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Oracle
02-25-2009, 06:07 PM
trade up and select a left tackle.

here's why...

the steelers are a very frugal organization. they cannot be happy about paying max starks 15 million over a two year span. they know as well as we do that he is not the long term solution. the reason why they did it is because they HAD to. they were STUCK with no other viable option (partly due to colbert's poor planning and neglect at that position). that ends this year. colbert won't make that mistake again. he will be selecting our left tackle of the future in this draft. the question is where?

with the combine results in, i didn't see a whole lot of second rounders forcing their way up into the first round. what i did see was a lot of early first rounders (in multiple positions) sliding their way down. this is a very odd year as far ranking the prospects. there seems to be a lot of uncertainty. i believe the result will be that teams will go for more solid, less risky picks in the first round and that will include a lot of OL and DL. i believe we will see another run on left tackles just like last year (and based on a comment colbert made the other day i believe he thinks the same thing too). nobody predicted duane brown could possibly go in the first round but when teams have needs they reach. that is just the reality. there are 'at least' six teams before us that need a left tackle. i think there's a good chance smith, smith, monroe, oher, beatty, and britton will all be gone by 1.32. that leaves us either reaching for meredith or waiting for later rounds to get loadholt, tupou, etc. i don't see colbert taking another developmental prospect. we just did that with hills and i don't think he's capturing the starting job. neither did essex. neither did capizzi. this has gone on too long and colbert knows it. we need someone who can step in right now if starks get hurt and then start in 2010. if oher or smith is still available around 20-ish i believe we will trade up and snag them. if beatty or britton is still available around 28-ish i believe we will trade up and snag them.

again i'm not saying that's what colbert SHOULD do, but what he WILL do. he did it with polamalu when we needed a safety. he did it with holmes when we needed a receiver. and i believe he will do it with left tackle this year. we have nine picks. NINE picks. i promise you we will be trading up somewhere. some of you may say "we'll take BPA at 1.32 and then trade up in round two" but that is not consistent with colbert's history. he is a first round guy, that is where his success lies, and i believe this year he will pick his horse at left tackle and go get him.

the more i see of mack, unger, wood, luigs, shipley, caldwell, etc. i don't believe we will be going OC at 1.32. there's too much value later in rounds 2-3. the same cannot be said for left tackle. i realize i'm going against the experts here but i'm sticking to my guns. i believe we go left tackle in the first and we trade up slightly to get him.

Ozey74
02-25-2009, 07:42 PM
I do know that the Steelers have 9 picks this year, so we could part with a pick in order to move up and still have a full slate of draft picks once the draft is over. Does anybody know what rounds our extra picks are in?


:tt2

NKySteeler
02-25-2009, 08:05 PM
Very good idea O, but the problem is (IMO) there are only a very few select players worth doing that... Someone of quality that could step-in almost immediately... And they will probably go rather quickly... Now yes, we do have several extra picks coming our way from the Faneca debacle (if I recall correctly), but at what price do you draw the line?... Also, we will have to sign whoever we would possibly draft, and from what I understand, we've blown almost half of our cap room on the tagging of Starks again... So what about the other "players of interest" already on the roster?... But then again, I'm by far no where near an expert in understanding the whole "cap" thing...

Ozey74
02-25-2009, 08:16 PM
I'm not an expert either, it's just fun to hash though all the different possibilities!!

steelblood
02-25-2009, 08:37 PM
who are you going to trade up for? The top three tackles will be gone in the first ten picks or so. Oher will go between 11-18. That leaves Eben Britton and Beatty from UConn. I'm not interested in either one. Britton is more of a right tackle and Beatty has trouble maintaining his weight and is a bit of a project.

RuthlessBurgher
02-25-2009, 08:37 PM
I do know that the Steelers have 9 picks this year, so we could part with a pick in order to move up and still have a full slate of draft picks once the draft is over. Does anybody know what rounds our extra picks are in?


:tt2

We have an extra pick in the middle of the 7th round from Tampa (traded for Mahan).

The other hasn't been officially announced yet, but it is likely to be a comp pick at the end of the 3rd round for Faneca. Comp picks can't be traded, though.

buckeyehoppy
02-25-2009, 08:54 PM
Judging from where we are likely to get comp picks and the spot in each round that we'll be drafting (right before the comps), trading their regular picks in the comp rounds makes a lot of sense in order to move up.

Max is not the long-term answer at LT and if the Steelers can move up to get a player who would be the heir apparent at the position. I have said this for at least the last two off-seasons, but, at a position that requires cohesion with teammates like the OL it is crucial that you get a player a season ahead of the need. Since Max is in the fold for next season, get the guy who will be groomed for that slot IN THIS DRAFT. That way, there is someone behind him pushing him and there will be no pressure to sign him to yet another inflated deal.

I wasn't thrilled when we drafted LT. But I saw the logic working with the FO and, now, the MLB corps is set for at least the next two years. This is where the Steelers need to be proactive where protecting their 9 figure QB is concerned. We need to invest high slots in the draft to #7s protection.

It's like the old saying goes: "if you pay peanuts, you get monkeys." If you draft Ben's protection low in the draft and hope to catch lightning in a bottle, you are pretty much working off the same principle.

grotonsteel
02-25-2009, 09:57 PM
Steelers are not going to get Elite OT at 32. They should be looking to draft a top Guard/ Center or Dlineman/CB from the draft .

I would be happy if Steelers 32 nd pick is from these pool of players:

Alex Mack - C
Duke Robinson - OG
Tyson Jackson - DE
Jarron Gilbert - DE
Ron Brace - DT
Sean Smith - CB

A lot depends on free agency though.

If they get Eric King, CB from Titans or DL- Shaun Cody from Lions Steelers can look for Guard/ Center in Rd 1.

Oracle
02-25-2009, 10:12 PM
groton, with all due respect, i don't think you were listening to my post

i said the steelers will TRADE UP into the 20's to go get a left tackle. i agree with you, all the elite ones will be gone by 1.32 that's WHY i wrote the post. colbert is not going to wait until the 3rd round to draft another LT project and continue to pay a mediocre player 8.4 million. now we can't afford to go get FA help or re-sign or own guys b/c we're paying starks franchise money. and there's no help on the horizon in our depth charts.

i'm not saying there won't be good value with DL, OC, or CB at 1.32 i'm saying colbert cannot neglect left tackle any longer. it's fine if you disagree, i just wanted to clarify.

thanks.

grotonsteel
02-25-2009, 11:05 PM
groton, with all due respect, i don't think you were listening to my post

i said the steelers will TRADE UP into the 20's to go get a left tackle. i agree with you, all the elite ones will be gone by 1.32 that's WHY i wrote the post. colbert is not going to wait until the 3rd round to draft another LT project and continue to pay a mediocre player 8.4 million. now we can't afford to go get FA help or re-sign or own guys b/c we're paying starks franchise money. and there's no help on the horizon in our depth charts.

i'm not saying there won't be good value with DL, OC, or CB at 1.32 i'm saying colbert cannot neglect left tackle any longer. it's fine if you disagree, i just wanted to clarify.

thanks.

My bad should have been more clear. I don't think Colbert is neglecting LT position. Max Starks is Steelers LT.Even if you trade to 20 you are going to pick 5th or 6th best Tackle. Steelers may pick either William Beatty or Eben Britton. Are these players better than Max Starks at LT? Will any of these players beat Willie Colon at RT. Steelers had issues with interior O-Lineman and not the Tackle position.

Is William Beatty or Eben Britton better NFL players than Alex Mack or Duke or Tyson etc?

It will be a reach to draft players like Beatty or Britton at 20. I would say Steelers to trade up if Andre Smith or M Oher are faliing down in 20s but it would be a mistake to trade up for Beatty or Britton. Draft a tackle like Jamon Meredith/ Tupou and let him develop for a year or two behind current starters.

Bottom line Steelers need OC/OG more than a Tackle. :2c

SteelerOfDeVille
02-26-2009, 12:34 AM
groton, with all due respect, i don't think you were listening to my post

i said the steelers will TRADE UP into the 20's to go get a left tackle. i agree with you, all the elite ones will be gone by 1.32 that's WHY i wrote the post. colbert is not going to wait until the 3rd round to draft another LT project and continue to pay a mediocre player 8.4 million. now we can't afford to go get FA help or re-sign or own guys b/c we're paying starks franchise money. and there's no help on the horizon in our depth charts.

i'm not saying there won't be good value with DL, OC, or CB at 1.32 i'm saying colbert cannot neglect left tackle any longer. it's fine if you disagree, i just wanted to clarify.

thanks.

My bad should have been more clear. I don't think Colbert is neglecting LT position. Max Starks is Steelers LT.Even if you trade to 20 you are going to pick 5th or 6th best Tackle. Steelers may pick either William Beatty or Eben Britton. Are these players better than Max Starks at LT? Will any of these players beat Willie Colon at RT. Steelers had issues with interior O-Lineman and not the Tackle position.

Is William Beatty or Eben Britton better NFL players than Alex Mack or Duke or Tyson etc?

It will be a reach to draft players like Beatty or Britton at 20. I would say Steelers to trade up if Andre Smith or M Oher are faliing down in 20s but it would be a mistake to trade up for Beatty or Britton. Draft a tackle like Jamon Meredith/ Tupou and let him develop for a year or two behind current starters.

Bottom line Steelers need OC/OG more than a Tackle. :2c
DeVille's Dollar $ign post of the day!!

They have a tackle under contract... and are likely to try and extend him.. If they're at #32 and an OT is there, it's a possibility. I don't see a legitimate reason to TRADE UP to get an OT (other than spite - and they're better than that)... a trade up to get Duke Robinson (the best OG) would be more reasonable...

They certainly have a lot of picks and I expect trading to happen because of it...

Give 'em Robinson and the draft suddenly becomes BPA from there on out...

Oviedo
02-26-2009, 09:18 AM
who are you going to trade up for? The top three tackles will be gone in the first ten picks or so. Oher will go between 11-18. That leaves Eben Britton and Beatty from UConn. I'm not interested in either one. Britton is more of a right tackle and Beatty has trouble maintaining his weight and is a bit of a project.

I completely agree. You can't package enough picks to move up to get a "sure thing" LT and anyone within reach is a big risk. I also am not interested in either Britton (one year wonder) or Beatty (cited weight problems) because I don't think either can be better at LT than Starks.

Our best LT option is Starks and everyone just needs to start realizing that and get over the emotionalism of thinking he was "overpaid" last year. The guy wasn't overpaid because he stepped in and saved the season at the most critical position on the OL. He was the best OL on the team last year for the bulk of the season. He is still young enough to get much better.

All this nonsense of reaching for unproven college players and assuming they will be better than a 5 year veteran is completely illogical. If you aren't picking in the Top 10 picks you are highly unlikely to get a franchise LT.

Iron Shiek
02-26-2009, 10:05 AM
All this nonsense of reaching for unproven college players and assuming they will be better than a 5 year veteran is completely illogical. If you aren't picking in the Top 10 picks you are highly unlikely to get a franchise LT.

That is the most logical thing I've read since the season ended...

aggiebones
02-26-2009, 01:53 PM
I say move up in the second and 3rd with your lower picks.
Use 1-32 on an OL
Trade 2-32 up to 2-15 or so with a couple picks and take another OL.
Then fall into line so to speak for the rest of the draft. Probably cost us a good pick to move up that high in the second, but if we see something we like, its worth it.

Oviedo
02-26-2009, 02:00 PM
I say move up in the second and 3rd with your lower picks.
Use 1-32 on an OL
Trade 2-32 up to 2-15 or so with a couple picks and take another OL.
Then fall into line so to speak for the rest of the draft. Probably cost us a good pick to move up that high in the second, but if we see something we like, its worth it.

I agree with the concept of moving up in Round 2 but I'm not sure that I spend two consecutive picks on the OL.

I'm actually more interested in trading down to one of the top 10 picks in Round 2. We could probabaly get an extra early Round 4 pick if we did that and then package our low Round 3 or Roiund 4 to move up in Round two.

I think by doing that we can get one OL and one DL and combined they would be equal if not better players than sitting at 1.32 and then waiting til 2.64.

RuthlessBurgher
02-26-2009, 02:38 PM
I say move up in the second and 3rd with your lower picks.
Use 1-32 on an OL
Trade 2-32 up to 2-15 or so with a couple picks and take another OL.
Then fall into line so to speak for the rest of the draft. Probably cost us a good pick to move up that high in the second, but if we see something we like, its worth it.

FYI: According to the draft trade value chart, our 2nd (270 pts.), 3rd (116 pts.), and 4th (44 pts.) add up exactly to the total for the 15th pick of the 2nd round (430 pts.). That's a pretty steep price to pay for a mid-2nd rounder (there aren't many LaMarr Woodleys that surprisingly fall to the middle of the 2nd round to be worth such a price).