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View Full Version : Not good - 2 witnesses. Here's the police report



SanAntonioSteelerFan
03-07-2010, 07:01 PM
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/pdf/2010 ... report.pdf (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/pdf/201003/milledgeville_police_report.pdf)

Don't know how to post a .pdf on the forum, but there's the link. Apparently a 19 year old witness, and a 20 year old witness.

Here's something that adds to the whole "sounds made up" aspect of this thing. Under "Victim", the name and other identifying info was clearly written in and then blanked out before the report was released, standard I guess for privacy reasons.

But under "Offender" - the name was NOT written in. It has height, weight (famously, exactly what the Steeler.com website has listed for Ben), sex, race, hair and eye color typed in. It even has, blacked out, dob and age.

But the "Offender"'s name was never typed in!!

This girl was apparently partying all night with him. Why wouldn't she say "Ben Roethlisberger"?

:?

BTW - unless Georgia drinking age is 19 y.o. , some guys just lost their liquor licenses ...

Shawn
03-07-2010, 07:09 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

Herewegosteelers!
03-07-2010, 07:14 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.
:Clap :Clap :Clap

Mister Pittsburgh
03-07-2010, 07:29 PM
I would guess the witnesses are friends with the girl making the claims. I would just like to hear what they are actually accusing he did other than just the generic 'sexual assault' term. Pinching a girls butt as she walked by could be considered sexual assault

SanAntonioSteelerFan
03-07-2010, 07:41 PM
I would guess the witnesses are friends with the girl making the claims. I would just like to hear what they are actually accusing he did other than just the generic 'sexual assault' term. Pinching a girls butt as she walked by could be considered sexual assault

Isn't there anything like it's OK to do that if it's consented to by the other person? What implies consent? Does partying all night together, flirting glances, maybe a touch of the shoulder and all that ... does that give consent? To what?

It gets crazy if you think about it ... two eighth graders at the county fair, and the guy gets up the nerve to put his arm around the girl's shoulders ... but the girl isn't ready for that ... sexual assault?

feltdizz
03-07-2010, 07:52 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

Maybe it's because some fans are tired of defending him or having to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I understand wanting to support Ben... but saying wait for the facts and innocent until proven guilty is what Pats, Ravens and Bungle fans do...

I actually think it's noble for Steeler fans to show frustration towrads the franchise QB who gives us the best chance of winning.

fezziwig
03-07-2010, 08:36 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

Maybe it's because some fans are tired of defending him or having to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I understand wanting to support Ben... but saying wait for the facts and innocent until proven guilty is what Pats, Ravens and Bungle fans do...

I actually think it's noble for Steeler fans to show frustration towrads the franchise QB who gives us the best chance of winning.


:Clap :Clap

NJ-STEELER
03-07-2010, 08:42 PM
I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

i used to think like that too. but after years of reading some of the crap on these message boards (this one isn't so bad) i've come to the conclusion steeler fans aren't much different then fans of other teams

NJ-STEELER
03-07-2010, 08:49 PM
how does the incident take place over 3 1/2 hours.

Snatch98
03-07-2010, 08:52 PM
He's 100% a target and he's a target that sleeps around a ton. He's not married, doesn't have kids and you can be rest assured he's not the only individual on this planet that sleeps around. He had one incident with a woman clearly full of sh.it which made him vulnerable to additional attacks. He goes to a podunk town to have a good time and some jackass with money on her mind shows up and tries to make something out of nothing.

I don't find that I need to defend Big Ben from the accusations. He's a young dude, in the NFL that "has a good time" nothing less, nothing more. I actually know quite a few people that are close personal friends of Big Ben. One said he "can't keep it in his pants" but that doesn't make him a bad person and I'm sure it's something he'll grow out of....

He's a target, this is a situation that is no different. If people want to toss the guy under the bus before getting all the facts fine. I'm not going to be one of them. We're also in the off-season, how much of a distraction is this really for the team? and the Media is just looking for something to write on...just like this chick is looking for some coin.

hawaiiansteel
03-07-2010, 08:56 PM
I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

i used to think like that too. but after years of reading some of the crap on these message boards (this one isn't so bad) i've come to the conclusion steeler fans aren't much different then fans of other teams



using poor judgment is not a criminal offense in and of itself, let's all just wait and see until the facts come out before we form any opinions. there will be plenty of time for that later.

having said that, i do understand fellow Steelers' fans frustrations with Ben's recent reckless behavior. when you drive a motorcycle without wearing a helmet you have a higher probability of getting seriously injured. when you are out partying at 2am with people you don't know very well and you're rich and famous you have a higher probability of getting yourself into trouble than if you didn't put yourself into those situations in the first place.

SteelCrazy
03-07-2010, 09:15 PM
It says on the report that the incident/sexual assault took place at 11:00 pm....however, many reports suggest she and Ben were together all night up until 2 am. That means after the incident occurred she partied with Ben for 3 more hours and had a great time according to other bar patrons..........

This whole thing smells like quick cash and hurt feelings

hawaiiansteel
03-07-2010, 10:11 PM
how does the incident take place over 3 1/2 hours.



yeah, whenever someone sexually assaults me and sexually manipulates my body parts at a bar against my wishes i always say something to somebody about it after 3 hours...
i would never allow it to go on that last half hour, i mean enough is enough! :wft

papillon
03-07-2010, 10:22 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

It's not about giving him the benefit of the doubt. I doubt he did anything that is criminal. However, his poor judgment is now potentially leading into a third training camp with something hanging over his head and the team. His poor judgment and frat boy maturity are reflecting poorly on the team and the family paying him 100 million dollars. He's letting his teammates, fans and most importantly his family down as well. There is a certain behavior that most Steeler fans and his family would expect and prefer. His behavior in Georgia is not it regardless of innocence or guilt.

Pappy

Chadman
03-07-2010, 10:37 PM
With barely any knowledge of what happened, outside of a police report that says 'something' happened at 'some time', by 'some guy' that happened to be un-named in the police report, it's kind of funny to see how opinionated the board can get.

Let's just say, for a second, that Ben grabbed this girl's bum, or groped her boobies...is he a criminal, deserving of the most severe punishment available?

Sure, it's not acceptable behaviour. And yes, Ben will want to pull his head in and behave. But really, if no 'fluid' was exchanged, if nobody got hurt, if it's just the same act that Joe Bloggs committs every Saturday night at any club, in any state, in any country around the world, give Ben a slap on the wrists, make him do some charity work, maybe an interview, and deal with it.

In the last year, we have had so many crimes committed by NFL players, that a heinous boobie grope kind of pales in significance.

Lets face it- if you can be drunk & drive your car, and kill a guy crossing the road, and basically get away with it- then Ben should be fine.

Dumb, really dumb most probably, but really- let's put things in perspective.

Unless of course, it's more than that, and someone did get hurt.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
03-07-2010, 10:39 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

It's not about giving him the benefit of the doubt. I doubt he did anything that is criminal. However, his poor judgment is now potentially leading into a third training camp with something hanging over his head and the team. His poor judgment and frat boy maturity are reflecting poorly on the team and the family paying him 100 million dollars. He's letting his teammates, fans and most importantly his family down as well. There is a certain behavior that most Steeler fans and his family would expect and prefer. His behavior in Georgia is not it regardless of innocence or guilt.

Pappy

I wish I could be as sure, but after reading some stuff on this forum (impeccable legal credentials found here!), e.g., "patting a girl's butt can be sexual assault", I can imagine a nightmare scenario where he goes down.

MeetJoeGreene
03-07-2010, 10:47 PM
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/pdf/201003/milledgeville_police_report.pdf

Don't know how to post a .pdf on the forum, but there's the link. Apparently a 19 year old witness, and a 20 year old witness.

Here's something that adds to the whole "sounds made up" aspect of this thing. Under "Victim", the name and other identifying info was clearly written in and then blanked out before the report was released, standard I guess for privacy reasons.

But under "Offender" - the name was NOT written in. It has height, weight (famously, exactly what the Steeler.com website has listed for Ben), sex, race, hair and eye color typed in. It even has, blacked out, dob and age.

But the "Offender"'s name was never typed in!!

This girl was apparently partying all night with him. Why wouldn't she say "Ben Roethlisberger"?

:?

BTW - unless Georgia drinking age is 19 y.o. , some guys just lost their liquor licenses ...

My thought exactly. They were underage.

papillon
03-07-2010, 10:56 PM
With barely any knowledge of what happened, outside of a police report that says 'something' happened at 'some time', by 'some guy' that happened to be un-named in the police report, it's kind of funny to see how opinionated the board can get.

Let's just say, for a second, that Ben grabbed this girl's bum, or groped her boobies...is he a criminal, deserving of the most severe punishment available?

Sure, it's not acceptable behaviour. And yes, Ben will want to pull his head in and behave. But really, if no 'fluid' was exchanged, if nobody got hurt, if it's just the same act that Joe Bloggs committs every Saturday night at any club, in any state, in any country around the world, give Ben a slap on the wrists, make him do some charity work, maybe an interview, and deal with it.

In the last year, we have had so many crimes committed by NFL players, that a heinous boobie grope kind of pales in significance.

Lets face it- if you can be drunk & drive your car, and kill a guy crossing the road, and basically get away with it- then Ben should be fine.

Dumb, really dumb most probably, but really- let's put things in perspective.

Unless of course, it's more than that, and someone did get hurt.

Being a Steeler fan is different, you know this, you're a great fan. Steeler fans would rather be able to say the team functions within the boundaries of the law and then some. That's why Reed and Spaeth were vilified for peeing in public. The same act that Joe sixpack does every weekend. These players need to realize it's a privilege to play in the NFL and that they aren't Joe sixpack any longer. You can't run around acting like a college kid on spring break and believe that it is okay. I'm funny that way I guess.

Ben is not Joe Bloggs and his contract says so; the Rooneys don't think he's Joe Bloggs, fans don't and he shouldn't. His behavior is abhorrent in this case and potentially in Nevada. He needs to grow up.

Pappy

Shawn
03-07-2010, 11:30 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

Maybe it's because some fans are tired of defending him or having to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I understand wanting to support Ben... but saying wait for the facts and innocent until proven guilty is what Pats, Ravens and Bungle fans do...
I actually think it's noble for Steeler fans to show frustration towrads the franchise QB who gives us the best chance of winning.

No actually that's what Americans do. If you like guilty until proven innocent head on over to the Mid East.

Shawn
03-07-2010, 11:36 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

It's not about giving him the benefit of the doubt. I doubt he did anything that is criminal. However, his poor judgment is now potentially leading into a third training camp with something hanging over his head and the team. His poor judgment and frat boy maturity are reflecting poorly on the team and the family paying him 100 million dollars. He's letting his teammates, fans and most importantly his family down as well. There is a certain behavior that most Steeler fans and his family would expect and prefer. His behavior in Georgia is not it regardless of innocence or guilt.

Pappy

I can give some validation to these points even though I don't completely agree. I don't think the man did anything wrong going to a bar hanging out with friends on his birthday. I still don't see how that is stupid...lawsuit or no lawsuit. The man has to live and he is not a priest. Most players go out. Ben is not alone in his "stupidity".

But, this is not what I'm talking about. I understand your frustration. What I'm talking about is the "where there is smoke there is fire people"...the "now I believe the first story" people...the "it's refreshing to see a white boy up on charges for a change people". I know every fan base has their morons but I guess I wanted to believe we had the best fans...the most loyal fans...the most level headed fans. I was obviously wrong...and this incident is bringing out our worst.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
03-07-2010, 11:51 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

It's not about giving him the benefit of the doubt. I doubt he did anything that is criminal. However, his poor judgment is now potentially leading into a third training camp with something hanging over his head and the team. His poor judgment and frat boy maturity are reflecting poorly on the team and the family paying him 100 million dollars. He's letting his teammates, fans and most importantly his family down as well. There is a certain behavior that most Steeler fans and his family would expect and prefer. His behavior in Georgia is not it regardless of innocence or guilt.

Pappy

I can give some validation to these points even though I don't completely agree. I don't think the man did anything wrong going to a bar hanging out with friends on his birthday. I still don't see how that is stupid...lawsuit or no lawsuit. The man has to live and he is not a priest. Most players go out. Ben is not alone in his "stupidity".

But, this is not what I'm talking about. I understand your frustration. What I'm talking about is the "where there is smoke there is fire people"...the "now I believe the first story" people...the "it's refreshing to see a white boy up on charges for a change people". I know every fan base has their morons but I guess I wanted to believe we had the best fans...the most loyal fans...the most level headed fans. I was obviously wrong...and this incident is bringing out our worst.

I know I've not read every post here on this topic, but I don't get the sense at all this is the atmosphere on this board. The overwhelming sentiment I think I see is deep disappointment that Ben can't do what the vast majority of young 20-something multimillionaire sports celebs can do - keep it out of the scandal sheets/police blotters. Some Pittsburgh reporter, in the PPG maybe, said people like ... (fill it in on your own names here, I can't recall - maybe Crosby, Brady, Sanchez, Brees, etc.) can stay off the police blotters - why can't Ben?

Guilty or not, Ben let a lot of people down by not taking precautions to help keep this from happening. I think you could say he also cheapened the Steelers franchise by dragging its name through the mud - regardless of the legal outcome. Irvin ... Kobe ... Ray-Ray ... pick-a-Bengal ... and now Ben. None of them were convicted, but all of them now aren't the same as they were beforehand.

Personally - I remember last year my son asked me about "Why did Ben do that?". He's sixteen this year, we haven't had the discussion on this one yet, but I can tell you it will be a lot harder than last year's.

Just my :2c

BTW - how did the Bus get out of his similar sounding problems, wasn't that the Superbowl year (XL)?

papillon
03-08-2010, 12:04 AM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

It's not about giving him the benefit of the doubt. I doubt he did anything that is criminal. However, his poor judgment is now potentially leading into a third training camp with something hanging over his head and the team. His poor judgment and frat boy maturity are reflecting poorly on the team and the family paying him 100 million dollars. He's letting his teammates, fans and most importantly his family down as well. There is a certain behavior that most Steeler fans and his family would expect and prefer. His behavior in Georgia is not it regardless of innocence or guilt.

Pappy

I can give some validation to these points even though I don't completely agree. I don't think the man did anything wrong going to a bar hanging out with friends on his birthday. I still don't see how that is stupid...lawsuit or no lawsuit. The man has to live and he is not a priest. Most players go out. Ben is not alone in his "stupidity".

Yea, I know he has to live. He also has to realize that things have changed for him. He's a target now. I'm having a hard time recalling a player that has been accused of some type of inappropriate sexual behavior twice in less than a year. Not even the rotten egg players have done it. He simply needs to grow up (quickly).

But, this is not what I'm talking about. I understand your frustration. What I'm talking about is the "where there is smoke there is fire people"...the "now I believe the first story" people...the "it's refreshing to see a white boy up on charges for a change people". I know every fan base has their morons but I guess I wanted to believe we had the best fans...the most loyal fans...the most level headed fans. I was obviously wrong...and this incident is bringing out our worst.

Even if the fire is a smoldering camp fire and not a conflagration it's poor behavior. Lets say he groped the girl for feel. If she were your daughter or girlfriend what would you think? Just because he's young, rich and famous doesn't mean that there are separate rules by which he gets to conduct himself, ask Tiger.


Pappy

Shawn
03-08-2010, 12:41 AM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

It's not about giving him the benefit of the doubt. I doubt he did anything that is criminal. However, his poor judgment is now potentially leading into a third training camp with something hanging over his head and the team. His poor judgment and frat boy maturity are reflecting poorly on the team and the family paying him 100 million dollars. He's letting his teammates, fans and most importantly his family down as well. There is a certain behavior that most Steeler fans and his family would expect and prefer. His behavior in Georgia is not it regardless of innocence or guilt.

Pappy

I can give some validation to these points even though I don't completely agree. I don't think the man did anything wrong going to a bar hanging out with friends on his birthday. I still don't see how that is stupid...lawsuit or no lawsuit. The man has to live and he is not a priest. Most players go out. Ben is not alone in his "stupidity".

But, this is not what I'm talking about. I understand your frustration. What I'm talking about is the "where there is smoke there is fire people"...the "now I believe the first story" people...the "it's refreshing to see a white boy up on charges for a change people". I know every fan base has their morons but I guess I wanted to believe we had the best fans...the most loyal fans...the most level headed fans. I was obviously wrong...and this incident is bringing out our worst.

I know I've not read every post here on this topic, but I don't get the sense at all this is the atmosphere on this board. The overwhelming sentiment I think I see is deep disappointment that Ben can't do what the vast majority of young 20-something multimillionaire sports celebs can do - keep it out of the scandal sheets/police blotters. Some Pittsburgh reporter, in the PPG maybe, said people like ... (fill it in on your own names here, I can't recall - maybe Crosby, Brady, Sanchez, Brees, etc.) can stay off the police blotters - why can't Ben?

Guilty or not, Ben let a lot of people down by not taking precautions to help keep this from happening. I think you could say he also cheapened the Steelers franchise by dragging its name through the mud - regardless of the legal outcome. Irvin ... Kobe ... Ray-Ray ... pick-a-Bengal ... and now Ben. None of them were convicted, but all of them now aren't the same as they were beforehand.

Personally - I remember last year my son asked me about "Why did Ben do that?". He's sixteen this year, we haven't had the discussion on this one yet, but I can tell you it will be a lot harder than last year's.

Just my :2c

BTW - how did the Bus get out of his similar sounding problems, wasn't that the Superbowl year (XL)?

All those are near quotes...maybe not exact wording but it has been said none the less.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
03-08-2010, 12:56 AM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

It's not about giving him the benefit of the doubt. I doubt he did anything that is criminal. However, his poor judgment is now potentially leading into a third training camp with something hanging over his head and the team. His poor judgment and frat boy maturity are reflecting poorly on the team and the family paying him 100 million dollars. He's letting his teammates, fans and most importantly his family down as well. There is a certain behavior that most Steeler fans and his family would expect and prefer. His behavior in Georgia is not it regardless of innocence or guilt.

Pappy

I can give some validation to these points even though I don't completely agree. I don't think the man did anything wrong going to a bar hanging out with friends on his birthday. I still don't see how that is stupid...lawsuit or no lawsuit. The man has to live and he is not a priest. Most players go out. Ben is not alone in his "stupidity".

But, this is not what I'm talking about. I understand your frustration. What I'm talking about is the "where there is smoke there is fire people"...the "now I believe the first story" people...the "it's refreshing to see a white boy up on charges for a change people". I know every fan base has their morons but I guess I wanted to believe we had the best fans...the most loyal fans...the most level headed fans. I was obviously wrong...and this incident is bringing out our worst.

I know I've not read every post here on this topic, but I don't get the sense at all this is the atmosphere on this board. The overwhelming sentiment I think I see is deep disappointment that Ben can't do what the vast majority of young 20-something multimillionaire sports celebs can do - keep it out of the scandal sheets/police blotters. Some Pittsburgh reporter, in the PPG maybe, said people like ... (fill it in on your own names here, I can't recall - maybe Crosby, Brady, Sanchez, Brees, etc.) can stay off the police blotters - why can't Ben?

Guilty or not, Ben let a lot of people down by not taking precautions to help keep this from happening. I think you could say he also cheapened the Steelers franchise by dragging its name through the mud - regardless of the legal outcome. Irvin ... Kobe ... Ray-Ray ... pick-a-Bengal ... and now Ben. None of them were convicted, but all of them now aren't the same as they were beforehand.

Personally - I remember last year my son asked me about "Why did Ben do that?". He's sixteen this year, we haven't had the discussion on this one yet, but I can tell you it will be a lot harder than last year's.

Just my :2c

BTW - how did the Bus get out of his similar sounding problems, wasn't that the Superbowl year (XL)?

All those are near quotes...maybe not exact wording but it has been said none the less.

Not disputing that, but what I said was the overwhelming feeling on the board seems to be disappointment. Those comments may be true, but if so were outliers in terms of what the board seems to be saying. At least from what I can tell. Not that it matters too much ...

Steel Life
03-08-2010, 01:35 AM
Since the report is somewhat vague, hopefully it turns out to be that guy who was going around impersonating Steeler players...is he out yet?

SanAntonioSteelerFan
03-08-2010, 01:38 AM
Since the report is somewhat vague, hopefully it turns out to be that guy who was going around impersonating Steeler players...is he out yet?

Impersonating Big Ben AND Willie Colon - now that's talent!! :Boobs :Boobs

Chadman
03-08-2010, 01:41 AM
Since the report is somewhat vague, hopefully it turns out to be that guy who was going around impersonating Steeler players...is he out yet?

Impersonating Big Ben AND Willie Colon - now that's talent!! :Boobs :Boobs


It was a dark club...maybe in the right light... :D

By the way- red card for the boobies icon, really, given the context, you should know better!

hawaiiansteel
03-08-2010, 01:44 AM
I absolutely love my Pittsburgh Steelers, have loved them ever since my family moved to Rural Ridge from Germany when i was 12 years old (my Dad was in the Air Force).

Because of this love and undying loyalty, I will defend my Pittsburgh Steelers always.

But to say I'm not somewhat disappointed in Ben would be untrue.

What's that saying?

"Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me"

I think Ben is innocent of both of the allegations against him, but I do believe he is guilty of being naive and of using poor judgment in both cases.

Are any of us perfect? No.

I just wish he would have learned a lesson from the McNulty chick in Nevada. This is the second time, shame on Ben.

Chadman
03-08-2010, 02:55 AM
What's that saying?

"Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ux3DKxxFoM

Something like that...

hawaiiansteel
03-08-2010, 03:01 AM
What's that saying?

"Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ux3DKxxFoM

Something like that...


that is friggen hilarious, never saw that youtube video before... :Cheers

i will always have a special place in my heart for good ole George, for the sake of his legacy i really wish we could have found some of those weapons of mass destruction. :roll:

StarSpangledSteeler
03-08-2010, 03:38 AM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

amen shawn. a very similar situation happened to bettis. let's just wait to see the evidence.

StarSpangledSteeler
03-08-2010, 03:38 AM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

amen shawn. a very similar situation happened to bettis. let's just wait to see the evidence.

Mister Pittsburgh
03-08-2010, 09:04 AM
I would guess the witnesses are friends with the girl making the claims. I would just like to hear what they are actually accusing he did other than just the generic 'sexual assault' term. Pinching a girls butt as she walked by could be considered sexual assault

Isn't there anything like it's OK to do that if it's consented to by the other person? What implies consent? Does partying all night together, flirting glances, maybe a touch of the shoulder and all that ... does that give consent? To what?

It gets crazy if you think about it ... two eighth graders at the county fair, and the guy gets up the nerve to put his arm around the girl's shoulders ... but the girl isn't ready for that ... sexual assault?

By definition of the term, Joe Namath committed sexual assault on live TV by trying to kiss that Andrea Kramer or whatever her name was while he was drunk doing that interview.

feltdizz
03-08-2010, 10:14 AM
Bettis' case disappeared... he got married and is now on solid ground.

Ben's case was about to disappear... he went to a college bar and now we have a new headline.

Ben needs to open the wallet and attach a hush clause. He needs to put this behind him as quickly as possible.

Shawn, race has nothing to do with this...

MaxAMillion
03-08-2010, 10:43 AM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

Sorry, that sounds like hero worship to me. I don't lift any man up as being different than any other man. I can admire a person's talents while still looking at him or her as being flawed like the rest of us.

I hope the Steelers do well on the field. I have no idea who any of the players or coaches are once they leave the field and go home. I don't presume to know who they are and I don't look to support them just because they wear a Steeler jersey. Why? because they have the potential to make bad decisions just like the rest of us.

I don't have the slightest idea about what happened this weekend with Roethlisberger. I am simply going to wait and see the results of the investigation. I do know that I won't assume that Roethlisberger is either innocent or guilty based on him wearing a #7 jersey. This isn't a court of law.

JAR
03-08-2010, 10:58 AM
More witnesses, before any accusations even surfaced.

From one of the bartenders tweets.


Before news of the assault charges broke, a local bartender posted a status update saying, "ben roethlisberger was here last night hanging out at the bars in Milledgeville... he was molested by girls everywhere he went." Photos later surfaced, showing Roethlisberger out and about in Milledgeville posing with an array of young ladies at his side.

A bartender who said he served Roethlisberger told us: "He was as nice as any athlete that I have ever met. People were all over him, guys and girls. His body guards kept some people away to let him have a good time. This situation is sad and I feel for the guy. He was out having a good time just like everybody else and now this is blowing up."Friday, as news of the assault charges broke, one of the Milledgeville bartenders said the charges against Roethlisberger were "bull...." and that "she was all over him that night.... wonder why he pursued??? she saw $$$ signs."


http://deadspin.com/5487565/big-bens-ni ... enders-saw (http://deadspin.com/5487565/big-bens-night-out-in-millyvegas-what-the-bartenders-saw)

feltdizz
03-08-2010, 12:43 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

Sorry, that sounds like hero worship to me. I don't lift any man up as being different than any other man. I can admire a person's talents while still looking at him or her as being flawed like the rest of us.

I hope the Steelers do well on the field. I have no idea who any of the players or coaches are once they leave the field and go home. I don't presume to know who they are and I don't look to support them just because they wear a Steeler jersey. Why? because they have the potential to make bad decisions just like the rest of us.

I don't have the slightest idea about what happened this weekend with Roethlisberger. I am simply going to wait and see the results of the investigation. I do know that I won't assume that Roethlisberger is either innocent or guilty based on him wearing a #7 jersey. This isn't a court of law.
:Agree

I went to U of Tennessee for a year and those football players were doing some amazingly creepy criminal sh!te!!!

If priest and politicians can do immoral things best believe a football player can.

On field talent has nothing to do with off field everyday behavior.

Shawn
03-08-2010, 01:08 PM
Bettis' case disappeared... he got married and is now on solid ground.

Ben's case was about to disappear... he went to a college bar and now we have a new headline.

Ben needs to open the wallet and attach a hush clause. He needs to put this behind him as quickly as possible.

Shawn, race has nothing to do with this...

I wasn't referring to you Felt...I was referring to comments made by Fizzwig.

cruzer8
03-08-2010, 01:09 PM
More witnesses, before any accusations even surfaced.

From one of the bartenders tweets.


Before news of the assault charges broke, a local bartender posted a status update saying, "ben roethlisberger was here last night hanging out at the bars in Milledgeville... he was molested by girls everywhere he went." Photos later surfaced, showing Roethlisberger out and about in Milledgeville posing with an array of young ladies at his side.

A bartender who said he served Roethlisberger told us: "He was as nice as any athlete that I have ever met. People were all over him, guys and girls. His body guards kept some people away to let him have a good time. This situation is sad and I feel for the guy. He was out having a good time just like everybody else and now this is blowing up."Friday, as news of the assault charges broke, one of the Milledgeville bartenders said the charges against Roethlisberger were "bull...." and that "she was all over him that night.... wonder why he pursued??? she saw $$$ signs."


http://deadspin.com/5487565/big-bens-ni ... enders-saw (http://deadspin.com/5487565/big-bens-night-out-in-millyvegas-what-the-bartenders-saw)

I am not surprised at this.

Shawn
03-08-2010, 01:15 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

Sorry, that sounds like hero worship to me. I don't lift any man up as being different than any other man. I can admire a person's talents while still looking at him or her as being flawed like the rest of us.

I hope the Steelers do well on the field. I have no idea who any of the players or coaches are once they leave the field and go home. I don't presume to know who they are and I don't look to support them just because they wear a Steeler jersey. Why? because they have the potential to make bad decisions just like the rest of us.

I don't have the slightest idea about what happened this weekend with Roethlisberger. I am simply going to wait and see the results of the investigation. I do know that I won't assume that Roethlisberger is either innocent or guilty based on him wearing a #7 jersey. This isn't a court of law.

:roll:

Hero worship...lol. It's called supporting a team and it's players until the law has proven they are unworthy of that support. To emasculate not only founding principles of our country but our "responsibility" as fans is short sighted at best. I think we can all see people famous or not as humans with flaws. Do you believe you are unique...special? But, you can and should support your team and it's players until the facts prove you shouldn't. The mentality of many concerning this subject is the defenition of fair weather fan. As soon as the chips are down you see people bailing ship.

Chadman
03-08-2010, 06:26 PM
A bartender who said he served Roethlisberger told us: "He was as nice as any athlete that I have ever met. People were all over him, guys and girls. His body guards kept some people away to let him have a good time. This situation is sad and I feel for the guy. He was out having a good time just like everybody else and now this is blowing up."Friday, as news of the assault charges broke, one of the Milledgeville bartenders said the charges against Roethlisberger were "bull...." and that "she was all over him that night.... wonder why he pursued??? she saw $$$ signs."

Get the media on to this, name the woman, and let her answer the questions surrounding this comment.

It's what is happening to Ben- an accusation has led to Ben 'being guilty' & having to prove himself.

So, name her, tell her she was spotted throwing herself at Ben, and let her ride the same media circus.

It's only fair.

Otherwise Ben is being thrown under the bus by a faceless nobody- and we, as the fans, are lapping it up & already tarnishing a young man's reputation.

NorthCoast
03-08-2010, 07:48 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

amen shawn. a very similar situation happened to bettis. let's just wait to see the evidence.

The significance of this situation is it now becomes "they said- he said" rather than "he said-she said". Not trying to assign guilt or blame, but witnesses change the complexion of the case (whether for or against the accused).

stlrz d
03-08-2010, 10:15 PM
I just don't get why Steeler fans especially don't want to give Ben the credit of the doubt until we see something saying he is guilty. Two accusations mean nothing. It merely means he is a target. The stupidity issue has been debated ad naseum. Stupidity doesn't = rapist, frotteurist, molestor or even jack asc. I seen no evidence before...and until I see some solid evidence now...I will support Ben. That's what real fans do. We support our team and it's players until they prove unworthy of that support. I'm ashamed of some of the comments I'm reading. I would expect this kind of thing from Pats or Ravens fans...but not from Steeler fans.

amen shawn. a very similar situation happened to bettis. let's just wait to see the evidence.

The significance of this situation is it now becomes "they said- he said" rather than "he said-she said". Not trying to assign guilt or blame, but witnesses change the complexion of the case (whether for or against the accused).

Based on the stories I've seen where bouncers and bartenders are saying that Ben didn't do anything wrong I'd have to say it's they said - they said.