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View Full Version : If Cowher stayed, are we here?



rpmpit
01-30-2009, 09:44 AM
I say no.

Iron Shiek
01-30-2009, 09:46 AM
In the voice of Lumberg (office space): Mmmm, yeaaaahhhh. That would be greeeeaaaat.

But I don't think so. Who knows though, the leading force of our team is the defense...which is led by Lebeau who would still be here anyway...so it probably still coulda happened.

frankthetank1
01-30-2009, 09:48 AM
i agree i dont think we would be either. who knows if cowher didnt retire we might not have drafted timmons and woodley in rounds 1 and 2.

Ozey74
01-30-2009, 10:08 AM
I say no.



:Agree

MeetJoeGreene
01-30-2009, 10:31 AM
i agree i dont think we would be either. who knows if cowher didnt retire we might not have drafted timmons and woodley in rounds 1 and 2.

$$$

We could very well have entirely different persons as a result of 2 drafts.

But to answer the question would we be here. I don't know - but I tend to think that we would not.

Discipline of Steel
01-30-2009, 10:39 AM
The only reason you guys are saying no is because of Cowhers drop in enthusiasm for the game his last season. Based on that level of lethargy, of course not. But if you asked the same question including an 'energetic' Cowher, its a real possibility.

The reality of it is...Cowher had lost his energy for the game so if he stayed on, it would be an All-Birds SB.

rpmpit
01-30-2009, 10:44 AM
The only reason you guys are saying no is because of Cowhers drop in enthusiasm for the game his last season. Based on that level of lethargy, of course not. But if you asked the same question including an 'energetic' Cowher, its a real possibility.

The reality of it is...Cowher had lost his energy for the game so if he stayed on, it would be an All-Birds SB.

Cowher's last season is definitely part of it. Totally agree with you on that one.

But I also think Tomlin is much better at getting our guys to play and play on a high level when it counts. Don't want to knock Coach Cowher. I'm just REALLY glad Coach Tomlin is our guy now.

pfelix73
01-30-2009, 10:46 AM
I guess I'm the only one who sees us being here no matter who the coach is.

This is still pretty much Bill's team, except for a few players. Let's not forget that Colbert is the one who is drafting too. His influence was greater in that first year too.

Don't get me wrong- Tomlin is a good coach, but....let me just say the real coaching will be down the road.. IMO.

Roethlisberger
Parker
Miller
Starks
Kemo
Simmons
Colon
Ward
Holmes
Washington
Harrison
A. Smith
Hampton
Farrior
Foote
Taylor
Townsend
McFadden
Polamalu
Clark
Carter
Etc.

Were all here from the Cowher era....

Northern_Blitz
01-30-2009, 10:54 AM
I loved coach C, but i don't think we're here with him.

One of the reasons I think that we're here is that Tomlin trusts the O. Even though the O's not that good, Tomlin will go for it on 4 & 1, and 4th and goal. No way Cowher makes those calls. I think that making those calls tells the team (the O line in particular) that Tomlin has faith in them when it counts (even after they fail). I think that makes them play harder for him, then they would for even Cowher (who is a guy that most players seemed to love).

Although, if we still had Cowher, do we still get to have Whis? I'm not in the fire BA camp, but I think Whis would do more this this O (although Ben didn't seem to like him).

pfelix73
01-30-2009, 11:00 AM
Cowher went for it on 4th downs more so than Tomlin.

SB XL that Roethlisberger TD that was reviewed and upheld- Cowher was planning on going for it on 4th down there....

What's going to happen monday morning IF our beloved Steelers lose to Whisenhunt's Cards? The talk will begin on here and elsewhere.

Congrats to Tomlin for winning the Coach of the Year and all, but someone like the guy from Atlanta or Miami should have won that IMO. They did more with less......

Northern_Blitz
01-30-2009, 11:12 AM
Cowher went for it on 4th downs more so than Tomlin.

SB XL that Roethlisberger TD that was reviewed and upheld- Cowher was planning on going for it on 4th down there....

What's going to happen monday morning IF our beloved Steelers lose to Whisenhunt's Cards? The talk will begin on here and elsewhere.

Congrats to Tomlin for winning the Coach of the Year and all, but someone like the guy from Atlanta or Miami should have won that IMO. They did more with less......\

Tomlin went for it 12 times in the regular season this year (on 4th down), twice in the post season. Last year it was 13 and 1.

I looked at Cowher from 2003 - 2006

Year-------Regular Season------Post Season
2006--------13-------------------1
2005--------21--------------------
2004--------12-------------------2
2003--------12-------------------2

Clearly, I was wrong about Cowher and going for it on 4th.

I still believe that doing this makes your players play harder for you.

AngryAsian
01-30-2009, 11:40 AM
I really don't believe that personnel is what us got us here. I look at Tampa in 2003 and they basically had the same team on both sides of the ball and it took Gruden, not Dungy to get them over the top. Nothing against Dungy, his coaching prowess made evident two SBs ago, but you can have all the talent in the world, but if you don't have the right compass to point them all to the right direction, you don't have anything. The Cowboys is a glowing example of this. I don't think this team would be the same if Tomlin hadn't taken over. Deebo wasn't on this team and was never truly given a chance, until an injury. I doubt Peezy would of been show the door if Cowher remained as coach, and thus never would of given Deebo the chance to shine and garnish DPOY honors. I don't think the Timmons and Woodley picks would of been made as well. Tomlin was and is the right man for the job.

Oviedo
01-30-2009, 11:48 AM
i agree i dont think we would be either. who knows if cowher didnt retire we might not have drafted timmons and woodley in rounds 1 and 2.

I don't think that happens. I think we would have held on to some overage veterans and we may not have seen players who have contributed this year like Timmons, Gay and Woodley. Heck Harrison may not be Defensive Player of the Year because Cowher may have pushed to keep Porter.

The reality is that vital growing organizations reinvent themselves periodically in terms of the leadership and key individuals in that organization.

You stay true to your values but it is important to get a fresh outlook and perspective because everyone regardless of how good they are gets to the point where they can't see past their own prejudices and predetermined outlook on the organization. That is why after 10 years on the job it will be time for Tomlin to move on too. Hopefully he has won his fourth Super Bowl by then.

feltdizz
01-30-2009, 11:49 AM
hellll no.... now if Bettis stayed? Maybe...
cause I truly believe Bettis is what got us to the SB...

and Cowher kicks FG's all the time in the red zone...

stlrz d
01-30-2009, 12:00 PM
With the same personnel? Yes.

But who's to know how his drafts would have gone the past two seasons.

feltdizz
01-30-2009, 12:06 PM
With the same personnel? Yes.

But who's to know how his drafts would have gone the past two seasons.

I disagree D... Cowher was a great coach but there were times when you really had a :wft
with some of Cowhers game decisions...

putting Coclough back on a punt?
keeping Holmes at PR when it was obvious he wasn't going to protect the ball...
and his loyalty to the vets would have some of our better personnel on the sidelines.

I don't think Timmon's see's the field. Does Ike Taylor sit the bench?

I liked Cowher but I really feel like one SB is all Cowher ever wanted.

frankthetank1
01-30-2009, 12:10 PM
With the same personnel? Yes.

But who's to know how his drafts would have gone the past two seasons.

we would definetly be here with the same personnel. i think pretty much everyone can agree on that. also i doubt the special teams would have been this good this season if cowher were still the coach. he also might have benched ike this season for no reason :lol:

pfelix73
01-30-2009, 12:14 PM
But you can say the same about Tomlin.

Is Timmons even drafted? I still say a CB there in the slot would've done us more good than Timmons. Although Gay has been a pleasant surprise.

Don't forget about the bad calls Tomlin had last year, especially in the playoff game.

That 2 point conversion was one of them.

Early on last year, he second guessed himself on challenging some plays too.....

I'm not going to go on bashing Tomlin as a coach because quite frankly, he could wind up being a great coach. It will, however, take many more years, good years, for him to be considered a great coach. Is Barry Switzer considered a great NFL coach just because he followed Johnson and won a SB? I would say NO.

This team is overwhelmingly still Cowher's team. It's his nucleus of veterans. As these players leave via FA, etc and are replaced by Tomlin's players, then and only then will we be able to really answer just how good of a coach Tomlin is/was.

Oviedo
01-30-2009, 12:15 PM
With the same personnel? Yes.

But who's to know how his drafts would have gone the past two seasons.

we would definetly be here with the same personnel. i think pretty much everyone can agree on that. also i doubt the special teams would have been this good this season if cowher were still the coach. he also might have benched ike this season for no reason :lol:

Your comment on Ike may be right one because I think the biggest improvement under Tomlin has been the play of our DBs. Whatever he or whoever he has working with them has done there has been a difference in that area. Would Coclough be gone if Cowher was still here?

frankthetank1
01-30-2009, 12:17 PM
But you can say the same about Tomlin.

Is Timmons even drafted? I still say a CB there in the slot would've done us more good than Timmons. Although Gay has been a pleasant surprise.

Don't forget about the bad calls Tomlin had last year, especially in the playoff game.

That 2 point conversion was one of them.

Early on last year, he second guessed himself on challenging some plays too.....

I'm not going to go on bashing Tomlin as a coach because quite frankly, he could wind up being a great coach. It will, however, take many more years, good years, for him to be considered a great coach. Is Barry Switzer considered a great NFL coach just because he followed Johnson and won a SB? I would say NO.

This team is overwhelmingly still Cowher's team. It's his nucleus of veterans. As these players leave via FA, etc and are replaced by Tomlin's players, then and only then will we be able to really answer just how good of a coach Tomlin is/was.

i really wanted revis but he was taken right before timmons was. i also liked leon hall cant remember if he went before or after timmons. after two seasons i would much rather have timmons than hall. what other cb's would you rather of drafted than timmons? tomlin is much more aggresive and takes more chances than cowher did that is for certain. maybe cowher would of gambled more if they had a defense as good as this one

pfelix73
01-30-2009, 12:25 PM
Do you know why Revis went right ahead of us? Tomlin let it out in that PC that they were interested in him- bing badda boom, Jets move in front of us.....

I do agree that Tomlin's knowledge as a secondary coach has really helped our DBs.... And that is huge as I thought the weak link to this team were the CB's.

pfelix73
01-30-2009, 12:26 PM
I disagree on Tomlin taking more chances than his predecessor.

frankthetank1
01-30-2009, 12:27 PM
Do you know why Revis went right ahead of us? Tomlin let it out in that PC that they were interested in him- bing badda boom, Jets move in front of us.....

I do agree that Tomlin's knowledge as a secondary coach has really helped our DBs.... And that is huge as I thought the weak link to this team were the CB's.

really? i dont remember that at all. im sure he said something pretty vague, i cant imagine he would say we are taking revis. i assumed the jets moved ahead because revis is a great cb and they did need a lot of help in the secondary

BradshawsHairdresser
01-30-2009, 12:36 PM
15 starters on this team are holdovers from the Cowher era.
We would not be in this Super Bowl but for Cowher.

Cowher in home AFCC games: 0 for 4.
We would not be in the Super Bowl with Cowher as head coach.

AngryAsian
01-30-2009, 12:41 PM
15 starters on this team are holdovers from the Cowher era.
We would not be in this Super Bowl but for Cowher.

Cowher in home AFCC games: 0 for 4.
We would not be in the Super Bowl with Cowher as head coach.


Agreed. We are discussing who is the better runner.... your right leg or your left leg.

rpmpit
01-30-2009, 12:42 PM
Ok, I wasn't thinking personnel when I originally posted this. The main reason was I watched SBXL the other night. And I was surprised at how freakin' tight we looked in the first half. It wasn't just Ben, it was the whole team. Without those two big penalties in the first half (the holding and the push-off) we are potentially down 14 early.

pfelix, you seem like you're a big time Cowher guy. I have nothing against Coach Cowher except how he handled the big games. We had teams that were way more talented than what we put on the field for XL and those teams failed miserably in the playoffs. I agree with a lot of you guys who think that we won XL despite Cowher, not because of him.

Granted, we still have to see how Tomlin handles the game this weekend. I just think he'll be able to handle the pressure better than Cowher. And quite honestly, I think he's already shown that he can.

frankthetank1
01-30-2009, 12:53 PM
Ok, I wasn't thinking personnel when I originally posted this. The main reason was I watched SBXL the other night. And I was surprised at how freakin' tight we looked in the first half. It wasn't just Ben, it was the whole team. Without those two big penalties in the first half (the holding and the push-off) we are potentially down 14 early.

pfelix, you seem like you're a big time Cowher guy. I have nothing against Coach Cowher except how he handled the big games. We had teams that were way more talented than what we put on the field for XL and those teams failed miserably in the playoffs. I agree with a lot of you guys who think that we won XL despite Cowher, not because of him.

Granted, we still have to see how Tomlin handles the game this weekend. I just think he'll be able to handle the pressure better than Cowher. And quite honestly, I think he's already shown that he can.

i agree, plus tomlin has already been on a coaching staff of a team that was in a sb and i think that is pretty important. i noticed the other night when i was watching the 05 sb and ben and cowher were on the sidlines and ben goes "i dont want to play not to lose" i thought that was priceless. im sure cowher did not like that comment. it was the truth though. in big games cowher played not to lose and was way to conservative. i cant explain the onside kick in the 95 sb. shocking that cowher made that call

stlrz d
01-30-2009, 01:06 PM
Thought Cowher coached a pretty good game in XXX. I think he was tight in XL because it took him awhile to get back and he really wanted it.

After having won XL and with the same players Tomlin has I think we'd still be here.

pfelix73
01-30-2009, 01:07 PM
Don't forget that Ben has 5 years under his belt and is in the prime of his football career. Did any of you re-watch the SB XL the other night? I saw a Big Ben there in the 3rd Q that looked like a 2nd year QB. That interception return for almost another TD was a terrible throw.....

Ben has progressed immensely over 5 years. I hope he won't make those mistakes on Feb.1st.

He shouldn't. Let's hope he has a MVP caliber game.

rpmpit
01-30-2009, 01:09 PM
Ok, I wasn't thinking personnel when I originally posted this. The main reason was I watched SBXL the other night. And I was surprised at how freakin' tight we looked in the first half. It wasn't just Ben, it was the whole team. Without those two big penalties in the first half (the holding and the push-off) we are potentially down 14 early.

pfelix, you seem like you're a big time Cowher guy. I have nothing against Coach Cowher except how he handled the big games. We had teams that were way more talented than what we put on the field for XL and those teams failed miserably in the playoffs. I agree with a lot of you guys who think that we won XL despite Cowher, not because of him.

Granted, we still have to see how Tomlin handles the game this weekend. I just think he'll be able to handle the pressure better than Cowher. And quite honestly, I think he's already shown that he can.

i agree, plus tomlin has already been on a coaching staff of a team that was in a sb and i think that is pretty important. i noticed the other night when i was watching the 05 sb and ben and cowher were on the sidlines and ben goes "i dont want to play not to lose" i thought that was priceless. im sure cowher did not like that comment. it was the truth though. in big games cowher played not to lose and was way to conservative. i cant explain the onside kick in the 95 sb. shocking that cowher made that call

It was actually Bobby April's call. Cowher definitely had to "approve" it, but without April suggesting it, I doubt it happens.

And yes, Ben's comment about playing not to lose says it all.

Steeler Shades
01-30-2009, 01:38 PM
Yes!!!
8)

feltdizz
01-30-2009, 02:06 PM
But you can say the same about Tomlin.

Is Timmons even drafted? I still say a CB there in the slot would've done us more good than Timmons. Although Gay has been a pleasant surprise.

Don't forget about the bad calls Tomlin had last year, especially in the playoff game.

That 2 point conversion was one of them.

Early on last year, he second guessed himself on challenging some plays too.....

I'm not going to go on bashing Tomlin as a coach because quite frankly, he could wind up being a great coach. It will, however, take many more years, good years, for him to be considered a great coach. Is Barry Switzer considered a great NFL coach just because he followed Johnson and won a SB? I would say NO.

This team is overwhelmingly still Cowher's team. It's his nucleus of veterans. As these players leave via FA, etc and are replaced by Tomlin's players, then and only then will we be able to really answer just how good of a coach Tomlin is/was.


I don't think it's fair to keep reminding people of Tomlin's first year trip ups as a rookie HC... it happens with a coach that young.

It would be like me reminding people of Troy's first year when he was ripping up the NFL in his second year... or someone trying to convince me Timmon's still is suspect cause of last year. I don't buy it.

Sure Tomlin has years to go but so many detractors said this year would define how good Tomlin is.... This is not Cowhers team anymore either... it's one thing to ride on coat tails like Chucky or Switzer.... Tomlin has elevated this team.

Every player says it. Maybe it's cliche but I truly believe Tomlin broke all that Cowher vet bullsh#t out....

pfelix73
01-30-2009, 04:50 PM
Yes, I know. I said that for a reason. The reason being that most people on here are already predicting that Tomlin is the second coming of Vince Lombardi or Chuck Noll and he's only coached for 2 full seasons. That's from what I took out of some of the posts.

The question, If Cowher stayed, are we here? is a question that can't be answered, obviously. But those that said no way at the onset of this thread sounded to me that Tomlin is the reason why we're in the SB and that just ain't so.

Reality is that the nucleus of this team is/ was Cowher's and Colbert's team. But so what? The injection of Tomlin and his coaching has been a positive too and without it, maybe we would've lost a few more games along the way.

Let's face it, we also had some luck along the way too and there's nothing wrong with that.....

fezziwig
01-30-2009, 05:03 PM
No.........................


He lost his drive in my opinion. He doesn't finish the seasons very well. Our biggest qualities to our team are Marrison and Woodley and I doubt Woodely would be here on the team.
Harrison may not even be starting for that matter.

Would he have allowed BMac the playing time ?

I know he wouldn't allow Arians to screw up the offense so theres a little balance back.

Cowher had too many ghost in his coaching past. Tomlin was able to get this team over the hump.

Lonbull
01-30-2009, 05:53 PM
If Cowher Stayed, are we here?

I don't think you can compare Cowher's entire career versus Tomlin's relatively short one and come up with any answers.

Specifically this season - would a Cowher coached team have beaten San Diego and Baltimore - I think so, hence we're in the Super Bowl.

I think Alan Faneca would have stayed for Bill Cowher - is that good or bad - considering Simmons injury - probably good.

I don't believe we would have picked up Mewelde Moore - good or bad?? Probably bad.

The reverse question I would ask is "Would Tomlin be here if a 29 year old Kordell Stewart was his Quarterback?"

Tomlin perhaps has the best young Quarterback to have ever played the game (see victories in his first 5 seasons). And the Steelers will eventually go through changes and Tomlin may have some bad seasons because of them - the point is - if you've got a good / great head coach - you've got a foundation for success - and I believe we had that with both Cowher, Tomlin and certainly Noll.

If we win on Sunday I intend on writing a rather lenghty thread with an idea I've got. But one of the ideas in this upcoming thread is the victory of all Three major coaches in this upcoming Super Bowl.

Chuck Noll - Helped develop Tony Dungy as a player and coach (who in turn helped develop, briefly, Coach Mike Tomlin). He also left Cowher with a significant amount of talent in the early 90's.

Bill Cowher - Helped Dick LeBeau develop his fire zone defense, who in turn has helped Mike Tomlin's defense succeed. Bill Cowher also handed Mike Tomlin a significant amount of talent.

Mike Tomlin - of course is our current coach - and personally speaking I think he's done an excellent job. I think he's made some mistakes (onside kick at the beginning of the Redskins game??) but I think you want a young coach to be aggressive and learn, so you take the good with the bad.

In a way the Steelers wouldn't be here if not for all of these guys, and while I realize it may seem a stretch to include Chuck Noll - without him, you have to wonder if coming into this game our legacy would be any different from the Cardinals at this point?

Perhaps the bigger question here is - without the Steeler Ownership, Organization, and Legacy - would either Tomlin or Cowher ever gone to a Super Bowl?

L.B.

Lonbull
01-30-2009, 06:01 PM
I really don't believe that personnel is what us got us here. I look at Tampa in 2003 and they basically had the same team on both sides of the ball and it took Gruden, not Dungy to get them over the top.

IMO - Gruden was just lucky to be at the right place at the right time.

After his first year the Buccaneers progressively got worse (only going to the playoffs 2 times in the next 6).

Tony Dungy not only improved the Buccaneers (4 playoffs in 5 seasons), but he improved the Colts as well. The Colts went to the playoffs 7 straight seasons under Dungy.

Now maybe Gruden was the right guy for that particular year - but I certainly wouldn't want Tomlin to follow Gruden's one quick Super Bowl with another guy's talent and then just progressively get worse.

L.B.

Steelhere10
01-30-2009, 07:24 PM
HELL NO because we would still have Joey and Clark starting as OLB Sean Morey stiil on the team, no Lawrence T. or William Gay playing in crucial situations and Dick L. without full controll of the defense no Mewlde More = the reason we were the second sead see Ravens 1st game and Jacksonville and last but not least PLAYING NOT TO LOSE, INSTEAD OF PLAYING TO WIN

SteelerOfDeVille
01-30-2009, 07:33 PM
Do you know why Revis went right ahead of us? Tomlin let it out in that PC that they were interested in him- bing badda boom, Jets move in front of us.....

I do agree that Tomlin's knowledge as a secondary coach has really helped our DBs.... And that is huge as I thought the weak link to this team were the CB's.

really? i dont remember that at all. im sure he said something pretty vague, i cant imagine he would say we are taking revis. i assumed the jets moved ahead because revis is a great cb and they did need a lot of help in the secondary
yes - but, they wanted timmons... they released some mis-info to let Timmons fall...

SteelerOfDeVille
01-30-2009, 07:41 PM
clearly, both of them benefitted from having LeBeau as DC... and Cowher's teams didn't do as well without Tricky Dicky as DC...

I don't know that we'll ever be able to clearly say "coach x was better than coach y" in this case.

Will Tomlin ever find a Chan Gailey calling plays? I know the team is predominantly Cowher's guys... but, in all reality, Cowher won once with them and went around .500 in his final season.

The flip of that is Cowher's teams were seemingly always in contention...

Let's suppose they win this year and next... does that make Tomlin better already?

fun debate - impossible to prove.

pfelix73
01-30-2009, 07:45 PM
Porter would've been gone no matter who the coach. He was too expensive to re-sign and they let him go. Agreed that Faneca probably would still be on the team without a coaching change. Although, you could argue that $ was going to get the better of AF regardless and he would've walked no matter what.

As far as picking those in the draft, many are forgetting that Colbert has a great deal of influence on who is drafted. As well as the rest of the organization from the FO all the way to the coaches. It's not just one person's decision....

BURGH86STEEL
01-30-2009, 08:29 PM
Based on past history, there is a very good chance Cowher could've taken this team too the SB this season.

northgate1980
01-30-2009, 11:49 PM
I agree with a lot of you guys who think that we won XL despite Cowher, not because of him.



True, but he did an excellent job in the AFC playoffs leading up to that, especially in the Indy and Denver games. Allowing Ben to throw early, getting points, and not trying to sit on a lead too early. Also remember, this was the first year he ever had a good QB as well. Being as successful as he was with the string of sub par Qbs he had is a testament to his coaching as well, though he tended to tighten up way too much in big games.

BURGH86STEEL
01-31-2009, 09:03 AM
I agree with a lot of you guys who think that we won XL despite Cowher, not because of him.



True, but he did an excellent job in the AFC playoffs leading up to that, especially in the Indy and Denver games. Allowing Ben to throw early, getting points, and not trying to sit on a lead too early. Also remember, this was the first year he ever had a good QB as well. Being as successful as he was with the string of sub par Qbs he had is a testament to his coaching as well, though he tended to tighten up way too much in big games.

Peoples opinions of those games is usually wrong. It is strange that people continue to point the blame for losses in the wrong areas. Throwing early, getting points, and not trying to sit on a lead early was not the problem in those playoff losses. The problem came down to turnovers. The QBs decided to throw the ball too the other teams. It is really that simple.

It was not the first year Cowher had a good QB. Remember Neil Odonnel? He helped to take the team to the SB. He was a good QB for this team. Kordell had 2 or 3 good years.

Give me evidence that Cowher tightened up in big games. Always remember the turnovers. No coach can over come turnovers by the players.

Chachi
01-31-2009, 09:37 AM
We might still be here with Cowher though I think our defense, especially our DBs, have gained great insight and coaching from Tomlin that Cowher would not have been able to provide. We would still have a great defense, but not as dominate as we are. That is the stamp of Tomlin.

But, looking at the other team in this game I don't think the Cards are here if Cowher stays. I don't think Cowher would have signed a long deal, only a 2 year or so, and I think he convinces Wiz to stay for one more try. Hence, Cards don't get Wiz and wouldn't be here today.

ANPSTEEL
01-31-2009, 01:35 PM
Lots of really good points here-

IMO, the answer would be no. The team would not be in the SB this year- with Cowher coaching.

some of the reasons...

personnel differences..

-Faneca
-Porter
both still with the team?
-coke?
-is ike on the bench?
-is harrison on the field (this one i think is a yes.. he'd be playing opposite of porter)

does the team draft the same?
probably not

Offensively, I think the personality of the team would have been consistent with Cowher's style of ball control.

To me the big difference comes down to two issues- both strictly a reflection of coaching under Cowher, imo.

A. the teams historic under performance in big games

B. the teams historic tendency to play "flat" periodically during the season, and thus lose a few games they shouldn't. In other words, I think the team would have lost more games against that schedule, and possibly missed the playoffs- or been in as a wild card.


I am a big fan of Cowher- but I think Tomlin got the most out of this team- and is definitely the right guy for the job.

SteelSurf
01-31-2009, 03:24 PM
Tough call. Would we still have the Whiz? Everyone is a LeBeau fan here and for good reason. I think Arians calls frustrate many a Steeler fan. I dont dislike the guy, but at times he calls some pretty odd plays and has players doing things they were not meant to do.
Me? I have liked every coach the Steelers have had. My first one was Noll,so I'm dating myself. I've been a fan since before we had our first SuperBowl win.

Great thing about the Steelers...it's an organization.No one man,player,coach or head office guy can take credit for our wins or loses. The Steelers are unique in that way.

If a player gets in trouble with the law or shoots his mouth off, he is gone. We have many Star Players but we dont have TO's and Pacman Jones idiots play for us. Moss wouldnt play here nor would Ocho Cinco idiot (or whatever he is calling himself lately).

williar
01-31-2009, 07:19 PM
No! I think Cowher would have continued to rest on his laurels of finally winning a superbowl, even though it took him 15 years to finally do so. This team needed a new energy, a new direction. I think Tomlin was the perfect person for the job.