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steelerkeylargo
10-13-2009, 02:52 PM
A source with the Pittsburgh Steelers revealed to SteelCityInsider.com that Aaron Smith will undergo surgery on his right rotator cuff Friday, and that he won't be able to play for at least three months.
That leaves the Steelers' valuable defensive left end out of action until the middle of January, meaning Mike Tomlin will have to make a decision similar to the one Bill Cowher made in 1995 with Rod Woodson, when Cowher left open a roster spot until the Super Bowl that season.

steelblood
10-13-2009, 02:55 PM
A source with the Pittsburgh Steelers revealed to SteelCityInsider.com that Aaron Smith will undergo surgery on his right rotator cuff Friday, and that he won't be able to play for at least three months.
That leaves the Steelers' valuable defensive left end out of action until the middle of January, meaning Mike Tomlin will have to make a decision similar to the one Bill Cowher made in 1995 with Rod Woodson, when Cowher left open a roster spot until the Super Bowl that season.

ugh. our run defense just got much worse.

steelerkeylargo
10-13-2009, 02:56 PM
First thing I would do is get on the horn the Raiders and see if they want a first round pick back for that Richard Seymour trade.

Doogie36
10-13-2009, 03:00 PM
I look to look at things on a positive note. Aaron Smith is hard to replace but lets not get carried away with this tooo much.

Where are we getting KILLED this year???? 3rd down and in the passing game right??? With Aaron out wont teams try to run a little more than pass now???? If they do I look at that as a positive.......

I'm sick of seeing 3rd and longs and teams throwing for 1st downs.....I was so frustrated ths week being at DETROIT and watching the soft defense giving up 3rd and longs all day long.........I'd much rather a 3rd and 3 and seeing the teams try to RUN for the first which they might try to do now instead.......

Again positive thinking...........TROY can come up in the box on those 3rd and shorts....i dont see this as being a HUGE PROBLEM for us but in fact a HELP!!!!!!!!!

I'm just throwing a different twist on it.............seriously!!!!

ikestops85
10-13-2009, 03:01 PM
Sh!t

steelerkeylargo
10-13-2009, 03:02 PM
Limas Sweed and a 1st round Pick for Richard Seymour and a 3rd. Sounds good to me!

RuthlessBurgher
10-13-2009, 03:03 PM
First thing I would do is get on the horn the Raiders and see if they want a first round pick back for that Richard Seymour trade.

In Pittsburgh, first round picks are used to obtain building blocks that will be cornerstones of our franchise in the future (i.e. not to get guys that are over 30 who are playing out the final year of their contract).

Although Smith is the premier 3-4 DE in the league, I think that a DE rotation of Keisel, Hood, Kirschke, and Eason is solid enough (and we could perhaps grab Sonny Harris back off of the Carolina practice squad to put on our 53 man roster to provide depth if Tomlin decides to put Smith on I.R.)

RuthlessBurgher
10-13-2009, 03:04 PM
I look to look at things on a positive note. Aaron Smith is hard to replace but lets not get carried away with this tooo much.

Where are we getting KILLED this year???? 3rd down and in the passing game right??? With Aaron out wont teams try to run a little more than pass now???? If they do I look at that as a positive.......

I'm sick of seeing 3rd and longs and teams throwing for 1st downs.....I was so frustrated ths week being at DETROIT and watching the soft defense giving up 3rd and longs all day long.........I'd much rather a 3rd and 3 and seeing the teams try to RUN for the first which they might try to do now instead.......

Again positive thinking...........TROY can come up in the box on those 3rd and shorts....i dont see this as being a HUGE PROBLEM for us but in fact a HELP!!!!!!!!!

I'm just throwing a different twist on it.............seriously!!!!

I appreciate the effort, but it is never a help to lose your best d-lineman.

steelerkeylargo
10-13-2009, 03:10 PM
First thing I would do is get on the horn the Raiders and see if they want a first round pick back for that Richard Seymour trade.

In Pittsburgh, first round picks are used to obtain building blocks that will be cornerstones of our franchise in the future (i.e. not to get guys that are over 30 who are playing out the final year of their contract).

Although Smith is the premier 3-4 DE in the league, I think that a DE rotation of Keisel, Hood, Kirschke, and Eason is solid enough (and we could perhaps grab Sonny Harris back off of the Carolina practice squad to put on our 53 man roster to provide depth if Tomlin decides to put Smith on I.R.)

While I totally agree with the drafting philosophy the Steelers have used for years. I think you have to win every SuperBowl you can while you have the team to do it! Richard Seymour is as versatile a DL as their is in the NFL. And while he is in the last year of his contract we can work something out. Especially if next year is uncapped. With the pass D as shaky as it has been, we dont need the run D to suffer a similiar fate.

Oviedo
10-13-2009, 03:21 PM
First thing I would do is get on the horn the Raiders and see if they want a first round pick back for that Richard Seymour trade.

In Pittsburgh, first round picks are used to obtain building blocks that will be cornerstones of our franchise in the future (i.e. not to get guys that are over 30 who are playing out the final year of their contract).

Although Smith is the premier 3-4 DE in the league, I think that a DE rotation of Keisel, Hood, Kirschke, and Eason is solid enough (and we could perhaps grab Sonny Harris back off of the Carolina practice squad to put on our 53 man roster to provide depth if Tomlin decides to put Smith on I.R.)

I thought the same thing about grabbing Harris back if Smith goes on IR.

I like the idea of two young DL on the roster like Hood and Harris.

pfelix73
10-13-2009, 03:33 PM
Anyone form the TB Bucs or Vikings available? Tomlin seems to like to pluck players he knew from the past.

Conservatively thinking, picking up Harris is probably what they'll do.

I think this is horrible news. Last time we lost Aaron, remember what happened?

:tt1

RuthlessBurgher
10-13-2009, 03:44 PM
Anyone form the TB Bucs or Vikings available? Tomlin seems to like to pluck players he knew from the past.

Conservatively thinking, picking up Harris is probably what they'll do.

I think this is horrible news. Last time we lost Aaron, remember what happened?

:tt1

But back then, Nick Eason was gawd-awful (he's improved greatly since then), and we did not have a young first round talent like Ziggy on the roster either. It's awful news for sure, but should not be as bad as it was that year.

Also, back then, we had Clark Haggans as the OLB on that side. Even though Woodley hasn't had the splash plays so far this season that he had last year, he is a better than Haggas was.

Iron Shiek
10-13-2009, 04:01 PM
Pretty worrisome indeed. I'd like to see how they manage this going forward. I won't panic until I see their performance without him.

No doubt he will be missed.

proudpittsburgher
10-13-2009, 04:04 PM
Count me into the "Oh sh%t" side of this. :x :(

JTP53609
10-13-2009, 04:08 PM
not only bad for the team but i feel bad for aaron smith, this is bad news, very bad news, we just lost our best DLman

phillyesq
10-13-2009, 04:09 PM
Count me into the "Oh sh%t" side of this. :x :(

Me too. This is a huge loss.

SteelHead
10-13-2009, 04:11 PM
There is absolutely no downplaying this injury.....

It's a BIG time loss for this defense.

Here's hoping our back-ups on the D-line can fill some big shoes.

AngryAsian
10-13-2009, 04:12 PM
A source with the Pittsburgh Steelers revealed to SteelCityInsider.com that Aaron Smith will undergo surgery on his right rotator cuff Friday, and that he won't be able to play for at least three months.
That leaves the Steelers' valuable defensive left end out of action until the middle of January, meaning Mike Tomlin will have to make a decision similar to the one Bill Cowher made in 1995 with Rod Woodson, when Cowher left open a roster spot until the Super Bowl that season.

ugh. our run defense just got much worse.


We are a slight .2 yards from being number one against the run.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/team

NW Steeler
10-13-2009, 04:24 PM
Ugh....Double Ugh! Hopefully Ziggy will prove his worth of a first round pick! Imagine that, a first round pick contributing in his first year! Wow!

RuthlessBurgher
10-13-2009, 04:25 PM
not only bad for the team but i feel bad for aaron smith, this is bad news, very bad news, we just lost our best DLman

I don't feel quite as bad for Aaron himself. Although I know that he wants to be out there playing as much as anyone, at the very least he will be able to spend more time with his ill son while he is rehabbing. Unlike Mendenhall's situation, in which there was an issue with him being away from the team while rehabbing an injury, I would have no problem with Smith being away to spend time with his family during this unfortunate situation.

SteelBucks
10-13-2009, 04:42 PM
This sucks! Our run defense got absolutely shredded back in '07 when Smith was lost for the season. Here's hoping someone in the backup DE rotation steps up.

steeler_fan_in_t.o.
10-13-2009, 04:57 PM
I'm in the "Oh Sh!t" camp as well.

Eddie Spaghetti
10-13-2009, 04:58 PM
damn.

the 11 on the grass are the pittsburgh steelers, but this one hurts.

Flasteel
10-13-2009, 04:59 PM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





Dammit.

Mister Pittsburgh
10-13-2009, 05:09 PM
Ugh....Double Ugh! Hopefully Ziggy will prove his worth of a first round pick! Imagine that, a first round pick contributing in his first year! Wow!

I am sure they will attempt to hold him back as much as they can. Seems to be the Steelers way. I am sure they will play Kirshke more just cause he has more experience even though he will actually play worse than Hood is capable of doing.

BURGH86STEEL
10-13-2009, 05:12 PM
Someone or the group of players will have to step up and play well.

flippy
10-13-2009, 05:12 PM
What about Hoke?

We can also play around with a 4 man line.

Or only using 2 down linemen.

Teams passing against us less may not be so bad.

We'll be fine.

flippy
10-13-2009, 05:15 PM
Oh and this time around the offense can put up points.

If we put the pedal to the metal on offense, teams might have to pass to keep up anyway.

grotonsteel
10-13-2009, 05:22 PM
Man this hurts........Steelers just lost heart and soul of the defense.

Time for Ziggy show...

SteelBucks
10-13-2009, 06:05 PM
Man this hurts........Steelers just lost heart and soul of the defense.

Time for Ziggy show...

Here's the latest Tomlinism, at today's PC Tomlin said this about Hood: "He's not out of the oven yet." Which I guess means Ziggy isn't ready to start. Look for Eason and Kirschke to get the majority of the snaps.

Shoe
10-13-2009, 06:22 PM
I won't panic until I see their performance without him.

I'm gonna agree with this... I'm in the wait-&-see boat.
And, Ruthless made a legit point: back when Aaron went down that previous time, there were plenty of extenuating circumtances. One, he was two years younger. Two, Woodley is a better LB than Haggans. Three, we may be better prepared, personnel-wise to deal with this.

If the time frame permits, I do hope they keep the door open for him. That kinda thing (especially a guy as inspirational as Smith is) can light a fire for the team.

I know how bad this hurts Aaron though--the guy is a warrior. But I'm not ready towrite off the D or anything. I hope Ziggy steps up.

Mister Pittsburgh
10-13-2009, 07:05 PM
Man this hurts........Steelers just lost heart and soul of the defense.

Time for Ziggy show...

Here's the latest Tomlinism, at today's PC Tomlin said this about Hood: "He's not out of the oven yet." Which I guess means Ziggy isn't ready to start. Look for Eason and Kirschke to get the majority of the snaps.

Seems absolutely retarded that our D line coach said Hood is one of the best he has seen come in as a rookie in 16 years and Aaron Smith is heaping praises all over the dude saying he is extremely smart and a great talent, and he can't start at 3-4 DE mid season after all the mini camps, a full training camp, preseason, and heading into the 6th game.

Hood should absolutely, 100% hands down be the starter with whoever giving him breathers when he needs them.

SuperSize
10-13-2009, 07:06 PM
Oh and this time around the offense can put up points.

If we put the pedal to the metal on offense, teams might have to pass to keep up anyway.


Losing a man the caliber of Aaron Smith would hurt any team, and it certainly won't be good for the Steelers. However, like Flippy says, we have an offense this time.

Going into this last game vs. Detroit, I was thinking that this year's version of the Steelers is an offensive-minded team. They still have the players & the coaching to make plays when necessary on the defensive side (like dialing up three straight sacks in crunch time), but this year they are going as far as #7 & company take them, with or without Aaron Smith.

The offense is going to have to score 24+ every week, but can be done.


Pete

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
10-13-2009, 07:17 PM
Loosing Smith would be a big loss. I think we will be OK by comimttee until Hood gets some gametime in. Then we should be alright. Can't replace Smith but Hood eventually will fill in nicely. I think Ruth's scenario sounds like the best if Smith goes to IR. Harris should be signed to the 53 from Carolina's PS. I would also be alright with stealing Everette Pedescleaux away from the Broncos. I think Harris has a future at DT. He has the frame to get bigger and he needs to. I feel that will slow him down and he will be a DT. Not sure if he could be a 3-4 DT. I still think Everette Pedescleaux could develop into a solid starting 3-4 DE. Both are sitting there for the taking if Smith goes to the IR.

pfelix73
10-13-2009, 08:04 PM
I'm not so sure Hood is a 3-4 DE. I guess we'll find out. Unless they search the waiver wire and the FA's. Kevin Carter is a FA, but maybe he's not in shape. Just a thought.

:tt1

RuthlessBurgher
10-13-2009, 08:08 PM
I was intrigued by Everette Pendescleaux prior to the draft. But when they spent a draft pick on Harris and did not sign Pendescleaux as an UDFA, I figured that the front office knows more about these players than I do (duh...). I didn't even realize he was with the Broncos. He does have the proper build for the job, and is surprisingly athletic from most reports I have heard, but it may take a while for him to adjust to the NFL game coming from such a small school.

SteelHead
10-13-2009, 08:35 PM
Just to update this situation with Aaron....

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4556224


PITTSBURGH -- Pittsburgh Steelers defensive end Aaron Smith has a partial tear of the right rotator cuff, a source told ESPN.com's John Clayton.

Smith is weighing whether or not to have shoulder surgery, according to a source. Smith and doctors are expected to decide Wednesday morning which option to take. Multiple sources say if Smith has the operation, he could be out for as long as three months. If he opts not to have the surgery, he might not miss many games but he could do long-term damage to his career after this season.

Smith, injured Sunday in Detroit, was evaluated Tuesday.

Smith has been with the Steelers (3-2) longer than any player except wide receiver Hines Ward and defensive back Deshea Townsend. He is one of the keys to their 3-4 alignment and is often cited by teammates as being the most underrated player on what was the NFL's top defense the last two seasons.

Smith has 13 tackles and two sacks in five games and blocked a field goal attempt during the Steelers' 13-10 victory over Tennessee on Sept. 10. He also is one of the Steelers' primary run stoppers.

Coach Mike Tomlin said first-round draft pick Ziggy Hood is not yet ready to replace Smith, and that Travis Kirschke, Nick Eason and Hood would be used in his place.

"He's got a lot of talent," Tomlin said of Hood, the former Missouri player. "He's not out of the oven yet, if you will. We acknowledge that. He acknowledged that. And as long as we continue to do that, he'll move in the right direction. ... But by no means is Ziggy Hood a potential replacement for Aaron Smith at this point."

The 33-year-old Smith sat out the last four games of the 2007 season because of a torn biceps muscle.

Steelers safety Troy Polamalu, who has missed four games due to a torn left knee ligament, and running back Willie Parker (left big toe) are expected to return Sunday against the Cleveland Browns (1-4). Parker has missed two games.

Herewegosteelers!
10-13-2009, 09:34 PM
Even though Smith has the option not to have surgery, of course he is better off having it because of the long term damage possible....he can still play at a high level for at least 2-3 more years. Time for Ziggy to step up like Ben did when Maddox when down (that would be good) :tt1

(Even if he isn't ready just yet)

fezziwig
10-13-2009, 09:39 PM
This sucks! Our run defense got absolutely shredded back in '07 when Smith was lost for the season. Here's hoping someone in the backup DE rotation steps up.


I remember that very well and how they ran up the yards on Smiths side while he was away.

Tomlin said I believe, "Ziggy isn't ready to claim Smith position as a starter. " I'm sure they'll have the position in rotation. They'll also probably decide after two or three games, what player will be the full time starter.

I would like to see Hoke get a shot at that position. I don't think they alowed him that chance in 2007.

williar
10-13-2009, 09:49 PM
Man this hurts........Steelers just lost heart and soul of the defense.

Time for Ziggy show...

Here's the latest Tomlinism, at today's PC Tomlin said this about Hood: "He's not out of the oven yet." Which I guess means Ziggy isn't ready to start. Look for Eason and Kirschke to get the majority of the snaps.

Seems absolutely retarded that our D line coach said Hood is one of the best he has seen come in as a rookie in 16 years and Aaron Smith is heaping praises all over the dude saying he is extremely smart and a great talent, and he can't start at 3-4 DE mid season after all the mini camps, a full training camp, preseason, and heading into the 6th game.

Hood should absolutely, 100% hands down be the starter with whoever giving him breathers when he needs them.

I totally agree! I think you should be able to expect a little more out of first round draft pick other than a redshirt. At the risk of sounding "ignorant" here....I understand that football can be complex, complicated, etc. But for a d-lineman, how long does it take to learn that you need to somehow beat the man in front of you, track the football, tackle, go after the qb, or jump up and try to bat the ball down, etc......

birtikidis
10-13-2009, 10:08 PM
Man this hurts........Steelers just lost heart and soul of the defense.

Time for Ziggy show...

Here's the latest Tomlinism, at today's PC Tomlin said this about Hood: "He's not out of the oven yet." Which I guess means Ziggy isn't ready to start. Look for Eason and Kirschke to get the majority of the snaps.

Seems absolutely retarded that our D line coach said Hood is one of the best he has seen come in as a rookie in 16 years and Aaron Smith is heaping praises all over the dude saying he is extremely smart and a great talent, and he can't start at 3-4 DE mid season after all the mini camps, a full training camp, preseason, and heading into the 6th game.

Hood should absolutely, 100% hands down be the starter with whoever giving him breathers when he needs them.

if he's 100% supposed to be the starter half way through the season, wouldn't that mean they woulda had to bench smith?

now that smith is hurt he should be the starter, but all three should get a ton of snaps...

Northern_Blitz
10-13-2009, 10:29 PM
This is a bad injury. We've now had the 2 defensive starters who are least replacable go down.

But, on the bright side. Maybe this will encourage teams to try to run against us more. I think we'll still be better against the run without A.Smith than we are against teams when they start to throw 100% of the time.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
10-13-2009, 10:42 PM
Anyone know what the Brown's running game is like?

stlrz d
10-13-2009, 10:44 PM
This sucks! Our run defense got absolutely shredded back in '07 when Smith was lost for the season. Here's hoping someone in the backup DE rotation steps up.


I remember that very well and how they ran up the yards on Smiths side while he was away.

Tomlin said I believe, "Ziggy isn't ready to claim Smith position as a starter. " I'm sure they'll have the position in rotation. They'll also probably decide after two or three games, what player will be the full time starter.

I would like to see Hoke get a shot at that position. I don't think they alowed him that chance in 2007.

Hoke is Casey's back up. When is the last time you saw Casey in good enough shape to take every defensive snap?





Man this hurts........Steelers just lost heart and soul of the defense.

Time for Ziggy show...

Here's the latest Tomlinism, at today's PC Tomlin said this about Hood: "He's not out of the oven yet." Which I guess means Ziggy isn't ready to start. Look for Eason and Kirschke to get the majority of the snaps.

Seems absolutely retarded that our D line coach said Hood is one of the best he has seen come in as a rookie in 16 years and Aaron Smith is heaping praises all over the dude saying he is extremely smart and a great talent, and he can't start at 3-4 DE mid season after all the mini camps, a full training camp, preseason, and heading into the 6th game.

Hood should absolutely, 100% hands down be the starter with whoever giving him breathers when he needs them.

I totally agree! I think you should be able to expect a little more out of first round draft pick other than a redshirt. At the risk of sounding "ignorant" here....I understand that football can be complex, complicated, etc. But for a d-lineman, how long does it take to learn that you need to somehow beat the man in front of you, track the football, tackle, go after the qb, or jump up and try to bat the ball down, etc......

You've never played, have you?

RuthlessBurgher
10-13-2009, 10:50 PM
Anyone know what the Brown's running game is like?

This past weekend, Jamal Lewis ran for 117 yards on 31 carries against the Bills.

The previous week, Jerome Harrison ran for 121 yards on 29 carries against the Bengals.

sd steel
10-14-2009, 12:28 AM
Man this hurts........Steelers just lost heart and soul of the defense.

Time for Ziggy show...

Here's the latest Tomlinism, at today's PC Tomlin said this about Hood: "He's not out of the oven yet." Which I guess means Ziggy isn't ready to start. Look for Eason and Kirschke to get the majority of the snaps.

Seems absolutely retarded that our D line coach said Hood is one of the best he has seen come in as a rookie in 16 years and Aaron Smith is heaping praises all over the dude saying he is extremely smart and a great talent, and he can't start at 3-4 DE mid season after all the mini camps, a full training camp, preseason, and heading into the 6th game.

Hood should absolutely, 100% hands down be the starter with whoever giving him breathers when he needs them.

I think it's sort of funny that you would think a kid, (albeit a first round pick), who has not been with the organization for even a year, should be able to come in and replace a 10 year vet who is the best 3-4 defensive end in the league. Those shoes are too big. He will get the snaps, but we have other guys who are more experienced and who have shown they know their roles. Tomlin said Iggy Eason and Kirshke will all get time, which is good. If Iggy shows that he can dominate I'm sure he will get a majority of the snaps, but to say he should be annoited the starter sounds a little retarded IMO.

Shoe
10-14-2009, 12:57 AM
You've never played, have you?

You don't need to have played to know it... relatively, I don't think he's incorrect. (RB being the "easiest" to transition.)

That being said, D-line does usually require a transition period because physically, you are dealing with grown-a$s men--in the trenches. It's not some skinny-ish freshman or a 22-year old... you got grown-a$s, no-nonsense, get-the-F-out-of-my-way men playing.

Most often, a guy from college is too light in the britches by comparison, mainly cuz he is just a kid against... wait for it... grown-a$s men.

Mister Pittsburgh
10-14-2009, 04:17 AM
Man this hurts........Steelers just lost heart and soul of the defense.

Time for Ziggy show...

Here's the latest Tomlinism, at today's PC Tomlin said this about Hood: "He's not out of the oven yet." Which I guess means Ziggy isn't ready to start. Look for Eason and Kirschke to get the majority of the snaps.

Seems absolutely retarded that our D line coach said Hood is one of the best he has seen come in as a rookie in 16 years and Aaron Smith is heaping praises all over the dude saying he is extremely smart and a great talent, and he can't start at 3-4 DE mid season after all the mini camps, a full training camp, preseason, and heading into the 6th game.

Hood should absolutely, 100% hands down be the starter with whoever giving him breathers when he needs them.

if he's 100% supposed to be the starter half way through the season, wouldn't that mean they woulda had to bench smith?

now that smith is hurt he should be the starter, but all three should get a ton of snaps...

Smith is a pro bowler. I am saying he should be capable to step in as the starter now that Smith went down. I am saying that Travis Kirschke or Nick Eason should not be as good as Hood requiring him to give them equal snaps.

This isn't MLB where first round picks take 3 years to sniff the field on the big league team.

JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
10-14-2009, 08:31 AM
I was intrigued by Everette Pendescleaux prior to the draft. But when they spent a draft pick on Harris and did not sign Pendescleaux as an UDFA, I figured that the front office knows more about these players than I do (duh...). I didn't even realize he was with the Broncos. He does have the proper build for the job, and is surprisingly athletic from most reports I have heard, but it may take a while for him to adjust to the NFL game coming from such a small school.

I remember Everette choose the Broncos because of the opportunity on the DL. I not even sure if the Steelers contacted him about signing after the draft. I also wish Harris had another year of starting experience under his belt at Oregon. I think that might have kept him on the 53 rather than the Steelers trying to hide him on the PS & the Panthers stealing him. Everette would be my 2nd option if they went for a young guy. Harris makes more sense because he should have some of the playbook down. Whomever comes in here most likely will be inactive with Eason active if he is a young guy.

fezziwig
10-14-2009, 09:16 AM
Given Smiths age and the injury, this might be it for him. I tore my cuff before, surgey and never been the same.

I hope it is different for Smith. I do like the bright side of things as Ruthlesburger said, " allows him to spend time with his son that has health issues."

MaxAMillion
10-14-2009, 09:26 AM
More evidence that the Steeler defense has a lot of players with a lot of miles on the tires. Next year's draft should have a heavy focus on defensive players.

RuthlessBurgher
10-14-2009, 09:43 AM
You've never played, have you?

You don't need to have played to know it... relatively, I don't think he's incorrect. (RB being the "easiest" to transition.)

That being said, D-line does usually require a transition period because physically, you are dealing with grown-a$s men--in the trenches. It's not some skinny-ish freshman or a 22-year old... you got grown-a$s, no-nonsense, get-the-F-out-of-my-way men playing.

Most often, a guy from college is too light in the britches by comparison, mainly cuz he is just a kid against... wait for it... grown-a$s men.

There are more gap responsibilities to learn for a 3-4 DE, as opposed to a 4-3 DE, where you can just pin your ears back and rush the passer much of the time. In that case, you can rely on your natural abilities to a certain extent. But in our scheme, if you are not gap sound, that creates gaping holes in the defense. He has to understand fully what his job is each play before he can make a difference out there. I'm not saying he can't, but I think at first, we will see more of Kirschke or Eason on 1st and 2nd down, and more of Ziggy on 3rd down where he can play pass rushing DT role in a 4 man front in the nickel and dime defenses.

RuthlessBurgher
10-14-2009, 09:45 AM
I was intrigued by Everette Pendescleaux prior to the draft. But when they spent a draft pick on Harris and did not sign Pendescleaux as an UDFA, I figured that the front office knows more about these players than I do (duh...). I didn't even realize he was with the Broncos. He does have the proper build for the job, and is surprisingly athletic from most reports I have heard, but it may take a while for him to adjust to the NFL game coming from such a small school.

I remember Everette choose the Broncos because of the opportunity on the DL. I not even sure if the Steelers contacted him about signing after the draft. I also wish Harris had another year of starting experience under his belt at Oregon. I think that might have kept him on the 53 rather than the Steelers trying to hide him on the PS & the Panthers stealing him. Everette would be my 2nd option if they went for a young guy. Harris makes more sense because he should have some of the playbook down. Whomever comes in here most likely will be inactive with Eason active if he is a young guy.

It's official that Sonny Harris is a Steeler once again. I agree that Casey, Hoke, Keisel, Kirschke, Eason, and Hood will be the 6 active linemen on gameday, while Harris will likely be inactive most of the time (unless Kirschke's back acts up again). Sonny will stay on our 53 man roster for the rest of the season, but he most likely will not be among the 45 guys dressing unless someone else gets injured.

stlrz d
10-14-2009, 11:19 AM
You've never played, have you?

You don't need to have played to know it... relatively, I don't think he's incorrect. (RB being the "easiest" to transition.)

That being said, D-line does usually require a transition period because physically, you are dealing with grown-a$s men--in the trenches. It's not some skinny-ish freshman or a 22-year old... you got grown-a$s, no-nonsense, get-the-F-out-of-my-way men playing.

Most often, a guy from college is too light in the britches by comparison, mainly cuz he is just a kid against... wait for it... grown-a$s men.

There are more gap responsibilities to learn for a 3-4 DE, as opposed to a 4-3 DE, where you can just pin your ears back and rush the passer much of the time. In that case, you can rely on your natural abilities to a certain extent. But in our scheme, if you are not gap sound, that creates gaping holes in the defense. He has to understand fully what his job is each play before he can make a difference out there. I'm not saying he can't, but I think at first, we will see more of Kirschke or Eason on 1st and 2nd down, and more of Ziggy on 3rd down where he can play pass rushing DT role in a 4 man front in the nickel and dime defenses.

It's my day off, so I stayed up late and slept in...so you beat me to it! :D

He has to be able to understand the entire scheme.... There are subtleties as well that come with time. Understanding where the blitz is coming from so he can help create more space by shading a certain way, etc.

It's a lot more complicated than the poster I was addressing made it seem.

ikestops85
10-14-2009, 12:30 PM
[quote="stlrz d":2zu2jf05]
You've never played, have you?

You don't need to have played to know it... relatively, I don't think he's incorrect. (RB being the "easiest" to transition.)

That being said, D-line does usually require a transition period because physically, you are dealing with grown-a$s men--in the trenches. It's not some skinny-ish freshman or a 22-year old... you got grown-a$s, no-nonsense, get-the-F-out-of-my-way men playing.

Most often, a guy from college is too light in the britches by comparison, mainly cuz he is just a kid against... wait for it... grown-a$s men.

There are more gap responsibilities to learn for a 3-4 DE, as opposed to a 4-3 DE, where you can just pin your ears back and rush the passer much of the time. In that case, you can rely on your natural abilities to a certain extent. But in our scheme, if you are not gap sound, that creates gaping holes in the defense. He has to understand fully what his job is each play before he can make a difference out there. I'm not saying he can't, but I think at first, we will see more of Kirschke or Eason on 1st and 2nd down, and more of Ziggy on 3rd down where he can play pass rushing DT role in a 4 man front in the nickel and dime defenses.

It's my day off, so I stayed up late and slept in...so you beat me to it! :D

He has to be able to understand the entire scheme.... There are subtleties as well that come with time. Understanding where the blitz is coming from so he can help create more space by shading a certain way, etc.

It's a lot more complicated than the poster I was addressing made it seem.[/quote:2zu2jf05]


Boy you aren't kidding. Being a DE in a 3-4 system is not as simplistic as that poster made it sound. When Smith was out the last time we were constantly getting burned by the cutback which AS is a master at shutting down. We are probably better equipped to handle his loss this time than we were the last time but it will still hurt. Like Tomlin says, when someone goes down somebody else has to stand up and make plays.

Mel Blount's G
10-14-2009, 04:38 PM
Woodely's season, which wasn't exactly burning up the stat sheets, just got a whole lot tougher with Mr. Aaron Smith gone.

An entire domino effect here: Our master o-lineman-plugger is out. During passing plays, he's the guy who makes it possible for our athletic lb's to fly at the qb from/through a variety of schemes and angles. With him out, our pass rushing pressure drops off. As our pass rushing pressure drops off we either (a): have to send more guys after the qb or (b): require our db's to stay with their wr's longer so our pressure can get to the qb. Or (c) both. I think we all know what he meant to our run defense as well.

Earlier in the year I read one or another of our coaches giving praise to, and feeling confident with, our dline backups, eason and kirchke. I hope that was legit

stlrz d
10-14-2009, 08:28 PM
Woodely's season, which wasn't exactly burning up the stat sheets, just got a whole lot tougher with Mr. Aaron Smith gone.

An entire domino effect here: Our master o-lineman-plugger is out. During passing plays, he's the guy who makes it possible for our athletic lb's to fly at the qb from/through a variety of schemes and angles. With him out, our pass rushing pressure drops off. As our pass rushing pressure drops off we either (a): have to send more guys after the qb or (b): require our db's to stay with their wr's longer so our pressure can get to the qb. Or (c) both. I think we all know what he meant to our run defense as well.

Earlier in the year I read one or another of our coaches giving praise to, and feeling confident with, our dline backups, eason and kirchke. I hope that was legit

Actually on a lot of passing downs this season the Steelers have been playing this odd arrangement of only 2 down linemen (I've seen it a lot with Keisel and Kirschke) and an extra DB. It's the formation they've been blitzing Gay out of.

Mel Blount's G
10-15-2009, 12:26 PM
[quote="Mel Blount's G":15648a5j]Woodely's season, which wasn't exactly burning up the stat sheets, just got a whole lot tougher with Mr. Aaron Smith gone.

An entire domino effect here: Our master o-lineman-plugger is out. During passing plays, he's the guy who makes it possible for our athletic lb's to fly at the qb from/through a variety of schemes and angles. With him out, our pass rushing pressure drops off. As our pass rushing pressure drops off we either (a): have to send more guys after the qb or (b): require our db's to stay with their wr's longer so our pressure can get to the qb. Or (c) both. I think we all know what he meant to our run defense as well.

Earlier in the year I read one or another of our coaches giving praise to, and feeling confident with, our dline backups, eason and kirschke. I hope that was legit

Actually on a lot of passing downs this season the Steelers have been playing this odd arrangement of only 2 down linemen (I've seen it a lot with Keisel and Kirschke) and an extra DB. It's the formation they've been blitzing Gay out of.[/quote:15648a5j]
True. I've noticed that at times too. But from what I've seen B-Dub LeBeau might wanna go back to the drawing board on that. Wonder if that was a way of compensating for Troy's absence (having the extra db)?

Maybe Eason/kirschke are better than we all know? After all, a steeler defensive backup is often starting material on another team. And even if he doesn't start, Zhood's gonna get some extremely valuable game time reps I would guess that should accel his development as a steeler d lineman. And where abouts is Orpheyus Roye these days (sorry if this was prevously discussed)?

Mister Pittsburgh
10-15-2009, 12:50 PM
This sucks! Our run defense got absolutely shredded back in '07 when Smith was lost for the season. Here's hoping someone in the backup DE rotation steps up.


I remember that very well and how they ran up the yards on Smiths side while he was away.

Tomlin said I believe, "Ziggy isn't ready to claim Smith position as a starter. " I'm sure they'll have the position in rotation. They'll also probably decide after two or three games, what player will be the full time starter.

I would like to see Hoke get a shot at that position. I don't think they alowed him that chance in 2007.

Hoke is Casey's back up. When is the last time you saw Casey in good enough shape to take every defensive snap?




[quote=grotonsteel]Man this hurts........Steelers just lost heart and soul of the defense.

Time for Ziggy show...

Here's the latest Tomlinism, at today's PC Tomlin said this about Hood: "He's not out of the oven yet." Which I guess means Ziggy isn't ready to start. Look for Eason and Kirschke to get the majority of the snaps.

Seems absolutely retarded that our D line coach said Hood is one of the best he has seen come in as a rookie in 16 years and Aaron Smith is heaping praises all over the dude saying he is extremely smart and a great talent, and he can't start at 3-4 DE mid season after all the mini camps, a full training camp, preseason, and heading into the 6th game.

Hood should absolutely, 100% hands down be the starter with whoever giving him breathers when he needs them.

I totally agree! I think you should be able to expect a little more out of first round draft pick other than a redshirt. At the risk of sounding "ignorant" here....I understand that football can be complex, complicated, etc. But for a d-lineman, how long does it take to learn that you need to somehow beat the man in front of you, track the football, tackle, go after the qb, or jump up and try to bat the ball down, etc......

You've never played, have you?[/quote:zi98h10m]

Not sure if you were talking to me, but I have.

RuthlessBurgher
10-15-2009, 12:56 PM
[quote="stlrz d":1507bj9s][quote="Mel Blount's G":1507bj9s]Woodely's season, which wasn't exactly burning up the stat sheets, just got a whole lot tougher with Mr. Aaron Smith gone.

An entire domino effect here: Our master o-lineman-plugger is out. During passing plays, he's the guy who makes it possible for our athletic lb's to fly at the qb from/through a variety of schemes and angles. With him out, our pass rushing pressure drops off. As our pass rushing pressure drops off we either (a): have to send more guys after the qb or (b): require our db's to stay with their wr's longer so our pressure can get to the qb. Or (c) both. I think we all know what he meant to our run defense as well.

Earlier in the year I read one or another of our coaches giving praise to, and feeling confident with, our dline backups, eason and kirschke. I hope that was legit

Actually on a lot of passing downs this season the Steelers have been playing this odd arrangement of only 2 down linemen (I've seen it a lot with Keisel and Kirschke) and an extra DB. It's the formation they've been blitzing Gay out of.[/quote:1507bj9s]
True. I've noticed that at times too. But from what I've seen B-Dub LeBeau might wanna go back to the drawing board on that. Wonder if that was a way of compensating for Troy's absence (having the extra db)?

Maybe Eason/kirschke are better than we all know? After all, a steeler defensive backup is often starting material on another team. And even if he doesn't start, Zhood's gonna get some extremely valuable game time reps I would guess that should accel his development as a steeler d lineman. And where abouts is Orpheyus Roye these days (sorry if this was prevously discussed)?[/quote:1507bj9s]

We brought in Roye on Tuesday, but signed Sonny Harris from Carolina's practice squad instead. I'd rather have a young whippersnapper like Harris for depth than an old fella like Roye anyway (since Keisel, Kirschke, and Eason are all vets with Hood being the only young buck...good to get some young blood in here). And since the 5th DE will be on the 53 man roster but likely not among the 45 guys who dress, Roye wouldn't be any help on gameday...but Harris can develop within our scheme in practices even if he is inactive on the vast majority of gamedays.