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SteelCrazy
12-23-2009, 02:31 AM
I know we paid a lot of money to keep this guy, but he just isnt cutting it as a LT. He gets beat by the speed rush very easily and even gets bull rushed. He isn't 75% of Marvel Smith and Smith was barely above average. There has been a lot of talk of drafting a DB (even by me) in the 1st rd, but if an elite LT is available at our pick, we need to grab him. It's time to put Max back on the right side.

Thoughts on Max and his play?

frankthetank1
12-23-2009, 09:10 AM
he got killed by matthews last game but overall i think he has been pretty good this season. not as good as he played last year but i think he is a solid LT. I do think we could do better at center and RG than hartwig and essex

Oviedo
12-23-2009, 09:31 AM
Starks has been solid all season facing the best pass rushers every week the opponent could throw at us. Last game was his worse for sure but it doesn't take away that for the last two seasons he has been the best OL on the team and has done a credible job.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
12-23-2009, 09:35 AM
As I said in another post, this was the first game I can truely say Starks didn't earn his new contract. Hopefully, he had some type of leg issue because his feet were very lazy. If he did, hope he gets healthy soon because Suggs will be back. I'm not going to scrap him yet. If he continues to struggle then we have problems.

steelblood
12-23-2009, 09:52 AM
Max has had a great season. Very good LTs get beat every Sunday as they usually face the best pass rushers in the league. Max has shown that he doesn't need constant help out there, which frees up a back to go out for passes.

pfelix73
12-23-2009, 10:16 AM
Yea, Max has had a very good season thus far. He's our starting LT for the foreseeable future. Will only get better as he gets more playing time.

:tt1

calmkiller
12-23-2009, 10:47 AM
Yea, Max has had a very good season thus far. He's our starting LT for the foreseeable future. Will only get better as he gets more playing time.

:tt1


:HeadBanger

So hes going to get quicker with age?

ramblinjim
12-23-2009, 10:54 AM
Is this his first year or second year as a FT starter at LT? I mean, I think he's done a pretty good job. He'll never be "top 5 in the league" but he's played alright.

Pittsburgh
12-23-2009, 11:09 AM
Starks has been solid all season facing the best pass rushers every week the opponent could throw at us. Last game was his worse for sure but it doesn't take away that for the last two seasons he has been the best OL on the team and has done a credible job.

I second that.

He made Jared Allen a nonentity during the Vikings game, which was impressive in it's own right. Before he met up with Allen, he shut down Vanden Bosch, Odom and Dumervil. That's a pretty impressive group of players to shut down on a weekly basis.

While he didn't play his best game against the Packers, I feel Starks is the least of our concerns when it comes to the o-line.

ikestops85
12-23-2009, 11:22 AM
I agree with most that Starks has been playing pretty well most of the year. Mathews did abuse him but that seems to be the anomaly and not the rule. Starks has done a much better job at LT than I ever thought he would.

SteelCrazy
12-23-2009, 02:25 PM
Max has given up 4 sacks as of 12/04....He gave up at least 2 more against Green Bay and I'm not sure on the other two games after 12/04/09. So he has given up at least 6 sacks this season, maybe more......Back to the right for Max

RuthlessBurgher
12-23-2009, 02:36 PM
Is this his first year or second year as a FT starter at LT?

Marvel was the starter coming out of camp last year, and he started the first 5 games of the season before getting injured. Max took over the LT spot from that point forward and has started 14 games last season (11 in the regular season and 3 in the playoffs) plus another 14 games this season so far.

Slapstick
12-23-2009, 03:14 PM
Max has given up 4 sacks as of 12/04....He gave up at least 2 more against Green Bay and I'm not sure on the other two games after 12/04/09. So he has given up at least 6 sacks this season, maybe more......Back to the right for Max

How many are from Ben extending plays?

BURGH86STEEL
12-23-2009, 03:16 PM
Max has given up 4 sacks as of 12/04....He gave up at least 2 more against Green Bay and I'm not sure on the other two games after 12/04/09. So he has given up at least 6 sacks this season, maybe more......Back to the right for Max

Your analysis of Starks could not be more wrong. He is fine at LT and is having a very good year. He had a bad game last week or maybe Matthews was having one of those games. It happens. Fans expect players to play well every week. The nature of the game dictates that having good games every week is not going to happen. You really believe that Starks will shut out all the great pass rushes on the left side every week? Time to leave fantasy island.

Jason Peters was considered one of the best LT last season. I believe he gave up 11 sacks in 08.

Flasteel
12-23-2009, 03:36 PM
Max has given up 4 sacks as of 12/04....He gave up at least 2 more against Green Bay and I'm not sure on the other two games after 12/04/09. So he has given up at least 6 sacks this season, maybe more......Back to the right for Max

Your analysis of Starks could not be more wrong. He is fine at LT and is having a very good year. He had a bad game last week or maybe Matthews was having one of those games. It happens. Fans expect players to play well every week. The nature of the game dictates that having good games every week is not going to happen. You really believe that Starks will shut out all the great pass rushes on the left side every week? Time to leave fantasy island.

Jason Peters was considered one of the best LT last season. I believe he gave up 11 sacks in 08.

$$$$$$

Shoe
12-23-2009, 03:58 PM
Haha... it says a ton about our expectations, when Max Starks "is our best lineman", "the least of our concerns", etc.

I was a big hater on Starks, and I'll admit that he has exceeded my expectations of him... and I think he's evolved into an upper half, non-elite, LT :P (if you classify LT's into groups as: elite, solid, scrubs--he has made it to the upper half of the "solid" group, moving up from the "scrubs" list).

I'm not criticizing Starks for last week; I've been on him too much in the past to get on him for last week's game (it's ironic too--cuz I always felt this guy who be best served in December, when the weather is bad... it slows everyone else down, to his level was my theory). He's doing a credible job. Keep it up, Starks.

pittpete
12-23-2009, 04:01 PM
IMHO Starks has had a good season.

I rewatched the 4th quarter drive & he was winded.
A few series before he was on the sideline breathing heavily.
Perhaps a little more conditioning during the year and he plays better late in games

frankthetank1
12-23-2009, 06:06 PM
Max has given up 4 sacks as of 12/04....He gave up at least 2 more against Green Bay and I'm not sure on the other two games after 12/04/09. So he has given up at least 6 sacks this season, maybe more......Back to the right for Max

How many are from Ben extending plays?

thats an excellent point. most of the sacks ben has taken this season has been a result of holding on to the ball forever and trying to make a play. there havent been too many sacks when ben drops back and there is a guy in his face right away (except for the browns game). last season on the other hand there were a lot of sacks when ben had no chance. i will never get too down on ben for the sacks because he makes so many amazing plays by holding the ball forever, but i also wont blame the o-line too much either. last season was a different story

SteelCrazy
12-23-2009, 09:32 PM
Just re-watched the game and he was atrocious last night. Matthews abused him, but it was more than that. I know the guys were tired on that final drive, but he basically quit. He should have given up 3 sacks on that final drive. One actually occurred, one was not counted due to defensive holding and another Ben miraculously escaped after he whiffed. His effort was non-existent on that final drive.