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hawaiiansteel
05-03-2011, 08:45 PM
Steelers tried to trade up for cornerback

May 1, 2011

The Steelers tried unsuccessfully to trade up in the second round for a cornerback.

Their primary targets were presumably Ras-I Dowling and Aaron Williams, the first two players off the board on Friday.

The Steelers were then "all ready" to draft Brandon Harris late in the round, only to see the Texans trade up to steal him.

Tackle Marcus Gilbert was Plan B for Pittsburgh.

Source: Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/42852190/ ... ayer_news/ (http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/42852190/ns/sports-player_news/)

PSU_dropout43
05-03-2011, 08:52 PM
Bouchette chat 5/3/11


Steel Curtain Rising: How close did the Steelers get to trading up in the second round?

Ed Bouchette: Not very and apparently did not try as hard as I was first led to believe.

RuthlessBurgher
05-03-2011, 09:23 PM
Bouchette chat 5/3/11


Steel Curtain Rising: How close did the Steelers get to trading up in the second round?

Ed Bouchette: Not very and apparently did not try as hard as I was first led to believe.


Having your two targets come off the board in the first two picks of the second round makes trading up exceedingly difficult.

flippy
05-04-2011, 12:07 AM
Bouchette chat 5/3/11


Steel Curtain Rising: How close did the Steelers get to trading up in the second round?

Ed Bouchette: Not very and apparently did not try as hard as I was first led to believe.


Having your two targets come off the board in the first two picks of the second round makes trading up exceedingly difficult.

Maybe we shoulda taken Dowling in round 1 and then tried to trade up for Heyward. :)

Chadman
05-04-2011, 12:09 AM
Chadman reckons we came out of it alright... :D

hawaiiansteel
05-04-2011, 02:12 AM
Chadman reckons we came out of it alright... :D


I felt much better about how things unfolded when CB Curtis Brown was still available for us in Round 3. It allowed us to address the DL and the OL with our first two picks, nothing wrong with that.

Oviedo
05-04-2011, 08:15 AM
Chadman reckons we came out of it alright... :D


I felt much better about how things unfolded when CB Curtis Brown was still available for us in Round 3. It allowed us to address the DL and the OL with our first two picks, nothing wrong with that.

Getting Brown and Allen with two consecutive picks made me feel better about not getting a CB earlier. This is particularly good given after the first 3 or 4 CBs all the others were pretty well lumped together as far as talent and potential. I'm actually pretty excited about Allen and his potential.

My only concern remains are we going to change our standard operating procedure and actually give these kids a chance to play? If not our secondary will be no better than last year and that would be unfortunate.

He wasn't my first choice, but I'm really beginning to like the Heyward pick. Hopefullly we can figure how to get his motor running at max for entire games.

D Rock
05-04-2011, 08:19 AM
Chadman reckons we came out of it alright... :D


I felt much better about how things unfolded when CB Curtis Brown was still available for us in Round 3. It allowed us to address the DL and the OL with our first two picks, nothing wrong with that.

Getting Brown and Allen with two consecutive picks made me feel better about not getting a CB earlier. This is particularly good given after the first 3 or 4 CBs all the others were pretty well lumped together as far as talent and potential. I'm actually pretty excited about Allen and his potential.

My only concern remains are we going to change our standard operating procedure and actually give these kids a chance to play? If not our secondary will be no better than last year and that would be unfortunate.

They'll play if they earn it. Brown certainly can from what the coaches have said so far.

Lewis wasn't ready to play above Gay or McFadden. Neither was Butler. That's why they haven't, not because of the defensive scheme.

Madison was terrible too and he got some game time, but what does that tell us about Lewis?

Oviedo
05-04-2011, 08:33 AM
Chadman reckons we came out of it alright... :D


I felt much better about how things unfolded when CB Curtis Brown was still available for us in Round 3. It allowed us to address the DL and the OL with our first two picks, nothing wrong with that.

Getting Brown and Allen with two consecutive picks made me feel better about not getting a CB earlier. This is particularly good given after the first 3 or 4 CBs all the others were pretty well lumped together as far as talent and potential. I'm actually pretty excited about Allen and his potential.

My only concern remains are we going to change our standard operating procedure and actually give these kids a chance to play? If not our secondary will be no better than last year and that would be unfortunate.

They'll play if they earn it. Brown certainly can from what the coaches have said so far.

Lewis wasn't ready to play above Gay or McFadden. Neither was Butler. That's why they haven't, not because of the defensive scheme.

Madison was terrible too and he got some game time, but what does that tell us about Lewis?

I said when we drafted Lewis that Joe Burnett was going to be the better DB. Burnett played as a rookie and Lewis didn't. But we cut Burnett and keep Lewis and don't play him again. The logic of that baffles me.

D Rock
05-04-2011, 08:37 AM
Chadman reckons we came out of it alright... :D


I felt much better about how things unfolded when CB Curtis Brown was still available for us in Round 3. It allowed us to address the DL and the OL with our first two picks, nothing wrong with that.

Getting Brown and Allen with two consecutive picks made me feel better about not getting a CB earlier. This is particularly good given after the first 3 or 4 CBs all the others were pretty well lumped together as far as talent and potential. I'm actually pretty excited about Allen and his potential.

My only concern remains are we going to change our standard operating procedure and actually give these kids a chance to play? If not our secondary will be no better than last year and that would be unfortunate.

They'll play if they earn it. Brown certainly can from what the coaches have said so far.

Lewis wasn't ready to play above Gay or McFadden. Neither was Butler. That's why they haven't, not because of the defensive scheme.

Madison was terrible too and he got some game time, but what does that tell us about Lewis?

I said when we drafted Lewis that Joe Burnett was going to be the better DB. Burnett played as a rookie and Lewis didn't. But we cut Burnett and keep Lewis and don't play him again. The logic of that baffles me.

HIndsight is 20/20. Burnett looked more ready to play early, and his floor was probably higher than Lewis'. Lewis probably had a higher ceiling tho. Hence a 3rd round vs a 5th round draft pick.

Unfortunately Lewis hasn't come anywhere close to that ceiling. Of course it also needs to be considered that Burnett has been a non-factor in the league, and wasn't even on a team last year....But Lewis probably wont be on a team this year either.

Chadman
05-04-2011, 08:51 AM
Before we put a stke througt the heart of Keenan Lewis' career, is Chadman remembering things wrong, or was there a point in pre-season where Lewis was a chance of unseating McFadden for a starting role?

Didn't he get close, then struggled in one game- lost it on a glass pane or something & was then demoted by Tomlin?

To Chadman, this sounds like a guy that was very keen to get a role, knew he'd blown it & acted a little immaturely- not a guy that can't compete at the next level.

He may have been in Tomlin's doghouse last season as a result, but all is not lost if he gets his head on right. He might be closer to a starting role than we give him credit for.

Oviedo
05-04-2011, 09:37 AM
Before we put a stke througt the heart of Keenan Lewis' career, is Chadman remembering things wrong, or was there a point in pre-season where Lewis was a chance of unseating McFadden for a starting role?

Didn't he get close, then struggled in one game- lost it on a glass pane or something & was then demoted by Tomlin?

To Chadman, this sounds like a guy that was very keen to get a role, knew he'd blown it & acted a little immaturely- not a guy that can't compete at the next level.

He may have been in Tomlin's doghouse last season as a result, but all is not lost if he gets his head on right. He might be closer to a starting role than we give him credit for.

I hope so but I won't bet on it. Doghouse or not when we chose to have Anthony Madison (one of the worse DBs I've ever seen play) active and playing defense that is a real condemnation of Lewis and where he stands in the organization.

RuthlessBurgher
05-04-2011, 10:05 AM
Chadman reckons we came out of it alright... :D


I felt much better about how things unfolded when CB Curtis Brown was still available for us in Round 3. It allowed us to address the DL and the OL with our first two picks, nothing wrong with that.

Getting Brown and Allen with two consecutive picks made me feel better about not getting a CB earlier. This is particularly good given after the first 3 or 4 CBs all the others were pretty well lumped together as far as talent and potential. I'm actually pretty excited about Allen and his potential.

My only concern remains are we going to change our standard operating procedure and actually give these kids a chance to play? If not our secondary will be no better than last year and that would be unfortunate.

He wasn't my first choice, but I'm really beginning to like the Heyward pick. Hopefullly we can figure how to get his motor running at max for entire games.

He won't be running at Max during games.

He will be running at Max during practices.

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/131970/maxstarks_medium.jpg

:wink:

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
05-04-2011, 10:12 AM
Before we put a stke througt the heart of Keenan Lewis' career, is Chadman remembering things wrong, or was there a point in pre-season where Lewis was a chance of unseating McFadden for a starting role?

Didn't he get close, then struggled in one game- lost it on a glass pane or something & was then demoted by Tomlin?

To Chadman, this sounds like a guy that was very keen to get a role, knew he'd blown it & acted a little immaturely- not a guy that can't compete at the next level.

He may have been in Tomlin's doghouse last season as a result, but all is not lost if he gets his head on right. He might be closer to a starting role than we give him credit for.

I hope so but I won't bet on it. Doghouse or not when we chose to have Anthony Madison (one of the worse DBs I've ever seen play) active and playing defense that is a real condemnation of Lewis and where he stands in the organization.

If Lewis played ST then he would have found his way onto the game day roster last year. His inability to crack the 45 was not a condemnation of his CB play but rather his lack of flexibility. I think that if you asked Tomlin who the better CB was then he would not say Madison.

For Lewis to make it then he will have to do so by winning a CB position. He won't dress if he is merely a backup who can't also do something else effectively.

Chadman
05-04-2011, 10:33 AM
Before we put a stke througt the heart of Keenan Lewis' career, is Chadman remembering things wrong, or was there a point in pre-season where Lewis was a chance of unseating McFadden for a starting role?

Didn't he get close, then struggled in one game- lost it on a glass pane or something & was then demoted by Tomlin?

To Chadman, this sounds like a guy that was very keen to get a role, knew he'd blown it & acted a little immaturely- not a guy that can't compete at the next level.

He may have been in Tomlin's doghouse last season as a result, but all is not lost if he gets his head on right. He might be closer to a starting role than we give him credit for.

Seriously- is Chadman the only one to remember this? Because now Chadman is starting to question if he had a dream about it instead...

ikestops85
05-04-2011, 10:57 AM
Before we put a stke througt the heart of Keenan Lewis' career, is Chadman remembering things wrong, or was there a point in pre-season where Lewis was a chance of unseating McFadden for a starting role?

Didn't he get close, then struggled in one game- lost it on a glass pane or something & was then demoted by Tomlin?

To Chadman, this sounds like a guy that was very keen to get a role, knew he'd blown it & acted a little immaturely- not a guy that can't compete at the next level.

He may have been in Tomlin's doghouse last season as a result, but all is not lost if he gets his head on right. He might be closer to a starting role than we give him credit for.

Seriously- is Chadman the only one to remember this? Because now Chadman is starting to question if he had a dream about it instead...

I think Chadman is right about this. Unfortunately Lewis had some really bad personal fouls in the one pre-season game which put him in Tomlin's doghouse.

I also don't think Madison playing over Lewis is a statement about Lewis' cornerback play. Madison just got the hat because of his special teams talents which Lewis does not have.

RuthlessBurgher
05-04-2011, 01:21 PM
Before we put a stke througt the heart of Keenan Lewis' career, is Chadman remembering things wrong, or was there a point in pre-season where Lewis was a chance of unseating McFadden for a starting role?

Didn't he get close, then struggled in one game- lost it on a glass pane or something & was then demoted by Tomlin?

To Chadman, this sounds like a guy that was very keen to get a role, knew he'd blown it & acted a little immaturely- not a guy that can't compete at the next level.

He may have been in Tomlin's doghouse last season as a result, but all is not lost if he gets his head on right. He might be closer to a starting role than we give him credit for.

Seriously- is Chadman the only one to remember this? Because now Chadman is starting to question if he had a dream about it instead...

Not a dream...


Lewis didn't score with Tomlin on or off the field
By Scott Brown, PITTSBURGH TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Monday, August 30, 2010

DENVER A bad night Sunday got worse for cornerback Keenan Lewis as the Steelers filed into the visiting locker room at Invesco Field following a 34-17 loss to the Broncos.

Lewis, who got benched in the second quarter after picking up two personal foul penalties, punched a sign that was encased in glass. The glass shattered and many of the players had to walk by a guard telling them to watch their step and Tomlin making it very clear why there was broken glass outside of the Steelers' locker room.

"That's what you call young and dumb right there," Tomlin said to the players that passed him. "Watch your step. No. (23) is playing bad and doing stupid stuff as well."

Lewis started at the cornerback spot opposite Ike Taylor in place of Bryant McFadden, who didn't play because of an arm injury.

Lewis, who appeared to be pushing McFadden for the starting job gave up an 18-yard catch to Eddie Royal on the second play of the game and then tackled the Broncos wide receiver out of bounds.

"The first (unnecessary roughness penalty) I didn't know he was out of bounds," Lewis said. "The second one, that was my fault."

Lewis got flagged in the second quarter for unnecessary roughness after tackling Bronces wide receiver Brandon Lloyd.

Gay promptly replaced Lewis at cornerback, and after the game Tomlin said of the latter, "He stunk it up."

The 6-foot, 208-pounder Lewis didn't do anything to help himself after the game as Tomlin was livid when he saw the broken glass outside of the Steelers' locker room.

Lewis said he meant to punch the wall, not the sign.

"He had a tough night," said Steelers wide receiver Mike Wallace, who is Lewis' best friend. "That's why I told him we have next week. Shake it off, bounce back. We all make mistakes. Hopefully he can get back to the Keenan I know."

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_697081.html

feltdizz
05-04-2011, 05:23 PM
Lewis acted like the WR beat his grandmother up after catching an 8 yard pass. I think Lewis told himself he wouldn't give up a completion and once it happened he lost it. Maybe he bought a Bentley on credit or had a bet with McFadden. He acted like a spoiled brat in his first start.

hawaiiansteel
05-04-2011, 06:25 PM
Lewis acted like the WR beat his grandmother up after catching an 8 yard pass. I think Lewis told himself he wouldn't give up a completion and once it happened he lost it. Maybe he bought a Bentley on credit or had a bet with McFadden. He acted like a spoiled brat in his first start.


and that's what Tomlin was referring to when he said: "That's what you call young and dumb right there"...Keenan allowed his personal frustration to overwhelm him and thus make poor on-field decisions that ended up hurting the team.

Chadman
05-04-2011, 06:58 PM
Lewis acted like the WR beat his grandmother up after catching an 8 yard pass. I think Lewis told himself he wouldn't give up a completion and once it happened he lost it. Maybe he bought a Bentley on credit or had a bet with McFadden. He acted like a spoiled brat in his first start.


and that's what Tomlin was referring to when he said: "That's what you call young and dumb right there"...Keenan allowed his personal frustration to overwhelm him and thus make poor on-field decisions that ended up hurting the team.

So...if he eliminates the 'young & dumb'- where is Keenan Lewis at?

A starter?

hawaiiansteel
05-04-2011, 07:08 PM
Lewis acted like the WR beat his grandmother up after catching an 8 yard pass. I think Lewis told himself he wouldn't give up a completion and once it happened he lost it. Maybe he bought a Bentley on credit or had a bet with McFadden. He acted like a spoiled brat in his first start.


and that's what Tomlin was referring to when he said: "That's what you call young and dumb right there"...Keenan allowed his personal frustration to overwhelm him and thus make poor on-field decisions that ended up hurting the team.

So...if he eliminates the 'young & dumb'- where is Keenan Lewis at?

A starter?


I hope so, but won't be holding my breath. the few times I saw Keenan Lewis play he looked like he had no chance whatsoever against smaller, quicker receivers.

Chadman
05-04-2011, 07:21 PM
His college career leads Chadman to believe he might be the one most likely to become the 'next best' CB on this roster. It was a very solid body of work- both in run support & pass defense. He really fits the mold of a Steeler CB.

Lets hope Tomlin, LeBeau & Lake can get him game ready.

Actually, reading back the scouting reports on Lewis & Crezdon Butler- Butler might be the more FS-like of the two...more a straight line guy, not as good at turning & running...

Keyplay1
05-10-2011, 11:25 AM
Lewis acted like the WR beat his grandmother up after catching an 8 yard pass. I think Lewis told himself he wouldn't give up a completion and once it happened he lost it. Maybe he bought a Bentley on credit or had a bet with McFadden. He acted like a spoiled brat in his first start.


and that's what Tomlin was referring to when he said: "That's what you call young and dumb right there"...Keenan allowed his personal frustration to overwhelm him and thus make poor on-field decisions that ended up hurting the team.

So...if he eliminates the 'young & dumb'- where is Keenan Lewis at?

A starter?


I hope so, but won't be holding my breath. the few times I saw Keenan Lewis play he looked like he had no chance whatsoever against smaller, quicker receivers.

Yeah, that incident in Denver was really strange. And, in a pre-season game to boot. But, the outlook now is very good. The already highly ranked secondary, at least by NFL standards has added two more very promising prospects that should help make this secondary very solid. I saw the following post in another similar thread and thought it might fit here although who's to argue with wanting to upgrade a position or any position.

This was posted by Steel Chowder on the Steel City Board and it sort of refreshed my memory.

"It was good enough to win 12 regular season games, 2 playoff games, and gave Ben the ball with a chance to win the Super Bowl. I'm not going to bother listing stats that I've listed before about what our yards per attempts were, what our QB rating against was last season, suffice it to say, we were in the top three of both categories and others."

"Ike has won two Super Bowls and appeared in a third; McFadden has as well, with one of them being his rookie year. If Taylor, DeShea Townsend and a rookie second rounder (McFadden) can win a Super Bowl, Taylor, McFadden and a rookie pick tonight (whomever that may be) can win a Super Bowl as well."


BTW: Now that I've caught on to that trick someone posted about highlighting text, then copy and pasting it so you don't have to type it ---I am probably going to become one big pain in the :D :D Uh--in order to save time I"m going to post my reply to the expected reply to this last comment-------"Touche"

birtikidis
05-10-2011, 12:28 PM
His college career leads Chadman to believe he might be the one most likely to become the 'next best' CB on this roster. It was a very solid body of work- both in run support & pass defense. He really fits the mold of a Steeler CB.

Lets hope Tomlin, LeBeau & Lake can get him game ready.

Actually, reading back the scouting reports on Lewis & Crezdon Butler- Butler might be the more FS-like of the two...more a straight line guy, not as good at turning & running...
Using his college career as a benchmark is not a good idea. BMac, if I recall correctly, never allowed a td as a starting qb in his career at FSU.

Oviedo
05-10-2011, 12:40 PM
Lewis acted like the WR beat his grandmother up after catching an 8 yard pass. I think Lewis told himself he wouldn't give up a completion and once it happened he lost it. Maybe he bought a Bentley on credit or had a bet with McFadden. He acted like a spoiled brat in his first start.


and that's what Tomlin was referring to when he said: "That's what you call young and dumb right there"...Keenan allowed his personal frustration to overwhelm him and thus make poor on-field decisions that ended up hurting the team.

So...if he eliminates the 'young & dumb'- where is Keenan Lewis at?

A starter?

Keenan Lewis will not be a quality starter in the NFL. Hope I'm wrong but I doubt it after two years. Maybe it is a lack of talent or he is just another victim of our overly complex defense. Whatever it is he just doesn't seem to have it.

NJ-STEELER
05-10-2011, 09:52 PM
lewis and that WR got into a scuffle, lewis got the penalty cause he kept going. IIRC he got another 15 yder petty quickly and was given the hook.


that said, i could have sworn he played some ST gunner in the regular season

Gus
05-11-2011, 11:27 AM
Chadman, I recall this as well.

Wasn't Crezdon Butler also drawing rave reviews?

It is more likely that one or both of them get significant playing time; not the rooks. I'm thinking that one of them earns a starting job.

Oviedo
05-11-2011, 11:50 AM
Chadman, I recall this as well.

Wasn't Crezdon Butler also drawing rave reviews?

It is more likely that one or both of them get significant playing time; not the rooks. I'm thinking that one of them earns a starting job.

I think Brown gets on the field more than Lewis or Butler. His skill is far superior to both especially if they are playing him in the nickle or dime.

Cortez Allen is a project and I doubt he even sniffs the grass at Heinz Field this season unless he falls asleep on the ground on the sideline.

Dresden
05-11-2011, 04:43 PM
Lewis acted like the WR beat his grandmother up after catching an 8 yard pass. I think Lewis told himself he wouldn't give up a completion and once it happened he lost it. Maybe he bought a Bentley on credit or had a bet with McFadden. He acted like a spoiled brat in his first start.


and that's what Tomlin was referring to when he said: "That's what you call young and dumb right there"...Keenan allowed his personal frustration to overwhelm him and thus make poor on-field decisions that ended up hurting the team.

So...if he eliminates the 'young & dumb'- where is Keenan Lewis at?

A starter?

Keenan Lewis will not be a quality starter in the NFL. Hope I'm wrong but I doubt it after two years. Maybe it is a lack of talent or he is just another victim of our overly complex defense. Whatever it is he just doesn't seem to have it.


Apparently you (unlike many) actually watched Lewis play at Oregon State where he was basically a young Ike. Except,.... without the speed, and athleticism. And even less awareness and ball skills.

Not being down on the kid,.....everyone has a shot to turn things around in most aspects. However,..the price to do so might be steeper than lewis is prepared and or even willing to pay at this time.

Va Steelr
05-12-2011, 07:34 PM
I like most of you hold out hope thet Lewis will turn it around,but I think Brown and Butler may be our best hope.I am happy with the Heyward pick but I was REALLY
hoping to get Dowling.As a UVA fan I have watched this kid throughout his college
career.If he can stay healthy he will be a good player at this level.I really hate that the
Pats got him.

RuthlessBurgher
05-12-2011, 07:43 PM
I like most of you hold out hope thet Lewis will turn it around,but I think Brown and Butler may be our best hope.I am happy with the Heyward pick but I was REALLY
hoping to get Dowling.As a UVA fan I have watched this kid throughout his college
career.If he can stay healthy he will be a good player at this level.I really hate that the
Pats got him.

As someone who watches all of the UVa games, what do you think about Frank Minnefield's kid who took over for Ras-I when he was hurt? He could be an interesting prospect next year, even though his dad played for the Browns once upon a time (then again, Clay Matthews' dad played for the Browns once upon a time as well).

tiproast
05-14-2011, 01:00 AM
I like most of you hold out hope thet Lewis will turn it around,but I think Brown and Butler may be our best hope.I am happy with the Heyward pick but I was REALLY
hoping to get Dowling.As a UVA fan I have watched this kid throughout his college
career.If he can stay healthy he will be a good player at this level.I really hate that the
Pats got him.
New England isn't a huge college football area, so most Pats fans don't know much about Dowling. I hope you're right about him being a solid player in the NFL. Thanks for posting your assessment.

Last year that Pats picked a TE that had an injury-filled senior season (Gronkowski), and that turned out OK. But not everyone comes back 100%, or on the same timetable.

papillon
05-14-2011, 08:05 AM
Lewis acted like the WR beat his grandmother up after catching an 8 yard pass. I think Lewis told himself he wouldn't give up a completion and once it happened he lost it. Maybe he bought a Bentley on credit or had a bet with McFadden. He acted like a spoiled brat in his first start.


and that's what Tomlin was referring to when he said: "That's what you call young and dumb right there"...Keenan allowed his personal frustration to overwhelm him and thus make poor on-field decisions that ended up hurting the team.

So...if he eliminates the 'young & dumb'- where is Keenan Lewis at?

A starter?

There is a cure for being young. the other, not so much. I don't see Lewis as a starter, ever. That being said, with his size I'd love to be wrong.

Pappy

papillon
05-14-2011, 08:08 AM
I like most of you hold out hope thet Lewis will turn it around,but I think Brown and Butler may be our best hope.I am happy with the Heyward pick but I was REALLY
hoping to get Dowling.As a UVA fan I have watched this kid throughout his college
career.If he can stay healthy he will be a good player at this level.I really hate that the
Pats got him.
New England isn't a huge college football area, so most Pats fans don't know much about Dowling. I hope you're right about him being a solid player in the NFL. Thanks for posting your assessment.

Last year that Pats picked a TE that had an injury-filled senior season (Gronkowski), and that turned out OK. But not everyone comes back 100%, or on the same timetable.

I didn't realize Gronkowski had an injury plagued year, it seemed every time you guys needed a play he was capable of making the play. If he stays healthy, you have aplayer in that kid from what I saw.

Pappy

birtikidis
05-14-2011, 11:31 AM
I like most of you hold out hope thet Lewis will turn it around,but I think Brown and Butler may be our best hope.I am happy with the Heyward pick but I was REALLY
hoping to get Dowling.As a UVA fan I have watched this kid throughout his college
career.If he can stay healthy he will be a good player at this level.I really hate that the
Pats got him.
New England isn't a huge college football area, so most Pats fans don't know much about Dowling. I hope you're right about him being a solid player in the NFL. Thanks for posting your assessment.

Last year that Pats picked a TE that had an injury-filled senior season (Gronkowski), and that turned out OK. But not everyone comes back 100%, or on the same timetable.

I didn't realize Gronkowski had an injury plagued year, it seemed every time you guys needed a play he was capable of making the play. If he stays healthy, you have aplayer in that kid from what I saw.

Pappy
he meant in college

RuthlessBurgher
05-14-2011, 01:14 PM
I like most of you hold out hope thet Lewis will turn it around,but I think Brown and Butler may be our best hope.I am happy with the Heyward pick but I was REALLY
hoping to get Dowling.As a UVA fan I have watched this kid throughout his college
career.If he can stay healthy he will be a good player at this level.I really hate that the
Pats got him.
New England isn't a huge college football area, so most Pats fans don't know much about Dowling. I hope you're right about him being a solid player in the NFL. Thanks for posting your assessment.

Last year that Pats picked a TE that had an injury-filled senior season (Gronkowski), and that turned out OK. But not everyone comes back 100%, or on the same timetable.

I was really high on Dowling. If he stayed healthy, I think he would have been a mid-first round value. I wanted to trade up in the second for him (and apparently so did the Steelers' braintrust), but you guys taking him off the board with the first pick on day two put the kibosh on that thought from the get-go. I think you guys will really have something with McCourty and Dowling as your top two corners in the future (I also liked Darius Butler a few years ago...not as much as I like Dowling now, but that pick doesn't seem to have turned out all that well for you so far).

Solder could really be something if he is able to put on a few pounds (seems to have Tony Boselli-like athleticism, but needs to hit the weight room or his skinny @$$ will get bullrushed relentlessly if he gets any meaningful playing time as a rookie).

I don't like your two RB picks at all (actually, I do like that you picked them, because I think they suck, and I'm all for sucky picks in NE). The guys they got don't seem to be any better than the Law Firm or Woodhead, so what is the point adding more marginal committee guys with elite picks? They should have just taken Ingram or Leshoure and stopped trying to get cute.

The Mallett pick is certainly interesting. Could be an incredible value, or it could be another Kevin O'Connell 3rd round waste. Gotta love that cannon arm, though. In your system, he just might flourish (you guys suck...did I mention that already? :D ).

Overall, though, survey says that you did not get a pass rushing OLB or any of the quality 5-technique DE's in a very rich DL draft. Sure, you have an extra first and second rounder next year, but I'm sure that continually pushing picks into the future instead of taking advantage now has to grate on the nerves of NE fans a bit, right?

tiproast
05-14-2011, 03:25 PM
Overall, though, survey says that you did not get a pass rushing OLB or any of the quality 5-technique DE's in a very rich DL draft. Sure, you have an extra first and second rounder next year, but I'm sure that continually pushing picks into the future instead of taking advantage now has to grate on the nerves of NE fans a bit, right?
Yeah, lots of people on Pats boards questioning why the Pats didn't take some of those DE/OLBs available to them, or trade up to get one with their extra picks.

Lots of people (including me) also questioning the RBs - Belichick evaluates talent pretty well across the board, but his track record at RB isn't very good.

But 14-2 last year in what many viewed as a rebuilding year isn't too shabby. Lack of pass rush hurt in the playoffs.

I don't want to turn this into a Pats-only discussion though. What are your thoughts on Heyward? Obviously the Pats could have taken him with their 2nd first round choice, and they passed on him. And OSU products (other than Santonio Holmes) haven't been too successful. Do you see him as having an impact in his rookie year?

RuthlessBurgher
05-14-2011, 04:11 PM
Overall, though, survey says that you did not get a pass rushing OLB or any of the quality 5-technique DE's in a very rich DL draft. Sure, you have an extra first and second rounder next year, but I'm sure that continually pushing picks into the future instead of taking advantage now has to grate on the nerves of NE fans a bit, right?
Yeah, lots of people on Pats boards questioning why the Pats didn't take some of those DE/OLBs available to them, or trade up to get one with their extra picks.

Lots of people (including me) also questioning the RBs - Belichick evaluates talent pretty well across the board, but his track record at RB isn't very good.

But 14-2 last year in what many viewed as a rebuilding year isn't too shabby. Lack of pass rush hurt in the playoffs.

I don't want to turn this into a Pats-only discussion though. What are your thoughts on Heyward? Obviously the Pats could have taken him with their 2nd first round choice, and they passed on him. And OSU products (other than Santonio Holmes) haven't been too successful. Do you see him as having an impact in his rookie year?

Not in his rookie year, no. We don't necessarily draft guys to use immediately, though. He'll get some snaps as a nickel or dime pass rusher as a rookie like Ziggy Hood got in his first year here, but that's all I expect as a rook. Our DL was getting old (Aaron Smith is 35, Casey Hampton will be 34 in September, Brett Keisel will be 33 in September, Chris Hoke is 35, and Nick Eason will be 31 at the end of this month) with Ziggy Hood as the only talented youngster available on our roster. Since Aaron Smith is on his last legs (3 of the last 4 seasons were cut short due to injury), the Ziggy pick was made with him being Smith's heir apparent in mind, and Heyward should be Keisel's heir apparent in a couple of years when he is ready to hang 'em up. In the mean time, we will use a rotation between the experienced vets and the hungry young'uns that should keep everyone refreshed for the long haul, hopefully.

I really like our draft, even though I don't expect for any of them to be major contributors as rookies (that's just not how we typically roll). With several DL nearing the end of the line in the next few seasons, the Heyward pick made sense for the future.

With Flozell Adams turning 36 this month (and on the last year of his contract) and with Willie Colon a question mark (coming off a major Achilles injury and either an RFA or UFA depending on the CBA), the Gilbert pick made sense for the future.

Our biggest need in terms of adding talent was at corner, and I'm glad that we didn't reach with our top 2 picks when there were better players available at other positions, but getting a solid slot cover guy in Brown and an intriguing height/weight/speed combo in Allen with our next two picks also made sense for the future. Those guys may be able to contribute on special teams early, and one or both could improve our CB play in the future.

Chris Carter from Fresno St. was a value pick as a rush OLB behind Harrison, Woodley, and Worilds (essentially taking the place of Thad Gibson, our fourth round pick from last year who was claimed off of waivers by the Niners when we had a shortage of healthy d-lineman and needed to bring one up from the practice squad.

We also got a developmental guard in Nebraska's Keith Williams (we still need someone to step in and take hold of that RG spot since Pouncey 2.0 did not fall within reach of a reasonable tradeup, and our LG Kemoeatu tends to make just as many bonehead blown assignments or penalties as he does pancake blocks when he pulls and leads Mendenhall through the hole) and a possible future 3rd down back to replace Mewelde Moore (and an all-around interesting fella if you read his blog) in Texas Tech's Baron Batch.

The other teams in our division will have rookies that start early (A.J. Green and Andy Dalton in Cincy, Phil Taylor and Jabaal Sheard in Cleveland, and Jimmy Smith and Torrey Smith in Baltimore), but when we look at the draft a few years down the road, I think our draft will beat out those drafts once again, even if we don't get an immediate impact from anyone in year one. I think our rookie of the year will be the guy who contributes the most on special teams (perhaps Curtis Brown as a gunner).

tiproast
05-14-2011, 04:24 PM
I really like our draft, even though I don't expect for any of them to be major contributors as rookies (that's just not how we typically roll).
Drafting for depth and development, and avoiding reaches. That's how the consistently successful franchises operate.

Steelers have been doing it for a long time now. Pats have too, since Kraft bought the team.

Will be interesting to see what happens with the Colts, now that Polian is retiring and Manning is on the downside of his career.