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Ghost
07-21-2011, 07:33 PM
About damn time! :tt1

Ghost
07-21-2011, 07:35 PM
NFL owners have approved a labor deal and 10-year revenue-sharing agreement with players, Commissioner Roger Goodell announced Thursday evening.

Owners, meeting in Atlanta, in a 31-0 vote agreed to end the current lockout. Training camps could be open by Saturday, Goodell said.

Player representatives scheduled an 8 p.m. conference call in which they were expected to discuss re-certifying their union, allowing playings to vote on an agreement, said Coy Wire of the Atlanta Falcons.

"I do feel good" about the prospects of resolving the situation, Wire told CNN.

The first preseason game -- the annual Pro Football Hall of Fame Game, between the Chicago Bears and St. Louis Rams -- has been canceled, Goodell said. It had been scheduled for August 7.

sentinel33
07-21-2011, 09:56 PM
Not so fast.

It appears that D. Smith called shinanigans.

We have a verbage issue.

It just amazes me how you are so close that you have a verbal agreement and a handshake, but then the other party has to go and screw it all up by being less than honest and trying to slip issues by the PA on top of pressuring the players to get it ratified and have a certified union by tuesday.

Just stinks. And that stench is coming from the owners.

I don't for one second think it was an oversight by the owners. yeah, right.

Just pi$$es me off to no end!!! Sooooooo sick of this childish behavior.

MadSteel
07-21-2011, 10:32 PM
Players: Owners tried to slip items into CBA

Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on July 21, 2011, 9:31 PM EDT

It appears players won’t be voting on ratifying a deal on Thursday night.

One major reason: Players feel that the owners are trying to add new elements to a deal.

“Here is what the ‘Real’ fans need to know: The owners tried to slip many things in to the CBA “they” voted on that were NEVER agreed to!#PRPlay,” Saints fullback Heath Evans said on Twitter.

Similar player source quotes were relayed to various reporters. Mike Silver of Yahoo! Sports talked to an NFLPA* source who had a telling quote, when he said the NFL “will never learn” about backing players into a corner.

The question is whether it will be difficult for the players and owners to get past any emotions from Thursday. It sounds like the players continue to have issues with the agreement presented by the owners.

As long as leadership steps up, the remaining issues shouldn’t be that hard to negotiate. It just may not happen as quickly as owners, players, and fans want.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... -into-cba/ (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/21/players-owners-tried-to-slip-items-into-cba/)

fordfixer
07-21-2011, 10:53 PM
NFLPA does not vote; claims owners’ proposal may violate labor laws

By Doug Farrar
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdo ... nfl-wp3691 (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/NFLPA-does-not-vote-claims-owners-8217-propos;_ylt=AlRFbVPIzwgqmjD05kZSYTJDubYF?urn=nfl-wp3691)
NFLPA does not vote; claims owners’ proposal may violate labor laws

We've reported that the NFL owners have ratified their own proposal at about 7:00 PM ET, and we shared NFLPA head DeMaurice Smith's e-mail to the player reps just before the players' association's conference call that took place an hour later. Almost two hours later, the conference call ended, and the news is not good. Not only have the players refused to vote on that proposal (and for a very good reason; they claim not to have even seen it yet), but both Smith and general counsel for the NFLPA Richard Berthelsen believe that the nature of the proposal may violate labor laws.

In short, it's illegal for an employer to coerce employees to form a union, and that's what the NFLPA believes the owners have done in calling a press conference to make it clear that they want an agreement to pass that the players haven't yet seen.

Understandably, the players and the players' association aren't all too happy about this turn of events. A source close to the situation told Yahoo! Sports that there's "no way this gets fixed by [Friday] morning. Could [take] a few days just to get it back on course."

From Roger Goodell's post-settlement press conference:

With this ratification and with the ratification of the NFLPA board, we will be prepared to open the training facilities beginning on Saturday, this Saturday. We will then be prepared to start the new league year next Wednesday subject to the full membership of the players ratifying the agreement and recertifying as a union. Obviously you know that we're all under a time constraint. That's one of the reasons we worked to get this agreement completed tonight.

The NFL also is said to want proof that the majority of players have signed their voting cards to indicate the number of votes needed to approve re-certification.

The NFLPA's post-call e-mail (in part) to the player reps:

We received the NFL's proposed procedure for finalizing a settlement. Among other things, it … Demands that the players re-form as a union and provide evidence by Tuesday, July 26 that a majority of players have signed union authorization cards…

… In addition to depriving the players of the time needed to consider forming a union and making needed changes to the old Agreement, this proposed procedure would in my view also violate federal labor laws. Those laws prohibit employers from coercing their employees into forming a union, and could result in any Agreement reached through the procedure being declared null and void.

ESPN.com is reporting that the new proposal gives the NFLPA until Friday of next week to accept the parameters of the new proposal or negotiate new ones, and that if those parameters aren't accepted, certain aspects of the new deal would revert back to the language of the previous CBA — a CBA the owners opted out of in 2008 — for the life of the new CBA. Basically, the players would lose ground and be forced to accept it for the next decade.

Isn't this what they have been doing for the past 4 months

:HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger :HeadBanger

fordfixer
07-22-2011, 01:36 AM
Players delay vote on owners' proposal to end lockout

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2011/0 ... -end-locko (http://www.profootballweekly.com/2011/07/21/players-delay-vote-on-owners-proposal-to-end-locko)
By Eric Edholm

Updated at 11:29 p.m. ET, Thursday, July 21

Pro Football Weekly has learned that the players did not cast a vote on Thursday's ownership proposal to end the lockout — one that elicited cheers from team owners following a 31-0 vote in Atlanta — because the NFLPA leadership said it had not seen the entire contents of the deal.

The players' association informed its club representatives on a conference call that lasted more than 90 minutes that it hoped to go over the latest deal the NFL owners passed before planning its next move.

NFLPA executive director DeMaurice Smith informed those on the call that he had not received the contents of the deal, but would look at the details after receiving it, working late into Thursday night and beyond, to make sure that there were no inconsistencies with what the owners' previous offers had been.

Late Thursday night, NFLPA sources indicated they had finally received a copy of the latest offer from the league and planned to scour the details before taking next significant action.

NFLPA counsel Richard Berthelsen sent out an email to player reps prior to the call, outlining the process that would need to happen for the group to recertify as a union. The proposal included the demand from the NFL that the NFLPA must prove it had indeed recertified as a union by July 26, which would be followed by a vote to ratify a brand new CBA soon thereafter.

But that was only procedural information, not a complete and formal CBA proposal; what the NFLPA would not accept was that the NFL had asked that the old CBA terms be in place until the ownership accepted the would-be union's course.

"I am here to tell you that there is no deal," Smith told the listeners of the call, one of them told PFW, echoing what Smith wrote in an email earlier in the day following the owners' ratification vote.

Smith made it clear to the players on the call that he had not seen anything concrete and that he wanted to go over the owners' most recent offer to see if any changes had been made. The final mediated session involving Smith and NFL commissioner Roger Goodell happened sometime Friday morning. There were a few delays in the owners' meetings that, sources said, were held up for calls between Smith and Goodell.

The source on the call indicated that Smith attempted to rally the players and understand what exactly had happened earlier in the day. He also tried to instill a sense of calm and a timeline that differed from that of the owners', saying that "no one should feel like they are being rushed" into a deal. Smith told his players he would inform them in short order, within hours, of any new developments.

It appears that the two sides have agreed on nearly all of the key economic issues, which have been in place for a week or so, and that apparently has not changed. The union now has a three-pronged approach towards getting an agreement: They must agree to the economic terms; settle the remaining litigation; and take the procedural steps needed to reconstitute the union.

Smith took time to further explain Berthelsen's email — most notably the part where he suggested the owners' actions could be construed as unlawful. Smith said the NFLPA has looked closely at what entails reformation of the union and that the process the owners have proposed would not work. Because the NFLPA believes this is a critical piece to the puzzle, it would not allow its members to vote on it by email or phone, preferring to do it in person.

Another chief procedural problem: The matter of a non-union agreeing to terms of a collectively bargained agreement. This is how Smith explained the matter as being unlawful to the callers.

But the tone of the call — despite a few rallying cries from players who felt like the owners had deceived them badly on Thursday — was that the NFLPA leadership was continuing to find a way to work towards a deal. That means more negotiations through Friday and perhaps the weekend. Smith might use the threat of unlawful practice against the owners, but sources say he also needs to ponder this latest offer and digest what all it entails.

If there are inconsistencies, it could lead to trouble. On the call, sources say, Smith painted a worst-case scenario of missed games and negotiations perhaps not coming to completion until midway through what would have been the 2011 regular season. But he also sounded resolute that the two sides, ultimately, could remain on track for a deal with football relatively uninterrupted.

"I believe in the process," sources report Smith saying more than once on the call. The question now is whether that process leads to a new CBA now or in what could be the distant future.

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
07-22-2011, 03:14 AM
I'll believe it when I see it.

Oviedo
07-22-2011, 07:59 AM
I'll believe it when I see it.

I believe it when I see it too. What I'll never believe is the BS that these now "legal expert" players are actually going to sit down and read the contract. Really????? Who believes they will read it much less understand it??????

No reason to stall like they are.

Ghost
07-22-2011, 08:39 AM
Yeah...I gopt all excited last night with the talk of the facilities being opend up Saturday.

I find this a little interesting: Clearly a couple of owners thought the deal was ready to go nbut that's not at all what Smith is saying:

Before NFLPA leaders had seen the owners' proposal, Smith wrote in an email to the 32 player representatives: "Issues that need to be collectively bargained remain open; other issues, such as workers' compensation, economic issues and end of deal terms, remain unresolved. There is no agreement between the NFL and the players at this time."

"That's baffling to me," Panthers owner Jerry Richardson told ESPN's Sal Paolantonio. "We believe we have handshake agreement with the players."

"We believe we have an agreement," added New York Giants owner John Mara. "Now it's up to the players."

Sugar
07-22-2011, 08:45 AM
I'll believe it when I see it.

I believe it when I see it too. What I'll never believe is the BS that these now "legal expert" players are actually going to sit down and read the contract. Really????? Who believes they will read it much less understand it??????

No reason to stall like they are.

When their money and career are on the line, people tend to bone up on these things.

feltdizz
07-22-2011, 08:52 AM
I'll believe it when I see it.

I believe it when I see it too. What I'll never believe is the BS that these now "legal expert" players are actually going to sit down and read the contract. Really????? Who believes they will read it much less understand it??????

No reason to stall like they are.

When their money and career are on the line, people tend to bone up on these things.

:Agree

I'm sure the owners tried to slip some new things into the agreement at the last minute and I'm sure the players are also trying to take out a few things they "agreed on" at the last minute.

ikestops85
07-22-2011, 09:41 AM
Not so fast.

It appears that D. Smith called shinanigans.

We have a verbage issue.

It just amazes me how you are so close that you have a verbal agreement and a handshake, but then the other party has to go and screw it all up by being less than honest and trying to slip issues by the PA on top of pressuring the players to get it ratified and have a certified union by tuesday.

Just stinks. And that stench is coming from the owners.

I don't for one second think it was an oversight by the owners. yeah, right.

Just pi$$es me off to no end!!! Sooooooo sick of this childish behavior.

I'm sick of this childish behavior also. How can Smith and company just now start to look into what it takes to re-form the Players Association? WTF have they been doing the last 5 months?

The owners voted on what they thought Smith had agreed to. I haven't heard of anything they tried to "slip by" the players. They came up with a timeline of what they thought would work. If it doesn't, then change it. No big deal. I don't know what the owners did that you think was so bad.

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
07-22-2011, 09:58 AM
From what the articles read, there was one item that was "slipped in": The PA must re-certify. I'm confused because how is it that the head of the NFLPA is negotiating on behalf of an entity that does not exist? What authority does D. Smith and the 32 player reps operate under if there is no PA?

If the PA de-certifying in the first place was a bargaining tool, and if they otherwise came to an agreement, then why the fuss over re-certifying?

RuthlessBurgher
07-22-2011, 10:09 AM
From what the articles read, there was one item that was "slipped in": The PA must re-certify. I'm confused because how is it that the head of the NFLPA is negotiating on behalf of an entity that does not exist? What authority does D. Smith and the 32 player reps operate under if there is no PA?

If the PA de-certifying in the first place was a bargaining tool, and if they otherwise came to an agreement, then why the fuss over re-certifying?

I may be wrong, but I think the only way that you can have a collectively bargained agreement is if you have a union. The players and owners are supposed to be partners, and negotiated a deal as such. As far as I know, management can't have a CBA with individual employees, it must be with a collective group. This concept seems pretty basic (and I'm FAR from a lawyer)...I don't understand why it would be holding things up whatsoever. The whole "we are being coerced by management to recertify as a union" thing seems ridiculous, because a union is required in order to have a working CBA, no?

Chavezz
07-22-2011, 01:23 PM
That may be one of the dumbest things I've read. We're being coerced to form a union? Jackass. You have to have a union to sign the agreement. You had a union that you chose to decertify. How can the union pres now say its coercion. Am I missing smoething here or demaurice a gigantic dumbass?

Oviedo
07-22-2011, 02:04 PM
From what the articles read, there was one item that was "slipped in": The PA must re-certify. I'm confused because how is it that the head of the NFLPA is negotiating on behalf of an entity that does not exist? What authority does D. Smith and the 32 player reps operate under if there is no PA?

If the PA de-certifying in the first place was a bargaining tool, and if they otherwise came to an agreement, then why the fuss over re-certifying?

I may be wrong, but I think the only way that you can have a collectively bargained agreement is if you have a union. The players and owners are supposed to be partners, and negotiated a deal as such. As far as I know, management can't have a CBA with individual employees, it must be with a collective group. This concept seems pretty basic (and I'm FAR from a lawyer)...I don't understand why it would be holding things up whatsoever. The whole "we are being coerced by management to recertify as a union" thing seems ridiculous, because a union is required in order to have a working CBA, no?

This agreement must be signed by a collective bargaining organization or the owners are still open to anti-trust litigation by the players. The owners have learned for sure that this current player leadership likes taking things to court so it only makes sense that they require this.

hawaiiansteel
07-22-2011, 02:40 PM
Gerry: NFLPA will take their time now

FRIDAY, 22 JULY 2011
WRITTEN BY GERRY DULAC


It sounded good for Kevin Mawae, president of the NFL Players Association, to say that the players won’t be voting on the new collective bargaining agreement today out of respect for the passing of Myra Kraft, wife of New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft.

It was a thoughtful and heartfelt gesture by Mawae, and no doubt well-intended.

But there’s no way the players were going to vote today anyway on the new collective bargaining agreement, not after the way the owners backed them into a corner.

Not after the way the owners made it look as though the players and their vote are the only things standing in the way of the National Football League resuming immediately.

Mawae would have paid respect to the Pirates dropping out of first place if he had to, anything to delay the vote a little longer and make the owners and Commissioner Roger Goodell squirm even more.

When the owners overwhelmingly voted, 31-0, to ratify the terms of the new CBA and announced that training camps will open Wednesday, they gave the players a short timetable to re-certify as a union – something that takes time – and vote on the new agreement.

By doing so, they created a public perception that the deal – and, more important, the resumption of football – is solely in the corner of the players. In effect, the owners said, “OK, we did our part, now it’s up to you.”

In fact, those were pretty much the words of Steelers president Art Rooney II. Now, if the players have some sort of problem with the final package, they will look like the bad guys for further delaying the process.

Truth be told, it was a brilliant move by the owners. And the players know that. But they didn’t like it, and now they’re going to take their grand old time voting on the agreement.

Training camps are scheduled to open around the league on Wednesday, and the Steelers are planning to be at St. Vincent College that day. But, if I were you, I wouldn’t be making any post-practice dinner reservations at Dino’s or Sharkey’s in Latrobe on Wednesday.

http://plus.sites.post-gazette.com/inde ... r-time-now (http://plus.sites.post-gazette.com/index.php/pro-sports/steelers/110852-gerry-nflpa-will-take-their-time-now)

Chavezz
07-22-2011, 07:24 PM
This is grandstanding, nothing more.

If the owners would have come up with a deal that gave 100% of revenue they wouldn't have voted yesterday or today.

They don't want to appear to be voting because the owners told them to. If the owners told them not to vote, they would have.

hawaiiansteel
07-22-2011, 07:59 PM
This is grandstanding, nothing more.

If the owners would have come up with a deal that gave 100% of revenue they wouldn't have voted yesterday or today.

They don't want to appear to be voting because the owners told them to. If the owners told them not to vote, they would have.


I agree with what you're saying and I think in addition to the grandstanding a big factor in the delay is there's also a high level of distrust by the players towards the owners. I'm sure the NFLPA attorneys are going over the ratified CBA contract the owners voted on with a fine-toothed comb to ensure nothing was added or changed by the owners and until they're done the players are going to be reluctant to vote.

BradshawsHairdresser
07-23-2011, 02:59 PM
Am I missing smoething here or demaurice a gigantic dumbass?
You ain't missing anything there.