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Oviedo
01-29-2010, 04:40 PM
Cardinals, welcome to mediocrity and thank the NFL that you are in the NFC West and not the AFC West. Cardinals will be 8-8 in 2010.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4870096

RuthlessBurgher
01-29-2010, 04:46 PM
They were 10-6 this season and 9-7 the year before when they went to the Super Bowl. Without Warner, I think they fall back further than just a game or two to 8-8. Unless they trade Matt Leinart for Matt Hasselbeck or Anquan Boldin for Donovan McNabb.

The Niners are now officially the favorites in the NFC West (what a crappy division...we go get to play them in 2011).

Sugar
01-29-2010, 05:11 PM
All the best to Kurt and his family. He's had a heck of a career and showed himself to be a class act. Enshrinement awaits!

flippy
01-29-2010, 05:38 PM
They still have a heck of an offense without Warner. I bet they still win their division even if they have to go with Leinart.

I'd get on the horn with the Redskins to see if they'd be interested in getting rid of Jason Campbell.

MeetJoeGreene
01-29-2010, 05:49 PM
Good Luck Mr. Warner.

He was classy and one of the good guys.

devilsdancefloor
01-29-2010, 06:05 PM
good luck kurt class act! so this means the NFC west champ will be 6-10

feltdizz
01-29-2010, 06:13 PM
They still have a heck of an offense without Warner. I bet they still win their division even if they have to go with Leinart.

I'd get on the horn with the Redskins to see if they'd be interested in getting rid of Jason Campbell.

Jason Campbell? :wft

costanza2k1
01-29-2010, 08:39 PM
Respect. His story is very inspirational on many levels...have nothing but respect for the man.

snarky
01-29-2010, 09:20 PM
Never liked the guy and I'm glad he's gone.

frankthetank1
01-29-2010, 10:08 PM
Never liked the guy and I'm glad he's gone.

i always thought he had a bland personality and pretty boring but he definetly had class and at least warner will retire for good unlike jett farve. i dont know how you cant like warner's story going from some bum who stocked shelves at a grocery store to winning a super bowl. it's also one less good fantasy qb so that sucks too

SteelTorch
01-29-2010, 10:40 PM
Best of luck to him. The guy's a great QB and a class act, and deserves to get into Canton IMO. Now provided he stays retired, let's hope Brett Favre takes a page out of his book.

hawaiiansteel
01-29-2010, 11:25 PM
I have always respected Kurt Warner and wish him the very best of luck. He's gonna need it spending the rest of his life with that wife of his...I'm sure glad I don't have to. :lol:

sling it
01-30-2010, 03:43 AM
Interesting stats for this guy. Three years he started all 16 games - 99, 01, 08. Three years he threw for over 4,000 - same years. Three years he went to the SB - same years. He started less than ten games in 5 of 12 seasons.

Should he be in the HOF? How many QB's have led two different teams to a SB?

I do like the guy, except for the 4th quarter in XLIII of course. Jerk.

BradshawsHairdresser
01-30-2010, 11:08 AM
He should make the HOF.

He was twice league MVP. He took two different teams to the SB, and played fantastic ball EACH TIME he was in the big game. I think he holds the record for most Super Bowl passing yardage, and is #1 and #2 as far as passing yardage in a single Super Bowl game. He would have won not just one, but two SB's with the Rams, if the *'s hadn't cheated. He came close (too close) to winning one for the Cardinals last year.

I don't see how anyone could not like the guy. He wasn't colorful? Maybe, but his story is pretty darn inspirational. There will always be plenty of pompous, arrogant @sses in the game. I'd rather celebrate the good guys. Warner was one of the good guys.

stlrz d
01-30-2010, 11:10 AM
He should make the HOF.

He was twice league MVP. He took two different teams to the SB, and played fantastic ball EACH TIME he was in the big game. I think he holds the record for most Super Bowl passing yardage, and is #1 and #2 as far as passing yardage in a single Super Bowl game. He would have won not just one, but two SB's with the Rams, if the *'s hadn't cheated. He came close (too close) to winning one for the Cardinals last year.

I don't see how anyone could not like the guy. He wasn't colorful? Maybe, but his story is pretty darn inspirational. There will always be plenty of pompous, arrogant @sses in the game. I'd rather celebrate the good guys. Warner was one of the good guys.

He's also #3.

Steel Life
01-30-2010, 12:10 PM
Nice guy, great story, some great stats...but no HOFer despite all the fawning. Here's some reasons...

1. Career wins aren't impressive: 67-50 (Ken Stabler: 97-49-1/Big Ben 59-26)
2. Turnover waiting to happen: 128 INT, 104 Fumbles, 260 Sacks
3. The "Gap": For 4 seasons 02-03 he was non-existent, 04-07 he was below average
4. Not the Starter you think: He has been a sub .500 QB 5 different seasons. He's missed 51 games (about 5 per season). Some to injury, but mostly from the one thing most people donít want to see - he kept losing his starting job...FOUR times...to Marc Bulger, Eli Manning, Josh McCown & Matt Leinart.
5. The Super Bowl Myth: Just some are quick to point out that one of Ben's SB wins wasn't all that impressive (Peyton's wasn't either BTW), Warner's SB numbers aren't as impressive when you account for the fact that being behind in those games, he HAD to throw.

And given the talent level he's had in both St. Louis & Arizona, why hasn't he done better?

feltdizz
01-30-2010, 12:55 PM
Nice guy, great story, some great stats...but no HOFer despite all the fawning. Here's some reasons...

1. Career wins aren't impressive: 67-50 (Ken Stabler: 97-49-1/Big Ben 59-26)
2. Turnover waiting to happen: 128 INT, 104 Fumbles, 260 Sacks
3. The "Gap": For 4 seasons 02-03 he was non-existent, 04-07 he was below average
4. Not the Starter you think: He has been a sub .500 QB 5 different seasons. He's missed 51 games (about 5 per season). Some to injury, but mostly from the one thing most people donít want to see - he kept losing his starting job...FOUR times...to Marc Bulger, Eli Manning, Josh McCown & Matt Leinart.
5. The Super Bowl Myth: Just some are quick to point out that one of Ben's SB wins wasn't all that impressive (Peyton's wasn't either BTW), Warner's SB numbers aren't as impressive when you account for the fact that being behind in those games, he HAD to throw.

And given the talent level he's had in both St. Louis & Arizona, why hasn't he done better?
That last line is classic... You talk about the Rams and the Cards like they were good before Warner was the QB. That pretty much tells me how good the guy is.
Kurt Warner was old when he came into the league and most GM's are not going to build a team around a QB his age. Now imagine if FO's were excited and built teams around Warner.

Whether you want to admit it or not the guy can pass his butt off when it's clicking. He wasn't passing in SB's because they were behind, they were passing because Warner is a beast and the best option to get down the field.

The talent in AZ and St. Louis... LOL.

Steel Life
01-30-2010, 01:17 PM
Nice guy, great story, some great stats...but no HOFer despite all the fawning. Here's some reasons...

1. Career wins aren't impressive: 67-50 (Ken Stabler: 97-49-1/Big Ben 59-26)
2. Turnover waiting to happen: 128 INT, 104 Fumbles, 260 Sacks
3. The "Gap": For 4 seasons 02-03 he was non-existent, 04-07 he was below average
4. Not the Starter you think: He has been a sub .500 QB 5 different seasons. He's missed 51 games (about 5 per season). Some to injury, but mostly from the one thing most people donít want to see - he kept losing his starting job...FOUR times...to Marc Bulger, Eli Manning, Josh McCown & Matt Leinart.
5. The Super Bowl Myth: Just some are quick to point out that one of Ben's SB wins wasn't all that impressive (Peyton's wasn't either BTW), Warner's SB numbers aren't as impressive when you account for the fact that being behind in those games, he HAD to throw.

And given the talent level he's had in both St. Louis & Arizona, why hasn't he done better?
That last line is classic... You talk about the Rams and the Cards like they were good before Warner was the QB. That pretty much tells me how good the guy is.
Kurt Warner was old when he came into the league and most GM's are not going to build a team around a QB his age. Now imagine if FO's were excited and built teams around Warner.

Whether you want to admit it or not the guy can pass his butt off when it's clicking. He wasn't passing in SB's because they were behind, they were passing because Warner is a beast and the best option to get down the field.

The talent in AZ and St. Louis... LOL.
Let's see...
St. Louis: Marshall Faulk (3 NFL Offensive Player of the Year awards, 1 NFL MVP), Isaac Bruce, Torry Holt, Orlando Pace

NYG: Tiki Barber, Jeremy Shockey, Amani Toomer

Cardinals: Larry Fitzgerald, Anquan Boldin, Steve Breaston, Early Doucet, Beanie Wells

Yeah he's had no talent at all...and you skip the obvious - if he's as good as you think then why hasn't he won more? In the end that's all that counts.

feltdizz
01-30-2010, 01:53 PM
You make it sound like Kurt Warner had to take everyone to a SB to be a HOFer
you also talk like Warner wasn't close to beating us in the SB in 2008.

He has the 3 highest passing games in SB history... Asking why he didn't take the Giants there as well isn't a convincing argument.

BradshawsHairdresser
01-30-2010, 04:51 PM
Nice guy, great story, some great stats...but no HOFer despite all the fawning. Here's some reasons...

1. Career wins aren't impressive: 67-50 (Ken Stabler: 97-49-1/Big Ben 59-26)
2. Turnover waiting to happen: 128 INT, 104 Fumbles, 260 Sacks

What are Terry Bradshaw's turnover stats?




3. The "Gap": For 4 seasons 02-03 he was non-existent, 04-07 he was below average

What were Terry Bradshaw's statistics before about 1977?

[quote="Steel Life":3e0wqlq8]
4. Not the Starter you think: He has been a sub .500 QB 5 different seasons. He's missed 51 games (about 5 per season). Some to injury, but mostly from the one thing most people donít want to see - he kept losing his starting job...FOUR times...to Marc Bulger, Eli Manning, Josh McCown & Matt Leinart.

And do you think all of those QB's were really better than Warner? Could it be, at least in a couple of those cases, that Warner wasn't really benched because he got "beat out," but for some other reason?



5. The Super Bowl Myth: Just some are quick to point out that one of Ben's SB wins wasn't all that impressive (Peyton's wasn't either BTW), Warner's SB numbers aren't as impressive when you account for the fact that being behind in those games, he HAD to throw.
That makes no sense at all. The fact that he HAD to throw, and came up with the numbers he did makes his performances all the MORE impressive; after all, the opposing defenses in those contests knew he "had to throw."


And given the talent level he's had in both St. Louis & Arizona, why hasn't he done better?[/quote:3e0wqlq8]
With St. Louis, he had 2 Super Bowl appearances (should have been two Super Bowl wins, but for the cheating *'s). Who would have done as well at Arizona as Warner did, except for other HOF-caliber QBs?

Steel Life
01-30-2010, 09:43 PM
I get it that you guys like Warner - & he's a likable guy, but it doesn't take away the fact he's got HUGE gaps in his resume. Call him the NFL's Lazarus if you want, but if Dan Fouts isn't a 1st-ballot HOFer, & Ken Stabler isn't good enough, then what is Warner? And to suggest ulterior motives for his benchings besides poor play is a reach. Here's a breakdown of some of those years...

2002 (Rams) - Warner puts up one of the worst touchdown-to-interception ratios in NFL history (3 touchdowns, 11 interceptions). Record 0-6
2003 (Rams) - Loses starting job after fumbling 6 times in the season opener. Marc Bulger takes over & leads the Rams to a 12-4 record and a second-seed in the postseason. Warner is released. Record 0-1
2004 (Giants) - A shell of what he was, he fumbles 8 times and tosses 3 INTs in a 3-game span that cost him the starting job in the middle of the season. Eli Manning takes over & Warner is released. Record 5-4
2005 (Cards) - Named the starter, Warner struggled before getting injured. Josh McCown takes over & does well enough to be named starter. Warner gets position back, but goes down with season-ending injury. Record 2-8
2006 (Cards) - Named starting quarterback, he gets replaced by Leinart in the 4th game. Warner remains benched until Leinart suffers an injury in week 16. Record 1-4
2007 (Cards) - Leinart was the Cardsí starter, before suffering a season-ending injury in week four that handed the job back to Warner. Record 5-6
2008 (Cards) - Leinart was named as the Cards' starter in the offseason, but right before the season starts, Warner was handed the starting job. Record 9-7

Hardly seems HOF material - much less 1st Ballot - or do we just focus on those Super Bowl stats, despite the fact he's lost two?

feltdizz
01-30-2010, 11:45 PM
I get it that you guys like Warner - & he's a likable guy, but it doesn't take away the fact he's got HUGE gaps in his resume. Call him the NFL's Lazarus if you want, but if Dan Fouts isn't a 1st-ballot HOFer, & Ken Stabler isn't good enough, then what is Warner? And to suggest ulterior motives for his benchings besides poor play is a reach. Here's a breakdown of some of those years...

2002 (Rams) - Warner puts up one of the worst touchdown-to-interception ratios in NFL history (3 touchdowns, 11 interceptions). Record 0-6
2003 (Rams) - Loses starting job after fumbling 6 times in the season opener. Marc Bulger takes over & leads the Rams to a 12-4 record and a second-seed in the postseason. Warner is released. Record 0-1
2004 (Giants) - A shell of what he was, he fumbles 8 times and tosses 3 INTs in a 3-game span that cost him the starting job in the middle of the season. Eli Manning takes over & Warner is released. Record 5-4
2005 (Cards) - Named the starter, Warner struggled before getting injured. Josh McCown takes over & does well enough to be named starter. Warner gets position back, but goes down with season-ending injury. Record 2-8
2006 (Cards) - Named starting quarterback, he gets replaced by Leinart in the 4th game. Warner remains benched until Leinart suffers an injury in week 16. Record 1-4
2007 (Cards) - Leinart was the Cardsí starter, before suffering a season-ending injury in week four that handed the job back to Warner. Record 5-6
2008 (Cards) - Leinart was named as the Cards' starter in the offseason, but right before the season starts, Warner was handed the starting job. Record 9-7

Hardly seems HOF material - much less 1st Ballot - or do we just focus on those Super Bowl stats, despite the fact he's lost two?

What part of Rams and Cards do you not understand?

I understand your 5 year gap debate but this is what makes Warner a HOFer....
it adds to the legend of Warner... he won a SB, he lost a SB.. he fell down, got back up and took another sorry azz team to the SB..

When a QB's arm gets 2 franchises with a culture of losing to the SB ... it's over. There is nothing more to debate.

frankthetank1
01-31-2010, 09:18 AM
i dont think warner is quite worthy of the hof. not to mention the huge gaps of success he has had in the nfl but he was awful with the giants. yeah warner was the man on great offenses with the rams and cards but you put him on an average to below average offense and he stunk. a hall of fame caliber qb has success no matter what talent he has around him.

NorthCoast
01-31-2010, 09:40 AM
My sense is that if he doesn't get in quickly, the hype will fade and he will struggle along side some other just-as-worthy QBs.
He has definitely had a mixed career, almost a Jekyl and Hyde thing. I would like to see how the Cards do next season. If they keep the team intact, the Cards performance will tell a lot about how good Warner was. If they tank, then you know that QB was a big part of their game. I suspect without a franchise QB they will focus on developing the run game, very similar to what Cleveland did at the end of the season.

stlrz d
01-31-2010, 11:05 AM
I get it that you guys like Warner - & he's a likable guy, but it doesn't take away the fact he's got HUGE gaps in his resume. Call him the NFL's Lazarus if you want, but if Dan Fouts isn't a 1st-ballot HOFer, & Ken Stabler isn't good enough, then what is Warner? And to suggest ulterior motives for his benchings besides poor play is a reach. Here's a breakdown of some of those years...

2002 (Rams) - Warner puts up one of the worst touchdown-to-interception ratios in NFL history (3 touchdowns, 11 interceptions). Record 0-6
2003 (Rams) - Loses starting job after fumbling 6 times in the season opener. Marc Bulger takes over & leads the Rams to a 12-4 record and a second-seed in the postseason. Warner is released. Record 0-1
2004 (Giants) - A shell of what he was, he fumbles 8 times and tosses 3 INTs in a 3-game span that cost him the starting job in the middle of the season. Eli Manning takes over & Warner is released. Record 5-4
2005 (Cards) - Named the starter, Warner struggled before getting injured. Josh McCown takes over & does well enough to be named starter. Warner gets position back, but goes down with season-ending injury. Record 2-8
2006 (Cards) - Named starting quarterback, he gets replaced by Leinart in the 4th game. Warner remains benched until Leinart suffers an injury in week 16. Record 1-4
2007 (Cards) - Leinart was the Cardsí starter, before suffering a season-ending injury in week four that handed the job back to Warner. Record 5-6
2008 (Cards) - Leinart was named as the Cards' starter in the offseason, but right before the season starts, Warner was handed the starting job. Record 9-7

Hardly seems HOF material - much less 1st Ballot - or do we just focus on those Super Bowl stats, despite the fact he's lost two?

What part of Rams and Cards do you not understand?

I understand your 5 year gap debate but this is what makes Warner a HOFer....
it adds to the legend of Warner... he won a SB, he lost a SB.. he fell down, got back up and took another sorry azz team to the SB..

When a QB's arm gets 2 franchises with a culture of losing to the SB ... it's over. There is nothing more to debate.

Do the names Marshall Faulk, Torry Holt, Isaac Bruce, Larry Fitzgerald, Anquan Boldin, etc...ring a bell?

He didn't do it on his own. He may have been the difference maker, but he didn't do it alone.

feltdizz
01-31-2010, 02:29 PM
No QB does it alone... what QB has great stats throwing to scrubs? Besides McNabb...

I think if people were pointing out great defensive players it would hold more weight. No one says Rice, Taylor, Roger Craig, Ronnie Lott when speaking of Montana. Not saying Warner is on his level but throwing out names proves Warner didn't blow it with the talent he had.

SteelTorch
01-31-2010, 05:00 PM
[quote="Steel Life":vthm81ol]I get it that you guys like Warner - & he's a likable guy, but it doesn't take away the fact he's got HUGE gaps in his resume. Call him the NFL's Lazarus if you want, but if Dan Fouts isn't a 1st-ballot HOFer, & Ken Stabler isn't good enough, then what is Warner? And to suggest ulterior motives for his benchings besides poor play is a reach. Here's a breakdown of some of those years...

2002 (Rams) - Warner puts up one of the worst touchdown-to-interception ratios in NFL history (3 touchdowns, 11 interceptions). Record 0-6
2003 (Rams) - Loses starting job after fumbling 6 times in the season opener. Marc Bulger takes over & leads the Rams to a 12-4 record and a second-seed in the postseason. Warner is released. Record 0-1
2004 (Giants) - A shell of what he was, he fumbles 8 times and tosses 3 INTs in a 3-game span that cost him the starting job in the middle of the season. Eli Manning takes over & Warner is released. Record 5-4
2005 (Cards) - Named the starter, Warner struggled before getting injured. Josh McCown takes over & does well enough to be named starter. Warner gets position back, but goes down with season-ending injury. Record 2-8
2006 (Cards) - Named starting quarterback, he gets replaced by Leinart in the 4th game. Warner remains benched until Leinart suffers an injury in week 16. Record 1-4
2007 (Cards) - Leinart was the Cardsí starter, before suffering a season-ending injury in week four that handed the job back to Warner. Record 5-6
2008 (Cards) - Leinart was named as the Cards' starter in the offseason, but right before the season starts, Warner was handed the starting job. Record 9-7

Hardly seems HOF material - much less 1st Ballot - or do we just focus on those Super Bowl stats, despite the fact he's lost two?

What part of Rams and Cards do you not understand?

I understand your 5 year gap debate but this is what makes Warner a HOFer....
it adds to the legend of Warner... he won a SB, he lost a SB.. he fell down, got back up and took another sorry azz team to the SB..

When a QB's arm gets 2 franchises with a culture of losing to the SB ... it's over. There is nothing more to debate.

Do the names Marshall Faulk, Torry Holt, Isaac Bruce, Larry Fitzgerald, Anquan Boldin, etc...ring a bell?

He didn't do it on his own. He may have been the difference maker, but he didn't do it alone.[/quote:vthm81ol]
Reality check people: no QB does it alone. People said the same thing about Big Ben - that he was just a product of the talent around him. Would you say the same thing? Would you have been willing to say the same about Terry Bradshaw? Joe Montana? Steve Young? Peyton Manning?

Of course Warner's had talent around him. So have most top-tier QBs in history. The point is, Warner is a great passer and difference maker who does the most with what he's got around him. To knock on him just because he "didn't do it alone" is misguided and borderline stupid.

feltdizz
01-31-2010, 05:29 PM
[quote="Steel Life":2nmgvxsh]I get it that you guys like Warner - & he's a likable guy, but it doesn't take away the fact he's got HUGE gaps in his resume. Call him the NFL's Lazarus if you want, but if Dan Fouts isn't a 1st-ballot HOFer, & Ken Stabler isn't good enough, then what is Warner? And to suggest ulterior motives for his benchings besides poor play is a reach. Here's a breakdown of some of those years...

2002 (Rams) - Warner puts up one of the worst touchdown-to-interception ratios in NFL history (3 touchdowns, 11 interceptions). Record 0-6
2003 (Rams) - Loses starting job after fumbling 6 times in the season opener. Marc Bulger takes over & leads the Rams to a 12-4 record and a second-seed in the postseason. Warner is released. Record 0-1
2004 (Giants) - A shell of what he was, he fumbles 8 times and tosses 3 INTs in a 3-game span that cost him the starting job in the middle of the season. Eli Manning takes over & Warner is released. Record 5-4
2005 (Cards) - Named the starter, Warner struggled before getting injured. Josh McCown takes over & does well enough to be named starter. Warner gets position back, but goes down with season-ending injury. Record 2-8
2006 (Cards) - Named starting quarterback, he gets replaced by Leinart in the 4th game. Warner remains benched until Leinart suffers an injury in week 16. Record 1-4
2007 (Cards) - Leinart was the Cardsí starter, before suffering a season-ending injury in week four that handed the job back to Warner. Record 5-6
2008 (Cards) - Leinart was named as the Cards' starter in the offseason, but right before the season starts, Warner was handed the starting job. Record 9-7

Hardly seems HOF material - much less 1st Ballot - or do we just focus on those Super Bowl stats, despite the fact he's lost two?

What part of Rams and Cards do you not understand?

I understand your 5 year gap debate but this is what makes Warner a HOFer....
it adds to the legend of Warner... he won a SB, he lost a SB.. he fell down, got back up and took another sorry azz team to the SB..

When a QB's arm gets 2 franchises with a culture of losing to the SB ... it's over. There is nothing more to debate.

Do the names Marshall Faulk, Torry Holt, Isaac Bruce, Larry Fitzgerald, Anquan Boldin, etc...ring a bell?

He didn't do it on his own. He may have been the difference maker, but he didn't do it alone.
Reality check people: no QB does it alone. People said the same thing about Big Ben - that he was just a product of the talent around him. Would you say the same thing? Would you have been willing to say the same about Terry Bradshaw? Joe Montana? Steve Young? Peyton Manning?

Of course Warner's had talent around him. So have most top-tier QBs in history. The point is, Warner is a great passer and difference maker who does the most with what he's got around him. To knock on him just because he "didn't do it alone" is misguided and borderline stupid.[/quote:2nmgvxsh]

:Agree To StlrzD's credit he did say Warner was the difference maker... but that is also my point.

NJ-STEELER
01-31-2010, 07:05 PM
if trent green never got hurt, it would hve been interesting seeing him play with the "greatest show on turf"

feltdizz
01-31-2010, 07:32 PM
if trent green never got hurt, it would hve been interesting seeing him play with the "greatest show on turf"

I forgot about him...

Steel Life
01-31-2010, 08:58 PM
Go back & look at his record during those years I outlined...hardly difference making. Those are things that can't be ignored when evaluating his career or candidacy. There a ton of great players who haven't gotten in, so to "rubber-stamp" a Jeckyl & Hyde career for HOF seems premature & short-sided. I'm all in favor of players with varied careers getting in (i.e. supported Swann & Monk), but a gap in your career like that doesn't just get glossed over.

Maybe more than any other player in recent memory, Warner's career will be seen as either half-full or half-empty when his name comes up. But for Warner to fall short of the HOF would be no disservice to his career or story.

SteelTorch
01-31-2010, 09:35 PM
Go back & look at his record during those years I outlined...hardly difference making. Those are things that can't be ignored when evaluating his career or candidacy. There a ton of great players who haven't gotten in, so to "rubber-stamp" a Jeckyl & Hyde career for HOF seems premature & short-sided. I'm all in favor of players with varied careers getting in (i.e. supported Swann & Monk), but a gap in your career like that doesn't just get glossed over.

Maybe more than any other player in recent memory, Warner's career will be seen as either half-full or half-empty when his name comes up. But for Warner to fall short of the HOF would be no disservice to his career or story.
It's the nature of football. Not every QB is going to have a lights-out season every year. Even then, his good seasons far outway his bad ones. It's not "jekyll and hyde" as you put it.

To focus on his negative records, while completely ignoring his good ones (which is exactly what you're doing) is wrong.

stlrz d
01-31-2010, 10:13 PM
if trent green never got hurt, it would hve been interesting seeing him play with the "greatest show on turf"

I agree.

I think Warner belongs in the Hall of Really, Really Good, but not great, Players.

SteelAbility
02-02-2010, 12:48 PM
Now the question is what odds is Vegas offering for bets on Warner coming out of retirement. What a feel-good story if Warner comes out of retirement and ends up facing Brett Favre in next year's NFCCG. :P

Steel Life
02-03-2010, 10:47 PM
Go back & look at his record during those years I outlined...hardly difference making. Those are things that can't be ignored when evaluating his career or candidacy. There a ton of great players who haven't gotten in, so to "rubber-stamp" a Jeckyl & Hyde career for HOF seems premature & short-sided. I'm all in favor of players with varied careers getting in (i.e. supported Swann & Monk), but a gap in your career like that doesn't just get glossed over.

Maybe more than any other player in recent memory, Warner's career will be seen as either half-full or half-empty when his name comes up. But for Warner to fall short of the HOF would be no disservice to his career or story.
It's the nature of football. Not every QB is going to have a lights-out season every year. Even then, his good seasons far outway his bad ones. It's not "jekyll and hyde" as you put it.

To focus on his negative records, while completely ignoring his good ones (which is exactly what you're doing) is wrong.
ITs a good point Torch, but I felt that the GOOD of his career is so well-known & put out there that I was curious as to his down years. And you're right, the nature of the game does make it hard to have a "lights out" season every year, but it is that ability to sustain excellence that makes HOFers. In some ways, Warner is our generation's Jim Plunkett, who also revived a listless career to recapture glory. Now I use Plunkett illustrate the revival of a career, not to suggest they are equal, as I believe Warner is much better. But I also have a hard time putting him in ahead of Stabler, who has a superior W-L record & a SB championship as well. I'm just glad they get to settle down for a few years before they're eligible for consideration & a proper view of their career can be taken.