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View Full Version : Why the Steelers might let Woodley walk



Shawn
08-01-2010, 10:26 AM
Listen...I have no axe to grind with Woodley. He was in my mock that year and I have been singing his praises every since. But, my eyes can fool me just like the next guy. I like big powerful hitters and guys who can sack the QB. It's fun to watch. But, there is more to being a linebacker than sacking the QB.

Question why did the Steelers draft two higher round OLBs this season? STs and because they needed depth? I don't believe so. I believe it's because they don't plan on re-signing Woodley. That just seems ignorant until you look at the non sack numbers.

Woodley was ranked 73rd worst among linebackers in run Defense in 2009
Woodley was ranked 52nd worst among linebackers in Pass defense (in coverage only, not rushing QB)


We know Tomlin likes linebackers who can do it all including cover. Woodley wasn't that guy last year.

Crash
08-01-2010, 10:32 AM
Woodley's a little better in coverage than people think but I agree about the run defense.

But who's to say it won't be Harrison (who's way over 30) to be the one to go? If he continues to slump this season like he did at the end of last season who knows? It could happen.

Flasteel
08-01-2010, 11:29 AM
Listen...I have no axe to grind with Woodley. He was in my mock that year and I have been singing his praises every since. But, my eyes can fool me just like the next guy. I like big powerful hitters and guys who can sack the QB. It's fun to watch. But, there is more to being a linebacker than sacking the QB.

Question why did the Steelers draft two higher round OLBs this season? STs and because they needed depth? I don't believe so. I believe it's because they don't plan on re-signing Woodley. That just seems ignorant until you look at the non sack numbers.

Woodley was ranked 73rd worst among linebackers in run Defense in 2009
Woodley was ranked 52nd worst among linebackers in Pass defense (in coverage only, not rushing QB)


We know Tomlin likes linebackers who can do it all including cover. Woodley wasn't that guy last year.

Are you serious Shawn? Quit hitting your nitrous supply before you post. :D The primary function of a 3-4 outside linebacker is to rush the passer (apologies for stating the obvious). Woodley is arguably the best up and coming pass rush specialist in this league. I fully realize that he cannot become a liability in the other phases of his game, but I don't believe you have presented any significant evidence to show that he has.


I see Woodley out in the flats all of the time in coverage and distinctly remember him running with TE's down the seam 20 yards upfield. Hell, last year he had 5 passes defended and even had an interception in 2008. I'm not sure what stats constitute either of the categories you listed (run defense and pass defense), but you cannot compare his role to that of a 4-3 linebacker by plugging him into that positional ranking (nice inclusion of "worst", by the way). Why don't you see how he fares against all DE's?

Woodley will no-doubt be the Steelers top priority after this season. You are trying to reason against all common sense and logic by suggesting anything different.

I applaud you for your [failed] effort.

grotonsteel
08-01-2010, 11:42 AM
Woodley's a little better in coverage than people think but I agree about the run defense.

But who's to say it won't be Harrison (who's way over 30) to be the one to go? If he continues to slump this season like he did at the end of last season who knows? It could happen.


:Agree

The only reason i think Steelers drafted 2 OLBS in this draft. From bench strength/backups this year to starters in 2-3 years.

BURGH86STEEL
08-01-2010, 12:14 PM
Listen...I have no axe to grind with Woodley. He was in my mock that year and I have been singing his praises every since. But, my eyes can fool me just like the next guy. I like big powerful hitters and guys who can sack the QB. It's fun to watch. But, there is more to being a linebacker than sacking the QB.

Question why did the Steelers draft two higher round OLBs this season? STs and because they needed depth? I don't believe so. I believe it's because they don't plan on re-signing Woodley. That just seems ignorant until you look at the non sack numbers.

Woodley was ranked 73rd worst among linebackers in run Defense in 2009
Woodley was ranked 52nd worst among linebackers in Pass defense (in coverage only, not rushing QB)


We know Tomlin likes linebackers who can do it all including cover. Woodley wasn't that guy last year.
How anyone can come up with numbers for LB's in pass coverage is beyond me. At the end of the day, those stats might be meaningless. There are many variables to consider.

I agree, there is more to being a LB then rushing the passer. Woodley may not be a great man to man coverage LB. He can become better then he is now. He can become more instinctive in pass coverage with experience. He is still a player entering the prime of his career.

Steelers drafted LB's because it is what they do. Having depth at the position is key to having a great pass rush/3-4 defense. Harrison is not getting any younger. They can also use those players to improve the special teams coverage. They might not be able to resign Woodley. There are a number of reasons why they drafted LB's. They seem to take one or two every draft or pick up UDFA's at LB.

I believe the Steelers would like to resign Woodley. I don't think it will have anything to do with meaningless pass coverage numbers. Please stop smoking whatever MSM is smoking.

feltdizz
08-01-2010, 12:17 PM
Listen...I have no axe to grind with Woodley. He was in my mock that year and I have been singing his praises every since. But, my eyes can fool me just like the next guy. I like big powerful hitters and guys who can sack the QB. It's fun to watch. But, there is more to being a linebacker than sacking the QB.

Question why did the Steelers draft two higher round OLBs this season? STs and because they needed depth? I don't believe so. I believe it's because they don't plan on re-signing Woodley. That just seems ignorant until you look at the non sack numbers.

Woodley was ranked 73rd worst among linebackers in run Defense in 2009
Woodley was ranked 52nd worst among linebackers in Pass defense (in coverage only, not rushing QB)


We know Tomlin likes linebackers who can do it all including cover. Woodley wasn't that guy last year.
How anyone can come up with numbers for LB's in pass coverage is beyond me. At the end of the day, those stats might be meaningless. There are many variables to consider.

There is more to being a LB then rushing the passer. Woodley may not be a great man to man coverage LB. He can become better then he is now. He can become more instinctive in pass coverage with experience. He is still a player entering the prime of his career.

Steelers drafted LB's because it is what they do. Having depth at the position is key to having a great pass rush. Harrison is not getting any younger. They can also use those players to improve the special teams coverage. They might not be able to resign Woodley. There are a number of reasons why they drafted LB's. They seem to take one or two every draft or pick up UDFA's at LB.

I believe the Steelers would like to resign Woodley. I don't think it will have anything to do with meaningless pass coverage numbers. Please stop smoking whatever MSM is smoking.

:Agree

Shawn
08-01-2010, 01:26 PM
Woodley's a little better in coverage than people think but I agree about the run defense.

But who's to say it won't be Harrison (who's way over 30) to be the one to go? If he continues to slump this season like he did at the end of last season who knows? It could happen.


:Agree

The only reason i think Steelers drafted 2 OLBS in this draft. From bench strength/backups this year to starters in 2-3 years.

Possibly. But, I trust stats more than my eyes in this case. I know I can be mislead by a freakish pass rusher into thinking he is better than he is. In every area but pass rushing (which I admit he is elite in that area) he has struggled statistically.

The question I had after reading this was...do you pay a pure pass rusher with little run support ability and little ability to pass cover a HUGE top 5 LBr contract?

It's just a theory guys but I wouldn't be surprised in the least if they let him walk...especially if Worilds turns out to be the real deal. Harrison while he has some age on him doesn't have as much mileage as his stated age. He should be good to go for another 4-5 seasons barring injury.

Jooser
08-01-2010, 01:45 PM
The thing is this, teams didn't run the ball on us, even last season. Our rushing D was great, but rather there was an absence of pass rush at times last season that further exploited our porous pass defense. Why would we want to lose what was arguably our best pass rush weapon, we'd take a step backwards in the category that could be strengthened this season. I don't care what Wood's individual stats were in the rushing d or passing d categories, he gives us a force to be reckoned with (period).

Flasteel
08-01-2010, 01:57 PM
From the Bleacher Report:
Last season, Woodley tied for the lead in the NFL with 19 tackles for loss.
Other than being one of the best pass rushers in the league, people do not realize that Woodley is one of the best against the run as well.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/4235 ... ion#page/4 (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/423538-pittsburgh-steelers-10-reasons-lamarr-woodley-deserves-an-extension#page/4)

Mike Mayock on Daniel Graham:
I kind of like him at 3-4 outside linebacker, NFL Network draft analyst Mike Mayock said. The first time I put a tape on, he reminded me an awful lot of Woodley. They both were tremendously stout against the run and they had some explosion getting up the field.
http://www.annarbor.com/sports/um-footb ... ct-in-nfl/ (http://www.annarbor.com/sports/um-football/at-linebacker-or-defensive-end-brandon-graham-should-make-an-impact-in-nfl/)

Scouting report out of college:
Woodley is clearly a "tweener" and will most likely find himself playing linebacker at the next level. His best fit in the NFL would be a 3-4 defense as an outside linebacker an occasionally line up at defensive end. Woodley has all the intangibles to excel in a 3-4 scheme as a pass rusher and get the job done against the run. He will be a first day selection, probably a mid-to-late first round pick.
http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/prof ... ect_id=510 (http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?prospect_id=510)

Lamarr Woodley on Lamarr Woodley:
Im great against the run, Woodley said last Friday. I do a good job of holding my gap and holding my own against offensive linemen. You run the ball my way, Im definitely going to pass the test. I dont back down from anybody, and Im pretty good at everything I do. And if I beat you, Im going to drill you all the way into the ground.
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=m ... sday052610 (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-trippintuesday052610)

Im not sure if you just read some obscure stat and decided that Woodley was weak against the run, or if you are just basing this erroneous assessment on your observations. Regardless, it would seem your "evidence" lacks any punch.

Shawn
08-01-2010, 01:59 PM
The thing is this, teams didn't run the ball on us, even last season. Our rushing D was great, but rather there was an absence of pass rush at times last season that further exploited our porous pass defense. Why would we want to lose what was arguably our best pass rush weapon, we'd take a step backwards in the category that could be strengthened this season. I don't care what Wood's individual stats were in the rushing d or passing d categories, he gives us a force to be reckoned with (period).

I'm certainly not saying I want to lose Woodley. What I am saying is that if Worilds shows he is the real deal it might be real easy not to pay Woodley top 5 LBr money.

ANPSTEEL
08-01-2010, 02:27 PM
...I believe the Steelers would like to resign Woodley. I don't think it will have anything to do with meaningless pass coverage numbers. ...

I think this is it exactly.

I believe the team has every intention of resigning 56.

They drafted the three LBs for depth, development, and insurance.

Clearly, they will play on ST- at least those that make the roster- and I think all three will.

Of the starting lbs

Farrior is probably in his last season- certainly as a starter.

Foote is a servicable Mack- but certainly not an impact guy.

Harrison has a ton of heart and a lot of ability, but as we saw the last half of the year- a guy that plays that hard- at his age (32) how much more does he have in the tank??

Woodley & Timmons are the future of this unit.

Timmons ultimately will move to Buck- which is where he should be in a 3-4.
Woodley will stay where he is.
Worlids will replace Harrison.
Gibbson will provide depth- and be insurance (as will Worlids) in case the team is unable to resign Lamarr due to $$$ demands or injury.
Sylvester is a Mack ILB - and maybe a good one.... the scouting reports indicate he excels at fighting through traffic to get to the ball carrier.

That is it.

So Woodley stays, imo, unless his contract demands are completely unreasonable.

calmkiller
08-01-2010, 04:10 PM
Isn't it obvious that they aren't going to resign him so pouncey can have his number?

Shawn
08-01-2010, 04:10 PM
I do like my statistics I must admit...but I know they don't tell the whole tale. With that said, these stats are very hard to ignore.

When runs were coming at Harrison opposing RBs only averaged 1.9 ypc.

When runs were coming at Woodley they averaged 3.7 ypc

Overall, the Steelers were 2nd best in stopping runs when the opposing offense runs
around left end (Or right end from the defensive viewpoint). And that is James Harrison's
side.

Steelers were 23rd ranked in stopping runs when the opposing offense runs around
right end. (or left end from the defensive viewpoint) And that is Woodley's side.

Also Harrison allowed 5.8 Yards per pass when he was listed as the target in pass coverage. This was a ranking of 12th over all among LB (tied with Timmons). Meanwhile Woodley allowed 7.0 per pass for a ranking of 52.


While I believe Woodley to be a large value to this team I don't believe he is as good as the contract that he wants. He is a pure pass rusher and the Steelers will want more from him before they give him top 5 LBr pay.

frankthetank1
08-01-2010, 04:14 PM
how good was porter in coverage or any other OLB we have had in the 3-4 zone blitz? pass coverage isnt a big part of the OLB's in this defense. even kevin greene or lloyd were not great in pass coverage. woodley is better than people think in coverage but he is a premier pass rusher which is why he is so valuable to the defense.

harrison is in his 30's so if we were drafting an OLB to replace anyone it is him. i have an easier time believing the reason why we drafted 3 OLB's in the past draft is because the switch to a 4-3 could be in the near future rather than drafting for both woodley and harrison's replacements.

Shawn
08-01-2010, 04:17 PM
how good was porter in coverage or any other OLB we have had in the 3-4 zone blitz? pass coverage isnt a big part of the OLB's in this defense. even kevin greene or lloyd were not great in pass coverage. woodley is better than people think in coverage but he is a premier pass rusher which is why he is so valuable to the defense.

harrison is in his 30's so if we were drafting an OLB to replace anyone it is him. i have an easier time believing the reason why we drafted 3 OLB's in the past draft is because the switch to a 4-3 could be in the near future rather than drafting for both woodley and harrison's replacements.

Check out Harrison's above. He's pretty darn good in coverage. Statistically Woodley can't shine Harrison's shoes. Harrison is a complete LBr. That's why he got paid.

Preacher
08-01-2010, 04:20 PM
Woodley's a little better in coverage than people think but I agree about the run defense.

But who's to say it won't be Harrison (who's way over 30) to be the one to go? If he continues to slump this season like he did at the end of last season who knows? It could happen.


:Agree

The only reason i think Steelers drafted 2 OLBS in this draft. From bench strength/backups this year to starters in 2-3 years.

I'd have to agree with that for the most part. Though, even Timmons and Woodley were considered bench strength their first year (and second for Timmons).

Its just part of the cycle that keeps the Steeler linebacker corp the best 3-4 LB corp in the NFL.

BTW, hello again everyone.

frankthetank1
08-01-2010, 04:22 PM
how good was porter in coverage or any other OLB we have had in the 3-4 zone blitz? pass coverage isnt a big part of the OLB's in this defense. even kevin greene or lloyd were not great in pass coverage. woodley is better than people think in coverage but he is a premier pass rusher which is why he is so valuable to the defense.

harrison is in his 30's so if we were drafting an OLB to replace anyone it is him. i have an easier time believing the reason why we drafted 3 OLB's in the past draft is because the switch to a 4-3 could be in the near future rather than drafting for both woodley and harrison's replacements.

Check out Harrison's above. He's pretty darn good in coverage. Statistically Woodley can't shine Harrison's shoes. Harrison is a complete LBr. That's why he got paid.

harrison is also seven years or so older than woodley. he is only going into his 4th season in the nfl. he has progressed every season as a steeler so he should get paid. i would be shocked if any of our OLB's we drafted turn out to be just as good as woodley

Shawn
08-01-2010, 04:28 PM
how good was porter in coverage or any other OLB we have had in the 3-4 zone blitz? pass coverage isnt a big part of the OLB's in this defense. even kevin greene or lloyd were not great in pass coverage. woodley is better than people think in coverage but he is a premier pass rusher which is why he is so valuable to the defense.

harrison is in his 30's so if we were drafting an OLB to replace anyone it is him. i have an easier time believing the reason why we drafted 3 OLB's in the past draft is because the switch to a 4-3 could be in the near future rather than drafting for both woodley and harrison's replacements.

Check out Harrison's above. He's pretty darn good in coverage. Statistically Woodley can't shine Harrison's shoes. Harrison is a complete LBr. That's why he got paid.

harrison is also seven years or so older than woodley. he is only going into his 4th season in the nfl. he has progressed every season as a steeler so he should get paid. i would be shocked if any of our OLB's we drafted turn out to be just as good as woodley

Like I said, I like Woodley. Shoot, I was tooting his horn before that draft. I have every reason to want him to do well. He is indeed an elite pass rusher and I agree he is getting better all around. The problem. His agent wants top 5 money on this contract and that won't happen if Worilds proves he is the real deal. His game isn't complete enough to warrant that kind of money and the Steelers don't do business like that. They pay that kind of money only for complete ballers. And right now Woodley isn't that.

Discipline of Steel
08-01-2010, 04:33 PM
Harrison's 'slump' is directly correlated to Woodleys rise. Woodley slumped the first half of the year when Harrison was on a tear. I think offenses adjusted their attention to the left side. BTW, Harrison is near the top of the charts in every statistical category. The man is an alpha male...Harrison stays.

Secondly, You could say there were about 130 starting LB in the league last year. If Woodley was 52 out of 130 in pass coverage, that is almost top third in the league...at least top half. 75 or whatever against the run might be partially explainable in that half of the 130 LB in the league are inside LB who make their paychecks stopping the run. Woodely stays.

frankthetank1
08-01-2010, 04:35 PM
how good was porter in coverage or any other OLB we have had in the 3-4 zone blitz? pass coverage isnt a big part of the OLB's in this defense. even kevin greene or lloyd were not great in pass coverage. woodley is better than people think in coverage but he is a premier pass rusher which is why he is so valuable to the defense.

harrison is in his 30's so if we were drafting an OLB to replace anyone it is him. i have an easier time believing the reason why we drafted 3 OLB's in the past draft is because the switch to a 4-3 could be in the near future rather than drafting for both woodley and harrison's replacements.

Check out Harrison's above. He's pretty darn good in coverage. Statistically Woodley can't shine Harrison's shoes. Harrison is a complete LBr. That's why he got paid.

harrison is also seven years or so older than woodley. he is only going into his 4th season in the nfl. he has progressed every season as a steeler so he should get paid. i would be shocked if any of our OLB's we drafted turn out to be just as good as woodley

Like I said, I like Woodley. Shoot, I was tooting his horn before that draft. I have every reason to want him to do well. He is indeed an elite pass rusher and I agree he is getting better all around. The problem. His agent wants top 5 money on this contract and that won't happen if Worilds proves he is the real deal. His game isn't complete enough to warrant that kind of money and the Steelers don't do business like that. They pay that kind of money only for complete ballers. And right now Woodley isn't that.

well i guess the steelers should pony up and pay woodley his money because worilds isnt in the same class as woodley and i doubt he ever will be. his stats in 3 seasons at VT are very unimpressive. in 2 seasons starting at VT he had a whopping 12 sacks to go along with zero forced fumbles and int's.

Shawn
08-01-2010, 05:02 PM
how good was porter in coverage or any other OLB we have had in the 3-4 zone blitz? pass coverage isnt a big part of the OLB's in this defense. even kevin greene or lloyd were not great in pass coverage. woodley is better than people think in coverage but he is a premier pass rusher which is why he is so valuable to the defense.

harrison is in his 30's so if we were drafting an OLB to replace anyone it is him. i have an easier time believing the reason why we drafted 3 OLB's in the past draft is because the switch to a 4-3 could be in the near future rather than drafting for both woodley and harrison's replacements.

Check out Harrison's above. He's pretty darn good in coverage. Statistically Woodley can't shine Harrison's shoes. Harrison is a complete LBr. That's why he got paid.

harrison is also seven years or so older than woodley. he is only going into his 4th season in the nfl. he has progressed every season as a steeler so he should get paid. i would be shocked if any of our OLB's we drafted turn out to be just as good as woodley

Like I said, I like Woodley. Shoot, I was tooting his horn before that draft. I have every reason to want him to do well. He is indeed an elite pass rusher and I agree he is getting better all around. The problem. His agent wants top 5 money on this contract and that won't happen if Worilds proves he is the real deal. His game isn't complete enough to warrant that kind of money and the Steelers don't do business like that. They pay that kind of money only for complete ballers. And right now Woodley isn't that.

well i guess the steelers should pony up and pay woodley his money because worilds isnt in the same class as woodley and i doubt he ever will be. his stats in 3 seasons at VT are very unimpressive. in 2 seasons starting at VT he had a whopping 12 sacks to go along with zero forced fumbles and int's.


Then I guess we drafted poorly and we will have to overpay Woodley if you are correct.

Shawn
08-01-2010, 05:03 PM
Harrison's 'slump' is directly correlated to Woodleys rise. Woodley slumped the first half of the year when Harrison was on a tear. I think offenses adjusted their attention to the left side. BTW, Harrison is near the top of the charts in every statistical category. The man is an alpha male...Harrison stays.

Secondly, You could say there were about 130 starting LB in the league last year. If Woodley was 52 out of 130 in pass coverage, that is almost top third in the league...at least top half. 75 or whatever against the run might be partially explainable in that half of the 130 LB in the league are inside LB who make their paychecks stopping the run. Woodely stays.

Sure...Woodley is an elite pass rusher but very average at everything else. My question is does that kind of play warrant top 5 money?

steelz09
08-02-2010, 12:04 AM
If the Steelers don't resign Woodley, it will be one of the biggest blunders in recent Steelers history.

Meanwhile, why don't we sign another player thats 30+ years old and let go our young stud players :roll:

stlrz d
08-02-2010, 12:41 AM
Stats are for baseball.

Woodley isn't going anywhere.

Boomerang
08-02-2010, 12:45 AM
Stats are for baseball.

Woodley isn't going anywhere.


I bet you said the same thing about Kendrell Bell, that's assuming you were a Steeler fan during that time. Never say never. By the way if stats are for baseball then why do they flash stats every 20 seconds during an NFL game? To fill the screen up?

Crash
08-02-2010, 12:55 AM
Kendrell Bell was let go because he was hurt, wouldn't do "what it takes" to get on the field, and wore out his welcome with Cowher.

Shawn
08-02-2010, 01:04 AM
Kendrell Bell was let go because he was hurt, wouldn't do "what it takes" to get on the field, and wore out his welcome with Cowher.

But, there are some additional similarities in that Bell was also a one dimensional Lbr.

As for signing 30+ yr players. Well, ya know when they don't break the bank and they fill a role not a bad signing. Paying top 5 money for a guy who can only rush the passer? I just don't know guys. I hope I'm wrong because fans would burn the stadium down if they don't re-sign him.

hawaiiansteel
08-02-2010, 01:32 AM
Paying top 5 money for a guy who can only rush the passer? I just don't know guys. I hope I'm wrong because fans would burn the stadium down if they don't re-sign him.


only if LaMarr has a great season...if he doesn't, true Steelers fans will understand if we don't give an unreasonable long-term contract to Woodley.

RuthlessBurgher
08-05-2010, 12:34 AM
I do like my statistics I must admit...but I know they don't tell the whole tale. With that said, these stats are very hard to ignore.

When runs were coming at Harrison opposing RBs only averaged 1.9 ypc.

When runs were coming at Woodley they averaged 3.7 ypc

Overall, the Steelers were 2nd best in stopping runs when the opposing offense runs
around left end (Or right end from the defensive viewpoint). And that is James Harrison's
side.

Steelers were 23rd ranked in stopping runs when the opposing offense runs around
right end. (or left end from the defensive viewpoint) And that is Woodley's side.

Also Harrison allowed 5.8 Yards per pass when he was listed as the target in pass coverage. This was a ranking of 12th over all among LB (tied with Timmons). Meanwhile Woodley allowed 7.0 per pass for a ranking of 52.


While I believe Woodley to be a large value to this team I don't believe he is as good as the contract that he wants. He is a pure pass rusher and the Steelers will want more from him before they give him top 5 LBr pay.

You have to take into account that the best 3-4 DE in the league (who plays in front of Woodley) was out of the lineup for 11 games last year. So Keisel and Harrison may be better stopping the run than Eason and Woodley. That's not exactly shocking. Plus you have to take into account that Woodley plays the strong side where the TE lines up, so there is typically an extra blocker on runs to his side as opposed to Harrison's side. And most teams tend to be "right-handed" when running the ball. Just look at us, and how often we pull Kemoeatu from his LG spot to lead the way on a run to the right side. We never did the opposite of that with Trai Essex pulling to run to the left.

LaMarr Woodley may not be a young Jack Ham, but so what...who is? I'll be happy with LaMarr Woodley as a young Kevin Greene. That's fine with me.

NJ-STEELER
08-05-2010, 01:09 AM
i dont think he's a liabilty in either run support or pass coverage. were the people who did those rankings the same ones that rated Semi one of the 3 best RTs in the game

but, like i said in the other thread, i am also afriad of what the FO might be thinking.

maybe the FO looks at timmons factoring in with the '10 draftees on the outside

RuthlessBurgher
08-05-2010, 01:34 AM
i dont think he's a liabilty in either run support or pass coverage. were the people who did those rankings the same ones that rated Semi one of the 3 best RTs in the game

but, like i said in the other thread, i am also afriad of what the FO might be thinking.

maybe the FO looks at timmons factoring in with the '10 draftees on the outside

Nope...don't know where Shawn got those numbers from, but it wasn't from that ProFootballFocus site, since they rated Woodley as the #1 3-4 OLB in the league (ahead of DeMarcus Ware and James Harrison).

http://profootballfocus.com/by_position.php?tab=by_position&season=2009&pos=OLB4&stype=r&runpass=&teamid=-1&numsnaps=25&numgames=1

Shawn
08-05-2010, 01:56 AM
i dont think he's a liabilty in either run support or pass coverage. were the people who did those rankings the same ones that rated Semi one of the 3 best RTs in the game

but, like i said in the other thread, i am also afriad of what the FO might be thinking.

maybe the FO looks at timmons factoring in with the '10 draftees on the outside

Nope...don't know where Shawn got those numbers from, but it wasn't from that ProFootballFocus site, since they rated Woodley as the #1 3-4 OLB in the league (ahead of DeMarcus Ware and James Harrison).

http://profootballfocus.com/by_position.php?tab=by_position&season=2009&pos=OLB4&stype=r&runpass=&teamid=-1&numsnaps=25&numgames=1

What do any of those numbers mean? I apologize for being slow but I don't understand the rating system and how they weight stats.

RuthlessBurgher
08-05-2010, 02:09 AM
i dont think he's a liabilty in either run support or pass coverage. were the people who did those rankings the same ones that rated Semi one of the 3 best RTs in the game

but, like i said in the other thread, i am also afriad of what the FO might be thinking.

maybe the FO looks at timmons factoring in with the '10 draftees on the outside

Nope...don't know where Shawn got those numbers from, but it wasn't from that ProFootballFocus site, since they rated Woodley as the #1 3-4 OLB in the league (ahead of DeMarcus Ware and James Harrison).

http://profootballfocus.com/by_position.php?tab=by_position&season=2009&pos=OLB4&stype=r&runpass=&teamid=-1&numsnaps=25&numgames=1

What do any of those numbers mean? I apologize for being slow but I don't understand the rating system and how they weight stats.

I have no idea...they seem to be pretty arbitrary if Willie Colon is the 3rd best OT in the game and Adrian Peterson is the 17th best RB.

ikestops85
08-05-2010, 01:22 PM
There is a guy in Indy by the name of Freeney who gets paid a lot of money to rush the passer. He isn't great against the run and never covers a receiver. I think the Vikings Jared Allen parlayed his pass rushing ability into a huge payday also.

I realize that these guys are defensive ends but in essence so is Woodley ... except he is a lot more versatile than they are. Also, I have never heard an NFL scout or even an NFL analyst say a bad thing about Woodley's ability to stop the run or defend the pass. In fact I have only heard that he is constantly improving and is one of the best in the league as a linebacker.

I do remember when you used these same stats to say that Aaron Smith was losing it defending against the run and it turns out you had which side of the line they were talking about backwards. Could it be the same in this case?

Shawn
08-05-2010, 02:51 PM
i dont think he's a liabilty in either run support or pass coverage. were the people who did those rankings the same ones that rated Semi one of the 3 best RTs in the game

but, like i said in the other thread, i am also afriad of what the FO might be thinking.

maybe the FO looks at timmons factoring in with the '10 draftees on the outside

Nope...don't know where Shawn got those numbers from, but it wasn't from that ProFootballFocus site, since they rated Woodley as the #1 3-4 OLB in the league (ahead of DeMarcus Ware and James Harrison).

http://profootballfocus.com/by_position.php?tab=by_position&season=2009&pos=OLB4&stype=r&runpass=&teamid=-1&numsnaps=25&numgames=1

What do any of those numbers mean? I apologize for being slow but I don't understand the rating system and how they weight stats.

I have no idea...they seem to be pretty arbitrary if Willie Colon is the 3rd best OT in the game and Adrian Peterson is the 17th best RB.

I have seen the same players ranked very differently from site to site depending on how the weight the stats.

Slapstick
08-05-2010, 03:06 PM
Woodley will stay...Woodley is like Joey Porter without the embarrassing loudmouth...

Besides, when the Steelers move to a 4-3 after Lebeau retires ( :stirpot ) they'll probably run a 4 man line similar to Ohio State...

Last year, for example, Thaddeus Gibson played the "Leo" defensive end...on the Buckeyes 4 man line, that DE needs to have the ability to stand up and drop into coverage...when the "Leo" plays like a stand-up LB, the DT next to him has to shift to the outside and play more like a DE...last year, the player next to Gibson on the D-line was Doug Worthington...Woodley would play a very effective "Leo" on that kind of defense...

Another thing the Buckeyes did last year was play a line with 2 "Leos"...Gibson on one side and Nathan Williams on the other...when they did, their D looked an awful lot like a 3-4...

RuthlessBurgher
08-05-2010, 03:46 PM
Another thing the Buckeyes did last year was play a line with 2 "Leos"

Uh oh...the dreaded Double Leo!!!

http://www.femalefirst.co.uk/images/leonardo-dicaprio-blood.jpghttp://img261.imageshack.us/img261/2559/leovo8.jpg

RuthlessBurgher
08-05-2010, 03:52 PM
BTW, hello again everyone.

Yo, Preach.

http://cinemafique.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/cm-capture-3.png

Slapstick
08-05-2010, 06:41 PM
Uh oh...the dreaded Double Leo!!!


You laugh, but the Buckeyes beat down the Wisconsin Badgers pretty handily with the "double Leo"... :wink:

Chavezz
08-05-2010, 07:12 PM
I can't believe that it took that long for someone to point out the obvious. Losing Aaron Smith had a lot to do with the running numbers being inflated.

RuthlessBurgher
08-05-2010, 09:53 PM
Uh oh...the dreaded Double Leo!!!


You laugh, but the Buckeyes beat down the Wisconsin Badgers pretty handily with the "double Leo"... :wink:

Badgers? BADGERS??? WE DON'T NEED NO STINKING BADGERS!!!

[youtube:3rsap6p8]gx6TBrfCW54[/youtube:3rsap6p8]

stlrz d
08-05-2010, 10:12 PM
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