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View Full Version : Santonio wants to return punts



RussBII
06-12-2008, 09:41 AM
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_572251.html

Didn't he have a pretty bad case of the dropsies in his rookie year? But wasn't that the same year that no one on our team could catch a freaking kick?

I say give him a shot, he ripped that one off against Carolina, and i would LOVE to have a dynamic returner. Plus we're so frigging deep at WR, it's hardly a risk...

However, if he muffs ONE PUNT in Preaseson, he loses the job...

Oviedo
06-12-2008, 09:52 AM
No thanks. I don't want the most explosive WR we have injured on a punt return. Lynn Swann use to return punts as a rookie, but once he established himself as a starting WR he stopped doing that for good reason.

Shawn
06-12-2008, 10:11 AM
Absolutely...ST's is a huge part of the game. I never understood the whole...they might get hurt thing. Get the ball into your playmakers hands. Holmes is a homerun hitter and I want to see him with the ball.

ghettoscott
06-12-2008, 10:18 AM
eeesh, dont know about Santonio back there again.....kind of interested in Mewelde and what he can do in that area.

AngryAsian
06-12-2008, 10:39 AM
I applaud anybody on this team willing to wear different hats to insure the success of this ball club in whatever capacity. ST was soft spot for us last year and any upgrade that might be instituted would extremely welcomed. Holmes had the most dependable hands last year and he has game break speed, so logic would dictate that this could be a very good fit for us. I am curious on how Moore will pan out... having never seen his production in Minn. A Viking fan at work said we got a steal with this cat.... supposedly he has some serious skillz. I want proof positive.

Ozey74
06-12-2008, 10:41 AM
eeesh, dont know about Santonio back there again.....kind of interested in Mewelde and what he can do in that area.


:Agree

Shawn
06-12-2008, 10:42 AM
I would play every starter we have on STs personally.

Oviedo
06-12-2008, 10:52 AM
I would play every starter we have on STs personally.

James Harrison said in a recent article that playing on Special teams wore him down late in the season. Given that he only had 2 sacks in the last 8 games there appears to be a valid point here. I don't think we want our starters doing the same later in season.

Our Speical Teams need some hungry young players who have the athletic ability to be successful. Our problem has been that the talent level of our reserves has declined the last several years. I think the last two drafts have been positive steps in the right direction.

rpmpit
06-12-2008, 12:22 PM
Sehorn is a big reason why starters on st is a taboo subject in the NFL. The injury he suffered returning a kick pretty much ended his career.

Still, how great was it watching Rod on returns. We haven't had anyone come close to him. ARE was decent I guess.

I say give Santonio a shot.

MeetJoeGreene
06-12-2008, 12:31 PM
eeesh, dont know about Santonio back there again.....kind of interested in Mewelde and what he can do in that area.


:Agree

:Agree

AngryAsian
06-12-2008, 12:31 PM
Sehorn is a big reason why starters on st is a taboo subject in the NFL. The injury he suffered returning a kick pretty much ended his career.

Still, how great was it watching Rod on returns. We haven't had anyone come close to him. ARE was decent I guess.

I say give Santonio a shot.


Rod was money and I agree, we haven't had that caliber of a return man since. I used to own people in Tecmo Bowl playing the Steelers and Rod being the return man.... oh ya!

http://www.gamemag.ru/media/arts/new/temco-bowl.jpg

Flasteel
06-12-2008, 12:37 PM
I applaud anybody on this team willing to wear different hats to insure the success of this ball club in whatever capacity. ST was soft spot for us last year and any upgrade that might be instituted would extremely welcomed. Holmes had the most dependable hands last year and he has game break speed, so logic would dictate that this could be a very good fit for us. I am curious on how Moore will pan out... having never seen his production in Minn. A Viking fan at work said we got a steal with this cat.... supposedly he has some serious skillz. I want proof positive.

I agree with you and Shawn on this. Special teams is one-third of the game and it has killed us far too many times to not consider any and all options in the return game. Granted most of our problems have been in containing the other team's return guy , but just think back to what ARE brought to the table when he was our guy. Four career TDs and countless times he set the offense up in great field position...I miss that. I think Moore is slated to be the kick return specialist and will compete for the punt return duties, but if Holmes can beat him out, then I say go for it.

RussBII
06-12-2008, 12:58 PM
In regards to not playing starters on ST due to risk of injury. I always thought this was bogus, is there a stat anywhere that says more injuries occur on STs? If not, then the risk would be the same as playing any other down. The only increase in risk is because he actually plays more plays.

I'm more interested in him has a part time returner, ya know? Kind of like Steve Smith or Ed Reed.

Santonio vs Mewelde: I thougth Mewelde was more of a KR than a PR. If he's got PR chops, then let him an Santonio fight for the position. We had no problem w/ ARE returning punts when he was our 2nd or 3rd receiver, right?

Not to mention what a boon for your offense a good PR/KR is. Just ask the freaking browns... or The Bears. Hell the bears would have about 8 less wins over the past 2 years if they had our ST

AngryAsian
06-12-2008, 01:08 PM
I applaud anybody on this team willing to wear different hats to insure the success of this ball club in whatever capacity. ST was soft spot for us last year and any upgrade that might be instituted would extremely welcomed. Holmes had the most dependable hands last year and he has game break speed, so logic would dictate that this could be a very good fit for us. I am curious on how Moore will pan out... having never seen his production in Minn. A Viking fan at work said we got a steal with this cat.... supposedly he has some serious skillz. I want proof positive.

I agree with you and Shawn on this. Special teams is one-third of the game and it has killed us far too many times to not consider any and all options in the return game. Granted most of our problems have been in containing the other team's return guy , but just think back to what ARE brought to the table when he was our guy. Four career TDs and countless times he set the offense up in great field position...I miss that. I think Moore is slated to be the kick return specialist and will compete for the punt return duties, but if Holmes can beat him out, then I say go for it.


Everybody remembers the Monday Night Game against Baltimore last year on our sopping rained-on field. You remember Silverback's monster night and Ben's record breaking TDs in one game. But how short was the field we had to work with in that game. I distinctly remember two possessions we had on their 40 yard line or better..... and Ben made them pay for it. I don't even want TDs from our ST guys.... just shorten the field and let our offense go for the jugular.

SanAntonioSteelerFan
06-12-2008, 01:19 PM
No thanks. I don't want the most explosive WR we have injured on a punt return. Lynn Swann use to return punts as a rookie, but once he established himself as a starting WR he stopped doing that for good reason.

:Agree
If Ben could return punts well, would we put him back there? Well, even though SAH is not quite as unexpendable as Big Ben, I think about putting him back there the same way. Just 'coz he can doesn't mean he should.

:2c

Jigawatts
06-12-2008, 01:19 PM
Everybody remembers the Monday Night Game against Baltimore last year on our sopping rained-on field. You remember Silverback's monster night and Ben's record breaking TDs in one game. But how short was the field we had to work with in that game. I distinctly remember two possessions we had on their 40 yard line or better..... and Ben made them pay for it. I don't even want TDs from our ST guys.... just shorten the field and let our offense go for the jugular.

And wasn't that Silverback who crushed Ed Reed on a punt return? Reed had a harder
time picking himself up after the Ward hit, but I don't like the idea of putting one of our
best players in the sights of a special teams gunner.

I think it's a bit different on the defensive side of the ball. There's always a chance of
a starter running down the field and turning an ankle while trying to make a tackle, but flip that around and you're putting someone in position to get jacked. Or in Reed's
case, Jamesed. :wink:

If returning punts and kickoffs is so important, which it is, get a specialist like
Cribbs or Hester.

LasVegasGuy
06-12-2008, 01:32 PM
No thanks. I don't want the most explosive WR we have injured on a punt return. Lynn Swann use to return punts as a rookie, but once he established himself as a starting WR he stopped doing that for good reason.


:Agree :Agree :Agree :Agree :Agree


If we have to resort to using our future #1 wide reciever for punt returns then we are in worse shape then I could imagine on special teams. Throw Dennis Dixon out there , homie has some escapability, speed and hands to probably be a pretty good punt returner. Besides he will be sitting on the bench for a few years anyway collecting a check let's get something out of him in the meantime.

stlrz d
06-12-2008, 02:05 PM
eeesh, dont know about Santonio back there again.....kind of interested in Mewelde and what he can do in that area.


:Agree

:Agree

:Agree

We have a punt returner.

http://www.nfl.com/players/meweldemoore ... =MOO557284 (http://www.nfl.com/players/meweldemoore/careerstats?id=MOO557284)

motter1975
06-12-2008, 02:51 PM
In regards to not playing starters on ST due to risk of injury. I always thought this was bogus, is there a stat anywhere that says more injuries occur on STs? If not, then the risk would be the same as playing any other down. The only increase in risk is because he actually plays more plays.

I'm more interested in him has a part time returner, ya know? Kind of like Steve Smith or Ed Reed.

Santonio vs Mewelde: I thougth Mewelde was more of a KR than a PR. If he's got PR chops, then let him an Santonio fight for the position. We had no problem w/ ARE returning punts when he was our 2nd or 3rd receiver, right?

Not to mention what a boon for your offense a good PR/KR is. Just ask the freaking browns... or The Bears. Hell the bears would have about 8 less wins over the past 2 years if they had our ST

only 8...hell, I would think it a LOT more than that...Can you imagine how formidable the Bears would be if they had ANY kind of an offense????

Shawn
06-12-2008, 03:05 PM
I would play every starter we have on STs personally.

James Harrison said in a recent article that playing on Special teams wore him down late in the season. Given that he only had 2 sacks in the last 8 games there appears to be a valid point here. I don't think we want our starters doing the same later in season.

Our Speical Teams need some hungry young players who have the athletic ability to be successful. Our problem has been that the talent level of our reserves has declined the last several years. I think the last two drafts have been positive steps in the right direction.

Sounds like Harrison needs to run a few more gassers. :2c

Oviedo
06-12-2008, 03:07 PM
In regards to not playing starters on ST due to risk of injury. I always thought this was bogus, is there a stat anywhere that says more injuries occur on STs? If not, then the risk would be the same as playing any other down. The only increase in risk is because he actually plays more plays.

I'm more interested in him has a part time returner, ya know? Kind of like Steve Smith or Ed Reed.

Santonio vs Mewelde: I thougth Mewelde was more of a KR than a PR. If he's got PR chops, then let him an Santonio fight for the position. We had no problem w/ ARE returning punts when he was our 2nd or 3rd receiver, right?

Not to mention what a boon for your offense a good PR/KR is. Just ask the freaking browns... or The Bears. Hell the bears would have about 8 less wins over the past 2 years if they had our ST

Moore has been more of a punt returner in his career. He has returned 74 punts for 768 yards and 2 tds. He has returned 26 kick offs (20 of those in 2004) for 503 yards and 0 tds.

Don't forget that last year Santonio has shown a propensity for pulled hammies. Don't need him doing that returning kicks.

Let Nate Washington return kicks since he is such a "freakish" athlete and is getting paid $1.4M.

RussBII
06-12-2008, 03:08 PM
In regards to not playing starters on ST due to risk of injury. I always thought this was bogus, is there a stat anywhere that says more injuries occur on STs? If not, then the risk would be the same as playing any other down. The only increase in risk is because he actually plays more plays.

I'm more interested in him has a part time returner, ya know? Kind of like Steve Smith or Ed Reed.

Santonio vs Mewelde: I thougth Mewelde was more of a KR than a PR. If he's got PR chops, then let him an Santonio fight for the position. We had no problem w/ ARE returning punts when he was our 2nd or 3rd receiver, right?

Not to mention what a boon for your offense a good PR/KR is. Just ask the freaking browns... or The Bears. Hell the bears would have about 8 less wins over the past 2 years if they had our ST

only 8...hell, I would think it a LOT more than that...Can you imagine how formidable the Bears would be if they had ANY kind of an offense????

I was being conservative because I didn't want to go dig for the stats...

I still don't get the huge risk of injury... are there stats anywhere that state that folks get hurt on ST plays more than normal plays? Or is it simply because the player is involved in more plays per game?

Steve Smith returns punts occasionally. Ed Reed does too.

And the Eagles use Brian Westbrook to return punts every now and then. Now if the eagles lose Westbrook they are d-o-n-e.

If the kid has the ability to give us good field position, then let him return punts. What's the point of having WRs if you can never get past the 50, because you always start insinde the 15 or 10?

Chemsteel
06-12-2008, 03:35 PM
Santonio Holmes has great hand to eye coordination and concentration. He is also fearless and would prevent a lot of muffs. He is also one of our best receivers at getting off the LOS.

I would hesitate to give Holmes the responsibility of receiver on the punt team until the Steelers make changes in their special teams strategy.

We have led the League in muffed punts for many years. All too often the opposition sprint guys are in the face of our receivers. On kick offs, we retreat on the front way too much. We cannot prevent defensive penetration or block with 200 lb. Wedge Busters.

We think speed is the greatest need on ST. I would rather have some 270 lb. guys breathing fire and cursing all the way to the ball carriers.

Shawn
06-12-2008, 03:38 PM
eeesh, dont know about Santonio back there again.....kind of interested in Mewelde and what he can do in that area.


:Agree

:Agree

:Agree

We have a punt returner.

http://www.nfl.com/players/meweldemoore ... =MOO557284 (http://www.nfl.com/players/meweldemoore/careerstats?id=MOO557284)

So we would assume...but we thought the same about Rossum.

Shawn
06-12-2008, 03:41 PM
In regards to not playing starters on ST due to risk of injury. I always thought this was bogus, is there a stat anywhere that says more injuries occur on STs? If not, then the risk would be the same as playing any other down. The only increase in risk is because he actually plays more plays.

I'm more interested in him has a part time returner, ya know? Kind of like Steve Smith or Ed Reed.

Santonio vs Mewelde: I thougth Mewelde was more of a KR than a PR. If he's got PR chops, then let him an Santonio fight for the position. We had no problem w/ ARE returning punts when he was our 2nd or 3rd receiver, right?

Not to mention what a boon for your offense a good PR/KR is. Just ask the freaking browns... or The Bears. Hell the bears would have about 8 less wins over the past 2 years if they had our ST

only 8...hell, I would think it a LOT more than that...Can you imagine how formidable the Bears would be if they had ANY kind of an offense????

I was being conservative because I didn't want to go dig for the stats...

I still don't get the huge risk of injury... are there stats anywhere that state that folks get hurt on ST plays more than normal plays? Or is it simply because the player is involved in more plays per game?

Steve Smith returns punts occasionally. Ed Reed does too.

And the Eagles use Brian Westbrook to return punts every now and then. Now if the eagles lose Westbrook they are d-o-n-e.

If the kid has the ability to give us good field position, then let him return punts. What's the point of having WRs if you can never get past the 50, because you always start insinde the 15 or 10?

I agree...what next benching Ben because of the risk of injury due to our OL sucking?

RussBII
06-12-2008, 03:48 PM
Moore has been more of a punt returner in his career. He has returned 74 punts for 768 yards and 2 tds. He has returned 26 kick offs (20 of those in 2004) for 503 yards and 0 tds.

Don't forget that last year Santonio has shown a propensity for pulled hammies. Don't need him doing that returning kicks.

Let Nate Washington return kicks since he is such a "freakish" athlete and is getting paid $1.4M.

I stand corrected. Let em compete then. I just want the best punt returner out there returning the ball. I have to guess that if Nate was a return threat he would've been doing it by now...


I agree...what next benching Ben because of the risk of injury due to our OL sucking?

I'd actually agree with that more...

motter1975
06-12-2008, 04:09 PM
In regards to not playing starters on ST due to risk of injury. I always thought this was bogus, is there a stat anywhere that says more injuries occur on STs? If not, then the risk would be the same as playing any other down. The only increase in risk is because he actually plays more plays.

I'm more interested in him has a part time returner, ya know? Kind of like Steve Smith or Ed Reed.

Santonio vs Mewelde: I thougth Mewelde was more of a KR than a PR. If he's got PR chops, then let him an Santonio fight for the position. We had no problem w/ ARE returning punts when he was our 2nd or 3rd receiver, right?

Not to mention what a boon for your offense a good PR/KR is. Just ask the freaking browns... or The Bears. Hell the bears would have about 8 less wins over the past 2 years if they had our ST

only 8...hell, I would think it a LOT more than that...Can you imagine how formidable the Bears would be if they had ANY kind of an offense????

I was being conservative because I didn't want to go dig for the stats...

I still don't get the huge risk of injury... are there stats anywhere that state that folks get hurt on ST plays more than normal plays? Or is it simply because the player is involved in more plays per game?

Steve Smith returns punts occasionally. Ed Reed does too.

And the Eagles use Brian Westbrook to return punts every now and then. Now if the eagles lose Westbrook they are d-o-n-e.

If the kid has the ability to give us good field position, then let him return punts. What's the point of having WRs if you can never get past the 50, because you always start insinde the 15 or 10?

Oh, I agree with you 100% on using your best players on special teams, regardless of whether they are starters or not; I was just being facetious about the Bears. My fiance is a huge Bears fan, so I've watched most of their games over the past several seasons. One of the big reasons I believe that Hester has been so successful (aside from him being freakishly fast and elusive) is that the Bears use a number of their starting defensive players (like Urlacher) as blockers for Dev on kick and punt returns. Dev is amazing, but he gets some really good blocks to open up some nice holes for him. I don't think he'd be half the returner he is without the rest of the special teams unit, and he's usually the first to give credit to the rest of the guys.

RussBII
06-12-2008, 04:14 PM
In regards to not playing starters on ST due to risk of injury. I always thought this was bogus, is there a stat anywhere that says more injuries occur on STs? If not, then the risk would be the same as playing any other down. The only increase in risk is because he actually plays more plays.

I'm more interested in him has a part time returner, ya know? Kind of like Steve Smith or Ed Reed.

Santonio vs Mewelde: I thougth Mewelde was more of a KR than a PR. If he's got PR chops, then let him an Santonio fight for the position. We had no problem w/ ARE returning punts when he was our 2nd or 3rd receiver, right?

Not to mention what a boon for your offense a good PR/KR is. Just ask the freaking browns... or The Bears. Hell the bears would have about 8 less wins over the past 2 years if they had our ST

only 8...hell, I would think it a LOT more than that...Can you imagine how formidable the Bears would be if they had ANY kind of an offense????

I was being conservative because I didn't want to go dig for the stats...

I still don't get the huge risk of injury... are there stats anywhere that state that folks get hurt on ST plays more than normal plays? Or is it simply because the player is involved in more plays per game?

Steve Smith returns punts occasionally. Ed Reed does too.

And the Eagles use Brian Westbrook to return punts every now and then. Now if the eagles lose Westbrook they are d-o-n-e.

If the kid has the ability to give us good field position, then let him return punts. What's the point of having WRs if you can never get past the 50, because you always start insinde the 15 or 10?

Oh, I agree with you 100% on using your best players on special teams, regardless of whether they are starters or not; I was just being facetious about the Bears. My fiance is a huge Bears fan, so I've watched most of their games over the past several seasons. One of the big reasons I believe that Hester has been so successful (aside from him being freakishly fast and elusive) is that the Bears use a number of their starting defensive players (like Urlacher) as blockers for Dev on kick and punt returns. Dev is amazing, but he gets some really good blocks to open up some nice holes for him. I don't think he'd be half the returner he is without the rest of the special teams unit, and he's usually the first to give credit to the rest of the guys.

I was condensing many replies into one. I didn't mean to direct that to you. Sorry about that.

However, you raise a great point. Rossum looked like dirt last year. Half of the reason was because the blocking was _horrific_. This worries me because some the same guys also couldn't freaking tackle on STs.... If you can't block, and you can't tackle, how pray tell, did you wind up on a roster?

Sorry, I don't mean to get riled up but I keep seeing Maurice Jones-Drew and J. Cribbs running past the 50 in my head... and I hate it. If we had an answer of our own in the return game it would certainly ease my pain... When Dante Hall went off a few years ago I had dreams of having a returner like him. Not someone above average like ARE, but someone who was a distinct threat on EVERY punt....

motter1975
06-12-2008, 04:31 PM
Oh, I agree with you 100% on using your best players on special teams, regardless of whether they are starters or not; I was just being facetious about the Bears. My fiance is a huge Bears fan, so I've watched most of their games over the past several seasons. One of the big reasons I believe that Hester has been so successful (aside from him being freakishly fast and elusive) is that the Bears use a number of their starting defensive players (like Urlacher) as blockers for Dev on kick and punt returns. Dev is amazing, but he gets some really good blocks to open up some nice holes for him. I don't think he'd be half the returner he is without the rest of the special teams unit, and he's usually the first to give credit to the rest of the guys.

I was condensing many replies into one. I didn't mean to direct that to you. Sorry about that.

However, you raise a great point. Rossum looked like dirt last year. Half of the reason was because the blocking was _horrific_. This worries me because some the same guys also couldn't freaking tackle on STs.... If you can't block, and you can't tackle, how pray tell, did you wind up on a roster?

Sorry, I don't mean to get riled up but I keep seeing Maurice Jones-Drew and J. Cribbs running past the 50 in my head... and I hate it. If we had an answer of our own in the return game it would certainly ease my pain... When Dante Hall went off a few years ago I had dreams of having a returner like him. Not someone above average like ARE, but someone who was a distinct threat on EVERY punt....

Oh, no offense taken...I definitely agree with you. I hate the way our special teams play, and I don't know whether it's mostly that we don't have a good return guy, or if we can't block effectively. It's definitely a bit of both, but which is the most immediate need to fix, don't know. I know we can't tackle, because it seems like we consistently give the other team too good of field position. Then we have to rely on our defense to stop them on a short field...doesn't work too well at all. Seems like we need to put some starters in to block and tackle. The only thing positive I can say about last year was that at least we didn't seem to fumble the returns near as much as in 2006.

Which brings us back to the original point of the thread. I gotta agree with the first poster...if Santonio wants to return punts, great, try him out. But if he fumbles AT ALL in the pre-season, pull him and let him be strictly a wide receiver. I'd rather get minimal returns then to turn the ball over!

AngryAsian
06-12-2008, 05:40 PM
Let Nate Washington return kicks since he is such a "freakish" athlete and is getting paid $1.4M.



Winner, Winner, Chicken Dinner! Phenomenal Idea. :Agree

RuthlessBurgher
06-12-2008, 07:40 PM
I'll let Shia give you my response to Santonio attempting to return punts again.

[youtube:1y005l8w]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/8IXCK1EyP4s&hl=en"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/8IXCK1EyP4s&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/youtube:1y005l8w]

By the way, is there a more femme name ever than Shia LaBeouf? When I first heard the name, I thought it was the oldest daughter from the Cosby Show (but that was Sabrina LeBeauf).

stlrz d
06-12-2008, 07:41 PM
eeesh, dont know about Santonio back there again.....kind of interested in Mewelde and what he can do in that area.


:Agree

:Agree

:Agree

We have a punt returner.

http://www.nfl.com/players/meweldemoore ... =MOO557284 (http://www.nfl.com/players/meweldemoore/careerstats?id=MOO557284)

So we would assume...but we thought the same about Rossum.

Rossum's odometer had many more miles on it when he came to us than what Moore has now.