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SteelStallion
11-15-2010, 11:16 AM
... of the circling of the drain like last year? Their pass D seems as bad as last year even with Troy. Farrior and Foote aren't reliable when called upon. And their " number one against the run" thing seems deceiving since one clearly doesn't have to run to beat Pittsburgh. This, and the O isn't as good. So is this the start of another losing streak? Have they been exposed again or do they rebound? Thoughts?

NW Steeler
11-15-2010, 11:24 AM
Well, not every team is equipped to do what the Pats did to the Steelers last night. But with the amount of injuries that we have, it will be a daunting task to make the playoffs with the amount of teams at 6-3 & 5-4. Last night was FUGLY.

Oviedo
11-15-2010, 11:24 AM
... of the circling of the drain like last year? Their pass D seems as bad as last year even with Troy. Farrior and Foote aren't reliable when called upon. And their " number one against the run" thing seems deceiving since one clearly doesn't have to run to beat Pittsburgh. This, and the O isn't as good. So is this the start of another losing streak? Have they been exposed again or do they rebound? Thoughts?

That's because last year's defensive problems had nothing to do with Troy missing but it was a convenient excuse versus doing a real assessment of a scheme that everyone we play against knows if you max protect against you will have all day to find an open receiver.

The O is being hamstrung by an OL that is totally inconsistent due to injuries and the lack of talented depth. Add to that a WR corps that has one legit receiver (Wallace) and a bunch of over the hill WRs who can't get separation in Hines and ARE. Put ARE on the sideline and get Sanders and Brown on the field. What is the worse that can happen...they drop passes? ARE has that mastered.

sentinel33
11-15-2010, 11:33 AM
People need to chill. We didnt play our best game by any stretch. and it was the patriots after all. Belichick is a better coach. thats one reason we lost that game.
defensive adjustments are another reason we lost that game.
losing ward early didnt help, along with a LT & LG that had never played together before.
missing our starting defensive ends doesnt help either. with all of that going on and to lose by 10. the team played hard. except Reed. he's turned into an embarassment and should be released. bring in piotr czech.
i dont think this is gonna turn into the out of control spiral of last year.
i thought that early in the game we missed opportunities(mainly by the Wr's) but i really liked how Wallace, a second year player, and Sanders, a rookie, turned there game on. you could see it. i think this was a good learning game for both of those receivers and we will be better off because of it.
ben was right on pretty much the entire game. not his fault his receivers cant catch-Randle El.
You pretty much have to play mistake free football when you play the cheatriots. missing opportunities early to stay in the game cost us. you certainly dont want to play catch up against a team like that.
dont know how serious wards injury is. but as for me, i've been wanting antonio brown active for weeks. i really like the trio of wallace, sanders and brown. yeah they are young and will make mistakes, but they are also the future. with oakland and buffalo coming in this is the time to really get them involved. i dont know why brown isnt active but randle el is?
tough loss but all is not lost. keep the faith people

Oviedo
11-15-2010, 12:10 PM
People need to chill. We didnt play our best game by any stretch. and it was the patriots after all. Belichick is a better coach. thats one reason we lost that game.
defensive adjustments are another reason we lost that game.
losing ward early didnt help, along with a LT & LG that had never played together before.
missing our starting defensive ends doesnt help either. with all of that going on and to lose by 10. the team played hard. except Reed. he's turned into an embarassment and should be released. bring in piotr czech.
i dont think this is gonna turn into the out of control spiral of last year.
i thought that early in the game we missed opportunities(mainly by the Wr's) but i really liked how Wallace, a second year player, and Sanders, a rookie, turned there game on. you could see it. i think this was a good learning game for both of those receivers and we will be better off because of it.
ben was right on pretty much the entire game. not his fault his receivers cant catch-Randle El.
You pretty much have to play mistake free football when you play the cheatriots. missing opportunities early to stay in the game cost us. you certainly dont want to play catch up against a team like that.
dont know how serious wards injury is. but as for me, i've been wanting antonio brown active for weeks. i really like the trio of wallace, sanders and brown. yeah they are young and will make mistakes, but they are also the future. with oakland and buffalo coming in this is the time to really get them involved. i dont know why brown isnt active but randle el is?
tough loss but all is not lost. keep the faith people



defensive adjustments are another reason we lost that game

Did you see any? I saw the same one I saw in the second half of the Saints game...zero!!!! Just do the same old thing and wait for someone to make a play.

steelblood
11-15-2010, 01:49 PM
Yeah, you know, after last year, I don't want to hear that we need to chill. This team imploded when Aaron Smith got injured and teams started spreading us out and exposing our weaker DBs. It is happening again. It is time to try something, anything different. When the next team starts picking us apart, I want to see that the coaches have a new strategy/personnel grouping/alignment. IF it doesn't work, I'm fine with that. I really just want to see that our staff recognizes that there is a formula for beating us and that they can at least attempt to counteract it.

papillon
11-15-2010, 02:29 PM
... of the circling of the drain like last year? Their pass D seems as bad as last year even with Troy. Farrior and Foote aren't reliable when called upon. And their " number one against the run" thing seems deceiving since one clearly doesn't have to run to beat Pittsburgh. This, and the O isn't as good. So is this the start of another losing streak? Have they been exposed again or do they rebound? Thoughts?

Maybe the Steelers are finding out that Aaron Smith is much more important than they want to believe, since, he's really the only defensive started not playing the past few games and the defense has gotten torched.

Pappy

Oviedo
11-15-2010, 02:37 PM
... of the circling of the drain like last year? Their pass D seems as bad as last year even with Troy. Farrior and Foote aren't reliable when called upon. And their " number one against the run" thing seems deceiving since one clearly doesn't have to run to beat Pittsburgh. This, and the O isn't as good. So is this the start of another losing streak? Have they been exposed again or do they rebound? Thoughts?

Maybe the Steelers are finding out that Aaron Smith is much more important than they want to believe, since, he's really the only defensive started not playing the past few games and the defense has gotten torched.

Pappy

And that would be a major concern because he has one year at most left in him. I think there is a high probability he retires after this season.

BURGH86STEEL
11-15-2010, 02:41 PM
... of the circling of the drain like last year? Their pass D seems as bad as last year even with Troy. Farrior and Foote aren't reliable when called upon. And their " number one against the run" thing seems deceiving since one clearly doesn't have to run to beat Pittsburgh. This, and the O isn't as good. So is this the start of another losing streak? Have they been exposed again or do they rebound? Thoughts?

Maybe the Steelers are finding out that Aaron Smith is much more important than they want to believe, since, he's really the only defensive started not playing the past few games and the defense has gotten torched.

Pappy

I don't buy it. Smith's not responsible for rushing the passer or pass coverage. He was great at helping the defense stop the run. He was never a great pass rusher.

This defense loss to the Pats because they could not get consistent pressure on Brady. Brady had a lot to do with that by making the right decisions, quick decisions, and he threw the ball accurately. Appeared the defense tried to mix things up. Brady was on his game. Gotta give him credit. He's one of the few QB's that makes every one around him better.

RuthlessBurgher
11-15-2010, 02:51 PM
I'm not pushing any panic buttons yet. It was an awful showing against a good team. That happens. Last year, the circling of the drain involved losing inexplicably to the dregs of the league. So far, we have only lost to teams that are quite good (7-2 New England, 6-3 New Orleans, and 6-3 Baltimore). So far, we have beaten the teams that we should beat (3-6 Cleveland, 2-7 Cincinnati) and also beaten several teams with respectable records at this point as well (7-2 Atlanta, 6-3 Tampa Bay, 5-4 Tennessee, 5-4 Miami). If we lose to, say, Buffalo in a couple of weeks, then I'd start being majorly concerned about history possibly repeating itself. But right now we still have twice as many wins than losses in spite of all the injuries, suspension, absurd fines, etc. Next week's game will be a legit challenge, since the Raiders are all of a sudden a solid squad. How we bounce back from this performance will show us a lot about what this team is made of.

AngryAsian
11-15-2010, 02:57 PM
I'm not pushing any panic buttons yet. It was an awful showing against a good team. That happens. Last year, the circling of the drain involved losing inexplicably to the dregs of the league. So far, we have only lost to teams that are quite good (7-2 New England, 6-3 New Orleans, and 6-3 Baltimore). So far, we have beaten the teams that we should beat (3-6 Cleveland, 2-7 Cincinnati) and also beaten several teams with respectable records at this point as well (7-2 Atlanta, 6-3 Tampa Bay, 5-4 Tennessee, 5-4 Miami). If we lose to, say, Buffalo in a couple of weeks, then I'd start being majorly concerned about history possibly repeating itself. But right now we still have twice as many wins than losses in spite of all the injuries, suspension, absurd fines, etc. Next week's game will be a legit challenge, since the Raiders are all of a sudden a solid squad. How we bounce back from this performance will show us a lot about what this team is made of.


The voice of reason. Thank you, compadre.

NW Steeler
11-15-2010, 03:38 PM
I'm not pushing any panic buttons yet. It was an awful showing against a good team. That happens. Last year, the circling of the drain involved losing inexplicably to the dregs of the league. So far, we have only lost to teams that are quite good (7-2 New England, 6-3 New Orleans, and 6-3 Baltimore). So far, we have beaten the teams that we should beat (3-6 Cleveland, 2-7 Cincinnati) and also beaten several teams with respectable records at this point as well (7-2 Atlanta, 6-3 Tampa Bay, 5-4 Tennessee, 5-4 Miami). If we lose to, say, Buffalo in a couple of weeks, then I'd start being majorly concerned about history possibly repeating itself. But right now we still have twice as many wins than losses in spite of all the injuries, suspension, absurd fines, etc. Next week's game will be a legit challenge, since the Raiders are all of a sudden a solid squad. How we bounce back from this performance will show us a lot about what this team is made of.


The voice of reason. Thank you, compadre.

Absolutely. Next week will tell us a lot about how the remainder of this season will go.

CanadianSteel
11-15-2010, 03:42 PM
0 sacks


no pressure and ours CBs get owned, I was wrong on B Mac. Really thought he was the answer to Gays bad play last year. Now we have B Mac and Gay to worry about.


If we have no CBs on the roster better then Gay we are in trouble, and i don't mean just this year.......

RuthlessBurgher
11-15-2010, 03:57 PM
0 sacks


no pressure and ours CBs get owned, I was wrong on B Mac. Really thought he was the answer to Gays bad play last year. Now we have B Mac and Gay to worry about.


If we have no CBs on the roster better then Gay we are in trouble, and i don't mean just this year.......

When I saw that both Keenan Lewis and Crezdon Butler were active this game, I thought we might finally start seeing something from the younger, more physically talented players than what we have (not) gotten so far out of the vets that we know. Did Lewis or Butler see the field for anything other than special teams, though?

buckeyehoppy
11-15-2010, 04:11 PM
I'm not pushing any panic buttons yet. It was an awful showing against a good team. That happens. Last year, the circling of the drain involved losing inexplicably to the dregs of the league. So far, we have only lost to teams that are quite good (7-2 New England, 6-3 New Orleans, and 6-3 Baltimore). So far, we have beaten the teams that we should beat (3-6 Cleveland, 2-7 Cincinnati) and also beaten several teams with respectable records at this point as well (7-2 Atlanta, 6-3 Tampa Bay, 5-4 Tennessee, 5-4 Miami). If we lose to, say, Buffalo in a couple of weeks, then I'd start being majorly concerned about history possibly repeating itself. But right now we still have twice as many wins than losses in spite of all the injuries, suspension, absurd fines, etc. Next week's game will be a legit challenge, since the Raiders are all of a sudden a solid squad. How we bounce back from this performance will show us a lot about what this team is made of.


The voice of reason. Thank you, compadre.

Very true!

No panic buttons yet, considering the teams we've lost to are likely to appear in the playoffs and we have chalked up wins against quality opposition, some of which were on the road.

OTOH, there are a lot of teams who are bunched in the 6-3/5-4 range. The Steelers really need to get a sense of urgency about where they are headed, or else we could be on the outside looking in again.

I don't necessarily buy the specter of injuries being that much of a factor outside of Smitty. Every team is banged up and will remain so through the rest of the season. But the hallmark of champions is how well they adjust to key players missing. This is where we see new stars emerge.

Championship is an attitude, not a performance. We WILL see how these guys are equipped starting with the Oakland game. FWIW, we have mailed in the last two games and it is NOT acceptable. The Oakland game should be a sore spot to these guys and they need to want to deliver a blow that gets felt. And it won't be cool to simply get by with just enough effort to get the W.

AngryAsian
11-15-2010, 04:37 PM
I'm not pushing any panic buttons yet. It was an awful showing against a good team. That happens. Last year, the circling of the drain involved losing inexplicably to the dregs of the league. So far, we have only lost to teams that are quite good (7-2 New England, 6-3 New Orleans, and 6-3 Baltimore). So far, we have beaten the teams that we should beat (3-6 Cleveland, 2-7 Cincinnati) and also beaten several teams with respectable records at this point as well (7-2 Atlanta, 6-3 Tampa Bay, 5-4 Tennessee, 5-4 Miami). If we lose to, say, Buffalo in a couple of weeks, then I'd start being majorly concerned about history possibly repeating itself. But right now we still have twice as many wins than losses in spite of all the injuries, suspension, absurd fines, etc. Next week's game will be a legit challenge, since the Raiders are all of a sudden a solid squad. How we bounce back from this performance will show us a lot about what this team is made of.


The voice of reason. Thank you, compadre.

Very true!

No panic buttons yet, considering the teams we've lost to are likely to appear in the playoffs and we have chalked up wins against quality opposition, some of which were on the road.

OTOH, there are a lot of teams who are bunched in the 6-3/5-4 range. The Steelers really need to get a sense of urgency about where they are headed, or else we could be on the outside looking in again.

I don't necessarily buy the specter of injuries being that much of a factor outside of Smitty. Every team is banged up and will remain so through the rest of the season. But the hallmark of champions is how well they adjust to key players missing. This is where we see new stars emerge.

Championship is an attitude, not a performance. We WILL see how these guys are equipped starting with the Oakland game. FWIW, we have mailed in the last two games and it is NOT acceptable. The Oakland game should be a sore spot to these guys and they need to want to deliver a blow that gets felt. And it won't be cool to simply get by with just enough effort to get the W.

Agreed. In '05 and '08 the sense of urgency was evident in each of the games down the stretch because our team seemed to get stronger and stronger. The hunger for yet another championship was not only palpable but infectious... one splash play on defense ignited a subsequent offensive series. And regardless of poor play and injury, there seemed to be some compensatory reaction from the others... but the injuries that have mounted thus far in the season have never impacted us so greatly, but OTOH you see teams like Indy and GB having their respective line-ups decimated still find a way to stay in games and eke out wins.... Not get blown out at home.

SteelStallion
11-16-2010, 03:13 PM
0 sacks


no pressure and ours CBs get owned, I was wrong on B Mac. Really thought he was the answer to Gays bad play last year. Now we have B Mac and Gay to worry about.


If we have no CBs on the roster better then Gay we are in trouble, and i don't mean just this year.......

When I saw that both Keenan Lewis and Crezdon Butler were active this game, I thought we might finally start seeing something from the younger, more physically talented players than what we have (not) gotten so far out of the vets that we know. Did Lewis or Butler see the field for anything other than special teams, though?

What you just said is why I'm gonna got out on a limb and say that yes we're circling the drain and headed for a second half meltdown. Yes, because 1.) the team has too many old players and 2.) THEY DON'T LET THEIR YOUNG PLAYERS PLAY! This is one of their worst secondaries ever-other than Troy. Lewis and Butler have the intangibles but they're not allowed to play. Why? They dont spend a high draft pick on a db in a draft known for depth at db, instead having strong feelings for two lbs- so strong they let one of them get stolen off the practice squad, the other, not allowed to play, not even to givesomeone a break and gain some experience. Why? Timmons goes down , they go with Foote who, like Farrior,can't cover. Sylvester-nothing but accolades, not allowed to play. Why? Antonio Brown, kickoff for TD, never see him again, they like "El." Remember when they wanted Pouncy to play guard first (as if we had a center)?

I know, I know, they're the experts who see all and I'm just a dumb lay-z-boy chair stiff, but something's wrong here. New England has something like 5 rookie starters, and otherwise young players all over the field that you never heard of, and they kick as s. And our guys "aren't ready" or whatever. But yes, I think a number of teams will beat us throwing. I hope not. We'll see.

Oviedo
11-16-2010, 03:25 PM
0 sacks


no pressure and ours CBs get owned, I was wrong on B Mac. Really thought he was the answer to Gays bad play last year. Now we have B Mac and Gay to worry about.


If we have no CBs on the roster better then Gay we are in trouble, and i don't mean just this year.......

When I saw that both Keenan Lewis and Crezdon Butler were active this game, I thought we might finally start seeing something from the younger, more physically talented players than what we have (not) gotten so far out of the vets that we know. Did Lewis or Butler see the field for anything other than special teams, though?

What you just said is why I'm gonna got out on a limb and say that yes we're circling the drain and headed for a second half meltdown. Yes, because 1.) the team has too many old players and 2.) THEY DON'T LET THEIR YOUNG PLAYERS PLAY! This is one of their worst secondaries ever-other than Troy. Lewis and Butler have the intangibles but they're not allowed to play. Why? They dont spend a high draft pick on a db in a draft known for depth at db, instead having strong feelings for two lbs- so strong they let one of them get stolen off the practice squad, the other, not allowed to play, not even to givesomeone a break and gain some experience. Why? Timmons goes down , they go with Foote who, like Farrior,can't cover. Sylvester-nothing but accolades, not allowed to play. Why? Antonio Brown, kickoff for TD, never see him again, they like "El." Remember when they wanted Pouncy to play guard first (as if we had a center)?

I know, I know, they're the experts who see all and I'm just a dumb lay-z-boy chair stiff, but something's wrong here. New England has something like 5 rookie starters, and otherwise young players all over the field that you never heard of, and they kick as s. And our guys "aren't ready" or whatever. But yes, I think a number of teams will beat us throwing. I hope not. We'll see.


You need to qualify the following


2.) THEY DON'T LET THEIR YOUNG PLAYERS PLAY!

I think Arians does a good job getting a few young players on the field for regular downs every year. This year it is Pouncey and Sanders. Last year it was Johnson, Wallace and Foster.

It never seems to happen on defense. Big problem.

LouSteel
11-16-2010, 07:28 PM
I think Arians does a good job getting a few young players on the field for regular downs every year. This year it is Pouncey and Sanders. Last year it was Johnson, Wallace and Foster.

It never seems to happen on defense. Big problem.

I tend to agree: this year, I don't see many openings on the O for players that aren't already there.

Who do you move on the OL? Do you really risk doing that to an already shaky line?
We mix Redman in RB, but I'd like to see a bit more from him, especially since Moore does very little.
We're moving Sanders in, and I wouldn't mind seeing him take over for ARE 100% of the time.
Who goes out to let someone else in?

AND for the D... yeah, apparently we can't teach any of our young corners how to properly give up 10 yard cushions :roll:

papillon
11-16-2010, 07:44 PM
... of the circling of the drain like last year? Their pass D seems as bad as last year even with Troy. Farrior and Foote aren't reliable when called upon. And their " number one against the run" thing seems deceiving since one clearly doesn't have to run to beat Pittsburgh. This, and the O isn't as good. So is this the start of another losing streak? Have they been exposed again or do they rebound? Thoughts?

Maybe the Steelers are finding out that Aaron Smith is much more important than they want to believe, since, he's really the only defensive started not playing the past few games and the defense has gotten torched.

Pappy

I don't buy it. Smith's not responsible for rushing the passer or pass coverage. He was great at helping the defense stop the run. He was never a great pass rusher.

This defense loss to the Pats because they could not get consistent pressure on Brady. Brady had a lot to do with that by making the right decisions, quick decisions, and he threw the ball accurately. Appeared the defense tried to mix things up. Brady was on his game. Gotta give him credit. He's one of the few QB's that makes every one around him better.

Smith doesn't get sacks, but he pushes the pocket and requires two people to block him (usually) allowing other players to make a play. Hood and Eason were blocked by one guy all night and the front three got very little push to cause Brady any type of discomfort.

The patriots got enough out of their running game to make the play action passes hold LBs and safeties. Smith means more than you thinkl, IMO.

Pappy

LouSteel
11-16-2010, 07:56 PM
Smith doesn't get sacks, but he pushes the pocket and requires two people to block him (usually) allowing other players to make a play. Hood and Eason were blocked by one guy all night and the front three got very little push to cause Brady any type of discomfort.

:Agree :Agree

Without the DL eating up blockers, the 3-4 doesn't work.

Hood & Eason couldn't eat up blockers.

That, plus dropping just about everyone else back into coverage, means Brady has enough time to balance his checkbook while in the pocket.

A healthy Aaron Smith occupies more OL attention, giving the D scheme we ran a marginally higher chance of getting to Marsha.

Va Steelr
11-16-2010, 08:13 PM
I agree,don't panic.I had three MAJOR concerns watching the game.

1. No offensive rational gameplan.

2. No adjustments on either side of the ball.

3. Looking flat for big game,hell any game that is unacceptable.

That being said this is still a quality team,Let's see how badly they want #7.

SteelStallion
11-16-2010, 08:24 PM
0 sacks


no pressure and ours CBs get owned, I was wrong on B Mac. Really thought he was the answer to Gays bad play last year. Now we have B Mac and Gay to worry about.


If we have no CBs on the roster better then Gay we are in trouble, and i don't mean just this year.......

When I saw that both Keenan Lewis and Crezdon Butler were active this game, I thought we might finally start seeing something from the younger, more physically talented players than what we have (not) gotten so far out of the vets that we know. Did Lewis or Butler see the field for anything other than special teams, though?

What you just said is why I'm gonna got out on a limb and say that yes we're circling the drain and headed for a second half meltdown. Yes, because 1.) the team has too many old players and 2.) THEY DON'T LET THEIR YOUNG PLAYERS PLAY! This is one of their worst secondaries ever-other than Troy. Lewis and Butler have the intangibles but they're not allowed to play. Why? They dont spend a high draft pick on a db in a draft known for depth at db, instead having strong feelings for two lbs- so strong they let one of them get stolen off the practice squad, the other, not allowed to play, not even to givesomeone a break and gain some experience. Why? Timmons goes down , they go with Foote who, like Farrior,can't cover. Sylvester-nothing but accolades, not allowed to play. Why? Antonio Brown, kickoff for TD, never see him again, they like "El." Remember when they wanted Pouncy to play guard first (as if we had a center)?

I know, I know, they're the experts who see all and I'm just a dumb lay-z-boy chair stiff, but something's wrong here. New England has something like 5 rookie starters, and otherwise young players all over the field that you never heard of, and they kick as s. And our guys "aren't ready" or whatever. But yes, I think a number of teams will beat us throwing. I hope not. We'll see.


You need to qualify the following


2.) THEY DON'T LET THEIR YOUNG PLAYERS PLAY!

I think Arians does a good job getting a few young players on the field for regular downs every year. This year it is Pouncey and Sanders. Last year it was Johnson, Wallace and Foster.

It never seems to happen on defense. Big problem.

Good point. I qualify by saying that the culture seems to be one of extreme reluctance to let a rookie or even nonrookie young player compete. They'll do it out of necessity but that's all. They let Mendy play-big deal- Bettis had been retired for a number of years and there was no other big back on the team. The spot was open so I don't consider that to be any bold move. They let Wallace and Sanders play-again, who else would have? The openings were there.They let Pouncy play -big deal, we didn't have a competent center on the team, and they were still reluctant and almost f'ed that up with the "right guard first," "he can't handle the signals" thing. But what they never do is let a rook compete with a veteran, especially a declining one under contract. Is Brown competing with El?- no way, it's a joke. Why is Ziggy playing? Injury and therefore necessity. Is Woirlds gaining any substantive experience? No. Are they pretending that Farrior and Foote can still play? Yes. Are they giving any young players a chance at those spots? No. If they had protected Gibson and waived outright any of the following: McFadden, Gay, I'll even throw in Clark- is there any chance whatsoever of losing them? IMO, no. Steeler starters who can't cover. So I think there's something wrong with this picture. And I think they do it on both sides of the ball, it's just coincidence they have more aging vets under contract on the D side. And I think they lose some big games down the stretch.

NW Steeler
11-16-2010, 09:00 PM
I agree,don't panic.I had three MAJOR concerns watching the game.

1. No offensive rational gameplan.

2. No adjustments on either side of the ball.

3. Looking flat for big game,hell any game that is unacceptable.

That being said this is still a quality team,Let's see how badly they want #7.

I'm not throwing in the towel yet, but I am starting to feel like the amount of injuries that we have will be too much to overcome. I hope I am wrong.