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View Full Version : Kirwan says CB's could fall to us



steelcityrules!!
03-22-2009, 10:50 AM
He's saying that the top two tackles are separating themselves from the pack, and pass-rushing DE's or OLB's are holding strong... but a top-flight CB could land in our laps.


If those players are moving up, who is moving down? Outside of Malcolm Jenkins, it appears the cornerbacks group isn't holding in the top half of the draft. Vontae Davis, Alphonso Smith and D.J. Moore seem to falling to the bottom of the first round or into the second round. That could be good news for teams like the Tennessee Titans, Pittsburgh Steelers and a few others who pick late in the first round.

his latest article (http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80f5dc39&template=without-video-with-comments&confirm=true)

Mel Blount's G
03-22-2009, 11:05 AM
I hope not. S'not what I want to use our #32 on but then I'm sure the coaches know best...



Of course, this is just one more clown's opinion so who knows...

RuthlessBurgher
03-22-2009, 12:01 PM
If the top two tackles (Jason Smith and Eugene Monroe) are separating themselves from the pack, as Kirwin is saying, perhaps another top tackle (say, Michael Oher) falls down to within striking distance. I'd give Tampa our 2nd and 6th round picks to move up in the first round from #32 to #19 ahead of Detroit and Philadelphia to take Oher. Then draft a NT and an interior o-lineman in round 3, a CB in round 4, a WR in round 5, and a couple of 3-4 DE prospects in round 7.

Oviedo
03-22-2009, 03:01 PM
He's saying that the top two tackles are separating themselves from the pack, and pass-rushing DE's or OLB's are holding strong... but a top-flight CB could land in our laps.


If those players are moving up, who is moving down? Outside of Malcolm Jenkins, it appears the cornerbacks group isn't holding in the top half of the draft. Vontae Davis, Alphonso Smith and D.J. Moore seem to falling to the bottom of the first round or into the second round. That could be good news for teams like the Tennessee Titans, Pittsburgh Steelers and a few others who pick late in the first round.

his latest article (http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80f5dc39&template=without-video-with-comments&confirm=true)

Maybe they are falkling because everyone is realizing they are not Round 1 talent. None of the CBs mentioned play the same style at CB the Steelers play. Better value in Round 2 with Macho Harris or Darius Butler. Big strong CBs who play the run tough.

Discipline of Steel
03-22-2009, 03:25 PM
He's saying that the top two tackles are separating themselves from the pack, and pass-rushing DE's or OLB's are holding strong... but a top-flight CB could land in our laps.


If those players are moving up, who is moving down? Outside of Malcolm Jenkins, it appears the cornerbacks group isn't holding in the top half of the draft. Vontae Davis, Alphonso Smith and D.J. Moore seem to falling to the bottom of the first round or into the second round. That could be good news for teams like the Tennessee Titans, Pittsburgh Steelers and a few others who pick late in the first round.

his latest article (http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80f5dc39&template=without-video-with-comments&confirm=true)

Maybe they are falkling because everyone is realizing they are not Round 1 talent. None of the CBs mentioned play the same style at CB the Steelers play. Better value in Round 2 with Macho Harris or Darius Butler. Big strong CBs who play the run tough.


Darius Butler at the end of round 2 would be an absolute steal for us.

Oracle
03-22-2009, 09:20 PM
ruthless -

i support your sentiments whole heartedly.

that's all

Chadman
03-22-2009, 09:24 PM
He's saying that the top two tackles are separating themselves from the pack, and pass-rushing DE's or OLB's are holding strong... but a top-flight CB could land in our laps.


If those players are moving up, who is moving down? Outside of Malcolm Jenkins, it appears the cornerbacks group isn't holding in the top half of the draft. Vontae Davis, Alphonso Smith and D.J. Moore seem to falling to the bottom of the first round or into the second round. That could be good news for teams like the Tennessee Titans, Pittsburgh Steelers and a few others who pick late in the first round.

his latest article (http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80f5dc39&template=without-video-with-comments&confirm=true)

Maybe they are falkling because everyone is realizing they are not Round 1 talent. None of the CBs mentioned play the same style at CB the Steelers play. Better value in Round 2 with Macho Harris or Darius Butler. Big strong CBs who play the run tough.

O- aren't Butler & Harris 5'10"ish and around 190lbs?

Hardly 'big'!! :D

Reading reports- Asher Allen plays the run brilliantly, but he's only 5'9"- strike him?

Chadman isn't convinced size is that important at CB. If Alphonso Smith or DJ Moore are available at the end of Round 1- they'd HAVE to be considered.

papillon
03-22-2009, 11:08 PM
Just to be a contrarian a good cornerback wouldn't be the worst thing that happens to the Steelers in the first round. :tt2

Pappy

Oviedo
03-23-2009, 07:51 AM
Just to be a contrarian a good cornerback wouldn't be the worst thing that happens to the Steelers in the first round. :tt2

Pappy

Just to be contrary to your contraian point of view it wouldn'yt be the end of the world but to pass on the OL and DL talent at 1.32 and not pick again for 32 picks would not IMO be a smart move. CB is the least of our issues.

pfelix73
03-23-2009, 09:35 AM
We need another CB on this roster BEFORE we ever draft another OT.

Trading up to get Oher is absurd. Not a good idea, in my opinion.

The first pick will be on the defensive side IMO.

Someone like a CB or a NG.

RuthlessBurgher
03-23-2009, 10:14 AM
We need another CB on this roster BEFORE we ever draft another OT.

Trading up to get Oher is absurd. Not a good idea, in my opinion.

The first pick will be on the defensive side IMO.

Someone like a CB or a NG.

On what planet is CB more important than OT? (not PlanetSteelers :mrgreen: )

You need 2 starters at each of those positions, and then quality depth behind them.

At CB, you have Ike Taylor (your #1 corner), William Gay (a young up-and-coming guy who split time with McFadden last year even after McFadden returned from injury), Deshea Townsend (a wily vet who fills the nickel back role well and could fill in as a starter if needed), Roy Lewis (who impressed in training camp last year), and Anthony Madison (known more for his special teams prowess, but he is also a CB as well). I do think that we will draft a CB in the first 3 rounds of the draft, but I do not think it is top priority by any means.

At OT, you have Max Starks and Willie Colon starting. Both of their contracts are up after this season, and they will be expensive to retain. Neither are elite talents by any means (they are hovering around the adequate-decent range). And behind them, you have Tony Hills (who has no game experience in the NFL whatsoever) and Jason Capizzi (who has bounced from practice squad to practice squad). Likely, if Starks or Colon were hurt, Trai Essex could fill in, but he is also the top backup at both guard positions as well (and could challenge Darnell for the starting RG spot in training camp). I would much prefer to have a young stud OT in your pocket so you don't have Starks and Colon holding you over a barrel every year because you have no other option but to overpay them. Trading up for an OT if one falls would give you a younger, potentially more talented option who would also cost significantly less throughout the course of his rookie contract.

At CB, I think we have better starters than we have at OT, and I also think that we have much better depth at CB than we have at OT. Factor in that quality OT's are harder to find, and I came to the conclusion that if one falls to within our tradeable range, I would pounce, and would be much happier than if we just waited to see who the BPA to fall to #32 might be.

Oviedo
03-23-2009, 10:53 AM
We need another CB on this roster BEFORE we ever draft another OT.

Trading up to get Oher is absurd. Not a good idea, in my opinion.

The first pick will be on the defensive side IMO.

Someone like a CB or a NG.

On what planet is CB more important than OT? (not PlanetSteelers :mrgreen: )

You need 2 starters at each of those positions, and then quality depth behind them.

At CB, you have Ike Taylor (your #1 corner), William Gay (a young up-and-coming guy who split time with McFadden last year even after McFadden returned from injury), Deshea Townsend (a wily vet who fills the nickel back role well and could fill in as a starter if needed), Roy Lewis (who impressed in training camp last year), and Anthony Madison (known more for his special teams prowess, but he is also a CB as well). I do think that we will draft a CB in the first 3 rounds of the draft, but I do not think it is top priority by any means.

At OT, you have Max Starks and Willie Colon starting. Both of their contracts are up after this season, and they will be expensive to retain. Neither are elite talents by any means (they are hovering around the adequate-decent range). And behind them, you have Tony Hills (who has no game experience in the NFL whatsoever) and Jason Capizzi (who has bounced from practice squad to practice squad). Likely, if Starks or Colon were hurt, Trai Essex could fill in, but he is also the top backup at both guard positions as well (and could challenge Darnell for the starting RG spot in training camp). I would much prefer to have a young stud OT in your pocket so you don't have Starks and Colon holding you over a barrel every year because you have no other option but to overpay them. Trading up for an OT if one falls would give you a younger, potentially more talented option who would also cost significantly less throughout the course of his rookie contract.

At CB, I think we have better starters than we have at OT, and I also think that we have much better depth at CB than we have at OT. Factor in that quality OT's are harder to find, and I came to the conclusion that if one falls to within our tradeable range, I would pounce, and would be much happier than if we just waited to see who the BPA to fall to #32 might be.


You are singin my song. OL and DL are the picks we need to make at 1.32; even a WR. A CB in Rounds 2-5 would get us what we need. CB is the most overhyped position in the league which is the only reason they get pushed higher in Round 1 than their eventual contributions show are warranted.

pfelix73
03-23-2009, 01:18 PM
I disagree. The CB position is in need of some depth. I would prioritize the DL ahead of the secondary, but we can draft another OT in the later rounds too. We need to find an eventual replacement for Big Snack- his contract is up next year and for that matter, so is Clark's at Safety.

There's plenty of competition at OT. Between Starks, Essex, Capizzi, Hills, and Colon we can pick up another OT later on to compete down the road with the starters. I'd be picking an interior lineman for depth way before I'm looking at OT's. Colbert led on with this as well last week when he was on the radio.

Back to CB- You can do the 'what if' at CB too. 'what if' Ike goes down with an injury? All we have is Gay, Townsend, Madison, Bryant, and a few other scrubs. That's not that impressive and some depth is needed. They say, CB is deep this year, so maybe they wait til later to get a CB, but if one of those CB's fall down the board to us, BPA could be a CB at 32. I'm just saying.......

For the record- I still like Ron Brace at 32. And Shipley in the 3rd.

TallyStiller
03-23-2009, 08:26 PM
DJ Moore was also a tremendous kick and punt returner at Vandy... bring him in, and we can stop risking our #1 receiver on punt returns AND improve our drive start position by about 10 yards on kickoffs because we won't have to run our short yardage back out there. To me, that's gotta be a consideration.

We're caught in no man's land in terms of draft position - the likelihood that a worthwhile 1st round talent falls to us at tackle is slim, decent interior linemen can be had later, there's littlle 3 - 4 end talent that will be available and worth the 32nd pick, and we'd be crazy to pick a fat, slow 2 down player at nose there in an increasingly pass happy league. Another corner would help us cover spread offenses like the Cards ran at us in the 4th quarter of the SB, and like the one the Pats are certainly going to run at us this year. A 1st round corner, especially Moore, definitely appeals to me.

steelcityrules!!
03-24-2009, 08:29 PM
bottom line is BPA is the way to go.
If they have william beatty valued high and he falls, take him.
if they have alphonso smith or vontae davis rated higher, and one falls... pull the trigger.

I just think the talent at LT at the top, or CB at the top has a bigger fall-off than center, as much as mack could help the team.

Discipline of Steel
03-24-2009, 09:30 PM
I have 2 contributions to this discussion ... first, there are often 3 CB on the field at any one time. Secondly, as we have seen in the mock draft, there is a good chance that no decent OT will fall to within our range...William Beatty was picked by #20 for crying out loud. Would we pay our first and second picks for him? Would we take the guy lesser than him at #32? On the other hand, I wouldnt sacrifice our #2 or #3 to move up for any of the CB available this year either.