Safety First? What About Roethlisberger?

[hawaiiansteel]

Safety First? What About Roethlisberger?

By Jim Wexell
SteelCityInsider.net
Posted Aug 24, 2011

http://media.scout.com/Media/Image/96/963328.jpg

The hits keep coming for Ben Roethlisberger -- late hits, low hits, cheap hits. But he won't complain, and for good reason.


PITTSBURGH – It’s bugging Ben Roethlisberger, make no mistake.

The Steelers’ quarterback was hit late after his first pass of his first preseason game this season, and then was hit late after his first pass of his second preseason game.

After both plays, replays showed the referee clearly eyeballing the late hit, but neither time did he throw a flag.

Roethlisberger was asked Tuesday whether he wanted to comment, but he chose to keep quiet.

“If I start complaining about that, they might call in-the-grasp more quickly, more often,” Roethlisberger said of what was another poor call last Thursday against Philadelphia.

“It’s too fine of a line right now,” he said.

So, what is it with the officiating in this alleged era of safety? Why does the Steelers’ quarterback continue to take a pounding and yet no one has anything to say about it?

“We’ll let you do all the complaining,” said Brett Keisel, one of Roethlisberger’s close friends. “Or better yet, go ask Pounce about it.”

Maurkice Pouncey, young, tough, respected center, is also a known hot head.

Hey, Maurkice, you got a minute?

“Sure, babe, what you need?”

What about your quarterback getting hit late in the first two preseason games?

“Man, that ain’t right,” said last season’s rookie Pro Bowler. “Any other team that would happen to, things would probably differently. We’ve just got to deal with it and hopefully they pick it up next time.”

What would you do if you saw someone hitting him late?

“I’d run up to the dude and say something – at the least,” Pouncey said. “That just ain’t right.”

OK, that’s a start.

Ramon Foster, last year’s right guard, has a hot streak to him. What do you think, Ramon?

“It’s definitely getting a little ridiculous right now,” Foster said. “I know we have a tough quarterback and stuff like that but certain things should be called fairly throughout the whole league, no matter if you’re a prime-time guy or just a guy getting his first start. It’s one of those things where you take care of the quarterback like that.”

Do officials let defenders get away with hitting Roethlisberger late because of his size and toughness?

“I really couldn’t tell you,” Foster said. “But you can’t really say too much about it because you may get a fine. Um, just hopefully they catch it and call it when they see it.”

“We’ve been trying to shine a light on it for a while,” said right tackle Willie Colon. “But it’s up to the referees. No matter how much you complain about it, they’re still going to react how they want to react.”

Might an all-out brawl help?

Colon smiled a knowing smile. “A lot of times I haven’t seen it. Most of the time I’m blocking my guy,” he said. “But if I ever saw anything deliberate or out of bounds, I’d be the first one to step up.”

Yep. That’s a start.

http://pit.scout.com/2/1098865.html

[SteelTorch]

The officiating in this league is at an all-time low. It's now gotten to the point where it's actually damaging my love for the sport. :?

[flippy]

I'll take them letting Ben play. It gives us a better chance at the big plays and Ben's a tough SOB.

Even on the play where his helmet got ripped off, Ben didn't go down. If the refs didn't stop that play, Ben could have seriously still made a play down field after that.

Ben's a beast. Let him be a beast.

Not complaining about this stuff can be intimidating to a degree. Any other QB would be complaining, but Ben doesn't. It send the message, Ben owns QB pressure. Send the house after him, he doesn't care. It's gotta be a little maddening to a defense playing against Ben. You can't hit him and get him out of his game.

Really the only way to play Ben is rushing 3 and dropping 8 and trying to confuse him with coverage. You're wasting your time trying to pressure this guy.

[steelblood]

I'll take them letting Ben play. It gives us a better chance at the big plays and Ben's a tough SOB.

Even on the play where his helmet got ripped off, Ben didn't go down. If the refs didn't stop that play, Ben could have seriously still made a play down field after that.

Ben's a beast. Let him be a beast.

Not complaining about this stuff can be intimidating to a degree. Any other QB would be complaining, but Ben doesn't. It send the message, Ben owns QB pressure. Send the house after him, he doesn't care. It's gotta be a little maddening to a defense playing against Ben. You can't hit him and get him out of his game.

Really the only way to play Ben is rushing 3 and dropping 8 and trying to confuse him with coverage. You're wasting your time trying to pressure this guy.

I totally disagree. Baltimore will blitz Ben because they know they can get hits on him. They would love to injure him and knock him out of the game or make him miss part of the season. That is their best chance to win the division.

[phillyesq]

I'll take them letting Ben play. It gives us a better chance at the big plays and Ben's a tough SOB.

Even on the play where his helmet got ripped off, Ben didn't go down. If the refs didn't stop that play, Ben could have seriously still made a play down field after that.

Ben's a beast. Let him be a beast.

Not complaining about this stuff can be intimidating to a degree. Any other QB would be complaining, but Ben doesn't. It send the message, Ben owns QB pressure. Send the house after him, he doesn't care. It's gotta be a little maddening to a defense playing against Ben. You can't hit him and get him out of his game.

Really the only way to play Ben is rushing 3 and dropping 8 and trying to confuse him with coverage. You're wasting your time trying to pressure this guy.

I'll take the refs letting Ben play if they actually let him play. But from what I've seen, they don't. They're very quick to call in the grasp against Ben, but ignore blatant late hits. I haven't made it all the way through the Falcons game yet, but the hit by Babin in the Eagles game was beyond dirty.

[Eich]

I'll take them letting Ben play. It gives us a better chance at the big plays and Ben's a tough SOB.

Even on the play where his helmet got ripped off, Ben didn't go down. If the refs didn't stop that play, Ben could have seriously still made a play down field after that.

Ben's a beast. Let him be a beast.

Not complaining about this stuff can be intimidating to a degree. Any other QB would be complaining, but Ben doesn't. It send the message, Ben owns QB pressure. Send the house after him, he doesn't care. It's gotta be a little maddening to a defense playing against Ben. You can't hit him and get him out of his game.

Really the only way to play Ben is rushing 3 and dropping 8 and trying to confuse him with coverage. You're wasting your time trying to pressure this guy.

I'll take the refs letting Ben play if they actually let him play. But from what I've seen, they don't. They're very quick to call in the grasp against Ben, but ignore blatant late hits. I haven't made it all the way through the Falcons game yet, but the hit by Babin in the Eagles game was beyond dirty.

I agree. We now have the WORST of both worlds:

1. Teams know they can hit Ben anyway they want. Slam him to the turf, break his nose, rip off his helmet, hell... even punch him directly in the head when the play is over and there will be NO flag whatsoever.

2. Teams also now know that if they get a good handful of jersey, the Refs are going to call in-the-grasp.

Complete BS. I think the 2 accusations against Ben made the situation worse for Ben. It seems like the league is intent on making him continue to pay on-the-field.

[Oviedo]

I'll take them letting Ben play. It gives us a better chance at the big plays and Ben's a tough SOB.

Even on the play where his helmet got ripped off, Ben didn't go down. If the refs didn't stop that play, Ben could have seriously still made a play down field after that.

Ben's a beast. Let him be a beast.

Not complaining about this stuff can be intimidating to a degree. Any other QB would be complaining, but Ben doesn't. It send the message, Ben owns QB pressure. Send the house after him, he doesn't care. It's gotta be a little maddening to a defense playing against Ben. You can't hit him and get him out of his game.

Really the only way to play Ben is rushing 3 and dropping 8 and trying to confuse him with coverage. You're wasting your time trying to pressure this guy.

I'll take the refs letting Ben play if they actually let him play. But from what I've seen, they don't. They're very quick to call in the grasp against Ben, but ignore blatant late hits. I haven't made it all the way through the Falcons game yet, but the hit by Babin in the Eagles game was beyond dirty.

I agree. We now have the WORST of both worlds:

1. Teams know they can hit Ben anyway they want. Slam him to the turf, break his nose, rip off his helmet, hell... even punch him directly in the head when the play is over and there will be NO flag whatsoever.

2. Teams also now know that if they get a good handful of jersey, the Refs are going to call in-the-grasp.

Complete BS. I think the 2 accusations against Ben made the situation worse for Ben. It seems like the league is intent on making him continue to pay on-the-field.

Teams also know that with Leftwich hurt our back ups are Batch and Dixon, so we are pretty much screwed if Ben gets hurt. That will encourage them to tee off on Ben even more.

[steelz09]

I'm not a huge fan of Vick but he doesn't get the calls either.

Goodell's rule is geared around the stereotypical "pocket passer" (Brees, Manning, Brady) that doesn't have much mobility skills.

Vick used to be more of an athlete than a QB and I think that is starting to reverse.

Ben is more of a QB w/ above average athleticism especially for a QB.

I'd be curious to know whether Rodgers gets those calls because he has athleticism.

[birtikidis]

I'll take them letting Ben play. It gives us a better chance at the big plays and Ben's a tough SOB.

Even on the play where his helmet got ripped off, Ben didn't go down. If the refs didn't stop that play, Ben could have seriously still made a play down field after that.

Ben's a beast. Let him be a beast.

Not complaining about this stuff can be intimidating to a degree. Any other QB would be complaining, but Ben doesn't. It send the message, Ben owns QB pressure. Send the house after him, he doesn't care. It's gotta be a little maddening to a defense playing against Ben. You can't hit him and get him out of his game.

Really the only way to play Ben is rushing 3 and dropping 8 and trying to confuse him with coverage. You're wasting your time trying to pressure this guy.
You'll say that until Ben gets broken.

[flippy]

If he breaks, he breaks. I don't want to see my QB in a skirt. This is football.

And when you have a QB willing to take shots and not complain, it sets the tone for the rest of the team. I for one applaud Ben's reaction.

It's only gonna make the rest of the guys work harder for him.

Let Tomlin or BA complain for Ben. And Ben can just keep doing his thing. It's a fine line and if we force the refs to remove the line instead of letting Ben remove it, we're gonna be in bigger trouble cause Ben's game is all about the big play under pressure.

And let the Ravens have their shots. This is football. I'd expect them to take their shots. Otherwise it wouldn't be as competitive or intense.

[pittpete]

Maybe Ben can plead his case to Brady.
Im sure if Tom complains good ole Roger will do something about it.
I mean there are 2 rules made just for this guy in the last few years. :roll:

[RuthlessBurgher]

Way to embrace your inner Drago, flip.


If he breaks, he breaks.

http://www.myteespot.com/images/Images_d/DSCF7334.jpg

[feltdizz]

If he breaks, he breaks. I don't want to see my QB in a skirt. This is football.

And when you have a QB willing to take shots and not complain, it sets the tone for the rest of the team. I for one applaud Ben's reaction.

It's only gonna make the rest of the guys work harder for him.

Let Tomlin or BA complain for Ben. And Ben can just keep doing his thing. It's a fine line and if we force the refs to remove the line instead of letting Ben remove it, we're gonna be in bigger trouble cause Ben's game is all about the big play under pressure.

And let the Ravens have their shots. This is football. I'd expect them to take their shots. Otherwise it wouldn't be as competitive or intense.

I disagree... when a player takes 3 steps after the ball is released and goes low at Ben's knee's that is dirty.

I have no problem with a slower whistle due to Ben's style but that doesn't mean guys can get free shots at him after he has released the ball.

[flippy]

Way to embrace your inner Drago, flip.


If he breaks, he breaks.

http://www.myteespot.com/images/Images_d/DSCF7334.jpg

I can't slip any references past you.

[insanesteelersfan]

Bottom line, Ben gets the least amount of respect that ANY QB who is, or SHOULD be considered a Super Star player. I don't wanna see Ben complain publically no. But, I WOULD like to see, after a Late hit on Ben, have Ben go,,," Paul Crewe " on that Defensive player by launching the ball at 80 MPH right at that players " NUT SACK "...just like in " The longest Yard " :lol:




That will teach T-Suggs and the rest a lesson!!

[flippy]

Bottom line, Ben gets the least amount of respect that ANY QB who is, or SHOULD be considered a Super Star player. I don't wanna see Ben complain publically no. But, I WOULD like to see, after a Late hit on Ben, have Ben go,,," Paul Crewe " on that Defensive player by launching the ball at 80 MPH right at that players " NUT SACK "...just like in " The longest Yard " :lol:




That will teach T-Suggs and the rest a lesson!!

Look at it from the defenders point of view. This isn't like hitting any other QB. Ben's bigger than most defenders and he doesn't go down. The defenders have to go all out to tackle him.

Brady, Brees, Peyton, etc are going down when you hit them. Ben simply doesn't.

If Ben went down like a China Doll, then they'd have to protect him. But he doesn't so they don't. It's not a Steelers disrespect thing as much as an athleticism, size, and capability thing

[insanesteelersfan]

Bottom line, Ben gets the least amount of respect that ANY QB who is, or SHOULD be considered a Super Star player. I don't wanna see Ben complain publically no. But, I WOULD like to see, after a Late hit on Ben, have Ben go,,," Paul Crewe " on that Defensive player by launching the ball at 80 MPH right at that players " NUT SACK "...just like in " The longest Yard " :lol:




That will teach T-Suggs and the rest a lesson!!

Look at it from the defenders point of view. This isn't like hitting any other QB. Ben's bigger than most defenders and he doesn't go down. The defenders have to go all out to tackle him.

Brady, Brees, Peyton, etc are going down when you hit them. Ben simply doesn't.

If Ben went down like a China Doll, then they'd have to protect him. But he doesn't so they don't. It's not a Steelers disrespect thing as much as an athleticism, size, and capability thing




One's size has nothing to do with it Flippy. I mean Manning is 6ft, 5 and 240 Lbs,,,I mean he is everybit as big and as strong as Ben is. And all of Ben's size means nothing if a defensive player can rip at his helmet, or if he lands incorrectly on his arm right after a throw and a defender slams him to the ground. All the size and strength won't mean squat then. ONLY way to prevent this is to,,after it happens, have one of your D-Players take a shot at their QB. Then maybe they will get the message. But, if we wait for Goodell to ever do anything,,,Ben WILL be dead!

[Oviedo]

Bottom line, Ben gets the least amount of respect that ANY QB who is, or SHOULD be considered a Super Star player. I don't wanna see Ben complain publically no. But, I WOULD like to see, after a Late hit on Ben, have Ben go,,," Paul Crewe " on that Defensive player by launching the ball at 80 MPH right at that players " NUT SACK "...just like in " The longest Yard " :lol:




That will teach T-Suggs and the rest a lesson!!

Look at it from the defenders point of view. This isn't like hitting any other QB. Ben's bigger than most defenders and he doesn't go down. The defenders have to go all out to tackle him.

Brady, Brees, Peyton, etc are going down when you hit them. Ben simply doesn't.

If Ben went down like a China Doll, then they'd have to protect him. But he doesn't so they don't. It's not a Steelers disrespect thing as much as an athleticism, size, and capability thing




One's size has nothing to do with it Flippy. I mean Manning is 6ft, 5 and 240 Lbs,,,I mean he is everybit as big and as strong as Ben is. And all of Ben's size means nothing if a defensive player can rip at his helmet, or if he lands incorrectly on his arm right after a throw and a defender slams him to the ground. All the size and strength won't mean squat then. ONLY way to prevent this is to,,after it happens, have one of your D-Players take a shot at their QB. Then maybe they will get the message. But, if we wait for Goodell to ever do anything,,,Ben WILL be dead!

:Agree There are lots of QBs as big as Ben.

Romo is 6'2" 226lbs

Freeman is 6'6" 250lbs

Ryan is 6'4" 225lbs

Flacco is 6' 6" 240lbs

Point is that none of these guys are small and they all get protected except for Ben. If they don't protect Ben we are going to lose him.

[feltdizz]

I think Flippy is talking about how Ben absorbs hits and still gets a pass off. There isn't another QB in the league who can get hit by a blitzing DB, a LB and still get a decent pass off.

My only concern is the cheap shot after he throws the ball...

[flippy]

I think Flippy is talking about how Ben absorbs hits and still gets a pass off. There isn't another QB in the league who can get hit by a blitzing DB, a LB and still get a decent pass off.

My only concern is the cheap shot after he throws the ball...

Exactly.

Call the clearly cheap shots. But let Ben play a little. He needs to be the one to figure out if it's worth it to hold the ball and make a play or get rid of the ball to play another play.

We should be happy the NFL seems to be letting Ben make plays. It's on Ben if he wants to get rid of the ball sooner and not absorb so many hits and have to fight to keep a play alive.

I trust Ben's judgement. And as he gets older, he may get to the point where his body can't take the hits and he'll have to adjust.

[insanesteelersfan]

I think Flippy is talking about how Ben absorbs hits and still gets a pass off. There isn't another QB in the league who can get hit by a blitzing DB, a LB and still get a decent pass off.

My only concern is the cheap shot after he throws the ball...

Exactly.

Call the clearly cheap shots. But let Ben play a little. He needs to be the one to figure out if it's worth it to hold the ball and make a play or get rid of the ball to play another play.

We should be happy the NFL seems to be letting Ben make plays. It's on Ben if he wants to get rid of the ball sooner and not absorb so many hits and have to fight to keep a play alive.

I trust Ben's judgement. And as he gets older, he may get to the point where his body can't take the hits and he'll have to adjust.




The whole thing that Ben holds on to the ball too long, and that's why he gets sacked so much is a MYTH! It is complete BS! I have timed the amount of pocket time Ben averages before he HAS to run to avoid the pressure, and it's LESS then 1.8 seconds per pass play. Ben has NEVER had one single pass play in 6 years where he had more then 3 seconds back there. As where Brady averages over 5 seconds in the pocket before ANY pressure is ever on him. Ben runs around cause most of the time he has no choice to do so. And Ben has taken cheap hits, either low ones, or ones that happen well after the ball has been released then ANY other league QB. And until Tomlin has the Nut sack to tell his players to take the other teams QB out of a game with a shot to his knees or rip off his helmet then SLAM his head on the ground...then Tomlin will ALWAYS be a wimp, and will be putting our franchise QB at risk.



Time for US to start to put a little Darryl Stingley action on the opposing teams QB's,,,so that they get the message to lay off ours. And if that statement sounds too rough or insensative.....TOUGH! This is Football!!

[RuthlessBurgher]

Our coach is a wimp who puts our QB at risk unless he orders our defensive players to take out opposing QB's knees or slam his helmetless head to the ground? Okay. Glad we cleared that up. :roll:

Sweep the leg. Mercy is for the weak. Get him a bodybag, yeah!!! :wft

[insanesteelersfan]

Our coach is a wimp who puts our QB at risk unless he orders our defensive players to take out opposing QB's knees or slam his helmetless head to the ground? Okay. Glad we cleared that up. :roll:

Sweep the leg. Mercy is for the weak. Get him a bodybag, yeah!!! :wft





I never said cheat. I just said to combat violence, one MUST use greater violence. If Ben is NOT cheap-shoted against, then don't do anything. But if he is, then you MUST retaliate. Anything other then that is just showing weakness. Why do you think other teams pitchers hit the opposing batters once their own have been hit earlier in a game ?

[flippy]

Ben can throw the ball away when he gets pressure if he chooses. He typically doesn't.

How many games have you tracked Ben's average time with the ball to come up with your 1.8 second average, insane?

Sorry to doubt the stat, but when you say he's never had more than 3 seconds 1 time since he's been here, that's silly. I bet there's not only more than 1 in 6 years, but there's more than 1 per game, even more than 1 per quarter.

A quick search on Roethlisberger's sacks uncovered this article:
http://www.aolnews.com/2008/06/13/does- ... -too-long/ (http://www.aolnews.com/2008/06/13/does-roethlisberger-hold-onto-the-ball-too-long/)

According to this guy who timed every sack, Ben got sacked in less than 3 seconds on 30 of his 53 sacks. The rest came after the 3 second mark. Maybe this guy's timer was off??? I dunno, I don't go back and time these things myself.

I do notice Ben gets hit quickly sometimes. And other times I notice he has time back there. And I've seen him buy time and not just throw the ball away like most other QBs, so the holding the ball doesn't seem so mythical to me????

Maybe we should just retaliate....

Lebeau - Deebo, I want Flacco out of commission
Deebo - But Lebeau, I can beat this guy
Lebeau - I don't want him beat
Deebo - But I'll be fined
Lebeau - Out of Commission

[feltdizz]

Our coach is a wimp who puts our QB at risk unless he orders our defensive players to take out opposing QB's knees or slam his helmetless head to the ground? Okay. Glad we cleared that up. :roll:

Sweep the leg. Mercy is for the weak. Get him a bodybag, yeah!!! :wft





I never said cheat. I just said to combat violence, one MUST use greater violence. If Ben is NOT cheap-shoted against, then don't do anything. But if he is, then you MUST retaliate. Anything other then that is just showing weakness. Why do you think other teams pitchers hit the opposing batters once their own have been hit earlier in a game ?

It's because they play 200 games a year. If the baseball season was 40 games you wouldn't see pitchers doing that stuff.

As far as Ben never having 3 seconds in 6 years.... that is a damn lie.

Ben usually has just as much time as any other QB besides Brady (except in the playoffs and vs. the Lions the other night :lol:)

The difference is Ben will HOLD ONTO THE BALL while Brady, Peyton and Brees get it out and avoid most hits. The only other elite QB who holds onto the ball is Rodgers and he has concussion problems already. Rodgers has learned to get the ball out much faster as well. He had about 50 sacks his first year as a starter and they have decreased because he realizes he isn't built to take those hits.

Ben can take the hits so he holds onto the ball more often but this preseason he has done a great job of avoiding hits and hitting RB's.

[ikestops85]

I think Flippy is talking about how Ben absorbs hits and still gets a pass off. There isn't another QB in the league who can get hit by a blitzing DB, a LB and still get a decent pass off.

My only concern is the cheap shot after he throws the ball...

Exactly.

Call the clearly cheap shots. But let Ben play a little. He needs to be the one to figure out if it's worth it to hold the ball and make a play or get rid of the ball to play another play.

We should be happy the NFL seems to be letting Ben make plays. It's on Ben if he wants to get rid of the ball sooner and not absorb so many hits and have to fight to keep a play alive.

I trust Ben's judgement. And as he gets older, he may get to the point where his body can't take the hits and he'll have to adjust.




The whole thing that Ben holds on to the ball too long, and that's why he gets sacked so much is a MYTH! It is complete BS! I have timed the amount of pocket time Ben averages before he HAS to run to avoid the pressure, and it's LESS then 1.8 seconds per pass play. Ben has NEVER had one single pass play in 6 years where he had more then 3 seconds back there. As where Brady averages over 5 seconds in the pocket before ANY pressure is ever on him. Ben runs around cause most of the time he has no choice to do so. And Ben has taken cheap hits, either low ones, or ones that happen well after the ball has been released then ANY other league QB. And until Tomlin has the Nut sack to tell his players to take the other teams QB out of a game with a shot to his knees or rip off his helmet then SLAM his head on the ground...then Tomlin will ALWAYS be a wimp, and will be putting our franchise QB at risk.



Time for US to start to put a little Darryl Stingley action on the opposing teams QB's,,,so that they get the message to lay off ours. And if that statement sounds too rough or insensative.....TOUGH! This is Football!!

Where do you get these made up numbers? There are certainly times where Ben has had all day to throw. Not often but it happens. I don't believe Brady AVERAGES over 5 seconds in the pocket before he has to throw. The Pats certainly have a better pass blocking line than us but saying they average 5 seconds is ridiculous. They would be one of the best lines of all time if they did that. Please stop exaggerating to make your point stronger.

[SanAntonioSteelerFan]

...

I just said to combat violence, one MUST use greater violence. If Ben is NOT cheap-shoted against, then don't do anything. But if he is, then you MUST retaliate. Anything other then that is just showing weakness. Why do you think other teams pitchers hit the opposing batters once their own have been hit earlier in a game ?

Can I open the nominations for PlanetSteelers 2011/2012 Martin Luther King, Jr. Awards with this one? :lol: :lol:

Sorry, insane, I know you were just meaning it in this context, and I know what you are saying!! But just about 2 minutes ago having read a quote by MLK, your quote just reached out and poked me in the eye! I owe you one dude ... :Cheers :tt1 :tt2


Nonviolence is the answer to the crucial political and moral questions of our time: the need for man to overcome oppression and violence without resorting to oppression and violence. Man must evolve for all human conflict a method which rejects revenge,aggression and retaliation.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Hate multiplies hate, violence multiplies violence, and toughness multiplies toughness in a descending spiral of destruction... and defense wins Championships.