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Djfan
12-27-2010, 11:32 AM
This guy is the real deal. Why did we let him go?

ikestops85
12-27-2010, 11:37 AM
This guy is the real deal. Why did we let him go?

I don't know because he seems like the proto-typical Steeler. A hard-nosed 110% guy who is willing to do anything he can for the team.

Oh, that's right. We don't need a FB. :HeadBanger

grotonsteel
12-27-2010, 11:37 AM
BA does not use FB in his offense... :wink: :twisted:

Mister Pittsburgh
12-27-2010, 12:32 PM
I would of kept him at halfback ala peyton hillis. Owners want to run it like we have the ability to power run, then get speed backs.

We don't sign or keep white skill position players though.

rpmpit
12-27-2010, 12:32 PM
Same reason we got rid of Kreider. Because our running game works soooo much better without a FB.

Please note sarcasm.

ikestops85
12-27-2010, 12:44 PM
I would of kept him at halfback ala peyton hillis. Owners want to run it like we have the ability to power run, then get speed backs.

We don't sign or keep white skill position players though.

Ben is black :shock:

or hispanic :shock:

or asian :shock:

I didn't know :wink:

Mister Pittsburgh
12-27-2010, 01:21 PM
I would of kept him at halfback ala peyton hillis. Owners want to run it like we have the ability to power run, then get speed backs.

We don't sign or keep white skill position players though.

Ben is black :shock:

or hispanic :shock:

or asian :shock:

I didn't know :wink:

Wasn't including QB....but if you want to go there, Batch, Lefty, Dixon.....how many NFL teams can claim that?

RuthlessBurgher
12-27-2010, 01:24 PM
http://www.post-gazette.com/images4/20070601lf_Steelers01_450.jpg

Mister Pittsburgh
12-27-2010, 01:45 PM
BenLeftwich
Batch
Dixon
Heath
SpaethJohnson
Bright
Mendenhall
Moore
Redman
Dwyer
Tank
Hines
Wallace
Sanders
Brown
El
Battle
Sweed
Grisham

All DB's + All LB's on roster
All OL on roster minus Legursky

Sorry, just my opinion.

feltdizz
12-27-2010, 01:53 PM
If we had Kuhn we would have won the SB already. Did the guy do anything at all while he was here? Do yousee Ben throwing to Kuhn 5 times a game?

We are a vertical team right now... we are 11-4 and people are mad because we aren't blowing teams out by 50 one week and losing the next. That's what people want right? A high powered O that is 9-6....

No FB, no 4-3, no white utility players and a black HC with a ring. Aaron Smith isn't hurt, we just like having one more black man on the DL. Black power! LOL.

sarcasm.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-27-2010, 02:04 PM
If we had Kuhn we would have won the SB already. Did the guy do anything at all while he was here? Do yousee Ben throwing to Kuhn 5 times a game?

We are a vertical team right now... we are 11-4 and people are mad because we aren't blowing teams out by 50 one week and losing the next. That's what people want right? A high powered O that is 9-6....

No FB, no 4-3, no white utility players and a black HC with a ring. Aaron Smith isn't hurt, we just like having one more black man on the DL. Black power! LOL.

sarcasm.

My intent wasn't to start some racial argument. I just don't think Kuhn would play here, bottom line. They have no problem carrying the fat worthless blob Frank Summers though. Just in my opinion things don't match up on the Steelers as they do on most other teams. NFL is 65% African American. By those standards there should be 39.65 African Americans and 21.35 Other on the roster (plus practice squad). Steelers have 12 white dudes. They have 3 somoan islanders. They have 46 African Americans. These are facts presented as facts.

We have won a superbowl with this type of makeup so I am not complaining. Simply stating I don't think Kuhn would have a place on this team.

papillon
12-27-2010, 02:15 PM
John Kuhn just didn't fit into the Steeler offense as it is designed right now. The Steelers don't use a fullback (whether that's good or bad can be discussed in another thread) and like to go vertical, so Kuhn was expendable. I'm not sure what Summers' role on this team is, but since, the Steelers don't use a fullback I would have released him and kept Gibson back in the beginning of the year.

I'm happy that Kuhn is finding a niche for his skills and the team he is playing for is winning. I liked him as a big tailback, the coaches didn't, so they released him. I doubt his color had anything to do with his release, at least, I would hope not.

Pappy

Mister Pittsburgh
12-27-2010, 02:25 PM
John Kuhn just didn't fit into the Steeler offense as it is designed right now. The Steelers don't use a fullback (whether that's good or bad can be discussed in another thread) and like to go vertical, so Kuhn was expendable. I'm not sure what Summers' role on this team is, but since, the Steelers don't use a fullback I would have released him and kept Gibson back in the beginning of the year.

I'm happy that Kuhn is finding a niche for his skills and the team he is playing for is winning. I liked him as a big tailback, the coaches didn't, so they released him. I doubt his color had anything to do with his release, at least, I would hope not.

Pappy

He wasn't with us this year. He hasn't been with us since 2006 I believe. We let him walk at the end of 2006 season (Tomlins hiring) and it was announced in Sept. 2007 that Dan Kreider wouldn't have a place in our offense and wouldn't be used much.

I understand we changed our offensive system, but still carried supposed hammers to pick up first downs and for redzone running.....those have been Gary Russel, Redman, and I guess Frank Summers.

RuthlessBurgher
12-27-2010, 02:28 PM
If we had Kuhn we would have won the SB already. Did the guy do anything at all while he was here? Do yousee Ben throwing to Kuhn 5 times a game?

We are a vertical team right now... we are 11-4 and people are mad because we aren't blowing teams out by 50 one week and losing the next. That's what people want right? A high powered O that is 9-6....

No FB, no 4-3, no white utility players and a black HC with a ring. Aaron Smith isn't hurt, we just like having one more black man on the DL. Black power! LOL.

sarcasm.

My intent wasn't to start some racial argument. I just don't think Kuhn would play here, bottom line. They have no problem carrying the fat worthless blob Frank Summers though. Just in my opinion things don't match up on the Steelers as they do on most other teams. NFL is 65% African American. By those standards there should be 39.65 African Americans and 21.35 Other on the roster (plus practice squad). Steelers have 12 white dudes. They have 3 somoan islanders. They have 46 African Americans. These are facts presented as facts.

We have won a superbowl with this type of makeup so I am not complaining. Simply stating I don't think Kuhn would have a place on this team.

Dayum...a detailed statistical breakdown of our roster based on ethnicity...Wow.

What's next? An analysis of how many black guys we should have on our coaching staff? Is Tomlin, Mitchell, Daniel, Horton, Montgomery, Wilson, and Goodwin too many? Too few? Just right?

I seriously never really pay much attention to how many black or white players our team or most other teams have (except for pass catchers in Indy and New England...in those cases, whenever a white guy goes down, it seems like a new similar white guy magically appears out of thin air...Dallas Clark, Austin Collie, Blair White, Jacob Tamme...Wes Welker, Danny Woodhead, Julian Edelman, Rob Gronkowski).

To stay on topic, Kuhn spent a year and a half on our practice squad (and got a SBXL ring), then spent 9 games on our active roster. I think he may have used up his P.S. eligibility with us (which is where "fat worthless blob" Summers currently resides), and Green Bay had an open spot on their active roster, so Kuhn became a Packer.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-27-2010, 02:37 PM
I don't know guys, not sure what to say. I just don't understand all three backup QB's being black, and every single offensive linemen but one. Not one white LB, DB, WR, only one OL, only one of the QB's. Maybe it is just an anomoly on the NFL landscape.

Eddie Spaghetti
12-27-2010, 02:38 PM
wow.

what a dumb thread.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-27-2010, 03:03 PM
Sorry. Stats are what I do all day as an urban planner.

RuthlessBurgher
12-27-2010, 03:04 PM
I don't know guys, not sure what to say. I just don't understand all three backup QB's being black, and every single offensive linemen but one. Not one white LB, DB, WR, only one OL, only one of the QB's. Maybe it is just an anomoly on the NFL landscape.

It's about picking the best available players regardless of color. I want better o-lineman, not more white ones. I don't care if he grew up in Antarctica and his maternal grandmother is from El Salvador, his maternal grandfather is from Pakistan, his paternal grandmother is from Uganda, and his paternal grandfather is from the Netherlands. At least we met our quota for half-black, half-Korean wideouts, though.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-27-2010, 03:15 PM
I don't know guys, not sure what to say. I just don't understand all three backup QB's being black, and every single offensive linemen but one. Not one white LB, DB, WR, only one OL, only one of the QB's. Maybe it is just an anomoly on the NFL landscape.

It's about picking the best available players regardless of color. I want better o-lineman, not more white ones. I don't care if he grew up in Antarctica and his maternal grandmother is from El Salvador, his maternal grandfather is from Pakistan, his paternal grandmother is from Uganda, and his paternal grandmother is from the Netherlands. At least we met our quota for half-black, half-Korean wideouts, though.

Maybe they should start scouting in Antarctica, cause where they are scouting has produces some majorly subpar linemen.

BrownSteel
12-27-2010, 08:19 PM
This is the most asinine thing I have ever heard. I there were white players availablke who fit our system we would take them. Kuhn was caught up in a system dilemna just like Vrable.

steelsnis
12-27-2010, 10:20 PM
I just don't understand all three backup QB's being black, and every single offensive linemen but one.

What's not to understand? That it's not 1954 anymore?

SteelHoss
12-27-2010, 11:26 PM
John Kuhn just didn't fit into the Steeler offense as it is designed right now. The Steelers don't use a fullback (whether that's good or bad can be discussed in another thread) and like to go vertical, so Kuhn was expendable. I'm not sure what Summers' role on this team is, but since, the Steelers don't use a fullback I would have released him and kept Gibson back in the beginning of the year.

I'm happy that Kuhn is finding a niche for his skills and the team he is playing for is winning. I liked him as a big tailback, the coaches didn't, so they released him. I doubt his color had anything to do with his release, at least, I would hope not.

Pappy


:Agree :tt1 :tt1

NJ-STEELER
12-28-2010, 02:02 AM
simple answer


how could we carry arounda guy who's name is pronounced like that with an all black offensive line :wink:

fezziwig
12-28-2010, 10:58 AM
This guy is the real deal. Why did we let him go?


When we got him I was very happy and I'm still upset that we allowed him to leave. He reminded me a lot of Meril Hodge.

To answer your question, ARIANS ! will not have a fullback on his team !
Who were some of those sad backs we had on our team while allowing Kuhn to sit the bench and eventually allowed to be released.

This alone should be enough for Art Rooney the II to boot Arians off the team.

Really ****ing stupid to allow Kuhns to leave our team. Just ****ing stupid !

RuthlessBurgher
12-28-2010, 11:06 AM
Kuhn was a Steeler from 2005-2006. The RB's on our team in 2007 were Willie Parker (15 games, 15 starts), Najeh Davenport (15 games, 1 start), Carey Davis (16 games, 7 starts), Dan Kreider (10 games, 4 starts), Gary Russell (3 games, 0 starts), and Verron Haynes (1 game, 0 starts).

steelsnis
12-28-2010, 11:43 AM
Let's be real about this. The Steelers liked John Kuhn a lot. They wouldn't have brought him into camp from Shippensburg if they didn't. The fact is, he made it onto the acitve roster after bouncing back and forth around the practice squad in 05 and 06.

This is a smaller-scale James Harrison situation. You can't keep everyone on the active roster and some times you have release guys you like and hope to re-sign them at a later date. That's what happened with Kuhn but the Packers snatched him up. You can't win 'em all.

fezziwig
12-28-2010, 11:55 AM
Still a Steelers goof . Of all the backs that they retained over Kuhn, Kuhn is the only one I believe still in the NFL.

Carey Davis was a joke.

Willie was good but not good enough and no longer in the NFL.

Davenport must have had some dirt on Tomlin.

Veron Haynes wasn't the answer.

Krieder I believe was injured at the time.

Some fans cried to sign Gary Russell in fear he would go to the Bengals, Browns or Ravens because he was supposed to be this great sleeper pick.

Allowing the better talent plus youth to be gambled on releasing him is not good coaching. No one was going to take Carey Davis, Davenport or Haynes. I don't believe it was any of that to tell you the truth.

Arians didn't want a fullback on the team that was a true fullback.

He kept the other backs because they were more like utility players and utility players means, they can't do any one thing really well.

I was also pissed when they allowed Vrabel to be released.

Djfan
12-28-2010, 12:28 PM
Agreed on Vrabell and Kuhn. Still angry over Kevin Greene and Rod Woodson, but I'm old.

I guess I just want a short yardage / redzone power game somewhere. But, I'm not BA, so I guess I don't understand how unimportant scoring and first downs are.

Ghost
12-28-2010, 02:12 PM
The Vrabrell argument is foolish. I don't think the Steelers thought he wasn't good. I believe Cowher even told him he thought he was talented enough to be starter - just not in Pittsburgh. And at the time he was correct. The Steelers had Gildon, Holmes and Porter. He wasn't getting ahead of them. Sometimes it's just a matter of timing.

The Rams thought Bettis was done.

It's a cool story for Kuhn but at the time no one really knew a guy from Shippensburg was ever going to be any more than potential. Luckily for him, he developed more.

fezziwig
12-28-2010, 02:27 PM
I'm old enough to remember Kevin Greene and Rod Woodson. To tell you the truth I wasn't so upset that they didn't keep Woodson. I'm upset he didn't retire a Steeler but that to me is all on Rod.

Rod had lost a step in my opinion as a corner for his style of play. Rod liked to play the field, gamble due to his great speed and physical abilities and when he was in his prime he, could do all that.
As Rod got older or more banged up Rod, should have maintained his little island and still remained a shutdown corner.

Not because I read the article but just to share with you guys Rods, play style took a toll on Rods body. They were showing pictures of Rod when he first came into the game compared when he left the Steelers and his shoulders and upper body started to slump, give way due to the physical hits Rod would put on the opposing players. They said with the change in Rods body condition it was a direct link to his ability to play at the speed he and we were used to seeing from this guy.

They then showed Deon Sanders and his body had no physical change at all because the guy did not place his body in harms way because Deon was a puss and wouldn't take on a direct tackle or tackle hardly at all when needed.

Rod supported the run and all that could be asked of a guy but as time went on Rod, should have stuck with the Steelers and did what was asked of him. I kind of recall they also asked him to move to safety but, he refused.

Dan Rooney said the only time Cowher and Donahue agreed was when it came time to let Woodson go.

Kevin Green was a beast and they should have kept that guy on the team along with Willie Williams and Carnell Lake. I know, you can't keep them all.

I never thought Peezy was as good as advertised and I thought the guy that had taken Greenes place was the worse ever despite his stats and sacks. I can't remember his name but he played as if he was in a full body cast.

I wish we had another Ray Seals, Levon Kirland on this team too.

feltdizz
12-28-2010, 02:40 PM
WE aren't missing Kuhn... we can't keep everybody and we damn sure shouldn't have kept a guy who isn't part of our scheme. He had 2 good games recently... nothing more.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-28-2010, 03:13 PM
WE aren't missing Kuhn... we can't keep everybody and we damn sure shouldn't have kept a guy who isn't part of our scheme. He had 2 good games recently... nothing more.

I think the point is we cut him for Carey freaking Davis. Rooney should of fired Arians on the spot when he named Davis the starter over Kreider.

feltdizz
12-28-2010, 03:23 PM
WE aren't missing Kuhn... we can't keep everybody and we damn sure shouldn't have kept a guy who isn't part of our scheme. He had 2 good games recently... nothing more.

I think the point is we cut him for Carey freaking Davis. Rooney should of fired Arians on the spot when he named Davis the starter over Kreider.

Kuhn isn't the difference between winning a SB and missing the playoffs.

Where is Kreider and what has he done since leaving Pittsburgh. I think he played in St. Louis for a minute then went to Pittsburgh west.

Wasn't he also hurt or had back problems?

Crash
12-28-2010, 03:25 PM
Maybe if we had a FB we could run on all three downs in the redzone.

Yoi!

OchoUno
12-28-2010, 06:48 PM
If we had Kuhn we would have won the SB already. Did the guy do anything at all while he was here? Do yousee Ben throwing to Kuhn 5 times a game?

We are a vertical team right now... we are 11-4 and people are mad because we aren't blowing teams out by 50 one week and losing the next. That's what people want right? A high powered O that is 9-6....

No FB, no 4-3, no white utility players and a black HC with a ring. Aaron Smith isn't hurt, we just like having one more black man on the DL. Black power! LOL.

sarcasm.

My intent wasn't to start some racial argument. I just don't think Kuhn would play here, bottom line. They have no problem carrying the fat worthless blob Frank Summers though. Just in my opinion things don't match up on the Steelers as they do on most other teams. NFL is 65% African American. By those standards there should be 39.65 African Americans and 21.35 Other on the roster (plus practice squad). Steelers have 12 white dudes. They have 3 somoan islanders. They have 46 African Americans. These are facts presented as facts.

We have won a superbowl with this type of makeup so I am not complaining. Simply stating I don't think Kuhn would have a place on this team.

Because of his color. Not because, at the time, he was nothing more special than a decent preseason blocker and below average runner.

He's really tearin **** up with his 14 catches on the season on the team that likes white folk. And his less than 300 yards.

We have Redman and there's whining about not having Kuhn and other whiteys. JFC.

Mister Pittsburgh
12-29-2010, 08:48 AM
If we had Kuhn we would have won the SB already. Did the guy do anything at all while he was here? Do yousee Ben throwing to Kuhn 5 times a game?

We are a vertical team right now... we are 11-4 and people are mad because we aren't blowing teams out by 50 one week and losing the next. That's what people want right? A high powered O that is 9-6....

No FB, no 4-3, no white utility players and a black HC with a ring. Aaron Smith isn't hurt, we just like having one more black man on the DL. Black power! LOL.

sarcasm.

My intent wasn't to start some racial argument. I just don't think Kuhn would play here, bottom line. They have no problem carrying the fat worthless blob Frank Summers though. Just in my opinion things don't match up on the Steelers as they do on most other teams. NFL is 65% African American. By those standards there should be 39.65 African Americans and 21.35 Other on the roster (plus practice squad). Steelers have 12 white dudes. They have 3 somoan islanders. They have 46 African Americans. These are facts presented as facts.

We have won a superbowl with this type of makeup so I am not complaining. Simply stating I don't think Kuhn would have a place on this team.

Because of his color. Not because, at the time, he was nothing more special than a decent preseason blocker and below average runner.

He's really tearin bad word up with his 14 catches on the season on the team that likes white folk. And his less than 300 yards.

We have Redman and there's whining about not having Kuhn and other whiteys. JFC.


I will take Green Bays redzone production over the Steelers. I would take Kuhn in the redzone as a lead blocker over Redman. Sorry. We kept Carey Davis over Kuhn and Davis couldn't block, catch, or run with the ball.