Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

[flippy]

Isn't it enough for Ben to be a great QB?

Why does he have to be a great person too?

I'll wear my Big Ben jersey either way.

I don't need him to be a role model.

I'd like him to steer clear of trouble so he doesn't get suspended in the future, but that's about all I expect from him.

I still think it's bs he's been suspended. Not that I personally condone anything he's allegedly done wrong. But at the same time, I don't really care what he does as long as he performs on the field.

I just want his best effort everytime he steps on the field. And I believe I've gotten that and I'll continue to get that.

I have a friend of a friend with a kid that's had cancer and has known Ben and the Rooneys. And I've heard from very reliable resources that Ben goes out of his way to make the kid feel special. And the only guy the kid thinks is nicer than Ben is Casey Hampton.

And even though I think that's great, who cares really? As long as he gives everything to bringing home more hardware for us, isn't that enough?

I'm wearing my Big Ben jersey on game 1 and I'm wearing it for SuperBowl Sunday when we bring home #7.

Don't get me wrong, if he produces for you and me and the rest of Steeler Nation, I wish him well. Heck I wish everyone well. But I could care less how Ben acts when he's not on the field. Not my concern. I don't need to even know about it really.

[Prok]

Apparently he needs to be a great person to satisfy his critics. :Blah

I'm with you. He's made me a happy Steelers fan and i always wear my Ben jersey too.

[proudpittsburgher]

Flippy, Ben doesn't have to be a great person, he just has to not be a deplorable one. I know there are two sides to every story, and there is no way that Ben is as bad a person as many are making him out to be right now, no one is. At least that is the way I am viewing it. So i am in full support mode for Ben.

But as many have pointed out, we take great pride in not being the bungles organization, that's part of what makes this team great to many of its fans. So yes, there are higher standards for character. You certainly don't have to be a choirboy, but nobody wants to root for a criminal either. Ben is no criminal, but if he goes through all of this, and thumbs his nose at the team by continuing down his path in life, i don't want him on this team anymore.

[siss]

Ben owes it to us to stay out of trouble in the off season. And He owes it to the Rooney's, who pay him a lot, to stay out of trouble. No one has ever complained about Ben when he is around children. I just want the guy I cheer for on the field to be a stand up guy off the field...

[California-Steel]

We should all try to be the best we can be. If not then you have chaos. Ben is in the public eye and if he does what he wants, no matter how small, then like it or not others will follow suit. People in Ben’s position have the power of influence, and left to act a fool will influence others on a grand scale that this is ok to do. Ben has a responsibility to be a good person, if not then for the sake of the society he has to be made an example of, good or bad.

Be good and people say, “boy I sure would like my son to be like him”. Be bad and suffer what comes with that and people will say, “Boy, he had it all and tossed it away, son, don’t be like him”.

Either way he sets an example for others to follow. He has been placed in a position of leadership. He needs to be good if not great.

[hawaiiansteel]

Ben just needs to grow up and win us our 7th Lombardi Trophy and all will be forgiven... :tt2

[flippy]

I hear what you're saying, but at the end of the day I'm a Steelers fan because I'm a fan of Pittsburgh and a fan of football.

And I love the nostalgia of simpler time in life when we were kids and care free.

I loved going to Kennywood, riding the incline, boating at the point, and going to TRS.

I love the people of Pittsburgh, the work ethic, the pierogis, the Carnegies, the Mellons, and the Rooneys.

I love the art, the architecture, the colleges, and the heritage.

As a young adult I grew to love the southside and strip districts, a primanti sammich after a night of too many beers, seeing Bruce Springsteen at Nick's Fat City, clogging some arteries Fat Heads, or even enjoying the best selection of Belgian beers on the East Coast @ the Sharp Edge.

We got to witness a Steel City turn into a city of culture, art, and technology. The entertainment around us is more influenced by Warhol than any other artist in American history. Pitt and Carnegie Mellon produce more technology for industry than all but a handful of schools. Some of the coolest medical research is happeneing at UPMC in the field of regenerative medicine.

The city is awesome and the people from Pittsburgh are some of the best people in the world I've ever met.

And nothing Ben does can detract from that collective experience and the collective experience we have watching the Steelers week in and week out.

Ben just needs to help us win. Because it's in those moments we realize and reflect on how we are all united together in common purpose.

Pittsburgh is the best town in America.

Heck it's the best town in the world.

And if I could do it all over again, you can darn well bet, I'd be a Pittsburgher all over.

Yinz are the best.

And Ben can only enhance that tradition.

But there's nothing he can do to detract from everything we are.

Who ride?

[cruzer8]

Again?

Really?

How many times must this be covered?

[SteelAbility]

Is this a standing invitation for HHM to start up with that incessant shtick again? :?

[flippy]

Again?

Really?

How many times must this be covered?

Until you come up with a better username :P

[fordfixer]

To have a six-game suspension cut to a four-game suspension

[papillon]

He doesn't have to be a great person, but he does have to obey the statutes put in place to maintain a semblance of order in our society. He's done that, but he's walking a thin line. It's just an added perk to being a Steeler fan if he behaves and acts civilized. Stay off the police blotter, adhere to the rules the NFL has in place and play football, that's all he's required to do.

Now the Rooneys may say differently, since they've invested $100 million dollars in Ben. So, if they tell him not to ride the bike w/o a helmet, to stop being a rogue to women and to stay off the police blotter in the off season; I think he owes that much to the Rooneys.

Pappy

[MeetJoeGreene]

Because.

I want it all.

I at least want to have my cake and eat it too.

But I agree w/ the some points already made. He doesn't have to be a great person - just not a total tool.

[MaxAMillion]

To each his own...if Donte Stallworth played for the Steelers, I would have a problem with it. I have a problem with supporting people who hurt other people. If Ben was convicted of rape, or if he somehow admitted to sexual assault, I would have a big problem with it.

I don't have a problem with behavior that doesn't hurt anyone else. For example, I don't really care of Santonio Holmes smokes weed. I smoked weed when I was younger and I certainly won't be a hypocrite about it. Now if you get high and start to drive then we have another problem. Holmes was accused of physical assault of a woman. I have a much bigger problem with that than weed.

I sure hope Rooney II used the allegation by the woman as reason to make that awful trade with Holmes. I have a hard time believing he would weaken the team and trade Holmes to a playoff competitor because Holmes was going to miss games for smoking weed.

[steelreserve]

He doesn't have to be a great person. Maybe not even an average one. But I have a hard time rooting for someone individually if they seem like a flat-out jerk.

Doesn't mean I don't like the team anymore. Doesn't mean I'm not glad to see Ben do well inasmuch as it helps the team succeed, either. But unless something really changes ... well, then just how excited I can get about him individually is going to have a finite limit. And I'm pretty sure that if I was watching the game at a bar and started yelling "YEAH! Big Ben -- my MAN!" when he completed a pass, I guarantee you it would devolve into "yeah, but--" within 1.5 seconds.

Yes, it still is more than a bit awkward, and obviously for a lot of fans, the line for that is not the exact same thing as the line where you're guilty of CRIMINAL conduct or not.

[hawaiiansteel]

To each his own...if Donte Stallworth played for the Steelers, I would have a problem with it. I have a problem with supporting people who hurt other people. If Ben was convicted of rape, or if he somehow admitted to sexual assault, I would have a big problem with it.





I would have a hard time if Michael Vick played for the Steelers, what he did to me is impossible to forgive...

Ben needs to grow up and not believe girls who wear DTF stickers are sincere, but i have no problem with forgiving him for that.

[HeHateMe]

Sorry Rape is WORSE than killing dogs. What is the penalty for Rape in the Bible? It is DEATH. Of course cruelty to animals or anything is wrong, not condoning that at all. Of course Ben is innocent in the judicial system but.... everyone is prison is not guilty and everyone free is not innocent. We have ALL gotten away with crimes that we were never charged for but that doesn't mean we didn't do anything. But IF holding onto the "he wasn't charged" card makes you feel better then so be it. But If the Ben situation was the Carson Palmer situation I have a feeling that you all would not feel the same about the situations and to me that is sheer hypocrisy. Remember this cry? "RAY LEWIS IS A MURDERER!" That cry came from Steeler fans. Where were the Steelers fans who say "Why does Lewis have to be a great person? As long as he is good on the field?" And Please save the "Ben is a Steeler we back our own". Thats fine but do you back them to the point of lying for them, turning a blind eye and being dishonest? Perhaps.

[SteelAbility]

Sorry Rape is WORSE than killing dogs. What is the penalty for Rape in the Bible? It is DEATH. Of course cruelty to animals or anything is wrong, not condoning that at all. Of course Ben is innocent in the judicial system but.... everyone is prison is not guilty and everyone free is not innocent. We have ALL gotten away with crimes that we were never charged for but that doesn't mean we didn't do anything. But IF holding onto the "he wasn't charged" card makes you feel better then so be it. But If the Ben situation was the Carson Palmer situation I have a feeling that you all would not feel the same about the situations and to me that is sheer hypocrisy. Remember this cry? "RAY LEWIS IS A MURDERER!" That cry came from Steeler fans. Where were the Steelers fans who say "Why does Lewis have to be a great person? As long as he is good on the field?" And Please save the "Ben is a Steeler we back our own". Thats fine but do you back them to the point of lying for them, turning a blind eye and being dishonest? Perhaps.

According to the Bible, what "you and I" consider to be the smallest sin is worthy of death. Secondly, the Bible prescribes death for a man who rapes a woman who is either married or pledged to be married. If he rapes an unmarried woman then he has to marry her if he's caught.

Now, that being said, you have a bit of a conundrum on your hands. The Steeler organization is backing Ben right now. So, if you are going to root for the Steelers, follow them and go through with the standard support you have for the Steelers, then you are supporting the organization that backs Ben, a man whom you consider to be a vile rapist. So, whether consciously or sub-consciously, if you support the Steelers, then you are supporting Ben. So, get off this stupid-@$$ high-horse you are on and come back down to Earth. If you are going to preach against Ben, then you also have to preach against the Steelers and boycott them since they back Ben. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS HERE. Anything else is just spinning words and hypocrisy, something you seem to be very quick to others of and with seemingly lots of glee. :loser

[Shawn]

Isn't it enough for Ben to be a great QB?

Why does he have to be a great person too?

I'll wear my Big Ben jersey either way.

I don't need him to be a role model.

I'd like him to steer clear of trouble so he doesn't get suspended in the future, but that's about all I expect from him.

I still think it's bs he's been suspended. Not that I personally condone anything he's allegedly done wrong. But at the same time, I don't really care what he does as long as he performs on the field.

I just want his best effort everytime he steps on the field. And I believe I've gotten that and I'll continue to get that.

I have a friend of a friend with a kid that's had cancer and has known Ben and the Rooneys. And I've heard from very reliable resources that Ben goes out of his way to make the kid feel special. And the only guy the kid thinks is nicer than Ben is Casey Hampton.

And even though I think that's great, who cares really? As long as he gives everything to bringing home more hardware for us, isn't that enough?

I'm wearing my Big Ben jersey on game 1 and I'm wearing it for SuperBowl Sunday when we bring home #7.

Don't get me wrong, if he produces for you and me and the rest of Steeler Nation, I wish him well. Heck I wish everyone well. But I could care less how Ben acts when he's not on the field. Not my concern. I don't need to even know about it really.

:Clap

The reason people care is very complex but I think the main one is fans like to elevate football to something more important than it is...a game. It's merely a game we enjoy watching. What Ben does off the field is not my concern unless it effects his game.

For those who have an issue cheering for a team with a "bad guy" on it. Well you probably need to stop watching football. Every team has a player or two...maybe not with Ben press but issues none the less. The Steelers do not reflect on me as a person. They do not effect my self esteem. When they fail...it doesn't mean I fail. When I cheer for them it doesn't mean I condone some of their off the field actions. I honestly don't get the fascination.

[Shawn]

Sorry Rape is WORSE than killing dogs. What is the penalty for Rape in the Bible? It is DEATH. Of course cruelty to animals or anything is wrong, not condoning that at all. Of course Ben is innocent in the judicial system but.... everyone is prison is not guilty and everyone free is not innocent. We have ALL gotten away with crimes that we were never charged for but that doesn't mean we didn't do anything. But IF holding onto the "he wasn't charged" card makes you feel better then so be it. But If the Ben situation was the Carson Palmer situation I have a feeling that you all would not feel the same about the situations and to me that is sheer hypocrisy. Remember this cry? "RAY LEWIS IS A MURDERER!" That cry came from Steeler fans. Where were the Steelers fans who say "Why does Lewis have to be a great person? As long as he is good on the field?" And Please save the "Ben is a Steeler we back our own". Thats fine but do you back them to the point of lying for them, turning a blind eye and being dishonest? Perhaps.

According to the Bible, what "you and I" consider to be the smallest sin is worthy of death. Secondly, the Bible prescribes death for a man who rapes a woman who is either married or pledged to be married. If he rapes an unmarried woman then he has to marry her if he's caught.

Now, that being said, you have a bit of a conundrum on your hands. The Steeler organization is backing Ben right now. So, if you are going to root for the Steelers, follow them and go through with the standard support you have for the Steelers, then you are supporting the organization that backs Ben, a man whom you consider to be a vile rapist. So, whether consciously or sub-consciously, if you support the Steelers, then you are supporting Ben. So, get off this stupid-@$$ high-horse you are on and come back down to Earth. If you are going to preach against Ben, then you also have to preach against the Steelers and boycott them since they back Ben. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS HERE. Anything else is just spinning words and hypocrisy, something you seem to be very quick to others of and with seemingly lots of glee. :loser


Why even address the ignorance?

[Shawn]

To each his own...if Donte Stallworth played for the Steelers, I would have a problem with it. I have a problem with supporting people who hurt other people. If Ben was convicted of rape, or if he somehow admitted to sexual assault, I would have a big problem with it.

I don't have a problem with behavior that doesn't hurt anyone else. For example, I don't really care of Santonio Holmes smokes weed. I smoked weed when I was younger and I certainly won't be a hypocrite about it. Now if you get high and start to drive then we have another problem. Holmes was accused of physical assault of a woman. I have a much bigger problem with that than weed.

I sure hope Rooney II used the allegation by the woman as reason to make that awful trade with Holmes. I have a hard time believing he would weaken the team and trade Holmes to a playoff competitor because Holmes was going to miss games for smoking weed.

You are supporting the team...not the person. If you don't want to wear his jersey that is well within your right. But, the Steelers are stocked with quality character.

[proudpittsburgher]

Sorry Rape is WORSE than killing dogs. What is the penalty for Rape in the Bible? It is DEATH. Of course cruelty to animals or anything is wrong, not condoning that at all. Of course Ben is innocent in the judicial system but.... everyone is prison is not guilty and everyone free is not innocent. We have ALL gotten away with crimes that we were never charged for but that doesn't mean we didn't do anything. But IF holding onto the "he wasn't charged" card makes you feel better then so be it. But If the Ben situation was the Carson Palmer situation I have a feeling that you all would not feel the same about the situations and to me that is sheer hypocrisy. Remember this cry? "RAY LEWIS IS A MURDERER!" That cry came from Steeler fans. Where were the Steelers fans who say "Why does Lewis have to be a great person? As long as he is good on the field?" And Please save the "Ben is a Steeler we back our own". Thats fine but do you back them to the point of lying for them, turning a blind eye and being dishonest? Perhaps.

According to the Bible, what "you and I" consider to be the smallest sin is worthy of death. Secondly, the Bible prescribes death for a man who rapes a woman who is either married or pledged to be married. If he rapes an unmarried woman then he has to marry her if he's caught.

Now, that being said, you have a bit of a conundrum on your hands. The Steeler organization is backing Ben right now. So, if you are going to root for the Steelers, follow them and go through with the standard support you have for the Steelers, then you are supporting the organization that backs Ben, a man whom you consider to be a vile rapist. So, whether consciously or sub-consciously, if you support the Steelers, then you are supporting Ben. So, get off this stupid-@$$ high-horse you are on and come back down to Earth. If you are going to preach against Ben, then you also have to preach against the Steelers and boycott them since they back Ben. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS HERE. Anything else is just spinning words and hypocrisy, something you seem to be very quick to others of and with seemingly lots of glee. :loser


Why even address the ignorance?


There used to be a guy on the Pirates board who ran with the same schtick ove ran dover. At first, we thought he was open fo rlegitimate discussion, but we soon found out that no matter what we said, or how we moved th epoint along, he kept going back tot he same thing over and over and over and over again. This appears to be the same.

[flippy]

Sorry Rape is WORSE than killing dogs. What is the penalty for Rape in the Bible? It is DEATH. Of course cruelty to animals or anything is wrong, not condoning that at all. Of course Ben is innocent in the judicial system but.... everyone is prison is not guilty and everyone free is not innocent. We have ALL gotten away with crimes that we were never charged for but that doesn't mean we didn't do anything. But IF holding onto the "he wasn't charged" card makes you feel better then so be it. But If the Ben situation was the Carson Palmer situation I have a feeling that you all would not feel the same about the situations and to me that is sheer hypocrisy. Remember this cry? "RAY LEWIS IS A MURDERER!" That cry came from Steeler fans. Where were the Steelers fans who say "Why does Lewis have to be a great person? As long as he is good on the field?" And Please save the "Ben is a Steeler we back our own". Thats fine but do you back them to the point of lying for them, turning a blind eye and being dishonest? Perhaps.

According to the Bible, what "you and I" consider to be the smallest sin is worthy of death. Secondly, the Bible prescribes death for a man who rapes a woman who is either married or pledged to be married. If he rapes an unmarried woman then he has to marry her if he's caught.

Now, that being said, you have a bit of a conundrum on your hands. The Steeler organization is backing Ben right now. So, if you are going to root for the Steelers, follow them and go through with the standard support you have for the Steelers, then you are supporting the organization that backs Ben, a man whom you consider to be a vile rapist. So, whether consciously or sub-consciously, if you support the Steelers, then you are supporting Ben. So, get off this stupid-@$$ high-horse you are on and come back down to Earth. If you are going to preach against Ben, then you also have to preach against the Steelers and boycott them since they back Ben. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS HERE. Anything else is just spinning words and hypocrisy, something you seem to be very quick to others of and with seemingly lots of glee. :loser


Why even address the ignorance?


There used to be a guy on the Pirates board who ran with the same schtick ove ran dover. At first, we thought he was open fo rlegitimate discussion, but we soon found out that no matter what we said, or how we moved th epoint along, he kept going back tot he same thing over and over and over and over again. This appears to be the same.

In fairness, it is the Pirates and they keep losing over and over and over again.

Every day I look at my Roberto Clemente memorabilia in my man room and wonder if he's real or I just dreamed him up one day as a kid. If Roberto was in Pittsburgh today, we would just trade him for a couple of crummy minor league pitching prospects and a left handed hitter with no power.

[ricardisimo]

If Ben were a Raider or a Bunghole, I think you'd be viewing his troubles with a different eye. He's a Steeler, so many in the Nation are looking for nuance where there probably is none.

On the plus side, a few lines in Ed Bouchette's recent chat and a few other articles scattered throughout the Pittsburgh media suggested to me that a) Ben is "getting it"; and b) he may be in a Program now - 12-Step or another variety - which would be great news for all of us.

I'm not in any program myself, so I'm not 100% certain... just a hunch. There's sort of "code" that Program people use, which I've picked up from friends and acquaintances and I thought I detected some of that.

[Lonbull]

Flippy -

I hear what you're saying - and I think this is a great question -

But my question in return is - Where do you draw the line?

Can Ben get away with murder and it's okay?
Theft?
Rape?

If he cuts the fingers off of blind children at night but wins games on Sundays are you okay with that?

Again where do you draw the line.

Currently we have two women who have claimed sexual assault - but haven't had the legal system completely behind them - so currently the only thing I see on record is that Ben has had sex with women he shouldn't have been with....I'm in no position to really hold that against him. And I doubt many of you are either, especially SteelerofDeville you just know that guy was a playa at some point - :P

However - Here's a person who represents the city of Pittsburgh, in fact many would argue Ben Roethlisberger IS the face of Pittsburgh right now - a city you said has great people and in your opinion is the greatest place on earth - as a representative of that city I expect him to live up to those standards.

From the looks of it Ben Roethlisberger's ego is out of control - and I would love for him to get that in check, however huge ego isn't exactly a new thing in pro sports - so hopefully he'll mature in that regard.

I guess where you and I "might" be different is that when Michael Irvin was getting caught for Cocaine issues, BUT winning Super Bowls - I wouldn't have wanted him, and it sounds like you don't care.

But to me when I invest my time, money and support into a business like the Steelers I expect them to win off the field as well.

IMO - Ben Roethlisberger doesn't HAVE to be great - but with his ability, resources and profile trying to be anything less than great is just lazy or misguided on his part.

L.B.

[NJ-STEELER]

To get in a "better light"

he needs to get a girlfriend. knock her up , then leave her for another woman and when he marries her...have his bodyguards shoot their guns at the paperazzi trying to get pictures of them

[flippy]

Flippy -

I hear what you're saying - and I think this is a great question -

But my question in return is - Where do you draw the line?

Can Ben get away with murder and it's okay?
Theft?
Rape?

If he cuts the fingers off of blind children at night but wins games on Sundays are you okay with that?

Again where do you draw the line.

Currently we have two women who have claimed sexual assault - but haven't had the legal system completely behind them - so currently the only thing I see on record is that Ben has had sex with women he shouldn't have been with....I'm in no position to really hold that against him. And I doubt many of you are either, especially SteelerofDeville you just know that guy was a playa at some point - :P

However - Here's a person who represents the city of Pittsburgh, in fact many would argue Ben Roethlisberger IS the face of Pittsburgh right now - a city you said has great people and in your opinion is the greatest place on earth - as a representative of that city I expect him to live up to those standards.

From the looks of it Ben Roethlisberger's ego is out of control - and I would love for him to get that in check, however huge ego isn't exactly a new thing in pro sports - so hopefully he'll mature in that regard.

I guess where you and I "might" be different is that when Michael Irvin was getting caught for Cocaine issues, BUT winning Super Bowls - I wouldn't have wanted him, and it sounds like you don't care.

But to me when I invest my time, money and support into a business like the Steelers I expect them to win off the field as well.

IMO - Ben Roethlisberger doesn't HAVE to be great - but with his ability, resources and profile trying to be anything less than great is just lazy or misguided on his part.

L.B.

I think the line should be where it starts to impact his game.

I'm a fan of the team, the city, the colors, the games. And I wish the best for these guys off the field considering they bring us enjoyment.

But at the end of the day, their personal life is their personal life. And I'm never gonna know these guys personally.

And it kinda sucks for the modern athlete or person in the public eye that we hold them to impossible standards really. We want them to be perfect. And we know everything about them.

I guess I'm not really condoning anything he does or doesn't do off the field. I just long for the older days when football was simply football and the off field stuff wasn't a part of it.

And why do we decide to look so closely at some people's personal lives and not others? Seems like all football players should be treated the same to some degree.

We're all messed up in some way.

[Prok]

One thing i've never bought into but still am fascinated with is the "Steeler way" or "Steeler character" myth.

I put us all in the category of USA residents. Therefore in my world, we are all Americans.

But it fascinates me as to how many Steelers fans are so stubborn and unforgiving in ways

To me, what Ben got in such trouble for in the almighty court of public opinion, is just partying in a college bar. Yeah he needed to grow out of that stage as did a BUNCH of us American males at his age. But it's nothing to condemn him for IMO. We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

[papillon]

One thing i've never bought into but still am fascinated with is the "Steeler way" or "Steeler character" myth.

I put us all in the category of USA residents. Therefore in my world, we are all Americans.

But it fascinates me as to how many Steelers fans are so stubborn and unforgiving in ways

To me, what Ben got in such trouble for in the almighty court of public opinion, is just partying in a college bar. Yeah he needed to grow out of that stage as did a BUNCH of us American males at his age. But it's nothing to condemn him for IMO. We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

I chastised him for poor decision making and not being responsible for himself or taking the responsibility given to him by the Steelers serious enough. That being said, once everyone started piling on like he was a serial murderer I became staunch Ben supporter when it comes to this matter.

He still holds the ball too long... :stirpot

Pappy

[Prok]

One thing i've never bought into but still am fascinated with is the "Steeler way" or "Steeler character" myth.

I put us all in the category of USA residents. Therefore in my world, we are all Americans.

But it fascinates me as to how many Steelers fans are so stubborn and unforgiving in ways

To me, what Ben got in such trouble for in the almighty court of public opinion, is just partying in a college bar. Yeah he needed to grow out of that stage as did a BUNCH of us American males at his age. But it's nothing to condemn him for IMO. We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

I chastised him for poor decision making and not being responsible for himself or taking the responsibility given to him by the Steelers serious enough. That being said, once everyone started piling on like he was a serial murderer I became staunch Ben supporter when it comes to this matter.

He still holds the ball too long... :stirpot

Pappy

lol And he takes too many sacks too !! :Binky

My initial response when this all broke was dammit he's in the news for this a SECOND time ?? I was and am still upset over that. That is his own damn fault. But we need to let him learn from mistakes as well. It was 14 yrs ago but i was once a 28 yr od hanging out at college bars too. I think alot of us can relate.

[NKySteeler]

To me, what Ben got in such trouble for in the almighty court of public opinion, is just partying in a college bar. Yeah he needed to grow out of that stage as did a BUNCH of us American males at his age. But it's nothing to condemn him for IMO. We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

The problem with this is that WE are not paid millions of dollars to play a sport. Nor are we under contract within an organization/league that has such clauses relating to our conduct... For that situation that Ben is in, it makes all similar comparisons to us "normal" folk a completely different situation... If it is a printed "conduct clause" (which it is), and Ben violates it, then there is a price to pay.

I'm not down on Ben (at least not too much)... But at this point, I just want to see production on the field telling me he's "earning his money" from his contract... Beyond that, I really don't care.

[feltdizz]

Why does Ben need to be a bad person? :stirpot

Just sayin... Ben doesn't have to be Mother Theresa but he doesn't have to be a "publicity nightmare" and damage our team's image and chances of winning games. Ben is lucky to fall toa team who had everything but a clutch QB... but I think he is down to his last "off field incident"

The fame takes away a lot of the everyday freedoms but the compensation is lovely. This isn't the NBA or the MLB... the contracts are not guaranteed.

[NJ-STEELER]

One thing i've never bought into but still am fascinated with is the "Steeler way" or "Steeler character" myth.

I put us all in the category of USA residents. Therefore in my world, we are all Americans.

But it fascinates me as to how many Steelers fans are so stubborn and unforgiving in ways

To me, what Ben got in such trouble for in the almighty court of public opinion, is just partying in a college bar. Yeah he needed to grow out of that stage as did a BUNCH of us American males at his age. But it's nothing to condemn him for IMO. We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

I chastised him for poor decision making and not being responsible for himself or taking the responsibility given to him by the Steelers serious enough. That being said, once everyone started piling on like he was a serial murderer I became staunch Ben supporter when it comes to this matter.

He still holds the ball too long... :stirpot

Pappy

It was 14 yrs ago but i was once a 28 yr od hanging out at college bars too. I think alot of us can relate.

you should of been here when the news first broke. there were plenty complaining of that on here

[eniparadoxgma]

Isn't it enough for Ben to be a great QB?

Why does he have to be a great person too?

I'll wear my Big Ben jersey either way.

I don't need him to be a role model.

I'd like him to steer clear of trouble so he doesn't get suspended in the future, but that's about all I expect from him.

I still think it's bs he's been suspended. Not that I personally condone anything he's allegedly done wrong. But at the same time, I don't really care what he does as long as he performs on the field.

I just want his best effort everytime he steps on the field. And I believe I've gotten that and I'll continue to get that.

I have a friend of a friend with a kid that's had cancer and has known Ben and the Rooneys. And I've heard from very reliable resources that Ben goes out of his way to make the kid feel special. And the only guy the kid thinks is nicer than Ben is Casey Hampton.

And even though I think that's great, who cares really? As long as he gives everything to bringing home more hardware for us, isn't that enough?

I'm wearing my Big Ben jersey on game 1 and I'm wearing it for SuperBowl Sunday when we bring home #7.

Don't get me wrong, if he produces for you and me and the rest of Steeler Nation, I wish him well. Heck I wish everyone well. But I could care less how Ben acts when he's not on the field. Not my concern. I don't need to even know about it really.

I don't care if Ben does things like bang college chicks, cheats on his wife, smokes herb, tries to evade his taxes, or things like that. I DO care if he was to actually literally rape a woman, molest a kid, abuse a dog, murder an innocent, etc. There are certain things I am completely incapable of being able to look past and will never be able to condone.

[ikestops85]

I don't care if Ben does things like bang college chicks, cheats on his wife, smokes herb, tries to evade his taxes, or things like that. I DO care if he was to actually literally rape a woman, molest a kid, abuse a dog, murder an innocent, etc. There are certain things I am completely incapable of being able to look past and will never be able to condone.

Well put E. If Ben did rape or sexually assault a women then put him in prison and throw away the key. There is no evidence that he has done that.

I am more pissed at Harrison for what he did than I am at Ben. Harrison knocked around a women which to me is more heinous than anything Michael Vick ever did! I love the effort Harrison puts forth every game but I don't like the fact that he is a steeler. JMHO.

[HeHateMe]

Sorry Rape is WORSE than killing dogs. What is the penalty for Rape in the Bible? It is DEATH. Of course cruelty to animals or anything is wrong, not condoning that at all. Of course Ben is innocent in the judicial system but.... everyone is prison is not guilty and everyone free is not innocent. We have ALL gotten away with crimes that we were never charged for but that doesn't mean we didn't do anything. But IF holding onto the "he wasn't charged" card makes you feel better then so be it. But If the Ben situation was the Carson Palmer situation I have a feeling that you all would not feel the same about the situations and to me that is sheer hypocrisy. Remember this cry? "RAY LEWIS IS A MURDERER!" That cry came from Steeler fans. Where were the Steelers fans who say "Why does Lewis have to be a great person? As long as he is good on the field?" And Please save the "Ben is a Steeler we back our own". Thats fine but do you back them to the point of lying for them, turning a blind eye and being dishonest? Perhaps.

According to the Bible, what "you and I" consider to be the smallest sin is worthy of death. Secondly, the Bible prescribes death for a man who rapes a woman who is either married or pledged to be married. If he rapes an unmarried woman then he has to marry her if he's caught.

Now, that being said, you have a bit of a conundrum on your hands. The Steeler organization is backing Ben right now. So, if you are going to root for the Steelers, follow them and go through with the standard support you have for the Steelers, then you are supporting the organization that backs Ben, a man whom you consider to be a vile rapist. So, whether consciously or sub-consciously, if you support the Steelers, then you are supporting Ben. So, get off this stupid-@$$ high-horse you are on and come back down to Earth. If you are going to preach against Ben, then you also have to preach against the Steelers and boycott them since they back Ben. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS HERE. Anything else is just spinning words and hypocrisy, something you seem to be very quick to others of and with seemingly lots of glee. :loser
That is incorrect. Only MAJOR sins like Rape, Murder, Adultery and child molestation carry the penalty of Death. You say I 'think" Ben is a vile Rapist. I just feel Ben acted like a guilty man would. He lied, he remained silent and he acted TOTALLY DIFFERENT than he did in the Mcnulty incident (with Mcnulty he seemed MIGHTY innocent). How come he didnt sue the Georgia woman for defamation like he did Mcnulty? Hmmm
Anyways, JUST because the Steeler brass stands behind him (reluctantly I might add) doesnt mean the Steeler Nation has to. Lets apply YOUR logic. So does that mean that I am in the Same Tax bracket as the Rooneys? Does that mean that I can attend the winter Meetings? Does that Mean that I have a vote on new rules? Does that mean that I can profit in revenue sharing? No it does not and why not? Because I and the Steelers brass are a seperate entity. But your analogy was cute. Tell fans to remember your analogy when Bashing Arians. Ok? Loser? Sticks and Stones bro.

[steelblood]

Ben has done some very nice charitable things. But, that doesn't mean he isn't a huge jerk. I don't get that argument at all.

We'll never know the real story about what happened in midgeville. There will never be a resolution that puts this to rest. Ben will deal with this for the rest of his career.

[Prok]

I don't care if Ben does things like bang college chicks, cheats on his wife, smokes herb, tries to evade his taxes, or things like that. I DO care if he was to actually literally rape a woman, molest a kid, abuse a dog, murder an innocent, etc. There are certain things I am completely incapable of being able to look past and will never be able to condone.

Well put E. If Ben did rape or sexually assault a women then put him in prison and throw away the key. There is no evidence that he has done that.

I am more pissed at Harrison for what he did than I am at Ben. Harrison knocked around a women which to me is more heinous than anything Michael Vick ever did! I love the effort Harrison puts forth every game but I don't like the fact that he is a steeler. JMHO.

Can't argue that. It's fact that Harrison hit a woman.

For as great a play as he made to help us win our last SB I was extremely upset with him losing his temper and getting that costly personal foul penalty near the end as well. Ya just don't lose your temper that badly in that situation IMO. I was screaming at the TV. Ike's penalty was just as bad IMO too.

[HeHateMe]

Flippy -

I hear what you're saying - and I think this is a great question -

But my question in return is - Where do you draw the line?

Can Ben get away with murder and it's okay?
Theft?
Rape?

If he cuts the fingers off of blind children at night but wins games on Sundays are you okay with that?

Again where do you draw the line.

Currently we have two women who have claimed sexual assault - but haven't had the legal system completely behind them - so currently the only thing I see on record is that Ben has had sex with women he shouldn't have been with....I'm in no position to really hold that against him. And I doubt many of you are either, especially SteelerofDeville you just know that guy was a playa at some point - :P

However - Here's a person who represents the city of Pittsburgh, in fact many would argue Ben Roethlisberger IS the face of Pittsburgh right now - a city you said has great people and in your opinion is the greatest place on earth - as a representative of that city I expect him to live up to those standards.

From the looks of it Ben Roethlisberger's ego is out of control - and I would love for him to get that in check, however huge ego isn't exactly a new thing in pro sports - so hopefully he'll mature in that regard.

I guess where you and I "might" be different is that when Michael Irvin was getting caught for Cocaine issues, BUT winning Super Bowls - I wouldn't have wanted him, and it sounds like you don't care.

But to me when I invest my time, money and support into a business like the Steelers I expect them to win off the field as well.

IMO - Ben Roethlisberger doesn't HAVE to be great - but with his ability, resources and profile trying to be anything less than great is just lazy or misguided on his part.

L.B.

+1000

[HeHateMe]

Ask the Rooneys who they took a bigger PR hit from Harrison or Ben. I GUARANTEE it will be the latter. Ben screwed himself, everytime he walks into a bar the women will start whispering and pointing. Not good.

[cruzer8]

I don't care if Ben does things like bang college chicks, cheats on his wife, smokes herb, tries to evade his taxes, or things like that. I DO care if he was to actually literally rape a woman, molest a kid, abuse a dog, murder an innocent, etc. There are certain things I am completely incapable of being able to look past and will never be able to condone.

Well put E. If Ben did rape or sexually assault a women then put him in prison and throw away the key. There is no evidence that he has done that.

I am more pissed at Harrison for what he did than I am at Ben. Harrison knocked around a women which to me is more heinous than anything Michael Vick ever did! I love the effort Harrison puts forth every game but I don't like the fact that he is a steeler. JMHO.

Millions of men have made that mistake once and learned from it. Has James done it again? To condemn someone for life due to a brief moment of insanity that didn't result in death or serious harm to another is foolish, imo.

[Prok]

And BTW i'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say that Ben IS a great person. None of us really know what he's like away from football but i'm basing my judgement on what i see from him in inteviews and PC's and the couple times i got to talk with him at training camp. Just my opinion, of course.

Back in '95 my niece and I were HUGE Neil O'donnell fans. We actually saw him at TC that summer and couldn't even get him to say hello to us OR stop for a quick pic. That still irk's me a bit.

[JTP53609]

Now, I really do not have a strong opinon one way or another on Ben, but if Flacco or Palmer were to be in Big Bens shoes right now, how many in here would be refering to them as rapists??

[steelblood]

We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

We would know? How? It is possible that he came to a private settlement with her in which she agreed not to prosecute. It is possible that he raped her (in the Georgia legal system's sense of the word) and then made it go away.

I don't believe this is the case. But, it is possible.

[cruzer8]

We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

We would know? How? It is possible that he came to a private settlement with her in which she agreed not to prosecute. It is possible that he raped her (in the Georgia legal system's sense of the word) and then made it go away.

I don't believe this is the case. But, it is possible.

It is also possible, like the accuser's representative said, that the family did not want the media attention associated with a trial. It's possible they knew they wouldn't win and decided it wasn't worth the expense and attention to even try.

[NJ-STEELER]

We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

We would know? How? It is possible that he came to a private settlement with her in which she agreed not to prosecute. .

wouldn't that lead to the theory that she was out for a money grab from the start?

[Prok]

We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

We would know? How? It is possible that he came to a private settlement with her in which she agreed not to prosecute. .

wouldn't that lead to the theory that she was out for a money grab from the start?

If they had ample proof the DA even said they would have pursued charges reguardles. Not sure how that fact gets overlooked. Either way, it's been time for us to move on for quite some time now.

It's over as far as i'm concerned.

[HeHateMe]

How can the Prosecutor proceed if the ACCUSER is not willing to go through with it? Thats like a Head coach trying to coach a game and the players wont come out of the tunnel.

[HeHateMe]

Now, I really do not have a strong opinon one way or another on Ben, but if Flacco or Palmer were to be in Big Bens shoes right now, how many in here would be refering to them as rapists??
EXACTLY

[HeHateMe]

We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

We would know? How? It is possible that he came to a private settlement with her in which she agreed not to prosecute. It is possible that he raped her (in the Georgia legal system's sense of the word) and then made it go away.

I don't believe this is the case. But, it is possible.
Agreed

[eniparadoxgma]

How can the Prosecutor proceed if the ACCUSER is not willing to go through with it? Thats like a Head coach trying to coach a game and the players wont come out of the tunnel.

Dude, either you're lying about working in the criminal justice field or you need to go back to school for it. The fact is that the state can proceed without the accuser if they so choose. This. happens. all. the. time.

[HeHateMe]

We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

We would know? How? It is possible that he came to a private settlement with her in which she agreed not to prosecute. It is possible that he raped her (in the Georgia legal system's sense of the word) and then made it go away.

I don't believe this is the case. But, it is possible.

It is also possible, like the accuser's representative said, that the family did not want the media attention associated with a trial. It's possible they knew they wouldn't win and decided it wasn't worth the expense and attention to even try.

If that was the case then WHY not decide the next day or the next week to bow out? Why wait as long as they did and then back out? You never heard of rich people using their money to their benefit? If you were rich and in danger of going to prison you are telling me YOU wouldn't use your money to help yourself? IF Ben did use his money it is the smartest thing he has done in a long time.

[Prok]

Here's a good read about the whole situation. Pretty well sums it up IMO.

http://ludwig.squarespace.com/politics- ... erger.html (http://ludwig.squarespace.com/politics-journal/2010/4/15/the-media-lynching-of-ben-roethlisberger.html)

Thanks to the folks at SU for finding this.

[Prok]

How can the Prosecutor proceed if the ACCUSER is not willing to go through with it? Thats like a Head coach trying to coach a game and the players wont come out of the tunnel.

Dude, either you're lying about working in the criminal justice field or you need to go back to school for it. The fact is that the state can proceed without the accuser if they so choose. This. happens. all. the. time.

Bingo. There will not be any more response from me on this. it's insanity to keep arguing this imo.

http://www.postgameheroes.com/?p=9023

[stlrz d]

Now, I really do not have a strong opinon one way or another on Ben, but if Flacco or Palmer were to be in Big Bens shoes right now, how many in here would be refering to them as rapists??

I don't know how many would be, but I know the smart ones wouldn't be. :)

[NJ-STEELER]

We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

We would know? How? It is possible that he came to a private settlement with her in which she agreed not to prosecute. .

wouldn't that lead to the theory that she was out for a money grab from the start?

If they had ample proof the DA even said they would have pursued charges reguardles. Not sure how that fact gets overlooked. Either way, it's been time for us to move on for quite some time now.

It's over as far as i'm concerned.

you dont have to sell me on that. or the DA's own words about "not prosecuting morals, we prosecute Crimes"

unfortunately, some are too stupid to interpret the point blank words of the man responsible to file a charge

in addition to (unforunately for them) not being around any partying college aged girls the last 25 years +