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hawaiiansteel
12-06-2010, 09:26 PM
Brady, not Manning, is era's best QB

http://static.foxsports.com/content/fscom/img/2009/12/12/jasonWhitlock_20091212205120_0_0.JPG


For those of us who have long been skeptical of the national media’s premature and unjustified anointment of Peyton Manning as the greatest quarterback of all time, our day is here.

Sunday, Manning continued to show his age (34), tossing four interceptions, including two pick-6s, in the Colts’ 38-35 loss to the Cowboys. At 6-6, there’s a good chance Indy won’t make the playoffs. Manning is having his worst season in nine years (24 TDs, 15 INTs).

His apologists blame his poor play on injuries to Dallas Clark and Joseph Addai, a leaky offensive line and the lack of a consistent running game.

To his credit, Peyton Manning blames Peyton Manning.

“I threw four interceptions to guys who were covered, and the ball shouldn’t have been thrown,” Manning told Indy reporters after the game. “I’ve either got to throw it away or throw it to somebody else. That’s basic football. The quarterback’s job is to protect the ball, and I’m not following through on that.”

If the media didn’t overhype Manning, he might be one of my all-time favorite players. He’s a stand-up guy and a marvelous player. He’s just not the best QB of all time. He’s not the best QB of this era.

Tom Brady is.

Monday night, when the Jets and Patriots square off in a blockbuster matchup, Brady has a chance to take control of the MVP race and demonstrate the intangible that makes him a better quarterback than Manning.

Brady is fearless. Two years after the knee injury I thought would undermine his pocket toughness, Brady is back to being Brady, a courageous, unflappable pocket passer.

He’s thrown 23 touchdown passes and just four interceptions. He’s leading the league in passer rating. A victory Monday night, and the Patriots will tie the Falcons for the league’s best record (10-2).

When it comes to evaluating Brady, it’s always about more than statistics. There are no stats for courage and leadership. They’re like obscenity. You know them when you see them. Look at the smooth way Brady and Bill Belichick ushered locker-room cancer Randy Moss out of New England. That’s leadership.

Standing in the pocket and taking a hit rather than nervously throwing into coverage is leadership, too. Manning has always thrown more interceptions (and a higher percentage of INTs) than Brady because Manning has always gone to greater lengths to avoid contact.

Playoff teams are adept at hitting the opposing quarterback. That explains the dramatic difference between Brady’s and Manning’s playoff records and performances (Brady three Super Bowls and Manning one). Three-four, exotic zone-blitz defenses get inside Manning’s head. They make him think and panic.

Let me repeat: I do not dislike Peyton Manning. He’s one of the 10 best QBs of all time. What bothers me is people think he’s better than Tom Brady. It’s just not true.

In five years, Big Ben Roethlisberger might move ahead of Manning on my list. Regardless of what Roger Goodell does to NFL rules, football is always going to be a game defined by toughness. Did you watch Big Ben Sunday night?

The Ravens broke his nose in the first quarter and Big Ben never blinked. He never thought about coming out of the game. And down the stretch, against the meanest defense in football, Big Ben fought off Terrell Suggs and avoided a sack on one play and threw the game-winning TD pass two plays later.

There is no stat for playing with a broken nose. There is no stat for fighting off Suggs and throwing the ball away. If the league kept those stats, we know Roethlisberger and Brady would rank higher on the chart than Manning.

Maybe after Monday night, if Brady survives Rex Ryan’s punishing defense and the Patriots win, I’ll win some more converts. Maybe a second MVP award for Brady will help him close the Manning gap.

And, yes, as of right now, Brady deserves the MVP award more than Michael Vick.

I said “as of right now.”

Vick is an incredible story. His 467 rushing yards and six rushing TDs add a dimension to his candidacy that Brady can’t match. But Vick hasn’t played enough and the Eagles are 8-4. I’m open to changing my mind over the last month of the season.

Right now it’s Brady, followed by Vick and Pittsburgh safety Troy Polamalu.

In terms of best QB of this era, it’s Brady, followed by Manning and Roethlisberger. I’m not open to changing my mind about that.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/tom- ... ion-120610 (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/tom-brady-not-peyton-manning-is-best-qb-of-this-generation-120610)

DukieBoy
12-06-2010, 09:29 PM
Steve Young didn't repent his misguided self-serving opinions and give Ben his due props tonight, did he. SuperWuss.

Crash
12-06-2010, 09:44 PM
Ben's better than Peyton.

Shawn
12-06-2010, 09:56 PM
Ben's better than Peyton.

I would much rather have Ben than Manning especially on this team. Ben is a winner and he is fearless. He epitomizes Steeler toughness.

Captain Lemming
12-06-2010, 09:56 PM
Ben's better than Peyton.

Yup.
Peyton is a machine under ideal conditions.

Ben can have the line break down, receivers covered during the initial route and still make a play downfield.

Put Peyton on our team with our rag tag line and an outdoor home stadium and he isnt in the conversation.

He is the biggest choker IN HISTORY. Did it yet AGAIN last year.

Despite his "reputation" for carrying a team PEYTON WAS CARRIED BY DEFENSE AND RUN GAME to get his one ring, the very thing critics say about Ben.

Shawn
12-06-2010, 10:01 PM
Under perfect conditions, terrific OL, great WRs and a no stress game I would rather have Manning.

In a big game, or without one of the above I would MUCH rather have Ben.

Captain Lemming
12-06-2010, 10:09 PM
........ a no stress game I would rather have Manning.

In a big game, or without one of the above I would MUCH rather have Ben.

Question Shawn (or anyone)....in what way is Peyton is like Reggie Jackson?

DukieBoy
12-06-2010, 10:13 PM
But Phlop Rivers is putting up those Marino-like numbers and many talking heads are talking him up as MVP. Oh, wait, he's 6 - 6 this year.

flippy
12-06-2010, 10:28 PM
Flacco had a better QB rating than Ben last night. Stats never lie.

hawaiiansteel
12-07-2010, 01:18 AM
Flacco had a better QB rating than Ben last night. Stats never lie.


speaking of passer ratings, Tom Brady's was 148.9 tonight against the Jets...

Tom's final stats: 21/29 for 326 yards and 4 TDs with no INTs

tiproast
12-07-2010, 01:25 AM
Flacco had a better QB rating than Ben last night. Stats never lie.


speaking of passer ratings, Tom Brady's was 148.9 tonight against the Jets...

Tom's final stats: 21/29 for 326 yards and 4 TDs with no INTs
Almost 10 points lower than his previous game.

Time to give Hoyer a chance. :D

hawaiiansteel
12-07-2010, 01:39 AM
Flacco had a better QB rating than Ben last night. Stats never lie.


speaking of passer ratings, Tom Brady's was 148.9 tonight against the Jets...

Tom's final stats: 21/29 for 326 yards and 4 TDs with no INTs
Almost 10 points lower than his previous game.

Time to give Hoyer a chance. :D


I completely agree...the Patriots should definitely start Hoyer against the Steelers in the AFCC game! :lol:

msp26505
12-07-2010, 08:35 AM
........ a no stress game I would rather have Manning.

In a big game, or without one of the above I would MUCH rather have Ben.

Question Shawn (or anyone)....in what way is Peyton is like Reggie Jackson?

Mr. October... :mrgreen:

chiken
12-07-2010, 09:44 AM
If/when we knock of the Pats in Foxboro (snapping that string of consecutive home wins) and then seal the deal in Dallas - lets revisit this.
Ben 3 - Brady 3

Peyton to me was out the picture when Ben won his 2nd..

Ben = champion
Peyton = FF king.

Tomlinator
12-07-2010, 10:21 AM
Marsha still has the cheat stink on him.

No matter how well he does I cannot get that out of my mind. At least once a game when I watch the *'s I hear the quote "When you have all the answers to the test..."

I'd like to know why the defensive geniuses haven't figured out a counter to the *'s schtick. The sungle wing, the K gun, the 46 defense, even the zone blitz, all have their achilles and have been successfully attacked. The ^&*# cheatriots scheme cannot be that impossible to defend.

Djfan
12-07-2010, 10:45 AM
Marsha still has the cheat stink on him.

No matter how well he does I cannot get that out of my mind. At least once a game when I watch the *'s I hear the quote "When you have all the answers to the test..."

I'd like to know why the defensive geniuses haven't figured out a counter to the *'s schtick. The sungle wing, the K gun, the 46 defense, even the zone blitz, all have their achilles and have been successfully attacked. The ^&*# cheatriots scheme cannot be that impossible to defend.


Agreed on the stink. It won't go away for me ever.

Also, the defense needed isn't perfected by anyone yet, but we had better get serious about it soon. We're going there in January.

MeetJoeGreene
12-07-2010, 10:50 AM
Marsha still has the cheat stink on him.

No matter how well he does I cannot get that out of my mind. At least once a game when I watch the *'s I hear the quote "When you have all the answers to the test..."

I'd like to know why the defensive geniuses haven't figured out a counter to the *'s schtick. The sungle wing, the K gun, the 46 defense, even the zone blitz, all have their achilles and have been successfully attacked. The ^&*# cheatriots scheme cannot be that impossible to defend.

Marsha does have the cheating taint.
And now he also enjoys extra protection from the refs and Goodell that Ben doesn't get.

ikestops85
12-07-2010, 11:04 AM
As much as I hate Tom Brady I agree that he is the best of this era so far. This era is not complete yet so I know of a QB with a crooked nose who could take that title away. :mrgreen:

aggiebones
12-07-2010, 01:22 PM
Eh, its hard to peg a group of QBs as elite.
I'd say Brady is an elite QB. He's a pretty pinpoint thrower that studies and exposes GOOD defenses.
After him, its hard to push out Manning. He's getting older so Brady is his main competition. But its hard not to look at Brees as his main competition.

Brady is CLEARLY no.1, like him or not. How much is BillB, we'll never know.

Brees is chasing Manning as an older top QB

Big Ben is above Rivers and Rodgers, maybe a few others chasing in the youth group, but Ben has the rings. Again, how much is the team. Ben bailed us out of the last SB, but didn't play great for 3 quarters. In the first one, he was a kid and being carried. So yes, he has 2 rings, but he needs another where he carries the team to solidify himself as a full elite, next to Brady. That said, Manning or Brees could also elevate themselves for the rest of their careers, but not there yet.
Manning bought Indy out of the toilet, where they will likely fall back to when he retires.


So Brady = unquestioned elite
Manning, Big Ben, Brees = probably elite, but have questions
Rivers, Rodgers, X = potential elites with alot to prove, but ability to do it IMO

proudpittsburgher
12-07-2010, 01:51 PM
Flacco had a better QB rating than Ben last night. Stats never lie.

And Manning had a slightly higher passing Rating than did Ben. You tell me who had the better game. :)

We can have this conversation all day, and have had it numerous times in the past, but I get incensed when Peyton Manning time after time gets a pass for his chokejobs in virtually every playoff year, yet Ben gets criticised after a completion because, well, it would have been better had he gotten rid of the ball sooner.

hawaiiansteel
12-07-2010, 04:58 PM
Peyton tops Unitas, but he’d prefer not to

Posted by Michael David Smith on December 7, 2010, 3:47 PM EST

http://nbcprofootballtalk.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/peyton2.jpg?w=250


Colts quarterback Johnny Unitas had a three-game stretch during Weeks 8-10 of the 1960 season in which he completed 54 of 103 passes for 979 yards, with seven touchdowns. But he also threw 10 interceptions over the course of those three games, and the defending champion Colts started a late-season skid, falling from first place to fourth place.

Fifty years later, Peyton Manning has done Unitas one better. Or one worse.

As I wrote in today’s Wall Street Journal, Manning’s passer rating of 77.7 in the last three games has topped Unitas’s rating of 68.4 in those three games in 1960, and is now the highest rating ever for a three-game stretch in which a quarterback throws at least 10 interceptions.

Basically, Manning has alternated from great (completing 105 of 148 passes for 1,046 yards and eight touchdowns) to terrible (11 interceptions) over the last three games. And the terrible side has won out, with the Colts falling from 6-3 to 6-6.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... er-not-to/ (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/12/07/peyton-tops-unitas-but-hed-prefer-not-to/)

aggiebones
12-07-2010, 05:26 PM
Window in time. Always fun to bash a guy when he's having a bad string.
But in reality, Manning is one of the best of our recent time. His coaches including Dungy are not top end. His defenses and running game mostly suspect, but he keeps them around.
Hard to do everything just by throwing.

RuthlessBurgher
12-07-2010, 11:42 PM
Brady=Montana (the pretty boys....both taken later in the draft...most titles of their respective eras)

Peyton=Marino (as fantasy QB's, they make you drool...but you don't get rings for fantasy stats, just commercials)

Ben=Elway (gritty, gutty, athletic, gunslinging, unconventional, playground comeback kings with multiple titles)

People had their favorites in the 80's.
People have their favorites now.
The debate continues on, a generation later.

tiproast
12-08-2010, 12:54 AM
Brady=Montana (the pretty boys....both taken later in the draft...most titles of their respective eras)

Peyton=Marino (as fantasy QB's, they make you drool...but you don't get rings for fantasy stats, just commercials)

Ben=Elway (gritty, gutty, athletic, gunslinging, unconventional, playground comeback kings with multiple titles)

People had their favorites in the 80's.
People have their favorites now.
The debate continues on, a generation later.
Apt comparisons.

Never liked Elway. An over-gifted underachiever. He was a supporting actor while Terrel Davis played the lead role on those two Super Bowl winners.

Ben's OK, I'm sure I'd be a big fan if he were QB of my team.

Never liked Marino, but like Manning even less. Both QBs seem to trust their arms more than their teammates. Maybe that's why Montana and Brady have been more successful - when you're not as physically gifted, you have to figure out how to use everyone's talents to get the best results. And if you have NFL level talent, and top-tier competitiveness and figure out the leadership challenge, then multiple championships happen.

Crash
12-08-2010, 03:13 AM
Never liked Elway. An over-gifted underachiever. He was a supporting actor while Terrel Davis played the lead role on those two Super Bowl winners.

Not true. Look at Elway's career from 1993-1998. His best seasons were after Dan Reeves' 1970 playbook vanished starting in 1993 and they went to a West Coast offense. Elway was dominant in his final three seasons and his most productive years were during his last 6 once Reeves was fired.

If anything Reeves wasted Elway's talent in his prime by not using him.

tiproast
12-08-2010, 08:59 AM
Not true. Look at Elway's career from 1993-1998. His best seasons were after Dan Reeves' 1970 playbook vanished starting in 1993 and they went to a West Coast offense. Elway was dominant in his final three seasons and his most productive years were during his last 6 once Reeves was fired.

If anything Reeves wasted Elway's talent in his prime by not using him.
This is the Internet. You're not supposed to use a rational argument to demolish my long-held but unsupportable bias against a despised player on a hated rival. :D

ALLD
12-08-2010, 05:41 PM
Manning choked at Tennessee. His one ring came as a game manager, so the first SBs between he and BB are a wash. Given a second opportunity, BB came up with the greatest pass in SB history and in Manning's second attempt he threw a pick.

I don't buy the media hype surrounding Manning. He is marketable and the media portrays him as a complete QB. However, he is more finesse and plays in a dome. Kurt Warner was tougher and he had a habit of choking too.

hawaiiansteel
12-08-2010, 06:52 PM
not only is Ben a great QB, but he's a good guy as well... :tt2


New fan story…

DECEMBER 8TH, 2010 BY ADMIN

This story comes from Robert Rangel of Grove City, California. He and his son Jonathan (photo below) took a cross-country trip to Baltimore on Sunday to watch the Steelers play the Ravens.

http://bigben7.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/jonathanrangel_dec52010.jpg

From Mr. Rangel:

I just want to publicly thank Ben for tossing the game ball to my son Jonathan on Sunday night as he walked off the field in Baltimore.

It was so cold the entire stadium emptied out before Ben left the field except for about six Steeler fans and a bunch of security guys.

We didn’t even know he was still out there. We just wanted to cheer the team after the game. We saw Mike Wallace walking off the field and were just saying things like “Great game!”, when all of a sudden we saw Ben approaching. He looked real tired, and I am sure he was hurting pretty bad. The crowd had been really mean to him all night long, so my son made a point of just yelling things like “Great game!” and “Way to go, Ben!”, and since we were just about alone in the stands next to the tunnel, it was easy for him to see who was yelling.

All I remember was Ben cracking a big smile (broken nose and all) and then tossing Jonathan the ball he had been holding since taking a knee to end the game. We couldn’t believe it. Jonathan, a former HS football player, hugged the ball between both arms like a running back while trying not to drop it as we waded through thousands of Raven fans leaving the stadium. By the time we walked back to our hotel, we saw a post-game video that showed Ben holding the ball while shaking Flacco’s hand and then while being interviewed on the field.

Needless to say, it made our trip from sunny California to freezing cold Baltimore the best father-son trip ever. Last year we traveled to Denver, the two years before to San Diego. Next year, we want to travel to Pittsburgh to see a “home” game.

Ben made a lifetime impression on my son (and me). We didn’t expect it, which made it even more special.

Attached is a photo of Jonathan holding the ball. Not ever going to see this ball on e-Bay or anywhere else. We are going to get a case for it and display it with the tickets and program.

More than that, we will tell and re-tell the story of a great game and a great QB who took the time to make us smile.

Ben, your gesture will always be remembered by two lifelong West Coast Steeler fans. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Robert Rangel
Garden Grove (a California suburb of Pittsburgh)

*Robert and Jonathan, thank you both for sharing the story and the photo!

http://bigben7.com/

ter1230_4
12-08-2010, 07:05 PM
Big Ben is above Rivers and Rodgers, maybe a few others chasing in the youth group, but Ben has the rings. Again, how much is the team. Ben bailed us out of the last SB, but didn't play great for 3 quarters. In the first one, he was a kid and being carried. So yes, he has 2 rings, but he needs another where he carries the team to solidify himself as a full elite, next to Brady

Two comments. First, I really object to the idea that in the first Super Bowl that the Steelers won with Roethlisberger as the QB he "was being carried". There is no question that Big Ben did not have the best game in Super Bowl XL as evidenced by his QB rating of 22, but even there he made a number of plays that don't show up in the statistics. like the big block he made on the Randle El TD pass. And the fact is that in the three road playoff games that the Steelers won to get to Super Bowl XL, Big Ben literally put the team on his shoulders and CARRIED THEM to the promised land. Who can ever forget the Immaculate Tackle that he made to save the game against the Colts? Brady doesn't make that play, nor Manning. Over the 4 postseason games that year, Roethlisberger had 8 TD's, 3 INT's and a QB Rating of 103 (and that includes the 22 from the SB). Contrast that with the Great Payton Manning's 4 post season games culminating in SB XLI, where he had 3 TD's, 8 INT's and a QB rating of 78. The first thing that Bill Cowher should do every morning when he wakes up is to Thank God for sending him Big Ben.

My second comment is that while Brady has one more ring, Brady has never lead his team to victory in the final minutes of a Super Bowl by driving them to a TD. His drives have been FG drives, which are not as difficult. The Great Payton Manning tried to do it last year and look what happened. In fact, the only other QB besides Big Ben to lead his team to a last minute TD scoring drive to win the Super Bowl in recent history is Eli Manning (and I was screamoing my support every step of the way).

chiken
12-09-2010, 12:12 AM
I hate Brady, but he is a living Qb legend right now.. He has 3 rings..
(hold on, let me throw up right quick)

Ben has 2 and if gets the 3rd he will also Walk in that world..
Every Qb with 3 or more rings is in the H.O.F.

Ben Performs in Big games just like Brady - these men are known as Winners throughout the league - even from people who hate them.. Manning has never ever ever been considered a winner, in fact he is labeled a choke artist which has accurately followed him from his college days.

Manning is a numbers God, his ring puts him above Marino, but like Marino falls short to Montana, Manning falls short to Brady.
The guy is 1 less choke job away from being Mcnabb.

IF Brees never wins another Superbowl is he really in the conversation?

Crash
12-09-2010, 04:11 AM
Peyton sucked in the playoffs the year he won his ring too.

papillon
12-09-2010, 01:44 PM
Ben's better than Peyton.

Ben is better at winning important games, but he is not a better quarterback than Peyton. That said, I wouldn't have anyone else quarterbacking the Steelers right now or in the past 6 years. Ben has made being a Steeler fan fun with the way he plays and with no preconceived notion of what a quarterback should and shouldn't do to be successful.

Even in the 70s it wasn't as much fun as it is right now to watch a Steeler game. The 70s guys had HOFers on top of HOFers playing, currently, Troy, Hines and Ben are potentials and that's a bout it and, yet, they continue to win a lot of games including playoffs and Super Bowls.

Peyton is still the better quarterback (overall, not just in the past three weeks).

Pappy

fordfixer
12-09-2010, 01:51 PM
Ben's better than Peyton.

Ben is better at winning important games, but he is not a better quarterback than Peyton. That said, I wouldn't have anyone else quarterbacking the Steelers right now or in the past 6 years. Ben has made being a Steeler fan fun with the way he plays and with no preconceived notion of what a quarterback should and shouldn't do to be successful.

Even in the 70s it wasn't as much fun as it is right now to watch a Steeler game. The 70s guys had HOFers on top of HOFers playing, currently, Troy, Hines and Ben are potentials and that's a bout it and, yet, they continue to win a lot of games including playoffs and Super Bowls.

Peyton is still the better quarterback (overall, not just in the past three weeks).

Pappy


IMHO it's hard to say who is the better QB when the style of play is so different. That being said I would take Ben over Tom or Payton. :tt1 :tt1

SteelTorch
12-09-2010, 01:59 PM
Ben's better than Peyton.

Ben is better at winning important games, but he is not a better quarterback than Peyton. That said, I wouldn't have anyone else quarterbacking the Steelers right now or in the past 6 years. Ben has made being a Steeler fan fun with the way he plays and with no preconceived notion of what a quarterback should and shouldn't do to be successful.

Even in the 70s it wasn't as much fun as it is right now to watch a Steeler game. The 70s guys had HOFers on top of HOFers playing, currently, Troy, Hines and Ben are potentials and that's a bout it and, yet, they continue to win a lot of games including playoffs and Super Bowls.

Peyton is still the better regular season quarterback (overall, not just in the past three weeks).

Pappy
Fixed one part for ya. :P

Crash
12-09-2010, 03:06 PM
Ben is better at winning important games, but he is not a better quarterback than Peyton.

Sure he is. This season confirms it. For the first time in his career the stability that Peyton has enjoyed at the skill positions around him is gone.

And he can't stop throwing picks.

Ben produces, even though for seven years he's always had constant change around him.

BURGH86STEEL
12-09-2010, 04:59 PM
Ben is better at winning important games, but he is not a better quarterback than Peyton.

Sure he is. This season confirms it. For the first time in his career the stability that Peyton has enjoyed at the skill positions around him is gone.

And he can't stop throwing picks.

Ben produces, even though for seven years he's always had constant change around him.

This season does not confirm anything. Most teams go through constant changes.

Put Peyton in the Steelers offense and I believe the offensive production and TD's goes up. We can talk about issues a long the Olines for both teams.

Peyton's struggled the last few weeks and the Colts suffered. Even with those struggles, he's put up 25 TD's up to this point in the season. The Colts offense is 4th in the league in scoring and ppg. Put that type of production with this Steelers defense and who knows how good the Steelers will be. Peyton must clean up the turnovers for his team to have a chance to make the playoffs.

IMO, one big difference between Peyton and Ben is consistency. Peyton plays his style of game at a higher level more consistently. The Steelers offense struggles because Ben does not play his style of game at a high level consistently. Consistency is what separates Peyton from Ben.

Crash
12-09-2010, 06:11 PM
This season does not confirm anything. Most teams go through constant changes.

I'm not talking most teams. I'm talking about Peyton.

Look at Ben's cast at WR. An over the hill Ward, Wallace is a stud, but Sanders and A. Brown are rookies and learning.

Add to that the OL Ben has.

And Ben still produces.

Manning would get slaughtered behind this line.


IMO, one big difference between Peyton and Ben is consistency. Peyton plays his style of game at a higher level more consistently.

Having the same guys around him for years will do that.

Peyton had Wayne/Harrison for 8 years straight.

Ben's in his 7th season, and already he's had FIVE DIFFERENT WR combos. That's almost unheard of.

But look now, Peyton's stability is crashing around him.

And so is his production.

hawaiiansteel
12-10-2010, 01:03 AM
Peyton looked good tonight against the Titans:


C/ATT YDS TD INT RATING

P. Manning 25/35 319 2 0 118.6


http://www2.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/Indianapolis+Colts+v+Tennessee+Titans+6TIJG6Jh4gIl .jpg

Captain Lemming
12-10-2010, 01:52 AM
Ben is better at winning important games, but he is not a better quarterback than Peyton.
I am sorry but in my view, this is an inherent contradiction.

Especially at QB, how you perform when its all on the line defines you.

The very fact that Peyton is SO GREAT a regular season QB, makes his chokes all the more pronounced.

Peytons game gets worse, the higher the stakes.

That is pathetic.

tiproast
12-10-2010, 02:08 AM
I am sorry but in my view, this is an inherent contradiction.

Especially at QB, how you perform when its all on the line defines you.

The very fact that Peyton is SO GREAT a regular season QB, makes his chokes all the more pronounced.

Peytons game gets worse, the higher the stakes.

That is pathetic.
Agree. Also, he's suffering now that he isn't surrounded by All-Pro talent at WR, RB and TE.

It's obvious this year that when he has to play with average NFL-level players, he's no longer the best QB in the league.

Polian built an offensive juggernaut by getting consecutive #1 overall picks due to suckiness, and spent almost all the arrows in his quiver on offense. And it worked for a while, but now that some of his original pieces are retired/hurt (E. James, Harrison, Dallas Clark), the team shows a remarkable lack of depth on both sides of the ball, and his QB's flaws, which many Pats fans have been pointing out for years, have become evident to even some formerly ardent Manning supporters.

papillon
12-10-2010, 07:45 AM
Ben is better at winning important games, but he is not a better quarterback than Peyton.
I am sorry but in my view, this is an inherent contradiction.

Especially at QB, how you perform when its all on the line defines you.

The very fact that Peyton is SO GREAT a regular season QB, makes his chokes all the more pronounced.

Peytons game gets worse, the higher the stakes.

That is pathetic.

And I disagree that winning in big games defines a quarterback. Dan Marino, Dan Fouts, Warren Moon, Jim Kelly and Fran Tarkenton are all in the HOF and were considered great quarterbacks.

Pappy

proudpittsburgher
12-10-2010, 10:13 AM
Put Peyton in the Steelers offense and I believe the offensive production and TD's goes up. We can talk about issues a long the Olines for both teams.

There is no way in the world Peyton puts up the same numbers as ben, much less exceed them, behind the Steelers offensive line. No way in hell. Many of Peyton's seasons have been behidn the best offensive line in the league, or at th every least a top five line. Ever since 05, The Steelers o-line has been putrid at best. I am not sayign you can;t win with that, but no way Peton does what Ben does behidn it.

ikestops85
12-10-2010, 11:03 AM
Peyton has looked bad the last few weeks because he has been knocked on his arse play after play. He does not like to get hit and that is why he is throwing balls where he shouldn't be. In my book Peyton is a better passer than Ben but Ben is the better QB.

Peyton needs everybody on the team to do their job right to be successful and he has been lucky that for the most part he has had a great offensive line and WRs. Ben can salvage things when others don't do their jobs. In other words Ben can take lemons and make lemonade. Peyton can't.

hawaiiansteel
12-13-2010, 04:17 PM
Tom Brady completed 27-of-40 passes for a season-high 369 yards and two touchdowns to the lead the Patriots to a blowout victory over the Bears at a snowy and windy Soldier Field in Week 14.

If the season ended now, Brady would be the slam-dunk MVP. As expected, he was masterful in the short passing game, defeating the elements while picking apart the Bears defense for a 33-0 halftime lead. Moving into 20th in all-time passing yards, Brady is behind only Bernie Kosar and Rich Gannon for the most consecutive pass attempts without an interception.

In the past five weeks without a Patriots turnover, Brady is 118-of-164 (72.0 percent) for 1,572 yards and a 15:0 TD-to-INT ratio. There isn't a hotter player in the league heading into a Week 15 matchup against the Packers.

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/player ... FL&id=1163 (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&id=1163)

williar
12-13-2010, 10:29 PM
Y'all are flat out killing me!!!! Don't even mention Ben Roetlisberger in the same sentence as Manning, Brady, Brees etc. As pitiful as our offense is...can't even score from the 2 yard line. And some of you fools saying you would rather have Ben then Brady or Manning? That's like saying I'd rather have Bryant McFadden over Darelle Revis or Nhamdi Asomuaugh. You know, because Mcfadden is perfect for our system. Well, if you guys are happy averaging 3 field goals and 5 sacks per game, well then, I guess Ben is your guy! If you like touchdowns and competitive scoring then you better consider Brady, Manning, Brees or Rivers. This, Ben is better than Manning and Brady crap is so elementary.

Captain Lemming
12-13-2010, 11:02 PM
Well, if you guys are happy averaging 3 field goals and 5 sacks per game, well then, I guess Ben is your guy! If you like touchdowns and competitive scoring then you better consider Brady, Manning, Brees or Rivers. This, Ben is better than Manning and Brady crap is so elementary.

Brady is GREAT. Manning? I'll take Ben over him any day.

I like a QB who can take his team down the field under SB pressure to score the winning TD without CHOCKING. Can Manning do THAT?

I like championships. The real kind. Thats what Ben does.
Your "touchdowns and competitive scoring"?
Yeah, when I want a fantasy football championship I'll take Manning over Ben easy.

feltdizz
12-13-2010, 11:31 PM
Put Peyton in the Steelers offense and I believe the offensive production and TD's goes up. We can talk about issues a long the Olines for both teams.

There is no way in the world Peyton puts up the same numbers as ben, much less exceed them, behind the Steelers offensive line. No way in hell. Many of Peyton's seasons have been behidn the best offensive line in the league, or at th every least a top five line. Ever since 05, The Steelers o-line has been putrid at best. I am not sayign you can;t win with that, but no way Peton does what Ben does behidn it.

That argument doesn't hold water.... how good would Manning be if he had our D?

One thing I know... if Peyton was our QB... we wouldn't have a bad OL. He wouldn't let the GM get away with it. Ben takes pride in playing with a bad OL and carrying them along for the ride.

hawaiiansteel
12-15-2010, 02:37 PM
Peyton Manning named AFC offensive player of the week

Posted by Michael David Smith on December 15, 2010

http://nbcprofootballtalk.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/peyton3.jpg?w=250


The Colts snapped their three-game losing streak and Peyton Manning ended his three-game slump last week, and as a result Manning has been named the AFC offensive player of the week.

Manning completed 25-of-35 passes for 319 yards with two touchdowns and no interceptions as the Colts beat the Titans 30-28 on Thursday. It was Manning’s 63rd 300-yard game, tying Dan Marino’s NFL record.

Manning had thrown for 1,046 yards during the Colts’ three-game losing streak, but he also threw 11 interceptions. The difference between the Manning we saw Thursday night and the Manning who led the Colts to three straight losses was that Manning finally stopped throwing the ball to the other team.

Now we’ll see if Manning can keep avoiding interceptions with the Colts’ season on the line Sunday against the Jaguars.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... -the-week/ (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/12/15/peyton-manning-named-afc-offensive-player-of-the-week/)

grotonsteel
12-15-2010, 02:55 PM
Put Peyton in the Steelers offense and I believe the offensive production and TD's goes up. We can talk about issues a long the Olines for both teams.

There is no way in the world Peyton puts up the same numbers as ben, much less exceed them, behind the Steelers offensive line. No way in hell. Many of Peyton's seasons have been behidn the best offensive line in the league, or at th every least a top five line. Ever since 05, The Steelers o-line has been putrid at best. I am not sayign you can;t win with that, but no way Peton does what Ben does behidn it.

That argument doesn't hold water.... how good would Manning be if he had our D?



I disagree.

Can you remember a Peyton drive which goes for 9 min? Steelers D will be gasping for air in 3Q itself.

Also Peyton Manning cannot throw in cold weather and bad turf.

grotonsteel
12-15-2010, 02:59 PM
Ben is better at winning important games, but he is not a better quarterback than Peyton.

Sure he is. This season confirms it. For the first time in his career the stability that Peyton has enjoyed at the skill positions around him is gone.

And he can't stop throwing picks.

Ben produces, even though for seven years he's always had constant change around him.

This season does not confirm anything. Most teams go through constant changes.

Put Peyton in the Steelers offense and I believe the offensive production and TD's goes up. We can talk about issues a long the Olines for both teams.

Peyton's struggled the last few weeks and the Colts suffered. Even with those struggles, he's put up 25 TD's up to this point in the season. The Colts offense is 4th in the league in scoring and ppg. Put that type of production with this Steelers defense and who knows how good the Steelers will be. Peyton must clean up the turnovers for his team to have a chance to make the playoffs.

IMO, one big difference between Peyton and Ben is consistency. Peyton plays his style of game at a higher level more consistently. The Steelers offense struggles because Ben does not play his style of game at a high level consistently. Consistency is what separates Peyton from Ben.


Its easy to be consistent when you are playing in dome and in AFC South where Defense is optional.

Peyton make Colts Defense look bad. The year they won SB...Peyton sucked but they ran the ball more. Is it coincidence that Colts had a better defense once they started running the ball more?

feltdizz
12-15-2010, 03:07 PM
Put Peyton in the Steelers offense and I believe the offensive production and TD's goes up. We can talk about issues a long the Olines for both teams.

There is no way in the world Peyton puts up the same numbers as ben, much less exceed them, behind the Steelers offensive line. No way in hell. Many of Peyton's seasons have been behidn the best offensive line in the league, or at th every least a top five line. Ever since 05, The Steelers o-line has been putrid at best. I am not sayign you can;t win with that, but no way Peton does what Ben does behidn it.

That argument doesn't hold water.... how good would Manning be if he had our D?



I disagree.

Can you remember a Peyton drive which goes for 9 min? Steelers D will be gasping for air in 3Q itself.

Also Peyton Manning cannot throw in cold weather and bad turf.

that is because he runs the hurry up all damn game like he has to pee.

The year they won the SB they definitely ran more but the key was Sanders. He was their anchor on D. He just gets hurt too often.

grotonsteel
12-15-2010, 03:22 PM
Put Peyton in the Steelers offense and I believe the offensive production and TD's goes up. We can talk about issues a long the Olines for both teams.

There is no way in the world Peyton puts up the same numbers as ben, much less exceed them, behind the Steelers offensive line. No way in hell. Many of Peyton's seasons have been behidn the best offensive line in the league, or at th every least a top five line. Ever since 05, The Steelers o-line has been putrid at best. I am not sayign you can;t win with that, but no way Peton does what Ben does behidn it.

That argument doesn't hold water.... how good would Manning be if he had our D?



I disagree.

Can you remember a Peyton drive which goes for 9 min? Steelers D will be gasping for air in 3Q itself.

Also Peyton Manning cannot throw in cold weather and bad turf.

that is because he runs the hurry up all damn game like he has to pee.

The year they won the SB they definitely ran more but the key was Sanders. He was their anchor on D. He just gets hurt too often.


Sanders is heck of a safety but often injured...i think he will retire this offseason..

hawaiiansteel
12-16-2010, 02:02 PM
100 Things Every Steelers Fan Should Know Before They Die: #90 – Public Enemy #1 – Tom Brady

by Matt Loede

http://www.steelersgab.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/brady.jpg

No one player seems to have had the disdain of Steeler Nation more than that of Patriots future Hall of Fame quarterback Tom Brady. He has given the Steelers nightmares, and basically has been responsible for keeping the Steelers out of not one, but two Super Bowls under Bill Cowher. He also has recorded a couple of huge regular season wins as well, again beating Cowher and now Steelers coach Mike Tomlin.


To say that Brady is everything that the Steeler fans dislike is an understatement. He’s handsome, married to a model, and has graced the cover of GQ magazine. Yuck. If there’s anything that Steeler fans hate, it’s a guy that not only seems to have it all on the field, but off of it as well. You can’t deny Brady’s success though, as he’s a for sure first ballot Hall of Famer, and a guy that has broken plenty of hearts in Steeler Country.

The dislike of Brady started in the 2001 season, as the QB was the starter as New England came to Pittsburgh as heavy underdogs in the AFC Championship game against Kordell Stewart and the 13-3 Steelers. He didn’t have all that huge of an impact on the upset win, but did go 12-for-18 for 115 yards before he left the game with a knee injury and was relieved by Drew Bledsoe.

New England though ended the Steelers season 24-17 mostly thanks to a blocked field goal for a score, and a punt return for a score. Even with that, the stage was set for Steelers fans to disdain Brady as the following week he hoisted the Super Bowl trophy after beating the St.Louis Rams 20-17 in New Orleans.

The two teams met on opening night the following season, and with revenge on the mind of the Steelers they were once again put to sleep by Brady and New England, as he threw for 294 yards and three scores as the black and gold were soundly beaten 30-14.

It took a bewitching holiday two years later for the Steelers to finally stop Brady. On Halloween 2004, rookie QB Ben Roethlisberger and the team halted the Pats 21-game winning streak, winning 34-20 as the team went 15-1 in the regular season. Heartbreak by Brady again through would follow.

In one the of the toughest playoff losses in Steelers history, Brady and New England returned to Heinz Field on January 23rd, and soundly beat Pittsburgh in the AFC Title game 41-27. Brady was on fire all day, hitting on 14-of-21 passes for 207 yards and two touchdowns to go along with a QB rating of 130.5.

It was a long hard day for Cowher and the Steelers, and yet another day that Brady celebrated at the Steelers expense. Maybe the toughest part of the day was the fact that the night before Brady was getting intravenous treatment as he ran a temperature of 103 degrees.

The following season he once again came into Pittsburgh, and rolled the Steelers for 372 yards going 31-of-44 as the Pats won 23-20 in week three of the NFL season. About the only saving grace was the fact that New England was knocked out of the playoffs by the Broncos, and the following day the Steelers topped the number one seed Colts in the playoffs to earn the right to travel to Denver to play for the right to go to the Super Bowl, which of course the team won to eventually win their fifth Super Bowl.

The final Brady win over the Steelers came in week 14 of the 2006 Patriots regular season undefeated season. Upset by a guarantee by Steelers safety Anthony Madison that the Steelers would win, Brady gouged the team, going 32-of-46 for 399 yards and four TD’s as New England won 34-13. It was the first time that Mike Tomlin felt the wrath of Brady against a Steelers defense, and the QB made it look rather easy.

At the end of the day, the numbers and record Brady has put up against the Steelers cannot be denied. He owns a lifetime 5-1 mark against them, throwing for 1658 yards, hitting on 123-of-212 passes with 11 touchdowns and three interceptions. Maybe one day in a big game the Steelers will have the last laugh, but for now, Brady remains public enemy number one on the Steelers list of players we love to hate.

http://www.steelersgab.com/2010/11/13/1 ... ey-die-90- (http://www.steelersgab.com/2010/11/13/100-things-every-steelers-fan-should-know-before-they-die-90-)–-public-enemy-1-tom-brady/

RuthlessBurgher
12-16-2010, 02:06 PM
Anthony Madison??? Killswitch's last name is Smith.

hawaiiansteel
12-17-2010, 02:46 AM
Determined Pats QB Tom Brady 'playing on a different planet'

By Jim Corbett, USA TODAY


FOXBOROUGH, Mass. — Pittsburgh Steelers defensive coordinator D!ck LeBeau marveled at how Tom Brady's passes sliced through a Soldier Field blizzard as if he were facing the Chicago Bears on a sun-splashed September day.

That 36-7 rout Sunday epitomized Brady and coach Bill Belichick's 11-2 New England Patriots at their winterized best, with Brady throwing for a season-high 369 yards with two touchdowns despite 30- to 50-mph wind gusts.

"To do what Brady did in those weather conditions in Chicago? That might be one of the most outstanding quarterback performances — ever," said LeBeau, 73, a cornerback and coach for 51 years whose defense was lit up by Brady 39-26 on Nov. 14. "He's doing it every week.

"But it's not the same in a blizzard. He's remarkable."

How remarkable?

The three-time Super Bowl winner hasn't thrown an interception in 268 consecutive passes.

That impressive streak will be on the line Sunday at Gillette Stadium against the Green Bay Packers.

"Tom is playing terrific football," said Harrison, who won two Super Bowls with Brady from 2003 to 2008. "You can talk about (Philadelphia Eagles starter) Michael Vick and how dynamic he's been. But Tom's playing on a different planet.

"Tom's the best player on the best team right now."

Yet Brady, the league's most efficient third-down passer with 12 touchdowns and two interceptions, isn't focused on taking home his second league MVP award since earning 2007 honors. He's driven to hoist a fourth Lombardi Trophy after leading the Patriots to Super Bowl titles after the 2001, 2003 and 2004 seasons.

"I locker next to this guy, and he never ceases to amaze me with how he continues to improve in his preparation and his teaching of the receivers to gain that edge," said Deion Branch, the ninth-year receiver reunited with Brady in an Oct. 12 trade after four seasons with the Seattle Seahawks. "MVP honors don't do anything for Tom.

"You can see it in his eyes, his preparation and his play. Winning Super Bowls is his destiny."

No Moss, no loss

Remember when the young, post-Randy Moss Patriots were supposed to struggle in a rebuilding season after Belichick traded the deep-threat receiver to the Minnesota Vikings on Oct. 3?

Instead, the league's hottest team has won eight of nine. Brady appears to be liberated from the burden of mollifying Moss.

Belichick and Brady have built a deceptively high-powered offense, averaging a league-best 31.9 points. Without a lot of star power, they're causing matchup nightmares with rookie tight ends Rob Gronkowski and Aaron Hernandez (a combined 11 TDs) and slithery, smallish receivers Wes Welker, Branch, Julian Edelman and Brandon Tate. Equally undersized running back Danny Woodhead is complemented by power back BenJarvus Green-Ellis (11 TDs).

"With Randy gone, it's a more productive, higher-percentage passing game," said former Patriots receiver Troy Brown, who was with Brady for all three Super Bowl victories and now is a Comcast SportsNet New England analyst.

"People kill me saying, 'It's a simple offense.' If it's so simple, then stop it."

Brady's best season was his 50-touchdown, 2007 campaign. He lost nearly all of the 2008 season after a hit by then-Kansas City Chiefs safety Bernard Pollard early in the opener. And he might not have been 100% last season as the Patriots fell to the Baltimore Ravens in the first round of the playoffs — at New England.

But this season, he appears more confident in his surgically repaired left knee.

"This is what Brady does," Harrison said. "Everyone forgets he was still hurt last year. I had the same injury. It takes two years to feel comfortable."

How has Brady continued raising his game in his 10th season as a starter?

"He's always working on the little things that might come up on one play twice a season," Belichick said.

"He continually prepares at a very high level both on the opposing team's scheme and personnel. And he continues to try to have a better understanding of our offense, what options there are on certain plays and situations. He's always striving to get better."

With a 122-36 record including playoffs, Brady has led the Patriots to victory in 108 of his 140 career regular-season starts. That's a .771 winning percentage, best of any quarterback in the Super Bowl era.

"He came up to me on the field before the Chicago game and Tom had this killer look in his eyes in the sense of that killer instinct," owner Robert Kraft said. "He's a great competitor who makes everyone around him better."

At 33, Brady is the elder statesman now, radiating an urgency stemming from brushes with his mortality. He first felt them after a possible fourth Super Bowl title was unceremoniously ripped away by the New York Giants after the 2007 season and again after losing that 2008 season to injury.

On the morning of Sept. 10, Brady's Audi sedan was blindsided by a van that ran a red light near his Boston home as he headed to team headquarters.

That evening, the quarterback signed a four-year, $72 million extension, making him the league's highest-paid player.

The crash shook him.

Brady's father, Tom Sr., sensed a realization by his son that he was "vincible."

The elder Brady, speaking from his home in Northern California, said, "Tommy had a lot of success early on. (After the 2005 season), he flipped the coin before the Super Bowl, walked off the field, through the tunnel and flew home. He said, 'I can't watch a Super Bowl I'm not playing in.'

"He feels the Super Bowl is his divine right. If he can get his team to another Super Bowl, that will be five in nine years. It darned near feels like your divine right."

Brady looks the part of the California boy with cleft chin and flowing rock-star hair he says his supermodel wife, Gisele Bundchen, prefers, tucked beneath his blue Patriots cap when he addressed the news media Wednesday at his locker.

Yet the golden boy acknowledges he's in his golden years, at least football-wise.

"With any veteran, you naturally take on more responsibility," Brady said. "I do a little more mentorship and relate to what the younger guys are going through.

"My teammates elected me captain. It's something I'm very proud of and take very seriously."

Especially in December and January.

"In college, who knew he'd be where he is now?" says Packers cornerback Charles Woodson, Brady's Michigan teammate. "Joe Montana was Joe Cool. Brady's very similar the way he drops back, sits in that pocket and acts like there's no rush coming. And he's a winner. That's the greatest comparison."

Brady's 14 playoff victories as a starting quarterback are two behind boyhood idol Montana, who owns one more Super Bowl victory.

"We were happy we had the privilege of making Tom the game's highest-paid player," Kraft said. "He's like my fifth son.

"I've watched him grow up from our fourth-string quarterback. Even with all the success, he's remained the same humble guy who works so hard."

Snow Ball

The Belichick era Patriots are 11-0 in the snow, which is forecast for Sunday.

The wizard of situational preparedness, Belichick has his team practice on New England's frozen turf. To prepare for the Bears, Belichick had Brady practice with footballs stored in a freezer.

"Mr. Kraft had that practice bubble built that we don't use," Branch laughed. "I don't know how many millions it cost him. Coach Belichick doesn't care."

Atlanta Falcons quarterback Matt Ryan is nicknamed "Matty Ice." But "Brady Ice" thrives in cold weather with a 19-2 record in games played in snow, ice or below-freezing temperatures.

By clinching a playoff berth Sunday, the Patriots own the inside track for AFC home-field advantage, meaning the AFC road to Super Bowl XLV might well go through New England's snow fort, where Brady has won 26 consecutive regular-season games.

Wasn't it only yesterday that Brady, who replaced injured Drew Bledsoe in Week 3 of 2001, clapped both hands atop his head in disbelief after leading the Patriots to a Super Bowl XXXVI stunner against the St. Louis Rams?

Then he had veterans such as linebackers Willie McGinest and Tedy Bruschi to police the locker room.

"He's had to become more of a vocal leader, because when we won those three championships, we had veterans sprinkled all around," Harrison said.

Yet this is the time of year Brady lives for. Like his demanding coach, the perfectionist quarterback won't let teammates settle. "Coach wants us to be a smart, tough, physical football team that plays well under pressure," Brady said. "This is football season now.

"It's not easy anymore to get out of bed, come to work and practice. Everyone's tired. It's cold. And there's 25 things going on with the holidays and family.

"But this is when the real teams start to shine."

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football ... over_N.htm (http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/patriots/2010-12-16-tom-brady-cover_N.htm)

tiproast
12-17-2010, 07:08 AM
Nice article, Hawaiian. Thanks for posting it.

hawaiiansteel
12-19-2010, 02:48 PM
Nice article, Hawaiian. Thanks for posting it.


you are very welcome.

do you remember if Tom Brady was as good at Michigan as he is now in the pros? he must not have been or else he would have gotten drafted higher than the 6th round...

grotonsteel
12-19-2010, 03:06 PM
Nice article, Hawaiian. Thanks for posting it.


you are very welcome.

do you remember if Tom Brady was as good at Michigan as he is now in the pros? he must not have been or else he would have gotten drafted higher than the 6th round...

I am not sure if Tom Brady was the starter in Michigan.

If my memory serves me right he was a backup to Brian Griese.

tiproast
12-19-2010, 03:41 PM
Nice article, Hawaiian. Thanks for posting it.


you are very welcome.

do you remember if Tom Brady was as good at Michigan as he is now in the pros? he must not have been or else he would have gotten drafted higher than the 6th round...
He was backup to Brian Griese the year Michigan was National Champion.

He started his junior and senior years, although his brain-dead coach would occasionally put in Drew Henson.

Michigan spotted Alabama a huge lead in the Orange Bowl one year, and Brady led them all the way back to an OT victory (35-47 369, 4 TDs, 0 Ints). That's what put him on the Pats radar screen for that year's draft.

hawaiiansteel
12-21-2010, 02:58 PM
Terrell Suggs: Drew Brees is better than Peyton Manning, Tom Brady

Posted by Michael David Smith on December 16, 2010


http://nbcprofootballtalk.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/drewbrees.jpg?w=250


Ravens linebacker Terrell Suggs is preparing for Sunday’s game against Saints quarterback Drew Brees, an NFC quarterback Suggs doesn’t see often. But Suggs says he’s seen enough to know that Brees is even better than a couple of AFC quarterbacks he does see often, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning.

“Well, in my eyes he’s better,” Suggs said, per Jamison Hensley of the Baltimore Sun. “Maybe it could be my personal vendetta against the other guys, but he’s definitely one of the premier quarterbacks in this league, and he’s got the numbers to prove it. And not only that, he’s got the hardware to prove it.”

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... tom-brady/ (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/12/16/terrell-suggs-drew-brees-is-better-than-peyton-manning-tom-brady/)

papillon
12-21-2010, 03:15 PM
For me, Ben makes the game so much more fun to watch than Tom Brady, Peyton Manning and Drew Brees and so, since, the NFL is entertainment for me I'll take Ben all day long.

He's not as polished a quarterback as those guys.
He may not see the game the way those guys do.
He may not even be as accurate as those guys.

One thing he is though is entertaining and he also happens to be a d@mn good quarterback. Watching Steeler football has never been so much fun as it has since Ben took over in 2004. You never know what might happen and the Steelers are never out of a game in which Ben is the quarterback. It's fun, maddening and exciting; I'll take it all day.

Pappy

Crash
12-21-2010, 03:19 PM
Put Ben in a freaking dome 10 times a year and lets see how he does?

Drew Brees was so good in 2003 he was benched for Doug Flutie.

PSU_dropout43
12-21-2010, 03:39 PM
For me, Ben makes the game so much more fun to watch than Tom Brady, Peyton Manning and Drew Brees and so, since, the NFL is entertainment for me I'll take Ben all day long.

He's not as polished a quarterback as those guys.
He may not see the game the way those guys do.
He may not even be as accurate as those guys.

One thing he is though is entertaining and he also happens to be a d@mn good quarterback. Watching Steeler football has never been so much fun as it has since Ben took over in 2004. You never know what might happen and the Steelers are never out of a game in which Ben is the quarterback. It's fun, maddening and exciting; I'll take it all day.

Pappy
In a lot of ways, Ben's a modern day Roger Staubach.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-t ... -vs-Morton (http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-top-ten/09000d5d81113dc8/Top-Ten-QB-Controversies-Staubach-vs-Morton)

Crash
12-21-2010, 03:40 PM
Ben is Bradshaw, that's what drives Terry nuts.

papillon
12-21-2010, 03:47 PM
Ben is Bradshaw, that's what drives Terry nuts.

There it is; only difference is Ben is a better quarterback.

Pappy

tiproast
12-21-2010, 06:29 PM
Put Ben in a freaking dome 10 times a year and lets see how he does?

And conversely, I'd like to see how Brees and Manning would do in the Chicago weather Brady was faced with just over a week ago.

hawaiiansteel
12-21-2010, 09:59 PM
I'd like to see how Brees and Manning would do in the Chicago weather Brady was faced with just over a week ago.


that's only because Tom had the unfair advantage of wearing those Ugg boots...

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_0te6xpwQSUI/TPijJaAmO1I/AAAAAAAABBM/Fa-SFzCqYtM/s400/tombrady.jpg

tiproast
12-21-2010, 11:07 PM
that's only because Tom had the unfair advantage of wearing those Ugg boots...

Old Chinese saying from Pau'P Wah Ner - You play the way you practice.

hawaiiansteel
12-26-2010, 04:47 PM
gotta give Brady props, this is a heckuva record... :Clap


Updated: December 26, 2010

Tom Brady sets NFL record

Associated Press

http://tombradyphotos.com/images/tom_brady_photos1.jpg


ORCHARD PARK, N.Y. -- New England Patriots quarterback Tom Brady has set the NFL record for consecutive pass attempts without an interception.

Brady broke the mark of 308 attempts without a pick previously set by Cleveland's Bernie Kosar over the 1990-91 seasons with his 17th attempt in the third quarter of New England's game against Buffalo on Sunday. It came on a short pass over the middle that tight end Rod Gronkowski dropped at the goal line.

The two then hooked up for an 8-yard TD on the next play to put the Patriots up 31-3. Brady opened the game going 10 of 18 for 87 yards and three touchdowns.

Brady has thrown only four interceptions this season, his last coming nine games ago when he threw two in a 23-20 win over Baltimore on Oct. 17.

http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/nfl/ne ... id=5957144 (http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/nfl/news/story?id=5957144)