Why is our O not elite?

[Shawn]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.

[insanesteelersfan]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.



Shawn, we have had several different systems while Ben has been here, as well as great weapons. The only continuous factor has been our O-Line. One slug after another. When you factor in that this basic squad has won TWO Super Bowls the past 5 years is amazing. Even with all MY Whining :Binky ...I still have to give credit for Ben overcoming such a below average unit on the O-Line. They're not the worst in the league. But of all the teams that are considered double-digit win teams, they easily are the worst.


So even though I do agree that Arians system sometimes leaves me scratching my head, overall our main problem stopping us from having a All-World, high scoring team IS the O-Line.

[steelnavy]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.

Two Words: Bruce Arians. Could we REALLY GET ANY WORSE with somoone else?

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.



Shawn, we have had several different systems while Ben has been here, as well as great weapons. The only continuous factor has been our O-Line. One slug after another. When you factor in that this basic squad has won TWO Super Bowls the past 5 years is amazing. Even with all MY Whining :Binky ...I still have to give credit for Ben overcoming such a below average unit on the O-Line. They're not the worst in the league. But of all the teams that are considered double-digit win teams, they easily are the worst.


So even though I do agree that Arians system sometimes leaves me scratching my head, overall our main problem stopping us from having a All-World, high scoring team IS the O-Line.

Agreed insane. Put any other top QB behind this line - Brady, Brees, Manning, Rivers, Rodgers......and they are not top tier QBs.

[insanesteelersfan]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.

Two Words: Bruce Arians. Could we REALLY GET ANY WORSE with somoone else?





Any worse ?....Bruce has been our OC since 2007, in 4 years we have been in 2 Super Bowls under him, winning one, and our offense has NEVER been higher ranked with ANYONE else as our OC, even in the Bradshaw days.

So please check yourself B4 U Mess yourself :lol:

[fezziwig]

1. The o-line stinks.

2. Does Ben ever check down to a runingback or tight end ?

Ben will rather take the sack looking down field than to have a release valve guy waiting in the wings. Then again, he might be getting his instructions from Arians and if not, Arians should be teaching this.

3. We win despite Arians. Arians is a piss poor coach. Always has been and always will.
It's a crying shame when I notice opposing teams assistant coachs doing stupid stuff or just looking lousy. The only time I really noticed a team having a boob of an offensive cord was when Arians was with the Browns.
Arians gave our Steeler teams wins in the past when he was with the Browns.

People want to talk of three Super Bowls in so few years and our offensive stats, yada, yada, yada and the funny thing is.....no one mentions Arians or ever considers him for a head coaching job.

4. Ben is basically why our offense can accomplish anything to start with.

Either tomlin isn't allowed to get rid of this guy or he is just as lost at the offense to know this Arians is all smucked up.

5. Arians is like Kordell. As much as I thought he was probably a good person, I knew he wasn't a high caliber QB but, many Steeler fans wear the rose color glasses and didn't see crap because he was a team member or they never knew what a real QB looked like.
Arians shouldn't even be coaching the PW league.

[insanesteelersfan]

1. The o-line stinks.

2. Does Ben ever check down to a runingback or tight end ?

Ben will rather take the sack looking down field than to have a release valve guy waiting in the wings. Then again, he might be getting his instructions from Arians and if not, Arians should be teaching this.

3. We win despite Arians. Arians is a piss poor coach. Always has been and always will.
It's a crying shame when I notice opposing teams assistant coachs doing stupid stuff or just looking lousy. The only time I really noticed a team having a boob of an offensive cord was when Arians was with the Browns.
Arians gave our Steeler teams wins in the past when he was with the Browns.

People want to talk of three Super Bowls in so few years and our offensive stats, yada, yada, yada and the funny thing is.....no one mentions Arians or ever considers him for a head coaching job.

4. Ben is basically why our offense can accomplish anything to start with.

Either tomlin isn't allowed to get rid of this guy or he is just as lost at the offense to know this Arians is all smucked up.

5. Arians is like Kordell. As much as I thought he was probably a good person, I knew he wasn't a high caliber QB but, many Steeler fans wear the rose color glasses and didn't see crap because he was a team member or they never knew what a real QB looked like.
Arians shouldn't even be coaching the PW league.




Your whole post makes zero sense. Arians has been a great coach for us. Peyton Manning credits him for being a great QB coach, and said HE made him what he is!! Please show me where our offense has been any better without Arians in the past ? Yes I know alot of that has to do with the fact that the steelers finally drafted a QB with great talent. But Ben doesn't take any sacks. He gets Immediate pressure from opposing defenses within 2 seconds of the snap, and thats with opposing defenses only rushing 3 or 4 guys at him! Please, check your facts before you spew!!

[BackwoodsSteeler]

BA and the o-line.

You put a Brady, Brees, Manning, etc back there and they would be seeking long term disability from AFLAC before week 5.

We have 2 rings due to Ben's ability to make plays and in spite of BA's bulls h it.

[fezziwig]

1. The o-line stinks.

2. Does Ben ever check down to a runingback or tight end ?

Ben will rather take the sack looking down field than to have a release valve guy waiting in the wings. Then again, he might be getting his instructions from Arians and if not, Arians should be teaching this.

3. We win despite Arians. Arians is a piss poor coach. Always has been and always will.
It's a crying shame when I notice opposing teams assistant coachs doing stupid stuff or just looking lousy. The only time I really noticed a team having a boob of an offensive cord was when Arians was with the Browns.
Arians gave our Steeler teams wins in the past when he was with the Browns.

People want to talk of three Super Bowls in so few years and our offensive stats, yada, yada, yada and the funny thing is.....no one mentions Arians or ever considers him for a head coaching job.

4. Ben is basically why our offense can accomplish anything to start with.

Either tomlin isn't allowed to get rid of this guy or he is just as lost at the offense to know this Arians is all smucked up.

5. Arians is like Kordell. As much as I thought he was probably a good person, I knew he wasn't a high caliber QB but, many Steeler fans wear the rose color glasses and didn't see crap because he was a team member or they never knew what a real QB looked like.
Arians shouldn't even be coaching the PW league.




Your whole post makes zero sense. Arians has been a great coach for us. Peyton Manning credits him for being a great QB coach, and said HE made him what he is!! Please show me where our offense has been any better without Arians in the past ? Yes I know alot of that has to do with the fact that the steelers finally drafted a QB with great talent. But Ben doesn't take any sacks. He gets Immediate pressure from opposing defenses within 2 seconds of the snap, and thats with opposing defenses only rushing 3 or 4 guys at him! Please, check your facts before you spew!!


I'm sorry, I didn't know I had to have your blessing to speak my on views.

As for Manning, what else was he supposed to say about Arians when asked ? Manning was good/great before Arians ever knew him and would have been just as good had he not had Arians in his life.

Yep, we have a lousy o-line except for the best right guard in the NFL and that is Willie Colon. It must be true because Arians is the only one that ever called Colon that.

Any positives you can place on our offense all come despite Arians.

[steelnavy]

1. The o-line stinks.

2. Does Ben ever check down to a runingback or tight end ?

Ben will rather take the sack looking down field than to have a release valve guy waiting in the wings. Then again, he might be getting his instructions from Arians and if not, Arians should be teaching this.

3. We win despite Arians. Arians is a piss poor coach. Always has been and always will.
It's a crying shame when I notice opposing teams assistant coachs doing stupid stuff or just looking lousy. The only time I really noticed a team having a boob of an offensive cord was when Arians was with the Browns.
Arians gave our Steeler teams wins in the past when he was with the Browns.

People want to talk of three Super Bowls in so few years and our offensive stats, yada, yada, yada and the funny thing is.....no one mentions Arians or ever considers him for a head coaching job.

4. Ben is basically why our offense can accomplish anything to start with.

Either tomlin isn't allowed to get rid of this guy or he is just as lost at the offense to know this Arians is all smucked up.

5. Arians is like Kordell. As much as I thought he was probably a good person, I knew he wasn't a high caliber QB but, many Steeler fans wear the rose color glasses and didn't see crap because he was a team member or they never knew what a real QB looked like.
Arians shouldn't even be coaching the PW league.




Your whole post makes zero sense. Arians has been a great coach for us. Peyton Manning credits him for being a great QB coach, and said HE made him what he is!! Please show me where our offense has been any better without Arians in the past ? Yes I know alot of that has to do with the fact that the steelers finally drafted a QB with great talent. But Ben doesn't take any sacks. He gets Immediate pressure from opposing defenses within 2 seconds of the snap, and thats with opposing defenses only rushing 3 or 4 guys at him! Please, check your facts before you spew!!

We have a winner! Guess those other NFL franchises just don't know a great offensive coordinator/prospective head coach when they see one.

Insane, if you are going to claim that Arian's offenses have been the Steelers best ever, please cite some facts because I don't believe it. And if that is the case, without Ben to salvage poorly called plays, the ranking wouldnt be so high. How can you love somebody who has so little creativity, does not try and cover up player weaknesses, does not design plays to take advantage of player's strengths, and does not seem to plan much week to week to take advantage of opponent's defensive weaknesses?

Here is a fact for you: He has been mediocre for his ENTIRE coaching career. Look it up! Most coaches that make it that far have a resume that would impress your socks off. Then there is BA...

[BURGH86STEEL]

I believe it starts with the QB position.

[skyhawk]

Maybe our "weapons" are overrated???

[hawaiiansteel]

Please show me where our offense has been any better without Arians in the past ? Please, check your facts before you spew!!

maybe you should check your facts before you spew...

how about in 1979 when the Steelers were #1 in the NFL in scoring offense averaging 26.0 per game while scoring 416 points? THAT was an "elite" offense!

meanwhile, Arians' offense has never been ranked higher than 9th in scoring and has never scored more than 393 points in the regular season.

and in 2008 our scoring offense was ranked 20th in the NFL, only averaging 21.7 points per game.

the title of this thread reads "Why is our O not elite?" the Steelers offensive rankings of 9th, 20th, 12th and 12th in the 4 years under Arians are far from "elite"...not bad, but certainly not "elite".

[Steelhere10]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.I have two words why the offense is not elite. Right and Left..... The left tackle constant allow pressure from the outside and the right guard had been week for years, allowing pressure up the middle no matter who you plug in there. I refuse to at least believe that J Scott is a starting LT in this league and that there is no one better on the bench. I used to blame BA, but i i think he calls plays to try and cover up Scott and Legursky. I think Kemo is decent, Pouncey is a Pro Bowler and the rest has and always been garbage including Colon.
Some are devastated by the injury but me i believe it's a blessing in the making, the only negative coming from his injury is that Gilbert can't take the LT position now.

[feltdizz]

You guys are crazy. Put Brees or Brady behind this OL and they throw away passes quickly and live to see another day.

Ben is what he is, a big physical QB who doesn't mind getting hit. While Brady and Brees are checking down to the RB's and letting them get first downs with their feet Ben is looking downfield for the big play. It's feast or famine and more times then not it's feast.

Ben loves Arians.. we have been to 2 SB's with BA in 4 years... The OL sucks because we don't draft OL in the early rounds and spend our money on the weapons and the D.

It works... quit complaining about it.

[papillon]

You guys are crazy. Put Brees or Brady behind this OL and they throw away passes quickly and live to see another day.

Ben is what he is, a big physical QB who doesn't mind getting hit. While Brady and Brees are checking down to the RB's and letting them get first downs with their feet Ben is looking downfield for the big play. It's feast or famine and more times then not it's feast.

Ben loves Arians.. we have been to 2 SB's with BA in 4 years... The OL sucks because we don't draft OL in the early rounds and spend our money on the weapons and the D.

It works... quit complaining about it.

I agree with you 100%, well actually only about 97% :D Brees and Brady may throw it away to live another day, but their punters would be getting more work. I watch the games each of those guys played in this past weekend and by and large they were both able to drop back, scan the field and deliver the ball without to much concern about getting waxed. Ben, well, not so much...He stilled played like crap, Brady isn't throwing for 500 plus with the Steelers line in front of him.

Pappy

[feltdizz]

You guys are crazy. Put Brees or Brady behind this OL and they throw away passes quickly and live to see another day.

Ben is what he is, a big physical QB who doesn't mind getting hit. While Brady and Brees are checking down to the RB's and letting them get first downs with their feet Ben is looking downfield for the big play. It's feast or famine and more times then not it's feast.

Ben loves Arians.. we have been to 2 SB's with BA in 4 years... The OL sucks because we don't draft OL in the early rounds and spend our money on the weapons and the D.

It works... quit complaining about it.

I agree with you 100%, well actually only about 97% :D Brees and Brady may throw it away to live another day, but their punters would be getting more work. I watch the games each of those guys played in this past weekend and by and large they were both able to drop back, scan the field and deliver the ball without to much concern about getting waxed. Ben, well, not so much...He stilled played like crap, Brady isn't throwing for 500 plus with the Steelers line in front of him.

Pappy
The Pats have a system and we've seen multiple QB's have success running that offense. Look at their weapons compared to ours at skill positions. You could say it's the OL but if you really watch Brady you will see a QB who checks down EARLY even when he isn't under pressure. This is why he isn't under pressure. He goes through his progressions so quick it doesn't give the D time to get pressure. Add the uptempo and you have a winded D.

Brees throws the ball when WR's are blanketed... he and Rogers are probably the best at throwing on the back shoulder when his WR are covered.

Ben isn't that kind of QB. He doesn't throw passes before WR's make their break. Our OL isn't that great but it isn't the reason why our O isn't churning out the yards and the points.

[papillon]

You guys are crazy. Put Brees or Brady behind this OL and they throw away passes quickly and live to see another day.

Ben is what he is, a big physical QB who doesn't mind getting hit. While Brady and Brees are checking down to the RB's and letting them get first downs with their feet Ben is looking downfield for the big play. It's feast or famine and more times then not it's feast.

Ben loves Arians.. we have been to 2 SB's with BA in 4 years... The OL sucks because we don't draft OL in the early rounds and spend our money on the weapons and the D.

It works... quit complaining about it.

I agree with you 100%, well actually only about 97% :D Brees and Brady may throw it away to live another day, but their punters would be getting more work. I watch the games each of those guys played in this past weekend and by and large they were both able to drop back, scan the field and deliver the ball without to much concern about getting waxed. Ben, well, not so much...He stilled played like crap, Brady isn't throwing for 500 plus with the Steelers line in front of him.

Pappy
The Pats have a system and we've seen multiple QB's have success running that offense. Look at their weapons compared to ours at skill positions. You could say it's the OL but if you really watch Brady you will see a QB who checks down EARLY even when he isn't under pressure. This is why he isn't under pressure. He goes through his progressions so quick it doesn't give the D time to get pressure. Add the uptempo and you have a winded D.

Brees throws the ball when WR's are blanketed... he and Rogers are probably the best at throwing on the back shoulder when his WR are covered.

Ben isn't that kind of QB. He doesn't throw passes before WR's make their break. Our OL isn't that great but it isn't the reason why our O isn't churning out the yards and the points.

I don't disagree that both quarterbacks get through their progressions quickly. However, if your RB is the 4th option in the progression it still takes 2-3 seconds to allow all the routes to unfold enough to be able to determine whether or not a WR is open or not. Brady, Brees and Rogers as well are provided ample time to look for receivers. They rarely get happy feet, because they rarely get hit.

You're right Ben isn't that kind of quarterback, but when he's given time he gets the ball into the right players hands, it's not like he's completely void of the standard set of quarterbacking skills. The line is going to contribute to shortening his career.

Pappy

[Discipline of Steel]

Arians just doesnt really utilize the RB as a pass catcher out of the backfield. Reggie Bush would have worked very well but Moore actually has produced some positive yards the few times hes been asked to do it

[Mister Pittsburgh]

My answer, if I had to give just one answer, would be Ben.

[DHSF]

My answer, if I had to give just one answer, would be Ben.

Clearly you weren't around during the Post-Bradshaw years. One scrub QB after another. The only one that was decent was O-Donnell and he folded like an accordion in the SB.

[fezziwig]

If Brady and Brees are considered better than Ben because they check down then, why isn't Arians coaching Ben to do this ? If you have a weak or poor offensive line then , even more reasons to check down. I don't mind us getting a couple of screens thrown to a couple of the best runningbacks in the league. Mendenhall and Redman could cause some damage on the fly if you ask me.
As for the receivers, how much over the top talent at receivers do we need for Arians offense to finally click.
I would like to know if there is a stat of functional plays compared to broken down plays that the Steelers perform.
Ben might not be the typical drop back paser and that's okay but, it is Arians job to teach him how not to take the sack, how to dump off to the backs, tightends and what have you.
According to one guy on this site, Arians practically turned Peyton Manning into the star that he is today. What has he done for Ben other than see him get crushed ?
As another poster has mentioned, Arian does not adjust to game surroundings, doesn't go after the weak link.

Our offense should be in the top three every season with the guys we have. There is a lot of negatives about the o-line. To stop the defenses from crashing through, having tunnel vision on Ben there are ways to get around that. Again, some quick dump off passes to Mendenhall or Redmen will give the defenses something to think about. Why should the defenses hesitate rushing Ben when they know our team only goes for the big yardage ?

The defenses zero in on Ben because they know he will take the sack and that, you can't always blame on the o-line.

How many times have you seen a linebacker come full steam at a quarterback while thinking, " he's going to sack him " but only to have the QB to toss a pass over the linebackers head to a runningback for a first down ?

Arians does not even consider that but that's okay, we always have Batch, Lefty or Dixon to take Bens place.

[BURGH86STEEL]

You guys are crazy. Put Brees or Brady behind this OL and they throw away passes quickly and live to see another day.

Ben is what he is, a big physical QB who doesn't mind getting hit. While Brady and Brees are checking down to the RB's and letting them get first downs with their feet Ben is looking downfield for the big play. It's feast or famine and more times then not it's feast.

Ben loves Arians.. we have been to 2 SB's with BA in 4 years... The OL sucks because we don't draft OL in the early rounds and spend our money on the weapons and the D.

It works... quit complaining about it.

I agree with you 100%, well actually only about 97% :D Brees and Brady may throw it away to live another day, but their punters would be getting more work. I watch the games each of those guys played in this past weekend and by and large they were both able to drop back, scan the field and deliver the ball without to much concern about getting waxed. Ben, well, not so much...He stilled played like crap, Brady isn't throwing for 500 plus with the Steelers line in front of him.

Pappy

Those QB's faced pressure. Several times, they got rid of the ball before the rush arrived. A couple of times they slid away from the rush. I am of the belief that QB play has a trickle down effect on the entire offense. For example, there are things that a QB can do help the offensive line. Making quick decisions with timing and rhythm passing can help. The Steelers attempted quick passes vs the Ravens. Some had success and a few passes were tipped by Ravens Dlinemen. A QB's style can also have an impact on the way defenses prepare and play vs a particular QB.

At times, we've all seen Ben thrive in this offense. I will state again for the 1000th time that I believe that Ben's inconsistency is why this offense doesn't perform at the optimum level. At some point, people will have to look at the situation and accept it for what it is. No other team has probowl players at every position a long the Oline. That's where I've watched and believe QB play make up for deficiencies on an offense.

[BURGH86STEEL]

Arians just doesnt really utilize the RB as a pass catcher out of the backfield. Reggie Bush would have worked very well but Moore actually has produced some positive yards the few times hes been asked to do it
The RB's caught passes in this offense. Sometimes they went out as pass catchers and sometimes they stayed into block.

The QB decides where to go with the football.

[fezziwig]

You've brought up a good point. Ben has passes knocked down at the defensive line. To me it seems like a lot of that goes on with Ben. For as tall as he is maybe, that is the problem ?
Maybe the other guys just bloop them over out of the reach of the defenders and maybe Ben throws downward to the shrimpy backs ?

Just joking but, Ben does seem to get a lot of his passes smacked down.

[steelblood]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.



Shawn, we have had several different systems while Ben has been here, as well as great weapons. The only continuous factor has been our O-Line. One slug after another. When you factor in that this basic squad has won TWO Super Bowls the past 5 years is amazing. Even with all MY Whining :Binky ...I still have to give credit for Ben overcoming such a below average unit on the O-Line. They're not the worst in the league. But of all the teams that are considered double-digit win teams, they easily are the worst.


So even though I do agree that Arians system sometimes leaves me scratching my head, overall our main problem stopping us from having a All-World, high scoring team IS the O-Line.

Agreed insane. Put any other top QB behind this line - Brady, Brees, Manning, Rivers, Rodgers......and they are not top tier QBs.

You may have a point with Manning and maybe Brady, but...

Why couldn't Rogers be top tier here? He is quite mobile and is very quick to get the ball out. Don't forget that Batch (and even Dixon) can win games with this line. Rogers could have great success here. He is highly accurate and very athletic. He might still get sacked a lot and he doesn't have Ben's strength. But, he also does some things better than Ben. I believe he could be at least as good as Ben.

[grotonsteel]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.



Shawn, we have had several different systems while Ben has been here, as well as great weapons. The only continuous factor has been our O-Line. One slug after another. When you factor in that this basic squad has won TWO Super Bowls the past 5 years is amazing. Even with all MY Whining :Binky ...I still have to give credit for Ben overcoming such a below average unit on the O-Line. They're not the worst in the league. But of all the teams that are considered double-digit win teams, they easily are the worst.


So even though I do agree that Arians system sometimes leaves me scratching my head, overall our main problem stopping us from having a All-World, high scoring team IS the O-Line.

Agreed insane. Put any other top QB behind this line - Brady, Brees, Manning, Rivers, Rodgers......and they are not top tier QBs.

You may have a point with Manning and maybe Brady, but...

Why couldn't Rogers be top tier here? He is quite mobile and is very quick to get the ball out. Don't forget that Batch (and even Dixon) can win games with this line. Rogers could have great success here. He is highly accurate and very athletic. He might still get sacked a lot and he doesn't have Ben's strength. But, he also does some things better than Ben. I believe he could be at least as good as Ben.

I don't think Aaron Rodgers get rid of the ball quick. He is one of the most sacked QB in this league as well as QB with most concussion i would say. He gets hit a lot and i don't think that would happen if he was very quick to get rid of the ball.

Now maybe things might change because they are using 5 TE though instead of a FB.Also their Offensive philosophy is different. They are a pass happy team unlike Steelers. Rodgers has great WR and TE personnel compared to Steelers.

[papillon]

You guys are crazy. Put Brees or Brady behind this OL and they throw away passes quickly and live to see another day.

Ben is what he is, a big physical QB who doesn't mind getting hit. While Brady and Brees are checking down to the RB's and letting them get first downs with their feet Ben is looking downfield for the big play. It's feast or famine and more times then not it's feast.

Ben loves Arians.. we have been to 2 SB's with BA in 4 years... The OL sucks because we don't draft OL in the early rounds and spend our money on the weapons and the D.

It works... quit complaining about it.

I agree with you 100%, well actually only about 97% :D Brees and Brady may throw it away to live another day, but their punters would be getting more work. I watch the games each of those guys played in this past weekend and by and large they were both able to drop back, scan the field and deliver the ball without to much concern about getting waxed. Ben, well, not so much...He stilled played like crap, Brady isn't throwing for 500 plus with the Steelers line in front of him.

Pappy

Those QB's faced pressure. Several times, they got rid of the ball before the rush arrived. A couple of times they slid away from the rush. I am of the belief that QB play has a trickle down effect on the entire offense. For example, there are things that a QB can do help the offensive line. Making quick decisions with timing and rhythm passing can help. The Steelers attempted quick passes vs the Ravens. Some had success and a few passes were tipped by Ravens Dlinemen. A QB's style can also have an impact on the way defenses prepare and play vs a particular QB.

At times, we've all seen Ben thrive in this offense. I will state again for the 1000th time that I believe that Ben's inconsistency is why this offense doesn't perform at the optimum level. At some point, people will have to look at the situation and accept it for what it is. No other team has probowl players at every position a long the Oline. That's where I've watched and believe QB play make up for deficiencies on an offense.

You're right those quarterbacks faced pressure several times; while Ben doesn't have pressure several times and that's the difference. The quarterback can make the O-line look good by dumping it off, throwing it away, etc. But, by and large you can't compare the pressure Ben feels to that of Brady or Brees.

You can't count on two hands how many pass plays Suggs disrupted within a 2 count last week, that's unacceptable O-line play, IMO. One stinking player on the other team disrupted the entire Steeler offense for 60 minutes, that's crap O-line play and to a degree offense strategy. The Steeler O-linemen lost every one-on-one battle with Sugss and it wasn't even close.

Before you can dump it on your 4th progression you have to be able to get through the first three and Ben wasn't afforded too many opportunities to do so.

Pappy

[papillon]

You've brought up a good point. Ben has passes knocked down at the defensive line. To me it seems like a lot of that goes on with Ben. For as tall as he is maybe, that is the problem ?
Maybe the other guys just bloop them over out of the reach of the defenders and maybe Ben throws downward to the shrimpy backs ?

Just joking but, Ben does seem to get a lot of his passes smacked down.

Many times because an offensive lineman has been walked back into his face by the defensive lineman. The O-line was bad last week, Ben was bad last week, the WRs might have been good, but they looked bad, because the O-line and Ben were bad.

Normally Ben gets the ball out without a problem, but when your 6'5" tackle is walked back into your face it becomes more difficult to get the ball out without it being batted down. There is only a small window (normally) to fit a ball into downfield and you need a clear line of sight to fit it in.

Pappy

[grotonsteel]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.


Steelers think a great Defense and adequate O is good enough to win a SB. Steelers FO has not spent much money on the Offense. You are not going to get an elite Offense by picking somone else reject on the team. Steelers LT and RG position are absolute scrubs. Now i don't expect all-pro players there but if your O-line can't block 4-man rush its an issue. If you look at Ravens game Ben did not have even time to set his feet on a 3-step drop. That is on O-line.

Regarding 3 speedy WRs...Mike Wallace is a one trick pony. Great at it but still one trick pony. Antonio Brown does not know where he should be on the field.Only WR that runs his route well is Manny. I believe these 3 speedy WRs will need 1 yr to become good WRs. I really loved the way Ravens game planned against Steelers. The only throws that were available to Ben were sideline throws.

I also think the notion that we should run ball 25 times a game is killing this Offense. Steelers will never score high if they keep running the ball 25-30 times a game unless their YPA is 6.0 or something which is clearly not the case. One major reason Steelers keep running the ball is TOP which is important i think and helps the Defense tremendously.

Mendy had a YPA of 3.9 which is average at best in my book. To me it tells me O-line is not doing its job because i think Mendy is a Top-tier RB.

I think Ben also needs to use more checkdown options knowing this O-line sucks but i don't know if it is on Ben or BA.

Last but not least BA boneheaded play calling in the red zone or the way he abandons the plays in 2nd half that worked in first half . Even if we improve Red Zone offense by 40% Steelers will be consistently scoring 25 points.

[NJ-STEELER]

well said pap.

and it extends to the run game as well. we have a big talented RB that we drafted in the 1st round and he tip toes too much when he gets the handoff.

its because the D is penetrating thru the OL, so he needs to go elsewhere with the play

[fezziwig]

I actually believe Ben threw some dump off passes when he was under pressure and we did well with that for some yardage.

[brothervad]

ahh let us look back on the career that is Kevin Colbert:

it's obviously subjective but red = bust, Orange = got some mileage out of the pick, Green = value, Blue = undecided.

2011 I did not anontate, and 2010 the jury still out even on guys that aren't on the team anymore but still may provide value in the NFL. I have no problems ammending this but the initial assessment is shocking.

Part of the reason the Steelers O is not elite has to do with Arians, but the other problem is that this franchise has failed to build an effective offensive front for their franchise QB.

The old saying goes that football starts out at the pits...look at the years of bad selections on both sides of the line. Anyone want to know are D-line is long in tooth look at the drafts since Ben. It's abysmal.

2011 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd 1, Pick 31 (31) Heyward, Cam DT
Rd 2, Pick 31 (63) Gilbert, Marcus OL
Rd 3, Pick 31 (95) Brown, Curtis DB
Rd 4, Pick 31 (128) Allen, Cortez DB
Rd 5, Pick 31 (162) Carter, Chris DL
Rd 6, Pick 31 (196) Williams, Keith OL
Rd 7, Pick 29 (232) Batch, Baron RB





2010 - Pittsburgh Steelers
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 18 Maurkice Pouncey C Florida
2 52 Jason Worilds LB Virginia Tech
3 82 Emmanuel Sanders WR Southern Methodist
4 116 Thaddeus Gibson LB Ohio State
5 151 Chris Scott T Tennessee
5 164 Crezdon Butler DB Clemson
5 166 Stevenson Sylvester LB Utah
6 188 Jonathan Dwyer RB Georgia Tech
6 195 Antonio Brown WR Central Michigan
7 242 Doug Worthington DE Ohio State




2009 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 32 Ziggy Hood DT Missouri
3 79 Kraig Urbik T Wisconsin
3 84 Mike Wallace WR Mississippi
3 96 Keenan Lewis DB Oregon State
5 168 Joe Burnett DB Central Florida
5 169 Frank Summers RB Las Vegas
6 205 Ra'Shon Harris DT Oregon
7 226 A.Q. Shipley C Penn State
7 241 David Johnson TE Arkansas State


2008 - Pittsburgh Steelers
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 23 Rashard Mendenhall RB Illinois
2 53 Limas Sweed WR Texas
3 88 Bruce Davis LB UCLA
4 130 Tony Hills T Texas
5 156 Dennis Dixon QB Oregon
6 188 Mike Humpal OLB Iowa
6 194 Ryan Mundy FS West Virginia


2007 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 15 Lawrence Timmons LB Florida State
2 46 LaMarr Woodley LB Michigan
3 77 Matt Spaeth TE Minnesota
4 112 Daniel Sepulveda P Baylor
4 132 Ryan McBean DE Oklahoma State
5 156 Came5 170 William Gay CB Louisville
ron Stephenson G Rutgers
7 227 Dallas Baker WR Florida


2006 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 25 Santonio Holmes WR Ohio State
3 83 Anthony Smith DB Syracuse
3 95 Willie Reid WR Florida State
4 131 Willie Colon T Hofstra
4 133 Orien Harris DT Miami (Fla.)
5 164 Omar Jacobs QB Bowling Green State
5 167 Charles Davis TE Purdue
6 201 Marvin Philip C California
7 240 Cedric Humes RB Virginia Tech


2005 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 30 Heath Miller TE Virginia
2 62 Bryant McFadden DB Florida State
3 93 Trai Essex T Northwestern
4 131 Fred Gibson WR Georgia
5 166 Rian Wallace LB Temple
6 204 Chris Kemoeatu G Utah
7 228 Shaun Nua DE Brigham Young
7 244 Noah Herron RB Northwestern


2004 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 11 Ben Roethlisberger QB Miami (Ohio)
2 38 Ricardo Colclough CB Tusculum
3 75 Max Starks T Florida
5 145 Nathaniel Adibi DE Virginia Tech
6 177 Bo Lacy T Arkansas
6 194 Matt Kranchick TE Penn State
6 197 Drew Caylor C Stanford
7 212 Eric Taylor DT Memphis

[fezziwig]

That's a lot of red

[steelfin]

I believe its a combination of a subpar OL and OC...

But I am sure it has something to do with our defensive scheme and washed up DC... :stirpot

[NJ-STEELER]

and just to add my 2 cents on the topic of weapons.

i like our guys and feel we have enough to win with, but they aren't near the top of the league compared to others. we have some nice depth but lack in matching skill level of the top units

[SteelAbility]

If the Steelers can solve their goal-line problems, I think they are pushing elite.

[hawaiiansteel]

we have some nice depth but lack in matching skill level of the top units

a good example of that to me is the way the Pats* use their top two TEs Rob Gronkowski and Aaron Hernandez so effectively in the passing game.

so far in their first two games against the Dolphins and Chargers Gronkowski and Hernandez have combined for 27 receptions good for 337 yards and 5 TDs.

meanwhile, Heath Miller has caught 4 passes for 58 yards and 0 TDs the first two games while DJ Johnson and Weslye Saunders have yet to catch even one pass.

the difference between our TEs production and that of the Pats* duo is pretty significant.

[Mister Pittsburgh]

The reason I say Ben is he is a visual & reactionary QB & not a robot. How many timing patterns do you see him run?

[JAdams8777]

We have not drafted talent on the offensive line, with the exception of Pouncey and Gilbert, in a long time. We also lack speed at Tight End. Miller is a great blocker and has tremendous hands, but he is not running away from anyone. He makes his plays running crisp routes and catching the ball in traffic. A fast TE would be a huge asset with Wallace and Brown stretching the top of the defense.

[fordfixer]

We have not drafted talent on the offensive line, with the exception of Pouncey and Gilbert, in a long time. We also lack speed at Tight End. Miller is a great blocker and has tremendous hands, but he is not running away from anyone. He makes his plays running crisp routes and catching the ball in traffic. A fast TE would be a huge asset with Wallace and Brown stretching the top of the defense.


Welcome to the Planet :tt1

[grotonsteel]

We have not drafted talent on the offensive line, with the exception of Pouncey and Gilbert, in a long time. We also lack speed at Tight End. Miller is a great blocker and has tremendous hands, but he is not running away from anyone. He makes his plays running crisp routes and catching the ball in traffic. A fast TE would be a huge asset with Wallace and Brown stretching the top of the defense.


:Agree

[feltdizz]

we have some nice depth but lack in matching skill level of the top units

a good example of that to me is the way the Pats* use their top two TEs Rob Gronkowski and Aaron Hernandez so effectively in the passing game.

so far in their first two games against the Dolphins and Chargers Gronkowski and Hernandez have combined for 27 receptions good for 337 yards and 5 TDs.

meanwhile, Heath Miller has caught 4 passes for 58 yards and 0 TDs the first two games while DJ Johnson and Weslye Saunders have yet to catch even one pass.

the difference between our TEs production and that of the Pats* duo is pretty significant.

Billicheat stresses TE's in the redzone...

we don't.

[Dee Dub]

I have a different idea on this and may be a little unpopular but here you go...

Two of those three speedy receivers you (shawn), talk about arent on the field all that often. Brown and Sanders come in on 3 and 4 wr sets. For the most part Hines Ward is either the primary or secondary look in Ben's progressions. I love Hines Ward and he is a legit hall of famer but he should not be any higher than 4 on this pecking order at this stage of his career. He has a hard time getting open and then combine that with the O-line issues and you are looking at an offensive approach that isnt going to be clicking on all cylinders.

Also...David Johnson doenst help much either. A horrible blocker.

[frankthetank1]

Considering we have a franchise QB, 3 speedy talented WRs, of the best TEs in the game, and a top tier RB...why on this green earth are we not putting up points like the Pats, Packers and Saints?

Is it all our OL? In my opinion it has to be the system...it has to be the coaching.


Steelers think a great Defense and adequate O is good enough to win a SB. Steelers FO has not spent much money on the Offense. You are not going to get an elite Offense by picking somone else reject on the team. Steelers LT and RG position are absolute scrubs. Now i don't expect all-pro players there but if your O-line can't block 4-man rush its an issue. If you look at Ravens game Ben did not have even time to set his feet on a 3-step drop. That is on O-line.

Regarding 3 speedy WRs...Mike Wallace is a one trick pony. Great at it but still one trick pony. Antonio Brown does not know where he should be on the field.Only WR that runs his route well is Manny. I believe these 3 speedy WRs will need 1 yr to become good WRs. I really loved the way Ravens game planned against Steelers. The only throws that were available to Ben were sideline throws.

I also think the notion that we should run ball 25 times a game is killing this Offense. Steelers will never score high if they keep running the ball 25-30 times a game unless their YPA is 6.0 or something which is clearly not the case. One major reason Steelers keep running the ball is TOP which is important i think and helps the Defense tremendously.

Mendy had a YPA of 3.9 which is average at best in my book. To me it tells me O-line is not doing its job because i think Mendy is a Top-tier RB.

I think Ben also needs to use more checkdown options knowing this O-line sucks but i don't know if it is on Ben or BA.

Last but not least BA boneheaded play calling in the red zone or the way he abandons the plays in 2nd half that worked in first half . Even if we improve Red Zone offense by 40% Steelers will be consistently scoring 25 points.

wallace hasnt caught a deep ball yet this season but has still put up great numbers. the days of wallace being a "one trick pony" are over. even in the super bowl he had a lot of catches for 100+ yards. he is already a complete wr. i dont know about brown not knowing where he should be on the field. he had at least 4 nice catches yesterday. i think most of the problem on offense is the crap scheme and the crap o-line. its odd to me that so far this season the only wr screens that have been called are to hines. he is the last wr on this team i would want catching a screen pass

[Sonny]

Our coordinators are among the most sought after for the position of Head Coach, year after year.

Why not Bruce?

[feltdizz]

bruce is old... look around the league. Old coaches aren't in high demand.

[Slapstick]

ahh let us look back on the career that is Kevin Colbert:

it's obviously subjective but red = bust, Orange = got some mileage out of the pick, Green = value, Blue = undecided.

2011 I did not anontate, and 2010 the jury still out even on guys that aren't on the team anymore but still may provide value in the NFL. I have no problems ammending this but the initial assessment is shocking.

Part of the reason the Steelers O is not elite has to do with Arians, but the other problem is that this franchise has failed to build an effective offensive front for their franchise QB.

The old saying goes that football starts out at the pits...look at the years of bad selections on both sides of the line. Anyone want to know are D-line is long in tooth look at the drafts since Ben. It's abysmal.

2011 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd 1, Pick 31 (31) Heyward, Cam DT
Rd 2, Pick 31 (63) Gilbert, Marcus OL
Rd 3, Pick 31 (95) Brown, Curtis DB
Rd 4, Pick 31 (128) Allen, Cortez DB
Rd 5, Pick 31 (162) Carter, Chris DL
Rd 6, Pick 31 (196) Williams, Keith OL
Rd 7, Pick 29 (232) Batch, Baron RB





2010 - Pittsburgh Steelers
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 18 Maurkice Pouncey C Florida
2 52 Jason Worilds LB Virginia Tech
3 82 Emmanuel Sanders WR Southern Methodist
4 116 Thaddeus Gibson LB Ohio State
5 151 Chris Scott T Tennessee
5 164 Crezdon Butler DB Clemson
5 166 Stevenson Sylvester LB Utah
6 188 Jonathan Dwyer RB Georgia Tech
6 195 Antonio Brown WR Central Michigan
7 242 Doug Worthington DE Ohio State




2009 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 32 Ziggy Hood DT Missouri
3 79 Kraig Urbik T Wisconsin
3 84 Mike Wallace WR Mississippi
3 96 Keenan Lewis DB Oregon State
5 168 Joe Burnett DB Central Florida
5 169 Frank Summers RB Las Vegas
6 205 Ra'Shon Harris DT Oregon
7 226 A.Q. Shipley C Penn State
7 241 David Johnson TE Arkansas State


2008 - Pittsburgh Steelers
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 23 Rashard Mendenhall RB Illinois
2 53 Limas Sweed WR Texas
3 88 Bruce Davis LB UCLA
4 130 Tony Hills T Texas
5 156 Dennis Dixon QB Oregon
6 188 Mike Humpal OLB Iowa
6 194 Ryan Mundy FS West Virginia


2007 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 15 Lawrence Timmons LB Florida State
2 46 LaMarr Woodley LB Michigan
3 77 Matt Spaeth TE Minnesota
4 112 Daniel Sepulveda P Baylor
4 132 Ryan McBean DE Oklahoma State
5 156 Came5 170 William Gay CB Louisville
ron Stephenson G Rutgers
7 227 Dallas Baker WR Florida


2006 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 25 Santonio Holmes WR Ohio State
3 83 Anthony Smith DB Syracuse
3 95 Willie Reid WR Florida State
4 131 Willie Colon T Hofstra
4 133 Orien Harris DT Miami (Fla.)
5 164 Omar Jacobs QB Bowling Green State
5 167 Charles Davis TE Purdue
6 201 Marvin Philip C California
7 240 Cedric Humes RB Virginia Tech


2005 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 30 Heath Miller TE Virginia
2 62 Bryant McFadden DB Florida State
3 93 Trai Essex T Northwestern
4 131 Fred Gibson WR Georgia
5 166 Rian Wallace LB Temple
6 204 Chris Kemoeatu G Utah
7 228 Shaun Nua DE Brigham Young
7 244 Noah Herron RB Northwestern


2004 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 11 Ben Roethlisberger QB Miami (Ohio)
2 38 Ricardo Colclough CB Tusculum
3 75 Max Starks T Florida
5 145 Nathaniel Adibi DE Virginia Tech
6 177 Bo Lacy T Arkansas
6 194 Matt Kranchick TE Penn State
6 197 Drew Caylor C Stanford
7 212 Eric Taylor DT Memphis

Please help me...

What exactly is your criteria for "bust" status? Is Jonathan Dwyer a bust because he didn't put Mendenhall out on the street?

The Steelers "got some mileage" out of Thaddeus Gibson, despite the fact that he's no longer on the team and was cut midway through his rookie year, but Chris Scott and Ryan Mundy, who are both still on the team, are busts?

[brothervad]

ahh let us look back on the career that is Kevin Colbert:

it's obviously subjective but red = bust, Orange = got some mileage out of the pick, Green = value, Blue = undecided.

2011 I did not anontate, and 2010 the jury still out even on guys that aren't on the team anymore but still may provide value in the NFL. I have no problems ammending this but the initial assessment is shocking.

Part of the reason the Steelers O is not elite has to do with Arians, but the other problem is that this franchise has failed to build an effective offensive front for their franchise QB.

The old saying goes that football starts out at the pits...look at the years of bad selections on both sides of the line. Anyone want to know are D-line is long in tooth look at the drafts since Ben. It's abysmal.

2011 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd 1, Pick 31 (31) Heyward, Cam DT
Rd 2, Pick 31 (63) Gilbert, Marcus OL
Rd 3, Pick 31 (95) Brown, Curtis DB
Rd 4, Pick 31 (128) Allen, Cortez DB
Rd 5, Pick 31 (162) Carter, Chris DL
Rd 6, Pick 31 (196) Williams, Keith OL
Rd 7, Pick 29 (232) Batch, Baron RB





2010 - Pittsburgh Steelers
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 18 Maurkice Pouncey C Florida
2 52 Jason Worilds LB Virginia Tech
3 82 Emmanuel Sanders WR Southern Methodist
4 116 Thaddeus Gibson LB Ohio State
5 151 Chris Scott T Tennessee
5 164 Crezdon Butler DB Clemson
5 166 Stevenson Sylvester LB Utah
6 188 Jonathan Dwyer RB Georgia Tech
6 195 Antonio Brown WR Central Michigan
7 242 Doug Worthington DE Ohio State




2009 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 32 Ziggy Hood DT Missouri
3 79 Kraig Urbik T Wisconsin
3 84 Mike Wallace WR Mississippi
3 96 Keenan Lewis DB Oregon State
5 168 Joe Burnett DB Central Florida
5 169 Frank Summers RB Las Vegas
6 205 Ra'Shon Harris DT Oregon
7 226 A.Q. Shipley C Penn State
7 241 David Johnson TE Arkansas State


2008 - Pittsburgh Steelers
Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 23 Rashard Mendenhall RB Illinois
2 53 Limas Sweed WR Texas
3 88 Bruce Davis LB UCLA
4 130 Tony Hills T Texas
5 156 Dennis Dixon QB Oregon
6 188 Mike Humpal OLB Iowa
6 194 Ryan Mundy FS West Virginia


2007 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 15 Lawrence Timmons LB Florida State
2 46 LaMarr Woodley LB Michigan
3 77 Matt Spaeth TE Minnesota
4 112 Daniel Sepulveda P Baylor
4 132 Ryan McBean DE Oklahoma State
5 156 Came5 170 William Gay CB Louisville
ron Stephenson G Rutgers
7 227 Dallas Baker WR Florida


2006 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 25 Santonio Holmes WR Ohio State
3 83 Anthony Smith DB Syracuse
3 95 Willie Reid WR Florida State
4 131 Willie Colon T Hofstra
4 133 Orien Harris DT Miami (Fla.)
5 164 Omar Jacobs QB Bowling Green State
5 167 Charles Davis TE Purdue
6 201 Marvin Philip C California
7 240 Cedric Humes RB Virginia Tech


2005 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 30 Heath Miller TE Virginia
2 62 Bryant McFadden DB Florida State
3 93 Trai Essex T Northwestern
4 131 Fred Gibson WR Georgia
5 166 Rian Wallace LB Temple
6 204 Chris Kemoeatu G Utah
7 228 Shaun Nua DE Brigham Young
7 244 Noah Herron RB Northwestern


2004 - Pittsburgh Steelers

Rd Sel # Player Position School
1 11 Ben Roethlisberger QB Miami (Ohio)
2 38 Ricardo Colclough CB Tusculum
3 75 Max Starks T Florida
5 145 Nathaniel Adibi DE Virginia Tech
6 177 Bo Lacy T Arkansas
6 194 Matt Kranchick TE Penn State
6 197 Drew Caylor C Stanford
7 212 Eric Taylor DT Memphis

Please help me...

What exactly is your criteria for "bust" status? Is Jonathan Dwyer a bust because he didn't put Mendenhall out on the street?

The Steelers "got some mileage" out of Thaddeus Gibson, despite the fact that he's no longer on the team and was cut midway through his rookie year, but Chris Scott and Ryan Mundy, who are both still on the team, are busts?

Not to sound defensive but I did suggest it was a highly subjective analysis. I would be happy to concede the point on all of your comments and still stand by my original premise.

My main point was more about the lack of building the two lines over the years since Ben was drafted.

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

I have a different idea on this and may be a little unpopular but here you go...

Two of those three speedy receivers you (shawn), talk about arent on the field all that often. Brown and Sanders come in on 3 and 4 wr sets. For the most part Hines Ward is either the primary or secondary look in Ben's progressions. I love Hines Ward and he is a legit hall of famer but he should not be any higher than 4 on this pecking order at this stage of his career. He has a hard time getting open and then combine that with the O-line issues and you are looking at an offensive approach that isnt going to be clicking on all cylinders.

Also...David Johnson doenst help much either. A horrible blocker.

So Dee, if we go to a standard formation of 3 WR (Wallace, Brown, Sanders), 1 TE (Miller), 1 RB (Mendenhall) we will have less pressure coming because the D will have to devote their extra pass rushers to coverage, especially if we don't use BA's favorite formation that bunches three receivers in tight.

Something to consider, however, teams like Baltimore are able to get immediate pressure without committing extra men to the blitz. Sugga and Ngata were all over Ben, even with a three or four man rush.

I would like to see this formation in action though, I think that they could do some damage with it when Ben gets time.

[Slapstick]

I would definitely put in 3 WRs, a TE and an RB vs. the Ravens...

Do to them what teams do to us...spread them out and throw some quick passes...that will frost Pagano...

[hawaiiansteel]

Lack of Push on Steelers Offensive Line is Killing Running Game and Big Ben

SEP 20th 2011
AUTHOR: Craig

http://nicepickcowher.com/files/2011/09/09000d5d82255ec2_gallery_600-300x240.jpg

Mendy was short of the goal line a few times on Sunday.

As I sat there and watched the Steelers fail to break the plane of the goal line on not one but two offensive series, I started to wonder why the offensive line had no push off the ball. ’Were the blocking sleds made out of aluminum or something in training camp and at practice?’ The offensive line for the Steelers has absolutely no push off the snap of the ball and it’s killing the running game, and ultimately Big Ben. The only smash mouth football the offense is experiencing right now is in the form of Ben Roethlisberger taking hits and sacks continuously throughout the game.

Perhaps Bruce Arians is more brilliant than we all thought… or at least the amazing ability of foresight. Could it be that Arians recognized that his offensive line never possessed the collective talent to be the huge run blocking force that it used to be during the days of Jerome Bettis and Willie Parker? It’s not that the Steelers can’t run the ball at all – they just can’t be the ball control offense they once were. Mendenhall is fast enough that if he can get the edge, he gains a fair amount of yards. Rarely do we see any holes open up for a significant gain on the inside corners. This occurred in both games against the Ravens and Seahawks – both teams with good defensive lines.

Arians stated earlier this season that he wanted the passing game to ramp up. Again, maybe he had the foresight to recognize that the offense would struggle in the run when it came to pushing the o-line forward. Maybe those two goal line stances were his way of confirming his premonitions. No push in the running game means that even on 3rd and short, the offense is in a better position to throw for a first than run for one. If for one do not trust the offensive line to get us a 1st down on a 3rd and short if the Steelers were to run the ball. Less trust in the run, means more passing – but that’s not necessarily a better scenario either.

Big Ben is constantly avoiding the rush of the defense. He is hit on numerous passing plays throughout the game. He’s been sacked 6 times in two games – par for the course. This trend however, is more damaging to a 29 year old than a 24 or 25 year old. Perhaps that’s why Big Ben threw about a bazillion short slant passes on Sunday. He’s got the fast receivers for quick strikes, and even the PPG reported this morning that Ben’s release has gotten much faster – amazing that his brain and body are able to work together for means of self preservation… the 0-line sure isn’t helping.

We don't ever really want to see this happening again.

But, how long can Ben self preserve? A major part of his brain has the champion running a full tilt, so he is going to extend the play as much as he can if it means taking another step towards winning the game. That, no one will ever be able to turn off. But as we saw on Sunday, even getting rid of the ball on time can have ill effects if the pocket is not solidified. Every single person in Steelers Nation had their hearts skip a beat and waited on bated breath after Raheem Brock went for Ben’s knees (yeah I don’t care what anyone says – you watch that replay and you can see that Brock lowers his head and shoulders towards Ben’s knees instead of extending his arms to prevent that kind of hit). That was very close to the way Tom Brady’s season ended a few years ago and what would eventually create the ‘Tom Brady’ rule from its fallout (doubtful there would ever be a Ben Roethlisberger rule). There’s going to be a time when the offensive line will cave one too many times, and Big Ben will pay the price in a season ending injury. Let’s face it, injuries are a part of the game and Ben gets beat up a lot – direct result from the o-line or not. But if Ben is such an elite QB and the Steelers’ franchise QB, then shouldn’t they do everything in their power to get an offensive line together that will help protect him at the very least? Can you imagine what this offense would look like if we had to depend on Byron Lefty’s slow release? I’d take a 45 year old Charlie Batch over that.

Perhaps this is where Tomlin’s (and Colbert’s) and Arian’s philosophies really diverge. Tomlin (and Colbert) is willing to spend the dough to sign three defensive players (Taylor, Woodley and Polamalu) but not spend the dough on the offensive line and release players who were on that line in last year’s Super Bowl season.

http://nicepickcowher.com/2011/09/20/la ... #more-9727 (http://nicepickcowher.com/2011/09/20/lack-of-push-on-steelers-offensive-line-is-killing-running-game-and-big-ben/#more-9727)