Summing up the season - the Steelers really only had 3 complete games (seahawks, pats, and bungles at home). We allowed curtis painter to look like a pro-bowler and needed tyler palko to throw multiple picks so we could eeek one out. The ravens built their team to overcome us and sure enough we gave them 92 yards to put a stranglehold on the division.

The playoffs worked as they should. all wildcard teams lost. winning the division and playing at home should mean something. it clearly did this year.

we still have an excellent team. I think we need to address O-line and D-line. lack of pressure on opposing QB's, and too much pressure on Ben were weaknesses we simply couldn't keep overcoming.

While I'm extremely disappointed with this loss - I had no faith we were going to go into NE and beat the pats. Even if we made the SB - did anyone think we have the ability to: stop the packers/saints OR put up 35 to stay with them?


I took vacation to be available for every playoff game. what the heck do I do now????.............
Good post.
Ditto.

You pretty much nailed it.I don't have to vent any longer because you made every one of my points.

I'm going to bed

Steelgal
01-08-2012, 10:51 PM
+1

Some also then has to go to Tomlin. He's allowing his coordinators to game plan this way and not asking them to make changes. Tomlin needs to assert more authority or be held accountable as well.

BradshawsHairdresser
01-08-2012, 10:56 PM
Agree with Starlifter.

As to Steelgal's post, if we bring in new coordinators, I believe we will see Tomlin
begin to assert more authority.

pick6
01-08-2012, 11:12 PM
Players gotta play. I dont know what the heck just happened.

mshifko
01-08-2012, 11:23 PM
Tough loss, but going cover 0 in OT with basically a 6-3 front is inexcusable

papillon
01-08-2012, 11:34 PM
Tough loss, but going cover 0 in OT with basically a 6-3 front is inexcusable

Yea, that was rather odd to be sure, they disrespected Tebow in the game plan and he made them pay. I doubt that ever happens again. All they had to do was play their base defense and they would have been fine. I didn't understand stacking the LOS like they did and giving all the potential big plays. The Steelers have tried to negate big plays forever, but, today, because they didn't think Tebow could hurt them they played out of character and got burned.

Pappy

sd steel
01-08-2012, 11:40 PM
Cotchery or Wallace make a catch and it's a different ball game. If we execute we don't give coaches chances to screw up. And how many times can Ben audible to a run play that loses yards?

TallyStiller
01-08-2012, 11:40 PM
Tremendous post. I salute you, sir. :moon :D

steelblood
01-09-2012, 09:28 AM
Ok. I'll defend the coordinators (to a degree).

LeBeau. If I told you on Saturday that the game plan was to sell out to stop the run and leave their receivers in press man on the outside forcing Tebow to make great downfield throws to beat us, most would probably be okay with that (especially if I told you that for them to beat us they'd have to burn Ike downfield several times).

Arians. We ran the ball well. There were two NEW(er) running plays in that game. There were very good opportunities (good play calls) left on the field (especially in the first half). Brown was badly held and interfered with leading to a FG. Wallace flat dropped a bomb and later couldn't beat a single DB in open field for a first down. There were two-to-three more bad drops. We could have easily scored 30 points in that game if we had executed well (even with a gimpy Ben, no Pouncey, no Mendenhall, Starks leaving the game, and Legursky playing with one arm). I thought the offensive game plan and play calling were generally good.

Now, I am in NO WAY, saying that we made great in game adjustments. LeBeau needed to leave at least a single high safety on that last series. That was terrible. Obviously, Ike was having trouble with Thomas and Gay can't run with Royal downfield. Arians had a few stinkers out there too.

SidSmythe
01-09-2012, 09:32 AM
Ok. I'll defend the coordinators (to a degree).

LeBeau. If I told you on Saturday that the game plan was to sell out to stop the run and leave their receivers in press man on the outside forcing Tebow to make great downfield throws to beat us, most would probably be okay with that (especially if I told you that for them to beat us they'd have to burn Ike downfield several times).

Arians. We ran the ball well. There were two NEW(er) running plays in that game. There were very good opportunities (good play calls) left on the field (especially in the first half). Brown was badly held and interfered with leading to a FG. Wallace flat dropped a bomb and later couldn't beat a single DB in open field for a first down. There were two-to-three more bad drops. We could have easily scored 30 points in that game if we had executed well (even with a gimpy Ben, no Pouncey, no Mendenhall, Starks leaving the game, and Legursky playing with one arm). I thought the offensive game plan and play calling were generally good.

Now, I am in NO WAY, saying that we made great in game adjustments. LeBeau needed to leave at least a single high safety on that last series. That was terrible. Obviously, Ike was having trouble with Thomas and Gay can't run with Royal downfield. Arians had a few stinkers out there too.

:Agree

except for the last play of the game :HeadBanger

papillon
01-09-2012, 09:41 AM
Ok. I'll defend the coordinators (to a degree).

LeBeau. If I told you on Saturday that the game plan was to sell out to stop the run and leave their receivers in press man on the outside forcing Tebow to make great downfield throws to beat us, most would probably be okay with that (especially if I told you that for them to beat us they'd have to burn Ike downfield several times).

Arians. We ran the ball well. There were two NEW(er) running plays in that game. There were very good opportunities (good play calls) left on the field (especially in the first half). Brown was badly held and interfered with leading to a FG. Wallace flat dropped a bomb and later couldn't beat a single DB in open field for a first down. There were two-to-three more bad drops. We could have easily scored 30 points in that game if we had executed well (even with a gimpy Ben, no Pouncey, no Mendenhall, Starks leaving the game, and Legursky playing with one arm). I thought the offensive game plan and play calling were generally good.

Now, I am in NO WAY, saying that we made great in game adjustments. LeBeau needed to leave at least a single high safety on that last series. That was terrible. Obviously, Ike was having trouble with Thomas and Gay can't run with Royal downfield. Arians had a few stinkers out there too.

Blood,

Be careful using rational thinking and logic, didn't you get the memo, hyperbole, knee jerk and irrational thinking are in order for the next week. You'll get banned if you try to be rational. :D

:tt2 :tt2

Pappy

Oviedo
01-09-2012, 09:47 AM
+1

Some also then has to go to Tomlin. He's allowing his coordinators to game plan this way and not asking them to make changes. Tomlin needs to assert more authority or be held accountable as well.

Exactly what I have been saying for over a year. LeBeau needs to go because it removes the awkward situation that Tomlin has by having a beloved "legend" on the staff. Arians needs to go because he has taken this offense as far as he is capable.

Tomlin needs to bring in his own people and move forward.

papillon
01-09-2012, 09:48 AM
+1

Some also then has to go to Tomlin. He's allowing his coordinators to game plan this way and not asking them to make changes. Tomlin needs to assert more authority or be held accountable as well.

Exactly what I have been saying for over a year. LeBeau needs to go because it removes the awkward situation that Tomlin has by having a beloved "legend" on the staff. Arians needs to go because he has taken this offense as far as he is capable.

Tomlin needs to bring in his own people and move forward.

Be careful what you ask for you may get it. If Lebeau and Arians walk away or are fired their replacements are on the staff right now.

Pappy

Steelgal
01-09-2012, 09:50 AM
+1

Some also then has to go to Tomlin. He's allowing his coordinators to game plan this way and not asking them to make changes. Tomlin needs to assert more authority or be held accountable as well.

Exactly what I have been saying for over a year. LeBeau needs to go because it removes the awkward situation that Tomlin has by having a beloved "legend" on the staff. Arians needs to go because he has taken this offense as far as he is capable.

Tomlin needs to bring in his own people and move forward.

Let's hope one of those people isn't Raheem Morris. Not impressed with his few years in Tampa.

ramblinjim
01-09-2012, 09:54 AM
Anytime you get beat by what I think we would all agree was an inferior team, there is some blame to go around. Some 'splainin to do. It's going to be a neat off season to see what happens with older guys like Ward, Farrior & Smitty and even some youngsters like Wallace (1st & 3rd tender?) etc.

It's going to be fun to see Brown work with a real off-season, Saunders made some nice catches yesterday too. Wallace, Brown, Saunders, Heath... Eh, not bad.

Hines Ward = Receivers coach.

Who's our backup quarterback going to be next year. Does Charlie keep hanging around?

feltdizz
01-09-2012, 10:22 AM
It's touching but sad when fans wonder if Smitty is returning. :wft

Starlifter
01-09-2012, 10:35 AM
Ok. I'll defend the coordinators (to a degree).

LeBeau. If I told you on Saturday that the game plan was to sell out to stop the run and leave their receivers in press man on the outside forcing Tebow to make great downfield throws to beat us, most would probably be okay with that (especially if I told you that for them to beat us they'd have to burn Ike downfield several times).


I agree with that and before the game expected that would indeed be the plan. After the 2nd quarter however I was really expecting we would go back to a more traditional balanced defense. Remember how lebeau is known for confusing rookie QB's? yeah, i know tebow is in his second year but this is his first year of playing. did he look confused? this was his first playoff game. It looked to me like he was extremely comfortable. That is a testament to tebow as a player - but it was disturbing to watch, and unexpected.

at least we didn't have to endure Kordell in the postgame saying the better team lost.

feltdizz
01-09-2012, 10:48 AM
Ok. I'll defend the coordinators (to a degree).

LeBeau. If I told you on Saturday that the game plan was to sell out to stop the run and leave their receivers in press man on the outside forcing Tebow to make great downfield throws to beat us, most would probably be okay with that (especially if I told you that for them to beat us they'd have to burn Ike downfield several times).


I agree with that and before the game expected that would indeed be the plan. After the 2nd quarter however I was really expecting we would go back to a more traditional balanced defense. Remember how lebeau is known for confusing rookie QB's? yeah, i know tebow is in his second year but this is his first year of playing. did he look confused? this was his first playoff game. It looked to me like he was extremely comfortable. That is a testament to tebow as a player - but it was disturbing to watch, and unexpected.

at least we didn't have to endure Kordell in the postgame saying the better team lost.

After he torched us we should have switched philosophies.. we played their game instead of making him play ours.

What happened to zone blitzing and confusing QB's?

Oviedo
01-09-2012, 11:40 AM
Ok. I'll defend the coordinators (to a degree).

LeBeau. If I told you on Saturday that the game plan was to sell out to stop the run and leave their receivers in press man on the outside forcing Tebow to make great downfield throws to beat us, most would probably be okay with that (especially if I told you that for them to beat us they'd have to burn Ike downfield several times).


I agree with that and before the game expected that would indeed be the plan. After the 2nd quarter however I was really expecting we would go back to a more traditional balanced defense. Remember how lebeau is known for confusing rookie QB's? yeah, i know tebow is in his second year but this is his first year of playing. did he look confused? this was his first playoff game. It looked to me like he was extremely comfortable. That is a testament to tebow as a player - but it was disturbing to watch, and unexpected.

at least we didn't have to endure Kordell in the postgame saying the better team lost.

After he torched us we should have switched philosophies.. we played their game instead of making him play ours.

What happened to zone blitzing and confusing QB's?

The only person confused yesterday was LeBeau. He forgot what a blitz was.

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
01-09-2012, 12:48 PM
LeBeau. If I told you on Saturday that the game plan was to sell out to stop the run and leave their receivers in press man on the outside forcing Tebow to make great downfield throws to beat us, most would probably be okay with that (especially if I told you that for them to beat us they'd have to burn Ike downfield several times).

I don't really have a stand one way or the other on the coordinators, I don't think that they are as bad as many, but also don't think that the blame always lies on the execution.

That being said, I agree that we go into this game with a gameplan stating that we force Tebow to beat us with his arm deep - good plan. But, over the course of four quarters he proved capable of doing just that. As we enter overtime we need to make an adjustment. There is no way that you enter OT with the same defensive mindset.

Ghost
01-09-2012, 12:59 PM
You almost never see this but in the Post Gazette today, Dulac gave the Coaching staff an F in his team grades:

The season ended the same way it began -- with a disjointed performance by the defense in which they were outexecuted, outperformed and outschemed by an 8-8 team

Read more: http://www.postgazette.com/pg/12009/120 ... z1iytYA8iy (http://www.postgazette.com/pg/12009/1202356-66-2.stm#ixzz1iytYA8iy)

LouSteel
01-09-2012, 02:38 PM
LeBeau. If I told you on Saturday that the game plan was to sell out to stop the run and leave their receivers in press man on the outside forcing Tebow to make great downfield throws to beat us, most would probably be okay with that (especially if I told you that for them to beat us they'd have to burn Ike downfield several times).

I don't really have a stand one way or the other on the coordinators, I don't think that they are as bad as many, but also don't think that the blame always lies on the execution.

That being said, I agree that we go into this game with a gameplan stating that we force Tebow to beat us with his arm deep - good plan. But, over the course of four quarters he proved capable of doing just that. As we enter overtime we need to make an adjustment. There is no way that you enter OT with the same defensive mindset.

See, that's it right there.

There must've been some adjustments at half time, because Tebow was pretty well contained. BUT THEN, it's like we forgot everything that we had seen, and Mundy/Troy end up 3 yards away from the LOS in OT.

There's no excuse for not keeping the safeties back, especially after watching Ike take a beating all game long