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flippy
12-02-2011, 12:45 PM
Given that we can't consistently run the ball, could we scrap the running game and just go 5 wide no huddle all the time?

And then maybe work in a couple draws to keep the defense honest, but only run 5-10 times/game?

anger 82&95
12-02-2011, 12:48 PM
Sorry, I had to modify your original question: "Could we scrap dancing around ineffectively in the backfield and just go 5 wide no huddle all the time?"

williar
12-02-2011, 01:02 PM
We should be running the same offense as GB and NO. I believe we have those caliber of weapons. Whatever we are doing now ain't workin'... Watching Mendenhall (aka the tiny dancer) run and spin around is painful. Never thought I'd long for the days of Willie Parker. And why didn't we trade for Marshawn Lynch when we had a chance. What did the seahawks give for him? a 4th or 5th rounder. That's the kind of running back I like...

Mister Pittsburgh
12-02-2011, 01:17 PM
We should be running the same offense as GB and NO. I believe we have those caliber of weapons. Whatever we are doing now ain't workin'... Watching Mendenhall (aka the tiny dancer) run and spin around is painful. Never thought I'd long for the days of Willie Parker. And why didn't we trade for Marshawn Lynch when we had a chance. What did the seahawks give for him? a 4th or 5th rounder. That's the kind of running back I like...

I would say we should be running the same offense that the Patriots did/do run and that the Saints run. We don't have the weapons Green Bay has. They can loft 10 throws a game 30 yards downfield because their WR are huge and physical and can outleap DB's to go up and catch the ball at its highest point.

Our WR are closer to NE type WR's where Wallace is like a Randy Moss type and the rest are more like Wes WElkers and Branch's. We have two pass catching TE's in Saunders and Heath like NE does. The only reason we beat NE this year is because we finally had the DB's to go man on them and give Brady fits finding an open WR until we got our LB's to him. Normally their offense was quick strikes tearing apart zone defenses because nobody could match up man. WEll, who can go man on Wallace, Brown, Sanders, Cotchery, Hines, Heath, Saunders?

By the way, F Mendenhall, he sucks. I see RB's at Div. II colleges running with more determination and fighting for that extra yard. This guy, if he does happen to turn the corner and rip off a 30 yard run, runs out of bounds to avoid contact instead of making it 35. As soon as someone gets in front of him he stops and tries to dance instead of trying to bowl that player over and pick up an extra 3 yards. He never picks a hole and goes. He tiptoes up to the hole then dances.

RuthlessBurgher
12-02-2011, 01:26 PM
We should be running the same offense as GB and NO. I believe we have those caliber of weapons. Whatever we are doing now ain't workin'... Watching Mendenhall (aka the tiny dancer) run and spin around is painful. Never thought I'd long for the days of Willie Parker. And why didn't we trade for Marshawn Lynch when we had a chance. What did the seahawks give for him? a 4th or 5th rounder. That's the kind of running back I like...

Lynch's off-the-field reputation wasn't exactly golden...


Sullivan: It's time for Lynch to depart
By Jerry Sullivan

Published:
January 10, 2010, 8:06 PM

The last time I saw Marshawn Lynch was on locker cleanout day, one week ago today. He was

sitting on a bench just outside the Bills dressing room, playing with a remote control car. As

I approached, the car flipped over on the practice turf. Lynch glared at me and asked if I

could turn the car back onto its wheels.

Laughing, I obliged. Imagine that, I thought, Lynch having a motor vehicle mishap in full

view of a media member. Somehow, I suspected that the irony of the moment was lost on him.

Trouble has a peculiar way of following this guy around. The latest revelations came on

Saturday, in a front-page Buffalo News story in which a Buffalo detective sergeant claimed

that Lynch had stolen $20 from his wife last month at a TGI Friday's in Hamburg.

It's unclear exactly what happened that day. Hamburg police are now saying the news account

wasn't consistent with their information. We might never find out if Lynch actually threatened

the woman or uttered the now-infamous words, "Do you know who I am?"

Lynch might be guilty of nothing worse than being a jerk and adding another chapter to his

legend of boorish behavior at Western New York bars. But I know this: It's always something

with Lynch. This isn't about $20. It's about an athlete whose behavior has gone over the line

time and again.

I stopped giving Lynch the benefit of the doubt last summer, after he pleaded guilty to gun

possession in L.A. That was nine months after the hit-and-run in downtown Buffalo. On the day

Lynch was playing with the toy car, the news broke that the Ontario woman who was struck in

that 2008 accident was suing.

Yes, it's a long list of indiscretions, including Lynch's charming custom of bringing his

own alcohol into bars. For every incident that became public, there's another that never saw

the light of day. As Hamburg police said after the hit-and-run on Chippewa, it was consistent

with a pattern of behavior since Lynch arrived in town in 2007.

Lynch has complained of being harassed by the cops. Apologists make him out to be a victim.

People are questioning the motives of the detective who filed the complaint. There's always

someone willing to defend Lynch because he came from a brutal section of Oakland.

That's an insult to every person who rose from difficult circumstances to became a decent,

law-abiding citizen. Pro sports are full of such men. It's too bad the goof-ups get most of

the attention.

Lynch isn't worth the trouble. He was on thin ice when he was starting. Now he's a backup.

You'd have expected him to come back newly motivated and on his best behavior in

public after his three-game suspension. Instead, he seemed slow and indifferent. Lynch

lost his job to Fred Jackson, a class act who worked his way from undrafted free agent to a

1,000-yard rushing season.

Jackson did it the hard way, laboring in the minor leagues before getting his chance. He

appreciates what it means to be a professional football player. Lynch takes it for granted.

The Bills handed him $10 million in guaranteed money when he came into the league and he acts

as if the world owes him still.

Three years later, Lynch is approaching bust status. People talk about Mike Williams and

Donte Whitner as dubious high draft picks by the Bills. But when you consider Lynch's

embarrassing off-field antics, and his current status as a backup, he might be an even bigger

mistake at No. 12 overall.

The Bills are evaluating their entire operation. They should take a long, hard look at

their troubled running back. Any serious evaluation of Lynch has to conclude that he's headed

for more trouble, and the worst might be yet to come.

Let it be elsewhere. Trade him, cut him, but get Lynch out of our town, before he does

something truly regrettable.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Why-the-Bills-should-dump-Marshawn-Lynch.html

RuthlessBurgher
12-02-2011, 01:29 PM
We should be running the same offense as GB and NO. I believe we have those caliber of weapons. Whatever we are doing now ain't workin'... Watching Mendenhall (aka the tiny dancer) run and spin around is painful. Never thought I'd long for the days of Willie Parker. And why didn't we trade for Marshawn Lynch when we had a chance. What did the seahawks give for him? a 4th or 5th rounder. That's the kind of running back I like...

I would say we should be running the same offense that the Patriots did/do run and that the Saints run. We don't have the weapons Green Bay has. They can loft 10 throws a game 30 yards downfield because their WR are huge and physical and can outleap DB's to go up and catch the ball at its highest point.

Our WR are closer to NE type WR's where Wallace is like a Randy Moss type and the rest are more like Wes WElkers and Branch's. We have two pass catching TE's in Saunders and Heath like NE does. The only reason we beat NE this year is because we finally had the DB's to go man on them and give Brady fits finding an open WR until we got our LB's to him. Normally their offense was quick strikes tearing apart zone defenses because nobody could match up man. WEll, who can go man on Wallace, Brown, Sanders, Cotchery, Hines, Heath, Saunders?

By the way, F Mendenhall, he sucks. I see RB's at Div. II colleges running with more determination and fighting for that extra yard. This guy, if he does happen to turn the corner and rip off a 30 yard run, runs out of bounds to avoid contact instead of making it 35. As soon as someone gets in front of him he stops and tries to dance instead of trying to bowl that player over and pick up an extra 3 yards. He never picks a hole and goes. He tiptoes up to the hole then dances.

Green Bay doesn't have huge WR's. Jordy Nelson is a big-ish guy at 6'3", but the rest of them are no bigger than what we have (Greg Jennings 5'11", James Jones 6'1", Donald Driver 6'0", and Randall Cobb 5'10").

Mister Pittsburgh
12-02-2011, 01:33 PM
We should be running the same offense as GB and NO. I believe we have those caliber of weapons. Whatever we are doing now ain't workin'... Watching Mendenhall (aka the tiny dancer) run and spin around is painful. Never thought I'd long for the days of Willie Parker. And why didn't we trade for Marshawn Lynch when we had a chance. What did the seahawks give for him? a 4th or 5th rounder. That's the kind of running back I like...

I would say we should be running the same offense that the Patriots did/do run and that the Saints run. We don't have the weapons Green Bay has. They can loft 10 throws a game 30 yards downfield because their WR are huge and physical and can outleap DB's to go up and catch the ball at its highest point.

Our WR are closer to NE type WR's where Wallace is like a Randy Moss type and the rest are more like Wes WElkers and Branch's. We have two pass catching TE's in Saunders and Heath like NE does. The only reason we beat NE this year is because we finally had the DB's to go man on them and give Brady fits finding an open WR until we got our LB's to him. Normally their offense was quick strikes tearing apart zone defenses because nobody could match up man. WEll, who can go man on Wallace, Brown, Sanders, Cotchery, Hines, Heath, Saunders?

By the way, F Mendenhall, he sucks. I see RB's at Div. II colleges running with more determination and fighting for that extra yard. This guy, if he does happen to turn the corner and rip off a 30 yard run, runs out of bounds to avoid contact instead of making it 35. As soon as someone gets in front of him he stops and tries to dance instead of trying to bowl that player over and pick up an extra 3 yards. He never picks a hole and goes. He tiptoes up to the hole then dances.

Green Bay doesn't have huge WR's. Jordy Nelson is a big-ish guy at 6'3", but the rest of them are no bigger than what we have (Greg Jennings 5'11", James Jones 6'1", Donald Driver 6'0", and Randall Cobb 5'10").

I am literally shocked right now. Those guys DO NOT play like their size then. The last two times I have watched them I see those WR's going up against DB's and literally outjumping the DB's and catching it at its highest point and taking the ball off the DB's. I honestly would of guess Greg Jennings was at least 6'3" and same with Jones and Driver.

drprwnap
12-02-2011, 01:39 PM
We should be running the same offense as GB and NO. I believe we have those caliber of weapons. Whatever we are doing now ain't workin'... Watching Mendenhall (aka the tiny dancer) run and spin around is painful. Never thought I'd long for the days of Willie Parker. And why didn't we trade for Marshawn Lynch when we had a chance. What did the seahawks give for him? a 4th or 5th rounder. That's the kind of running back I like...

I would say we should be running the same offense that the Patriots did/do run and that the Saints run. We don't have the weapons Green Bay has. They can loft 10 throws a game 30 yards downfield because their WR are huge and physical and can outleap DB's to go up and catch the ball at its highest point.

Our WR are closer to NE type WR's where Wallace is like a Randy Moss type and the rest are more like Wes WElkers and Branch's. We have two pass catching TE's in Saunders and Heath like NE does. The only reason we beat NE this year is because we finally had the DB's to go man on them and give Brady fits finding an open WR until we got our LB's to him. Normally their offense was quick strikes tearing apart zone defenses because nobody could match up man. WEll, who can go man on Wallace, Brown, Sanders, Cotchery, Hines, Heath, Saunders?

By the way, F Mendenhall, he sucks. I see RB's at Div. II colleges running with more determination and fighting for that extra yard. This guy, if he does happen to turn the corner and rip off a 30 yard run, runs out of bounds to avoid contact instead of making it 35. As soon as someone gets in front of him he stops and tries to dance instead of trying to bowl that player over and pick up an extra 3 yards. He never picks a hole and goes. He tiptoes up to the hole then dances.

We do have the weapons GB does, we just don't have the OFFINSIVE LINE GB does. Having WR that can go up and catch the ball does you no good if you QB is under pressure immediately and has no time to throw the ball.
I agree with your comments on Mendy. I remember a RB that wore #32 that ran out of bounds a lot but put his head down, hit the hole hard, and didn't let the breeze of some tackler's arm bring him down.

BURGH86STEEL
12-02-2011, 02:08 PM
No team can completely scrap the run game. It would also not be a good idea to go with the no huddle all the time. The strength(defense) of this team could suffer as a result.

Steelers can run the same offense as Pats, Packers, and Saints. The problem is they don't get the consistent QB play those teams get on a week to week basis.

WindyCitySteel
12-02-2011, 02:53 PM
We should be running a spread with 3 WR, Heath, and Mendy in the backfield. Mendy can run and catch from the spread when he isn't picking up blitzes. That's how he rolled at Illinois, not in the offensive sets we run for him now.

ColumbusSteelerFan
12-02-2011, 02:59 PM
We should be running a spread with 3 WR, Heath, and Mendy in the backfield. Mendy can run and catch from the spread when he isn't picking up blitzes. That's how he rolled at Illinois, not in the offensive sets we run for him now.

Can we get Ron Zook as the OC? I heard he's available. :lol:

Mister Pittsburgh
12-02-2011, 03:21 PM
We should be running the same offense as GB and NO. I believe we have those caliber of weapons. Whatever we are doing now ain't workin'... Watching Mendenhall (aka the tiny dancer) run and spin around is painful. Never thought I'd long for the days of Willie Parker. And why didn't we trade for Marshawn Lynch when we had a chance. What did the seahawks give for him? a 4th or 5th rounder. That's the kind of running back I like...

I would say we should be running the same offense that the Patriots did/do run and that the Saints run. We don't have the weapons Green Bay has. They can loft 10 throws a game 30 yards downfield because their WR are huge and physical and can outleap DB's to go up and catch the ball at its highest point.

Our WR are closer to NE type WR's where Wallace is like a Randy Moss type and the rest are more like Wes WElkers and Branch's. We have two pass catching TE's in Saunders and Heath like NE does. The only reason we beat NE this year is because we finally had the DB's to go man on them and give Brady fits finding an open WR until we got our LB's to him. Normally their offense was quick strikes tearing apart zone defenses because nobody could match up man. WEll, who can go man on Wallace, Brown, Sanders, Cotchery, Hines, Heath, Saunders?

By the way, F Mendenhall, he sucks. I see RB's at Div. II colleges running with more determination and fighting for that extra yard. This guy, if he does happen to turn the corner and rip off a 30 yard run, runs out of bounds to avoid contact instead of making it 35. As soon as someone gets in front of him he stops and tries to dance instead of trying to bowl that player over and pick up an extra 3 yards. He never picks a hole and goes. He tiptoes up to the hole then dances.

We do have the weapons GB does, we just don't have the OFFINSIVE LINE GB does. Having WR that can go up and catch the ball does you no good if you QB is under pressure immediately and has no time to throw the ball.
I agree with your comments on Mendy. I remember a RB that wore #32 that ran out of bounds a lot but put his head down, hit the hole hard, and didn't let the breeze of some tackler's arm bring him down.


You combat not having a line that can hold blocks by designing your offense around a quick strike passing attack from the shotgun using multiple weapons.....not by having your QB line up under center, take 5 and 7 step drops, then stand back there waiting for patterns to develop 15 to 20 yards downfield.

We have been most consistent this year when we deploy this type of attack.....Tennessee game, second half of second Ravens game, portions of the last Cincy game.

pittpete
12-02-2011, 03:25 PM
We could if dont want to have Ben around for the next few years

feltdizz
12-02-2011, 04:28 PM
Green Bay doesn't have huge WR's. Jordy Nelson is a big-ish guy at 6'3", but the rest of them are no bigger than what we have (Greg Jennings 5'11", James Jones 6'1", Donald Driver 6'0", and Randall Cobb 5'10").

I am literally shocked right now. Those guys DO NOT play like their size then. The last two times I have watched them I see those WR's going up against DB's and literally outjumping the DB's and catching it at its highest point and taking the ball off the DB's. I honestly would of guess Greg Jennings was at least 6'3" and same with Jones and Driver.

I feel you.... my eyes must be playing tricks on me because they look pretty big to me. Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE I talk to when it comes to Green Bay mentions their WR's size...

Maybe it's their uni colors because those guys look huge and guys bounce off of them after they catch the ball.

Our WR's are like potato bugs or whatever those bugs are that curl up when you touch them.

snarky
12-02-2011, 05:05 PM
We should be running the same offense as GB and NO. I believe we have those caliber of weapons. Whatever we are doing now ain't workin'... Watching Mendenhall (aka the tiny dancer) run and spin around is painful. Never thought I'd long for the days of Willie Parker. And why didn't we trade for Marshawn Lynch when we had a chance. What did the seahawks give for him? a 4th or 5th rounder. That's the kind of running back I like...

Lynch's off-the-field reputation wasn't exactly golden...


Sullivan: It's time for Lynch to depart
By Jerry Sullivan

Published:
January 10, 2010, 8:06 PM

The last time I saw Marshawn Lynch was on locker cleanout day, one week ago today. He was

sitting on a bench just outside the Bills dressing room, playing with a remote control car. As

I approached, the car flipped over on the practice turf. Lynch glared at me and asked if I

could turn the car back onto its wheels.

Laughing, I obliged. Imagine that, I thought, Lynch having a motor vehicle mishap in full

view of a media member. Somehow, I suspected that the irony of the moment was lost on him.

Trouble has a peculiar way of following this guy around. The latest revelations came on

Saturday, in a front-page Buffalo News story in which a Buffalo detective sergeant claimed

that Lynch had stolen $20 from his wife last month at a TGI Friday's in Hamburg.

It's unclear exactly what happened that day. Hamburg police are now saying the news account

wasn't consistent with their information. We might never find out if Lynch actually threatened

the woman or uttered the now-infamous words, "Do you know who I am?"

Lynch might be guilty of nothing worse than being a jerk and adding another chapter to his

legend of boorish behavior at Western New York bars. But I know this: It's always something

with Lynch. This isn't about $20. It's about an athlete whose behavior has gone over the line

time and again.

I stopped giving Lynch the benefit of the doubt last summer, after he pleaded guilty to gun

possession in L.A. That was nine months after the hit-and-run in downtown Buffalo. On the day

Lynch was playing with the toy car, the news broke that the Ontario woman who was struck in

that 2008 accident was suing.

Yes, it's a long list of indiscretions, including Lynch's charming custom of bringing his

own alcohol into bars. For every incident that became public, there's another that never saw

the light of day. As Hamburg police said after the hit-and-run on Chippewa, it was consistent

with a pattern of behavior since Lynch arrived in town in 2007.

Lynch has complained of being harassed by the cops. Apologists make him out to be a victim.

People are questioning the motives of the detective who filed the complaint. There's always

someone willing to defend Lynch because he came from a brutal section of Oakland.

That's an insult to every person who rose from difficult circumstances to became a decent,

law-abiding citizen. Pro sports are full of such men. It's too bad the goof-ups get most of

the attention.

Lynch isn't worth the trouble. He was on thin ice when he was starting. Now he's a backup.

You'd have expected him to come back newly motivated and on his best behavior in

public after his three-game suspension. Instead, he seemed slow and indifferent. Lynch

lost his job to Fred Jackson, a class act who worked his way from undrafted free agent to a

1,000-yard rushing season.

Jackson did it the hard way, laboring in the minor leagues before getting his chance. He

appreciates what it means to be a professional football player. Lynch takes it for granted.

The Bills handed him $10 million in guaranteed money when he came into the league and he acts

as if the world owes him still.

Three years later, Lynch is approaching bust status. People talk about Mike Williams and

Donte Whitner as dubious high draft picks by the Bills. But when you consider Lynch's

embarrassing off-field antics, and his current status as a backup, he might be an even bigger

mistake at No. 12 overall.

The Bills are evaluating their entire operation. They should take a long, hard look at

their troubled running back. Any serious evaluation of Lynch has to conclude that he's headed

for more trouble, and the worst might be yet to come.

Let it be elsewhere. Trade him, cut him, but get Lynch out of our town, before he does

something truly regrettable.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Why-the-Bills-should-dump-Marshawn-Lynch.html

I don't see a single thing in there about tummy-aches so obviously we should have picked him up.

Dee Dub
12-02-2011, 06:00 PM
The Steelers haven't had a problem running the ball when Redman, Moore, and even Dwyer have had their opportunities.

hawaiiansteel
12-04-2011, 02:55 PM
two early rushing TDs by Mendy early on, maybe we better not scrap running the ball completely... :tt2 :tt2

Shawn
12-05-2011, 11:32 AM
The reason you run the ball and pass out of running formations is to create match up issues. If you run 4 and 5 wide all game teams are able to nickle and dime all game. But when you run a trip set, QB under center and Mendy in the backfield...running 50%, passing 50%...it isn't just about the yards you gain on the runs. It's about keeping the passing D packages off the field. And when you have linebackers trying to cover guys like Brown or Sanders...good luck.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-05-2011, 01:06 PM
The reason you run the ball and pass out of running formations is to create match up issues. If you run 4 and 5 wide all game teams are able to nickle and dime all game. But when you run a trip set, QB under center and Mendy in the backfield...running 50%, passing 50%...it isn't just about the yards you gain on the runs. It's about keeping the passing D packages off the field. And when you have linebackers trying to cover guys like Brown or Sanders...good luck.

I don't remember the Patriots establishing the run against our top 3 defense the years they kicked our butts. They lined up in shotgun and picked apart our zone D cause they knew we didn't have the talent to line up man on them. If we did attempt to go man they would beat us straight up.

We have the weapons to inflict our will on teams by picking apart their zone or beating them man. We need to get #85 Johnston off the field and deploy Heath and Saunders with a single back and Wallace and Brown and pick teams apart. I would like to see what would happen if you had Saunders actually split out once in a while.

If they want to take LB's off the field then good luck covering Heath and Saunders with DB's. If you want to keep the LB's on the field and blitz Ben we pick them apart.

feltdizz
12-05-2011, 01:10 PM
The reason you run the ball and pass out of running formations is to create match up issues. If you run 4 and 5 wide all game teams are able to nickle and dime all game. But when you run a trip set, QB under center and Mendy in the backfield...running 50%, passing 50%...it isn't just about the yards you gain on the runs. It's about keeping the passing D packages off the field. And when you have linebackers trying to cover guys like Brown or Sanders...good luck.

I don't remember the Patriots establishing the run against our top 3 defense the years they kicked our butts. They lined up in shotgun and picked apart our zone D cause they knew we didn't have the talent to line up man on them. If we did attempt to go man they would beat us straight up.

We have the weapons to inflict our will on teams by picking apart their zone or beating them man. We need to get #85 Johnston off the field and deploy Heath and Saunders with a single back and Wallace and Brown and pick teams apart. I would like to see what would happen if you had Saunders actually split out once in a while.

If they want to take LB's off the field then good luck covering Heath and Saunders with DB's. If you want to keep the LB's on the field and blitz Ben we pick them apart.

bingo... then you run draws when they are in the dime a few times to give the impression of a balanced attack.

Funny think is their high draft pick at RB stunk in their system and they have a midget, old man Faulk and the young guy in there getting good production when they run.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-05-2011, 01:36 PM
The reason you run the ball and pass out of running formations is to create match up issues. If you run 4 and 5 wide all game teams are able to nickle and dime all game. But when you run a trip set, QB under center and Mendy in the backfield...running 50%, passing 50%...it isn't just about the yards you gain on the runs. It's about keeping the passing D packages off the field. And when you have linebackers trying to cover guys like Brown or Sanders...good luck.

I don't remember the Patriots establishing the run against our top 3 defense the years they kicked our butts. They lined up in shotgun and picked apart our zone D cause they knew we didn't have the talent to line up man on them. If we did attempt to go man they would beat us straight up.

We have the weapons to inflict our will on teams by picking apart their zone or beating them man. We need to get #85 Johnston off the field and deploy Heath and Saunders with a single back and Wallace and Brown and pick teams apart. I would like to see what would happen if you had Saunders actually split out once in a while.

If they want to take LB's off the field then good luck covering Heath and Saunders with DB's. If you want to keep the LB's on the field and blitz Ben we pick them apart.

bingo... then you run draws when they are in the dime a few times to give the impression of a balanced attack.

Funny think is their high draft pick at RB stunk in their system and they have a midget, old man Faulk and the young guy in there getting good production when they run.

I am hoping Barron Batch can be a Faulk type RB where he can pick up a blitz, but is GREAT coming out of the backfield. Faulk was awesome at catching the ball on the run so he could beat LB's to the edge and gain 5-10 yds every time he caught the ball.

here are batch's numbers at TTech.....

caught 32 passes for 226 yards (most among Tech running backs) with three touchdowns

I think Saunders could end up being a star TE in this league. Mix him with Heath and the WR's and only Bruce Arians could screw things up and keep us out of being a top 5 offense.

Shawn
12-05-2011, 03:51 PM
The reason you run the ball and pass out of running formations is to create match up issues. If you run 4 and 5 wide all game teams are able to nickle and dime all game. But when you run a trip set, QB under center and Mendy in the backfield...running 50%, passing 50%...it isn't just about the yards you gain on the runs. It's about keeping the passing D packages off the field. And when you have linebackers trying to cover guys like Brown or Sanders...good luck.

I don't remember the Patriots establishing the run against our top 3 defense the years they kicked our butts. They lined up in shotgun and picked apart our zone D cause they knew we didn't have the talent to line up man on them. If we did attempt to go man they would beat us straight up.

We have the weapons to inflict our will on teams by picking apart their zone or beating them man. We need to get #85 Johnston off the field and deploy Heath and Saunders with a single back and Wallace and Brown and pick teams apart. I would like to see what would happen if you had Saunders actually split out once in a while.

If they want to take LB's off the field then good luck covering Heath and Saunders with DB's. If you want to keep the LB's on the field and blitz Ben we pick them apart.

Why would you have had to with our secondary? Our linebackers were at least as good as our #3 and 4 DBs in coverage.

feltdizz
12-05-2011, 04:36 PM
The reason you run the ball and pass out of running formations is to create match up issues. If you run 4 and 5 wide all game teams are able to nickle and dime all game. But when you run a trip set, QB under center and Mendy in the backfield...running 50%, passing 50%...it isn't just about the yards you gain on the runs. It's about keeping the passing D packages off the field. And when you have linebackers trying to cover guys like Brown or Sanders...good luck.

I don't remember the Patriots establishing the run against our top 3 defense the years they kicked our butts. They lined up in shotgun and picked apart our zone D cause they knew we didn't have the talent to line up man on them. If we did attempt to go man they would beat us straight up.

We have the weapons to inflict our will on teams by picking apart their zone or beating them man. We need to get #85 Johnston off the field and deploy Heath and Saunders with a single back and Wallace and Brown and pick teams apart. I would like to see what would happen if you had Saunders actually split out once in a while.

If they want to take LB's off the field then good luck covering Heath and Saunders with DB's. If you want to keep the LB's on the field and blitz Ben we pick them apart.

Why would you have had to with our secondary? Our linebackers were at least as good as our #3 and 4 DBs in coverage.


besides Timmons we don't have any LB's who can break down a RB in open space.

we saw what happened when we left our LB's on RB's in previous Patriot games... burn notice.

I know we like to bash the DB's but they are still faster and more agile then our LB's.

RuthlessBurgher
12-05-2011, 04:42 PM
The reason you run the ball and pass out of running formations is to create match up issues. If you run 4 and 5 wide all game teams are able to nickle and dime all game. But when you run a trip set, QB under center and Mendy in the backfield...running 50%, passing 50%...it isn't just about the yards you gain on the runs. It's about keeping the passing D packages off the field. And when you have linebackers trying to cover guys like Brown or Sanders...good luck.

I don't remember the Patriots establishing the run against our top 3 defense the years they kicked our butts. They lined up in shotgun and picked apart our zone D cause they knew we didn't have the talent to line up man on them. If we did attempt to go man they would beat us straight up.

We have the weapons to inflict our will on teams by picking apart their zone or beating them man. We need to get #85 Johnston off the field and deploy Heath and Saunders with a single back and Wallace and Brown and pick teams apart. I would like to see what would happen if you had Saunders actually split out once in a while.

If they want to take LB's off the field then good luck covering Heath and Saunders with DB's. If you want to keep the LB's on the field and blitz Ben we pick them apart.

Why would you have had to with our secondary? Our linebackers were at least as good as our #3 and 4 DBs in coverage.


besides Timmons we don't have any LB's who can break down a RB in open space.

we saw what happened when we left our LB's on RB's in previous Patriot games... burn notice.

I know we like to bash the DB's but they are still faster and more agile then our LB's.

Running backs who see James Harrison in open space crap themselves before falling down into a fetal position.

Oviedo
12-05-2011, 04:44 PM
The reason you run the ball and pass out of running formations is to create match up issues. If you run 4 and 5 wide all game teams are able to nickle and dime all game. But when you run a trip set, QB under center and Mendy in the backfield...running 50%, passing 50%...it isn't just about the yards you gain on the runs. It's about keeping the passing D packages off the field. And when you have linebackers trying to cover guys like Brown or Sanders...good luck.

I don't remember the Patriots establishing the run against our top 3 defense the years they kicked our butts. They lined up in shotgun and picked apart our zone D cause they knew we didn't have the talent to line up man on them. If we did attempt to go man they would beat us straight up.

We have the weapons to inflict our will on teams by picking apart their zone or beating them man. We need to get #85 Johnston off the field and deploy Heath and Saunders with a single back and Wallace and Brown and pick teams apart. I would like to see what would happen if you had Saunders actually split out once in a while.

If they want to take LB's off the field then good luck covering Heath and Saunders with DB's. If you want to keep the LB's on the field and blitz Ben we pick them apart.

Why would you have had to with our secondary? Our linebackers were at least as good as our #3 and 4 DBs in coverage.


besides Timmons we don't have any LB's who can break down a RB in open space.

we saw what happened when we left our LB's on RB's in previous Patriot games... burn notice.

I know we like to bash the DB's but they are still faster and more agile then our LB's.

You're right. Timmons is the only LB we have who can consistently deal with opposing players with speed. Farrior use to be able to but not anymore.

Problem is our DBs can't handle TEs who are becoming the weapons of choice for several elite passing teams which is why we need another Timmons-like LB or a Safety with Troy's speed but better coverage skills.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-05-2011, 04:56 PM
The reason you run the ball and pass out of running formations is to create match up issues. If you run 4 and 5 wide all game teams are able to nickle and dime all game. But when you run a trip set, QB under center and Mendy in the backfield...running 50%, passing 50%...it isn't just about the yards you gain on the runs. It's about keeping the passing D packages off the field. And when you have linebackers trying to cover guys like Brown or Sanders...good luck.

I don't remember the Patriots establishing the run against our top 3 defense the years they kicked our butts. They lined up in shotgun and picked apart our zone D cause they knew we didn't have the talent to line up man on them. If we did attempt to go man they would beat us straight up.

We have the weapons to inflict our will on teams by picking apart their zone or beating them man. We need to get #85 Johnston off the field and deploy Heath and Saunders with a single back and Wallace and Brown and pick teams apart. I would like to see what would happen if you had Saunders actually split out once in a while.

If they want to take LB's off the field then good luck covering Heath and Saunders with DB's. If you want to keep the LB's on the field and blitz Ben we pick them apart.

Why would you have had to with our secondary? Our linebackers were at least as good as our #3 and 4 DBs in coverage.


besides Timmons we don't have any LB's who can break down a RB in open space.

we saw what happened when we left our LB's on RB's in previous Patriot games... burn notice.

I know we like to bash the DB's but they are still faster and more agile then our LB's.

You're right. Timmons is the only LB we have who can consistently deal with opposing players with speed. Farrior use to be able to but not anymore.

Problem is our DBs can't handle TEs who are becoming the weapons of choice for several elite passing teams which is why we need another Timmons-like LB or a Safety with Troy's speed but better coverage skills.

So pass catching TE's are the weapons of choice for several elite passing teams.....maybe some day we will be an elite passing team as well. All we need is a franchise QB, a couple of WR that are awesome, and some pass catching TE's......wait....we have those.....what else we need? An OC that knows how to harness those types of talents and develop an offense around them? Saunders had one pass go his way yesterday....and one the week before......and i think that is it on the year.....

hawaiiansteel
12-05-2011, 09:16 PM
Steelers runners get message and deliver

Mendenhall, Redman run hard over Bengals

Monday, December 05, 2011
By Ron Cook, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/images/201112/pd03steelers120411_500.jpg

Rashard Mendenhall high steps his way into the end zone against the Bengals Sunday at Heinz Field.


Publicly, Steelers running back Rashard Mendenhall said last week that it's difficult to get the team's much-maligned running game going when the offensive coordinator calls so many pass plays.

Privately, offensive coordinator Bruce Arians had a simple message for Mendenhall and backup Ike Redman.

" 'You want to run the ball more, run it better,' " Arians recalled telling the two.

So Mendenhall did in the 35-7 win Sunday against the Cincinnati Bengals at Heinz Field.

Redman, as well.

"That was a lot better," Arians said. "I saw backs breaking tackles. I saw a much better surge ...

"It's so much easier to call run plays when they're gaining 4 yards instead of 2 1/2 or 3 yards. It's nice to be in second-and-6 situations. That's a nice down for us. We can do a lot of different things."

Statistically, this wasn't the Steelers' best game running the football. They rushed for 185 yards against Jacksonville and 174 yards against Tennessee, both wins. But Mendenhall and Redman ran hard. Mendenhall had 60 yards on 16 carries and Redman 51 on eight, accounting for the biggest chunks of the team's 136 rushing yards.

What was impressive was the way the Steelers ran the ball against a Bengals defense that was ranked fifth in the NFL against the rush. There was a feeling they were not going to be stopped.

After punting on their first two possessions, the Steelers moved to the Bengals 15. Redman carried three consecutive times for 12 yards before Mendenhall scored on a 3-yard touchdown run for a 7-0 lead.

On the Steelers' next possession, Mendenhall got the call on first down from the Cincinnati 20 and ripped off a 15-yard gain. A play later, he scored on a 5-yard touchdown run, making a terrific cutback. It stretched the lead to 14-0 and was Mendenhall's fourth touchdown in two games against the Bengals, his eighth of the season and the 28th regular-season rushing touchdown of his career, which moved him into fifth place on the franchise's all-time list.

That brings to mind something former Steelers great Jerome Bettis always said:

"They pay me to score touchdowns."

Mendenhall is very good at it. Counting postseason games, he has scored 16 touchdowns in his past 17 games.

The run game figured in the Steelers' third touchdown. On first-and-10 from the Bengals 12, quarterback Ben Roethlisberger faked a handoff to Redman, rolled to his right and found wide receiver Mike Wallace wide open for a 12-yard touchdown. "That was nice," Arians said. "You have to be able to run the ball for the play-action stuff to work."

The Steelers seemed determined to run the ball in for one final touchdown late in the third quarter. Mendenhall gained 5 yards on first-and-goal from the Cincinnati 9, but the play was nullified by a holding penalty against guard Trai Essex. It didn't matter.

Roethlisberger threw a quick pass to Wallace on the right sideline and Wallace turned it into a 19-yard touchdown with a brilliant run after the catch. That made it four touchdowns in four trips inside the red zone.

"That was another point of emphasis last week," Arians said. "We wanted to run the ball better, but we really wanted to run it better down there."

The result was the Steelers' third blowout win of the season, one they needed to keep pace with the Baltimore Ravens in the AFC North Division. Roethlisberger, who had a solid day with the two touchdown passes to Wallace, a 117.3 passer rating and the 2,026th completion of his career, putting him at the top of the franchise's all-time list ahead of Hall of Famer Terry Bradshaw, was thrilled with the way the team got it done with the run game.

"That is something I know that our offensive linemen take pride in and our running backs, as well," Roethlisberger said. "It was awesome to see it really get going. We didn't need a whole lot from the passing game."

Roethlisberger is right about the big linemen loving the way this game went. Check out guard Doug Legursky's take:

"You can't ask for a better day as an offensive lineman. Every one of us wants to run the ball. Me? I think I'm a better run blocker than pass blocker. I'd love to run it every play."

That won't happen, of course.

Not with the great Roethlisberger at quarterback.

But it probably wouldn't hurt the linemen -- not to mention Mendenhall and Redman -- to keep Arians' words in mind as they prepare for the Thursday night game against the Cleveland Browns at Heinz Field.

"You want to run the ball more, run it better."

Sunday was a nice start.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11339/11 ... z1fi1g8wlk (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11339/1194642-87-0.stm#ixzz1fi1g8wlk)

Mister Pittsburgh
12-06-2011, 12:50 PM
Its really awesome our RB's need told to run better and they do it on command. You would think they would just, you know, have some personal accountability and sense of pride in the matter.

Slapstick
12-06-2011, 01:04 PM
Its really awesome our RB's need told to run better and they do it on command. You would think they would just, you know, have some personal accountability and sense of pride in the matter.

To be fair, I don't think Redman needed to be told that...while he isn't as athletically gifted as Mendenhall, the guy runs hard every time he touches the ball...

ikestops85
12-06-2011, 01:36 PM
Its really awesome our RB's need told to run better and they do it on command. You would think they would just, you know, have some personal accountability and sense of pride in the matter.

To be fair, I don't think Redman needed to be told that...while he isn't as athletically gifted as Mendenhall, the guy runs hard every time he touches the ball...

I see a huge difference between when Mendy hits resistance and when Redman hits resistance. When Redman hits it he pushes them backwards almost everytime. Sometimes he breaks away from those grasping at him to get a few more yards. Mendy hardly ever does this ... except lately he has been doing it at the goal line. I'd like to see him start doing it on our own 20 to make it easier on Ben when 3rd down comes around.

Keyplay1
12-06-2011, 06:35 PM
Given that we can't consistently run the ball, could we scrap the running game and just go 5 wide no huddle all the time?

And then maybe work in a couple draws to keep the defense honest, but only run 5-10 times/game?

GREEN: Wonder how many other Steeler fans [me too] thought this also.

GOLD: williar said: "We should be running the same offense as GB and NO. I believe we have those caliber of weapons. Whatever we are doing now ain't workin'... Watching Mendenhall (aka the tiny dancer) run and spin around is painful. Never thought I'd long for the days of Willie Parker.

GREEN: Lots of fans think this also. [me too]

GOLD: Mister Pittsburgh said: "I would say we should be running the same offense that the Patriots did/do run and that the Saints run."\

GREEN: Lots of fans think this too. But taking a look at the run pass stats of these four and other perceived totally pass - pass teams it is surprising that they run the ball a lot more than one would think. These stats are from nfl.com Dammit another beef against this site. You cannot select highlight the info you want. Since I only want to show the rank-attempts-results of these teams I am forced to type this stuff.

PASS---------------------RUSH

---Rk--Att--Avg--------

GB #1 412 9.4------#27 420 3.8
NE #2 459 8.5------#19 362 4.0
NYG#3 442 8.4
HOU#4 345 8.1------#14 432 4.2
NO #4 497 8.1--------#4 309 4.8
CAR#6 414 8.0
PIT #6 410 8.0-------#14 323 4.2
DAL #8 372 7.9
OAK #9 372 7.7
SD #9 419 7.7
MIA#11 356 7.4
SF #11 326 7.4
DET#13 490 7.3

Simply by looking at the stat page you can see just about all the teams that are dominating in the standings are also highly ranked in the Pass category. But what is not mentioned or factored in is they also run the ball a lot also. NOTICE: Green Bay and New England have more rushing attempts than the Steelers. But. only New Orleans has been more effective doing so.

Also easy enough to notice is that the Steelers are right there in the passing department too.

What is surprising to me is for the past several weeks I also have been really wondering where the heck the Steeler running game has gone. But maybe it is not as bad as it appears. Maybe expectations are too high but I don't think so.

Well anyway, things seemed to pick up a bit last week maybe that will continue.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-06-2011, 08:18 PM
I think there is a distinct difference between the formations the steelers run out of and what the situation is in the game vs most high powered offenses. Seems to me we telegraph when we will run & there is no rythm or flow to our playcalling.