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View Full Version : 1-4 @ home because we showed too much?



Steeler Shades
12-27-2008, 03:43 PM
Does anyone else think the Steelers have struggled with home playoff games because we didn't hide enough from opposing teams during the regular season? If we showed too much to get into the playoffs wouldn't we have the same problem on the road? I'm not talking specifically about this year but in the last 5 home playoff games....... have we lost them because we didn't have enough to confuse the opponents? 8)



You know what happens when you throw the sink to get homefield? you go 1-4 at home cause you have nothing know to confuse the opponents.

Wolfhound45
12-27-2008, 04:01 PM
I do. I think that we have tipped our hand much too early in the past when it came to potential playoff matchups. At some point you have to play the regular season with an eye towards the postseason. It is a delicate balance which we have not mastered in the past. In this instance, I don't think it will help much. We are just not as good a team as we need to be in the playoffs. Too many issues with our OL and running game will hold us back.

Flasteel
12-27-2008, 04:23 PM
How can we not have something new? Our offense is about as predictable as weather in the Sahara and has the imagination of a retarded monkey. Unless BA trimmed the playbook down to the size of Hardy Brothers mystery novel, there has to be tons of plays in our back pocket. Unfortunately we'll probably trot out the same stuff we have all year and just hope that our guys beat theirs.

Ozey74
12-27-2008, 04:33 PM
This is a new Steeler team under Coach Tomlin. What was done in the past was done in the Cowher era. I know we lost last year at home in the playoffs to the Jags, but we were expected to since we were a 1.5 or 2 pt underdog.

We will go into the playoffs this year with a bad-a$$ D & are more rested as a team.

:tt2

Steeler Shades
12-27-2008, 04:47 PM
If we have actually "showed too much" during the regular season in the past, wouldn't our road playoff record be just as bad as our home playoff record? 8)

BURGH86STEEL
12-27-2008, 05:16 PM
Does anyone else think the Steelers have struggled with home playoff games because we didn't hide enough from opposing teams during the regular season? If we showed too much to get into the playoffs wouldn't we have the same problem on the road? I'm not talking specifically about this year but in the last 5 home playoff games....... have we lost them because we didn't have enough to confuse the opponents? 8)



You know what happens when you throw the sink to get homefield? you go 1-4 at home cause you have nothing know to confuse the opponents.

Steelers have struggled with home playoff losses because they gave the ball away. It is really that simple.

Steeler Shades
12-27-2008, 06:14 PM
You know what happens when you throw the sink to get homefield? you go 1-4 at home cause you have nothing know to confuse the opponents.Steelers have struggled with home playoff losses because they gave the ball away. It is really that simple.
TOs have killed us in the playoffs. Why haven't TOs killed us on the road? Actually other than 2005 how many road playoff games have we played during the time we were 1-4 at home? 8)

NKySteeler
12-27-2008, 06:45 PM
Actually other than 2005 how many road playoff games have we played during the time we were 1-4 at home? 8)

What timeframe are you looking at with an overall 1-4 home record?... Are you looking at only championship games?.... Or was it just a "hypothetical" question... :lol:

Since Cowher came to town, here's our playoff history... Personally, to answer the question, I think it is simply bad luck and coincidence... As you already noted, we haven't played much on the road.

We were 0-1 at home in '07
We were 3-0 on the road in '05
We were 1-1 at home in '04
We were 1-0 at home and 0-1 on the road in '02
We were 1-1 at home in '01
We were 1-1 at home in '97
We were 1-0 at home and 0-1 on the road in '96
We were 2-0 at home in '95
We were 1-1 at home in '94
We were 0-1 on the road in '93
We were 0-1 at home in '92

Wolfhound45
12-27-2008, 06:52 PM
If we have actually "showed too much" during the regular season in the past, wouldn't our road playoff record be just as bad as our home playoff record? 8)

Though you used the example of our home playoff record, the reality is that you have to be careful regardless as to whether you play at home or on the road. I would agree with other posters that our offensive play calling is just offensive. Nothing more needs to be said. However, our defensive play calling is fairly innovative and you should show only the most basic of sets and coverages when you in in the final quarter of the season and preparing for the playoffs.

Again, a delicate balance.

costanza2k1
12-27-2008, 07:54 PM
That's a good theory and some of it maybe true. I think we've lost the home games because we've done the same things and not mixed it up enough. In the Bill Cowher days we ran on 1st and 2nd down and pass on the 3rd downs. The only 2 times we didn't do it was in 95 and 05 and we all know where we ended it up then.

I guess the question should be, how will the Steelers mix it up this time around? Put in some bubbas and a FB and shove it down the opposing teams throats, even if unsuccessful. It will be interesting for sure.

I don't think Arians is capable of doing any type of mixing up to be honest. He has a great 15 scripted plays but then falls apart after that once he needs to be creative. He's the opposite of Lebeau. I do think the defense has held a lot back during the season which is pretty damn scary. We just haven't used a whole lot exotic bliztes, just seemed to line up and put together a beat down most of the time. The playoffs will be interesting.

stlrz d
12-27-2008, 08:34 PM
Actually other than 2005 how many road playoff games have we played during the time we were 1-4 at home? 8)

What timeframe are you looking at with an overall 1-4 home record?... Are you looking at only championship games?.... Or was it just a "hypothetical" question... :lol:

Since Cowher came to town, here's our playoff history... Personally, to answer the question, I think it is simply bad luck and coincidence... As you already noted, we haven't played much on the road.

We were 0-1 at home in '07
We were 3-0 on the road in '05
We were 1-1 at home in '04
We were 1-0 at home and 0-1 on the road in '02
We were 1-1 at home in '01
We were 1-1 at home in '97
We were 1-0 at home and 0-1 on the road in '96
We were 2-0 at home in '95
We were 1-1 at home in '94
We were 0-1 on the road in '93
We were 0-1 at home in '92

Shame on you for being too lazy to do all that research and typing...and then not totaling them up! :P :lol:

Ok, from '92 to '07 we are 8-6 at home and 4-4 on the road*. 12-10 overall.

*I added in SB XXX (road loss) and SB XL (road win).

Steeler Shades
12-27-2008, 09:23 PM
I was trying to determine whether the following statement was accurate. The poster did not give the time frame he was referencing. Thanks for doing the research & math. 8)

You know what happens when you throw the sink to get homefield? you go 1-4 at home cause you have nothing know to confuse the opponents.

NKySteeler
12-27-2008, 10:53 PM
Shame on you for being too lazy to do all that research and typing...and then not totaling them up!

:oops: :oops: ......... :lol:

... I actually was going to do so... But you're right, I got lazy..... But my point was that we really haven't been on the road too much if you toss out '05.

NKySteeler
12-27-2008, 10:58 PM
I was trying to determine whether the following statement was accurate. The poster did not give the time frame he was referencing. Thanks for doing the research & math. 8)

You know what happens when you throw the sink to get homefield? you go 1-4 at home cause you have nothing know to confuse the opponents.

Well, given the numbers, I really don't see thier position...

Personally, I don't think it is a matter of "showing all the cards" during the season, but more of just plain and simple coincidence... Stuff happens, and most of our playoff games during more closer years were at home. It's bound to happen. Heck, we probably should've won 1 or 2 of those home games, but I'm not going to bring Korky into the equation... Also, there were several plays that got us wins on the road (the trick play in Cincy in '05 stands out to me).

If anyone wants to complain about what Cowher brought to the table and where he took this team (win or lose in the playoffs), I have only one thing to say.... It could have been a helluva lot worse over those years... Be thankful that we didn't have someone like Bruce Coslett as a head coach.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
12-27-2008, 11:36 PM
Am I the only one who thinks of film crews and the *s when I read this thread?

Steeler Shades
12-27-2008, 11:46 PM
Well, given the numbers, I really don't see thier position...

Personally, I don't think it is a matter of "showing all the cards" during the season, but more of just plain and simple coincidence... Stuff happens, and most of our playoff games during more closer years were at home. It's bound to happen. Heck, we probably should've won 1 or 2 of those home games, but I'm not going to bring Korky into the equation... Also, there were several plays that got us wins on the road (the trick play in Cincy in '05 stands out to me).

If anyone wants to complain about what Cowher brought to the table and where he took this team (win or lose in the playoffs), I have only one thing to say.... It could have been a helluva lot worse over those years... Be thankful that we didn't have someone like Bruce Coslett as a head coach.
:Clap :Clap
Couldn't agree more. 8)

BURGH86STEEL
12-28-2008, 02:40 AM
That's a good theory and some of it maybe true. I think we've lost the home games because we've done the same things and not mixed it up enough. In the Bill Cowher days we ran on 1st and 2nd down and pass on the 3rd downs. The only 2 times we didn't do it was in 95 and 05 and we all know where we ended it up then.

I guess the question should be, how will the Steelers mix it up this time around? Put in some bubbas and a FB and shove it down the opposing teams throats, even if unsuccessful. It will be interesting for sure.

I don't think Arians is capable of doing any type of mixing up to be honest. He has a great 15 scripted plays but then falls apart after that once he needs to be creative. He's the opposite of Lebeau. I do think the defense has held a lot back during the season which is pretty damn scary. We just haven't used a whole lot exotic bliztes, just seemed to line up and put together a beat down most of the time. The playoffs will be interesting.

You should take a look at how much they passed on 1st and 2nd downs through those years. I think you will find out that you are wrong. The main problem in the losses were the turnovers. QBs failed to execute in the losses.

The team does not have the players up front to run well on a consistent basis. For the life of me, I cannot figure out why people think it has something to do with mixing it up. Like there is a magical formula for running the football. The players have to line up and beat the guys in front of them. This is something they have not done well consistently this season. There always seems to be one break down.

Here we go with the Arians stuff again. He can only work with what he has. No coordinator can get the job done well if the coordinator does not have the players. That includes Lebeau. In 2007, we did not have 2 quality pass rushers coming off the edge. No matter what they did, they had trouble getting to QBs. It was one reason they used Troy to blitz more last season. Can we really say what the defense held back? How many different exotic looks do they have? It would've helped if they used some against the Titans and Giants. When they rush the passer, it will be about beating the guy in front of them. Either those guys get it done or they do not.

stlrz d
12-28-2008, 10:49 AM
That's a good theory and some of it maybe true. I think we've lost the home games because we've done the same things and not mixed it up enough. In the Bill Cowher days we ran on 1st and 2nd down and pass on the 3rd downs. The only 2 times we didn't do it was in 95 and 05 and we all know where we ended it up then.

I guess the question should be, how will the Steelers mix it up this time around? Put in some bubbas and a FB and shove it down the opposing teams throats, even if unsuccessful. It will be interesting for sure.

I don't think Arians is capable of doing any type of mixing up to be honest. He has a great 15 scripted plays but then falls apart after that once he needs to be creative. He's the opposite of Lebeau. I do think the defense has held a lot back during the season which is pretty damn scary. We just haven't used a whole lot exotic bliztes, just seemed to line up and put together a beat down most of the time. The playoffs will be interesting.

You should take a look at how much they passed on 1st and 2nd downs through those years. I think you will find out that you are wrong. The main problem in the losses were the turnovers. QBs failed to execute in the losses.

The team does not have the players up front to run well on a consistent basis. For the life of me, I cannot figure out why people think it has something to do with mixing it up. Like there is a magical formula for running the football. The players have to line up and beat the guys in front of them. This is something they have not done well consistently this season. There always seems to be one break down.

Here we go with the Arians stuff again. He can only work with what he has. No coordinator can get the job done well if the coordinator does not have the players. That includes Lebeau. In 2007, we did not have 2 quality pass rushers coming off the edge. No matter what they did, they had trouble getting to QBs. It was one reason they used Troy to blitz more last season. Can we really say what the defense held back? How many different exotic looks do they have? It would've helped if they used some against the Titans and Giants. When they rush the passer, it will be about beating the guy in front of them. Either those guys get it done or they do not.

That's adapting to the players you have, something Arians doesn't seem to get.

BURGH86STEEL
12-28-2008, 12:27 PM
That's a good theory and some of it maybe true. I think we've lost the home games because we've done the same things and not mixed it up enough. In the Bill Cowher days we ran on 1st and 2nd down and pass on the 3rd downs. The only 2 times we didn't do it was in 95 and 05 and we all know where we ended it up then.

I guess the question should be, how will the Steelers mix it up this time around? Put in some bubbas and a FB and shove it down the opposing teams throats, even if unsuccessful. It will be interesting for sure.

I don't think Arians is capable of doing any type of mixing up to be honest. He has a great 15 scripted plays but then falls apart after that once he needs to be creative. He's the opposite of Lebeau. I do think the defense has held a lot back during the season which is pretty damn scary. We just haven't used a whole lot exotic bliztes, just seemed to line up and put together a beat down most of the time. The playoffs will be interesting.

You should take a look at how much they passed on 1st and 2nd downs through those years. I think you will find out that you are wrong. The main problem in the losses were the turnovers. QBs failed to execute in the losses.

The team does not have the players up front to run well on a consistent basis. For the life of me, I cannot figure out why people think it has something to do with mixing it up. Like there is a magical formula for running the football. The players have to line up and beat the guys in front of them. This is something they have not done well consistently this season. There always seems to be one break down.

Here we go with the Arians stuff again. He can only work with what he has. No coordinator can get the job done well if the coordinator does not have the players. That includes Lebeau. In 2007, we did not have 2 quality pass rushers coming off the edge. No matter what they did, they had trouble getting to QBs. It was one reason they used Troy to blitz more last season. Can we really say what the defense held back? How many different exotic looks do they have? It would've helped if they used some against the Titans and Giants. When they rush the passer, it will be about beating the guy in front of them. Either those guys get it done or they do not.

That's adapting to the players you have, something Arians doesn't seem to get.

Blitzing Troy hurt the overall defense more because he was injured. It did not help the pass rush. Lebeau did not have the players to rush the passer last season. As a result, the defense suffered. Especially late in the season.

The bottom line is this, coaches need the players to get the job done. Without the players, no coach can do his job. People keep getting all over Arians when fans admit the Oline is not up to par. When Ben is not playing at a high level this season. Parker and Mendenhall are injured. When Miller and Speath are inconsistent blockers in the run and passing games. Injuries on the Oline. WRs drop passes. How can any OC overcome the inconsistencies with this offense? No matter who they bring in as the OC, it will be more of the same if Ben and the rest of the players on offense perform this poorly next season.

stlrz d
12-28-2008, 12:33 PM
I wasn't thrilled with how Troy was used last season either, but the point is at least LeBeau tried something.

Steeler Shades
12-28-2008, 12:42 PM
Did we lose the playoff game to Jax because we threw the "sink" at them during the regular season game and then had "nothing know to confuse the opponents"? 8)

feltdizz
12-28-2008, 10:29 PM
I think the actual quote shades used is being used or referenced by many out of context.

When I was debating "showing our cards" I was actually talking about the Titans game and if Lebeau may have gone vanilla on D against the Titans.

Now maybe I'm crazy but I think when you are playing for the #1 seed in week 17.... Lebeau not showing all his cards isn't that crazy of an idea....

now regarding the 1-4 record... it sure seemed like we did things just like we did all year while our opponents did new things and exposed our flaws...

I was simply suggesting that playing a playoff team so late in the season could have Lebeau holding back on a few looks..

as Steeler fans I think we can all agree that the #1 seed is not as important as TN made it out to be.. look at recent #1 seeds in the AFC as proof. Who was the last #1 seed in the AFC to win the SB anyway?

feltdizz
12-28-2008, 10:36 PM
Did we lose the playoff game to Jax because we threw the "sink" at them during the regular season game and then had "nothing know to confuse the opponents"? 8)

nope...

but I think a better question would be...

Do people think Lebeau should have used every blitz and scheme possible to win the Titans game?

I just think the playoff victory is much more important then the win for the #1 seed and I could see Lebeau holding back on a few looks...

Steeler Shades
12-28-2008, 10:39 PM
I think the playoff victory is much more important then the win for the #1 seed.
If the two were exclusive that might be true. The fact is that the #1 seed goes to the SB more often than any other seed, and there is no evidence that winning the #1 seed during the regular season decreases a teams odds of winning in the playoffs. 8)

MaxAMillion
12-29-2008, 12:23 AM
Playing against a team who secretly films the Steelers may have something to do with it.

SteelStallion
12-29-2008, 12:47 AM
Does anyone else think the Steelers have struggled with home playoff games because we didn't hide enough from opposing teams during the regular season? If we showed too much to get into the playoffs wouldn't we have the same problem on the road? I'm not talking specifically about this year but in the last 5 home playoff games....... have we lost them because we didn't have enough to confuse the opponents? 8)



You know what happens when you throw the sink to get homefield? you go 1-4 at home cause you have nothing know to confuse the opponents.

I personally don't subscribe to the 'showing too much playbook' theory. I think they basically got beat by better teams. They may have physically peaked too early in one or two cases. One could argue (which I don't care to do one way or the other) about the overall conservative style in the past. Or some other factors. I think creativity helps in the playoffs. I think facing a team in the playoffs that you've beaten in the regular season once or even twice is a negative. But in general no, I don't think that 'not hiding enough' in and of itself is a factor.