Tomlin shouldn't have lost faith in veterans

[fordfixer]

Harris: Tomlin shouldn't have lost faith in veterans

By John Harris, TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Monday, December 28, 2009
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsbu ... 59679.html (http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_659679.html)

See, Mike Tomlin. This is why you don't hang your football team out to dry with four games left in the season.

Steelers 23, Baltimore 20.

You don't throw dirt on your players, no matter how angry you may be at the time, because they're the defending Super Bowl champions.

They might not be what you want them to be, but they're not as bad as you wanted us to believe following the 27-24 loss to Oakland on Dec. 6.

Let's face it. Your Steelers aren't as good as they were a year ago -- injuries, poor play and bad luck saw to that.

Still, at 8-7, they're in mathematical contention for a playoff berth if they win next week's regular-season finale at Miami and the football gods smile upon them as they did at critical times during Sunday's nail-biter against the Ravens at Heinz Field.

"We never lost confidence. We're champions. We know what it feels like to be champions," said veteran nose tackle Casey Hampton, who has played his best this season down the stretch. "We know what we're capable of doing when we play to the best of our ability."

On the one hand, Tomlin's critical eye toward his players -- and his defense in particular -- may have sparked yesterday's must-win. I'm sure that's what he would like for us to believe.

On the other hand, the Steelers are a prideful group led by veterans who know how to take a punch. When backed into a corner, they came out swinging.

"It shows the character of this team and our leadership," said defensive co-captain James Farrior, who had eight tackles and an interception that set up the Steelers' first field goal yesterday. "We've had a rough season. We haven't played as well as we wanted.

"We feel these last couple of weeks if we can get these wins, we can redeem ourselves and sort of get this ship righted."

Farrior is typical of the Steelers' veteran leadership. At 34, he leads the team in tackles and has recorded 100-plus tackles for the seventh consecutive year.

Farrior has heard the talk about him losing a step in pass coverage. It's true. He's not as fast as he was a year ago.

But nobody's heart is bigger. Farrior is a gamer. If he can walk, he can play.

Next Sunday's game at Miami will mark the fourth consecutive season in which he has started every game.

Do the defending Super Bowl champions need to redeem themselves for losing five games in a row and all but knocking themselves out of the playoff race?

"For us, more than anything, we wanted to prove it to ourselves," Farrior said. "There are a lot of people out there saying we can't do it. This is basically the playoffs for us. It's win or go home. That's our attitude right now."

The Steelers' veteran leadership is personified in 34-year-old cornerback Deshea Townsend.

Townsend was a starting cornerback in 2008, but he lost his job because of injury and has been relegated to backup/nickel back status.

When Tomlin promised lineup changes a few weeks ago, Townsend's name wasn't in the mix. He was passed over for rookie Joe Burnett, who didn't get the job done. When starter William Gay struggled, Tomlin deferred to the veteran against Baltimore.

The more things change, the more they remain the same.

Look for No. 26 in the starting lineup against Miami.

"It's about doing your job, staying humble, waiting on your opportunity," Townsend said. "My thing is to do whatever for the team. When coach told me earlier in the week, I was very excited for the opportunity to help our team win. To play 60 minutes, it's all about getting that timing back, getting in the flow of the game."

Townsend was reunited with cornerback Ike Taylor, who had a fumble recovery and his first career sack against the Ravens.

"Ike had an excellent game," said Townsend, who finished with seven tackles. "I think he was excited to see me out there. It was a great feeling to have -- me and Ike back at corner."

Tomlin selected his words carefully after the Steelers won their second straight.

What was once a bad football team has suddenly become a fortuitous one.

"I know that sometimes when you lose, you look for deeper reasons why, but every week, I come up here and tell you it's a play here or a play there. You've got to make significant plays at significant moments," Tomlin said. "When we've lost, it's because we haven't. When we won, it's because we have."

Townsend views the Steelers' season with a veteran's wisdom.

Where it was once easier for others to doubt the defending champions, Townsend said the players never lost faith.

"We haven't been getting some of the breaks that we got today," Townsend said. "That's how the ball bounces. Fortunately, it finally bounced our way."

[Oviedo]

Stupid article. Tomlin was right on. If not for Mason's drop this same group of veterans would had lost another game because they can't pass defend. They needed to be served notice and changes need to be made in the off season.

[stlrz d]

Stupid article. Tomlin was right on. If not for Mason's drop this same group of veterans would had lost another game because they can't pass defend. They needed to be served notice and changes need to be made in the off season.

I'm going to give you a hint as to what Harris does with his articles:

:stirpot

Either people love you and they read every word you write...or people hate you and they read every word you write. He is in the latter category.

It's all part of the game.

[Mister Pittsburgh]

Deshea looked pathetic in coverage and Ike missed a plethora of tackles that gave up huge runs.

[feltdizz]

So... at 8-7 all is forgiven?

[phillyesq]

Stupid article. Tomlin was right on. If not for Mason's drop this same group of veterans would had lost another game because they can't pass defend. They needed to be served notice and changes need to be made in the off season.

I'm going to give you a hint as to what Harris does with his articles:

:stirpot

Either people love you and they read every word you write...or people hate you and they read every word you write. He is in the latter category.

It's all part of the game.

I think you're giving him too much credit. I remember reading one article from him this year that seemed to have some insight. Aside from that, he generally seems to write these quasi-controversial puff pieces that don't really stir the pot, or even show that he follows the team any more than a casual fan.

[TallyStiller]

Bullspit. This is an offense first team now. Ben is it's leader, and you strategize to place the burden of winning there. The onsides last week was a great example. This week, if he had faith in the defense, he'd've run another plunge into the line on 3rd and 11 at the 41, run clock, and punted it back to them with a minute left inside the 20 with no timeouts. Last year's defense wins that easily. This year, no friggin' chance... so we throw on that down, the Rats make yet another stupid mistake, and the game's over.

Frankly, if Tomlin had awakened to this reality a little earlier and given up on the defense SOONER, we'd be sitting here talking about playoff seeding, not hoping to make it. 3 point losses at the end of ballgames don't happen if you keep the accelerator mashed to the floor and keep racking up points... and against a defense as hapless as KC's or Oakland's, you've gotta do it. Ben BA, and MT have to get on the same page and understand that if this is what we are, we need to play like it.

[Oviedo]

And we continue to see everyone blamed except the person with the primary responsibility for fixing the defense...St Le beau

[Shoe]

I'm going to give you a hint as to what Harris does with his articles:

:stirpot

Precisely. To insinuate that, among other things, Townsend was unfairly passed over because of his age is stupidity.

[feltdizz]

And we continue to see everyone blamed except the person with the primary responsibility for fixing the defense...St Le beau

Every time we score a TD... we give up a TD by the D. I swear... it's like the board will explode if someone blames bad word LeBeau

[msp26505]

Sorry, but you BA apologists have to get off LeBeau's case. :nono

It's not LeBeau's fault that he has a quickly aging core of players and that the Steelers inept DB's were exposed in Polamolu's absence.

Give him something to work with and he gets the job done. He has a long track record of success to support this.

Similarly, Arians' resume supports the argument that he is a lousy OC. He is stubborn, can't make adjustments, and can't call a game worth crap.

But boy, those offensive stats are impressive (unless you look at wins and losses.) :roll:

[papillon]

Okay, it's Lebeau's fault the defensive secondary is God awful. Okay, great, now what? Fire him? Did he forget how to coach a defense? Call a game? Contrary to popular belief the Steelers defense did not play soft and stop blitzing early in the year in the 4th quarter, they simply weren't executing.

Okay, Lebeau has been blamed and to be held accountable we'll fire him, keep Arians, Ligashesky and Ray Horton. So, hire the new defensive coordinator since we are now rid of the problem.

This is the Steelers people they do not make knee jerk reactions because things don't go their way for one, two or even three years. Wake up.

Pappy

[MaxAMillion]

Part of the reason the Steeler defense has taken a fall is because they are still dependent on guys like Farrior and Townsend. The Steelers used to have guys in the pipeline ready to step in for aging players. They don't have that at LB or at Safety.

Colbert has been able to mostly get away without criticism this year. I think he shares some responsibility for the holes in the roster. He has hit on almost all of his first round picks, but has had a lot of struggles with middle round picks of late (Wallace being an obvious exception). If you are not going to spend major money in FA, you had better draft well to compensate. I think some draft struggles have led to some of the decline. The Steelers are not that deep anymore.

[DHSF]

Colbert has been able to mostly get away without criticism this year. I think he shares some responsibility for the holes in the roster. He has hit on almost all of his first round picks, but has had a lot of struggles with middle round picks of late (Wallace being an obvious exception). If you are not going to spend major money in FA, you had better draft well to compensate. I think some draft struggles have led to some of the decline. The Steelers are not that deep anymore.

This is a good point. We drafted Anthony Smith and William Gay in the mid rounds to bolster our secondary. Smith is gone and Gay doesn't look like he has what it takes to be a starting corner. Let's hope that Lewis and/or Burnett develop into starters. Regardless of how this season ends up, there will be a lot of holes to fill in the the draft.

[Oviedo]

Sorry, but you BA apologists have to get off LeBeau's case. :nono

It's not LeBeau's fault that he has a quickly aging core of players and that the Steelers inept DB's were exposed in Polamolu's absence.

Give him something to work with and he gets the job done. He has a long track record of success to support this.

Similarly, Arians' resume supports the argument that he is a lousy OC. He is stubborn, can't make adjustments, and can't call a game worth crap.

But boy, those offensive stats are impressive (unless you look at wins and losses.) :roll:

This perfectly illustrates the point that I was trying to make about La Beau being immune from criticism even though it is his defense. No one is a BA apologist, as a matter of fact I think he has taken the offense as far as he can since he has transformed it into a more potent quick strike offense for suited for the current challenges of the way the NFL now. Arians never got a pass for an aging, injured (Simmons and Marvel Smith), inexperienced OL and the loss of FWP and Mendenhall last season but we blindly rush to use that excure for LeBeau about the defense.

Our defense cost us this season. That is beyond contention, but we see Arians blamed, Tomlin blamed, players blamed but never La Beau. Since this is a discussion board I only bring this up because maybe, just maybe, we have a defensive coordinator who is undoubtedly a great coach and person blindly holding onto an defensive scheme not best fit the players we NOW have on the roster and that is the reason we have had this lackluster performance this season. He holds on to "his" 3-4 scheme and we never consider transitioning to something else. We complain about an "aging" defensive line but instead of adopting a scheme that would allow younger players to play sooner because they are familiar with a scheme out of college we maintain a defensive scheme that requires young players to take a 1 to 2 year "redshirt" to learn a new position on the DL or as a LB. This transition requirement has been far from successful the last few seasons. Does this make sense? Could this finally be coming back to haunt us and that is what we are seeing this eason?

Just saying we can't have it both ways after this season and all options should be considered and all coahes performance and suitability for the future should be evaluated.

[stlrz d]

I gave him a pass on the line when it stunk, Ovie.

I absolutely can not stand his situational play calling. That frustrates me to no end.

[msp26505]

Sorry, but you BA apologists have to get off LeBeau's case. :nono

It's not LeBeau's fault that he has a quickly aging core of players and that the Steelers inept DB's were exposed in Polamolu's absence.

Give him something to work with and he gets the job done. He has a long track record of success to support this.

Similarly, Arians' resume supports the argument that he is a lousy OC. He is stubborn, can't make adjustments, and can't call a game worth crap.

But boy, those offensive stats are impressive (unless you look at wins and losses.) :roll:

This perfectly illustrates the point that I was trying to make about La Beau being immune from criticism even though it is his defense. No one is a BA apologist, as a matter of fact I think he has taken the offense as far as he can since he has transformed it into a more potent quick strike offense for suited for the current challenges of the way the NFL now. Arians never got a pass for an aging, injured (Simmons and Marvel Smith), inexperienced OL and the loss of FWP and Mendenhall last season but we blindly rush to use that excure for LeBeau about the defense.

Our defense cost us this season. That is beyond contention, but we see Arians blamed, Tomlin blamed, players blamed but never La Beau. Since this is a discussion board I only bring this up because maybe, just maybe, we have a defensive coordinator who is undoubtedly a great coach and person blindly holding onto an defensive scheme not best fit the players we NOW have on the roster and that is the reason we have had this lackluster performance this season. He holds on to "his" 3-4 scheme and we never consider transitioning to something else. We complain about an "aging" defensive line but instead of adopting a scheme that would allow younger players to play sooner because they are familiar with a scheme out of college we maintain a defensive scheme that requires young players to take a 1 to 2 year "redshirt" to learn a new position on the DL or as a LB. This transition requirement has been far from successful the last few seasons. Does this make sense? Could this finally be coming back to haunt us and that is what we are seeing this eason?

Just saying we can't have it both ways after this season and all options should be considered and all coahes performance and suitability for the future should be evaluated.

I see your point, I just disagree with it.

I think the problems on D are more an issue of personnel than scheme. It happens to every team eventually...your stars get old and have to be replaced.

I think Colbert bears some responsibility on both sides of the ball (particularly o-line and DB's) but the fact remains that the OFFENSE has not helped the defense one bit this year.

When necessary in years past, the DEFENSE has carried this team...INCLUDING last years' SB.

Ben is a miracle worker at times (and takes terrible sacks and throws untimely INT's at others), but BA has done NOTHING to maximize Ben's talents and minimize his mistakes.

You do that mostly by establishing a running game...and not the "smoke and mirrors", lots-of-yards-but-completely-unreliable version we currently see. Watch the Ravens in the second half (particularly the third quarter) of Sunday's game for an example. I guarantee our D looks better if the O holds onto the ball all quarter.

I think Arians shortcomings are pretty obvious to most.

On the other hand, if the defense ain't broke don't fix it. The Steeler D has led the league in every conceivable category for much LeBeau's tenure. Sometimes it was legit and sometimes it was statistical anomaly, but no team other than the Ravens can come close to the Steelers level of excellence defensively.

I'm not necessarily opposed to the 4-3 someday (even next year if the personnel dictates), but did you really want to make the switch to it the offseason after the D was one of the best in the history of the game?

I just don't think the problem is LeBeau.

[Shawn]

Stupid article. Tomlin was right on. If not for Mason's drop this same group of veterans would had lost another game because they can't pass defend. They needed to be served notice and changes need to be made in the off season.

$$$...Tomlin made the right call and we won the game.

This Steelers O is arguably the best in the history of the franchise...yet we are 8-7? We have a 4000 yard passer, 2 1000 yard WRs, and a 1000 yard running back. We put points on the board. How many games did the D lose for us this year? How many games did our STs and D lose this year?

My observations...this D is suffering from a few things. One...obviously Troy. But a D can't revolve around one player...great Ds step up. Two...the loss of McFadden was HUGE. Very few gave the man the respect he deserved...and we let him leave for a very modest contract. Ignorant. And third...our front line is OLD. Our D looks fatigued about mid 3rd and on. Farrior isn't exactly a spring chicken either.

Tomlin made the ballsy call. I don't believe he made a call to slight his D. I believe he made the call to win the game. It appears it was the correct call. Good for him. True Steeler coach.

[Shawn]

And let me say something about Lebeau...the guy is a legend. This isn't a Lebeau issue. It's not a scheme issue. It's a personel issue...its a heart issue...its a talent issue.

[feltdizz]

No one is a BA apologist... I was for a minute when we kept getting leads late in games and the D was blowing it. However, the empty backfield and ignoring Mendenhall on 3rd and 1's.. and sitiuational playcalling pizz me off and lead me to believe Ben has BA in his pocket.

All that being said... I fail to see how Lebeau gets a pass this year. We lost Ben, Batch, Holmes, Ward, FWP and Mend for a few games the last 2 seasons and the offense was still respectable. We lose Troy and Smith and we fall to pieces on defense. That is coaching and scheme and whatever else you want to call it.

[msp26505]

This Steelers O is arguably the best in the history of the franchise...yet we are 8-7? We have a 4000 yard passer, 2 1000 yard WRs, and a 1000 yard running back. We put points on the board.

This is another example of a statistical anomaly. Yards only matter in fantasy football.

-The Steelers are 13th in the league in scoring offense.

-The Steelers can't convert third and short (and rarely line up in a power formation to even attempt it).

-The Steelers are poor in the redzone.

-The Steeler offense rarely helps the defense by sustaining time-consuming drives...particularly not at critical times in games.

-Arians situational play calling is horrendous.

I'm sorry, but there is no way other than yards that it can be argued that this offense is the best in the history of the franchise. Yards don't win games.

[papillon]

This Steelers O is arguably the best in the history of the franchise...yet we are 8-7? We have a 4000 yard passer, 2 1000 yard WRs, and a 1000 yard running back. We put points on the board.

This is another example of a statistical anomaly. Yards only matter in fantasy football.

-The Steelers are 13th in the league in scoring offense.

-The Steelers can't convert third and short (and rarely line up in a power formation to even attempt it).

-The Steelers are poor in the redzone.

-The Steeler offense rarely helps the defense by sustaining time-consuming drives...particularly not at critical times in games.

-Arians situational play calling is horrendous.

I'm sorry, but there is no way other than yards that it can be argued that this offense is the best in the history of the franchise. Yards don't win games.


Yup, there it is...stats are for fantasy football, unless, "W"s follow I could care less if they pass for 5,000 yards, rush for 1,600 yards and have three 1,000 WRs. If you're losing games it's all window dressing.

Pappy

[feltdizz]

I take it back... Besides the empty backfield and a few more runs I'm all for BA coming back.
We lost 5 games due to ST's and the D... Mostly the D though.. Unless BA's job is to keep the ball for 50 minutes a game I fail to see how he is to blame. We lose 2 guys on D and now the worst offenses in football are offensive powerhouses.. LeBeau is a legend but even legends have bad years.

[Shawn]

This Steelers O is arguably the best in the history of the franchise...yet we are 8-7? We have a 4000 yard passer, 2 1000 yard WRs, and a 1000 yard running back. We put points on the board.

This is another example of a statistical anomaly. Yards only matter in fantasy football.

-The Steelers are 13th in the league in scoring offense.

-The Steelers can't convert third and short (and rarely line up in a power formation to even attempt it).

-The Steelers are poor in the redzone.

-The Steeler offense rarely helps the defense by sustaining time-consuming drives...particularly not at critical times in games.

-Arians situational play calling is horrendous.

I'm sorry, but there is no way other than yards that it can be argued that this offense is the best in the history of the franchise. Yards don't win games.


It's impossible for me to understand anyone focusing their attention on this O. I'm not saying they don't have some red zone issues but this isn't an O problem. This is a ST and D issue. Total yards dont tell the whole story but YPP and YPC tell alot more. Of the top 32 QBs only one passer has a higher ypp than Ben's 8.6 ypp. His 98.9 passer rating is nothing to snuff at either. Lets move on the Mendenhall who is running at 4.6 ypc...which is better than 4 of the top 5 backs in the league. Holmes is averging 15.9...Ward 12.7 and our surprise rookie is averaging 18.7 ypc...second best in the league for any WR with more than 30 catches.

So, are our redzone issues a problem with talent? That would be a no. From a talent perspective I can't think of a better team offensively in the history of our franchise. Our O problems lie square on BAs shoulders. Most of the guys on this board could coach this team to more points.

This is a defensive and STs issue. Lets focus on the problems rather than our strengths for the purpose of this discussion.

[feltdizz]

So our O is powerful but we are not the best redzone team....

Do you really think trading 2 fg's for TD's would solve our problems this year? I think people missing the point with all this focus on BA and the redzone... Some people act like the other team would run the same plays if we scored more points... If we traded 3's for 7's two times a game that's 8 more points and the other team would become more aggressive and still march down the field and score a TD.... teams are putting up record numbers in the 4th quarter.. It's not the red zone at all... It's the D.

The only problem we have is 3rd down on offense. We could be better on 3rd down.

[msp26505]

This Steelers O is arguably the best in the history of the franchise...yet we are 8-7? We have a 4000 yard passer, 2 1000 yard WRs, and a 1000 yard running back. We put points on the board.

This is another example of a statistical anomaly. Yards only matter in fantasy football.

-The Steelers are 13th in the league in scoring offense.

-The Steelers can't convert third and short (and rarely line up in a power formation to even attempt it).

-The Steelers are poor in the redzone.

-The Steeler offense rarely helps the defense by sustaining time-consuming drives...particularly not at critical times in games.

-Arians situational play calling is horrendous.

I'm sorry, but there is no way other than yards that it can be argued that this offense is the best in the history of the franchise. Yards don't win games.


It's impossible for me to understand anyone focusing their attention on this O. I'm not saying they don't have some red zone issues but this isn't an O problem. This is a ST and D issue. Total yards dont tell the whole story but YPP and YPC tell alot more. Of the top 32 QBs only one passer has a higher ypp than Ben's 8.6 ypp. His 98.9 passer rating is nothing to snuff at either. Lets move on the Mendenhall who is running at 4.6 ypc...which is better than 4 of the top 5 backs in the league. Holmes is averging 15.9...Ward 12.7 and our surprise rookie is averaging 18.7 ypc...second best in the league for any WR with more than 30 catches.

So, are our redzone issues a problem with talent? That would be a no. From a talent perspective I can't think of a better team offensively in the history of our franchise. Our O problems lie square on BAs shoulders. Most of the guys on this board could coach this team to more points.

This is a defensive and STs issue. Lets focus on the problems rather than our strengths for the purpose of this discussion.

I am definitely not excusing either the D or ST's. They have both been bad and are each partly to blame for this team's mediocrity this year.

But I fall back on the wise words of Mark Twain...there are "lies, damn lies, and statistics".

This offense is great at times, but often not at the RIGHT times. Total yards, YPC and YPA are great IF they lead to points and wins. Otherwise they are only great to fantasy footballers.

I don't play fantasy football and my team's offense is squarely in the middle of the pack at 13th in PPG and 8 wins.

[feltdizz]

I remember hearing "it's not what you make it's what you spend..."

we can put up a ton of yards and score a ton of points but if we give up more points on D we still lose. If we put up 10 points and only get 100 yards and win who cares...

My point is... The D stinks right now.... The offense can't save the D like they did in GB the other week for a whole season. If we we falling behind all season I would see the beef with the offense. But most games we are ahead and the D breaks. What also amazes me is EVERYONE thought the Ravens game with Dixon was an automatic loss and when the D gave up 17 yards on 3rd and 20 and 40 yards on 4th and 3 people still blamed BA for the loss... Instead of giving crdit for putting Dixon in a position to win.

[Iron Shiek]

I remember hearing "it's not what you make it's what you spend..."

we can put up a ton of yards and score a ton of points but if we give up more points on D we still lose. If we put up 10 points and only get 100 yards and win who cares...

My point is... The D stinks right now.... The offense can't save the D like they did in GB the other week for a whole season. If we we falling behind all season I would see the beef with the offense. But most games we are ahead and the D breaks. What also amazes me is EVERYONE thought the Ravens game with Dixon was an automatic loss and when the D gave up 17 yards on 3rd and 20 and 40 yards on 4th and 3 people still blamed BA for the loss... Instead of giving crdit for putting Dixon in a position to win.


I actually recall several "kudos to BA" posts after that game.

[Shawn]

This Steelers O is arguably the best in the history of the franchise...yet we are 8-7? We have a 4000 yard passer, 2 1000 yard WRs, and a 1000 yard running back. We put points on the board.

This is another example of a statistical anomaly. Yards only matter in fantasy football.

-The Steelers are 13th in the league in scoring offense.

-The Steelers can't convert third and short (and rarely line up in a power formation to even attempt it).

-The Steelers are poor in the redzone.

-The Steeler offense rarely helps the defense by sustaining time-consuming drives...particularly not at critical times in games.

-Arians situational play calling is horrendous.

I'm sorry, but there is no way other than yards that it can be argued that this offense is the best in the history of the franchise. Yards don't win games.


It's impossible for me to understand anyone focusing their attention on this O. I'm not saying they don't have some red zone issues but this isn't an O problem. This is a ST and D issue. Total yards dont tell the whole story but YPP and YPC tell alot more. Of the top 32 QBs only one passer has a higher ypp than Ben's 8.6 ypp. His 98.9 passer rating is nothing to snuff at either. Lets move on the Mendenhall who is running at 4.6 ypc...which is better than 4 of the top 5 backs in the league. Holmes is averging 15.9...Ward 12.7 and our surprise rookie is averaging 18.7 ypc...second best in the league for any WR with more than 30 catches.

So, are our redzone issues a problem with talent? That would be a no. From a talent perspective I can't think of a better team offensively in the history of our franchise. Our O problems lie square on BAs shoulders. Most of the guys on this board could coach this team to more points.

This is a defensive and STs issue. Lets focus on the problems rather than our strengths for the purpose of this discussion.

I am definitely not excusing either the D or ST's. They have both been bad and are each partly to blame for this team's mediocrity this year.

But I fall back on the wise words of Mark Twain...there are "lies, damn lies, and statistics".

This offense is great at times, but often not at the RIGHT times. Total yards, YPC and YPA are great IF they lead to points and wins. Otherwise they are only great to fantasy footballers.

I don't play fantasy football and my team's offense is squarely in the middle of the pack at 13th in PPG and 8 wins.


Fair enough...but this O is putting enough points on the board for us to win games. My point about this being our best O comes from a pure talent perspective. If our D and STs would have played well we would be 12+ in the win department. We would be sitting at #2 and all this Jets/Ravens loss stuff would be a moot point.

[feltdizz]

Shawn... This board is brainwashed. LOL. I believe they scream at BA when the D is getting exposed. Maybe they think Lebeau is BA? are you gonna trust them or your lying eyes?

Lebeau is graded on his past success... BA is graded on Lebeaus present failures.

[msp26505]

Shawn... This board is brainwashed. LOL. I believe they scream at BA when the D is getting exposed. Maybe they think Lebeau is BA? are you gonna trust them or your lying eyes?

Lebeau is graded on his past success... BA is graded on Lebeaus present failures.

Lebeau is graded on his 13th ranked scoring offense and inability to grind out a win.

[Shawn]

Shawn... This board is brainwashed. LOL. I believe they scream at BA when the D is getting exposed. Maybe they think Lebeau is BA? are you gonna trust them or your lying eyes?

Lebeau is graded on his past success... BA is graded on Lebeaus present failures.

I'm somewhere in the middle on this...I don't like BA. I think a child could get more points out of this VERY talented team. We should be putting up 30+ every game with these guys. With that said, the O is not the problem. We lost several games because we gave up a kick return. Shoot, we gave up a return TD like 7 games in a row? Our D gave up in the 4th quarter in more games than I can count. If we correct ST and our D issues our O is strong enough to win us 12+ games.

[_SteeL_CurtaiN_]

Bullspit. This is an offense first team now. Ben is it's leader, and you strategize to place the burden of winning there. The onsides last week was a great example. This week, if he had faith in the defense, he'd've run another plunge into the line on 3rd and 11 at the 41, run clock, and punted it back to them with a minute left inside the 20 with no timeouts. Last year's defense wins that easily. This year, no friggin' chance... so we throw on that down, the Rats make yet another stupid mistake, and the game's over.

Frankly, if Tomlin had awakened to this reality a little earlier and given up on the defense SOONER, we'd be sitting here talking about playoff seeding, not hoping to make it. 3 point losses at the end of ballgames don't happen if you keep the accelerator mashed to the floor and keep racking up points... and against a defense as hapless as KC's or Oakland's, you've gotta do it. Ben BA, and MT have to get on the same page and understand that if this is what we are, we need to play like it.

:Agree Love it! The NFL is a business and the business of NFL teams is winning championships, it's not about being committed to PLAYERS ( see Bill Belicheat ) it's about commitment to winning. Injury or no injury if they can't get it done they can't get it done and as in any business the sooner weakness is recognized and addressed the better!