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NJ-STEELER
04-16-2010, 06:20 PM
http://ludwig.squarespace.com/politics- ... erger.html (http://ludwig.squarespace.com/politics-journal/2010/4/15/the-media-lynching-of-ben-roethlisberger.html)


The media is lynching Roethlisberger. The reporting isn't factual; it's an ideological and contrived version of events. People are printing the stuff that supports their bias or that has shock value. I've seen reports that the girl was dragged into the room by the "bodyguard." I've seen reports that she tried to exit the building because he had exposed himself, but she ended up accidentally going into the bathroom. I've seen all sorts of irresponsible claims: "victim told him 'no.'" And that, "she immediately reported it." What is the goal -- to lynch Roethlisberger?

What if, instead, the story had said this:

CHRONOLOGY:

1. The DA indicated that both parties were exchanging sexual comments (that he would not repeat in public, because of their graphic nature). He did confirm, however, that, "There were conversations, actions -- and it was a two-way street, It was. When I say a two-way street -- him to her, her to him -- [it was] of a sexual nature." 7:35, DA-interview. PART-4. http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apBOClZNRzY)

2. The accuser and her sorority sisters were wearing stickers that "had 'DTF' written on the bottom of the name tag ... [which] stood for 'down to ****.'" See Page 4 of 6 of police report, exhibit 16. http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ye ... ger15.html (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2010/0415101roethlisberger15.html)

3. The accuser was heavily intoxicated. [numerous sources].

4. The accuser was led down a hall to a bathroom. DA News Conference, PART-1, 3:10. http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liHs6C7ajzg)

5. The bathroom had crampt quarters -- less than 5 foot wide single-commode bathroom. DA News Conference, PART-1 http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liHs6C7ajzg)

7. Police staement: "Roethlisberger explained to Aurila that nothing had happened and that Roethlisberger was in the back with a girl and they were "messing around." Roethlsberger then explained that the girl slipped and he helped her up and then came back out. Aurila stated that he took "messing around" to mean" kissing, whatever. ... Roethlisberger indicated to Aurila that the girl had slipped and that he had helped her up and once Roethlisberger had helped her up he told the girl that they were not going to continue." ("During the conversation, Aurila described Roethlisberger's demeanor as angry and shocked that this [the accusation] was happening.")-- Police report, pg. 5 of 7, http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ye ... ger19.html (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2010/0415101roethlisberger19.html)

6. The accuser had a "superficial laceration" in the genital area, described by DA as consistent with having sex. (Or slipping while having it?). DA interview, PART-1 at 3:50. http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liHs6C7ajzg)

8. THE ACCUSER NEVER REPORTED A RAPE. It was never the accuser who said it was a rape; it was her sorority sisters who felt she was too drunk to be fraternizing with him. So they acted based upon that judgment. THEY are the ones who alleged it. They told the police this. See DA news conference, PART-2, starts 2:42 and key part at about 3:10: http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaRGdYizw7g)

-- From the DA conference: "The Sorority Sisters were doing the talking [making the accusation]." DA interview, PART-2, starts 2:42 and key part at about 4:00: http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html See also, DA interview, PART-3, 10:20 http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PsdE_KudoY)

When the officer on the spot said "I need to talk to the alleged victim, not you," he asked the alleged victim if Roethlisberger had raped her. She said:

(A). "No." DA news conference; PART 2, starts 2:42, key point: about 4:10: http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html

-- When asked if the two had sex, she said "well, I'm not sure." DA interview, PART 2, starts 2:42, key point: about 4:20: http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaRGdYizw7g)

(B) She gave a statement that night to police that said, "They met us at the Brick and called us a 'tease.' .... His body guards took him back to the rooms in 1 bathroom. I said, 'I don't know if this is a good idea,' and he said, "it's ok.' He had sex with me ... ." See Police report: march 4th. http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/ye ... rger3.html (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2010/0415101roethlisberger3.html)

(C) At the hospital that night, she said "a boy kinda raped me." DA interview, PART-2 at 6:00. http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaRGdYizw7g)

(D). The next day, she offered this story: "I told him it wasn't okay, no, we don't need to do this, and I proceeded to get up and try to leave. I went to the first door I saw, which happened to be a bathroom. He followed me into the bathroom, and shut the door behind him. I still said no, this is not okay. And he then had sex with me. He said it was okay" DA interview, PART-2 5:25. http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaRGdYizw7g)

[Note several things. 1. This suggested they started having sex OUTSIDE the bathroom. This contradicts the eyewitness claims that she was led to the bathroom by an escort.** 2. It also selectively fixes earlier statements. It fixes equivocation while retaining other things as accurate (e.g., "he said it was okay."). In other words, what helps her is accurate, what doesn't is fixed].

**Further support of this "problem." DA said there is no evidence of sex being had outside of the bathroom. No one in the VIP area of any entourage or any body guard saw anything like that. In fact, one body guard said she asked to use the restroom and was escorted back there and sat at a stool. (He didn't even see Ben go back there). See: DA CONFERENCE, PART-3, starting at 8:30. http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PsdE_KudoY)

(E) On March 17th, through her attorney, she says she doesn't want to go forward with it. [You will note that the vast majority of civil plaintiffs want criminal cases going on concurrently. Any lawyer will tell you why a civil plaintiff would want a criminal case going forward concurrently. One must assume that her reluctance here indicates one of two things: (a) the civil matter was already on a quick course of settlement; or (b) depositions and other matters may have rendered the next-day statement-of-events problematic. It is true that media frenzy and privacy are good reasons not to pursue things. But is this true if you have been wronged and can receive a major damage award? Or is it true if you have a drunken encounter and regret it? How many people get raped by millionaires and don't want to pursue even a civil case? And how many want to pursue one without pursuing a criminal case (the former helps the latter) -- [again, ask anylawyer].

9. Both the DA and the police believe not only that there was not enough proof to win their case, but that THERE WAS NOT EVEN PROBABLE CAUSE TO ARREST. Think about that. Law enforcement officials think the charge wasn't even worthy of an arrest. See DA News Conference, PART-1 12:00. http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/index.html (also at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liHs6C7ajzg)

Will anyone out there listen? People have every right to indict Roethlisberger for being an irresponsible frat boy. They have every reason to be disgusted with things like buying shots for girls and wanting a gigolo lifestyle. Or with having drunken sex. But they DON'T have ANY right to be disgusted with body guards dragging people back to rooms, with sex against a person's will, with "she reported it quickly," and that, "he exposed himself and she ran away, accidentally to a bathroom."

Where are you guys on this? They are MURDERING him. At worst, he's guilty of being a meathead and a playboy. Can you do nothing to make sure that, if people abuse him, it is for the FACTUAL THINGS and not a public lynching?

Regards and thanks.

Dr. Sean Wilson, Esq.

NJ-STEELER
04-16-2010, 06:21 PM
dp

Dee Dub
04-16-2010, 06:36 PM
I dont think much of anything about the case itself matters anymore. This is going to continue and it will probably get worse. This is why I think it is in the best interests of the Pittsburgh Steelers to trade Ben.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
04-16-2010, 06:38 PM
Dude (NJ), all I can say is that you are awesome for doing that research and posting it like that. I would, in all seriousness, send it to ESPN, any non-a$$hole Pgh beat writers, and the Rooneys. Though really what we need is the "other" side to come out, it looks like Ben has been advised to keep his trap shut, and what you've done is the next best thing. This stuff has to be publicized as much as the other cr@p stuff the media is putting out.

My prediction is that after the media has trashed been to all they can milk out of it, they will then move on the the DTF Posse, and their image will change from little darlin's to She-Devil Psycho-hose beasts. Not because it's any more true (though it may be!), but because that's all the media knows how to do.

They're not really bad, they're just drawn that way - they just can't help themselves.

Lebsteel
04-16-2010, 07:19 PM
Will anyone out there listen? People have every right to indict Roethlisberger for being an irresponsible frat boy. They have every reason to be disgusted with things like buying shots for girls and wanting a gigolo lifestyle. Or with having drunken sex. But they DON'T have ANY right to be disgusted with body guards dragging people back to rooms, with sex against a person's will, with "she reported it quickly," and that, "he exposed himself and she ran away, accidentally to a bathroom."


Exactly. I do not want the 28 yr. old QB of the Steelers to act like a 19 yr. old frat boy having sex with drunken girls in a public location. It is incredibly irresponsibe of him to behave this way, open himself to accusations of this type and jeopardize himself and the Steelers. IF he did nothing of the such, then he, Colon and the bodyguards need to speak and tell the truth. The problem is sadly, I think they know the truth and are glad they don't have to speak.

feltdizz
04-16-2010, 08:18 PM
You act like Ben isn't giving them rope to hang himself with...

He held a press conference looking like a greasy perv and says he won't answer any question or talk about it in the future.

pfelix73
04-16-2010, 08:22 PM
I've been thinking for a while now that Ben could end up being the victim in all of this.

Most of this 'media crap' will end by this time next week as they will move on to something else- Draft.

Time will make everyone forget this story. If you're going to trade Ben (which is rediculous), then trade Jeff Reed and Matt Spaeth too.
:tt2

sd steel
04-16-2010, 10:07 PM
I think it is amazing how having a teams star player basically caught redhanded on a second offense for rape have such an outpouring from fans on this board saying he was framed and setup. It truly scares me. And let it be known, those who are supporting Ben might as well be Ravens or Bengals fans. The boy has issues.

stlrz d
04-16-2010, 10:38 PM
I think it is amazing how having a teams star player basically caught redhanded on a second offense for rape have such an outpouring from fans on this board saying he was framed and setup. It truly scares me. And let it be known, those who are supporting Ben might as well be Ravens or Bengals fans. The boy has issues.

No chief, you're the one with issues.

sd steel
04-16-2010, 11:03 PM
[quote="sd steel":1j0bewj6]I think it is amazing how having a teams star player basically caught redhanded on a second offense for rape have such an outpouring from fans on this board saying he was framed and setup. It truly scares me. And let it be known, those who are supporting Ben might as well be Ravens or Bengals fans. The boy has issues.

No chief, you're the one with issues.[/quote:1j0bewj6]

No, you are letting the Super Bowls that #7 brought us blind you. You know Ben about as well as I know him, (I have met him once in passing at a late night at a bar in Pittsburgh). Basically I don't know him at all. Again, if this was Matt Spaeth we were talking about would you be so fast to proclaim him innocent after a second and maybe third allegation? Obviously you would root for Jeff Dahmer if he was our QB and winning Super Bowls, but I guess being that I played ball before Super Bowls aren't that important to me as opposed to teaching my kid right from wrong.

stlrz d
04-16-2010, 11:12 PM
[quote="stlrz d":yq83mjud][quote="sd steel":yq83mjud]I think it is amazing how having a teams star player basically caught redhanded on a second offense for rape have such an outpouring from fans on this board saying he was framed and setup. It truly scares me. And let it be known, those who are supporting Ben might as well be Ravens or Bengals fans. The boy has issues.

No chief, you're the one with issues.[/quote:yq83mjud]

No, you are letting the Super Bowls that #7 brought us blind you. You know Ben about as well as I know him, (I have met him once in passing at a late night at a bar in Pittsburgh). Basically I don't know him at all. Again, if this was Matt Spaeth we were talking about would you be so fast to proclaim him innocent after a second and maybe third allegation? Obviously you would root for Jeff Dahmer if he was our QB and winning Super Bowls, but I guess being that I played ball before Super Bowls aren't that important to me as opposed to teaching my kid right from wrong.[/quote:yq83mjud]

I'm not letting anything blind me. I'm also not stupid enough to read all the tabloid journalism and take it as 100% truth...and post things as moronic as, "a witness said he had his penis out. you don't just make stuff like that up. there's no doubt he raped her". That's where you have issues. Sport.

sd steel
04-16-2010, 11:26 PM
[quote="sd steel":kzvbxo8n][quote="stlrz d":kzvbxo8n][quote="sd steel":kzvbxo8n]I think it is amazing how having a teams star player basically caught redhanded on a second offense for rape have such an outpouring from fans on this board saying he was framed and setup. It truly scares me. And let it be known, those who are supporting Ben might as well be Ravens or Bengals fans. The boy has issues.

No chief, you're the one with issues.[/quote:kzvbxo8n]

No, you are letting the Super Bowls that #7 brought us blind you. You know Ben about as well as I know him, (I have met him once in passing at a late night at a bar in Pittsburgh). Basically I don't know him at all. Again, if this was Matt Spaeth we were talking about would you be so fast to proclaim him innocent after a second and maybe third allegation? Obviously you would root for Jeff Dahmer if he was our QB and winning Super Bowls, but I guess being that I played ball before Super Bowls aren't that important to me as opposed to teaching my kid right from wrong.[/quote:kzvbxo8n]

I'm not letting anything blind me. I'm also not stupid enough to read all the tabloid journalism and take it as 100% truth...and post things as moronic as, "a witness said he had his penis out. you don't just make stuff like that up. there's no doubt he raped her". That's where you have issues. Sport.[/quote:kzvbxo8n]
It's not in the tabloid, its in the police report. Now could it be possible that all 5 or 6 of the sorority chicks came forth with the exact same story the next day to collaborate the drunken night before, yes it's feasible, and is McNulty a nut job, yeah, but I would also have to guess that Bens people are also trying to put as much dirty laundry out against her to make her look as nutty as possible. The guy has unlimited funds. That is a major reason why I also think Ben is guilty, because people with that much money don't normally ever even have stuff become public. Obviously I am not going to change many guys minds as far as whether he is guilty or not, but I think it shows that people will back a guy who can win championships even if there might be a chance that he is a rapist. So I will quit arguing and you can continue to defend him.

Eddie Spaghetti
04-16-2010, 11:30 PM
charge the man or shut the hell up.

Sugar
04-16-2010, 11:30 PM
It's not in the tabloid, its in the police report. Now could it be possible that all 5 or 6 of the sorority chicks came forth with the exact same story the next day to collaborate the drunken night before, yes it's feasible, and is McNulty a nut job, yeah, but I would also have to guess that Bens people are also trying to put as much dirty laundry out against her to make her look as nutty as possible. The guy has unlimited funds. That is a major reason why I also think Ben is guilty, because people with that much money don't normally ever even have stuff become public. Obviously I am not going to change many guys minds as far as whether he is guilty or not, but I think it shows that people will back a guy who can win championships even if there might be a chance that he is a rapist. So I will quit arguing and you can continue to defend him.

Of course it's in the police report- they are reporting the accusation.

This doesn't make any sense. Tiger Woods and Mike Tyson had more money and celebrity than Ben and they were all over the headlines. You can think Ben is guilty if you want, it's a free country. But let's not throw "reason" into that mix. We really don't have information enough to reason it.

sd steel
04-16-2010, 11:35 PM
It's not in the tabloid, its in the police report. Now could it be possible that all 5 or 6 of the sorority chicks came forth with the exact same story the next day to collaborate the drunken night before, yes it's feasible, and is McNulty a nut job, yeah, but I would also have to guess that Bens people are also trying to put as much dirty laundry out against her to make her look as nutty as possible. The guy has unlimited funds. That is a major reason why I also think Ben is guilty, because people with that much money don't normally ever even have stuff become public. Obviously I am not going to change many guys minds as far as whether he is guilty or not, but I think it shows that people will back a guy who can win championships even if there might be a chance that he is a rapist. So I will quit arguing and you can continue to defend him.

Of course it's in the police report- they are reporting the accusation.

This doesn't make any sense. Tiger Woods and Mike Tyson had more money and celebrity than Ben and they were all over the headlines. You can think Ben is guilty if you want, it's a free country. But let's not throw "reason" into that mix. We really don't have information enough to reason it.
Tiger didn't commit a crime and Tyson is a crazy maniacal idiot who bites peoples ears off and wants to eat people children. Nice comparison. :Cheers

sd steel
04-16-2010, 11:37 PM
charge the man or shut the hell up.
I have. Guilty, best case pure stupidity twice, worst case 2 or 3 rapes.

stlrz d
04-16-2010, 11:39 PM
It's not in the tabloid, its in the police report. Now could it be possible that all 5 or 6 of the sorority chicks came forth with the exact same story the next day to collaborate the drunken night before, yes it's feasible, and is McNulty a nut job, yeah, but I would also have to guess that Bens people are also trying to put as much dirty laundry out against her to make her look as nutty as possible. The guy has unlimited funds. That is a major reason why I also think Ben is guilty, because people with that much money don't normally ever even have stuff become public. Obviously I am not going to change many guys minds as far as whether he is guilty or not, but I think it shows that people will back a guy who can win championships even if there might be a chance that he is a rapist. So I will quit arguing and you can continue to defend him.

Of course it's in the police report- they are reporting the accusation.

This doesn't make any sense. Tiger Woods and Mike Tyson had more money and celebrity than Ben and they were all over the headlines. You can think Ben is guilty if you want, it's a free country. But let's not throw "reason" into that mix. We really don't have information enough to reason it.

Please stop making sense man.

Someone here who doesn't like Ben's style of play wants to believe he raped someone because the accuser and her sorority sisters say so...with conflicting accounts I might add.

sd steel
04-16-2010, 11:50 PM
[quote="sd steel":2w2l7hlg]It's not in the tabloid, its in the police report. Now could it be possible that all 5 or 6 of the sorority chicks came forth with the exact same story the next day to collaborate the drunken night before, yes it's feasible, and is McNulty a nut job, yeah, but I would also have to guess that Bens people are also trying to put as much dirty laundry out against her to make her look as nutty as possible. The guy has unlimited funds. That is a major reason why I also think Ben is guilty, because people with that much money don't normally ever even have stuff become public. Obviously I am not going to change many guys minds as far as whether he is guilty or not, but I think it shows that people will back a guy who can win championships even if there might be a chance that he is a rapist. So I will quit arguing and you can continue to defend him.

Of course it's in the police report- they are reporting the accusation.

This doesn't make any sense. Tiger Woods and Mike Tyson had more money and celebrity than Ben and they were all over the headlines. You can think Ben is guilty if you want, it's a free country. But let's not throw "reason" into that mix. We really don't have information enough to reason it.

Please stop making sense man.

Someone here who doesn't like Ben's style of play wants to believe he raped someone because the accuser and her sorority sisters say so...with conflicting accounts I might add.[/quote:2w2l7hlg]
I don't get you, have I criticized the way Ben plays sometimes? Yes, but I love watching him and I love the success he has brought to the Steelers. I went as far as to get his autograph for my son. Do I feel he needs to be a superstar person for me to root for him? Not at all. I still prop Jack Lambert and Ernie Holmes when showing my kid my heroes and they were not saints outside of football, or even on the field. and if these accusations ever prove to be completely false and a money grab I will be the first one back on the board to state that I was mistaken about Ben, but until then I will see it for what I have learned from the police reports the witness statements, the fact that the cop quit, and the fact that Ben didn't defend himself by saying what really happened. Until then he is guilty in my mind.

Sugar
04-16-2010, 11:51 PM
Please stop making sense man.

Someone here who doesn't like Ben's style of play wants to believe he raped someone because the accuser and her sorority sisters say so...with conflicting accounts I might add.

But it is a well known fact that sorority girls never lie, even when they are drunk, even when they are under age and still downing shots... oh wait a minute.

stlrz d
04-16-2010, 11:54 PM
[quote=Sugar][quote="sd steel":wj0x32ue]It's not in the tabloid, its in the police report. Now could it be possible that all 5 or 6 of the sorority chicks came forth with the exact same story the next day to collaborate the drunken night before, yes it's feasible, and is McNulty a nut job, yeah, but I would also have to guess that Bens people are also trying to put as much dirty laundry out against her to make her look as nutty as possible. The guy has unlimited funds. That is a major reason why I also think Ben is guilty, because people with that much money don't normally ever even have stuff become public. Obviously I am not going to change many guys minds as far as whether he is guilty or not, but I think it shows that people will back a guy who can win championships even if there might be a chance that he is a rapist. So I will quit arguing and you can continue to defend him.

Of course it's in the police report- they are reporting the accusation.

This doesn't make any sense. Tiger Woods and Mike Tyson had more money and celebrity than Ben and they were all over the headlines. You can think Ben is guilty if you want, it's a free country. But let's not throw "reason" into that mix. We really don't have information enough to reason it.

Please stop making sense man.

Someone here who doesn't like Ben's style of play wants to believe he raped someone because the accuser and her sorority sisters say so...with conflicting accounts I might add.[/quote:wj0x32ue]
I don't get you, have I criticized the way Ben plays sometimes? Yes, but I love watching him and I love the success he has brought to the Steelers. I went as far as to get his autograph for my son. Do I feel he needs to be a superstar person for me to root for him? Not at all. I still prop Jack Lambert and Ernie Holmes when showing my kid my heroes and they were not saints outside of football, or even on the field. and if these accusations ever prove to be completely false and a money grab I will be the first one back on the board to state that I was mistaken about Ben, but until then I will see it for what I have learned from the police reports the witness statements, the fact that the cop quit, and the fact that Ben didn't defend himself by saying what really happened. Until then he is guilty in my mind.[/quote:wj0x32ue]

Thank you for proving exactly how simple minded you are. :tt2

Lebsteel
04-16-2010, 11:54 PM
Please stop making sense man.

Someone here who doesn't like Ben's style of play wants to believe he raped someone because the accuser and her sorority sisters say so...with conflicting accounts I might add.

But it is a well known fact that sorority girls never lie, even when they are drunk, even when they are under age and still downing shots... oh wait a minute.

Sugar, why are there plans to discipline Ben? Did he do anything wrong or is he a victim? Do you condone him being disciplined?

sd steel
04-16-2010, 11:55 PM
Please stop making sense man.

Someone here who doesn't like Ben's style of play wants to believe he raped someone because the accuser and her sorority sisters say so...with conflicting accounts I might add.

But it is a well known fact that sorority girls never lie, even when they are drunk, even when they are under age and still downing shots... oh wait a minute.

But why, if you are an underage sorority girl who isn't supposed to be drinking, would you go find the first cop that you saw and bring attention to your illegal drunkeness if you didn't get violated in some way?

Sugar
04-16-2010, 11:57 PM
Please stop making sense man.

Someone here who doesn't like Ben's style of play wants to believe he raped someone because the accuser and her sorority sisters say so...with conflicting accounts I might add.

But it is a well known fact that sorority girls never lie, even when they are drunk, even when they are under age and still downing shots... oh wait a minute.

Sugar, why are there plans to discipline Ben? Did he do anything wrong or is he a victim? Do you condone him being disciplined?

I do not condone him being disciplined in any way. I don't know if he did anything wrong. He hasn't admitted to anything. There is no video. There is no eyewitness testimony. There is no physical evidence.

Eddie Spaghetti
04-16-2010, 11:58 PM
i never thought the nation had so many people who rode really tall horses.

sd steel
04-17-2010, 12:02 AM
i never thought the nation had so many people who rode really tall horses.
I never thought the Nation would have so many people so dead set on winning that they would continue to back a guy who more than likely raped a drunk 20 year old.

stlrz d
04-17-2010, 12:08 AM
[quote="stlrz d":1p3p9jj5]Please stop making sense man.

Someone here who doesn't like Ben's style of play wants to believe he raped someone because the accuser and her sorority sisters say so...with conflicting accounts I might add.

But it is a well known fact that sorority girls never lie, even when they are drunk, even when they are under age and still downing shots... oh wait a minute.

But why, if you are an underage sorority girl who isn't supposed to be drinking, would you go find the first cop that you saw and bring attention to your illegal drunkeness if you didn't get violated in some way?[/quote:1p3p9jj5]

Because all you have to do is claim sexual assault or rape and all else is forgotten.

Have you yet seen a report that she was cited for underage drinking? She had a fake ID confiscated at the same club a few weeks earlier. She hasn't been cited for underage drinking despite that fact and despite the fact that she had a .2 bac.

I wonder why............

stlrz d
04-17-2010, 12:10 AM
[quote="Eddie Spaghetti":3mtk412i]i never thought the nation had so many people who rode really tall horses.
I never thought the Nation would have so many people so dead set on winning that they would continue to back a guy who more than likely raped a drunk 20 year old.[/quote:3mtk412i]

It's got nothing to do with winning you stupid mother ****er...it's got to do with not automatically assuming guilt based on the accounts of intoxicated, unreliable witnesses.

Jackass.

NJ-STEELER
04-17-2010, 12:11 AM
He held a press conference looking like a greasy perv and says he won't answer any question or talk about it in the future.

there was a report he was at the steeler facility (i think even working out). there was no plan to make a statment that day . and had to make the staement on the go with what was on him.

why they wouldn't wait for a chance for better clothes etc ...i dont know... you might want to ask the steeler brass on that one

but, you being influenced by a hair style and a nike shirt and slacks really doesn't suprise me

Sugar
04-17-2010, 12:14 AM
[quote="sd steel":11316r44][quote="Eddie Spaghetti":11316r44]i never thought the nation had so many people who rode really tall horses.
I never thought the Nation would have so many people so dead set on winning that they would continue to back a guy who more than likely raped a drunk 20 year old.[/quote:11316r44]

It's got nothing to do with winning you stupid mother bad word...it's got to do with not automatically assuming guilt based on the accounts of intoxicated, unreliable witnesses.

Jackass.[/quote:11316r44]

This is still America, right? Perhaps we should just make Ben a contestant on the Running Man!

NJ-STEELER
04-17-2010, 12:17 AM
[quote=Sugar][quote="sd steel":37agiilb]It's not in the tabloid, its in the police report. Now could it be possible that all 5 or 6 of the sorority chicks came forth with the exact same story the next day to collaborate the drunken night before, yes it's feasible, and is McNulty a nut job, yeah, but I would also have to guess that Bens people are also trying to put as much dirty laundry out against her to make her look as nutty as possible. The guy has unlimited funds. That is a major reason why I also think Ben is guilty, because people with that much money don't normally ever even have stuff become public. Obviously I am not going to change many guys minds as far as whether he is guilty or not, but I think it shows that people will back a guy who can win championships even if there might be a chance that he is a rapist. So I will quit arguing and you can continue to defend him.

Of course it's in the police report- they are reporting the accusation.



This doesn't make any sense. Tiger Woods and Mike Tyson had more money and celebrity than Ben and they were all over the headlines. You can think Ben is guilty if you want, it's a free country. But let's not throw "reason" into that mix. We really don't have information enough to reason it.

Please stop making sense man.

Someone here who doesn't like Ben's style of play wants to believe he raped someone because the accuser and her sorority sisters say so...with conflicting accounts I might add.[/quote:37agiilb]
I don't get you, have I criticized the way Ben plays sometimes? Yes, but I love watching him and I love the success he has brought to the Steelers. I went as far as to get his autograph for my son. Do I feel he needs to be a superstar person for me to root for him? Not at all. I still prop Jack Lambert and Ernie Holmes when showing my kid my heroes and they were not saints outside of football, or even on the field. and if these accusations ever prove to be completely false and a money grab I will be the first one back on the board to state that I was mistaken about Ben, but until then I will see it for what I have learned from the police reports the witness statements, .[/quote:37agiilb]


dont want to get in the middle of this arguement

but, why wouldn't you just wait. i dont believe we've heard the end of all sides to the story.
once more of the story comes out, it might be easier to figure out what happened instead of assuming the accusers statements are true and having to backtrack later if you're wrong

Eddie Spaghetti
04-17-2010, 12:21 AM
i'm still kind of amazed that this drunk girl and her friends just kept wandering into the same bars where ben happened to be even though it states his party left without telling them where they were going.

just dumb ****ing luck i guess.

DTF

sd steel
04-17-2010, 01:38 AM
i'm still kind of amazed that this drunk girl and her friends just kept wandering into the same bars where ben happened to be even though it states his party left without telling them where they were going.

just dumb bad word luck i guess.

DTF
Yeah sucks getting raped. Ask Stlrzd, its obvious that it's probably happened to him a couple times, only he wishes Ben did it. :loser

Steel Life
04-17-2010, 10:01 AM
dont want to get in the middle of this arguement

but, why wouldn't you just wait. i dont believe we've heard the end of all sides to the story.
once more of the story comes out, it might be easier to figure out what happened instead of assuming the accusers statements are true and having to backtrack later if you're wrong
I'll add to your point NJ...we don't need to wait, the DA reviewed all the evidence & interviews found that that there wasn't enough to charge him - that's it, there's no more, roll credits. We are where we are because an over-zealous DA decided to use his podium as a pulpit & cast dispersions on Ben's character rather than include the accuser in this drama, who at minimum was stupidly drunk & underage, & somehow managed to escape his definition of having poor "morals". What we need is to hear not from Ben (who needs to be silent yet contrite - per the Tiger manual), but from his lawyer Ed Garland who surely has evidence & testimony to support Ben's cause. I imagine if he's worth what everyone says he is, then it's pretty damaging to the accuser.

Sugar
04-17-2010, 10:14 AM
[quote="NJ-STEELER":1it1qx4k]dont want to get in the middle of this arguement

but, why wouldn't you just wait. i dont believe we've heard the end of all sides to the story.
once more of the story comes out, it might be easier to figure out what happened instead of assuming the accusers statements are true and having to backtrack later if you're wrong
I'll add to your point NJ...we don't need to wait, the DA reviewed all the evidence & interviews found that that there wasn't enough to charge him - that's it, there's no more, roll credits. We are where we are because an over-zealous DA decided to use his podium as a pulpit & cast dispersions on Ben's character rather than include the accuser in this drama, who at minimum was stupidly drunk & underage, & somehow managed to escape his definition of having poor "morals". What we need is to hear not from Ben (who needs to be silent yet contrite - per the Tiger manual), but from his lawyer Ed Garland who surely has evidence & testimony to support Ben's cause. I imagine if he's worth what everyone says he is, then it's pretty damaging to the accuser.[/quote:1it1qx4k]

Of course, there is that.

We need to remember that this isn't some case where Ben was charged and then found "not guilty" on some techinicality or something. There wasn't even a charge brought due to the fact that there was no evidence to support it. Ben shouldn't have to say anything, but I'm sure at least some details will come out over time. The last thing you want to do in a case like this is tar the female in a criminal case- it doesn't sit well with most people. You take the lesser of two evils and just shut up.

feltdizz
04-17-2010, 10:52 AM
If these allegations and off field incidents happened to any other NFL superstar athlete in a different uni I wonder how many on here would defend every move the guy has made.

I understand the impact Ben has to our win loss column but I don't understand how or why anyone could vouch for the guy off the field right now...

I'm not saying Ben did it... but I wouldn't proclaim he was totally innocent and this is one big media lynching because the media hates Ben or the Steelers. A Sgt. lost his job and another off duty cop or 2 will be scrutinized over this. It's not a conspiracy... and I love conspiracies. LOL!!!

Look at R. Kelly... he had a sex tape with a minor and he repeatedly re-focused the camera to get it all on film. The family actually defended R.Kelly in the trial and he walked because money talks. I'm not comparing Ben to R. Kelly... just pointing out how the "total innocence talk" is a stretch in the eyes of the public.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
04-17-2010, 11:11 AM
If these allegations and off field incidents happened to any other NFL superstar athlete in a different uni I wonder how many on here would defend every move the guy has made.

I understand the impact Ben has to our win loss column but I don't understand how or why anyone could vouch for the guy off the field right now...

I'm not saying Ben did it... but I wouldn't proclaim he was totally innocent and this is one big media lynching because the media hates Ben or the Steelers. A Sgt. lost his job and another off duty cop or 2 will be scrutinized over this. It's not a conspiracy... and I love conspiracies. LOL!!!

Look at R. Kelly... he had a sex tape with a minor and he repeatedly re-focused the camera to get it all on film. The family actually defended R.Kelly in the trial and he walked because money talks. I'm not comparing Ben to R. Kelly... just pointing out how the "total innocence talk" is a stretch in the eyes of the public.

Dude, you ARE comparing Ben to R. Kelly, why do you say you're not? Are you buffing your resume for a career in sports journalism? :wink:

stlrz d
04-17-2010, 11:29 AM
[quote="Eddie Spaghetti":2enonk6t]i'm still kind of amazed that this drunk girl and her friends just kept wandering into the same bars where ben happened to be even though it states his party left without telling them where they were going.

just dumb bad word luck i guess.

DTF
Yeah sucks getting raped. Ask Stlrzd, its obvious that it's probably happened to him a couple times, only he wishes Ben did it. :loser[/quote:2enonk6t]

No. I'm more of a Trai Essex kind of guy. Just ask SN1.

Jackass.

feltdizz
04-17-2010, 01:29 PM
If these allegations and off field incidents happened to any other NFL superstar athlete in a different uni I wonder how many on here would defend every move the guy has made.

I understand the impact Ben has to our win loss column but I don't understand how or why anyone could vouch for the guy off the field right now...

I'm not saying Ben did it... but I wouldn't proclaim he was totally innocent and this is one big media lynching because the media hates Ben or the Steelers. A Sgt. lost his job and another off duty cop or 2 will be scrutinized over this. It's not a conspiracy... and I love conspiracies. LOL!!!

Look at R. Kelly... he had a sex tape with a minor and he repeatedly re-focused the camera to get it all on film. The family actually defended R.Kelly in the trial and he walked because money talks. I'm not comparing Ben to R. Kelly... just pointing out how the "total innocence talk" is a stretch in the eyes of the public.

Dude, you ARE comparing Ben to R. Kelly, why do you say you're not? Are you buffing your resume for a career in sports journalism? :wink:
Maybe... LOL.

My intention was to point out how evidence or lack of evidence doesn't mean a guy is viewed as completely innocent. There is no video, Ben doesn't sing, Chappelle didn't imitate Ben, yet...

I'm not linking the 2 together... I think it's crazy to think not being charged means Ben is Mr Clean. Dude is still viewed as a dirty mudderfugher by some.