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hawaiiansteel
09-01-2010, 05:49 PM
just heard Sal Paolantonio on ESPN say Ben Roethlisberger's reps plan to ask for a 3-game reduction in his NFL suspension.

if Goodell has any sense of justice that's exactly what he should do...

feltdizz
09-01-2010, 05:51 PM
just heard Sal Paolantonio on ESPN say Ben Roethlisberger's reps plan to ask for a 3-game reduction in his NFL suspension.

if Goodell has any sense of justice that's exactly what he should do...

What's the worst that could happen?

cruzer8
09-01-2010, 06:21 PM
I just saw CBSSportsNFL tweet that and was coming here to post it.

Hey, you don't get what you don't ask for. I think he should ask for it to be 2 and hope that it's 3 since he should have been given 0 to begin with.

hawaiiansteel
09-01-2010, 06:22 PM
Updated: September 1, 2010

Sources: Steelers QB wants shorter ban

By Sal Paolantonio
ESPN


In Friday's meeting with NFL commissioner Roger Goodell, Ben Roethlisberger's representatives plan to ask the commissioner to reduce the six-game suspension by at least three games, bringing along team president Arthur J. Rooney II to the New York meeting to support the quarterback's case, sources with knowledge of upcoming proceedings told ESPN's Sal Paolantonio.

Roethlisberger was suspended in April for six games for violating the NFL's personal conduct policy a week after prosecutors decided not charge him in a case involving a 20-year-old college student who accused him of sexually assaulting her in a Georgia nightclub in March.

At the time, Goodell pledged to consider reducing the length of the suspension if Roethlisberger complied with a number of league imposed conditions, including a comprehensive behavioral evaluation, and stayed clear of any other off field problems.

Most observers believe Goodell has had in his mind all along to reduce the suspension by two games to four. But Roethlisberger's attorney, David Cornwell, is expected to ask for a greater reduction in the suspension, according to those with knowledge of discussions between the commissioners office and the quarterback's representatives.

Some in the Roethlisberger camp have argued since Roethlisberger is the first player suspended by Goodell under the personal conduct policy who has not been arrested, charged with or convicted of a crime, he should not be suspended more than two games. His camp has always considered the six game suspension too harsh. But few believe Goodell will go that far, and some in the Roethlisberger camp do not want to anger the commissioner by asking for too much.

Goodell wrote to Roethlisberger in April: "The Personal Conduct Policy makes clear that I may impose discipline 'even where the conduct does not result in conviction of a crime' as, for example, where the conduct 'imposes inherent danger to the safety and well being of another person' ....or conduct that 'undermines or puts at risk the integrity and reputation of the NFL.' "

At the time of the suspension, Rooney released a statement agreeing with and supporting the Goodell's ruling. It's not known what role Rooney will play during Friday's meeting between the commissioner and Roethlisberger.

If the suspension is reduced to four games, as expected, Roethlisberger would presumably spend the Steelers bye in Week 5 getting ready to start at home against the Cleveland Browns in Week 6 -- giving him two weeks of preparation for his first game back.

Sal Paolantonio is an NFL reporter for ESPN.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/stor ... LHeadlines (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5520964&campaign=rss&source=NFLHeadlines)

siss
09-01-2010, 06:34 PM
I like the fact that Rooney is supporting Ben.

NJ-STEELER
09-01-2010, 06:46 PM
espn anchor said "rumors are his reps will ask for AT LEAST a 3 game reduction"



make this right, rog

steelblood
09-01-2010, 07:59 PM
I like the fact that Rooney is supporting Ben.

Where did you get that?

SteelerNation1
09-01-2010, 08:31 PM
I like the fact that Rooney is supporting Ben.

Where did you get that?

Doubt Rooney II would stand by his side just for the heck of it.

In Friday's meeting with NFL commissioner Roger Goodell, Ben Roethlisberger's representatives plan to ask the commissioner to reduce the six-game suspension by at least three games, bringing along team president Arthur J. Rooney II to the New York meeting to support the quarterback's case, sources with knowledge of upcoming proceedings told ESPN's Sal Paolantonio.

drprwnap
09-01-2010, 08:52 PM
I like the fact that Rooney is supporting Ben.

Where did you get that?

Doubt Rooney II would stand by his side just for the heck of it.

In Friday's meeting with NFL commissioner Roger Goodell, Ben Roethlisberger's representatives plan to ask the commissioner to reduce the six-game suspension by at least three games, bringing along team president Arthur J. Rooney II to the New York meeting to support the quarterback's case, sources with knowledge of upcoming proceedings told ESPN's Sal Paolantonio.


This was also reported on KDKA news tonight.

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
09-01-2010, 09:06 PM
I like his chances.....

I have always been of the mind that the penalty was so harsh because it was backed by Rooney with the commish.

If he is in fact joining Ben in asking for a greater reduction then I think that it has a good chance of working.

Captain Lemming
09-01-2010, 09:09 PM
I like the fact that Rooney is supporting Ben.

Where did you get that?

Doubt Rooney II would stand by his side just for the heck of it.

In Friday's meeting with NFL commissioner Roger Goodell, Ben Roethlisberger's representatives plan to ask the commissioner to reduce the six-game suspension by at least three games, bringing along team president Arthur J. Rooney II to the New York meeting to support the quarterback's case, sources with knowledge of upcoming proceedings told ESPN's Sal Paolantonio.


This was also reported on KDKA news tonight.

I think Ben may make a persuasive case having proven a change to Rooney. I think if Rooney expresses strong support, the commish will take the request seriously.

Captain Lemming
09-01-2010, 09:10 PM
I like his chances.....

I have always been of the mind that the penalty was so harsh because it was backed by Rooney with the commish.

If he is in fact joining Ben in asking for a greater reduction then I think that it has a good chance of working.

Exactly.

stlrz d
09-01-2010, 09:58 PM
Ravens fans are gonna scream conspiracy if Ben only does 3 games.

They claim they wanna beat us with Ben, but if Ben plays they'll be crying big, purple tears. :lol:

SteelAbility
09-01-2010, 10:14 PM
This is the other side of the "Godell" coin. He reserves the right to arbitrary reduction. Ben has gone above and beyond according to all reports. Truthfully, there is merit to additional reduction (we get more games with Ben) as well as reduction to four (in theory, the lesson "sets" with Ben).

papillon
09-01-2010, 10:14 PM
espn anchor said "rumors are his reps will ask for AT LEAST a 3 game reduction"



make this right, rog

To make it right he'd have to reduce it to zero games.

Pappy

Herewegosteelers!
09-01-2010, 10:29 PM
espn anchor said "rumors are his reps will ask for AT LEAST a 3 game reduction"



make this right, rog

To make it right he'd have to reduce it to zero games.

Pappy

Very true indeed!

Steelhere10
09-01-2010, 10:48 PM
I think 3 games will be the penalty anyways, and my theory is that the biggest rivalry in the NFL today is the Ravens vs Steelers and i guarantee that it will be NATIONALLY TELEVISED . Couple that with no one wants to see Byron vs the Ravens , but the whole world will tune in to watch Ben first game back vs the Ravens.... my 2 cents.

Shawn
09-02-2010, 12:30 AM
I know I am in the great minority but I do believe Ben's actions warrant a 2 game suspension. But, I also believe Ben had sex in a public restroom with a girl too intoxicated to give consent. I believe Goodell knows closer to the full story than the rest of us. With that said, the rest of these guys deserve suspensions as well. All these guys should have been hit with a suspension. The only guys I wouldn't have suspended would have been Vick and Bensen.

AkronSteel
09-02-2010, 01:17 AM
I think it will end up bein a 2-3 game suspension and I'm leaning towards 2! I just have a feeling after Benson, Rogers, Young or anyone else weren't even suspended and with the way that Goodell stated Ben has gone above and beyond, I just have a feeling that we will be seeing Big Ben playing in Tampa!!! Either way, I'll take it!!

Crash
09-02-2010, 01:24 AM
But, I also believe Ben had sex in a public restroom with a girl too intoxicated to give consent.

The evidence doesn't support that theory "Doctor".

Ben denied it. She went to the hospital that night and they couldn't determine that they had sex. In your medical opinion, what would that mean?

Crash
09-02-2010, 01:25 AM
You wouldn't suspend Vick who was told to behave?

You wouldn't suspend Benson who has three arrests?

:Blah

hawaiiansteel
09-02-2010, 03:34 AM
I The only guys I wouldn't have suspended would have been Vick and Bensen.


Shawn, i gotta disagree with you on this one.

Michael Vick did some seriously disgusting things. if Ben is given a 4-game suspension for what he did, Vick deserves more games for what he did to those poor dogs...

Shawn
09-02-2010, 04:09 AM
But, I also believe Ben had sex in a public restroom with a girl too intoxicated to give consent.

The evidence doesn't support that theory "Doctor".

Ben denied it. She went to the hospital that night and they couldn't determine that they had sex. In your medical opinion, what would that mean?

I like how you put doctor in quotes. That does put some funny effect to the sarcasm. :lol: I have already gone over what was seen during exam and would rather not get into that again. But, the exam was supportive of very recent sexual activity and I explained why the physician was vague. Not really the point because I'm not trying to convince you. I believe what I believe you believe what you believe.

But, I do have a question for you. If Ben did have sex with a girl too drunk to give consent in a public restroom do you believe he deserves a suspension?

Shawn
09-02-2010, 04:10 AM
I The only guys I wouldn't have suspended would have been Vick and Bensen.


Shawn, i gotta disagree with you on this one.

Michael Vick did some seriously disgusting things. if Ben is given a 4-game suspension for what he did, Vick deserves more games for what he did to those poor dogs...

Nah...I agree with that. It was a horrible crime. I should have expounded. I meant the whole recent party incident.

Shawn
09-02-2010, 04:14 AM
You wouldn't suspend Vick who was told to behave?

You wouldn't suspend Benson who has three arrests?

:Blah

1) Nope out of his control
2) Nope...I read what happened. Black man at the wrong bar being harassed by idiots.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
09-02-2010, 05:53 AM
Does anyone think that it would be better for Ben to come back AFTER week 4, so he has a bye week to get the rust off?

papillon
09-02-2010, 06:26 AM
Does anyone think that it would be better for Ben to come back AFTER week 4, so he has a bye week to get the rust off?

Not me, the Steelers are better football team with Ben on the field, rust or no rust. IMHO

Pappy

stlrz d
09-02-2010, 07:06 AM
Does anyone think that it would be better for Ben to come back AFTER week 4, so he has a bye week to get the rust off?

Not me, the Steelers are better football team with Ben on the field, rust or no rust. IMHO

Pappy

Cosigned.

As for the other points brought up, isn't it odd how there are only TWO people saying Ben was in that bathroom? The accuser and the friend who supposedly went to get her? Not one other person in all of this says Ben was in that bathroom. Not one! You would think with all the stories that are floating around out there (i.e. Ben was drinking heavily, Ben was only nursing a beer, etc) that at least ONE other person would be saying that Ben was in that bathroom with her. But no one is doing that. No one.

Cedric Benson was being harassed. Fine. If he fought to protect himself that's fine too. He still should have been suspended for PUNCHING A BAR EMPLOYEE who was only escorting him out to put a stop to the trouble, and for SPITTING BLOOD IN THE FACE OF THAT EMPLOYEE.

Vick. Was told not to be around alcohol and certain people. He did both. And isn't it odd how the guy was shot shortly after Vick left? I mean only the mob does that, right? Vick would never give someone an order to do something to the dude, but wait until after I am gone, right? Nah...no chance.

I don't know if that's what happened with Vick, but if Ben is going to be suspended based on allegations drawn from hearsay then the same thing could be said for Vick.

Captain Lemming
09-02-2010, 07:22 AM
But, I also believe Ben had sex in a public restroom with a girl too intoxicated to give consent.

The evidence doesn't support that theory "Doctor".

Ben denied it. She went to the hospital that night and they couldn't determine that they had sex. In your medical opinion, what would that mean?

I like how you put doctor in quotes. That does put some funny effect to the sarcasm. :lol: I have already gone over what was seen during exam and would rather not get into that again. But, the exam was supportive of very recent sexual activity and I explained why the physician was vague. Not really the point because I'm not trying to convince you. I believe what I believe you believe what you believe.

But, I do have a question for you. If Ben did have sex with a girl too drunk to give consent in a public restroom do you believe he deserves a suspension?

Actually, while Crash keeps saying Ben did not have sex, his own "most likely scenario" states that Ben did in fact have sex, just not the kind that can produce children, the kind that got Bill Clinton in trouble. :wink:

Ben denies "sexual intercourse" very specifically for a reason.

Crash need not agree with you on whether proof exists of v sex happened.

Even if Crash is 100 percent correct your point Shawn of "too drunk for consent" is a big problem for Ben.

It explains why Ben cannot talk.

Captain Lemming
09-02-2010, 07:48 AM
As for the other points brought up, isn't it odd how there are only TWO people saying Ben was in that bathroom? The accuser and the friend who supposedly went to get her? Not one other person in all of this says Ben was in that bathroom. Not one! You would think with all the stories that are floating around out there (i.e. Ben was drinking heavily, Ben was only nursing a beer, etc) that at least ONE other person would be saying that Ben was in that bathroom with her. But no one is doing that. No one.

No one says Ben was NOT in the bathroom either. He has bodyguards, paid to watch him. Girl asks to go to the restroom and a bodyguard took the girl to a stool where she sat "waiting".

Bodyguards say they did not "see" Ben do anything, yet cannot say "I was with Ben and he never went into the bathroom". A room full of Ben's people and NOBODY says this.

I dont know what happened in the bathroom, but if he was never in there NONE OF THIS STUFF HAPPENS BECAUSE A ROOM FULL OF PEOPLE COULD TESTIFY HE WASNT IN THERE.

NOBODY DID. INCLUDING BEN HIMSELF.

Shawn
09-02-2010, 07:58 AM
But, I also believe Ben had sex in a public restroom with a girl too intoxicated to give consent.

The evidence doesn't support that theory "Doctor".

Ben denied it. She went to the hospital that night and they couldn't determine that they had sex. In your medical opinion, what would that mean?

I like how you put doctor in quotes. That does put some funny effect to the sarcasm. :lol: I have already gone over what was seen during exam and would rather not get into that again. But, the exam was supportive of very recent sexual activity and I explained why the physician was vague. Not really the point because I'm not trying to convince you. I believe what I believe you believe what you believe.

But, I do have a question for you. If Ben did have sex with a girl too drunk to give consent in a public restroom do you believe he deserves a suspension?

Actually, while Crash keeps saying Ben did not have sex, his own "most likely scenario" states that Ben did in fact have sex, just not the kind that can produce children, the kind that got Bill Clinton in trouble. :wink:

Ben denies "sexual intercourse" very specifically for a reason.

Crash need not agree with you on whether proof exists of v sex happened.

Even if Crash is 100 percent correct your point Shawn of "too drunk for consent" is a big problem for Ben.

It explains why Ben cannot talk.

The way I see it? Ben got off very very lucky. Do I believe he raped this girl in the traditional sense? No. But, I do believe he had sex with someone stumbling drunk and unable to give consent. That is criminal.

stlrz d
09-02-2010, 08:34 AM
We've already been down the legal reasons road, Cap'n so there's no use rehashing that.

And all Ben ever said about that girl is that they "messed around a bit and when he realized she was as drunk as she was he stopped".

Slapstick
09-02-2010, 08:54 AM
I dont know what happened in the bathroom, but if he was never in there NONE OF THIS STUFF HAPPENS BECAUSE A ROOM FULL OF PEOPLE COULD TESTIFY HE WASNT IN THERE.

NOBODY DID. INCLUDING BEN HIMSELF.

Well, unfortunately nobody will ever have the chance to testify...because there was no actual evidence, Ben will never get a day in court and hence will continue to be judged in the court of public opinion forever...

Personally, I don't care if he ever talks about it...he has already been suspended by the NFL without having been convicted or even charged with a crime...what does he have to gain by talking about it? Will Goodell retroactively lift his suspension? No, the PR hit to the NFL was too severe...will he ever convince all fans of his innocence? No, that won't happen either...

All talking about it will do is reopen the media feeding frenzy and subject him to being dragged through the mud all over again...

I'm not saying that Roethelisberger didn't do anything...but, I am saying that, to our knowledge, he didn't do anything criminal...

I'm also saying that continuing to talk about it will not help him in any way shape or form...the best thing he can do is simply accept that he is in the public eye and therefore not permitted to behave the same way as many other 26 year old men...he should just avoid such situations altogether...

Captain Lemming
09-02-2010, 09:17 AM
We've already been down the legal reasons road, Cap'n so there's no use rehashing that.

And all Ben ever said about that girl is that they "messed around a bit and when he realized she was as drunk as she was he stopped".

I may have missed it but what are the legal reasons that nobody in his party can say, "The chick is lying because I was with Ben and I can say Ben never went into the bathroom?"

Nobody "defends" Ben with definitive statements that contradict the girls claims that Ben was with her in the bathroom. They just plead ignorance of what happened.

All we get from anybody is:

http://thepighasacurlytail.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.jpg?w=447&h=354

frankthetank1
09-02-2010, 09:20 AM
But, I also believe Ben had sex in a public restroom with a girl too intoxicated to give consent.

The evidence doesn't support that theory "Doctor".

Ben denied it. She went to the hospital that night and they couldn't determine that they had sex. In your medical opinion, what would that mean?

I like how you put doctor in quotes. That does put some funny effect to the sarcasm. :lol: I have already gone over what was seen during exam and would rather not get into that again. But, the exam was supportive of very recent sexual activity and I explained why the physician was vague. Not really the point because I'm not trying to convince you. I believe what I believe you believe what you believe.

But, I do have a question for you. If Ben did have sex with a girl too drunk to give consent in a public restroom do you believe he deserves a suspension?

Actually, while Crash keeps saying Ben did not have sex, his own "most likely scenario" states that Ben did in fact have sex, just not the kind that can produce children, the kind that got Bill Clinton in trouble. :wink:

Ben denies "sexual intercourse" very specifically for a reason.

Crash need not agree with you on whether proof exists of v sex happened.

Even if Crash is 100 percent correct your point Shawn of "too drunk for consent" is a big problem for Ben.

It explains why Ben cannot talk.

The way I see it? Ben got off very very lucky. Do I believe he raped this girl in the traditional sense? No. But, I do believe he had sex with someone stumbling drunk and unable to give consent. That is criminal.

it is?? so if a man and a woman are at a bar getting wasted then later have sex its a crime? that doesnt make sense. if you really think it went down like that than that is rape in my book. what is rape in the traditional sense anyways? no one knows what went down EXACTLY so why speculate?

Captain Lemming
09-02-2010, 09:29 AM
I dont know what happened in the bathroom, but if he was never in there NONE OF THIS STUFF HAPPENS BECAUSE A ROOM FULL OF PEOPLE COULD TESTIFY HE WASNT IN THERE.

NOBODY DID. INCLUDING BEN HIMSELF.

Well, unfortunately nobody will ever have the chance to testify...because there was no actual evidence, Ben will never get a day in court and hence will continue to be judged in the court of public opinion forever...

Personally, I don't care if he ever talks about it...he has already been suspended by the NFL without having been convicted or even charged with a crime...what does he have to gain by talking about it? Will Goodell retroactively lift his suspension? No, the PR hit to the NFL was too severe...will he ever convince all fans of his innocence? No, that won't happen either...

All talking about it will do is reopen the media feeding frenzy and subject him to being dragged through the mud all over again...

I'm not saying that Roethelisberger didn't do anything...but, I am saying that, to our knowledge, he didn't do anything criminal...

I'm also saying that continuing to talk about it will not help him in any way shape or form...the best thing he can do is simply accept that he is in the public eye and therefore not permitted to behave the same way as many other 26 year old men...he should just avoid such situations altogether...

My point is not that it should be reopened. I agree with your statement, "I'm not saying that Roethelisberger didn't do anything...but, I am saying that, to our knowledge, he didn't do anything criminal....".

My point is in response to the contention he was not in the restroom at all.

If that was the case, this would be obvious by the comments of his friends who were interviewed and could have cleared Ben. This whole issue including the suspension never happens.

steelcurtain44
09-02-2010, 09:54 AM
Not sure why this is all being rehashed again, but something happened that night. The problem is that no one knows what it was. No Ben didn't get charged, but after hearing the DA talk about it, he sure wanted to charge him with something. All of it is heresay, so there really isn't a need to keep talking about it.

We as Steelers fan should actually be happy about this, because it has slowed Ben down. What do you all think would have happened if this didn't go down like it did? Ben would have been still running around like he was a king, and who knows, might have gotten himself in something he couldn't talk his way out of. As it is, we as Steelers fans don't have to worry about him doing something else stupid, because he's trying to walk the straight and narrow, after this humiliation and embarrassment.

flippy
09-02-2010, 09:58 AM
Why not ask for 0 games but to still be fined for 4-6 games.

Captain Lemming
09-02-2010, 10:02 AM
Why not ask for 0 games but to still be fined for 4-6 games.

No more "flippy juice" for you. :lol:

Shawn
09-02-2010, 10:31 AM
I dont know what happened in the bathroom, but if he was never in there NONE OF THIS STUFF HAPPENS BECAUSE A ROOM FULL OF PEOPLE COULD TESTIFY HE WASNT IN THERE.

NOBODY DID. INCLUDING BEN HIMSELF.

Well, unfortunately nobody will ever have the chance to testify...because there was no actual evidence, Ben will never get a day in court and hence will continue to be judged in the court of public opinion forever...

Personally, I don't care if he ever talks about it...he has already been suspended by the NFL without having been convicted or even charged with a crime...what does he have to gain by talking about it? Will Goodell retroactively lift his suspension? No, the PR hit to the NFL was too severe...will he ever convince all fans of his innocence? No, that won't happen either...

All talking about it will do is reopen the media feeding frenzy and subject him to being dragged through the mud all over again...

I'm not saying that Roethelisberger didn't do anything...but, I am saying that, to our knowledge, he didn't do anything criminal...

I'm also saying that continuing to talk about it will not help him in any way shape or form...the best thing he can do is simply accept that he is in the public eye and therefore not permitted to behave the same way as many other 26 year old men...he should just avoid such situations altogether...


I actually agree with you here. There really isn't a reason to rehash it. With that said, when you have Steeler fans crying foul over the suspension...reminders of why he was suspended will follow. Ben is taking it like a man...the fans need to do so as well.

Shawn
09-02-2010, 10:37 AM
Frank...I didn't make the law. But, if you have sex with someone who can't even walk in a straight line...you can be charged and prosecuted for rape. Yes, it happens every day. Yes people do it all the time without being charged. With that said, lets say you buy shots for a woman at a local bar...put down a bunch together. You leave with her and many witnesses notice you have to help hold her up to get into the taxi. If you go home and have sex with this woman it's rape. If she wakes up the next morning and decides to file charges against you, gets examined, they find your DNA all over her, and they have witnesses to the fact that this woman could barely walk...welp you are hosed. They will prosecute you and you will go to prison. You will also have to notify every neighborhood you ever move into of your presence.

Shawn
09-02-2010, 10:39 AM
Not sure why this is all being rehashed again, but something happened that night. The problem is that no one knows what it was. No Ben didn't get charged, but after hearing the DA talk about it, he sure wanted to charge him with something. All of it is heresay, so there really isn't a need to keep talking about it.

We as Steelers fan should actually be happy about this, because it has slowed Ben down. What do you all think would have happened if this didn't go down like it did? Ben would have been still running around like he was a king, and who knows, might have gotten himself in something he couldn't talk his way out of. As it is, we as Steelers fans don't have to worry about him doing something else stupid, because he's trying to walk the straight and narrow, after this humiliation and embarrassment.

$$$

You get it.

stlrz d
09-02-2010, 10:52 AM
[quote="stlrz d":gghxag69]We've already been down the legal reasons road, Cap'n so there's no use rehashing that.

And all Ben ever said about that girl is that they "messed around a bit and when he realized she was as drunk as she was he stopped".

I may have missed it but what are the legal reasons that nobody in his party can say, "The chick is lying because I was with Ben and I can say Ben never went into the bathroom?"

Nobody "defends" Ben with definitive statements that contradict the girls claims that Ben was with her in the bathroom. They just plead ignorance of what happened.

All we get from anybody is:

http://thepighasacurlytail.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.jpg?w=447&h=354[/quote:gghxag69]

Ben's bodyguards HAVE stated that that they never saw him go into or come out of that bathroom.

The people who "get it" shawn, are the people who realize that Goodell's policy is a joke and that Ben should have never been suspended due to unfounded and unsubstantiated allegations and accusations.

And NO Steelers fan should be happy about this suspension for ANY reason. If you don't know Ben personally then who the eff are you to say he needed "slowing down"?

:roll:

feltdizz
09-02-2010, 10:54 AM
if you don't know Ben who the eff are you to say he shouldn't change at all?

It's a freaking message board.... why do people keep trying to tell people what can and can't be said about a guy none of us know personally?

Eich
09-02-2010, 11:02 AM
Why not ask for 0 games but to still be fined for 4-6 games.

YES ! That's what the punishment SHOULD be. I'm sure Ben would be willing to play the first 4-6 games for free. And that punishes BEN - not the team or the fans.

Slapstick
09-02-2010, 11:16 AM
I may have missed it but what are the legal reasons that nobody in his party can say, "The chick is lying because I was with Ben and I can say Ben never went into the bathroom?"

Nobody "defends" Ben with definitive statements that contradict the girls claims that Ben was with her in the bathroom. They just plead ignorance of what happened.

All we get from anybody is:

http://thepighasacurlytail.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.jpg?w=447&h=354

It has nothing to do with legality and everything to do with self-preservation...an officer of the law was overheard saying that he didn't believe the story and ended up losing his job over it...the off-duty police officers that Ben hired as bodyguards were placed under intense scrutiny...at the end of the day, NO CHARGES WERE EVEN FILED AGAINST ROETHLISBERGER!!!

If someone speaks up not only will it reopen the floodgates of media scrutiny for Ben, it is likely that the person who speaks up will also become a part of the media feeding frenzy...you would find out about parking tickets, late child support payments, their internet habits and any number of other things that have NOTHING TO DO WITH the incident...

If Ben had been charged, then people would have to testify...since there were no charges, everybody should just shut the hell up...no one wants to be the person to say that an alleged victim was lying...especially in a case judged in the court of public opinion...

Crash
09-02-2010, 11:23 AM
Barravecchio's lawyer did tell KDKA that Miss DTF and her friends were lying when they specifically said Ben went down the hall with his pants down and his junk out.

You know what's funny also? All these investigations, by NUMEROUS investigation teams, and yet:

Ben is uncharged.

Joyner is still a state trooper.

Barraveccio (who was accused of "dragging" Miss DTF down the hall) is still a cop.

That says it all right there.

Oviedo
09-02-2010, 11:30 AM
Barravecchio's lawyer did tell KDKA that Miss DTF and her friends were lying when they specifically said Ben went down the hall with his pants down and his junk out.

You know what's funny also? All these investigations, by NUMEROUS investigation teams, and yet:

Ben is uncharged.

Joyner is still a state trooper.

Barraveccio (who was accused of "dragging" Miss DTF down the hall) is still a cop.

That says it all right there.

Does anyone really think that a bunch of sorority girls would actually go back to the sorority house and get their stories straight to divert attention from the fact that they were illegally drinking as underage students? Would classy young southern girls actually be willing to do such a thing?

You bet!!!! That is why the prosecutor did not prosecute because it was obvious that the stories were too similar and rehearsed. A good defense attorney would have blown them out of the water.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
09-02-2010, 11:32 AM
It's hard to read the new posts when this old stuff keeps getting rehashed.

You gents wouldn't want to bring your discussion over to the General Discussion section, would you? :D

Shawn
09-02-2010, 11:33 AM
[quote="Captain Lemming":36jwlp1v][quote="stlrz d":36jwlp1v]We've already been down the legal reasons road, Cap'n so there's no use rehashing that.

And all Ben ever said about that girl is that they "messed around a bit and when he realized she was as drunk as she was he stopped".

I may have missed it but what are the legal reasons that nobody in his party can say, "The chick is lying because I was with Ben and I can say Ben never went into the bathroom?"

Nobody "defends" Ben with definitive statements that contradict the girls claims that Ben was with her in the bathroom. They just plead ignorance of what happened.

All we get from anybody is:

http://thepighasacurlytail.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.jpg?w=447&h=354[/quote:36jwlp1v]

Ben's bodyguards HAVE stated that that they never saw him go into or come out of that bathroom.

The people who "get it" shawn, are the people who realize that Goodell's policy is a joke and that Ben should have never been suspended due to unfounded and unsubstantiated allegations and accusations.

And NO Steelers fan should be happy about this suspension for ANY reason. If you don't know Ben personally then who the eff are you to say he needed "slowing down"?

:roll:[/quote:36jwlp1v]

Please don't address me in your posts. Thanks.

Crash
09-02-2010, 12:00 PM
Ben denies "sexual intercourse" very specifically for a reason.

Because that was the SPECIFIC CRIME that he was accused of.

Unprotected rape sexual intercourse.

That's the accusation boys. That's what they investigated.

And they got NOTHING to support it.

Learn the facts of this case.

grotonsteel
09-02-2010, 12:03 PM
But, I also believe Ben had sex in a public restroom with a girl too intoxicated to give consent.

The evidence doesn't support that theory "Doctor".

Ben denied it. She went to the hospital that night and they couldn't determine that they had sex. In your medical opinion, what would that mean?

I like how you put doctor in quotes. That does put some funny effect to the sarcasm. :lol: I have already gone over what was seen during exam and would rather not get into that again. But, the exam was supportive of very recent sexual activity and I explained why the physician was vague. Not really the point because I'm not trying to convince you. I believe what I believe you believe what you believe.

But, I do have a question for you. If Ben did have sex with a girl too drunk to give consent in a public restroom do you believe he deserves a suspension?

Actually, while Crash keeps saying Ben did not have sex, his own "most likely scenario" states that Ben did in fact have sex, just not the kind that can produce children, the kind that got Bill Clinton in trouble. :wink:

Ben denies "sexual intercourse" very specifically for a reason.

Crash need not agree with you on whether proof exists of v sex happened.

Even if Crash is 100 percent correct your point Shawn of "too drunk for consent" is a big problem for Ben.

It explains why Ben cannot talk.

The way I see it? Ben got off very very lucky. Do I believe he raped this girl in the traditional sense? No. But, I do believe he had sex with someone stumbling drunk and unable to give consent. That is criminal.


Again how did you come to the conclusion that Big ben had sex with her of any kind?? Unless you think pressing boobies or grinding is sex to you... :roll:

Crash
09-02-2010, 12:04 PM
The way I see it? Ben got off very very lucky. Do I believe he raped this girl in the traditional sense? No. But, I do believe he had sex with someone stumbling drunk and unable to give consent. That is criminal.

So where did his DNA go? The accuser didn't take a shower. She went to the hospital. And yet no DNA of Ben's was in the accuser when she was examined.

You are also aware, that Miss DTF and her family stopped talking to police when they wanted DNA samples from inside her mouth, correct?

grotonsteel
09-02-2010, 12:17 PM
I may have missed it but what are the legal reasons that nobody in his party can say, "The chick is lying because I was with Ben and I can say Ben never went into the bathroom?"

Nobody "defends" Ben with definitive statements that contradict the girls claims that Ben was with her in the bathroom. They just plead ignorance of what happened.




:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Man i am disappointed i wrote an Eminem Style diss to you and you did not even read that??? WTF...wasted my time...anyways it was copied rap..


Remove your Ben Hater goggles and read fcuking transcripts or atleast what that DA had to say.

BIG BEN's BODYGAURDS OR CLUB BOUNCER DID NOT SEE BEN GO TO BATHROOM WITH THAT GIRL

Again its your opinion to say Big Ben screwed that girl but don't tell us lies that no one contradicted that girls statement.

grotonsteel
09-02-2010, 12:27 PM
The way I see it? Ben got off very very lucky. Do I believe he raped this girl in the traditional sense? No. But, I do believe he had sex with someone stumbling drunk and unable to give consent. That is criminal.

So where did his DNA go? The accuser didn't take a shower. She went to the hospital. And yet no DNA of Ben's was in the accuser when she was examined.

You are also aware, that Miss DTF and her family stopped talking to police when they wanted DNA samples from inside her mouth, correct?


Problem is Ben Haters have formed opinion based on reading headlines and when provided with facts they choose not to answer or show signs of short term memory loss.

Relentless7
09-02-2010, 12:42 PM
A DA has to take into account the probability of getting a "Guilty beyond a reasonable doubt" verdict for the state before he decides if he should move on with a case or not. In this case he did that, and didn't think he had the "ammo" as it were to make it a "slam dunk" for the state. Especially considering Ben would (and should have) the BEST lawyers money could buy sitting at his table. That's fine. That's the system.

I, on the other hand don't need "irrefutable proof" to form an opinion. And MY OPINION is Ben, AT ABSOLUTE BEST... acted like a complete idiot. At the worst he forced himself on that girl. Either way HE put himself in that position. He wasn't thinking about his teammates, or the fans, (as someone earlier in the thread alluded to that's who the suspension really hurts) he was thinking about himself. Ben embarrassed himself,but more so he embarassed the Steelers, and in a smaller sense the NFL.

If Goodell didn't suspend him, the Steelers would have (and should have). I'm no fan of Goodell, BY ANY STRETCH, but to aim all of your vitriol at him when Rooney II said at the time basically the team was ready to suspend him but was waiting for the league to act. Ben was going to miss these games one way or the other. So everyone in the "Ben can do no wrong" camp would have to been mad at Rooney instead of Goodell, but he was suspended either way.

Lastly, I would be SHOCKED if the suspension was reduced to anything less than 4. Floored actually. While I know the raging sentiment here, and among all Steeler fans for that matter is the suspension WAY too harsh, (I tend to agree, I thought 2 would have been reasonable) the opinion from around the league is Ben actually got off light. If Goodell reduces it below 4 the outcry from the vast majority of NFL fans would be overwhelming and embarrassing to the NFL.

Anyhow, sorry for helping to perpetuate this argument that everyone, myself included, is ready to move on from. But I'm new here and wasn't around to jump into the original debate, so figured this was as good place as any to share my opinions.

ikestops85
09-02-2010, 12:44 PM
The way I see it? Ben got off very very lucky. Do I believe he raped this girl in the traditional sense? No. But, I do believe he had sex with someone stumbling drunk and unable to give consent. That is criminal.

So where did his DNA go? The accuser didn't take a shower. She went to the hospital. And yet no DNA of Ben's was in the accuser when she was examined.

You are also aware, that Miss DTF and her family stopped talking to police when they wanted DNA samples from inside her mouth, correct?

Problem is Ben Haters have formed opinion based on reading headlines and when provided with facts they choose not to answer or show signs of short term memory loss.

I don't think it has anything to do with Ben haters. I think different people have differing opinions on what happened.

For me, as long as Ben did not sexually assault someone, I don't care what he did in that bar in Georgia. It isn't any of my business since I don't personally know him. He could be the nicest guy in the world or the biggest douche bag around. I follow him for football purposes only.

My problem is and always has been with the punishment from Goodell. If the personal conduct clause stated you couldn't go into an 18 and over bar or you would be suspended XX games then fine. If it said if you are even just accused you would be suspended for XX games ... still fine. What is not fine is the vagueness of the clause where it is interpreted by one man who decides what the punishment is based on the reports in the press. Then add into that the only source of appeal you have is to the same guy who laid down the punishment. That's what pisses me off about the whole situation.

grotonsteel
09-02-2010, 12:55 PM
The way I see it? Ben got off very very lucky. Do I believe he raped this girl in the traditional sense? No. But, I do believe he had sex with someone stumbling drunk and unable to give consent. That is criminal.

So where did his DNA go? The accuser didn't take a shower. She went to the hospital. And yet no DNA of Ben's was in the accuser when she was examined.

You are also aware, that Miss DTF and her family stopped talking to police when they wanted DNA samples from inside her mouth, correct?

Problem is Ben Haters have formed opinion based on reading headlines and when provided with facts they choose not to answer or show signs of short term memory loss.

I don't think it has anything to do with Ben haters. I think different people have differing opinions on what happened.

For me, as long as Ben did not sexually assault someone, I don't care what he did in that bar in Georgia. It isn't any of my business since I don't personally know him. He could be the nicest guy in the world or the biggest douche bag around. I follow him for football purposes only.

My problem is and always has been with the punishment from Goodell. If the personal conduct clause stated you couldn't go into an 18 and over bar or you would be suspended XX games then fine. If it said if you are even just accused you would be suspended for XX games ... still fine. What is not fine is the vagueness of the clause where it is interpreted by one man who decides what the punishment is based on the reports in the press. Then add into that the only source of appeal you have is to the same guy who laid down the punishment. That's what pisses me off about the whole situation.

As far as people having opinion about Big Ben its their business. I can't prove them wrong since its their opinion/belief whatever. But if some one is stating wrong facts then it is smack time. :twisted:


Well as long as Big Ben don't break any law i am fine with it. I don't really care what he does off field it none of our business. I appreciate Big Ben for what he did for Steelers and NFL.

As far Goodell goes..well i think he has started to take NFL down starting with the Cheatroits issues and what is troubling me is the support Rooneys are giving to him. Right from that cheating scandal.

Kid
09-02-2010, 01:05 PM
Frank...I didn't make the law. But, if you have sex with someone who can't even walk in a straight line...you can be charged and prosecuted for rape. Yes, it happens every day. Yes people do it all the time without being charged. With that said, lets say you buy shots for a woman at a local bar...put down a bunch together. You leave with her and many witnesses notice you have to help hold her up to get into the taxi. If you go home and have sex with this woman it's rape. If she wakes up the next morning and decides to file charges against you, gets examined, they find your DNA all over her, and they have witnesses to the fact that this woman could barely walk...welp you are hosed. They will prosecute you and you will go to prison. You will also have to notify every neighborhood you ever move into of your presence.


who says that the woman shouldn't/couldn't be the one charged with rape?

flippy
09-02-2010, 02:39 PM
Why not ask for 0 games but to still be fined for 4-6 games.

YES ! That's what the punishment SHOULD be. I'm sure Ben would be willing to play the first 4-6 games for free. And that punishes BEN - not the team or the fans.

No way I think it would happen. And I still think it's not completely fair to Ben. But it would allow the commish to save face in all of this and still punish Ben and not the Steelers.

flippy
09-02-2010, 02:46 PM
Why not ask for 0 games but to still be fined for 4-6 games.

No more "flippy juice" for you. :lol:

You need to start drinking the Maui Wowwee!!!!! :wink

Eich
09-02-2010, 03:05 PM
Why not ask for 0 games but to still be fined for 4-6 games.

YES ! That's what the punishment SHOULD be. I'm sure Ben would be willing to play the first 4-6 games for free. And that punishes BEN - not the team or the fans.

No way I think it would happen. And I still think it's not completely fair to Ben. But it would allow the commish to save face in all of this and still punish Ben and not the Steelers.

I'm sure it won't happen.

I wonder what WOULD happen if Ben came out and publically said that if his suspension was eliminated, he would donate every game check this year to charity?

flippy
09-02-2010, 03:24 PM
Why not ask for 0 games but to still be fined for 4-6 games.

YES ! That's what the punishment SHOULD be. I'm sure Ben would be willing to play the first 4-6 games for free. And that punishes BEN - not the team or the fans.

No way I think it would happen. And I still think it's not completely fair to Ben. But it would allow the commish to save face in all of this and still punish Ben and not the Steelers.

I'm sure it won't happen.

I wonder what WOULD happen if Ben came out and publically said that if his suspension was eliminated, he would donate every game check this year to charity?

That'd change the public perception. But it would probably be better if he just did it, then someone else leaked it later.

hawaiiansteel
09-02-2010, 03:29 PM
You need to start drinking the Maui Wowwee!!!!! :wink


actually, we smoke the Maui Wowie... :Cheers

http://www.gardenscure.com/420/attachments/genetics/118681d1110443956-maui-wowie-dscn0205.jpg

flippy
09-02-2010, 03:37 PM
You need to start drinking the Maui Wowwee!!!!! :wink


actually, we smoke the Maui Wowie... :Cheers

http://www.gardenscure.com/420/attachments/genetics/118681d1110443956-maui-wowie-dscn0205.jpg

You can put it in cakes and cookies or mix it into protein shakes for better health. :wink

fezziwig
09-02-2010, 03:39 PM
Funny how many were upset with Ben and agreed that punishment must be handed down are now changing their tunes after seeing our QB backups and that the season is nearing. I'm guilty too.

grotonsteel
09-02-2010, 04:34 PM
Funny how many were upset with Ben and agreed that punishment must be handed down are now changing their tunes after seeing our QB backups and that the season is nearing. I'm guilty too.

Not me..... 8)

Been a Big Ben supporter day 1

fezziwig
09-02-2010, 04:47 PM
I've never wanted him off the team but, I didn't appreciate Ben making choices that were affecting the team. Ben needed to come back down to earth and as I said before, all that Ben has accomplished, I would have been a loose canon too.
In any event, Ben got worked over too much about all that has happened and Goodell is too abusive with his power and not fair with his authority. Bens punishment was over the top in my opinion.

flippy
09-02-2010, 05:13 PM
Funny how many were upset with Ben and agreed that punishment must be handed down are now changing their tunes after seeing our QB backups and that the season is nearing. I'm guilty too.

Did any Steelers fan really want him suspended?

The ugh! reaction to the situation was to be expected. But no one wanted the team to suffer as a result.

Relentless7
09-02-2010, 05:24 PM
Funny how many were upset with Ben and agreed that punishment must be handed down are now changing their tunes after seeing our QB backups and that the season is nearing. I'm guilty too.

Did any Steelers fan really want him suspended?

The ugh! reaction to the situation was to be expected. But no one wanted the team to suffer as a result.

Call me crazy, and many have before, but I don't think Ben getting suspended is going to be THAT bad of a thing for him OR the team. We won't re-hash the "wake up call" aspect... mainly because I don't want to be told exactly what Ben is thinking at this very moment... but from the Team standpoint, I'm VERY hopeful that this suspension FORCES BA to: A) COMMIT to a consistent running game. B) Stop being "too cute" in short yardage situations. and C) just generally remove his head from his rear all the way around.

Hopefully a few weeks away from the field will "reform" both Ben and our OFFENSIVE coordinator.

Sugar
09-02-2010, 05:31 PM
What would be best is if Goodell comes out of that meeting tomorrow and announces that Ben's suspension will be turned into probation since:

A) Circumstantial evidence that has come out since the allegations indicate that Ben's behaviour was not nearly as eggregious as first thought.

B) He has cooperated fully with the NFL in every way thus far.

C) The full six games will be enforced upon credible evidence of Ben actually violating the Personal Conduct Policy going forward.

It won't happen- but it should!

NJ-STEELER
09-02-2010, 06:34 PM
Barravecchio's lawyer did tell KDKA that Miss DTF and her friends were lying when they specifically said Ben went down the hall with his pants down and his junk out.

You know what's funny also? All these investigations, by NUMEROUS investigation teams, and yet:

Ben is uncharged.

Joyner is still a state trooper.

Barraveccio (who was accused of "dragging" Miss DTF down the hall) is still a cop.

That says it all right there.

Does anyone really think that a bunch of sorority girls would actually go back to the sorority house and get their stories straight to divert attention from the fact that they were illegally drinking as underage students? Would classy young southern girls actually be willing to do such a thing?

You bet!!!! That is why the prosecutor did not prosecute because it was obvious that the stories were too similar and rehearsed. A good defense attorney would have blown them out of the water.


:Clap :Clap

NJ-STEELER
09-02-2010, 06:38 PM
Funny how many were upset with Ben and agreed that punishment must be handed down are now changing their tunes after seeing our QB backups and that the season is nearing. I'm guilty too.

Did any Steelers fan really want him suspended?

The ugh! reaction to the situation was to be expected. But no one wanted the team to suffer as a result.

Call me crazy, and many have before, but I don't think Ben getting suspended is going to be THAT bad of a thing for him OR the team. We won't re-hash the "wake up call" aspect... mainly because I don't want to be told exactly what Ben is thinking at this very moment... but from the Team standpoint, I'm VERY hopeful that this suspension FORCES BA to: A) COMMIT to a consistent running game. B) Stop being "too cute" in short yardage situations. and C) just generally remove his head from his rear all the way around.

Hopefully a few weeks away from the field will "reform" both Ben and our OFFENSIVE coordinator.

how would you feel if we went 1-3 in the first four games and missed the playoffs by 1 game

Relentless7
09-02-2010, 06:48 PM
Funny how many were upset with Ben and agreed that punishment must be handed down are now changing their tunes after seeing our QB backups and that the season is nearing. I'm guilty too.

Did any Steelers fan really want him suspended?

The ugh! reaction to the situation was to be expected. But no one wanted the team to suffer as a result.

Call me crazy, and many have before, but I don't think Ben getting suspended is going to be THAT bad of a thing for him OR the team. We won't re-hash the "wake up call" aspect... mainly because I don't want to be told exactly what Ben is thinking at this very moment... but from the Team standpoint, I'm VERY hopeful that this suspension FORCES BA to: A) COMMIT to a consistent running game. B) Stop being "too cute" in short yardage situations. and C) just generally remove his head from his rear all the way around.

Hopefully a few weeks away from the field will "reform" both Ben and our OFFENSIVE coordinator.

how would you feel if we went 1-3 in the first four games and missed the playoffs by 1 game


Obviously, as a Steeler fan, that would suck and I'd be upset. But I know I'm in the minority (especially here) but the person I've been "mad at" since the incident is Ben. HE put his team and this season in jeopardy that night in my opinion. But part of being a team is picking up your teammate, so hopefully the D and Mendy, and the O-Line can step up those first 4 weeks.

Again, as a fan I tend to have a more optimistic opinion about the first four games. Let's hope for both of our sake's I'm right and we can at least go 2-2, and MAYBE 3-1.

Crash
09-02-2010, 11:23 PM
Steelers sources deny this report....

Captain Lemming
09-03-2010, 02:02 AM
Ben denies "sexual intercourse" very specifically for a reason.

Because that was the SPECIFIC CRIME that he was accused of.

Unprotected rape sexual intercourse.

That's the accusation boys. That's what they investigated.

And they got NOTHING to support it.

Learn the facts of this case.

Crash "learn the facts" of what I said.
It is consistent with what you just said.
What do you think I implied when I mentioned Clinton?
I have stated before that I believe you scenario is likely and makes sense.
If you are correct it explains why Ben cannot talk.

If the girl is lying now, and what you say is too percent correct, and Ben admits it, she can hurt him.
If she says it happened just like you say, with witnesses all knowing how drunk she was it is a problem. You keep reminding us of now drunk she was. Not good for Ben.

If your scenario is correct it explains:

-Why the girl wants to drop it (embarrassing)
-Why Ben says nothing (even if she was a "willing" participant, her drunken state consent presents a consent issue.)
-Why Ben does not show near the same indignation against this girl as McNulty (he has to be nice to her)
She holds some serious cards.
If you are correct, her lawyer tells his lawyer how it is.

Captain Lemming
09-03-2010, 02:14 AM
Barravecchio's lawyer did tell KDKA that Miss DTF and her friends were lying when they specifically said Ben went down the hall with his pants down and his junk out.


But he did not say Ben wasn't in the bathroom. You know Ben was in the bathroom Crash. You have said it many times. Please convince your friends, I agree with you on that fact.

Crash
09-03-2010, 02:30 AM
I believe she was blowing him in the bathroom, she slipped, Ben helped her up, ended what they were doing and left.

Then he supposedly was sitting with another girl.

I think Miss DTF and her friends got pissed at that and "cried rape" simply to embarrass him.

Or, like I said before, the rumors about Miss DTF and her crew were true and thats why the text messages were not released by the GBI.

That 2nd interview by Miss DTF was embarrassing. It's so obvious she's making it up on the fly.

Captain Lemming
09-03-2010, 02:48 AM
I may have missed it but what are the legal reasons that nobody in his party can say, "The chick is lying because I was with Ben and I can say Ben never went into the bathroom?"

Nobody "defends" Ben with definitive statements that contradict the girls claims that Ben was with her in the bathroom. They just plead ignorance of what happened.




:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Man i am disappointed i wrote an Eminem Style diss to you and you did not even read that??? WTF...wasted my time...anyways it was copied rap..


Remove your Ben Hater goggles and read fcuking transcripts or atleast what that DA had to say.

BIG BEN's BODYGAURDS OR CLUB BOUNCER DID NOT SEE BEN GO TO BATHROOM WITH THAT GIRL

Again its your opinion to say Big Ben screwed that girl but don't tell us lies that no one contradicted that girls statement.

Where did I say "Big Ben screwed that girl" ? That is not my opinion. I have never said that.
I have said I think Crash's scenario is "likely".
I dont know what happened in the bathroom. I have said this many times.
I just said I believe it is obvious he was in the bathroom.

I read the transcripts clown. I know full well that:
BIG BEN's BODYGAURDS OR CLUB BOUNCER SAY THEY DID NOT SEE BEN GO TO BATHROOM WITH THAT GIRL

"I didn't see" is not definitive.

They are paid to watch him, yet they cannot say, "Ben was not in the bathroom".
They just "didn't see him" go in.

Can you comprehend the difference Eminem? (funny how you want to imitate a REAL Ben hater.)

A room full on people, and no one says "he never was in the bathroom", "I was with him," or "I saw him on a bar stool the whole time,' or a bodyguard say, "it was my job to watch him and I can say he never went in the bathroom."

If Ben is never in the restroom, it is so easy to confirm,none of this happens.

Slapstick
09-03-2010, 08:45 AM
"I didn't see" is not definitive.

They are paid to watch him, yet they cannot say, "Ben was not in the bathroom".
They just "didn't see him" go in.

Can you comprehend the difference Eminem? (funny how you want to imitate a REAL Ben hater.)

A room full on people, and no one says "he never was in the bathroom", "I was with him," or "I saw him on a bar stool the whole time,' or a bodyguard say, "it was my job to watch him and I can say he never went in the bathroom."

If Ben is never in the restroom, it is so easy to confirm,none of this happens.



Of course...why wouldn't Ben go into the restroom at any point during the evening...I mean, he was only at a bar...I can't imagine that he would have to take a piss at any point during the night...

IIRC, the alleged incident could have taken place over a three or four hour period, right? Was there ever a time pinpointed?

Under those circumstances, for Roethlisberger or any of his bodyguards to say he never went to the bathroom would be patently ridiculous...

What they did say was that they didn't see Ben go into the bathroom with his accuser...

grotonsteel
09-03-2010, 09:52 AM
[quote="Captain Lemming":2xpyf14a]
I may have missed it but what are the legal reasons that nobody in his party can say, "The chick is lying because I was with Ben and I can say Ben never went into the bathroom?"

Nobody "defends" Ben with definitive statements that contradict the girls claims that Ben was with her in the bathroom. They just plead ignorance of what happened.




:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Man i am disappointed i wrote an Eminem Style diss to you and you did not even read that??? WTF...wasted my time...anyways it was copied rap..


Remove your Ben Hater goggles and read fcuking transcripts or atleast what that DA had to say.

BIG BEN's BODYGAURDS OR CLUB BOUNCER DID NOT SEE BEN GO TO BATHROOM WITH THAT GIRL

Again its your opinion to say Big Ben screwed that girl but don't tell us lies that no one contradicted that girls statement.

Where did I say "Big Ben screwed that girl" ? That is not my opinion. I have never said that.
I have said I think Crash's scenario is "likely".
I dont know what happened in the bathroom. I have said this many times.
I just said I believe it is obvious he was in the bathroom.

I read the transcripts clown. I know full well that:
BIG BEN's BODYGAURDS OR CLUB BOUNCER SAY THEY DID NOT SEE BEN GO TO BATHROOM WITH THAT GIRL

"I didn't see" is not definitive.

They are paid to watch him, yet they cannot say, "Ben was not in the bathroom".
They just "didn't see him" go in.

Can you comprehend the difference Eminem? (funny how you want to imitate a REAL Ben hater.)

A room full on people, and no one says "he never was in the bathroom", "I was with him," or "I saw him on a bar stool the whole time,' or a bodyguard say, "it was my job to watch him and I can say he never went in the bathroom."

If Ben is never in the restroom, it is so easy to confirm,none of this happens.

[/quote:2xpyf14a]


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Your scenario is true if it happened at say at a particular time. But what you are saying is bull when the duration is whole night. Did anyone said or did videotapes showed Big Ben was in the bathroom ???

No way anyone is going to testify he never went to bathroom whole night. I mean is it even possible to hold your piss for 6 hours while drinking??

Again read the transcripts. And then spin it.

feltdizz
09-03-2010, 11:04 AM
The season can't get here soon enough....

Shawn
09-03-2010, 07:25 PM
I believe she was blowing him in the bathroom, she slipped, Ben helped her up, ended what they were doing and left.

Then he supposedly was sitting with another girl.

I think Miss DTF and her friends got pissed at that and "cried rape" simply to embarrass him.

Or, like I said before, the rumors about Miss DTF and her crew were true and thats why the text messages were not released by the GBI.

That 2nd interview by Miss DTF was embarrassing. It's so obvious she's making it up on the fly.

Still legally rape.

Shawn
09-03-2010, 07:29 PM
Frank...I didn't make the law. But, if you have sex with someone who can't even walk in a straight line...you can be charged and prosecuted for rape. Yes, it happens every day. Yes people do it all the time without being charged. With that said, lets say you buy shots for a woman at a local bar...put down a bunch together. You leave with her and many witnesses notice you have to help hold her up to get into the taxi. If you go home and have sex with this woman it's rape. If she wakes up the next morning and decides to file charges against you, gets examined, they find your DNA all over her, and they have witnesses to the fact that this woman could barely walk...welp you are hosed. They will prosecute you and you will go to prison. You will also have to notify every neighborhood you ever move into of your presence.


who says that the woman shouldn't/couldn't be the one charged with rape?

Depends because she could be charged with rape if he was stumbling drunk as witnessed by others. He would have to file charges. Being intoxicated and having sex isn't a crime. It becomes a crime when one of the partys press charges against the other. And when there are witnesses stating the victim was unable to ambulate without assistance, grossly intoxicated with given examples of the intoxication. The reason it's rarely prosecuted is because people rarely press charges.