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View Full Version : Did we make a deal with the Devil?



aggiebones
03-29-2010, 11:14 AM
We have 2 new Super Bowls in the bag, but at what price?

One of the best Super Bowl plays in NFL history was Ben to Santonio. Maybe not the best, but a top play.

Now the 2 'could' be sharing a cell in the near future. (not exactly unless things go really hairy).
I'll trying not to be over-dramatic. With Ben, I was like, OK, he's got some problems to deal with. I think we can agree, he likely didn't rape anyone. But he's tangling himself up in some nasty webs and isn't learning.
Holmes now is reappearing as a bad boy. We have blown off the pot smoking and being in the wrong place in Miami a few years ago, but now he reappears caught in another web.

Again, every team has bad eggs roaming around, but we are kinda trapped with 2 of them, saddled with the hopes of them leading our team over the next 6-10 years. Now what?

This is also a really cheap shot at the Rooney family.
Not long ago, it was Ward and Bettis leading our offense. They had nice images of hard nosed players with a smile off the field. Now even their legacies are getting tarnished.

Here's hoping things melt back to normalcy soon. I'm not throwing Ben and Santonio under the bus yet. I'm just worried that they'll need about 3-5 years of good behavior in the NFL (not prison) before people stop thumbing their noses at us.

I never respected the Cowboys when they had 5 Super Bowls to lead the NFL. They were a bunch of dirtbags and most people felt the same way and it came from the top in Jerry Jones. I think it would be horrible if people started feeling the same way about the Steelers. Yes, I have pride in my team for the 6 SBs, but more than anything for the class and integrity of the organization...compared with other NFL teams.

With us getting caught in the steroid issue for the first 4 Super Bowls and now with punks making multiple bad decisions, we could have 6 slightly tarnished footballs in the Great Hall. I'm getting angry about it.
With the problems/corruption in, for example, the Catholic Church (I'm Catholic), Congress, Boy Scouts, Military, whatever, I guess as I turn 40, I'm realizing that no group is safe from wolves coming to destroy it. Maybe I should be thankful that I had 40 years of semi-blind admiration. Admiration without perspective is a dangerous thing I guess, especially admiration in a prime individual that you think could be a good example. I can't imagine having one of my priests turn out to be a pedophile like many others have. Maybe its a good thing we only live for 80 +/- years. I'm halfway home I guess.

All time rankings:
1) a priest
2)a senator
3)Big Ben
4)a senator
5)a priest

:brownssuck :ratsuck :bungalssuck

SteelAbility
03-29-2010, 11:27 AM
Admiration without perspective is a dangerous thing I guess,

A very astute observation. And I agree with just about every point you make.

feltdizz
03-29-2010, 11:31 AM
The best teams always have the microscope on them and things get magnified. Holmes getting into an argument with a girl at a club is not the end of the world. These guys just don't get it when it comes to the "high road" pun intended.... it's the small details that get these guys in trouble or "media trouble"

AS far as the Steelers reputation is concerned... fans who hate the Steelers already see them as dirtbags, punks and cheap shot artist who only win due to luck and help from the refs.

For the Steeler fans who think the legacy was built on family values and fairy dust I have news for you.. our sh#t stinks just like the other teams. It's funny and sad to hear fans talk about the Steelers like their transgressions are surprising while every other team who has problems is a total joke.

At least we are winning SB's with our knuckleheads...

BradshawsHairdresser
03-29-2010, 11:35 AM
We have 2 new Super Bowls in the bag, but at what price?

One of the best Super Bowl plays in NFL history was Ben to Santonio. Maybe not the best, but a top play.

Now the 2 'could' be sharing a cell in the near future. (not exactly unless things go really hairy).
I'll trying not to be over-dramatic. With Ben, I was like, OK, he's got some problems to deal with. I think we can agree, he likely didn't rape anyone. But he's tangling himself up in some nasty webs and isn't learning.
Holmes now is reappearing as a bad boy. We have blown off the pot smoking and being in the wrong place in Miami a few years ago, but now he reappears caught in another web.

Again, every team has bad eggs roaming around, but we are kinda trapped with 2 of them, saddled with the hopes of them leading our team over the next 6-10 years. Now what?

This is also a really cheap shot at the Rooney family.
Not long ago, it was Ward and Bettis leading our offense. They had nice images of hard nosed players with a smile off the field. Now even their legacies are getting tarnished.

Here's hoping things melt back to normalcy soon. I'm not throwing Ben and Santonio under the bus yet. I'm just worried that they'll need about 3-5 years of good behavior in the NFL (not prison) before people stop thumbing their noses at us.

I never respected the Cowboys when they had 5 Super Bowls to lead the NFL. They were a bunch of dirtbags and most people felt the same way and it came from the top in Jerry Jones. I think it would be horrible if people started feeling the same way about the Steelers. Yes, I have pride in my team for the 6 SBs, but more than anything for the class and integrity of the organization...compared with other NFL teams.

With us getting caught in the steroid issue for the first 4 Super Bowls and now with punks making multiple bad decisions, we could have 6 slightly tarnished footballs in the Great Hall. I'm getting angry about it.
With the problems/corruption in, for example, the Catholic Church (I'm Catholic), Congress, Boy Scouts, Military, whatever, I guess as I turn 40, I'm realizing that no group is safe from wolves coming to destroy it. Maybe I should be thankful that I had 40 years of semi-blind admiration. Admiration without perspective is a dangerous thing I guess, especially admiration in a prime individual that you think could be a good example. I can't imagine having one of my priests turn out to be a pedophile like many others have. Maybe its a good thing we only live for 80 +/- years. I'm halfway home I guess.

All time rankings:
1) a priest
2)a senator
3)Big Ben
4)a senator
5)a priest

:brownssuck :ratsuck :bungalssuck


I'm getting fed up, too.

One of our great family activities has been rooting for the Steelers together. They are all avid fans, and they all have Steelers jerseys that we wear on gameday. Not long after Pig Ben's latest incident, they had a day at school to dress up as your sports hero. Guess who my 12-year-old son wanted to go as (he knew nothing of either of the cases against BB)? So I had to tell him that, no, you don't want Ben to be your hero, and explained why Ben was in trouble. My son was devastated. My 14-year-old daughter has a #10 jersey. Now she won't be able to wear it to school without getting a lot of crap about he-man Santokio.

Enough already. Guilty or not, these dolts keep on putting themselves in positions where they get into trouble. At the salaries they are making, this shouldn't be tolerated.

feltdizz
03-29-2010, 11:48 AM
Aggie I see nothing wrong with admiring your priest...

but if you find out he is a perv and make excuses, blame the victim or blame the devil because you like the way he preaches then you have a problem.

I don't mind those who say "wait for the facts" but I have a problem with those who say "regardless of the facts" I love Ben because he wins games...

Ben and Holmes, 2 players who keep "saying" they are maturing and/or have turned a corner, aren't actually "doing" what they preach.

Dee Dub
03-29-2010, 11:59 AM
Did we make a deal with the Devil?? I dont know about that but...what was it Ben wore on his shirt the night of these allegations against him? :wink:

aggiebones
03-29-2010, 12:32 PM
The best teams always have the microscope on them and things get magnified. Holmes getting into an argument with a girl at a club is not the end of the world. These guys just don't get it when it comes to the "high road" pun intended.... it's the small details that get these guys in trouble or "media trouble"

AS far as the Steelers reputation is concerned... fans who hate the Steelers already see them as dirtbags, punks and cheap shot artist who only win due to luck and help from the refs.

For the Steeler fans who think the legacy was built on family values and fairy dust I have news for you.. our sh#t stinks just like the other teams. It's funny and sad to hear fans talk about the Steelers like their transgressions are surprising while every other team who has problems is a total joke.

At least we are winning SB's with our knuckleheads...



Some good counter points here. I never thought our sh#t smelled good, but there are levels of bad smelling sh#t. Right now it appears we are coming back from Spring Break in Mexico and we better get on a decent diet with the occasional salad to clean out the pipes!
We will never have a clean program, but we do and should have higher standards than some. You CAN win with good guys. We'll see if BenTonio (and if they never win again, they will be tied together to a degree) are good guys at some level and really are maturing. Or if they are on a downward spiral. I really don't know and am giving them the benefit for now.


Also, not sure if I gave the impression that I would tolerate a perv priest, but I would NOT! To me, this is the most heinous crime on Earth.
If it happened to one of my 3 boys, then the Priest might be found under Heinz field 50 years later when they tear it up. So yea...I have a mean streak. :x

Sugar
03-29-2010, 12:35 PM
Deal with the Devil? Seriously? Not a single one of our players has been charged with jack yet?

BTW- the whole "Pig" Ben thing sounds like something a Ravens fan would say. Just sayin...

aggiebones
03-29-2010, 12:41 PM
It was a title. Title's are meant to attract attention.

The title, "Unfortunate things," does not attract much attention.

Ghost
03-29-2010, 03:21 PM
This just in....Steelers players getting 666 tattoos.... :HeadBanger

birtikidis
03-29-2010, 04:03 PM
you mention Bettis being one of our leaders... don't forget he was accused of the same thing that Ben was accused of.

flippy
03-29-2010, 04:04 PM
We applaud violence on the field, but loathe it off the field.

Maybe we should look in the mirror to see who's the problem.

Ben and Santonio act the same on and off the field.

Why should we expect anything different?

hawaiiansteel
03-29-2010, 04:05 PM
a deal with the devil? what makes you think that?

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.tmz.com/media/2010/03/0305_ben_groupclub_ex_tmz_01.jpg

birtikidis
03-29-2010, 04:05 PM
We applaud violence on the field, but loathe it off the field.

Maybe we should look in the mirror to see who's the problem.

Ben and Santonio act the same on and off the field.

Why should we expect anything different?
are you saying that every time ben reaches under center he's sexually assaulting Hartwig?!? that PERV!

flippy
03-29-2010, 04:09 PM
We applaud violence on the field, but loathe it off the field.

Maybe we should look in the mirror to see who's the problem.

Ben and Santonio act the same on and off the field.

Why should we expect anything different?
are you saying that every time ben reaches under center he's sexually assaulting Hartwig?!? that PERV!
:lol:

RuthlessBurgher
03-29-2010, 04:22 PM
We applaud violence on the field, but loathe it off the field.

Maybe we should look in the mirror to see who's the problem.

Ben and Santonio act the same on and off the field.

Why should we expect anything different?
are you saying that every time ben reaches under center he's sexually assaulting Hartwig?!? that PERV!

And Larry Zeirlein used to watch film of Hartwig being molested by Roethlisberger all the time! We thought forwarding porn via e-mail was bad! No wonder that guy was fired! :wink:

feltdizz
03-29-2010, 04:49 PM
Aggie I wasn't implying you would be ok with a priest being a perv. I think you said something like not "being able to imagine your priest being a pedophile." If it happened I would expect disgust and frustration... Unfortunately there ARE people who make excuses after the fact or blame everyone but the perpetrator.

It's like baseball and Steroids... people trashed Bonds and said if it was their player or team they wouldn't tolerate it or they would boycott baseball. Then Canseco wrote a book and dropped name after name and a few high profile names on the list leaked and all of a sudden the steroid era was OK...

I love the Steelers but I'm not defending behavior or making excuses for stupd decisions the players make off the field.

Steel Life
03-30-2010, 01:45 AM
"I need an old priest & a young priest"...

aggiebones
03-30-2010, 11:20 AM
We applaud violence on the field, but loathe it off the field.

Maybe we should look in the mirror to see who's the problem.

Ben and Santonio act the same on and off the field.

Why should we expect anything different?


Did you ever play football?
I applauded my own violence on the field. But off the field I conducted myself somewhat respectfully. Granted I wasn't good enough to get away with anything.
I don't think your argument holds water. Again, maybe Ben didn't do anything and he didn't for 99.99% of the night. We know that. But if that .01% was bad, then he should be punished and I won't feel at all bad because I root for violence on the field.

aggiebones
03-30-2010, 11:24 AM
Aggie I wasn't implying you would be ok with a priest being a perv. I think you said something like not "being able to imagine your priest being a pedophile." If it happened I would expect disgust and frustration... Unfortunately there ARE people who make excuses after the fact or blame everyone but the perpetrator.

It's like baseball and Steroids... people trashed Bonds and said if it was their player or team they wouldn't tolerate it or they would boycott baseball. Then Canseco wrote a book and dropped name after name and a few high profile names on the list leaked and all of a sudden the steroid era was OK...

I love the Steelers but I'm not defending behavior or making excuses for stupd decisions the players make off the field.


Frankly, most people came down harder on Bonds because he was a gigantic douche. If it was any other player from that era, say Bonilla, Drabek or Vanslyke, people wouldn't have been as hard.
He also has been hitting roids VERY hard and denying it while giving everyone the finger. Most just duck and cover, he's been an overly defiant fraud. And people tend not to like that.
...And the steroids era is not OK by me. I am one of those that says keep them all out of the Hall. ie Screw them.

flippy
03-30-2010, 12:08 PM
We applaud violence on the field, but loathe it off the field.

Maybe we should look in the mirror to see who's the problem.

Ben and Santonio act the same on and off the field.

Why should we expect anything different?


Did you ever play football?
I applauded my own violence on the field. But off the field I conducted myself somewhat respectfully. Granted I wasn't good enough to get away with anything.
I don't think your argument holds water. Again, maybe Ben didn't do anything and he didn't for 99.99% of the night. We know that. But if that .01% was bad, then he should be punished and I won't feel at all bad because I root for violence on the field.

I played football, baseball, and basketball in high school. And I had a bit of a temper back then.

I quit playing football in 9th grade after breaking my hand and focused on baseball which I was much better at.

I quit playing sports in college, didn't have time. I worked 40 hours a week and finished school in 3 years.

Funny thing, my temper went away in college and I'm just happy now and optimistic about everything.

I do think it's hard to turn on and off violence. And I think a lot of coaches are really hard on players and push them to be even more violent.

There's a lot of yelling, arrogance, violence, etc. in sports. Very few people are good coaches imho. And winning is held in higher esteem than sportsmanship.

There's good and bad in sports imho. Just like the rest of life.

But when you are elite, you essentially get paid to be violent.

And it's hard to turn some of that off off the field.

There are exceptions like yourself, but by and large most guys are the same on and off the field.

Ghost
03-30-2010, 12:31 PM
but by and large most guys are the same on and off the field.

This is a huge generalization that isn't backed by the facts. While there are certainly players who do not know how to turn it off when the leave the field; I think you only need look to the Steelers to see a multitude of men who would be considered 'violent' on the field but have never shown proclivities towards violence off the field. In fact they were known to be nice, family men, some of faith - Meen Joe Green, Rod Woodson, Aaron Smith, Troy Polamalu, etc.

RuthlessBurgher
03-30-2010, 01:37 PM
We applaud violence on the field, but loathe it off the field.

Maybe we should look in the mirror to see who's the problem.

Ben and Santonio act the same on and off the field.

Why should we expect anything different?


Did you ever play football?
I applauded my own violence on the field. But off the field I conducted myself somewhat respectfully. Granted I wasn't good enough to get away with anything.
I don't think your argument holds water. Again, maybe Ben didn't do anything and he didn't for 99.99% of the night. We know that. But if that .01% was bad, then he should be punished and I won't feel at all bad because I root for violence on the field.

I played football, baseball, and basketball in high school. And I had a bit of a temper back then.

I quit playing football in 9th grade after breaking my hand and focused on baseball which I was much better at.

I quit playing sports in college, didn't have time. I worked 40 hours a week and finished school in 3 years.

Funny thing, my temper went away in college and I'm just happy now and optimistic about everything.

I do think it's hard to turn on and off violence. And I think a lot of coaches are really hard on players and push them to be even more violent.

There's a lot of yelling, arrogance, violence, etc. in sports. Very few people are good coaches imho. And winning is held in higher esteem than sportsmanship.

There's good and bad in sports imho. Just like the rest of life.

But when you are elite, you essentially get paid to be violent.

And it's hard to turn some of that off off the field.

There are exceptions like yourself, but by and large most guys are the same on and off the field.

Hockey players are as violent if not moreso than football players (punching someone in the face with your bare knuckles gets you only a 5 minute penalty on the rink...such an infraction is slightly more severely punished in football...ask LeGarrette Blount).

But you rarely ever hear about off-the-field antics among hockey players. Perhaps the fact that most of them are Canadian makes them seemingly inherently more polite fellows than football players who are overwhelmingly from the U. S. of A.

Perhaps I'm wrong, though, and we just don't hear about the misdeeds of hockey players because ESPN does not cover the NHL like CBC and TSN does (I may get lambasted by reports of boorish behavior from hockey players in the Great White North from the likes of Steeler Fan in T.O. and Mel Blount's G).

But my general opinion of hockey players is that they tend to be humble gentlemen off the ice, while football players tend to be prima donna douchebags with a sense of entitlement off the field (not everyone, of course...to wit, Troy Polamalu seems to be the epitome of a humble gentleman, while Sean Avery seems like the ultimate horse's @$$).

aggiebones
03-30-2010, 03:36 PM
I was more trying to say that these violent type players are just that in life too. I don't think football should be blamed and frankly, they might have kept these guys out of trouble a bit longer and many have matured in football while avoiding the streets.

I don't want to pick on any one player unfairly and this is a stereotype of these two players who's background and upbringing I am not overly familiar with. But let's say Harrison and Porter, who have shown exceptional football violence for the Steelers, had never played football and were from a mean street. They may be already in jail instead of skirting disaster while playing football. Maybe football allowed them to get into their late 20s unscathed from the streets. And now though occasional a problem in society, they aren't the total scourge as they have matured a bit. If we can get them to their 30s, maybe they will tire and only rarely do something unacceptable.

Maybe football is keeping them from being complete disasters.

flippy
03-30-2010, 05:18 PM
It is kinda funny how hockey players seem nicer. I bet it's lack of coverage of the sport.

Ovechkin seems like a douche on and off the ice. ;)

Jagr was a known womanizer in his day.

But those guys are European instead of Canadian.

Maybe Canadian's a gentler folks?????

Mario was Canadian and he saved Pittsburgh.

Sid seems like a little kid on and off the ice.

Perhaps you have to work harder at hockey which I think is a much more difficult sport.

Or hockey players have to have a little money to be able to play hockey as a kid whereas football players don't. Maybe it's a socioeconomic issue.

RuthlessBurgher
03-30-2010, 06:53 PM
Ovechkin seems like a douche on and off the ice. ;)

What's this "seems like" crap, Flip? Scientific studies have shown that Ovechkin is indubitably one massive bag o' douche. Douchebaggery at its absolute apex of douchiness. :wink:

http://i633.photobucket.com/albums/uu55/DeRekx18/AlexOvechkin.jpg http://capitalsoutsider.com/files/2009/03/ovechkin_en_fuego.jpg

feltdizz
03-30-2010, 07:53 PM
I was more trying to say that these violent type players are just that in life too. I don't think football should be blamed and frankly, they might have kept these guys out of trouble a bit longer and many have matured in football while avoiding the streets.

I don't want to pick on any one player unfairly and this is a stereotype of these two players who's background and upbringing I am not overly familiar with. But let's say Harrison and Porter, who have shown exceptional football violence for the Steelers, had never played football and were from a mean street. They may be already in jail instead of skirting disaster while playing football. Maybe football allowed them to get into their late 20s unscathed from the streets. And now though occasional a problem in society, they aren't the total scourge as they have matured a bit. If we can get them to their 30s, maybe they will tire and only rarely do something unacceptable.

Maybe football is keeping them from being complete disasters.

I think it's a personal decision to go to jail or not. Football may occupy more of their time but in the end those who have no self respect or refuse to follow the rules find creative ways to get in trouble...

and this is with millions in their pocket and the world at their feet.

feltdizz
03-30-2010, 07:58 PM
Aggie I wasn't implying you would be ok with a priest being a perv. I think you said something like not "being able to imagine your priest being a pedophile." If it happened I would expect disgust and frustration... Unfortunately there ARE people who make excuses after the fact or blame everyone but the perpetrator.

It's like baseball and Steroids... people trashed Bonds and said if it was their player or team they wouldn't tolerate it or they would boycott baseball. Then Canseco wrote a book and dropped name after name and a few high profile names on the list leaked and all of a sudden the steroid era was OK...

I love the Steelers but I'm not defending behavior or making excuses for stupd decisions the players make off the field.


Frankly, most people came down harder on Bonds because he was a gigantic douche. If it was any other player from that era, say Bonilla, Drabek or Vanslyke, people wouldn't have been as hard.
He also has been hitting roids VERY hard and denying it while giving everyone the finger. Most just duck and cover, he's been an overly defiant fraud. And people tend not to like that.
...And the steroids era is not OK by me. I am one of those that says keep them all out of the Hall. ie Screw them.


I'm not defending or cosigning Bonds and his roid use. Still not sure if he ever failed a test or was caught red handed..

my point is fans in Boston and NY who swore up in down they wouldn't cheer for a cheater did a complete 180 when their players or team was exposed as cheats.