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View Full Version : Hmmmm,....



SteelCzar76
04-20-2009, 10:10 AM
It appears that I and a few others here are not alone in our thinking. Here's Pat Kirwan's latest Mock,......http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000 ... nfirm=true (http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80fbe661&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true)

Oviedo
04-20-2009, 10:14 AM
I have faith in the front office but would just be sitting and waiting for this kids first off field incident. Hopefully some real leadership in the locker room will scare him straight.

I'd still rather go OL.

Kirwin's credibility goes right out the window if he thinks Wood lasts until 2.64.

RuthlessBurgher
04-20-2009, 10:21 AM
It is interesting that Kirwin thinks that Alex Mack, William Beatty, Vontae Davis, and Percy Harvin will all available at #32 (Harvin would be the last of those guys that I would take if they were all available).

He says "The Steelers have not been afraid to take a great athlete with issues before." Yeah, his name was Burress. Ask the New York court system how that turned out.

SteelCzar76
04-20-2009, 10:31 AM
I have faith in the front office but would just be sitting and waiting for this kids first off field incident. Hopefully some real leadership in the locker room will scare him straight.

I'd still rather go OL.

Kirwin's credibility goes right out the window if he thinks Wood lasts until 2.64.

His crediblity wouldn't be effected in my opinion O,..as i do not think that he believes Wood should be there.( especially with the Bungles needing a quality center.) But perhaps he feels that they (Bungles) would have already selected Mack at the top of the 2nd if the rest of the league didn't sip his 1st round talent Kool-Aid or if say they took a character/need player like Robiskie at that point?

I don't know,...but what i'am certain of is,..if we could land Harvin in the 1st, wood in the second and come back with Macho in the 3rd,....i would be ecstatic to say the least. (Though i do understand your perspective in terms of Harvin)

Oviedo
04-20-2009, 10:37 AM
I have faith in the front office but would just be sitting and waiting for this kids first off field incident. Hopefully some real leadership in the locker room will scare him straight.

I'd still rather go OL.

Kirwin's credibility goes right out the window if he thinks Wood lasts until 2.64.

His crediblity wouldn't be effected in my opinion O,..as i do not think that he believes Wood should be there.( especially with the Bungles needing a quality center.) But perhaps he feels that they (Bungles) would have already selected Mack at the top of the 2nd if the rest of the league didn't sip his 1st round talent Kool-Aid or if say they took a character/need player like Robiskie at that point?

I don't know,...but what i'am certain of is,..if we could land Harvin in the 1st, wood in the second and come back with Macho in the 3rd,....i would be ecstatic to say the least. (Though i do understand your perspective in terms of Harvin)

Harvin is a remarkable talent with just a less remarkable brain. It is very much in Colbert's history to grab a high skill player in Round 1. IMO still would be a boom or bust pick.

SteelCzar76
04-20-2009, 10:51 AM
He says "The Steelers have not been afraid to take a great athlete with issues before." Yeah, his name was Burress. Ask the New York court system how that turned out.

I feel you Ruthless,...but at the same time Harvin is no more Plex than Plex was Randy Moss, Warren Sapp or Danny Marino.

What i mean is every person is an individual,...and as such shouldn't necessarily be condemned before they've even committed any character crimes at the pro level based upon the actions of their prospective predecessors.

Sure it can be said that collegiate level "red flags" hold some measure of weight,....but at the same time we must remember that though everyone would like for all of these kids to be mature beyond their years,...that's not the rule,..but the exception.

And many of these young men can grow, evolve and more importantly mature. As long as they are not just inherently "true villans",.. which in Harvin's case i do not feel that he is. (true villan) Sure he may be a little immature and exceptionally confident,...but i do not think he is cut from the same cloth as say a Pac-Man or even Plex (in terms of feeling that he's above the Law)

papillon
04-20-2009, 11:03 AM
It would be disappointing if the Steelers drafted a WR in the first round and not because of his character issues; simply, because the Steelers are not in any dire circumstance at the WR position. There are many other areas of the football team that need to be upgraded or have the beginnings of the future being planned.

I believe that Limas is who the Steelers believe is the future at WR.
The defensive line is aging and may be able to get through another without major injury; however, the future needs to begin soon.
The offensive line needs upgrades and future planning.
Corner back is thinner right now than it was at the end of the year and so is safety.

If Harvin happens to be there at 1.32 the Steelers should entertain a trade out of the position rather than actually select him or make a draft day trade. Of course, this would all depend on what other players are still available besides Harvin.

Pappy

calmkiller
04-20-2009, 11:09 AM
It would be disappointing if the Steelers drafted a WR in the first round and not because of his character issues; simply, because the Steelers are not in any dire circumstance at the WR position. There are many other areas of the football team that need to be upgraded or have the beginnings of the future being planned.

I believe that Limas is who the Steelers believe is the future at WR.
The defensive line is aging and may be able to get through another without major injury; however, the future needs to begin soon.
The offensive line needs upgrades and future planning.

Pappy


I agree with your thinking here Pap but the real question is do the Steelers? My first priority is OL/DL. I mean that by take the best player available for those two positions. But we won a SB last year and we have the exact same OL in place. So do the Steelers really consider it our #1 need? I personally do but the true question here is do they? Makes this look possible if you sit back and think.

RuthlessBurgher
04-20-2009, 11:15 AM
It would be disappointing if the Steelers drafted a WR in the first round and not because of his character issues; simply, because the Steelers are not in any dire circumstance at the WR position. There are many other areas of the football team that need to be upgraded or have the beginnings of the future being planned.

I believe that Limas is who the Steelers believe is the future at WR.
The defensive line is aging and may be able to get through another without major injury; however, the future needs to begin soon.
The offensive line needs upgrades and future planning.

Pappy


I agree with your thinking here Pap but the real question is do the Steelers? My first priority is OL/DL. I mean that by take the best player available for those two positions. But we won a SB last year and we have the exact same OL in place. So do the Steelers really consider it our #1 need? I personally do but the true question here is do they? Makes this look possible if you sit back and think.

Well, with the contracts of Starks, Colon, and Hartwig all set to expire after this season, the front office that makes draft decisions based on what their needs should be 2 years from now should really think that the OL is a top need.

SteelCzar76
04-20-2009, 11:22 AM
It would be disappointing if the Steelers drafted a WR in the first round and not because of his character issues; simply, because the Steelers are not in any dire circumstance at the WR position. There are many other areas of the football team that need to be upgraded or have the beginnings of the future being planned.

I believe that Limas is who the Steelers believe is the future at WR.
The defensive line is aging and may be able to get through another without major injury; however, the future needs to begin soon.
The offensive line needs upgrades and future planning.

Pappy


I agree with your thinking here Pap but the real question is do the Steelers? My first priority is OL/DL. I mean that by take the best player available for those two positions. But we won a SB last year and we have the exact same OL in place. So do the Steelers really consider it our #1 need? I personally do but the true question here is do they? Makes this look possible if you sit back and think.

Well, with the contracts of Starks, Colon, and Hartwig all set to expire after this season, the front office that makes draft decisions based on what their needs should be 2 years from now should really think that the OL is a top need.

That's true Ruthless,...but who's to say that extending Starks, Drafting Wood (or Ship second day) and say a player like Cornelius Lewis or a pure tackle with upside on the second day would not address such said need ?

calmkiller
04-20-2009, 11:33 AM
It would be disappointing if the Steelers drafted a WR in the first round and not because of his character issues; simply, because the Steelers are not in any dire circumstance at the WR position. There are many other areas of the football team that need to be upgraded or have the beginnings of the future being planned.

I believe that Limas is who the Steelers believe is the future at WR.
The defensive line is aging and may be able to get through another without major injury; however, the future needs to begin soon.
The offensive line needs upgrades and future planning.

Pappy


I agree with your thinking here Pap but the real question is do the Steelers? My first priority is OL/DL. I mean that by take the best player available for those two positions. But we won a SB last year and we have the exact same OL in place. So do the Steelers really consider it our #1 need? I personally do but the true question here is do they? Makes this look possible if you sit back and think.

Well, with the contracts of Starks, Colon, and Hartwig all set to expire after this season, the front office that makes draft decisions based on what their needs should be 2 years from now should really think that the OL is a top need.


Yes, but they want to sign Starks to a long term deal. If this is the case then LT is taken care of for the next X number years. We drafted Tony Hills last year and the team may view him as Colon's replacement after this year which means its not an immediate need. Stapleton is supposed to be the back up Center currently but hes the starting right guard. If they bring in a guard such as Louis Vasquez in the later rounds Stapelton moves to the Center position and you insert the rookie Louis Vasquez into the starting RG position.

None of this is my personal feelings, just trying to approach at it as the Steelers might. Just something to think about perhaps.

papillon
04-20-2009, 11:40 AM
It would be disappointing if the Steelers drafted a WR in the first round and not because of his character issues; simply, because the Steelers are not in any dire circumstance at the WR position. There are many other areas of the football team that need to be upgraded or have the beginnings of the future being planned.

I believe that Limas is who the Steelers believe is the future at WR.
The defensive line is aging and may be able to get through another without major injury; however, the future needs to begin soon.
The offensive line needs upgrades and future planning.

Pappy


I agree with your thinking here Pap but the real question is do the Steelers? My first priority is OL/DL. I mean that by take the best player available for those two positions. But we won a SB last year and we have the exact same OL in place. So do the Steelers really consider it our #1 need? I personally do but the true question here is do they? Makes this look possible if you sit back and think.

Well, here's what I'm thinking:

- Kemo is signed
- Hartwig is in his last year and was the 32nd rated center of the NFL starters
- Colon is capable, but, that's about it
- Stapleton may be good with last year under his belt or maybe a shift to center (similar to Hartings and Dawson after a year at guard,after all he was a center at Rutgers)
- Starks is only under contract for one more year (as of right now)

** I rewatched the Super Bowl this weekend trying to focus on the OL as much as a layman like me can focus on the OL. They were remarkably average and inconsistent, Ben, the receiving corps and Mewelde Moore were the difference. Willie Parker had a couple of 1 yard runs that should have been losses and one should have been a safety, but he managed to get the ball out of the end zone. I know continuity is something an offensive line needs. That group played the majority of the season, so, by the SB they should have had some continuity. **

The defensive line is simply getting older and the future needs to begin soon

We lost Washington (#3), Ward isn't getting younger (but, his production was good last year), Holmes is a star in the making, Sweed (will be given a chance), so, a WR wouldn't be horrible, but, I just can't see ignoring the OL/DL due to their age, current contract situation and inconsistency.

Pappy

SteelCzar76
04-20-2009, 11:45 AM
It would be disappointing if the Steelers drafted a WR in the first round and not because of his character issues; simply, because the Steelers are not in any dire circumstance at the WR position. There are many other areas of the football team that need to be upgraded or have the beginnings of the future being planned.

I believe that Limas is who the Steelers believe is the future at WR.
The defensive line is aging and may be able to get through another without major injury; however, the future needs to begin soon.
The offensive line needs upgrades and future planning.

Pappy


I agree with your thinking here Pap but the real question is do the Steelers? My first priority is OL/DL. I mean that by take the best player available for those two positions. But we won a SB last year and we have the exact same OL in place. So do the Steelers really consider it our #1 need? I personally do but the true question here is do they? Makes this look possible if you sit back and think.

Well, with the contracts of Starks, Colon, and Hartwig all set to expire after this season, the front office that makes draft decisions based on what their needs should be 2 years from now should really think that the OL is a top need.


Yes, but they want to sign Starks to a long term deal. If this is the case then LT is taken care of for the next X number years. We drafted Tony Hills last year and the team may view him as Colon's replacement after this year which means its not an immediate need. Stapleton is supposed to be the back up Center currently but hes the starting right guard. If they bring in a guard such as Louis Vasquez in the later rounds Stapelton moves to the Center position and you insert the rookie Louis Vasquez into the starting RG position.

None of this is my personal feelings, just trying to approach at it as the Steelers might. Just something to think about perhaps.

Well said. Nice call on Hills as well. Sure, at the moment the Jury's still out on him (even more so than with Sweed),..but who's to say that he doesn't become more effective than Colon sooner rather than later ? (especially if he were to come into camp hungry, healthy and having trained exceptionally hard this offseason)

aggiebones
04-20-2009, 12:11 PM
Holmes had issues too and apparently still is shoring things up in his personal life. Not worried about him being a saint, BUT you bring in Harmon and say Ward is done in a season? I pray not.
Then you have Harmon and Holmes running the show. It could go south. I think we need to avoid bringing in someone that could drag Holmes down some. Let's get a few more years of maturity in Holmes before asking him to lead new rookies.

There are other players that we could draft and avoid the risk. I think we should.

pfelix73
04-20-2009, 02:26 PM
"But we won a SB last year and we have the exact same OL in place. So do the Steelers really consider it our #1 need? I personally do but the true question here is do they? Makes this look possible if you sit back and think."

This quote is true.... They do not. Not according to what Colbert has been saying on the radio.......

If the BPA is a WR at 32, I say take him.....

RuthlessBurgher
04-20-2009, 02:35 PM
"But we won a SB last year and we have the exact same OL in place. So do the Steelers really consider it our #1 need? I personally do but the true question here is do they? Makes this look possible if you sit back and think."

This quote is true.... They do not. Not according to what Colbert has been saying on the radio.......

If the BPA is a WR at 32, I say take him.....

They want to avoid revealing their true opinions of prospects and priorities until after the draft. They remember what happened when Tomlin presented his feelings about Darrelle Revis to the media...the Jets traded one spot in front of us to get him.

birtikidis
04-20-2009, 03:16 PM
Though I wouldn't pick Harvin (unless he is BPA) i would really like to see his personal problems. I live in gainesvlle and have heard nothing bad about him

Slapstick
04-20-2009, 03:51 PM
What exactly did Percy Harvin do? I had read that he was suspended for a few games in high school, but he hasn't had any problems in college (at least nothing substantiated...only rumor)...

I don't know if this is important, but it should be noted that Mike Tomlin is from the same area of Virginia as Harvin (less than 40 miles away...same area code)...

calmkiller
04-20-2009, 04:00 PM
Harvin is an explosive play maker but as said before he is oft injured. I don't know anything about him as a person. But does anyone remember the problems Holmes had outta College? He has turned out alright. He did have an arrest because of Mary Jane....but that is either a big deal or no deal and a completely different topic. He has been a model citizen. My major concern would be his health.

Chadman
04-20-2009, 05:57 PM
Louis Delmas will be the #1 safety available, Ryan Clark is entering the last year of his contract....just saying...

calmkiller
04-20-2009, 06:35 PM
Ryan Mundy could play into that scenario as well Chadman.

mshifko
04-20-2009, 07:42 PM
percy is nasty, i'd love to see him in the black and gold...but i don't see it happening...if alex mack and vontae davis were available, you'd have to go those routes before percy even though it's tempting as all get out...i don't see percy lasting that long, but you never know...he's going to be a stud in the NFL with his return ability and YAC ability

BradshawsHairdresser
04-21-2009, 12:17 AM
Louis Delmas will be the #1 safety available, Ryan Clark is entering the last year of his contract....just saying...

Uh-oh...did you read the Ryan Clark thread? Now Cap Lemming and all his fellow lemmings will be all over you...You obviously lack appreciation of Clark's peerless run support abilities and shut-down pass coverage skills. How dare you disrespect the premier free safety in the league today by suggesting the Steelers take Delmas... :D

stlrz d
04-21-2009, 10:57 AM
Louis Delmas will be the #1 safety available, Ryan Clark is entering the last year of his contract....just saying...

Uh-oh...did you read the Ryan Clark thread? Now Cap Lemming and all his fellow lemmings will be all over you...You obviously lack appreciation of Clark's peerless run support abilities and shut-down pass coverage skills. How dare you disrespect the premier free safety in the league today by suggesting the Steelers take Delmas... :D

Reading comprehension is clearly not one of your strengths.